FWIW, I think the OP is pretty much on the mark. That's not to say that I don't think that toddlers should've been in the base game. It's not to say that I don't think they should be added at no additional cost to the consumers. But given the scope of adding them, yes, I think that they will be 'attached' to an EP.
Yes, they'll likely be patched in for everyone, regardless of whether or not you buy the EP, but it'll be an EP-related patch so they can basically 'package' them with the EP (almost certainly a Generations/Family-oriented thing) and use them as a selling point to encourage everyone to buy the EP for the 'full family experience.' Something like that.
That's -if- they even do add toddlers. At this point, I'm honestly skeptical. But this is still all just opinion and supposition, so, we'll see. I just think that all the folks waiting with baited breath on every free patch to see if toddlers are there are setting themselves up for a lot more disappointment. IMO, if they ever arrive, it'll be in a big package with lots of fanfare.
Then all of us waiting should give up waiting and just convince ourselves the game is what it is and just move on. Yeah - I actually agree - it has been too long - the pie has spoiled actually and who wants to eat a rotten pie anyway.
What a concept. Let's all move on. How dare us expect the Sims team to come thru and deliver what they said was in the game before it came out. LOL I guess that is much like any one expecting to get fixes that actually fix the game - how dare you expect a bugless game or a fixed one. Maybe you ought to give the Sims team some incentive and offer to pay for fixes - because after all no body is perfect right? We silly people who think we should have bugless games are just so absurd. Never mind expecting it for free. Time is money you know. A fix wasn't in the game then perhaps it should be in the game - ONLY. of course, if you are willing to pay for the Dev's time for making fixes....
Yes- we should all move on who is unhappy with the game and leave all of you happy with the way it is. Yep - great idea. Maybe I will yet. That darn thing we call hope just keeps slapping many of us upside the head - you know. But believe me you can only slap a dog so many times before they finally get tired of it and bite you back... or maybe they will just run away. Sounds like a plan.... Sounds better and better with each new patch and each new wave of disappointment. Guess it is high time for us dogs to either bite back or quietly sneak away.
Although I really wonder if all these people still waiting for things in the game were not here hoping and sharing their hopes - exactly how much of the threads would there be in the Sims 4 forum with just those happy with the game as it is? I wonder.
But you know - each slap in the face is really driving simmers away - so who knows maybe even next patch announcement no one of us still having hopes posts.... It is an idea that maybe you are right and we all should just move on....
The person you're quoting never, by word or deed, said you should give up or move on, Reg.
They quoted off the op and was actually above my post when I started writing - but never the less - maybe all of us unhappy with the game and feeling deceived should just give up then and leave the forums to those liking the game just the way it is - 8months is a long time to still feel deceived by promises of the missing could be added Guru posts anyway...
I didn't buy an ep for the first time ever - in my 16 years with Sims because of it - so maybe they are right - we can't love Sims 4 even though we love the Sims - so why waste anymore time...
A lot of people are leaving. I stay because I have friends here and I like talking about the sims even though I can't play 4. But more and more of the people I like to talk to are leaving. It's not the game that keeps me here, it's love of the franchise and having people to share it with. @Writin_Reg I really enjoy your posts and I'd miss them if you left, but I do understand how you're feeling. No sense in keeping up false hope and adding on unnecessary stress if there really is no hope. I'm getting to that point, too.
Aww, thank you. I totally agree - I am still here because of my friends, as well as I still go to Sims 3 Caw forum as I am still willing to help many of my friends test their Sims 3 worlds as I have always done. I am in fact waiting for one to be finished - the Simmer already asked even though it still has a good amount of work to do on the world - it looks fabulous. i just wished they had left Sims 3 forum a separate place - so then I probably would not come here at all. it is like a bad accident - it is hard to just go by everytime you have to pass it to get to where you are going. Add to that is hope - something a person with my own health issues live by is hope - so it is not easy for me to give up on my favorite game anymore than it is easy to give up hope i will maybe luck out and regain my health. After all both have been intertwined for some time - Sims kept me sane at times along with so many wonderful simmers over the years - so I guess I really mentally rebel against giving up hope - but anyway - enough of that.
I do truly thank you for your kind words - they are always appreciated. it is always nice to think I would be missed. It sort of makes you feel like I did some things right in my life after all - kind of thoughts. I cherish them for sure. Hugz.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
In dreams - I LIVE!
In REALITY, I simply exist.....
Well, I didn't research the game very much before I bought it, I'll admit. The only thing that drove me to the online community was wondering if something was intentional or a bug. I think watching the trailer was the most research I did. But the game doesn't do what was promised in that with regards to smarter sims and emotions. I'll admit I didn't realise there'd be no toddlers. Perhaps that was my own fault for presuming they were expanding on sims 3 features rather than stripping them back. I bought the game out of faith that I have loved every other game in the series so far. I have and am willing to invest in extra content. Toddlers aren't a deal breaker for me. But i think if the Base game felt more complete altogether people wouldn't be so angry about it because they could see what they've used their resources on instead. As it is, it is incomplete and many players are finding it dull. The more I play, the more I enjoy it but I've had to completely change the way I play to get to that and I'm not hooked like I was with all of the other base games. I'm not bothering with any of the Eps if the Base game doesn't excite me enough. I can find other games worth my money. I've learned my lesson and won't be buying any more games based on faith in the franchise. I'll review, test and check online first before looking to buy.
EA´s silence in the "toodlers affair" is killing my hopes, it is a so much great issue between the company and the simmers that I think we will hear a lot about their realization when/if they implement toddlers in the game.
I´ve always thought that toddlers were to be patched in, at a basic stage, to the base game, at the time when the Generations (or some) EP was ready to go, but not in a simple patch messed up with bugs fixes and such.
Toddlers will be a selling point for many simmers, even regarding other GPs and EPs, even for those who have not bought the base game yet, so when/if EA is ready to bring them out we will know it for sure with all the boasting and fanfare that EA is able to make, they will not be hidden in a monthly patch (IMO), there will be no surprise, we will be long before heavily advertised and pushed to buy the EP...
That said, while EA is close silent about toddlers it is because we are not near their realization, I start to doubt if we will have them at the end
I can play at last TS2 TS3 and TS4 So great that toddlers are here!!!
Despite everything I can and do say and think about the shortcomings of EA I do NOT believe they will sell us toddlers. I would put money on it that they will be patched in simply because toddlers are too big an inclusion. It would HAVE to be base game reliant and not EP reliant. EP toddlers would only work if toddlers only existed in a separate world like Granite Falls for instance. Well that clearly would not work. Life stages are base game dependant. Believe me. Toddlers will be patched in. (please god let me be right)
WEll then you must be okay with kids that never grow up, no teens, no YA's, and no Elders. Adults and babies that turned to kids were the only life stages of Sims 1 (the first test there were adults, babies, and kids with the baby not even aging into a kid - did you know that - there was no aging period). There were no cars - just car pools. (In fact the first rendition it was just those Sims in a house they never left - as careers and schools were not really a thought in testing, but was added before the final testing as well as car pools and buses - but even then School and work was every day. No days off from work or school - every day was a school day and a work day. Is that what you want. Also no weather in Sims 1. No University in Sims 1. Just the one world in Sims 1. You like that too I suppose. If you must find no toddler acceptable then you must find all the other stuff as acceptable then. You should be wishing just for the 3 life ages with none of the things that made Sims 2 - not Sims 1 the best selling game of all time.
In fact when they introduced Sims 2 - they proclaimed that all the things people stated over the 4 years of Sims 1 people thought the game needed to fill it out into the perfect game - the number one thing was all the life stages - and Sims lives that were more like ours and less like dolls in a dollhouse. As Will Wright said - Sims 1 was based on Dolls in a doll house -and doll houses came with a dad, a mom, a child, and a baby. No one ever aged, death and disaster never befell them, and things for the dolls all revolved with living together in the house forever.
Also it was said just the Sims 1 base game was planned as the complete game, as just like his Sims antz and other Sims games thus far were all a complete game in just the introduction game which of course later got called a base game. But because of people who fell in love with that main game - the Maxis team was asked if they were perhaps interested in going more in depth into these little Sims lives - as EA was sure getting lots of mail wanting more out of the game.... and thus The Sims became a series game as the team made eps to go more in depth with the dolls in the doll house based on what players were saying they would like to see. Where Will saw dolls in a dollhouse (in fact the original name of the game was "The Dollhouse" - ) the players saw themselves as God and the Sims as us and wanted things in the game that we had in real life and did.
So don't go pulling out the original game scenario as that was after all just a dollhouse. The series is thanks to the testers and later the players of that doll house that wanted the dolls, their world, and everything about them brought to life. I was a tester for Will Wright as was one other member of my family. I was there when Will Wright first introduced the idea to a bunch of us Sims City players.
ETA - I don't know - but saying players should be happy with the game backtracked all the way to the very first Sims base game is like saying people should have been happy with Gas light, horse and Buggies, and making your own clothes by hand. Those things were fine enough in their time as that was what people had - but life moves ever onward and forward, things are made in life to make things in general better for people. Electricity, cars, radios, tv. computers - travel cars, airplanes, even space ships all move the world forward and ever changing for the betterment of mankind. Even though some of us might do a few things like the pilgrims did now and then - would any of us ever vote to go all the way back to those days where all life revolved around us just existing. Same could be said the same for the sims - seeing regression is never a good thing. I mean would you like to go back in time where kids married at 14 - and their lives were pretty much over if they were lucky to live to 40 or 50 - where all life revolved around just existing? Well that is how we look at the game also. I am sure when gas light was first introduced to mankind - just like fire itself it was the greatest thing ever- but thank goodness to the efforts of those who look ever forward we moved onward to bigger and better things. PLagues that killed billions now a days have cures - infections of old would kill you and then man discovered penicillin, and so forth and so forth. Look at the whole picture and be grateful people are not happy to settle - they want better that the previous generations had it for a reason. To stay in the same spot and be happy with it is to stagnant. of course that is on a grande scale and I realize this is just a game we are talking about - but the fact remains doing things better than they were done before and not reversing the direction is always considered the direction people travel. You should learn from your past mistakes and do better - not return to the past mistakes. It's the human way for the betterment of mankind. it simply is.
Wow, you totally read my post way wrong! I didn't say anyone else should be happy, I simply stated that I was. I didn't say I wanted to change it even more, I said I was happy with my game. It's insane to me you replied the way you did and took so much time to post that huge response to my simple opinion that I'm happy without toddlers. I get you are upset, but you are taking it a bit far to jump on anyone who's opinion even slightly varies from your own.
Sorry to have ruined your life with my opinion about a game!
@Writin_Reg you are a valued member of the community, and there are people who really do care for you and wish that things were different. It's hard to watch people who are utterly in love with the series becoming heartbroken over this 'vision' and the 'we are listening' rhetoric.
You know what I think is sad? That people are actually suggesting that we should have such little faith in EA and the team that we should have just looked for a reason *not* to buy before release. Rather than appreciating that we bought to give the team the benefit of the doubt out of love for the sims. It's a really sad day when that loyalty is seen as a bad thing! (oh and ive not forgotten some of the same people were telling people off for not buying the game and trying it initially!)
You know what I think is sad? That people are actually suggesting that we should have such little faith in EA and the team that we should have just looked for a reason *not* to buy before release. Rather than appreciating that we bought to give the team the benefit of the doubt out of love for the sims. It's a really sad day when that loyalty is seen as a bad thing! (oh and ive not forgotten some of the same people were telling people off for not buying the game and trying it initially!)
While I would never suggest to anyone they shouldn't believe in EA, if we're being honest here, loyalty comes with a price. Sometimes, they don't deliver. Sometimes, you don't get what you were hoping for. Somebody is going to be unhappy, no matter what. There's nothing that will please absolutely everybody.
Why is it so hard for them to shut everyone up already and tell us toddlers are not happening? I mean I'm so sick to death of this topic that I'm ready to put a pause to my forum activity all together.
We either get them or we don't. Complaining continuously/endless topics on this is becoming as much as a bother to me as not having the toddlers in the first place.
plum!
The real trouble with reality is that there's no background music.
You know what I think is sad? That people are actually suggesting that we should have such little faith in EA and the team that we should have just looked for a reason *not* to buy before release. Rather than appreciating that we bought to give the team the benefit of the doubt out of love for the sims. It's a really sad day when that loyalty is seen as a bad thing! (oh and ive not forgotten some of the same people were telling people off for not buying the game and trying it initially!)
While I would never suggest to anyone they shouldn't believe in EA, if we're being honest here, loyalty comes with a price. Sometimes, they don't deliver. Sometimes, you don't get what you were hoping for. Somebody is going to be unhappy, no matter what. There's nothing that will please absolutely everybody.
There's some truth to that, but this isn't just a normal situation. They told us it was unfinished and they 'ran out of time'. Then patch in some missing things then act surprised that people expected them to completely finish the job, or that people want to know their intentions. @83bienchen has a quote in her signature regarding toddlers being a priority from a guru.
If they wanted to change the direction of the sims that's their prerogative. BUT then the onus is on EA to communicate that and their vision, and not have review embargoes which hide that from the loyal customers.
Why is it so hard for them to shut everyone up already and tell us toddlers are not happening? I mean I'm so sick to death of this topic that I'm ready to put a pause to my forum activity all together.
We either get them or we don't. Complaining continuously/endless topics on this is becoming as much as a bother to me as not having the toddlers in the first place.
plum!
Agreed.. The forums are becoming a unpleasant place now. Every thread is full bickering. Did they ever say why they won't comment on future content?
Why is it so hard for them to shut everyone up already and tell us toddlers are not happening? I mean I'm so sick to death of this topic that I'm ready to put a pause to my forum activity all together.
We either get them or we don't. Complaining continuously/endless topics on this is becoming as much as a bother to me as not having the toddlers in the first place.
plum!
Agreed.. The forums are becoming a unpleasant place now. Every thread is full bickering. Did they ever say why they won't comment on future content?
I believe they've said they can't because they're not allowed to at the minute.
Why is it so hard for them to shut everyone up already and tell us toddlers are not happening? I mean I'm so sick to death of this topic that I'm ready to put a pause to my forum activity all together.
We either get them or we don't. Complaining continuously/endless topics on this is becoming as much as a bother to me as not having the toddlers in the first place.
plum!
Agreed.. The forums are becoming a unpleasant place now. Every thread is full bickering. Did they ever say why they won't comment on future content?
Future content includes more than just content being developed. It includes ideas and concepts that may or may not actually make it into the game. It's the easiest way for EA to make players think something has the possibility of being developed. If they said toddlers were not being developed players would flat out stop playing the game. It would mean that they haven't been listening, which I think is clear enough at this point.
Why is it so hard for them to shut everyone up already and tell us toddlers are not happening? I mean I'm so sick to death of this topic that I'm ready to put a pause to my forum activity all together.
We either get them or we don't. Complaining continuously/endless topics on this is becoming as much as a bother to me as not having the toddlers in the first place.
plum!
Agreed.. The forums are becoming a unpleasant place now. Every thread is full bickering. Did they ever say why they won't comment on future content?
Future content includes more than just content being developed. It includes ideas and concepts that may or may not actually make it into the game. It's the easiest way for EA to make players think something has the possibility of being developed. If they said toddlers were not being developed players would flat out stop playing the game. It would mean that they haven't been listening, which I think is clear enough at this point.
Why is it so hard for them to shut everyone up already and tell us toddlers are not happening? I mean I'm so sick to death of this topic that I'm ready to put a pause to my forum activity all together.
We either get them or we don't. Complaining continuously/endless topics on this is becoming as much as a bother to me as not having the toddlers in the first place.
plum!
Agreed.. The forums are becoming a unpleasant place now. Every thread is full bickering. Did they ever say why they won't comment on future content?
Future content includes more than just content being developed. It includes ideas and concepts that may or may not actually make it into the game. It's the easiest way for EA to make players think something has the possibility of being developed. If they said toddlers were not being developed players would flat out stop playing the game. It would mean that they haven't been listening, which I think is clear enough at this point.
I highly doubt this because 1) there are players who do not want toddlers and 2) some people who were disappointed with the changes still bought the game. EA doesn't exactly have much to worry about.
Why is it so hard for them to shut everyone up already and tell us toddlers are not happening? I mean I'm so sick to death of this topic that I'm ready to put a pause to my forum activity all together.
We either get them or we don't. Complaining continuously/endless topics on this is becoming as much as a bother to me as not having the toddlers in the first place.
plum!
Agreed.. The forums are becoming a unpleasant place now. Every thread is full bickering. Did they ever say why they won't comment on future content?
Future content includes more than just content being developed. It includes ideas and concepts that may or may not actually make it into the game. It's the easiest way for EA to make players think something has the possibility of being developed. If they said toddlers were not being developed players would flat out stop playing the game. It would mean that they haven't been listening, which I think is clear enough at this point.
I highly doubt this because 1) there are players who do not want toddlers and 2) some people who were disappointed with the changes still bought the game. EA doesn't exactly have much to worry about.
They do actually. I know many players bought the game because of comments made before release about content not being included "at launch". Others (like myself) gave the developers the benefit of the doubt, I figured they couldn't possibly release a barren game; there had to be SOMETHING exciting they weren't telling. I was wrong. Toddlers are a very popular feature now that they are not included, I have been on the forums for years and I can tell you I have seen far more players asking for their return than I have asking for them to not return. Those players who based their purchase off of the words of Rachel Franklin are the ones now who are expecting them to come, and EA knows that. They aren't going to announce they're not coming when players will buy in the hopes they are.
Why is it so hard for them to shut everyone up already and tell us toddlers are not happening? I mean I'm so sick to death of this topic that I'm ready to put a pause to my forum activity all together.
We either get them or we don't. Complaining continuously/endless topics on this is becoming as much as a bother to me as not having the toddlers in the first place.
plum!
Oh, I can feel the love all the way over here. Didn't I tell you earlier that if you're tired of reading the complaint threads all you have to do is stay away from them? I've trained myself to stay away from the "TS4 is the next best thing since sliced bread" threads...why can't you do the same and train yourself to stay away from the complaint threads? Oh yeah, can't resist the temptation to come into these threads and scornfully point out how wrong people are for feeling the way they do.
Yes, the implication here is "Just shut up already and stop talking about wanting toddlers. I don't want toddlers and I shouldn't have to put up with those who do." I'm getting really tired of the snarkiness of you players who don't want toddlers, and whose idea of defending EA/Maxis and the Sims 4 is to put other players down...players, who by the way, were told off for not buying The Sims 4 in the first place because they made the choice not to buy it due to the fact that: no toddlers.
But, hey...those players were told to "get over it"..."They'll be added in an expansion!"
"TS4 isn't TS2 or TS3, it's different game! Lose that TS3 mindset!" (said by one of the producers).
And to answer your question...the day they admit there will be no toddlers is the day they will lose a ton of fans that have been with them from the beginning. It's already happening. I am serious when I say that if their next expansion pack is "Pets" I'm gone from this forum and from the franchise. The reason is because "Pets" is clearly an attempt to distract players from wanting toddlers. They think that cute puppies and kittehs will take the place of toddlers. Fat chance. And besides real bear = too hard/too expensive/would take years to animate properly. *cough cough*
It chaps my hide that people seriously expect those who want toddlers to *pay* for them. Yeah, let's send EA a clear message: "We're unintelligent Sims players who will buy anything with a Sims label on it and dance for joy and feel deep gratitude for you making The Sims 4 in the first place."
Yeah.
EA Marketing Department Motto:
"We Don't Care If You LIKE The Game, Just As Long As You BUY The Game!"
I Disapprove (Naturally) I Took The Pledge!
Why is it so hard for them to shut everyone up already and tell us toddlers are not happening? I mean I'm so sick to death of this topic that I'm ready to put a pause to my forum activity all together.
We either get them or we don't. Complaining continuously/endless topics on this is becoming as much as a bother to me as not having the toddlers in the first place.
plum!
Oh, I can feel the love all the way over here. Didn't I tell you earlier that if you're tired of reading the complaint threads all you have to do is stay away from them? I've trained myself to stay away from the "TS4 is the next best thing since sliced bread" threads...why can't you do the same and train yourself to stay away from the complaint threads? Oh yeah, can't resist the temptation to come into these threads and scornfully point out how wrong people are for feeling the way they do.
Yes, the implication here is "Just shut up already and stop talking about wanting toddlers. I don't want toddlers and I shouldn't have to put up with those who do." I'm getting really tired of the snarkiness of you players who don't want toddlers, and whose idea of defending EA/Maxis and the Sims 4 is to put other players down...players, who by the way, were told off for not buying The Sims 4 in the first place because they made the choice not to buy it due to the fact that: no toddlers.
But, hey...those players were told to "get over it"..."They'll be added in an expansion!"
"TS4 isn't TS2 or TS3, it's different game! Lose that TS3 mindset!" (said by one of the producers).
And to answer your question...the day they admit there will be no toddlers is the day they will lose a ton of fans that have been with them from the beginning. It's already happening. I am serious when I say that if their next expansion pack is "Pets" I'm gone from this forum and from the franchise. The reason is because "Pets" is clearly an attempt to distract players from wanting toddlers. They think that cute puppies and kittehs will take the place of toddlers. Fat chance. And besides real bear = too hard/too expensive/would take years to animate properly. *cough cough*
It chaps my hide that people seriously expect those who want toddlers to *pay* for them. Yeah, let's send EA a clear message: "We're unintelligent Sims players who will buy anything with a Sims label on it and dance for joy and feel deep gratitude for you making The Sims 4 in the first place."
Yeah.
I'll never understand why players who don't want toddlers feel they have more leverage here than players who do. i guess it all boils down to some players not expecting a certain level of quality in the full priced AAA titles they buy.
Why is it so hard for them to shut everyone up already and tell us toddlers are not happening? I mean I'm so sick to death of this topic that I'm ready to put a pause to my forum activity all together.
We either get them or we don't. Complaining continuously/endless topics on this is becoming as much as a bother to me as not having the toddlers in the first place.
plum!
Oh, I can feel the love all the way over here. Didn't I tell you earlier that if you're tired of reading the complaint threads all you have to do is stay away from them? I've trained myself to stay away from the "TS4 is the next best thing since sliced bread" threads...why can't you do the same and train yourself to stay away from the complaint threads? Oh yeah, can't resist the temptation to come into these threads and scornfully point out how wrong people are for feeling the way they do.
Yes, the implication here is "Just shut up already and stop talking about wanting toddlers. I don't want toddlers and I shouldn't have to put up with those who do." I'm getting really tired of the snarkiness of you players who don't want toddlers, and whose idea of defending EA/Maxis and the Sims 4 is to put other players down...players, who by the way, were told off for not buying The Sims 4 in the first place because they made the choice not to buy it due to the fact that: no toddlers.
But, hey...those players were told to "get over it"..."They'll be added in an expansion!"
"TS4 isn't TS2 or TS3, it's different game! Lose that TS3 mindset!" (said by one of the producers).
And to answer your question...the day they admit there will be no toddlers is the day they will lose a ton of fans that have been with them from the beginning. It's already happening. I am serious when I say that if their next expansion pack is "Pets" I'm gone from this forum and from the franchise. The reason is because "Pets" is clearly an attempt to distract players from wanting toddlers. They think that cute puppies and kittehs will take the place of toddlers. Fat chance. And besides real bear = too hard/too expensive/would take years to animate properly. *cough cough*
It chaps my hide that people seriously expect those who want toddlers to *pay* for them. Yeah, let's send EA a clear message: "We're unintelligent Sims players who will buy anything with a Sims label on it and dance for joy and feel deep gratitude for you making The Sims 4 in the first place."
Yeah.
I'll never understand why players who don't want toddlers feel they have more leverage here than players who do. i guess it all boils down to some players not expecting a certain level of quality in the full priced AAA titles they buy.
I think being persistent in asking for toddlers is better then just asking it once and once only. They'll mistake it for people not caring.
We have the freedom of asking it over and over again. Players who are satisfied with just playing one life stage can always ignore it.
Why is it so hard for them to shut everyone up already and tell us toddlers are not happening? I mean I'm so sick to death of this topic that I'm ready to put a pause to my forum activity all together.
We either get them or we don't. Complaining continuously/endless topics on this is becoming as much as a bother to me as not having the toddlers in the first place.
plum!
Oh, I can feel the love all the way over here. Didn't I tell you earlier that if you're tired of reading the complaint threads all you have to do is stay away from them? I've trained myself to stay away from the "TS4 is the next best thing since sliced bread" threads...why can't you do the same and train yourself to stay away from the complaint threads? Oh yeah, can't resist the temptation to come into these threads and scornfully point out how wrong people are for feeling the way they do.
Yes, the implication here is "Just shut up already and stop talking about wanting toddlers. I don't want toddlers and I shouldn't have to put up with those who do." I'm getting really tired of the snarkiness of you players who don't want toddlers, and whose idea of defending EA/Maxis and the Sims 4 is to put other players down...players, who by the way, were told off for not buying The Sims 4 in the first place because they made the choice not to buy it due to the fact that: no toddlers.
But, hey...those players were told to "get over it"..."They'll be added in an expansion!"
"TS4 isn't TS2 or TS3, it's different game! Lose that TS3 mindset!" (said by one of the producers).
And to answer your question...the day they admit there will be no toddlers is the day they will lose a ton of fans that have been with them from the beginning. It's already happening. I am serious when I say that if their next expansion pack is "Pets" I'm gone from this forum and from the franchise. The reason is because "Pets" is clearly an attempt to distract players from wanting toddlers. They think that cute puppies and kittehs will take the place of toddlers. Fat chance. And besides real bear = too hard/too expensive/would take years to animate properly. *cough cough*
It chaps my hide that people seriously expect those who want toddlers to *pay* for them. Yeah, let's send EA a clear message: "We're unintelligent Sims players who will buy anything with a Sims label on it and dance for joy and feel deep gratitude for you making The Sims 4 in the first place."
Yeah.
I'll never understand why players who don't want toddlers feel they have more leverage here than players who do. i guess it all boils down to some players not expecting a certain level of quality in the full priced AAA titles they buy.
I think being persistent in asking for toddlers is better then just asking it once and once only. They'll mistake it for people not caring.
We have the freedom of asking it over and over again. Players who are satisfied with just playing one life stage can always ignore it.
I agree. If something is important to players, and it's not being addressed it should be brought up at every turn so the developers know how important it is. With how heating players are getting I doubt they will be able to keep quiet on the situation for very much longer. We've seen what outrage on this forum can do, and I say go for it. If it forces them to release a blog post about toddlers that would be welcome, and it would definitely show players what is important to the people making the game.
I don't get it myself... my daughter (grown) and I were both happy no toddlers. We like our games without them. I hope they don't add them in a patch or an EP. I know that isn't a popular opinion but it's ours. I like the way my generations flow now. In TS2 and TS3 I hated the time it took to deal with the toddler phase. It was disproportionate to the other ages for me. Yes, it was realistic, but I had my kids and they are all grown now. I don't want to spend all of my time getting my sims to change diapers and potty training.
I do however agree that it is more likely to come in an EP than a patch. You may get the age group and some very basic hairs/clothes/items in a patch, but the real content will be in a pack. That is just my opinion.
As for deserving and demanding toddlers. They weren't in the base game. If you purchased the base game as is, then you told EA that you were OK with no toddlers. You can say that you were vocal in telling them you expect toddlers later on, but actions speak far louder than words!
Not to pick on you, however, I strongly disagree. I wasn't interested in TS4, until I heard it was no longer going to be an "online" game. Then I came to these forums to learn more about it. I had just gotten off the fence and decided to pre-order, when the announcement about the toddlers not being included came down. Was I disappointed? Yes, hugely. Babies and toddlers are my favorite age groups. But, I took a deep breath and decided to give this iteration a try. Especially, since it was stated that toddlers were only removed at the last minute, because they ran out of time to do their animations properly. (Please don't quote me, I only truly remember the gist of the message.) That was enough for me to think, okay, better to have them done properly, and that they would be added in, later. The implication is that they were working on them.
While you and your daughter may find toddlers tiresome, and I can fully appreciate your opinion on that, there is always the ability to do what many did back in TS3. Simply age them up! I do not wish to sound mean, but what you're suggesting is that those of us who want toddlers can take a flying leap. To me, it's an easy decision. Choice. Right now, I hastily age up the baby/OBJECT I loathe so much, but at least we have a baby in the game, of sorts.
I am truly sorry the devs got the 'wrong' impression when people did that. It isn't that the age group, in many cases, was unwanted, but they (the devs) dumbed them down so much, as they did the babies from the TS2 versions, they truly weren't as much fun to play. And, now, they've done away with them altogether and tethered the newborns to the dern bassinet. (BTW, this was a grossly ridiculous way of keeping babies off the floor, in my opinion.) Oi!
They have already cut so many corners in this iteration, why, oh, why take out a life stage? All the devs had to do was bring back the interactions we had with both babies and toddlers from TS2, and add one more. The Sim holding baby must put baby in a safe place (not the floor) or hand baby off to another Sim. Problem solved. Safe places could include, bed, baby seat, swing or a playpen or even a play mat (so that baby isn't on the cold floor directly). And something another Sim would walk around.
P.S. I also had a codicil regarding my purchase of said base game: if gameplay didn't wow me, I wouldn't add another penny to TS4. I am enjoying myself. The Sims seem far livelier than in TS3 (my least favorite iteration) and well, I now have OR and GTW. Trying my best to be patient about the toddlers thing. And to remain hopeful.
As for getting the basics in a patch with more to come via an EP, that's what they did in TS3. All I can say is the basics better be closer to the TS2 version.
Not trying to be condescending here, but I'm pretty upset that people are happy about features being omitted that bring so much joy to others. Toddlers and raising a family was practically my main playstyle and I know many others felt the same as me.
Rachel told us the only reason they didnt ship in the base *on release day* was because they 'ran out of time'. On a self imposed time limit. I will not reward cuts to quality by investing further in this game, because you know what? Next time they make a budget for the sims if they 'get away with' selling us back staples like toddlers then they will cut further because they will know we are accepting being treated that way.
They barely announced no toddlers before release. What two months before release? Are sims fans supposed to expect to be let down so much by EA that we have to check exactly what is coming after fifteen years of supporting this game?!
The 'fault' is not with the players. Its with the service we are being given. And take note. This time its toddlers, but whats to say next time its not the features you love the most in the sims?!
@poeticnebula I understand that you don't want toddlers in game because you consider them annoying and time-consuming. And that's okay, everyone has preferences. But you must admit that it ruins the simulation, because the aging process lacks realism with babies aging up to 10-years old. Even if they add toddlers, you will have the option to age them as soon as you wish and still enjoy the game. On the other hand, a family player like me can't enjoy the game quite as much. Because I desperately want to play toddlers, I really do, and I can't because there are none! If toddlers were there, we could both be happy - I would be happy with my toddlers and you without them.
You have real kids so you don't need any in your game and it's okay. But I was not lucky to have a child yet. And raising a family has been my favourite part of The Sims since TS2, because that is one thing I can't do in real life, so I like to have it in Sims at least. I don't really like playing the single sim because I am a student and I pretty much live like a single sim IRL.
But it's not about the toddlers actually. It's about missing the basic things, about things that make The Sims enjoyable and loved. We lost toddlers and continuity of aging process with them. Who knows what basic things will be taken from the game next time? Maybe it will be your favourite feature. And I don't want to see that happening because I don't want anyone to be frustrated about missing things like I am.
> @sparkfairy1 said: > Writin_Reg you are a valued member of the community, and there are people who really do care for you and wish that things were different. It's hard to watch people who are utterly in love with the series becoming heartbroken over this 'vision' and the 'we are listening' rhetoric. > > You know what I think is sad? That people are actually suggesting that we should have such little faith in EA and the team that we should have just looked for a reason *not* to buy before release. Rather than appreciating that we bought to give the team the benefit of the doubt out of love for the sims. It's a really sad day when that loyalty is seen as a bad thing! (oh and ive not forgotten some of the same people were telling people off for not buying the game and trying it initially!)
At the end of the day, EA is a business. I don't believe we should "have faith" in businesses anyway, because their loyalty is to their stockholders. Don't get me wrong - I love the Sims franchise and have played since the beginning. However, if there is something in a game that I find really bothersome, even in one I've stuck with for a long time (like SimCity as I mentioned earlier with the "always online" requirement), I choose not to shell out my money. While I don't think they should go backwards in terms of game features (which is the only reason why I personally want to see toddlers back), it's not a hill worth dying on for me personally - so I bought the game full knowing toddlers and other features weren't in it (I bought it months after release btw), being able to live with the game that was right in front of me at the time. If that wasn't the case, I would not have bought the game until said feature was fixed (and not necessarily even then, as I ended up going to Cities:Skylines even after SimCity got rid of "always online").
My only point is that regardless of what devs say, you have to remember that what you're buying is what you have in front of you - not "promises." Plans change, so on and so forth, even with the best of intentions. Besides, they have your money so it's not like they "have" to include it. They should respond to the fans, but realistically they don't have to.
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Aww, thank you. I totally agree - I am still here because of my friends, as well as I still go to Sims 3 Caw forum as I am still willing to help many of my friends test their Sims 3 worlds as I have always done. I am in fact waiting for one to be finished - the Simmer already asked even though it still has a good amount of work to do on the world - it looks fabulous. i just wished they had left Sims 3 forum a separate place - so then I probably would not come here at all. it is like a bad accident - it is hard to just go by everytime you have to pass it to get to where you are going. Add to that is hope - something a person with my own health issues live by is hope - so it is not easy for me to give up on my favorite game anymore than it is easy to give up hope i will maybe luck out and regain my health. After all both have been intertwined for some time - Sims kept me sane at times along with so many wonderful simmers over the years - so I guess I really mentally rebel against giving up hope - but anyway - enough of that.
I do truly thank you for your kind words - they are always appreciated. it is always nice to think I would be missed. It sort of makes you feel like I did some things right in my life after all - kind of thoughts. I cherish them for sure. Hugz.
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In REALITY, I simply exist.....
I bought the game out of faith that I have loved every other game in the series so far. I have and am willing to invest in extra content.
Toddlers aren't a deal breaker for me. But i think if the Base game felt more complete altogether people wouldn't be so angry about it because they could see what they've used their resources on instead. As it is, it is incomplete and many players are finding it dull. The more I play, the more I enjoy it but I've had to completely change the way I play to get to that and I'm not hooked like I was with all of the other base games.
I'm not bothering with any of the Eps if the Base game doesn't excite me enough. I can find other games worth my money. I've learned my lesson and won't be buying any more games based on faith in the franchise. I'll review, test and check online first before looking to buy.
I´ve always thought that toddlers were to be patched in, at a basic stage, to the base game, at the time when the Generations (or some) EP was ready to go, but not in a simple patch messed up with bugs fixes and such.
Toddlers will be a selling point for many simmers, even regarding other GPs and EPs, even for those who have not bought the base game yet, so when/if EA is ready to bring them out we will know it for sure with all the boasting and fanfare that EA is able to make, they will not be hidden in a monthly patch (IMO), there will be no surprise, we will be long before heavily advertised and pushed to buy the EP...
That said, while EA is close silent about toddlers it is because we are not near their realization, I start to doubt if we will have them at the end
I can play at last TS2 TS3 and TS4 So great that toddlers are here!!!
My Mood:
Wow, you totally read my post way wrong! I didn't say anyone else should be happy, I simply stated that I was. I didn't say I wanted to change it even more, I said I was happy with my game. It's insane to me you replied the way you did and took so much time to post that huge response to my simple opinion that I'm happy without toddlers. I get you are upset, but you are taking it a bit far to jump on anyone who's opinion even slightly varies from your own.
Sorry to have ruined your life with my opinion about a game!
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You know what I think is sad? That people are actually suggesting that we should have such little faith in EA and the team that we should have just looked for a reason *not* to buy before release. Rather than appreciating that we bought to give the team the benefit of the doubt out of love for the sims. It's a really sad day when that loyalty is seen as a bad thing! (oh and ive not forgotten some of the same people were telling people off for not buying the game and trying it initially!)
https://twitter.com/sparkfairy1
While I would never suggest to anyone they shouldn't believe in EA, if we're being honest here, loyalty comes with a price. Sometimes, they don't deliver. Sometimes, you don't get what you were hoping for. Somebody is going to be unhappy, no matter what. There's nothing that will please absolutely everybody.
We either get them or we don't. Complaining continuously/endless topics on this is becoming as much as a bother to me as not having the toddlers in the first place.
plum!
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There's some truth to that, but this isn't just a normal situation. They told us it was unfinished and they 'ran out of time'. Then patch in some missing things then act surprised that people expected them to completely finish the job, or that people want to know their intentions. @83bienchen has a quote in her signature regarding toddlers being a priority from a guru.
If they wanted to change the direction of the sims that's their prerogative. BUT then the onus is on EA to communicate that and their vision, and not have review embargoes which hide that from the loyal customers.
https://twitter.com/sparkfairy1
Agreed.. The forums are becoming a unpleasant place now. Every thread is full bickering. Did they ever say why they won't comment on future content?
I believe they've said they can't because they're not allowed to at the minute.
Future content includes more than just content being developed. It includes ideas and concepts that may or may not actually make it into the game. It's the easiest way for EA to make players think something has the possibility of being developed. If they said toddlers were not being developed players would flat out stop playing the game. It would mean that they haven't been listening, which I think is clear enough at this point.
Well said
I highly doubt this because 1) there are players who do not want toddlers and 2) some people who were disappointed with the changes still bought the game. EA doesn't exactly have much to worry about.
They do actually. I know many players bought the game because of comments made before release about content not being included "at launch". Others (like myself) gave the developers the benefit of the doubt, I figured they couldn't possibly release a barren game; there had to be SOMETHING exciting they weren't telling. I was wrong. Toddlers are a very popular feature now that they are not included, I have been on the forums for years and I can tell you I have seen far more players asking for their return than I have asking for them to not return. Those players who based their purchase off of the words of Rachel Franklin are the ones now who are expecting them to come, and EA knows that. They aren't going to announce they're not coming when players will buy in the hopes they are.
Oh, I can feel the love all the way over here. Didn't I tell you earlier that if you're tired of reading the complaint threads all you have to do is stay away from them? I've trained myself to stay away from the "TS4 is the next best thing since sliced bread" threads...why can't you do the same and train yourself to stay away from the complaint threads? Oh yeah, can't resist the temptation to come into these threads and scornfully point out how wrong people are for feeling the way they do.
Yes, the implication here is "Just shut up already and stop talking about wanting toddlers. I don't want toddlers and I shouldn't have to put up with those who do." I'm getting really tired of the snarkiness of you players who don't want toddlers, and whose idea of defending EA/Maxis and the Sims 4 is to put other players down...players, who by the way, were told off for not buying The Sims 4 in the first place because they made the choice not to buy it due to the fact that: no toddlers.
But, hey...those players were told to "get over it"..."They'll be added in an expansion!"
"TS4 isn't TS2 or TS3, it's different game! Lose that TS3 mindset!" (said by one of the producers).
And to answer your question...the day they admit there will be no toddlers is the day they will lose a ton of fans that have been with them from the beginning. It's already happening. I am serious when I say that if their next expansion pack is "Pets" I'm gone from this forum and from the franchise. The reason is because "Pets" is clearly an attempt to distract players from wanting toddlers. They think that cute puppies and kittehs will take the place of toddlers. Fat chance. And besides real bear = too hard/too expensive/would take years to animate properly. *cough cough*
It chaps my hide that people seriously expect those who want toddlers to *pay* for them. Yeah, let's send EA a clear message: "We're unintelligent Sims players who will buy anything with a Sims label on it and dance for joy and feel deep gratitude for you making The Sims 4 in the first place."
Yeah.
"We Don't Care If You LIKE The Game, Just As Long As You BUY The Game!"
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I Took The Pledge!
I'll never understand why players who don't want toddlers feel they have more leverage here than players who do. i guess it all boils down to some players not expecting a certain level of quality in the full priced AAA titles they buy.
I think being persistent in asking for toddlers is better then just asking it once and once only. They'll mistake it for people not caring.
We have the freedom of asking it over and over again. Players who are satisfied with just playing one life stage can always ignore it.
I agree. If something is important to players, and it's not being addressed it should be brought up at every turn so the developers know how important it is. With how heating players are getting I doubt they will be able to keep quiet on the situation for very much longer. We've seen what outrage on this forum can do, and I say go for it. If it forces them to release a blog post about toddlers that would be welcome, and it would definitely show players what is important to the people making the game.
While you and your daughter may find toddlers tiresome, and I can fully appreciate your opinion on that, there is always the ability to do what many did back in TS3. Simply age them up! I do not wish to sound mean, but what you're suggesting is that those of us who want toddlers can take a flying leap. To me, it's an easy decision. Choice. Right now, I hastily age up the baby/OBJECT I loathe so much, but at least we have a baby in the game, of sorts.
I am truly sorry the devs got the 'wrong' impression when people did that. It isn't that the age group, in many cases, was unwanted, but they (the devs) dumbed them down so much, as they did the babies from the TS2 versions, they truly weren't as much fun to play. And, now, they've done away with them altogether and tethered the newborns to the dern bassinet. (BTW, this was a grossly ridiculous way of keeping babies off the floor, in my opinion.) Oi!
They have already cut so many corners in this iteration, why, oh, why take out a life stage? All the devs had to do was bring back the interactions we had with both babies and toddlers from TS2, and add one more. The Sim holding baby must put baby in a safe place (not the floor) or hand baby off to another Sim. Problem solved. Safe places could include, bed, baby seat, swing or a playpen or even a play mat (so that baby isn't on the cold floor directly). And something another Sim would walk around.
P.S. I also had a codicil regarding my purchase of said base game: if gameplay didn't wow me, I wouldn't add another penny to TS4. I am enjoying myself. The Sims seem far livelier than in TS3 (my least favorite iteration) and well, I now have OR and GTW. Trying my best to be patient about the toddlers thing. And to remain hopeful.
As for getting the basics in a patch with more to come via an EP, that's what they did in TS3. All I can say is the basics better be closer to the TS2 version.
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Thank you @Sparkfairy1 and @Sul5ul! I agree completely!
You have real kids so you don't need any in your game and it's okay. But I was not lucky to have a child yet. And raising a family has been my favourite part of The Sims since TS2, because that is one thing I can't do in real life, so I like to have it in Sims at least. I don't really like playing the single sim because I am a student and I pretty much live like a single sim IRL.
But it's not about the toddlers actually. It's about missing the basic things, about things that make The Sims enjoyable and loved. We lost toddlers and continuity of aging process with them. Who knows what basic things will be taken from the game next time? Maybe it will be your favourite feature. And I don't want to see that happening because I don't want anyone to be frustrated about missing things like I am.
The Rossini Legacy
> Writin_Reg you are a valued member of the community, and there are people who really do care for you and wish that things were different. It's hard to watch people who are utterly in love with the series becoming heartbroken over this 'vision' and the 'we are listening' rhetoric.
>
> You know what I think is sad? That people are actually suggesting that we should have such little faith in EA and the team that we should have just looked for a reason *not* to buy before release. Rather than appreciating that we bought to give the team the benefit of the doubt out of love for the sims. It's a really sad day when that loyalty is seen as a bad thing! (oh and ive not forgotten some of the same people were telling people off for not buying the game and trying it initially!)
At the end of the day, EA is a business. I don't believe we should "have faith" in businesses anyway, because their loyalty is to their stockholders. Don't get me wrong - I love the Sims franchise and have played since the beginning. However, if there is something in a game that I find really bothersome, even in one I've stuck with for a long time (like SimCity as I mentioned earlier with the "always online" requirement), I choose not to shell out my money. While I don't think they should go backwards in terms of game features (which is the only reason why I personally want to see toddlers back), it's not a hill worth dying on for me personally - so I bought the game full knowing toddlers and other features weren't in it (I bought it months after release btw), being able to live with the game that was right in front of me at the time. If that wasn't the case, I would not have bought the game until said feature was fixed (and not necessarily even then, as I ended up going to Cities:Skylines even after SimCity got rid of "always online").
My only point is that regardless of what devs say, you have to remember that what you're buying is what you have in front of you - not "promises." Plans change, so on and so forth, even with the best of intentions. Besides, they have your money so it's not like they "have" to include it. They should respond to the fans, but realistically they don't have to.
EA ID: staravia81