One imprtant factor - how ever you like the game is your choices as much as you can make it your choice - no one plays it wrong as there is no right or wrong way to play - we may be limited as vets - but we find ways to get around what we can and enjoy our games and the newbs like the pace they can enjoy the game without all the little detail. EA has found a bit of a sweet spot - so they get continued success.
The issue though is that the game is broken. And continues getting more and more broken instead of getting fixed. Are you telling me that these people do not play with apartments, pets, restaurants, get to work careers?
Why anyone would continue to buy content for a broken game is beyond me,
Welcome to The Sims franchise, selling broken since 2009, fixes not guaranteed.
I'm pretty sure all the games in The Sims from 2000-2014+ has leftover glitches. The more ambitious the game engine, the more possibility for errors. And seeing how some or even most game developers are rushed into completion even though the game is clearly not ready to be released explains this issue is unfortunately common in the gaming industry overall. Not just The Sims.
I would prefer a quality game that the developers can take their time to get things right the first time by thoroughly testing for as many problems as possible and correcting any errors found before moving on to the next content.
To clarify the difference between TS3 and TS4 for me in terms of this issue. TS3 has many pros than cons, whereas TS4 has many cons than pros. Despite, the game's flaws I can easily overlook it when it comes to what is brought to the franchise and that greatly helps to make up for its shortcomings. Though, there shouldn't be any trade-offs to begin with unless because of a technological limitation. Some game companies lose their focus on creating games for fun and entertainment. They no longer seem to be represented as gamers for gamers and everything shifts to being business-minded and money, money and more money.
Despite the flaws in all The Sims games from 2000-2013, nothing compares to the lowest of low which is TS4. Look at TS's base game, TS2's base game coming from TS, TS3's base game coming from TS2 and TS4's base game coming from TS3. A series of games that are supposed to advance and improve after the one before it or what is the reason for playing the same old, same old and paying more money for it?
Of course, nothing wrong if that's what some like and want. It's not my money so I don't care what others do with theirs but I do ponder the logic behind it. But hey, everyone is different and has different preferences so it is what is and that's all that needs to be understood.
Yes all Sims games had glitches and bugs but nothing like the trend that TS3 started and TS4 continued.
As far as the rest, color for tastes and I've learned to not undermine anyone's taste when it comes to sandbox or simulation games, specially after being an avid harsh critique of TS4 and now mainly enjoying it (even if I still remain criticizing it). It's about perspective. I very much enjoyed TS3's focus on the world as a whole, but found myself seldom observing or enjoying details. It also depends on play style. I personally find many areas that I enjoy more in each iteration than in previous ones, and depending on quality I may or may not end up not missing previous features, which is still not an excuse for going backwards in some areas. The all time low for me was the introduction of TS3 store. And sure it was optional, but it was massive amounts of time and manpower spent on objects and new bits of gameplay mostly lackluster costing thousands upon thousands. That's why SPs don't even bother me at all in this one specially since at least they properly slashed the price instead of being worthless $20 SPs. Much of the constant store release time and money could have been spent on a better game but nope.
The main logic behind it is rather simple. People may or may not enjoy X game for Y, Z and W reasons. What you may find invaluable for enjoyment may not be what others need.
Ok. I'll be honest. I've played The Sims since I was a toddler. Sims kept getting better and better and when Sims 3 was released my mind was blown! It was the best Sims game EVER! (and yes, most of the glory goes to horses and open world). I loved the Sims and I loved how the game grew. It became better and better.
And then one glorious day they announced Sims 4. I was surprised and I remember telling my cousin, "Well, I don't know how they're going to top Sims 3. I think Sims 4 is going to be a flop." My cousin looked at me and she said, "We also didn't think they'll be able to top Sims 2, but here we are". At that moment I decided to give Sims 4 a chance and on release date, I got my copy of the game. Huge disappointment. I played it for like a week and then decided it was trash. I uninstalled the game and kept playing the Sims 3.
Well... With the release for Sims 4 for PS4, I got a copy of the game for my PS4 again and somehow the improvement in just the base game itself was remarkable. I then started playing Sims 4 on PC again an bought all of the EP, GP and some SP to spice the game up a bit. And honestly now I just can't get enough. The Sims 4 has done it again! They made a better game than Sims 3. So yes, give them all the time in the world that they need to finish the Sims 4. I'll wait, because it's worth it.
Here is my opinion: The Sims 4 has so many small (and even hidden) details. These details might not be noticed by all, but they still take time to perfect and put in the game. They are what makes this game more realistic and the closest to a life simulation than the Sims team has ever been before. These little details are just perfect to me. I mean sure, Sims 3 went all out and had amazing features that would make Sims 4 an even better game if brought into the Sims 4, but they didn't and it's ok. The Sims 4 is it's own game. It's a new game. It's a detailed and fantastic game. It's a life simulation like no other. It's The Sims 4 and not The Sims 3, The Sims 2 or The Sims. It's perfect and every EP and GP that get's added just makes this game better and better
I respect you love the game but think of what I just posted, then tell me later, after about $1,000 or more if you thought it was worth the price tag, when the seven years have ended and you have seen the same emotions, traits, aspirations, and using the Sim pc over and over for everything if you would have paid that or would have gladly given $40 for a more entertaining, fuller, more indepth base.
With respect. Why should anyone answer you? It's becoming like bringing homework to the teacher.
It's our money and if it does last out the seven years that money has been well spent if you enjoy the game as it is.
Because the thread is about after four years, should it continue since it is still lacking most of everything (AI, objects, gameplay, Animations, Interactions, packs) the others had by this time, and they didn't cost an arm and a leg. ETA: Point to get most of that you or some would have paid out triple and seven years of your life, just askin' if that seems reasonable to you.
Seems the only answer, that you can retain or that you find acceptable to your ears would be "no". Multiple people including myself have answered that they enjoy the game and are looking forward to future content.
My sims have good AI. I can only speak for my own game. But my sims will go to the restroom or cook on their own at times. There is plenty of interaction and since the game is not complete and is still being developed there will be more.
Post edited by EnjoyfulSimmer on
"Let Our Hearts And Hands Be Streched Out In Compassion Toward Others."
Given that game development takes around 2-3 years, the announcement that sims4 will be supported for 3 years makes me think that they just started working on the sims5. I hope they already are working on it because in my opinion, sims4 while being fun and stable, feels like it is on it's last legs, anyone else that got worried that with the latest get famous expansion we got so few lots? Almost like the game could not handle more lots.
It would not surprise me if upcoming expansions would have even less lots and content.
I agree. There is a sense that content is slowing down from a trickle to a single, frail drip... and with each new expansion, including the most recent Get Famous, getting numerous complaints about being so truncated.
I would love to hear about sims 5 tomorrow, but it is likely we won't hear about anything for a long while we wait out the clock and any new content for ts4 is spread out perhaps even more thinly over the next few years... in my humble opinion.
Given that game development takes around 2-3 years, the announcement that sims4 will be supported for 3 years makes me think that they just started working on the sims5. I hope they already are working on it because in my opinion, sims4 while being fun and stable, feels like it is on it's last legs, anyone else that got worried that with the latest get famous expansion we got so few lots? Almost like the game could not handle more lots.
It would not surprise me if upcoming expansions would have even less lots and content.
I agree. There is a sense that content is slowing down from a trickle to a single, frail drip... and with each new expansion, including the most recent Get Famous, getting numerous complaints about being so truncated.
I would love to hear about sims 5 tomorrow, but it is likely we won't hear about anything for a long while we wait out the clock and any new content for ts4 is spread out perhaps even more thinly over the next few years... in my humble opinion.
I'm seeing the opposite. If I recall correctly the first 2 years it was mostly SPs. Within the past 15 months or so it's been 3 EPs and 1 GP which is much more meaningful than overused SPs or waiting 1 year for an EP (City Living). GTW had and still has numerous issues and it was the first EP, hell retail is still a nightmare unmodded.
And GF is IMO the one true celebrity pack that makes sense, and where it works more as a spectrum than in previous iterations. I loved TS1 superstar and wished to see something like it back without plaguing the entire town with shallow celebs. About the only complaint is world size and I believe they are being gimpy now that the game has a decent amount of data, only proving further that they know little about optimization.
Ok. I'll be honest. I've played The Sims since I was a toddler. Sims kept getting better and better and when Sims 3 was released my mind was blown! It was the best Sims game EVER! (and yes, most of the glory goes to horses and open world). I loved the Sims and I loved how the game grew. It became better and better.
And then one glorious day they announced Sims 4. I was surprised and I remember telling my cousin, "Well, I don't know how they're going to top Sims 3. I think Sims 4 is going to be a flop." My cousin looked at me and she said, "We also didn't think they'll be able to top Sims 2, but here we are". At that moment I decided to give Sims 4 a chance and on release date, I got my copy of the game. Huge disappointment. I played it for like a week and then decided it was trash. I uninstalled the game and kept playing the Sims 3.
Well... With the release for Sims 4 for PS4, I got a copy of the game for my PS4 again and somehow the improvement in just the base game itself was remarkable. I then started playing Sims 4 on PC again an bought all of the EP, GP and some SP to spice the game up a bit. And honestly now I just can't get enough. The Sims 4 has done it again! They made a better game than Sims 3. So yes, give them all the time in the world that they need to finish the Sims 4. I'll wait, because it's worth it.
Here is my opinion: The Sims 4 has so many small (and even hidden) details. These details might not be noticed by all, but they still take time to perfect and put in the game. They are what makes this game more realistic and the closest to a life simulation than the Sims team has ever been before. These little details are just perfect to me. I mean sure, Sims 3 went all out and had amazing features that would make Sims 4 an even better game if brought into the Sims 4, but they didn't and it's ok. The Sims 4 is it's own game. It's a new game. It's a detailed and fantastic game. It's a life simulation like no other. It's The Sims 4 and not The Sims 3, The Sims 2 or The Sims. It's perfect and every EP and GP that get's added just makes this game better and better
I respect you love the game but think of what I just posted, then tell me later, after about $1,000 or more if you thought it was worth the price tag, when the seven years have ended and you have seen the same emotions, traits, aspirations, and using the Sim pc over and over for everything if you would have paid that or would have gladly given $40 for a more entertaining, fuller, more indepth base.
With respect. Why should anyone answer you? It's becoming like bringing homework to the teacher.
It's our money and if it does last out the seven years that money has been well spent if you enjoy the game as it is.
Because the thread is about after four years, should it continue since it is still lacking most of everything (AI, objects, gameplay, Animations, Interactions, packs) the others had by this time, and they didn't cost an arm and a leg. ETA: Point to get most of that you or some would have paid out triple and seven years of your life, just askin' if that seems reasonable to you.
Seems the only answer, that you can retain or that you find acceptable to your ears would be "no". Multiple people including myself have answered that they enjoy the game and are looking forward to future content.
My sims have good AI. I can only speak for my own game. But my sims to go to the restroom and cook on their own at times. There is plenty of interaction and since the game is not complete and is still being developed there will be more.
I'm not trying to be contrary. Of course the only answer isn't no. I was just thinking about something before I logged back on here today. You know how a lot of people say they don't want to see the same packs with the next versions etc.? And always wanting something different. I wonder if any of us would continue to buy these games (series' version on and on) if they never added Seasons, or Pets, or cult packs, or fame packs, or open for business type packs? I'm wondering if they never added those things in this game or the next if we would think what they did release was worth the prices so far and worth four years of our time? Just musing, like if in the next version if we didn't see any weather, was only adults, never any pets, never any type of self employment or able to run shops etc, and or vacation areas? I wonder is we would think it or this one was that good. Point is, people want all that and more, and expect after four years the game would have all that, and as much as the others. I'm not sure players actually want things really different like they say they do. Because I doubt I would buy a TS5 if it was only adults or young adults or no aging, or no weather, ever, etc.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
Ok. I'll be honest. I've played The Sims since I was a toddler. Sims kept getting better and better and when Sims 3 was released my mind was blown! It was the best Sims game EVER! (and yes, most of the glory goes to horses and open world). I loved the Sims and I loved how the game grew. It became better and better.
And then one glorious day they announced Sims 4. I was surprised and I remember telling my cousin, "Well, I don't know how they're going to top Sims 3. I think Sims 4 is going to be a flop." My cousin looked at me and she said, "We also didn't think they'll be able to top Sims 2, but here we are". At that moment I decided to give Sims 4 a chance and on release date, I got my copy of the game. Huge disappointment. I played it for like a week and then decided it was trash. I uninstalled the game and kept playing the Sims 3.
Well... With the release for Sims 4 for PS4, I got a copy of the game for my PS4 again and somehow the improvement in just the base game itself was remarkable. I then started playing Sims 4 on PC again an bought all of the EP, GP and some SP to spice the game up a bit. And honestly now I just can't get enough. The Sims 4 has done it again! They made a better game than Sims 3. So yes, give them all the time in the world that they need to finish the Sims 4. I'll wait, because it's worth it.
Here is my opinion: The Sims 4 has so many small (and even hidden) details. These details might not be noticed by all, but they still take time to perfect and put in the game. They are what makes this game more realistic and the closest to a life simulation than the Sims team has ever been before. These little details are just perfect to me. I mean sure, Sims 3 went all out and had amazing features that would make Sims 4 an even better game if brought into the Sims 4, but they didn't and it's ok. The Sims 4 is it's own game. It's a new game. It's a detailed and fantastic game. It's a life simulation like no other. It's The Sims 4 and not The Sims 3, The Sims 2 or The Sims. It's perfect and every EP and GP that get's added just makes this game better and better
I respect you love the game but think of what I just posted, then tell me later, after about $1,000 or more if you thought it was worth the price tag, when the seven years have ended and you have seen the same emotions, traits, aspirations, and using the Sim pc over and over for everything if you would have paid that or would have gladly given $40 for a more entertaining, fuller, more indepth base.
With respect. Why should anyone answer you? It's becoming like bringing homework to the teacher.
It's our money and if it does last out the seven years that money has been well spent if you enjoy the game as it is.
Because the thread is about after four years, should it continue since it is still lacking most of everything (AI, objects, gameplay, Animations, Interactions, packs) the others had by this time, and they didn't cost an arm and a leg. ETA: Point to get most of that you or some would have paid out triple and seven years of your life, just askin' if that seems reasonable to you.
Seems the only answer, that you can retain or that you find acceptable to your ears would be "no". Multiple people including myself have answered that they enjoy the game and are looking forward to future content.
My sims have good AI. I can only speak for my own game. But my sims to go to the restroom and cook on their own at times. There is plenty of interaction and since the game is not complete and is still being developed there will be more.
I'm not trying to be contrary. Of course the only answer isn't no. I was just thinking about something before I logged back on here today. You know how a lot of people say they don't want to see the same packs with the next versions etc.? And always wanting something different. I wonder if any of us would continue to buy these games (series' version on and on) if they never added Seasons, or Pets, or cult packs, or fame packs, or open for business type packs? I'm wondering if they never added those things in this game or the next if we would think what they did release was worth the prices so far and worth four year's of our time? Just musing, like if in the next version if we didn't see any weather, was only adults, never any pets, never any type of self employment or able to run shops etc, and or vacation areas? I wonder is we would think it or this one was that good. Point is people want all that and more, and expect after four years the game would have all that, and as much as the others. I'm not sure players actually want things really different like they say they do. Because I doubt I would buy a TS5 if it was only adults or young adults or no aging, or no weather, ever, etc.
I agree with your post and I have no problem with buying the next version even if have the same names as long as the packs are done right and include new material along with most of the old. However as far as the base game goes they have to give it more muscle that was previously offered also take some parts of the packs that is offered and include those parts in the base game and how they price those packs. I will never preorder the Sims 5(if it shows itself) or any other game unless that Dev is consistent in what it releases. I rather wait and hold my cash until I see where the next version is going and if it happens to be the same path Sims 4 took, it is truly time to say goodbye and spend my cash on other franchises worth my time.
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Ok. I'll be honest. I've played The Sims since I was a toddler. Sims kept getting better and better and when Sims 3 was released my mind was blown! It was the best Sims game EVER! (and yes, most of the glory goes to horses and open world). I loved the Sims and I loved how the game grew. It became better and better.
And then one glorious day they announced Sims 4. I was surprised and I remember telling my cousin, "Well, I don't know how they're going to top Sims 3. I think Sims 4 is going to be a flop." My cousin looked at me and she said, "We also didn't think they'll be able to top Sims 2, but here we are". At that moment I decided to give Sims 4 a chance and on release date, I got my copy of the game. Huge disappointment. I played it for like a week and then decided it was trash. I uninstalled the game and kept playing the Sims 3.
Well... With the release for Sims 4 for PS4, I got a copy of the game for my PS4 again and somehow the improvement in just the base game itself was remarkable. I then started playing Sims 4 on PC again an bought all of the EP, GP and some SP to spice the game up a bit. And honestly now I just can't get enough. The Sims 4 has done it again! They made a better game than Sims 3. So yes, give them all the time in the world that they need to finish the Sims 4. I'll wait, because it's worth it.
Here is my opinion: The Sims 4 has so many small (and even hidden) details. These details might not be noticed by all, but they still take time to perfect and put in the game. They are what makes this game more realistic and the closest to a life simulation than the Sims team has ever been before. These little details are just perfect to me. I mean sure, Sims 3 went all out and had amazing features that would make Sims 4 an even better game if brought into the Sims 4, but they didn't and it's ok. The Sims 4 is it's own game. It's a new game. It's a detailed and fantastic game. It's a life simulation like no other. It's The Sims 4 and not The Sims 3, The Sims 2 or The Sims. It's perfect and every EP and GP that get's added just makes this game better and better
I respect you love the game but think of what I just posted, then tell me later, after about $1,000 or more if you thought it was worth the price tag, when the seven years have ended and you have seen the same emotions, traits, aspirations, and using the Sim pc over and over for everything if you would have paid that or would have gladly given $40 for a more entertaining, fuller, more indepth base.
With respect. Why should anyone answer you? It's becoming like bringing homework to the teacher.
It's our money and if it does last out the seven years that money has been well spent if you enjoy the game as it is.
Because the thread is about after four years, should it continue since it is still lacking most of everything (AI, objects, gameplay, Animations, Interactions, packs) the others had by this time, and they didn't cost an arm and a leg. ETA: Point to get most of that you or some would have paid out triple and seven years of your life, just askin' if that seems reasonable to you.
Seems the only answer, that you can retain or that you find acceptable to your ears would be "no". Multiple people including myself have answered that they enjoy the game and are looking forward to future content.
My sims have good AI. I can only speak for my own game. But my sims to go to the restroom and cook on their own at times. There is plenty of interaction and since the game is not complete and is still being developed there will be more.
I'm not trying to be contrary. Of course the only answer isn't no. I was just thinking about something before I logged back on here today. You know how a lot of people say they don't want to see the same packs with the next versions etc.? And always wanting something different. I wonder if any of us would continue to buy these games (series' version on and on) if they never added Seasons, or Pets, or cult packs, or fame packs, or open for business type packs? I'm wondering if they never added those things in this game or the next if we would think what they did release was worth the prices so far and worth four year's of our time? Just musing, like if in the next version if we didn't see any weather, was only adults, never any pets, never any type of self employment or able to run shops etc, and or vacation areas? I wonder is we would think it or this one was that good. Point is people want all that and more, and expect after four years the game would have all that, and as much as the others. I'm not sure players actually want things really different like they say they do. Because I doubt I would buy a TS5 if it was only adults or young adults or no aging, or no weather, ever, etc.
I agree with your post and I have no problem with buying the next version even if have the same names as long as the packs are done right and include new material along with most of the old. However as far as the base game goes they have to give it more muscle that was previously offered also take some parts of the packs that is offered and include those parts in the base game and how they price those packs. I will never preorder the Sims 5(if it shows itself) or any other game unless that Dev is consistent in what it releases. I rather wait and hold my cash until I see where the next version is going and if it happens to be the same path Sims 4 took, it is truly time to say goodbye and spend my cash on other franchises worth my time.
Yes, this live service stuff isn't my thing, I don't like to be bothered every month. Nor, wait to see if my game is going to be fixed this time or not, and or what might be 'free'. I think it did more harm to this community than good, and in a lot of was made people more disinterested or disappointed or aggravated, and wasn't all that and a bag of chips.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
@Cinebar, Feedback can be quite toxic...when feedback is emotionally charged rather than based in facts, includes personal attacks rather than constructive criticism, and/or is worded in an aggressively, negative manner it would be toxic feedback. Generally the forum rules would prohibit all of this other than the emotionally charged kind and the gurus tend to pop into threads and remove the most toxic posts and then ask nicely for people to keep things constructive.
The feedback forums here are, honestly, quite rosie compared to unmoderated forums, and I think this community as a whole is pretty open-minded to opposing viewpoints although the divide in opinions over TS4 is definitely the biggest schism I've ever seen in the simming community in the history of the franchise.
We have to wonder don't we, if game changers ever said or improved the games before release. If it's true they get to enable early collaborative feedback for improvements, then I'm not seeing it. What I see is a lot of hype and ooohs, and aws, after the fact. Because it's obvivous, six residential lots were not improved...or maybe it was from two to six? Will never know, unless some game changer tells what input they gave and how Maxis listened and improved something.
I can't believe all those game changers who are veteran Simmers actually enjoy check lists, but it seems we get more and more of them, so maybe they do, or maybe they don't get to tell Maxis that's not sandbox or interesting. But it really is hard for me to believe experienced players as Maxis called them expert players?(what are we?) love check lists, I highly doubt it.
ETA: I will clarify that, It's my belief their core base is still playing TS2 or TS3, and highly doubt many of them play TS4. Maybe sometime, but doubt those expert players of their original core base would touch TS4.
Well the results of a poll I ran on the forum a year ago seem to indicate just the opposite. The majority of the simmers who enjoy the Sims 4 here on the forum, which traditionally caters to veteran simmers, began playing with the original Sims game. And the next largest majority started with the Sims 2. Surprisingly, those starting with the Sims 4 comprised the smallest percentage. I ran that poll because like your statement there had been comments that only players new to the game and didn't know what they were missing could possibly enjoy the Sims 4. Of course this was a year ago so maybe another poll is in order.
ETA: You may be right in your belief that the core base is still playing 2 and 3 though because i still do. Along with 4.
Thanks for sharing those results.
A lot has happened in the last year and most of it not good quality wise in my opinion. So I agree that another poll might be in order. A poll which showed when simmers started playing who do not like TS4 would also be interesting to see.
Regardless, we're still not going to see TS5, if at all, for about 3 years or more.
How many do you think played TS3 and still playing...thousands and thousands and your poll only shows 83, I would bet there are more than that down in the TS3 section right now.
The poll shows 83 respondents who enjoyed Sims 4 at the time of the poll started with Sims 3. Has nothing to do with the number of simmers playing Sims 3. Heck, I still play 3. And 2. I don't think we're ever going to get a game that gives us everything we want in one version.
Yes, you are right about that, we will never see a game version that gives us everythig we want. But let's just admit right now, TS2 and TS3 came pretty close. Not so much for TS4.
Objection. The witness is stating an opinion.
Is it your honor? lol (All in good fun). I don't know, we wanted more open areas (TS3) we wanted ability to move vacant lots (TS2/TS3) we wanted more consequences (TS2/TS3) we wanted supernaturals (TS2/TS3) we wanted more build tools (TS2/TS3) etc. etc. As I said not so much in TS4.
Again, opinion. Open world was a buggy mess for many of us. I was playing on the Mac during Sims 3, and all I wanted was a native Mac coded version rather than playing under the Cider emulator, and I got that with S4 (ironically I'm now on a Windows laptop) so that's an automatic plus. Placing vacant lots with World Builder was also buggy since you couldn't give those lots a proper address. No worries about that in Sims 4. More consequences could be added in packs and patches if the outcry is there. Supernaturals: we've gotten vampires and they're the best ones of any Sims series; I'm pretty sure that more will be forthcoming (witches didn't arrive in S2 until one of the last two packs, and those packs didn't get ported to the Mac so I never got to play with them). We got terrain tools patched in and while there are some issues they're likely continuing to work and improve them.
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I was hoping for maybe one more year of content because as others have said, TS4 will feel incomplete. Five years seems like a nice number. Also, I don't want them to rush out TS5 just to please us Simmers. There is already criticism from some about how in many ways,Sims4 isn't as good as Sims3 or Sims2 and so on along with all the game lags, bugs, or ongoing issues with the game. I want TS5 to knock our socks off and not be underwhelming which I think it will be the case if they release it too soon. Additionally, they have to make sure everybody's PC can handle a (hopefully) new and advanced game.
Sims 3 had a lot of bugs and lag as well - I had to install mods like Overwatch from NRaas to resolve them. Remember the spawning cars bug from Late Night? Then I used Master Controller to turn off features that were causing save bloat and corruption, like the memories feature, or that were just plain annoying like every Sim turning into a celebrity with Late Night, or into supernaturals with Supernatural. Then I found that I liked the customization options in NRaas' Story Progression, Register allowed me to control autoomous actions so my Sims wouldn't get diabetes from continuous use of the ice cream machine and deep fryer...etc.
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Fun must be always -- Tomas Hertl (San Jose Sharks hockey player)
Ok. I'll be honest. I've played The Sims since I was a toddler. Sims kept getting better and better and when Sims 3 was released my mind was blown! It was the best Sims game EVER! (and yes, most of the glory goes to horses and open world). I loved the Sims and I loved how the game grew. It became better and better.
And then one glorious day they announced Sims 4. I was surprised and I remember telling my cousin, "Well, I don't know how they're going to top Sims 3. I think Sims 4 is going to be a flop." My cousin looked at me and she said, "We also didn't think they'll be able to top Sims 2, but here we are". At that moment I decided to give Sims 4 a chance and on release date, I got my copy of the game. Huge disappointment. I played it for like a week and then decided it was trash. I uninstalled the game and kept playing the Sims 3.
Well... With the release for Sims 4 for PS4, I got a copy of the game for my PS4 again and somehow the improvement in just the base game itself was remarkable. I then started playing Sims 4 on PC again an bought all of the EP, GP and some SP to spice the game up a bit. And honestly now I just can't get enough. The Sims 4 has done it again! They made a better game than Sims 3. So yes, give them all the time in the world that they need to finish the Sims 4. I'll wait, because it's worth it.
Here is my opinion: The Sims 4 has so many small (and even hidden) details. These details might not be noticed by all, but they still take time to perfect and put in the game. They are what makes this game more realistic and the closest to a life simulation than the Sims team has ever been before. These little details are just perfect to me. I mean sure, Sims 3 went all out and had amazing features that would make Sims 4 an even better game if brought into the Sims 4, but they didn't and it's ok. The Sims 4 is it's own game. It's a new game. It's a detailed and fantastic game. It's a life simulation like no other. It's The Sims 4 and not The Sims 3, The Sims 2 or The Sims. It's perfect and every EP and GP that get's added just makes this game better and better
I respect you love the game but think of what I just posted, then tell me later, after about $1,000 or more if you thought it was worth the price tag, when the seven years have ended and you have seen the same emotions, traits, aspirations, and using the Sim pc over and over for everything if you would have paid that or would have gladly given $40 for a more entertaining, fuller, more indepth base.
With respect. Why should anyone answer you? It's becoming like bringing homework to the teacher.
It's our money and if it does last out the seven years that money has been well spent if you enjoy the game as it is.
Because the thread is about after four years, should it continue since it is still lacking most of everything (AI, objects, gameplay, Animations, Interactions, packs) the others had by this time, and they didn't cost an arm and a leg. ETA: Point to get most of that you or some would have paid out triple and seven years of your life, just askin' if that seems reasonable to you.
Seems the only answer, that you can retain or that you find acceptable to your ears would be "no". Multiple people including myself have answered that they enjoy the game and are looking forward to future content.
My sims have good AI. I can only speak for my own game. But my sims to go to the restroom and cook on their own at times. There is plenty of interaction and since the game is not complete and is still being developed there will be more.
I'm not trying to be contrary. Of course the only answer isn't no. I was just thinking about something before I logged back on here today. You know how a lot of people say they don't want to see the same packs with the next versions etc.? And always wanting something different. I wonder if any of us would continue to buy these games (series' version on and on) if they never added Seasons, or Pets, or cult packs, or fame packs, or open for business type packs? I'm wondering if they never added those things in this game or the next if we would think what they did release was worth the prices so far and worth four year's of our time? Just musing, like if in the next version if we didn't see any weather, was only adults, never any pets, never any type of self employment or able to run shops etc, and or vacation areas? I wonder is we would think it or this one was that good. Point is people want all that and more, and expect after four years the game would have all that, and as much as the others. I'm not sure players actually want things really different like they say they do. Because I doubt I would buy a TS5 if it was only adults or young adults or no aging, or no weather, ever, etc.
I agree with your post and I have no problem with buying the next version even if have the same names as long as the packs are done right and include new material along with most of the old. However as far as the base game goes they have to give it more muscle that was previously offered also take some parts of the packs that is offered and include those parts in the base game and how they price those packs. I will never preorder the Sims 5(if it shows itself) or any other game unless that Dev is consistent in what it releases. I rather wait and hold my cash until I see where the next version is going and if it happens to be the same path Sims 4 took, it is truly time to say goodbye and spend my cash on other franchises worth my time.
A base game is just that -- a base on which to add future content. A base game needs:
Sims (CAS, a basic personality system)
Places for Sims to live (Build Mode) and to help them live comfortably (Buy Mode)
Skills and ways to build them
A way to use those skills to make Simoleons (careers)
Activites (stuff for Sims to do)
A base game doesn't need weather, pets, supernaturals. Some people might not want those features in their game, or at least not in every save (which is why the hypothetical Sims 5 should offer toggles).
Also remember that The Sims caters to a wide audience, including those who can't afford or have no need for an ultra-souped up gaming rig. While at this point they could up the requirements a tad for Sims 5 (maybe Windows 10 minimum for PC and the current version of MacOS for Mac) and maybe the processor/graphic requirements to whatever is in the current midrange laptop, they're not going to want to anger their current fanbase by requiring most of them to have to shell out a couple of thousand dollars for a new computer on top of the money for a new base game.
Maybe I'm just weird but I'm perfectly fine with the Sims 4 at this late date; all I absolutely need are University and my witches and I'll be fine, though I'll likely get whatever they offer just because I'm a completionist, plus I might not use everything from a pack but there'll be enough there to make it worth the investment.
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Fun must be always -- Tomas Hertl (San Jose Sharks hockey player)
We have to wonder don't we, if game changers ever said or improved the games before release. If it's true they get to enable early collaborative feedback for improvements, then I'm not seeing it. What I see is a lot of hype and ooohs, and aws, after the fact. Because it's obvivous, six residential lots were not improved...or maybe it was from two to six? Will never know, unless some game changer tells what input they gave and how Maxis listened and improved something.
I can't believe all those game changers who are veteran Simmers actually enjoy check lists, but it seems we get more and more of them, so maybe they do, or maybe they don't get to tell Maxis that's not sandbox or interesting. But it really is hard for me to believe experienced players as Maxis called them expert players?(what are we?) love check lists, I highly doubt it.
ETA: I will clarify that, It's my belief their core base is still playing TS2 or TS3, and highly doubt many of them play TS4. Maybe sometime, but doubt those expert players of their original core base would touch TS4.
Well the results of a poll I ran on the forum a year ago seem to indicate just the opposite. The majority of the simmers who enjoy the Sims 4 here on the forum, which traditionally caters to veteran simmers, began playing with the original Sims game. And the next largest majority started with the Sims 2. Surprisingly, those starting with the Sims 4 comprised the smallest percentage. I ran that poll because like your statement there had been comments that only players new to the game and didn't know what they were missing could possibly enjoy the Sims 4. Of course this was a year ago so maybe another poll is in order.
ETA: You may be right in your belief that the core base is still playing 2 and 3 though because i still do. Along with 4.
Thanks for sharing those results.
A lot has happened in the last year and most of it not good quality wise in my opinion. So I agree that another poll might be in order. A poll which showed when simmers started playing who do not like TS4 would also be interesting to see.
Regardless, we're still not going to see TS5, if at all, for about 3 years or more.
How many do you think played TS3 and still playing...thousands and thousands and your poll only shows 83, I would bet there are more than that down in the TS3 section right now.
The poll shows 83 respondents who enjoyed Sims 4 at the time of the poll started with Sims 3. Has nothing to do with the number of simmers playing Sims 3. Heck, I still play 3. And 2. I don't think we're ever going to get a game that gives us everything we want in one version.
Yes, you are right about that, we will never see a game version that gives us everythig we want. But let's just admit right now, TS2 and TS3 came pretty close. Not so much for TS4.
Objection. The witness is stating an opinion.
Is it your honor? lol (All in good fun). I don't know, we wanted more open areas (TS3) we wanted ability to move vacant lots (TS2/TS3) we wanted more consequences (TS2/TS3) we wanted supernaturals (TS2/TS3) we wanted more build tools (TS2/TS3) etc. etc. As I said not so much in TS4.
Again, opinion. Open world was a buggy mess for many of us. I was playing on the Mac during Sims 3, and all I wanted was a native Mac coded version rather than playing under the Cider emulator, and I got that with S4 (ironically I'm now on a Windows laptop) so that's an automatic plus. Placing vacant lots with World Builder was also buggy since you couldn't give those lots a proper address. No worries about that in Sims 4. More consequences could be added in packs and patches if the outcry is there. Supernaturals: we've gotten vampires and they're the best ones of any Sims series; I'm pretty sure that more will be forthcoming (witches didn't arrive in S2 until one of the last two packs, and those packs didn't get ported to the Mac so I never got to play with them). We got terrain tools patched in and while there are some issues they're likely continuing to work and improve them.
Even so that should not be a reason to go backwards. I mean even TS2 let us place and edit lots. Let us make our own neighborhoods, if we want to have a poor area with nothing but 15x20 houses and dirty stores or luxurious 6 lot hoods, we shouod be able tom After all, this is something a game from 2004 had, and that's my biggest qualm with TS4. Worlds are all fake and static, like The Sims 1 (2000)
Open world was not the cause of lag per se, poor programming and amateur developers or lack of care was. Copious routing issues, bloating of garbage data, no proper garbage collection system like Overwatch, etc.
Ok. I'll be honest. I've played The Sims since I was a toddler. Sims kept getting better and better and when Sims 3 was released my mind was blown! It was the best Sims game EVER! (and yes, most of the glory goes to horses and open world). I loved the Sims and I loved how the game grew. It became better and better.
And then one glorious day they announced Sims 4. I was surprised and I remember telling my cousin, "Well, I don't know how they're going to top Sims 3. I think Sims 4 is going to be a flop." My cousin looked at me and she said, "We also didn't think they'll be able to top Sims 2, but here we are". At that moment I decided to give Sims 4 a chance and on release date, I got my copy of the game. Huge disappointment. I played it for like a week and then decided it was trash. I uninstalled the game and kept playing the Sims 3.
Well... With the release for Sims 4 for PS4, I got a copy of the game for my PS4 again and somehow the improvement in just the base game itself was remarkable. I then started playing Sims 4 on PC again an bought all of the EP, GP and some SP to spice the game up a bit. And honestly now I just can't get enough. The Sims 4 has done it again! They made a better game than Sims 3. So yes, give them all the time in the world that they need to finish the Sims 4. I'll wait, because it's worth it.
Here is my opinion: The Sims 4 has so many small (and even hidden) details. These details might not be noticed by all, but they still take time to perfect and put in the game. They are what makes this game more realistic and the closest to a life simulation than the Sims team has ever been before. These little details are just perfect to me. I mean sure, Sims 3 went all out and had amazing features that would make Sims 4 an even better game if brought into the Sims 4, but they didn't and it's ok. The Sims 4 is it's own game. It's a new game. It's a detailed and fantastic game. It's a life simulation like no other. It's The Sims 4 and not The Sims 3, The Sims 2 or The Sims. It's perfect and every EP and GP that get's added just makes this game better and better
I respect you love the game but think of what I just posted, then tell me later, after about $1,000 or more if you thought it was worth the price tag, when the seven years have ended and you have seen the same emotions, traits, aspirations, and using the Sim pc over and over for everything if you would have paid that or would have gladly given $40 for a more entertaining, fuller, more indepth base.
With respect. Why should anyone answer you? It's becoming like bringing homework to the teacher.
It's our money and if it does last out the seven years that money has been well spent if you enjoy the game as it is.
Because the thread is about after four years, should it continue since it is still lacking most of everything (AI, objects, gameplay, Animations, Interactions, packs) the others had by this time, and they didn't cost an arm and a leg. ETA: Point to get most of that you or some would have paid out triple and seven years of your life, just askin' if that seems reasonable to you.
Seems the only answer, that you can retain or that you find acceptable to your ears would be "no". Multiple people including myself have answered that they enjoy the game and are looking forward to future content.
My sims have good AI. I can only speak for my own game. But my sims to go to the restroom and cook on their own at times. There is plenty of interaction and since the game is not complete and is still being developed there will be more.
I'm not trying to be contrary. Of course the only answer isn't no. I was just thinking about something before I logged back on here today. You know how a lot of people say they don't want to see the same packs with the next versions etc.? And always wanting something different. I wonder if any of us would continue to buy these games (series' version on and on) if they never added Seasons, or Pets, or cult packs, or fame packs, or open for business type packs? I'm wondering if they never added those things in this game or the next if we would think what they did release was worth the prices so far and worth four year's of our time? Just musing, like if in the next version if we didn't see any weather, was only adults, never any pets, never any type of self employment or able to run shops etc, and or vacation areas? I wonder is we would think it or this one was that good. Point is people want all that and more, and expect after four years the game would have all that, and as much as the others. I'm not sure players actually want things really different like they say they do. Because I doubt I would buy a TS5 if it was only adults or young adults or no aging, or no weather, ever, etc.
I agree with your post and I have no problem with buying the next version even if have the same names as long as the packs are done right and include new material along with most of the old. However as far as the base game goes they have to give it more muscle that was previously offered also take some parts of the packs that is offered and include those parts in the base game and how they price those packs. I will never preorder the Sims 5(if it shows itself) or any other game unless that Dev is consistent in what it releases. I rather wait and hold my cash until I see where the next version is going and if it happens to be the same path Sims 4 took, it is truly time to say goodbye and spend my cash on other franchises worth my time.
A base game is just that -- a base on which to add future content. A base game needs:
Sims (CAS, a basic personality system)
Places for Sims to live (Build Mode) and to help them live comfortably (Buy Mode)
Skills and ways to build them
A way to use those skills to make Simoleons (careers)
Activites (stuff for Sims to do)
A base game doesn't need weather, pets, supernaturals. Some people might not want those features in their game, or at least not in every save (which is why the hypothetical Sims 5 should offer toggles).
Also remember that The Sims caters to a wide audience, including those who can't afford or have no need for an ultra-souped up gaming rig. While at this point they could up the requirements a tad for Sims 5 (maybe Windows 10 minimum for PC and the current version of MacOS for Mac) and maybe the processor/graphic requirements to whatever is in the current midrange laptop, they're not going to want to anger their current fanbase by requiring most of them to have to shell out a couple of thousand dollars for a new computer on top of the money for a new base game.
Maybe I'm just weird but I'm perfectly fine with the Sims 4 at this late date; all I absolutely need are University and my witches and I'll be fine, though I'll likely get whatever they offer just because I'm a completionist, plus I might not use everything from a pack but there'll be enough there to make it worth the investment.
Everything you just posted is your opinion as mine is my opinion. Hmmm, Sims developers cater to an wide range of users with various levels of systems that is true however, it treats each system the same regardless of what that system can do and each pack made is gimped as not to affect the performance. Now normally this would not be an problem with some mid level and high end systems and would affect more of the lower end systems. It does pose an problem when an system that is capable of handling many computer processes and is handicapped intentionally as not to use the specs effectively it possesses being the program cannot scale up or down to what each system possesses. If that was the case I should have went out and buy or put together an system paying the least amount of money. As posted you may be satisfied with what is offered but not everyone is satisfied with what is offered and if you are that is your bar and I too collect software with one difference I will never pay what is asked for software that I feel is not worth the asking price and wait for the price to drop to get it when I feel it is worth it. As far as what an base can contain is again is your opinion and I have mine and again as I posted I will not rush out and dive in if Sims 5 comes about and wait and see how it flows first because the base game will dictate if it is an yay or nay. as customers most have different tastes and what they want or expect out of an program or anything in life.
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Im not buying sims 5 without create a style. Im just NOT. Im not doing that again. I am fine without it in sims 4, because this game was intended to be simpler. And its entertaining enough without those things that I can keep on playing, and I do. But I swear that I am not buying sims 5 without open world.I wont be moving on , if its not a different playing experience than Sims 4.
If sims 5 doesnt have the gallery feature , that also will be a deal-breaker, because I love being able to download others creations easily and share my own creations .
So there is a lot that will have to be implemented with Sims 5 before I consider picking up a copy for myself.
"Let Our Hearts And Hands Be Streched Out In Compassion Toward Others."
Ok. I'll be honest. I've played The Sims since I was a toddler. Sims kept getting better and better and when Sims 3 was released my mind was blown! It was the best Sims game EVER! (and yes, most of the glory goes to horses and open world). I loved the Sims and I loved how the game grew. It became better and better.
And then one glorious day they announced Sims 4. I was surprised and I remember telling my cousin, "Well, I don't know how they're going to top Sims 3. I think Sims 4 is going to be a flop." My cousin looked at me and she said, "We also didn't think they'll be able to top Sims 2, but here we are". At that moment I decided to give Sims 4 a chance and on release date, I got my copy of the game. Huge disappointment. I played it for like a week and then decided it was trash. I uninstalled the game and kept playing the Sims 3.
Well... With the release for Sims 4 for PS4, I got a copy of the game for my PS4 again and somehow the improvement in just the base game itself was remarkable. I then started playing Sims 4 on PC again an bought all of the EP, GP and some SP to spice the game up a bit. And honestly now I just can't get enough. The Sims 4 has done it again! They made a better game than Sims 3. So yes, give them all the time in the world that they need to finish the Sims 4. I'll wait, because it's worth it.
Here is my opinion: The Sims 4 has so many small (and even hidden) details. These details might not be noticed by all, but they still take time to perfect and put in the game. They are what makes this game more realistic and the closest to a life simulation than the Sims team has ever been before. These little details are just perfect to me. I mean sure, Sims 3 went all out and had amazing features that would make Sims 4 an even better game if brought into the Sims 4, but they didn't and it's ok. The Sims 4 is it's own game. It's a new game. It's a detailed and fantastic game. It's a life simulation like no other. It's The Sims 4 and not The Sims 3, The Sims 2 or The Sims. It's perfect and every EP and GP that get's added just makes this game better and better
I respect you love the game but think of what I just posted, then tell me later, after about $1,000 or more if you thought it was worth the price tag, when the seven years have ended and you have seen the same emotions, traits, aspirations, and using the Sim pc over and over for everything if you would have paid that or would have gladly given $40 for a more entertaining, fuller, more indepth base.
With respect. Why should anyone answer you? It's becoming like bringing homework to the teacher.
It's our money and if it does last out the seven years that money has been well spent if you enjoy the game as it is.
Because the thread is about after four years, should it continue since it is still lacking most of everything (AI, objects, gameplay, Animations, Interactions, packs) the others had by this time, and they didn't cost an arm and a leg. ETA: Point to get most of that you or some would have paid out triple and seven years of your life, just askin' if that seems reasonable to you.
I've already answered the reasonable question .. yes for me it is. Everything is smoother animated and more involved than my Sims 2 gameplay ever was. I can tell more stories and delve deeper into playing different characters types as these packs come out. I can have them do things that for story purposes are way more involved. I like the current system that takes an idea and fleshes it out. I have many for instances but yoga is a good stereotypical for instance for me. I can make a more new-agey type that is into yoga and wellness, eats vegan, grows and splices their indoor garden, keeps bees for honey, collects crystals, burns incense, meditates, maybe practices massage and dresses the part (in different ways even) all while looking wonderful doing it with great, smooth animations to watch and back up my story. If I go in game I bet I can list a few other things that help that stereotype along actually or take it down diverging paths. In Sims 2 I could have them practice goofy yoga anywhere in a sweatsuit if there was more to it I never ran across it or couldn't find enough to make that character work or even contemplate having that type in my game. Other iterations at least the ones I played didn't have this by that time.. they never had this at this level. Do I have to play for it .. umm yes. You gotta pay for most stuff you want in this world. Do I want more fleshing out for different characters like I have for that new agey character... oh yes. I already have many other types in my game actually that way surpassed what I had in the last games I played and I want more for them even, because all those little details make the story bigger.
As for what @Simburian said... I do agree actually. There is no need to justify and many smarter simmers than me that enjoy Sims 4 just stay away from feedback threads like this at this point. It's been happening for awhile now... I'm learning, albeit slowly. This isn't an overview of what simmers in general want or even those on this form want. It's a thread about being disgruntled with what is happening in this game and series and that's okay. But don't expect that people will flock to the thread to tell you why this series should last longer. They are giving their attention to the game or other things that matter to them.
That probably is the difference between the way you and I play.
I get zero fulfillment out of watching a Sim do yoga and burn incense. That, to me, is not fun at all. I do like telling stories in my game, but even that's a challenge with the random, wacky emotion system of TS4, Sims that I can't truly personalize the way I'd like, and the necessity for me to use an overwhelming amount of my own imagination because the game is frequently doing its own thing.
I think that really highlights the issue with TS4, though. It's too focused on material things -- buying a $20 pack solely to watch your Sims go do yoga and head to a spa that offers no significant gameplay depth other than just sitting there and watching them get moodlets from animations. Spending $20 to watch them take a whole day to eat food at a fancy restaurant. Spending $10 to watch them bowl.
In The Sims 2, these elements were placed into a much bigger pack, and were only considered side thoughts. Packs actually expanded the core game, with new aspirations, wishes/wants (which was nowhere near as useless as whims), new AI mechanics, and more. They actually expanded the game in significant ways. The Sims 4's packs are here to pretty much throw fluff on top of a foundation that can't even handle worlds larger than 5 lots nowadays, from what it seems.
Add the fluff. But also support it by actually expanding the game with new game mechanics, AI improvements, and more. Imagine if Stardew Valley, a popular indie farming life simulation, scrapped or poorly designed the whole idea of making money, growing crops, building up a farm the way you'd like (i.e the core game) in favor of features like braiding your pixel horse's hair. That's what this series has become, focused on, what I feel, are the wrong things. There's little challenge, little depth, and it downright doesn't feel like a life simulation game to the scale of TS1, TS2, and TS3.
Folks, a quick reminder that we need to be respectful to one and other - you may not agree with people's thoughts/opinions on The Sims 4 vs other Sims titles, but let's just remember to keep it civil. Thank you~
~my hair color is frequently changing, so my Sim reflects that~
We have to wonder don't we, if game changers ever said or improved the games before release. If it's true they get to enable early collaborative feedback for improvements, then I'm not seeing it. What I see is a lot of hype and ooohs, and aws, after the fact. Because it's obvivous, six residential lots were not improved...or maybe it was from two to six? Will never know, unless some game changer tells what input they gave and how Maxis listened and improved something.
I can't believe all those game changers who are veteran Simmers actually enjoy check lists, but it seems we get more and more of them, so maybe they do, or maybe they don't get to tell Maxis that's not sandbox or interesting. But it really is hard for me to believe experienced players as Maxis called them expert players?(what are we?) love check lists, I highly doubt it.
ETA: I will clarify that, It's my belief their core base is still playing TS2 or TS3, and highly doubt many of them play TS4. Maybe sometime, but doubt those expert players of their original core base would touch TS4.
Well the results of a poll I ran on the forum a year ago seem to indicate just the opposite. The majority of the simmers who enjoy the Sims 4 here on the forum, which traditionally caters to veteran simmers, began playing with the original Sims game. And the next largest majority started with the Sims 2. Surprisingly, those starting with the Sims 4 comprised the smallest percentage. I ran that poll because like your statement there had been comments that only players new to the game and didn't know what they were missing could possibly enjoy the Sims 4. Of course this was a year ago so maybe another poll is in order.
ETA: You may be right in your belief that the core base is still playing 2 and 3 though because i still do. Along with 4.
Thanks for sharing those results.
A lot has happened in the last year and most of it not good quality wise in my opinion. So I agree that another poll might be in order. A poll which showed when simmers started playing who do not like TS4 would also be interesting to see.
Regardless, we're still not going to see TS5, if at all, for about 3 years or more.
How many do you think played TS3 and still playing...thousands and thousands and your poll only shows 83, I would bet there are more than that down in the TS3 section right now.
The poll shows 83 respondents who enjoyed Sims 4 at the time of the poll started with Sims 3. Has nothing to do with the number of simmers playing Sims 3. Heck, I still play 3. And 2. I don't think we're ever going to get a game that gives us everything we want in one version.
Yes, you are right about that, we will never see a game version that gives us everythig we want. But let's just admit right now, TS2 and TS3 came pretty close. Not so much for TS4.
Objection. The witness is stating an opinion.
Is it your honor? lol (All in good fun). I don't know, we wanted more open areas (TS3) we wanted ability to move vacant lots (TS2/TS3) we wanted more consequences (TS2/TS3) we wanted supernaturals (TS2/TS3) we wanted more build tools (TS2/TS3) etc. etc. As I said not so much in TS4.
Again, opinion. Open world was a buggy mess for many of us. I was playing on the Mac during Sims 3, and all I wanted was a native Mac coded version rather than playing under the Cider emulator, and I got that with S4 (ironically I'm now on a Windows laptop) so that's an automatic plus. Placing vacant lots with World Builder was also buggy since you couldn't give those lots a proper address. No worries about that in Sims 4. More consequences could be added in packs and patches if the outcry is there. Supernaturals: we've gotten vampires and they're the best ones of any Sims series; I'm pretty sure that more will be forthcoming (witches didn't arrive in S2 until one of the last two packs, and those packs didn't get ported to the Mac so I never got to play with them). We got terrain tools patched in and while there are some issues they're likely continuing to work and improve them.
Have we really thought about how many more EPs and tools and or stuff packs (or AKA store) set out to release to players compared to the four years of TS4. It's hard to fathom this game has as much or as indepth as older games comparing pack to pack, and quanity of the previous games. You name some things that are good and I agree better than TS2 vampires. They get A+ on that pack, however, they don't get a high grade from me concerning other things, like terrian tools that can't even dig a basement into it, or a big hole with water in it. Maybe before rushing things out just to pipe down the ongoing uproars that happen around here stemed from 'lack of content' protests, they should have kept it a secret a little longer and made the feature as good or even better than in previous games. You know what I'm saying? If it can't surpass something from the past, maybe it shouldn't be done. Or at least much more polished before releasing. I'm not sure why many of us are willing to go along with buy now, fix later....we wouldn't buy a car like that. And if someone gifted us something half broken or not something we wanted, I think we turn around and regift, or say thank you, but no.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
@Cinebar, Feedback can be quite toxic...when feedback is emotionally charged rather than based in facts, includes personal attacks rather than constructive criticism, and/or is worded in an aggressively, negative manner it would be toxic feedback. Generally the forum rules would prohibit all of this other than the emotionally charged kind and the gurus tend to pop into threads and remove the most toxic posts and then ask nicely for people to keep things constructive.
The feedback forums here are, honestly, quite rosie compared to unmoderated forums, and I think this community as a whole is pretty open-minded to opposing viewpoints although the divide in opinions over TS4 is definitely the biggest schism I've ever seen in the simming community in the history of the franchise.
I think that is what bothers me the most, that TS4 has divided the community even more than TS3 ever did. I'm not sure why some feel the need to defend it with tooth and nail with such passion when someone else is frustrated, makes emotional statements concerning the real money they spent on things broken or not working as intended. Personally, I would be amazed if someone wasn't upset over monies spent and the game failing them. We can all sugar coat stuff, and speak like some first year law student, however, that doesn't actually gain the person upset any more results than just saying they are fed up, and the feature or bug or whatever, just sux. Plain talk has always been more revealing to me than parsing words. And it's hard to know someone's intention sometimes, and I feel they never mean things personally, if they have an emotional outburst. We also have to remember kids play this game more than adults and adults play the older games more. (Just by what I see) I would be suprised if kids didn't go off more than they do spewing more emotional comments, considering Maxis has made them all believe they can be famous, popular and a Youtube star if they just show off the game more than actually play it. But that's my own perception, and if you think you aren't getting as much attention as the famous youtubers then of course adolence of youth is going to have an emotional outburst now and then.
ETA: I will just explain my view here. Right or wrong. Because Maxis has removed the buffer between customer and company young people are lead to believe gurus are their best buds over on twitter, it's sort of like a badge to get to talk with gurus on Twitter, wouldn't you say? And then when they don't get what they requested or would like to see, or even a complaint fixed they may have an emotional outburst...but that is all Maxis fault for removing a buffer and trying to portray developers as our friends, and when it's a friend instead of a company of course feelings get hurt on either side. And then those who engage with developers daily etc, may feel the need to defend them personally, when it should be the product that defended or crtitiqued. The buffer has been removed and that is where more than half the problems with misunderstandings, fights and defense of "maxis' comes from. Maxis doesn't need defending, as an enity. But if you feel you are friends with those who work there then of course you would feel you needed to defend a friend. And that is where the business relationship between customer and company is failing those who pay money to play a game they may or may not enjoy and get so much backlash for their complaining. Because others feel the need to defend a person when it is the game that is the subject.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
@Cinebar The social media phenomena you site is an interesting insight that I had not considered. Interesting viewpoint on the emotional investment we see here.
I think there's more to it than that though, on both sides of the schism of opinions on TS4. I think we see the emotional investment that we do because the differences in game design style between TS3 and TS4 is SO large that players who are fans of the franchise, on both sides of the debate, have a real fear that the franchise will go in a direction they do not support.
For those who are not fans of 4 (such as yourself) it is already happening and has been for several years. This whole thread is testament to that.
For the people who disagree with you, there is assuredly at least some degree of fear that the ideas which you present will take hold and we WON'T see 3 more years of content. Those folks want 3 more years, or more, of new stuff.
What the two sides of the debate have in common is a love of the game franchise and worry that the future of it won't suit their personal preferences. Natural that it will provoke some emotional responses from either side.
I'd like 3 more years of content myself, not really ready for a Sims 5 or even sure I ever will be, but now that TS4 has seasons and toddlers...the game is 'complete' for me, so anything more is just icing. But I also agree with many of your opinions and would hope that when TS4 finally ends, and TS5 comes, they do a much, much better job of making a game that is inclusive to all of our various preferences as a community. The two sides of this debate have more in common than not, it is entirely possible if the developers have the will to do so.
You're absolutely right. The line between consumer/customer and company definitely has been crossed. I wonder why though? Maybe a marketing strategy? I don't know. Either way that's the main reason why, We as players, bicker so much when it comes to this particular game. And quite frankly it seems quite very unprofessional for them to continue to let it go on like that, but hey that's my opinion.
@Stormkeep I feel the same way when it comes to feeling the game is complete, content-wise. All I would want more is a university pack and I'm done buying content for the game. As far as an overhaul of the game that is something I still expect especially since they're continuing this on for at least 3 more years.
"Bada su the gorn bada su the brawn bada bady oda aba donk donk donk gerbits gerbits vo gerbits".
@Noree_Doree Yes, definitely would like to see a University pack myself...but I am hoping it is more about education in general and not just college. I'd like options other than college for a higher education for my sims, and would also like to see them do a bit more with the grade school/high school for our sim children. I miss the boarding school options of past sims games, for example.
Also would be nice if, before the end of this 3-more-years, we got a tool to allow players to make their own neighborhoods.
This is backtracking a few posts to @Goldmoldar 's recent post (which I agree with) but there was an influx of responses, so I'm late.
I don't think that Sims 4, any Sims game, now or in the future, should be designed to run on some of the lower end computers that some people use. Because mid-range computers as a whole are much more capable than mid-range computers were a decade ago. I don't know much about computers, but I think that that much is true. And if we assume that Sims 4 players operate on a normal bell curve like most things in life, most people probably have these types of computers or higher.
Now, if this is flat out wrong and most players (not only us on the forum) actually use lower end computers, then I stand corrected and you can forget I mentioned anything. But if my suspicion is correct, I see no reason to limit the game for people. If their computers can't handle it, they know that. They'll limit expansions and lower graphics, but they'll still play the game. I've been that person with the lower end computer, and it didn't stop me from playing or make me love the game any less. At most, it caused occasional annoyance with my computer. I wouldn't want the game to become a shell (del sol valley lots are the timeless example) simply because I couldn't play on the highest settings or have all the packs. I'd want it to be awesome regardless (in this context, my definition of awesome is a game that is not pre-limited in what it can do for people. Pre-limited: Instead of us picking and choosing great things we can manage to run, we get everything which is mediocre. Again, opinion, moving on...)
Again I could be off base, but that's just my opinion. Please feel free to educate me and disagree with me. I'm not looking for a fight.
@Noree_Doree Yes, definitely would like to see a University pack myself...but I am hoping it is more about education in general and not just college. I'd like options other than college for a higher education for my sims, and would also like to see them do a bit more with the grade school/high school for our sim children. I miss the boarding school options of past sims games, for example.
Also would be nice if, before the end of this 3-more-years, we got a tool to allow players to make their own neighborhoods.
A university pack was always one my favorite packs. I'd say it is probably due soon as TS3's University came out in 2013, which was close to the end of TS3's development. Why they wait so long for University has puzzled me. I guess it's because the pack is not only a favorite of mine, but getting a higher education (which could include going to a trade school) usually comes before getting into a career. Even before getting married and starting a family in most cases.
It would be awfully tempting for me (I try to not say "never"), but I doubt I would get the pack for TS4. Largely because I haven't played TS4 for awhile now and don't see myself going back to it. I've made the decision not to invest any more of my money in this iteration. Having said that though, I would still like to see a University pack developed for those simmers who are enjoying TS4.
@Cinebar, Feedback can be quite toxic...when feedback is emotionally charged rather than based in facts, includes personal attacks rather than constructive criticism, and/or is worded in an aggressively, negative manner it would be toxic feedback. Generally the forum rules would prohibit all of this other than the emotionally charged kind and the gurus tend to pop into threads and remove the most toxic posts and then ask nicely for people to keep things constructive.
The feedback forums here are, honestly, quite rosie compared to unmoderated forums, and I think this community as a whole is pretty open-minded to opposing viewpoints although the divide in opinions over TS4 is definitely the biggest schism I've ever seen in the simming community in the history of the franchise.
I think that is what bothers me the most, that TS4 has divided the community even more than TS3 ever did. I'm not sure why some feel the need to defend it with tooth and nail with such passion when someone else is frustrated, makes emotional statements concerning the real money they spent on things broken or not working as intended. Personally, I would be amazed if someone wasn't upset over monies spent and the game failing them. We can all sugar coat stuff, and speak like some first year law student, however, that doesn't actually gain the person upset any more results than just saying they are fed up, and the feature or bug or whatever, just sux. Plain talk has always been more revealing to me than parsing words. And it's hard to know someone's intention sometimes, and I feel they never mean things personally, if they have an emotional outburst. We also have to remember kids play this game more than adults and adults play the older games more. (Just by what I see) I would be suprised if kids didn't go off more than they do spewing more emotional comments, considering Maxis has made them all believe they can be famous, popular and a Youtube star if they just show off the game more than actually play it. But that's my own perception, and if you think you aren't getting as much attention as the famous youtubers then of course adolence of youth is going to have an emotional outburst now and then.
ETA: I will just explain my view here. Right or wrong. Because Maxis has removed the buffer between customer and company young people are lead to believe gurus are their best buds over on twitter, it's sort of like a badge to get to talk with gurus on Twitter, wouldn't you say? And then when they don't get what they requested or would like to see, or even a complaint fixed they may have an emotional outburst...but that is all Maxis fault for removing a buffer and trying to portray developers as our friends, and when it's a friend instead of a company of course feelings get hurt on either side. And then those who engage with developers daily etc, may feel the need to defend them personally, when it should be the product that defended or crtitiqued. The buffer has been removed and that is where more than half the problems with misunderstandings, fights and defense of "maxis' comes from. Maxis doesn't need defending, as an enity. But if you feel you are friends with those who work there then of course you would feel you needed to defend a friend. And that is where the business relationship between customer and company is failing those who pay money to play a game they may or may not enjoy and get so much backlash for their complaining. Because others feel the need to defend a person when it is the game that is the subject.
This division has been bothersome to me, too. I had always thought that pointing out what could be better and wasn't working for many of us with EA's amorphic vision of the franchise would be a rising tide that would raise all boats... so to speak. I remember thinking back in 2014 when I hadn't completely lost faith and was still working through what exactly had happened to my favorite gaming franchise that this division seemed almost astroturfed at times... in my humble opinion. Hopefully the next iteration will be a healing experience.
@Noree_Doree Yes, definitely would like to see a University pack myself...but I am hoping it is more about education in general and not just college. I'd like options other than college for a higher education for my sims, and would also like to see them do a bit more with the grade school/high school for our sim children. I miss the boarding school options of past sims games, for example.
Also would be nice if, before the end of this 3-more-years, we got a tool to allow players to make their own neighborhoods.
I agree and I agree about the boarding school.
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Comments
Yes all Sims games had glitches and bugs but nothing like the trend that TS3 started and TS4 continued.
As far as the rest, color for tastes and I've learned to not undermine anyone's taste when it comes to sandbox or simulation games, specially after being an avid harsh critique of TS4 and now mainly enjoying it (even if I still remain criticizing it). It's about perspective. I very much enjoyed TS3's focus on the world as a whole, but found myself seldom observing or enjoying details. It also depends on play style. I personally find many areas that I enjoy more in each iteration than in previous ones, and depending on quality I may or may not end up not missing previous features, which is still not an excuse for going backwards in some areas. The all time low for me was the introduction of TS3 store. And sure it was optional, but it was massive amounts of time and manpower spent on objects and new bits of gameplay mostly lackluster costing thousands upon thousands. That's why SPs don't even bother me at all in this one specially since at least they properly slashed the price instead of being worthless $20 SPs. Much of the constant store release time and money could have been spent on a better game but nope.
The main logic behind it is rather simple. People may or may not enjoy X game for Y, Z and W reasons. What you may find invaluable for enjoyment may not be what others need.
Seems the only answer, that you can retain or that you find acceptable to your ears would be "no". Multiple people including myself have answered that they enjoy the game and are looking forward to future content.
My sims have good AI. I can only speak for my own game. But my sims will go to the restroom or cook on their own at times. There is plenty of interaction and since the game is not complete and is still being developed there will be more.
I agree. There is a sense that content is slowing down from a trickle to a single, frail drip... and with each new expansion, including the most recent Get Famous, getting numerous complaints about being so truncated.
I would love to hear about sims 5 tomorrow, but it is likely we won't hear about anything for a long while we wait out the clock and any new content for ts4 is spread out perhaps even more thinly over the next few years... in my humble opinion.
I'm seeing the opposite. If I recall correctly the first 2 years it was mostly SPs. Within the past 15 months or so it's been 3 EPs and 1 GP which is much more meaningful than overused SPs or waiting 1 year for an EP (City Living). GTW had and still has numerous issues and it was the first EP, hell retail is still a nightmare unmodded.
And GF is IMO the one true celebrity pack that makes sense, and where it works more as a spectrum than in previous iterations. I loved TS1 superstar and wished to see something like it back without plaguing the entire town with shallow celebs. About the only complaint is world size and I believe they are being gimpy now that the game has a decent amount of data, only proving further that they know little about optimization.
I'm not trying to be contrary. Of course the only answer isn't no. I was just thinking about something before I logged back on here today. You know how a lot of people say they don't want to see the same packs with the next versions etc.? And always wanting something different. I wonder if any of us would continue to buy these games (series' version on and on) if they never added Seasons, or Pets, or cult packs, or fame packs, or open for business type packs? I'm wondering if they never added those things in this game or the next if we would think what they did release was worth the prices so far and worth four years of our time? Just musing, like if in the next version if we didn't see any weather, was only adults, never any pets, never any type of self employment or able to run shops etc, and or vacation areas? I wonder is we would think it or this one was that good. Point is, people want all that and more, and expect after four years the game would have all that, and as much as the others. I'm not sure players actually want things really different like they say they do. Because I doubt I would buy a TS5 if it was only adults or young adults or no aging, or no weather, ever, etc.
I agree with your post and I have no problem with buying the next version even if have the same names as long as the packs are done right and include new material along with most of the old. However as far as the base game goes they have to give it more muscle that was previously offered also take some parts of the packs that is offered and include those parts in the base game and how they price those packs. I will never preorder the Sims 5(if it shows itself) or any other game unless that Dev is consistent in what it releases. I rather wait and hold my cash until I see where the next version is going and if it happens to be the same path Sims 4 took, it is truly time to say goodbye and spend my cash on other franchises worth my time.
Yes, this live service stuff isn't my thing, I don't like to be bothered every month. Nor, wait to see if my game is going to be fixed this time or not, and or what might be 'free'. I think it did more harm to this community than good, and in a lot of was made people more disinterested or disappointed or aggravated, and wasn't all that and a bag of chips.
@Cinebar, Feedback can be quite toxic...when feedback is emotionally charged rather than based in facts, includes personal attacks rather than constructive criticism, and/or is worded in an aggressively, negative manner it would be toxic feedback. Generally the forum rules would prohibit all of this other than the emotionally charged kind and the gurus tend to pop into threads and remove the most toxic posts and then ask nicely for people to keep things constructive.
The feedback forums here are, honestly, quite rosie compared to unmoderated forums, and I think this community as a whole is pretty open-minded to opposing viewpoints although the divide in opinions over TS4 is definitely the biggest schism I've ever seen in the simming community in the history of the franchise.
The Winters family Tree --- My Mods
Again, opinion. Open world was a buggy mess for many of us. I was playing on the Mac during Sims 3, and all I wanted was a native Mac coded version rather than playing under the Cider emulator, and I got that with S4 (ironically I'm now on a Windows laptop) so that's an automatic plus. Placing vacant lots with World Builder was also buggy since you couldn't give those lots a proper address. No worries about that in Sims 4. More consequences could be added in packs and patches if the outcry is there. Supernaturals: we've gotten vampires and they're the best ones of any Sims series; I'm pretty sure that more will be forthcoming (witches didn't arrive in S2 until one of the last two packs, and those packs didn't get ported to the Mac so I never got to play with them). We got terrain tools patched in and while there are some issues they're likely continuing to work and improve them.
Fun must be always -- Tomas Hertl (San Jose Sharks hockey player)
Sims 3 had a lot of bugs and lag as well - I had to install mods like Overwatch from NRaas to resolve them. Remember the spawning cars bug from Late Night? Then I used Master Controller to turn off features that were causing save bloat and corruption, like the memories feature, or that were just plain annoying like every Sim turning into a celebrity with Late Night, or into supernaturals with Supernatural. Then I found that I liked the customization options in NRaas' Story Progression, Register allowed me to control autoomous actions so my Sims wouldn't get diabetes from continuous use of the ice cream machine and deep fryer...etc.
Fun must be always -- Tomas Hertl (San Jose Sharks hockey player)
A base game is just that -- a base on which to add future content. A base game needs:
Sims (CAS, a basic personality system)
Places for Sims to live (Build Mode) and to help them live comfortably (Buy Mode)
Skills and ways to build them
A way to use those skills to make Simoleons (careers)
Activites (stuff for Sims to do)
A base game doesn't need weather, pets, supernaturals. Some people might not want those features in their game, or at least not in every save (which is why the hypothetical Sims 5 should offer toggles).
Also remember that The Sims caters to a wide audience, including those who can't afford or have no need for an ultra-souped up gaming rig. While at this point they could up the requirements a tad for Sims 5 (maybe Windows 10 minimum for PC and the current version of MacOS for Mac) and maybe the processor/graphic requirements to whatever is in the current midrange laptop, they're not going to want to anger their current fanbase by requiring most of them to have to shell out a couple of thousand dollars for a new computer on top of the money for a new base game.
Maybe I'm just weird but I'm perfectly fine with the Sims 4 at this late date; all I absolutely need are University and my witches and I'll be fine, though I'll likely get whatever they offer just because I'm a completionist, plus I might not use everything from a pack but there'll be enough there to make it worth the investment.
Fun must be always -- Tomas Hertl (San Jose Sharks hockey player)
Even so that should not be a reason to go backwards. I mean even TS2 let us place and edit lots. Let us make our own neighborhoods, if we want to have a poor area with nothing but 15x20 houses and dirty stores or luxurious 6 lot hoods, we shouod be able tom After all, this is something a game from 2004 had, and that's my biggest qualm with TS4. Worlds are all fake and static, like The Sims 1 (2000)
Open world was not the cause of lag per se, poor programming and amateur developers or lack of care was. Copious routing issues, bloating of garbage data, no proper garbage collection system like Overwatch, etc.
Everything you just posted is your opinion as mine is my opinion. Hmmm, Sims developers cater to an wide range of users with various levels of systems that is true however, it treats each system the same regardless of what that system can do and each pack made is gimped as not to affect the performance. Now normally this would not be an problem with some mid level and high end systems and would affect more of the lower end systems. It does pose an problem when an system that is capable of handling many computer processes and is handicapped intentionally as not to use the specs effectively it possesses being the program cannot scale up or down to what each system possesses. If that was the case I should have went out and buy or put together an system paying the least amount of money. As posted you may be satisfied with what is offered but not everyone is satisfied with what is offered and if you are that is your bar and I too collect software with one difference I will never pay what is asked for software that I feel is not worth the asking price and wait for the price to drop to get it when I feel it is worth it. As far as what an base can contain is again is your opinion and I have mine and again as I posted I will not rush out and dive in if Sims 5 comes about and wait and see how it flows first because the base game will dictate if it is an yay or nay. as customers most have different tastes and what they want or expect out of an program or anything in life.
Im not buying sims 5 without create a style. Im just NOT. Im not doing that again. I am fine without it in sims 4, because this game was intended to be simpler. And its entertaining enough without those things that I can keep on playing, and I do. But I swear that I am not buying sims 5 without open world.I wont be moving on , if its not a different playing experience than Sims 4.
If sims 5 doesnt have the gallery feature , that also will be a deal-breaker, because I love being able to download others creations easily and share my own creations .
So there is a lot that will have to be implemented with Sims 5 before I consider picking up a copy for myself.
That probably is the difference between the way you and I play.
I get zero fulfillment out of watching a Sim do yoga and burn incense. That, to me, is not fun at all. I do like telling stories in my game, but even that's a challenge with the random, wacky emotion system of TS4, Sims that I can't truly personalize the way I'd like, and the necessity for me to use an overwhelming amount of my own imagination because the game is frequently doing its own thing.
I think that really highlights the issue with TS4, though. It's too focused on material things -- buying a $20 pack solely to watch your Sims go do yoga and head to a spa that offers no significant gameplay depth other than just sitting there and watching them get moodlets from animations. Spending $20 to watch them take a whole day to eat food at a fancy restaurant. Spending $10 to watch them bowl.
In The Sims 2, these elements were placed into a much bigger pack, and were only considered side thoughts. Packs actually expanded the core game, with new aspirations, wishes/wants (which was nowhere near as useless as whims), new AI mechanics, and more. They actually expanded the game in significant ways. The Sims 4's packs are here to pretty much throw fluff on top of a foundation that can't even handle worlds larger than 5 lots nowadays, from what it seems.
Add the fluff. But also support it by actually expanding the game with new game mechanics, AI improvements, and more. Imagine if Stardew Valley, a popular indie farming life simulation, scrapped or poorly designed the whole idea of making money, growing crops, building up a farm the way you'd like (i.e the core game) in favor of features like braiding your pixel horse's hair. That's what this series has become, focused on, what I feel, are the wrong things. There's little challenge, little depth, and it downright doesn't feel like a life simulation game to the scale of TS1, TS2, and TS3.
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Have we really thought about how many more EPs and tools and or stuff packs (or AKA store) set out to release to players compared to the four years of TS4. It's hard to fathom this game has as much or as indepth as older games comparing pack to pack, and quanity of the previous games. You name some things that are good and I agree better than TS2 vampires. They get A+ on that pack, however, they don't get a high grade from me concerning other things, like terrian tools that can't even dig a basement into it, or a big hole with water in it. Maybe before rushing things out just to pipe down the ongoing uproars that happen around here stemed from 'lack of content' protests, they should have kept it a secret a little longer and made the feature as good or even better than in previous games. You know what I'm saying? If it can't surpass something from the past, maybe it shouldn't be done. Or at least much more polished before releasing. I'm not sure why many of us are willing to go along with buy now, fix later....we wouldn't buy a car like that. And if someone gifted us something half broken or not something we wanted, I think we turn around and regift, or say thank you, but no.
I think that is what bothers me the most, that TS4 has divided the community even more than TS3 ever did. I'm not sure why some feel the need to defend it with tooth and nail with such passion when someone else is frustrated, makes emotional statements concerning the real money they spent on things broken or not working as intended. Personally, I would be amazed if someone wasn't upset over monies spent and the game failing them. We can all sugar coat stuff, and speak like some first year law student, however, that doesn't actually gain the person upset any more results than just saying they are fed up, and the feature or bug or whatever, just sux. Plain talk has always been more revealing to me than parsing words. And it's hard to know someone's intention sometimes, and I feel they never mean things personally, if they have an emotional outburst. We also have to remember kids play this game more than adults and adults play the older games more. (Just by what I see) I would be suprised if kids didn't go off more than they do spewing more emotional comments, considering Maxis has made them all believe they can be famous, popular and a Youtube star if they just show off the game more than actually play it. But that's my own perception, and if you think you aren't getting as much attention as the famous youtubers then of course adolence of youth is going to have an emotional outburst now and then.
ETA: I will just explain my view here. Right or wrong. Because Maxis has removed the buffer between customer and company young people are lead to believe gurus are their best buds over on twitter, it's sort of like a badge to get to talk with gurus on Twitter, wouldn't you say? And then when they don't get what they requested or would like to see, or even a complaint fixed they may have an emotional outburst...but that is all Maxis fault for removing a buffer and trying to portray developers as our friends, and when it's a friend instead of a company of course feelings get hurt on either side. And then those who engage with developers daily etc, may feel the need to defend them personally, when it should be the product that defended or crtitiqued. The buffer has been removed and that is where more than half the problems with misunderstandings, fights and defense of "maxis' comes from. Maxis doesn't need defending, as an enity. But if you feel you are friends with those who work there then of course you would feel you needed to defend a friend. And that is where the business relationship between customer and company is failing those who pay money to play a game they may or may not enjoy and get so much backlash for their complaining. Because others feel the need to defend a person when it is the game that is the subject.
I think there's more to it than that though, on both sides of the schism of opinions on TS4. I think we see the emotional investment that we do because the differences in game design style between TS3 and TS4 is SO large that players who are fans of the franchise, on both sides of the debate, have a real fear that the franchise will go in a direction they do not support.
For those who are not fans of 4 (such as yourself) it is already happening and has been for several years. This whole thread is testament to that.
For the people who disagree with you, there is assuredly at least some degree of fear that the ideas which you present will take hold and we WON'T see 3 more years of content. Those folks want 3 more years, or more, of new stuff.
What the two sides of the debate have in common is a love of the game franchise and worry that the future of it won't suit their personal preferences. Natural that it will provoke some emotional responses from either side.
I'd like 3 more years of content myself, not really ready for a Sims 5 or even sure I ever will be, but now that TS4 has seasons and toddlers...the game is 'complete' for me, so anything more is just icing. But I also agree with many of your opinions and would hope that when TS4 finally ends, and TS5 comes, they do a much, much better job of making a game that is inclusive to all of our various preferences as a community. The two sides of this debate have more in common than not, it is entirely possible if the developers have the will to do so.
The Winters family Tree --- My Mods
You're absolutely right. The line between consumer/customer and company definitely has been crossed. I wonder why though? Maybe a marketing strategy? I don't know. Either way that's the main reason why, We as players, bicker so much when it comes to this particular game. And quite frankly it seems quite very unprofessional for them to continue to let it go on like that, but hey that's my opinion.
@Stormkeep I feel the same way when it comes to feeling the game is complete, content-wise. All I would want more is a university pack and I'm done buying content for the game. As far as an overhaul of the game that is something I still expect especially since they're continuing this on for at least 3 more years.
Also would be nice if, before the end of this 3-more-years, we got a tool to allow players to make their own neighborhoods.
The Winters family Tree --- My Mods
I don't think that Sims 4, any Sims game, now or in the future, should be designed to run on some of the lower end computers that some people use. Because mid-range computers as a whole are much more capable than mid-range computers were a decade ago. I don't know much about computers, but I think that that much is true. And if we assume that Sims 4 players operate on a normal bell curve like most things in life, most people probably have these types of computers or higher.
Now, if this is flat out wrong and most players (not only us on the forum) actually use lower end computers, then I stand corrected and you can forget I mentioned anything. But if my suspicion is correct, I see no reason to limit the game for people. If their computers can't handle it, they know that. They'll limit expansions and lower graphics, but they'll still play the game. I've been that person with the lower end computer, and it didn't stop me from playing or make me love the game any less. At most, it caused occasional annoyance with my computer. I wouldn't want the game to become a shell (del sol valley lots are the timeless example) simply because I couldn't play on the highest settings or have all the packs. I'd want it to be awesome regardless (in this context, my definition of awesome is a game that is not pre-limited in what it can do for people. Pre-limited: Instead of us picking and choosing great things we can manage to run, we get everything which is mediocre. Again, opinion, moving on...)
Again I could be off base, but that's just my opinion. Please feel free to educate me and disagree with me. I'm not looking for a fight.
A university pack was always one my favorite packs. I'd say it is probably due soon as TS3's University came out in 2013, which was close to the end of TS3's development. Why they wait so long for University has puzzled me. I guess it's because the pack is not only a favorite of mine, but getting a higher education (which could include going to a trade school) usually comes before getting into a career. Even before getting married and starting a family in most cases.
It would be awfully tempting for me (I try to not say "never"), but I doubt I would get the pack for TS4. Largely because I haven't played TS4 for awhile now and don't see myself going back to it. I've made the decision not to invest any more of my money in this iteration. Having said that though, I would still like to see a University pack developed for those simmers who are enjoying TS4.
This division has been bothersome to me, too. I had always thought that pointing out what could be better and wasn't working for many of us with EA's amorphic vision of the franchise would be a rising tide that would raise all boats... so to speak. I remember thinking back in 2014 when I hadn't completely lost faith and was still working through what exactly had happened to my favorite gaming franchise that this division seemed almost astroturfed at times... in my humble opinion. Hopefully the next iteration will be a healing experience.
I agree and I agree about the boarding school.