What mob mentality though? It's an honest question. I don't hate TS4, don't get me wrong, and if there is something they can do to improve what I really dislike about it, I'm all for it... but core issues shouldn't be fixed with asking me for more money. And for me and many simmers, personality in TS4 is a core issue.
There were people spamming the premiere live chat and Twitter all morning. Like everyone just loves to hate on the game and then others with more neutral opinions start to have unfounded negative opinions. This game is legitimately great.
What mob mentality though? It's an honest question. I don't hate TS4, don't get me wrong, and if there is something they can do to improve what I really dislike about it, I'm all for it... but core issues shouldn't be fixed with asking me for more money. And for me and many simmers, personality in TS4 is a core issue.
There were people spamming the premiere live chat and Twitter all morning. Like everyone just loves to hate on the game and then others with more neutral opinions start to have unfounded negative opinions. This game is legitimately great.
To be fair, people always spam the live chats for sims stuff. I try my best to ignore those, but I know what you mean, it's annoying
Such a feature will probably come in a free Basegame patch like reputation and ladders (for instance) did.
They are listing it as a feature of the pack in the description.
Also, reputation was exclusive to Get Famous, and ladders were never advertised as a feature of Eco Lifestyle.
Sadly, I think these features may be exclusive to the pack.
Such a system might make little sense if restricted to one EP. Much more interesting to develop if they can take all kinds of released features/moods/traits/reactions into it. So, I assume (and hope!) it will be a patch thing.
Such a system might make little sense if restricted to one EP. Much more interesting to develop if they can take all kinds of released features/moods/traits/reactions into it. So, I assume (and hope!) it will be a patch thing.
I hope you are right, but I sincerely doub it.
The only thing I can imagine, like someone else said earlier, is that they will introduce a basic version with the patch but keep the majority of it tied to the EP. However ... I can't imagine what a basic version of this kind of personality system would look like. Or how they'd add to it.
If the personality additions are tied to the pack, I think it's possibly because they actually do change your Sims' behaviors (as the write-up claims) with a hidden system, and I've seen some other players say they don't want that, they like the Sims the way they are now. If a big change like this were to be patched in after six years, Maxis could have another horde of angry players on their backs. Many people who are already invested in the game are comfortable with the mechanics, so to suddenly change that on them could be disruptive. The majority of the player base isn't on the Forums or stalking the game on social media, so I suppose it would be risky.
But personally, I was hoping we'd get it patched into the foundation of the game so it can be expanded on in the future. Unless it's based on the Myers and Briggs Sixteen Personalities psychology, which I suspect it might be, in which case that's all there is to that theory and it's a pretty solid one.
I suspect there will still be personality issues because, yes, the foundation isn't solid. The traits are still meager and flaccid, there is still no Fear emotion or Worry or Anxiety so there is no completion to emotions, and enemy/rival behaviors hardly exist. Without the basics of core behaviors, it's hard to build a system on top of it that brings the needed changes, but I won't say it's impossible. Sims 2 added personality in packs just fine.
All in all, I think it's a good start. Properly changing Sim behaviors is going to be a long process that I don't think can be done in one swift move. So it will be important for us to leave feedback on this system and let them know what works, what doesn't, and where we think they should go from here. The fact that we are getting a system shows that they are invested in our requests and interests and it's possible that they have been working on this for a while. To me, this is a major turning point and will require both positive and negative detailed feedback because this might influence how the devs move forward with related content and it could potentially bring the long-awaited changes in the game for the better.
Such a system might make little sense if restricted to one EP. Much more interesting to develop if they can take all kinds of released features/moods/traits/reactions into it. So, I assume (and hope!) it will be a patch thing.
Yeah, that's my take too, unless this personality overhaul is very limited to this EP, it makes no sense for them to not patch this in. All packs have to work with just the base game only, why would they not want to expand this feature to other packs that they will release in the future?
If the personality additions are tied to the pack, I think it's possibly because they actually do change your Sims' behaviors (as the write-up claims) with a hidden system, and I've seen some other players say they don't want that, they like the Sims the way they are now. If a big change like this were to be patched in after six years, Maxis could have another horde of angry players on their backs. Many people who are already invested in the game are comfortable with the mechanics, so to suddenly change that on them could be disruptive. The majority of the player base isn't on the Forums or stalking the game on social media, so I suppose it would be risky.
But personally, I was hoping we'd get it patched into the foundation of the game so it can be expanded on in the future. Unless it's based on the Myers and Briggs Sixteen Personalities psychology, which I suspect it might be, in which case that's all there is to that theory and it's a pretty solid one.
I suspect there will still be personality issues because, yes, the foundation isn't solid. The traits are still meager and flaccid, there is still no Fear emotion or Worry or Anxiety so there is no completion to emotions, and enemy/rival behaviors hardly exist. Without the basics of core behaviors, it's hard to build a system on top of it that brings the needed changes, but I won't say it's impossible. Sims 2 added personality in packs just fine.
All in all, I think it's a good start. Properly changing Sim behaviors is going to be a long process that I don't think can be done in one swift move. So it will be important for us to leave feedback on this system and let them know what works, what doesn't, and where we think they should go from here. The fact that we are getting a system shows that they are invested in our requests and interests and it's possible that they have been working on this for a while. To me, this is a major turning point and will require both positive and negative detailed feedback because this might influence how the devs move forward with related content and it could potentially bring the long-awaited changes in the game for the better.
Thank you for this post LiELF, as always, I agree with most of what you say and I appreciate adding some perspective to it. I agree that people might not want Maxis to just go and patch in personalities that would ruin their saves ... but that's partially also because their game is quite unstable and clearly doesn't handle major changes like that well. But it does give me something to think about while I walk the dog, so thanks for that
ETA: ALSO I didn't think about the MB thing but you might be right given the number 16! That would please me in a way, if it's done well. Although in that case, I'm even more sure there will be no base game version of it.
if it's game changing i think it'll definitely need a pre patch personality overhaul. but perhaps it's another thing like the get famous feature which is ehh...
the description looks promising but we all know devs can be misleading. anyways i doubt they will include such important changes into a pack, imagine the backlash if ladders were a pack specific feature?
The Sims 4 already has personality features hidden behind a pay wall, Character Value traits from Parenthood, and the Reputation from Get Famous. When I learned that the reputation system was only part of the pack it made me quite bitter, something as important as a sims public image should be in the base game.
Same story here, if this new feature isn’t part of base game, they should have at least tweaked the base game systems to be more meaningful, otherwise I will be quite bitter.
I have a feeling that they were forced to make this long requested sit behind a paywall in response due to financial difficulties posed by COVID + a slew of packs that were regarded as flops by their player base.
Yes. In The Sims 2 Personality was improved with Turn on and Turn Off(NightLife) Hobbies and Interest (FreeTime) and Reputation (Apartment Life). So I do not see why they cannot do those again TS4.
The problem comes into place when the core personality are still broken in the base game. Personality improvements for the traits and aspirations alongside with whims and emotions are all tied to the base game. As we know those are broken. The new system will attemptto fix those but certaintly will fail because at its core it is broken
To clear things up it is ok, if the game has a solid foundstion for personslity. But for TS4 while I like that thry are improving personalities, the base game ones should first need to be overhsuled
This is what makes me think we'll get something in the patch before the expansion pack to maybe fix some of the personality issues (maybe it won't address everything 100% yet as that will come in future patches/expansions), but when we got City Living and got the lot traits, we got a patch with some base game lot traits, too. So, maybe this is what they'll do for traits and also life-styles, maybe adding a few in the patch and then 16 more in the expansion pack. And with that, they could address the trait issue a little.. this could be an update to the system because of this pack.
It would be the right move -- we'll see if they commit to that...... or not.. there will be backlash, if they don't, that's for sure.
The Sims 4 already has personality features hidden behind a pay wall, Character Value traits from Parenthood, and the Reputation from Get Famous. When I learned that the reputation system was only part of the pack it made me quite bitter, something as important as a sims public image should be in the base game.
Same story here, if this new feature isn’t part of base game, they should have at least tweaked the base game systems to be more meaningful, otherwise I will be quite bitter.
Agreed. I think people are getting their hopes up about this being in a patch. I think it's unlikely that they will patch this in. It's listed as a feature of the pack in the description.
Maybe they'll patch in a smaller version of it to the base game?
The devs need to clarify this ASAP before speculation gets out of control. If it hasn't gotten of control already
If the personality additions are tied to the pack, I think it's possibly because they actually do change your Sims' behaviors (as the write-up claims) with a hidden system, and I've seen some other players say they don't want that, they like the Sims the way they are now. If a big change like this were to be patched in after six years, Maxis could have another horde of angry players on their backs. Many people who are already invested in the game are comfortable with the mechanics, so to suddenly change that on them could be disruptive. The majority of the player base isn't on the Forums or stalking the game on social media, so I suppose it would be risky.
But personally, I was hoping we'd get it patched into the foundation of the game so it can be expanded on in the future. Unless it's based on the Myers and Briggs Sixteen Personalities psychology, which I suspect it might be, in which case that's all there is to that theory and it's a pretty solid one.
I suspect there will still be personality issues because, yes, the foundation isn't solid. The traits are still meager and flaccid, there is still no Fear emotion or Worry or Anxiety so there is no completion to emotions, and enemy/rival behaviors hardly exist. Without the basics of core behaviors, it's hard to build a system on top of it that brings the needed changes, but I won't say it's impossible. Sims 2 added personality in packs just fine.
All in all, I think it's a good start. Properly changing Sim behaviors is going to be a long process that I don't think can be done in one swift move. So it will be important for us to leave feedback on this system and let them know what works, what doesn't, and where we think they should go from here. The fact that we are getting a system shows that they are invested in our requests and interests and it's possible that they have been working on this for a while. To me, this is a major turning point and will require both positive and negative detailed feedback because this might influence how the devs move forward with related content and it could potentially bring the long-awaited changes in the game for the better.
Very good point, it's possible that they want to try it out first because they don't know how well it is going to be received.
I mean, they did an overhaul of how sims react to the environment and someone over at maxis thought it was a great idea that your sim is going to do a yawning animation if their environment score is low and a "aha!" animation if their environment score is high, every time they receive the environment buff,
who knows what "bright ideas" Maxis would do with a personality overhaul. Maybe they will add tons of idle animations with this overhaul.
I have a feeling that they were forced to make this long requested sit behind a paywall in response due to financial difficulties posed by COVID + a slew of packs that were regarded as flops by their player base.
And we thought Journey to Batuu was low? Hiding core game features behind a paywall is even lower
But we still don't know yet. Hopefully the devs clarify soon....
I have a feeling that they were forced to make this long requested sit behind a paywall in response due to financial difficulties posed by COVID + a slew of packs that were regarded as flops by their player base.
But don't you know, gaming has increased a lot thanks to Covid.
Okay, so I don't want to hijack other threads with negative thoughts and all, so I'll throw it out here ...
Assuming that the new Lifestyles and Sentiments work as intended, and actually flesh out sim personalities, as described below:
The Sims 4 Snowy Escape also introduces Lifestyles and Sentiments features, adding more depth to Sims’ personalities and relationships. For the first time, up to 16 Lifestyles will manifest in response to a Sim’s actions and habits, changing their behaviors significantly more than Create a Sim traits as they reflect a Sim’s lived experiences. Sentiments represent how two Sims can feel differently about the outcome of a shared experience and have a lasting impact on Sims’ relationships to each other, affecting their social interactions.
.. is that really the route they're going with our feedback that sims need more personality?
Tying it to a 40 USD expansion?
.. feel free to share your thoughts. I'm really confused about how I feel about any of this. I really thought a pack like this (snow, winter, mountains) would excite me rather than worry me.
I actually don't care as long as it finally is there. Let's just hope it's well done.
I have a feeling that they were forced to make this long requested sit behind a paywall in response due to financial difficulties posed by COVID + a slew of packs that were regarded as flops by their player base.
And we thought Journey to Batuu was low? Hiding core game features behind a paywall is even lower
But we still don't know yet. Hopefully the devs clarify soon....
i was lowkey glad packs in ts4 were useless so i didn't feel the need to have them lol
If the personality additions are tied to the pack, I think it's possibly because they actually do change your Sims' behaviors (as the write-up claims) with a hidden system, and I've seen some other players say they don't want that, they like the Sims the way they are now. If a big change like this were to be patched in after six years, Maxis could have another horde of angry players on their backs. Many people who are already invested in the game are comfortable with the mechanics, so to suddenly change that on them could be disruptive. The majority of the player base isn't on the Forums or stalking the game on social media, so I suppose it would be risky.
But personally, I was hoping we'd get it patched into the foundation of the game so it can be expanded on in the future. Unless it's based on the Myers and Briggs Sixteen Personalities psychology, which I suspect it might be, in which case that's all there is to that theory and it's a pretty solid one.
I suspect there will still be personality issues because, yes, the foundation isn't solid. The traits are still meager and flaccid, there is still no Fear emotion or Worry or Anxiety so there is no completion to emotions, and enemy/rival behaviors hardly exist. Without the basics of core behaviors, it's hard to build a system on top of it that brings the needed changes, but I won't say it's impossible. Sims 2 added personality in packs just fine.
All in all, I think it's a good start. Properly changing Sim behaviors is going to be a long process that I don't think can be done in one swift move. So it will be important for us to leave feedback on this system and let them know what works, what doesn't, and where we think they should go from here. The fact that we are getting a system shows that they are invested in our requests and interests and it's possible that they have been working on this for a while. To me, this is a major turning point and will require both positive and negative detailed feedback because this might influence how the devs move forward with related content and it could potentially bring the long-awaited changes in the game for the better.
Very good point, it's possible that they want to try it out first because they don't know how well it is going to be received.
I mean, they did an overhaul of how sims react to the environment and someone over at maxis thought it was a great idea that your sim is going to do a yawning animation if their environment score is low and a "aha!" animation if their environment score is high, every time they receive the environment buff,
who knows what "bright ideas" Maxis would do with a personality overhaul. Maybe they will add tons of idle animations with this overhaul.
True. It could be like NAPS all over again. A bunch of lame, recycled animations we have to see all the time. If that's the case, then count me out
Sure. The whole point of an expansion pack is to expand the game in a meaningful way. The personality overhaul will add new depth to the game and enhance game play which is what an expansion should do.
I have a feeling that they were forced to make this long requested sit behind a paywall in response due to financial difficulties posed by COVID + a slew of packs that were regarded as flops by their player base.
But don't you know, gaming has increased a lot thanks to Covid.
It has, but not to derail the thread, Gaming Development has also become much more difficult because it requires a lot of communication between teams.
Comments
Updated with Werewolf Diaries (1)
There were people spamming the premiere live chat and Twitter all morning. Like everyone just loves to hate on the game and then others with more neutral opinions start to have unfounded negative opinions. This game is legitimately great.
It is clearly a base game feature.
To be fair, people always spam the live chats for sims stuff. I try my best to ignore those, but I know what you mean, it's annoying
They are listing it as a feature of the pack in the description.
Also, reputation was exclusive to Get Famous, and ladders were never advertised as a feature of Eco Lifestyle.
Sadly, I think these features may be exclusive to the pack.
I hope you are right, but I sincerely doub it.
The only thing I can imagine, like someone else said earlier, is that they will introduce a basic version with the patch but keep the majority of it tied to the EP. However ... I can't imagine what a basic version of this kind of personality system would look like. Or how they'd add to it.
But personally, I was hoping we'd get it patched into the foundation of the game so it can be expanded on in the future. Unless it's based on the Myers and Briggs Sixteen Personalities psychology, which I suspect it might be, in which case that's all there is to that theory and it's a pretty solid one.
I suspect there will still be personality issues because, yes, the foundation isn't solid. The traits are still meager and flaccid, there is still no Fear emotion or Worry or Anxiety so there is no completion to emotions, and enemy/rival behaviors hardly exist. Without the basics of core behaviors, it's hard to build a system on top of it that brings the needed changes, but I won't say it's impossible. Sims 2 added personality in packs just fine.
All in all, I think it's a good start. Properly changing Sim behaviors is going to be a long process that I don't think can be done in one swift move. So it will be important for us to leave feedback on this system and let them know what works, what doesn't, and where we think they should go from here. The fact that we are getting a system shows that they are invested in our requests and interests and it's possible that they have been working on this for a while. To me, this is a major turning point and will require both positive and negative detailed feedback because this might influence how the devs move forward with related content and it could potentially bring the long-awaited changes in the game for the better.
"The Sims 4 Snowy Escape also introduces Lifestyles and Sentiments features..."
It's a feature of the pack, not of the game overall.
I'm not trying to be negative, but the statement speaks for itself...
Yeah, that's my take too, unless this personality overhaul is very limited to this EP, it makes no sense for them to not patch this in. All packs have to work with just the base game only, why would they not want to expand this feature to other packs that they will release in the future?
Thank you for this post LiELF, as always, I agree with most of what you say and I appreciate adding some perspective to it. I agree that people might not want Maxis to just go and patch in personalities that would ruin their saves ... but that's partially also because their game is quite unstable and clearly doesn't handle major changes like that well. But it does give me something to think about while I walk the dog, so thanks for that
ETA: ALSO I didn't think about the MB thing but you might be right given the number 16! That would please me in a way, if it's done well. Although in that case, I'm even more sure there will be no base game version of it.
the description looks promising but we all know devs can be misleading. anyways i doubt they will include such important changes into a pack, imagine the backlash if ladders were a pack specific feature?
Same story here, if this new feature isn’t part of base game, they should have at least tweaked the base game systems to be more meaningful, otherwise I will be quite bitter.
This is what makes me think we'll get something in the patch before the expansion pack to maybe fix some of the personality issues (maybe it won't address everything 100% yet as that will come in future patches/expansions), but when we got City Living and got the lot traits, we got a patch with some base game lot traits, too. So, maybe this is what they'll do for traits and also life-styles, maybe adding a few in the patch and then 16 more in the expansion pack. And with that, they could address the trait issue a little.. this could be an update to the system because of this pack.
It would be the right move -- we'll see if they commit to that...... or not.. there will be backlash, if they don't, that's for sure.
Agreed. I think people are getting their hopes up about this being in a patch. I think it's unlikely that they will patch this in. It's listed as a feature of the pack in the description.
Maybe they'll patch in a smaller version of it to the base game?
The devs need to clarify this ASAP before speculation gets out of control. If it hasn't gotten of control already
Very good point, it's possible that they want to try it out first because they don't know how well it is going to be received.
I mean, they did an overhaul of how sims react to the environment and someone over at maxis thought it was a great idea that your sim is going to do a yawning animation if their environment score is low and a "aha!" animation if their environment score is high, every time they receive the environment buff,
who knows what "bright ideas" Maxis would do with a personality overhaul. Maybe they will add tons of idle animations with this overhaul.
And we thought Journey to Batuu was low? Hiding core game features behind a paywall is even lower
But we still don't know yet. Hopefully the devs clarify soon....
But don't you know, gaming has increased a lot thanks to Covid.
I actually don't care as long as it finally is there. Let's just hope it's well done.
i was lowkey glad packs in ts4 were useless so i didn't feel the need to have them lol
True. It could be like NAPS all over again. A bunch of lame, recycled animations we have to see all the time. If that's the case, then count me out
It has, but not to derail the thread, Gaming Development has also become much more difficult because it requires a lot of communication between teams.