Will Wright is not weeping over the Sims 4 and what became of *his* "vision". Will Wright could care less about The Sims series. He sold all the rights to Electronic Arts when he left Maxis.
I'm not really surprised that there's nobody on here trying to defend the game and telling us that we are betraying the Sims with all this negativity. The last person that tried that line of reasoning got his/her wrist slapped pretty hard.
That's the second comment about Sims 4 defenders. It's as if you're deliberately baiting us but we won't bite. At least not today. We're too excited by the new stuff pack releasing today.
No one is baiting anyone. Today when your stuff pack comes out and it has nothing but a few items are you going to be happy? There is a reason the stuff pack is only $10.00. EA doesn't market a huge pack for half the price of a Game Pack, especially when Stuff Packs 10 years ago (that were stuff packed with items) were $20.00. They also should have just taken that stuff and put it in either the base game, or in the expansion or in the game pack instead of expecting us to spend even more money on useless party times.
Moving on...
When Sims 2 was being created I am sure the Sims 2 team & Will Wright spent many hours working over time, working off the clock, taking work home with them. This was what is done when you want to make an amazing product, this is what is done when you believe in your job, this is what is done when you want to take pride in your work, this is what was done by our parents, by our grandparents and by our great grandparents. They didn't worry about being popular or about offending someone, they didn't let someone tell them it can't be done, they did what it took. I don't think that can be said about the Sims 4 team. I don't see them taking work home with them or working longs hours, or working off the clock. They spend more time tweeting about going to the movies then fixing bugs or even finding out what bugs there are.
My husband who works with the public says that the hires coming in today do not get what is required to succeed. That most (NOT ALL) need their hands held, have no common sense, you can't say anything to them because they become easily offended, god forbid you tell them to work harder and get off their phones because they break down and can't handle criticism, don't bother asking them to stay over because they won't.
My generation I am sad to say is partially responsible for the road that is laying out ahead of us. We have allowed for rear end kissing and favoritism to allow for promotions instead of hard work. We have fooled ourselves into believing that just because a person has a college education that makes a person more qualified then the person that has been actually doing the hard work for 20 years. We have pushed political correctness instead of freedom of speech and the truth. We have and are raising a generation of kids and adults that think they are all winners and everything they do is just fabulous when it isn't. We have said it is better to be popular and famous then it is to be ethically morale & taking pride in hard work. We have allowed for a generation of immature adults that don't want to think, don't want to work hard, don't want a challenge, don't question anything, don't want to do any research, and are more concerned about things being easy and being bro's and cool with children & teenagers instead of setting an example. By doing these things they don't understand that the more work and time you put into creating something the better that creation will be and everything else will fall into place. Our ancestors that came before us understood those simple things, the creators of Sims 2 understood that. If they want Sims 4 to be a success then they need to put in the extra effort by fixing the games bugs and listening to their fan base. If they start doing those things, and quickly, then maybe the game will start being a success, but I fear time is running out because even a fan base has their limits.
It's not that the 'self-starter' types aren't out there, it's just that the market has expanded so much, that you are now getting the crappy with the good. Used to be you had to be exceptionally gifted to create entertainment software. Now? Tools open it up to both the good and the bad. I'm not talking about the Sims 4 team in particular (I have no idea what kind of effort they put in), just my, admittedly, speculative opinion.
It has its flaws, and some really award-winningly bad design choices, but overall I find the current state of the game encouraging. Not great, but encouraging.
So yeah, parts are terrible. The active careers are seriously repetitive, and not at all fun. The constant loading screens destroy all semblance of immersion. The townie generation is out of control. There's no color wheel, and a very limited choice for hair/eye/skin tones. The emotional system is flawed, making negative emotions and emotional traits practically moot. There's no impact from story changes when Sims just will not respond to it. House-Visitors are outrageously common. Sim appearances in CAS are different from in-play. The sim personalities are extremely dull and not a one of them is any different from anyone else. Half the traits are useless. Career promotions are too difficult at high levels. Aspirations are repetitive. Townie appearance are not random enough. (The game selects a randomized pool and then that pool never varies.)
Still, despite all that, I'm still encouraged, and I think it has the potential to be the best in the series. I think they need to take a step back and look at their work though. Maybe get some better/more competent playtesters. I'd volunteer, but I don't live anywhere close by I'm sure.
It has its flaws, and some really award-winningly bad design choices, but overall I find the current state of the game encouraging. Not great, but encouraging.
So yeah, parts are terrible. The active careers are seriously repetitive, and not at all fun. The constant loading screens destroy all semblance of immersion. The townie generation is out of control. There's no color wheel, and a very limited choice for hair/eye/skin tones. The emotional system is flawed, making negative emotions and emotional traits practically moot. There's no impact from story changes when Sims just will not respond to it. House-Visitors are outrageously common. Sim appearances in CAS are different from in-play. The sim personalities are extremely dull and not a one of them is any different from anyone else. Half the traits are useless. Career promotions are too difficult at high levels. Aspirations are repetitive. Townie appearance are not random enough. (The game selects a randomized pool and then that pool never varies.)
Still, despite all that, I'm still encouraged, and I think it has the potential to be the best in the series. I think they need to take a step back and look at their work though. Maybe get some better/more competent playtesters. I'd volunteer, but I don't live anywhere close by I'm sure.
Everything you just listed and everything else that is wrong with Sims 4 like tiny non-customizable worlds, bad graphics, missing little details like sims being able to cuddle in bed and a bunch of other stuff, no memory system, and overall the limitations this new game has is the reason Sims 4 won't be the best in the series, ever.
It has its flaws, and some really award-winningly bad design choices, but overall I find the current state of the game encouraging. Not great, but encouraging.
So yeah, parts are terrible. The active careers are seriously repetitive, and not at all fun. The constant loading screens destroy all semblance of immersion. The townie generation is out of control. There's no color wheel, and a very limited choice for hair/eye/skin tones. The emotional system is flawed, making negative emotions and emotional traits practically moot. There's no impact from story changes when Sims just will not respond to it. House-Visitors are outrageously common. Sim appearances in CAS are different from in-play. The sim personalities are extremely dull and not a one of them is any different from anyone else. Half the traits are useless. Career promotions are too difficult at high levels. Aspirations are repetitive. Townie appearance are not random enough. (The game selects a randomized pool and then that pool never varies.)
Still, despite all that, I'm still encouraged, and I think it has the potential to be the best in the series. I think they need to take a step back and look at their work though. Maybe get some better/more competent playtesters. I'd volunteer, but I don't live anywhere close by I'm sure.
I really hope this game, not only delivers for you, but for others as well. I really do. I would hate to see some fans become disappointed if the game does not meet its potential. I smile and applaud your optimism , and I really hope there is a brighter end or beginning to this current situation.
It seems that the target aduence are now teenage boys with the 'bro traits' with focus on pranks and woohoo and teenage girls with 'cute guys' and pink trees
Mature players are 'too old' it seems. At 27, I feel that TS3 is the most mature Sims game for me
Ya. I'm 36. I find the potty humor pretty 🐸🐸🐸🐸. Also why the heck are they changing all these words? I don't understand!
I played TS1 when I was 12, I wouldn't have thought too much of the daft humour even then
I started playing the series when I was nine years old. I wouldn't have laughed either. I would've cringed a bit. I'm 21 years old now - not really too far away from teen age - and it's still not funny. I'm not a fan of toilet humor.
I haven't read every page - so I'm sorry if this has been brought up before. Did anyone remark on this part of the article"
“We did this through a combination of direct player dialogue and game telemetry,” Franklin continued. “For instance, we saw players on our forums talking about how ‘careers are too hard.’ We used the telemetry data to see where the sticking points were in the career progression. Then we took all that information, fine-tuned and improved careers and released them to players in one of our updates – and engagement in Careers doubled. We continue to do this today.”
They are using game telemetry to determine the success of their patches - which means that they are only paying attention to those fans who have 1) bought the game and installed it on a system connected to the internet, 2) have not turned off the privacy-invading features and 3) are still playing the game. Those of us who didn't buy the game because it didn't offer the kind of play we wanted, those of us who *did* buy the game but stopped playing because it didn't offer the kind of play we wanted and those of us who still play despite the lack of the kind of play we wanted *and turned off telemetry because we don't trust EA not to mess up our computers* are being ignored.
I have a feeling that the game telemetry is very important to the management at EA and management will not authorize programming time without some sort of game telemetry numbers to back up the request. Since Toddlers aren't in the game, they can't measure how much Toddlers are missed, so they can't get the time needed to develop Toddlers. It is a Catch-22. There might be a save through the game telemetry on 'Family Play' - they can measure how much time players spend developing a family - but I doubt it will ever bring us Toddlers. And since the game is set up to grind and goal, they can't get a good measure of the players who only grind because they want a locked feature - and then stop grinding once they have it. I wonder if game telemetry can tell them how many players are using mods to make the game more like previous iterations - the unlock everything mods, etc.
It is nearing a year since release and I see that we are still making rounds of "what do you want" and the general threads like that. I present the argument, is it really necessary? Why is there so much drive to hope that this game will get any better? Why are we still hopijg for nothing at all?
I haven't read every page - so I'm sorry if this has been brought up before. Did anyone remark on this part of the article"
“We did this through a combination of direct player dialogue and game telemetry,” Franklin continued. “For instance, we saw players on our forums talking about how ‘careers are too hard.’ We used the telemetry data to see where the sticking points were in the career progression. Then we took all that information, fine-tuned and improved careers and released them to players in one of our updates – and engagement in Careers doubled. We continue to do this today.”
They are using game telemetry to determine the success of their patches - which means that they are only paying attention to those fans who have 1) bought the game and installed it on a system connected to the internet, 2) have not turned off the privacy-invading features and 3) are still playing the game. Those of us who didn't buy the game because it didn't offer the kind of play we wanted, those of us who *did* buy the game but stopped playing because it didn't offer the kind of play we wanted and those of us who still play despite the lack of the kind of play we wanted *and turned off telemetry because we don't trust EA not to mess up our computers* are being ignored.
I have a feeling that the game telemetry is very important to the management at EA and management will not authorize programming time without some sort of game telemetry numbers to back up the request. Since Toddlers aren't in the game, they can't measure how much Toddlers are missed, so they can't get the time needed to develop Toddlers. It is a Catch-22. There might be a save through the game telemetry on 'Family Play' - they can measure how much time players spend developing a family - but I doubt it will ever bring us Toddlers. And since the game is set up to grind and goal, they can't get a good measure of the players who only grind because they want a locked feature - and then stop grinding once they have it. I wonder if game telemetry can tell them how many players are using mods to make the game more like previous iterations - the unlock everything mods, etc.
Actually Will Wright said they used telemetry to gage the game usage back when TS1 was being developed. I can't find my link at this moment but I did post the video on @Cinebar thread discussing Will Wrights "Vision" of TS. So saying it has been used for quite a few years. But it is askewed IMHO, because not all of us 1)play online or 2) share our information. Origin has made gathering telemetry easier since I am sure few shut off Origin, sharing and or online. Those of us older players are not only paranoid, we also like our privacy. EA/Origin doesn't need half the info it collects. If it was only game related I would be OK with it but it is so much more they gather.
Yes you are very right in that the info gathered is not very helpful nor complete. IMHO Surveys would give them more info faster!
But back during the original sims game, securom and other drm hadn't come along had it? So people were more willing to share. It was a more innocent time. After securom, a lot of us took more care. The ones who allow more these days, are probably the ones who weren't so upset about securom. Probably a lot of the older players (who are the ones they don't care about anyway ) are the ones who turn it off.
I haven't read every page - so I'm sorry if this has been brought up before. Did anyone remark on this part of the article"
“We did this through a combination of direct player dialogue and game telemetry,” Franklin continued. “For instance, we saw players on our forums talking about how ‘careers are too hard.’ We used the telemetry data to see where the sticking points were in the career progression. Then we took all that information, fine-tuned and improved careers and released them to players in one of our updates – and engagement in Careers doubled. We continue to do this today.”
They are using game telemetry to determine the success of their patches - which means that they are only paying attention to those fans who have 1) bought the game and installed it on a system connected to the internet, 2) have not turned off the privacy-invading features and 3) are still playing the game. Those of us who didn't buy the game because it didn't offer the kind of play we wanted, those of us who *did* buy the game but stopped playing because it didn't offer the kind of play we wanted and those of us who still play despite the lack of the kind of play we wanted *and turned off telemetry because we don't trust EA not to mess up our computers* are being ignored.
I have a feeling that the game telemetry is very important to the management at EA and management will not authorize programming time without some sort of game telemetry numbers to back up the request. Since Toddlers aren't in the game, they can't measure how much Toddlers are missed, so they can't get the time needed to develop Toddlers. It is a Catch-22. There might be a save through the game telemetry on 'Family Play' - they can measure how much time players spend developing a family - but I doubt it will ever bring us Toddlers. And since the game is set up to grind and goal, they can't get a good measure of the players who only grind because they want a locked feature - and then stop grinding once they have it. I wonder if game telemetry can tell them how many players are using mods to make the game more like previous iterations - the unlock everything mods, etc.
Oh what terrible developing company thought this was a good idea or plan. Are we really in that day in age where marking trumps talent that we need numerical and digital statistics to make a game. Oh the state of the game will continue to be abysmal if this is true because progress will continue to drop off the more and more fans stop playing.
That means even remaining fans are going to be subjected to awful changes to the game.
I haven't read every page - so I'm sorry if this has been brought up before. Did anyone remark on this part of the article"
“We did this through a combination of direct player dialogue and game telemetry,” Franklin continued. “For instance, we saw players on our forums talking about how ‘careers are too hard.’ We used the telemetry data to see where the sticking points were in the career progression. Then we took all that information, fine-tuned and improved careers and released them to players in one of our updates – and engagement in Careers doubled. We continue to do this today.”
They are using game telemetry to determine the success of their patches - which means that they are only paying attention to those fans who have 1) bought the game and installed it on a system connected to the internet, 2) have not turned off the privacy-invading features and 3) are still playing the game. Those of us who didn't buy the game because it didn't offer the kind of play we wanted, those of us who *did* buy the game but stopped playing because it didn't offer the kind of play we wanted and those of us who still play despite the lack of the kind of play we wanted *and turned off telemetry because we don't trust EA not to mess up our computers* are being ignored.
I have a feeling that the game telemetry is very important to the management at EA and management will not authorize programming time without some sort of game telemetry numbers to back up the request. Since Toddlers aren't in the game, they can't measure how much Toddlers are missed, so they can't get the time needed to develop Toddlers. It is a Catch-22. There might be a save through the game telemetry on 'Family Play' - they can measure how much time players spend developing a family - but I doubt it will ever bring us Toddlers. And since the game is set up to grind and goal, they can't get a good measure of the players who only grind because they want a locked feature - and then stop grinding once they have it. I wonder if game telemetry can tell them how many players are using mods to make the game more like previous iterations - the unlock everything mods, etc.
Oh what terrible developing company thought this was a good idea or plan. Are we really in that day in age where marking trumps talent that we need numerical and digital statistics to make a game. Oh the state of the game will continue to be abysmal if this is true because progress will continue to drop off the more and more fans stop playing.
That means even remaining fans are going to be subjected to awful changes to the game.
Not necessarily, the sales of EP/GP/SP will suffer the more and more alienated the fan base gets that eventually something will have to be done. Unfortunately that may take awhile
"Mobile games continue to be a core focus for EA" << i called it. the sims 5. only available on app store and google play.
That might be true but the mobile guy jump ships early and equally he's had his hand dipped in sims 4. So is the announcemtn at E3 this year going to be sims 4 going mobile?
Sure it will. The ship keeps sailing, no matter who "transitions". (Is that a thing now? Transitioning?)
if transitioning is what's happening Seems like jumping ship is more like. So who does this new position transition too. It's like every month someone jumps ship and they still haven't replaced the art creator they've got Lyndsay filling in for it right now.
I also wanted for this game to be great. I've been a fan since the beginning. When S1 came out, I loved it and played for hours & hours, regularly annoying my friends and relatives who weren't simmers. S2 was an improvement on the original. The humor, charm, and overall game play was wonderful...halfway through EA came into the picture and ever since have been slowly sucking the life force out of the franchise. S3 moved away from the core of what was enjoyable about the first 2 installments but at the same time gave us a few things in return (sandbox/open world, color/pattern customization, CAW, etc.)
S4 is by far the biggest let down for me. EA has turned this once-beloved franchise into a shell of it's former self by ignoring what their built-in fan base wants in favor a short-sighted quick buck; have they never heard of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"?
I'd like to believe that EA hasn't completely given up on TS but their behavior is leading me in that direction. They seem to have no interest in what I (or others like me) want and therefore whether or not they get my money. As much as it pains me, unless something drastically changes (I'm not holding my breath), I may be done with the Sims.
"I am and always will be the optimist, the hoper of far-flung hope, and the dreamer of improbable dreams."
The fact we are not even getting answers is what frustrates me the most.
I know there was another pension on change.org created a few months prior to TS4 release which has since gone unnoticed. So I have decided to do one of my own, when you have time please sign (given you agree with what is stated). If you feel anything could be added or corrected please PM me.
It seems that the target aduence are now teenage boys with the 'bro traits' with focus on pranks and woohoo and teenage girls with 'cute guys' and pink trees
Mature players are 'too old' it seems. At 27, I feel that TS3 is the most mature Sims game for me
Ya. I'm 36. I find the potty humor pretty 🐸🐸🐸🐸. Also why the heck are they changing all these words? I don't understand!
I played TS1 when I was 12, I wouldn't have thought too much of the daft humour even then
I started playing the series when I was nine years old. I wouldn't have laughed either. I would've cringed a bit. I'm 21 years old now - not really too far away from teen age - and it's still not funny. I'm not a fan of toilet humor.
Agreed
I have to admit I laughed when TS2 came out and I befriended the newspaper girl and after she was hanging out, she used the toilet and read the paper at the same time but it was only funny that once.
It seems some people, those who 'hate' TS3 with a passion where convinced that TS3 had no charm and humour (something I continue to debate) and wanted 'TS2 style humour' but all you got was 'angry poops' and 'pee like a champion'
Comments
It's not that the 'self-starter' types aren't out there, it's just that the market has expanded so much, that you are now getting the crappy with the good. Used to be you had to be exceptionally gifted to create entertainment software. Now? Tools open it up to both the good and the bad. I'm not talking about the Sims 4 team in particular (I have no idea what kind of effort they put in), just my, admittedly, speculative opinion.
So yeah, parts are terrible. The active careers are seriously repetitive, and not at all fun. The constant loading screens destroy all semblance of immersion. The townie generation is out of control. There's no color wheel, and a very limited choice for hair/eye/skin tones. The emotional system is flawed, making negative emotions and emotional traits practically moot. There's no impact from story changes when Sims just will not respond to it. House-Visitors are outrageously common. Sim appearances in CAS are different from in-play. The sim personalities are extremely dull and not a one of them is any different from anyone else. Half the traits are useless. Career promotions are too difficult at high levels. Aspirations are repetitive. Townie appearance are not random enough. (The game selects a randomized pool and then that pool never varies.)
Still, despite all that, I'm still encouraged, and I think it has the potential to be the best in the series. I think they need to take a step back and look at their work though. Maybe get some better/more competent playtesters. I'd volunteer, but I don't live anywhere close by I'm sure.
Players: Check out my Sims 4 Room Challenge.
Devs & Players: Check out my Archaeology Career Idea
Everything you just listed and everything else that is wrong with Sims 4 like tiny non-customizable worlds, bad graphics, missing little details like sims being able to cuddle in bed and a bunch of other stuff, no memory system, and overall the limitations this new game has is the reason Sims 4 won't be the best in the series, ever.
I really hope this game, not only delivers for you, but for others as well. I really do. I would hate to see some fans become disappointed if the game does not meet its potential. I smile and applaud your optimism
Oh and that ask a Guru thing earlier was dismal...
I started playing the series when I was nine years old. I wouldn't have laughed either. I would've cringed a bit. I'm 21 years old now - not really too far away from teen age - and it's still not funny. I'm not a fan of toilet humor.
They are using game telemetry to determine the success of their patches - which means that they are only paying attention to those fans who have 1) bought the game and installed it on a system connected to the internet, 2) have not turned off the privacy-invading features and 3) are still playing the game. Those of us who didn't buy the game because it didn't offer the kind of play we wanted, those of us who *did* buy the game but stopped playing because it didn't offer the kind of play we wanted and those of us who still play despite the lack of the kind of play we wanted *and turned off telemetry because we don't trust EA not to mess up our computers* are being ignored.
I have a feeling that the game telemetry is very important to the management at EA and management will not authorize programming time without some sort of game telemetry numbers to back up the request. Since Toddlers aren't in the game, they can't measure how much Toddlers are missed, so they can't get the time needed to develop Toddlers. It is a Catch-22. There might be a save through the game telemetry on 'Family Play' - they can measure how much time players spend developing a family - but I doubt it will ever bring us Toddlers. And since the game is set up to grind and goal, they can't get a good measure of the players who only grind because they want a locked feature - and then stop grinding once they have it. I wonder if game telemetry can tell them how many players are using mods to make the game more like previous iterations - the unlock everything mods, etc.
Disappointing EA. Truly disappointing.
Actually Will Wright said they used telemetry to gage the game usage back when TS1 was being developed. I can't find my link at this moment but I did post the video on @Cinebar thread discussing Will Wrights "Vision" of TS. So saying it has been used for quite a few years. But it is askewed IMHO, because not all of us 1)play online or 2) share our information. Origin has made gathering telemetry easier since I am sure few shut off Origin, sharing and or online. Those of us older players are not only paranoid, we also like our privacy. EA/Origin doesn't need half the info it collects. If it was only game related I would be OK with it but it is so much more they gather.
Yes you are very right in that the info gathered is not very helpful nor complete. IMHO Surveys would give them more info faster!
typo
Oh what terrible developing company thought this was a good idea or plan. Are we really in that day in age where marking trumps talent that we need numerical and digital statistics to make a game. Oh the state of the game will continue to be abysmal if this is true because progress will continue to drop off the more and more fans stop playing.
That means even remaining fans are going to be subjected to awful changes to the game.
Not necessarily, the sales of EP/GP/SP will suffer the more and more alienated the fan base gets that eventually something will have to be done. Unfortunately that may take awhile
Another suit leaves the company.
There is something horribly wrong at EA.
This is the truth.
Mitakuye oyasin.
To all my relations, keep dancing.
Believe or you will not see.
That might be true but the mobile guy jump ships early and equally he's had his hand dipped in sims 4. So is the announcemtn at E3 this year going to be sims 4 going mobile?
if transitioning is what's happening Seems like jumping ship is more like. So who does this new position transition too. It's like every month someone jumps ship and they still haven't replaced the art creator they've got Lyndsay filling in for it right now.
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/ea-exec-frank-gibeau-leaves-the-publisher-after-20/1100-6427458/
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/ea-revenue-and-profit-climb-as-digital-continues-t/1100-6427113/
S4 is by far the biggest let down for me. EA has turned this once-beloved franchise into a shell of it's former self by ignoring what their built-in fan base wants in favor a short-sighted quick buck; have they never heard of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"?
I'd like to believe that EA hasn't completely given up on TS but their behavior is leading me in that direction. They seem to have no interest in what I (or others like me) want and therefore whether or not they get my money. As much as it pains me, unless something drastically changes (I'm not holding my breath), I may be done with the Sims.
I know there was another pension on change.org created a few months prior to TS4 release which has since gone unnoticed. So I have decided to do one of my own, when you have time please sign (given you agree with what is stated). If you feel anything could be added or corrected please PM me.
I hope the link works...
Thanks
https://www.change.org/p/maxis-the-sims-studio-electronic-arts-maxis-give-your-fan-customer-base-answers-add-or-patch-in-missing-features?recruiter=282347236&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=share_email_responsive
My Simblr
Current family tree
Origin ID: tellekinz
Agreed
I have to admit I laughed when TS2 came out and I befriended the newspaper girl and after she was hanging out, she used the toilet and read the paper at the same time but it was only funny that once.
It seems some people, those who 'hate' TS3 with a passion where convinced that TS3 had no charm and humour (something I continue to debate) and wanted 'TS2 style humour' but all you got was 'angry poops' and 'pee like a champion'
I bet that TS3 dosnt seem quite as bad now lol