After closing the other thread for what seems like no reason it makes me even more likely to just cancel this preorder. I didn't really care for the theme and after so few lots in this world it's not even worth the near half off price I paid for it. $20 might be pushing it. I'm tired of small worlds with big price tags. Seasons showed so much promise, but this is just another grab $$ game.
"Performance issues" just means they ran out of time. There is no way this game can't handle a couple more lots per world. None. I can see why Cats & Dogs and Seasons could effect performance, but this is minuscule. They just ran out of time or budget. Performance is just an excuse.
I'm not really excited. While I'm up for any new worlds, I've been hoping for a beach environment. The lack of a true beachfront is disappointing. I can only hope the next GP is a beachy vacation world.
Hopefully their strict plan of keeping worlds small means they intend to give us neighbor to neighbor open world play at some point. If the neighborhoods were too big, that might not work as well. When I say open world I just mean being able to visit one neighbor without a load screen and see them walk around and live, not the entire world. I know we won't have that. It's only a hope though.
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I don't buy it as far as their answer goes as to why so few lots in this world. Performance issue? No way! If they said this about Sims 3 - I could see it - that was a 32 bit game - that seriously needed more ram - should have been upped to 64 bit - and yet look at all the many usable lots it had. Even look at sim 2 - look at all the usable lots and all the content in both those games - and here we are finally a 64 bit sims game - you need a 64 bit pc - tons of ram the game can see and utilize and they pull performance issues out of a bag. Really? That is so... never mind I can't even say it. Some things are just better left unsaid.
Just don't give me performance issues after we have played all the other sims games on 32 bit - with even sims 2 having a limit of 4600 sims before the game started culling on very weak pcs compared to what we are running now. I have 8 cores - I can run 4.5ghz of speed and have 16 gig of ram (I can easily go to 32 gig on this pc). Sims 2, 3, and 4 do not even barely move my pcs performance graphs even after hours of play in any one of those games - do not tell me 3 more houses on this map is an issue. All maps could have been Windenburg size throughout this game and not have been an issue. I just can't buy that - not on a 64bit game, and not in a game where we load just one live lot at a time.
Post edited by Writin_Reg on
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
In dreams - I LIVE!
In REALITY, I simply exist.....
Neither of these games use the same engine ... Just because you can do something with one game engin means it works with another.
What does this have to do with ram.
Everything. A 32bit game can only see and use 3.4 gigs of ram (and has to share that with your OS as well) - a 64 bit game can utilize all the ram your pc can handle. The more ram your pc has the more sims, houses, programming - you name it - can be handled by the game as long as your pc meets the game recommended requirements.. Lack of ram causes pcs to crash more than any other reason outside of excess heat or component failures. Error 12 is an indication of not enough ram - and that just happened to be Sims 3 most frequent error. That game was starved for ram.
Also keep in mind 32 bit games are really slow compared to 64bit games. So there is no good reason why this game should have performance issues after it was overhauled to run in 64 bit regardless of game engine. Ask yourself - what is the actual reason if there is one why they would make this kind of decision now - after finally giving you tools to use on the games lots. Where do we rule this game and make it our own if they take away your drawing board - which in this case is the lots we actually use to do that ruling from. What good is having a tool to do your thing with if they take away your palette and easel?
It's not a movie, it's a game where creators can mold the lots - the playing field on. You get the tools but at the same time they take away the places you can use them - drastically limiting you as the player again. I cannot understand any one being happy with this.
Post edited by Writin_Reg on
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
In dreams - I LIVE!
In REALITY, I simply exist.....
"Performance issues" just means they ran out of time. There is no way this game can't handle a couple more lots per world. None. I can see why Cats & Dogs and Seasons could effect performance, but this is minuscule. They just ran out of time or budget. Performance is just an excuse.
We don't know, nobody could know the actual reason. It is certaintly I think the world was planned to have this amount if neighborhoods from the beginning.
They plan things in advance and not just after we finish this part we move on, to the next and see how many we can create. Nope before they started the pack everything that was already there is already planned.
Their wnvironment team is responsible for creating worlds, and this pack was in development possibly before the release of seasons. In that case During the development of Brindleton Bay, They are also developing Selvadorada, and adjusting the worlds for Seasons. After
the release of Cats and Dogs focus must be put on Selvadorada and Present worlds. As packs start to develop this things are known in advance so its possible that they must have been decided to plan only this amount of lots in the world, if you think of it, While they are finishing up the worlds for Seasons, Del Sol Valley is not just the world that is in development. World for EP7 of Even GP6 might be in development. As Seasons was release the environment team possibly shifted their rescources to Finisihing up the planned content for this world, and some might even went to other worlds in development. And by that time finishing up their planned world content.
TLDR I dont think they runned out of time. Every content is being planned in advanced based on their schedule. They know from the beginning what content will they include based on their rescources. If it was rushed it should lack detail
, just like Oasis Springs feels rushed.
Everything. A 32bit game can only see and use 3.4 gigs of ram (and has to share that with your OS as well) - a 64 bit game can utilize all the ram your pc can handle. The more ram your pc has the more sims, houses, programming - you name it - can be handled by the game as long as your pc meets the game recommended requirements.. Lack of ram causes pcs to crash more than any other reason outside of excess heat or component failures. Error 12 is an indication of not enough ram - and that just happened to be Sims 3 most frequent error. That game was starved for ram.
Also keep in mine 32 bit games are really slow compared to 64bit games. So there is no good reason why this game should have performance issues.
Okay, but I'm not talking about performance issues there. TS3 was using a game engine made for open neighborhoords. TS4 is not.
Coding such a core feature in the engine would take time and effort, and when you have your new engine ready, you have your existing game built on the previous version, what do you do then ?
Neither of these games use the same engine ... Just because you can do something with one game engin means it works with another.
What does this have to do with ram.
Everything. A 32bit game can only see and use 3.4 gigs of ram (and has to share that with your OS as well) - a 64 bit game can utilize all the ram your pc can handle. The more ram your pc has the more sims, houses, programming - you name it - can be handled by the game as long as your pc meets the game recommended requirements.. Lack of ram causes pcs to crash more than any other reason outside of excess heat or component failures. Error 12 is an indication of not enough ram - and that just happened to be Sims 3 most frequent error. That game was starved for ram.
Also keep in mine 32 bit games are really slow compared to 64bit games. So there is no good reason why this game should have performance issues.
Preach it, because you are exactly right. I assume they want to keep the loading of the game to a minium of zero for laptops. And I think many aren't even using the 64 bit version of TS4 like most of us with a desktop. That was like give a dog a bone to eventually add 64bit for TS4. It's still running on 32 bit probably for all laptop users, if truth be known.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
Everything. A 32bit game can only see and use 3.4 gigs of ram (and has to share that with your OS as well) - a 64 bit game can utilize all the ram your pc can handle. The more ram your pc has the more sims, houses, programming - you name it - can be handled by the game as long as your pc meets the game recommended requirements.. Lack of ram causes pcs to crash more than any other reason outside of excess heat or component failures. Error 12 is an indication of not enough ram - and that just happened to be Sims 3 most frequent error. That game was starved for ram.
Also keep in mine 32 bit games are really slow compared to 64bit games. So there is no good reason why this game should have performance issues.
Okay, but I'm not talking about performance issues there. TS3 was using a game engine made for open neighborhoords. TS4 is not.
Coding such a core feature in the engine would take time and effort, and when you have your new engine ready, you have your existing game built on the previous version, what do you do then ?
I still hope they manage to do it someday though.
What difference does that make? It makes no difference on the kind of engine Sims 3 had - 64 bit is 64 bit - and allows things 32 bit does not. That's as bad as the" performance issue in the future" answer we got from them as to why we get so few lot in this world.. If you don't know, don't just throw anything out there. I happen to know better. I built my first pc back in 1984 before we had a windows operating system. Took machine basic back before that in 1981. Went back to college in 1989 and took computer sciences. Jeez - it's okay not to know something - but wild guesses isn't a solution. I was not even suggesting an open world - is the point. It was their answer to why we only get 6 residential lots. Not enough lots is the problem - and has nothing to do with this game engine or needing an open world game engine. I mean are you really okay with 6 residential lots and 3-4 of them already filled with game sims? I was asking about just adding 3 more residential lots.
No disrespect intended but, this is very unsavory to me when they give answers I can't believe as I know better.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
In dreams - I LIVE!
In REALITY, I simply exist.....
I was not even suggesting an open world - is the point. It was their answer to why we only get 6 residential lots. Not enough lots is the problem - and has nothing to do with this game engine or needing an open world game engine. I mean are you really okay with 6 residential lots and 3-4 of them already filled with game sims? I was asking about just adding 3 more residential lots.
No disrespect intended but, this is very unsavory to me when they give answers I can't believe as I know better.
Wow take a chill pill. I did not quote you at first because the general discussion was about the possibility and consequences of open worldness and that's what I came to discuss.
I did not ask for an record of things you were doing before I was born, especially considering game engines "make no difference for you". Since, you know, that's what I was trying to talk about.
You do you, but don't aggro me because you're mad about a world size. Jesus.
Everything. A 32bit game can only see and use 3.4 gigs of ram (and has to share that with your OS as well) - a 64 bit game can utilize all the ram your pc can handle. The more ram your pc has the more sims, houses, programming - you name it - can be handled by the game as long as your pc meets the game recommended requirements.. Lack of ram causes pcs to crash more than any other reason outside of excess heat or component failures. Error 12 is an indication of not enough ram - and that just happened to be Sims 3 most frequent error. That game was starved for ram.
Also keep in mine 32 bit games are really slow compared to 64bit games. So there is no good reason why this game should have performance issues.
Okay, but I'm not talking about performance issues there. TS3 was using a game engine made for open neighborhoords. TS4 is not.
Coding such a core feature in the engine would take time and effort, and when you have your new engine ready, you have your existing game built on the previous version, what do you do then ?
I still hope they manage to do it someday though.
Except the person you replied to was talking about performance issues and you tried to say it was a different engine as if that mattered. If TS3 can run on a crappier machine then TS4 even with it's glaring issues then there is no reason TS4 should have ANY performance issues with worlds in terms of a lot of lots. If it does it's because the engine isn't made well and they should stop making stuff for TS4. Work on TS5 or fix their issues instead of making small worlds while making excuses for why they can't do things like more open neighborhoods or more lots. TS3 is a crap engine too.
After closing the other thread for what seems like no reason it makes me even more likely to just cancel this preorder. I didn't really care for the theme and after so few lots in this world it's not even worth the near half off price I paid for it. $20 might be pushing it. I'm tired of small worlds with big price tags. Seasons showed so much promise, but this is just another grab $$ game.
You can cancel preorders?
Some stores will let you so long as it's not already been bought/used/played. Since there hasn't been a code given yet talking to support I probably can. I've done it before. I don't know if you can through origin though as I've never tried through that. I always buy mine from key websites.
Neither of these games use the same engine ... Just because you can do something with one game engin means it works with another.
What does this have to do with ram.
Everything. A 32bit game can only see and use 3.4 gigs of ram (and has to share that with your OS as well) - a 64 bit game can utilize all the ram your pc can handle. The more ram your pc has the more sims, houses, programming - you name it - can be handled by the game as long as your pc meets the game recommended requirements.. Lack of ram causes pcs to crash more than any other reason outside of excess heat or component failures. Error 12 is an indication of not enough ram - and that just happened to be Sims 3 most frequent error. That game was starved for ram.
Also keep in mine 32 bit games are really slow compared to 64bit games. So there is no good reason why this game should have performance issues.
Preach it, because you are exactly right. I assume they want to keep the loading of the game to a minium of zero for laptops. And I think many aren't even using the 64 bit version of TS4 like most of us with a desktop. That was like give a dog a bone to eventually add 64bit for TS4. It's still running on 32 bit probably for all laptop users, if truth be known.
So basically you think they will continue to limit the game as if the 64bit version didn't exist, just so it can be run on laptops?
I guess no big improvements are to be expected for future EPs then
Neither of these games use the same engine ... Just because you can do something with one game engin means it works with another.
What does this have to do with ram.
Everything. A 32bit game can only see and use 3.4 gigs of ram (and has to share that with your OS as well) - a 64 bit game can utilize all the ram your pc can handle. The more ram your pc has the more sims, houses, programming - you name it - can be handled by the game as long as your pc meets the game recommended requirements.. Lack of ram causes pcs to crash more than any other reason outside of excess heat or component failures. Error 12 is an indication of not enough ram - and that just happened to be Sims 3 most frequent error. That game was starved for ram.
Also keep in mine 32 bit games are really slow compared to 64bit games. So there is no good reason why this game should have performance issues.
Preach it, because you are exactly right. I assume they want to keep the loading of the game to a minium of zero for laptops. And I think many aren't even using the 64 bit version of TS4 like most of us with a desktop. That was like give a dog a bone to eventually add 64bit for TS4. It's still running on 32 bit probably for all laptop users, if truth be known.
I’d just like to specify non-gaming laptops. I run my game 64-bit on ultra just fine on my laptop.
Neither of these games use the same engine ... Just because you can do something with one game engin means it works with another.
What does this have to do with ram.
Everything. A 32bit game can only see and use 3.4 gigs of ram (and has to share that with your OS as well) - a 64 bit game can utilize all the ram your pc can handle. The more ram your pc has the more sims, houses, programming - you name it - can be handled by the game as long as your pc meets the game recommended requirements.. Lack of ram causes pcs to crash more than any other reason outside of excess heat or component failures. Error 12 is an indication of not enough ram - and that just happened to be Sims 3 most frequent error. That game was starved for ram.
Also keep in mine 32 bit games are really slow compared to 64bit games. So there is no good reason why this game should have performance issues.
Preach it, because you are exactly right. I assume they want to keep the loading of the game to a minium of zero for laptops. And I think many aren't even using the 64 bit version of TS4 like most of us with a desktop. That was like give a dog a bone to eventually add 64bit for TS4. It's still running on 32 bit probably for all laptop users, if truth be known.
I’d just like to specify non-gaming laptops. I run my game 64-bit on ultra just fine on my laptop.
I don't buy it as far as their answer goes as to why so few lots in this world. Performance issue? No way! If they said this about Sims 3 - I could see it - that was a 32 bit game - that seriously needed more ram - should have been upped to 64 bit - and yet look at all the many usable lots it had. Even look at sim 2 - look at all the usable lots and all the content in both those games - and here we are finally a 64 bit sims game - you need a 64 bit pc - tons of ram the game can see and utilize and they pull performance issues out of a bag. Really? That is so... never mind I can't even say it - but if you believe that - well you shouldn't be gaming - that or there is a huge issue with this game they are hiding.
Don't give me performance issues after we have played all the other sims games on 32 bit - with even sims 2 having a limit of 4600 sims before the game started culling on very weak pcs compared to what we are running now. I have 8 cores - I can run 4.5ghz of speed and have 16 gig of ram (I can easily go to 32 gig on this pc). Sims 2, 3, and 4 do not even barely move my pcs performance graphs even after hours of play in any one of those games - do not tell me 3 more houses on this map is an issue. All maps could have been Windenburg size throughout this game and not have been an issue. I just can't buy that - not on a 64bit game.
This. Totally agree.
(I would kill for the sims 3 being 64 bit, but never going to happen)
I don't buy it as far as their answer goes as to why so few lots in this world. Performance issue? No way! If they said this about Sims 3 - I could see it - that was a 32 bit game - that seriously needed more ram - should have been upped to 64 bit - and yet look at all the many usable lots it had. Even look at sim 2 - look at all the usable lots and all the content in both those games - and here we are finally a 64 bit sims game - you need a 64 bit pc - tons of ram the game can see and utilize and they pull performance issues out of a bag. Really? That is so... never mind I can't even say it - but if you believe that - well you shouldn't be gaming - that or there is a huge issue with this game they are hiding.
Don't give me performance issues after we have played all the other sims games on 32 bit - with even sims 2 having a limit of 4600 sims before the game started culling on very weak pcs compared to what we are running now. I have 8 cores - I can run 4.5ghz of speed and have 16 gig of ram (I can easily go to 32 gig on this pc). Sims 2, 3, and 4 do not even barely move my pcs performance graphs even after hours of play in any one of those games - do not tell me 3 more houses on this map is an issue. All maps could have been Windenburg size throughout this game and not have been an issue. I just can't buy that - not on a 64bit game.
This. Totally agree.
(I would kill for the sims 3 being 64 bit, but never going to happen)
Origin could easily update Sims 3 to be 64 bit still.
Neither of these games use the same engine ... Just because you can do something with one game engin means it works with another.
What does this have to do with ram.
Everything. A 32bit game can only see and use 3.4 gigs of ram (and has to share that with your OS as well) - a 64 bit game can utilize all the ram your pc can handle. The more ram your pc has the more sims, houses, programming - you name it - can be handled by the game as long as your pc meets the game recommended requirements.. Lack of ram causes pcs to crash more than any other reason outside of excess heat or component failures. Error 12 is an indication of not enough ram - and that just happened to be Sims 3 most frequent error. That game was starved for ram.
Also keep in mine 32 bit games are really slow compared to 64bit games. So there is no good reason why this game should have performance issues.
Preach it, because you are exactly right. I assume they want to keep the loading of the game to a minium of zero for laptops. And I think many aren't even using the 64 bit version of TS4 like most of us with a desktop. That was like give a dog a bone to eventually add 64bit for TS4. It's still running on 32 bit probably for all laptop users, if truth be known.
I’d just like to specify non-gaming laptops. I run my game 64-bit on ultra just fine on my laptop.
You are probably one of the few who own a gaming laptop and an exception. I have spent a lot of time in the last three years over in tech and bug threads, and what I saw almost daily was Rose telling those who were playing the game to reset it back to 32 bit. That wasn't a rare occurrence but I saw it often in those threads.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
The amount of set dressing in the immediately playable areas is absolutely appalling. The decorative cars littered around - totally unnecessary. You want a world with cars parked around? Make some functional cars then, or leave them out entirely as they add nothing to the game.
I don’t see how they can sit at their desks and continue to try and sell people on this games long bright future if they’re already stunting expansions under the excuse of performance concerns. Almost like we have heard that *several* times in the past...
At what point does it register that the game is just poorly designed and they’re reaching the point where patronizing PR can’t hide that?
The amount of set dressing in the immediately playable areas is absolutely appalling. The decorative cars littered around - totally unnecessary. You want a world with cars parked around? Make some functional cars then, or leave them out entirely as they add nothing to the game.
I don’t see how they can sit at their desks and continue to try and sell people on this games long bright future if they’re already stunting expansions under the excuse of performance concerns. Almost like we have heard that *several* times in the past...
At what point does it register that the game is just poorly designed and they’re reaching the point where patronizing PR can’t hide that?
I sadly agree with what you are saying. The game is well beyond the point of being able to hide it's short comings.
Everything. A 32bit game can only see and use 3.4 gigs of ram (and has to share that with your OS as well) - a 64 bit game can utilize all the ram your pc can handle. The more ram your pc has the more sims, houses, programming - you name it - can be handled by the game as long as your pc meets the game recommended requirements.. Lack of ram causes pcs to crash more than any other reason outside of excess heat or component failures. Error 12 is an indication of not enough ram - and that just happened to be Sims 3 most frequent error. That game was starved for ram.
Also keep in mine 32 bit games are really slow compared to 64bit games. So there is no good reason why this game should have performance issues.
Okay, but I'm not talking about performance issues there. TS3 was using a game engine made for open neighborhoords. TS4 is not.
Coding such a core feature in the engine would take time and effort, and when you have your new engine ready, you have your existing game built on the previous version, what do you do then ?
I still hope they manage to do it someday though.
What difference does that make? It makes no difference on the kind of engine Sims 3 had - 64 bit is 64 bit - and allows things 32 bit does not. That's as bad as the" performance issue in the future" answer we got from them as to why we get so few lot in this world.. If you don't know, don't just throw anything out there. I happen to know better. I built my first pc back in 1984 before we had a windows operating system. Took machine basic back before that in 1981. Went back to college in 1989 and took computer sciences. Jeez - it's okay not to know something - but wild guesses isn't a solution. I was not even suggesting an open world - is the point. It was their answer to why we only get 6 residential lots. Not enough lots is the problem - and has nothing to do with this game engine or needing an open world game engine. I mean are you really okay with 6 residential lots and 3-4 of them already filled with game sims? I was asking about just adding 3 more residential lots.
I would have figured that someone with such a background would know that actually the engine does matter....like a lot. In fact the main reason why we are here with 11 lots is in fact engine limitations on the amount of households in a neighborhood, and the amount of sims available to player in all of the worlds. The guru's are quite worried about the next 3 years and how the engine will handle ever increasing sims limit. We have 180 allotted to us at the moment. Again you said this isn't an engine issue when in fact its entirely an engine issue. Also you are absolutely right in saying that 32 bit to 64 bit is cause for the elimination of some constraints and instability issues. However game engines, CPU power, GPU power, and VRAM amount also play a role in limitations of the game. Specifically GPU and CPU processing. These are all factors in this discussion.
Most of here appreciate your expertise but the other poster was just trying to point out an observation or make a point. No need for personal attacks.
Specs: i9-9900k, SLI 2080ti MSI SeaHawk EK X, 32g 3000hz Corsair RAM, 2TB M.2 Samsung SSD, EVGA 1600W. Custom loop done by myself with dual 560mm radiators.
Everything. A 32bit game can only see and use 3.4 gigs of ram (and has to share that with your OS as well) - a 64 bit game can utilize all the ram your pc can handle. The more ram your pc has the more sims, houses, programming - you name it - can be handled by the game as long as your pc meets the game recommended requirements.. Lack of ram causes pcs to crash more than any other reason outside of excess heat or component failures. Error 12 is an indication of not enough ram - and that just happened to be Sims 3 most frequent error. That game was starved for ram.
Also keep in mine 32 bit games are really slow compared to 64bit games. So there is no good reason why this game should have performance issues.
Okay, but I'm not talking about performance issues there. TS3 was using a game engine made for open neighborhoords. TS4 is not.
Coding such a core feature in the engine would take time and effort, and when you have your new engine ready, you have your existing game built on the previous version, what do you do then ?
I still hope they manage to do it someday though.
What difference does that make? It makes no difference on the kind of engine Sims 3 had - 64 bit is 64 bit - and allows things 32 bit does not. That's as bad as the" performance issue in the future" answer we got from them as to why we get so few lot in this world.. If you don't know, don't just throw anything out there. I happen to know better. I built my first pc back in 1984 before we had a windows operating system. Took machine basic back before that in 1981. Went back to college in 1989 and took computer sciences. Jeez - it's okay not to know something - but wild guesses isn't a solution. I was not even suggesting an open world - is the point. It was their answer to why we only get 6 residential lots. Not enough lots is the problem - and has nothing to do with this game engine or needing an open world game engine. I mean are you really okay with 6 residential lots and 3-4 of them already filled with game sims? I was asking about just adding 3 more residential lots.
I would have figured that someone with such a background would know that actually the engine does matter....like a lot. In fact the main reason why we are here with 11 lots is in fact engine limitations on the amount of households in a neighborhood, and the amount of sims available to player in all of the worlds. The guru's are quite worried about the next 3 years and how the engine will handle ever increasing sims limit. We have 180 allotted to us at the moment. Again you said this isn't an engine issue when in fact its entirely an engine issue. Also you are absolutely right in saying that 32 bit to 64 bit is cause for the elimination of some constraints and instability issues. However game engines, CPU power, GPU power, and VRAM amount also play a role in limitations of the game. Specifically GPU and CPU processing. These are all factors in this discussion.
Most of here appreciate your expertise but the other poster was just trying to point out an observation or make a point. No need for personal attacks.
Currently, there's a default cap of 80 or 200 on your "favorite" (protected from culling) Sims. That cap can be manually turned off. The full population cap before culling begins is 675. It was last raised when Seasons was released.
There have been gradual performance increases all along as the game has developed, and increases in what the game can handle (without mods) in terms of population... and, obviously, lots for that population to live in. Looks like they hit more of a roadblock this time than with other EPs. EP releases have regularly seen population cap increases. I get the impression that they've left things open in terms of communicating this because the software engineers may or may not be able to break the current roadblock quickly. I suspect that as a result they've shifted some of what might have been space in this EP into some of what's being developed for the future rather than use more of it now and have even tinier worlds coming up before that roadblock is broken.
As for the game engine, it's not something that's 100% set in stone. I suspect that terrain editing, for example, is a major edit to the game engine.
Totally agree that they're dealing with performance limitations caused by what Simmers play on. There's only so far they probably cut lower-end computers off before too much of the games purchasing base disappears for development to continue at all. It's likely either nobody gets a Sims game or higher-end computer owners give up something so there can be one for everyone. Unfortunate reality, but a probably one.
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Comments
You can cancel preorders?
DBClayton's Superhero Mod Pack v. 1.1
"off the table" as of this month: http://simscommunity.info/2018/10/04/simgurugrant-reassures-that-open-worlds-and-neighborhoods-are-not-happening-for-the-sims-4/
FWIW, I suspect that open neighbourhood would slow the game down a lot more than adding more Sims & lots overall does, because lots more is being calculated all the time -- many lots' objects, not just one. Plus they'd have to reduce walkbys or increase the # of Sims in the neighbourhood at one time, or have even more performance reduction.
Just don't give me performance issues after we have played all the other sims games on 32 bit - with even sims 2 having a limit of 4600 sims before the game started culling on very weak pcs compared to what we are running now. I have 8 cores - I can run 4.5ghz of speed and have 16 gig of ram (I can easily go to 32 gig on this pc). Sims 2, 3, and 4 do not even barely move my pcs performance graphs even after hours of play in any one of those games - do not tell me 3 more houses on this map is an issue. All maps could have been Windenburg size throughout this game and not have been an issue. I just can't buy that - not on a 64bit game, and not in a game where we load just one live lot at a time.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
In dreams - I LIVE!
In REALITY, I simply exist.....
What does this have to do with ram.
Everything. A 32bit game can only see and use 3.4 gigs of ram (and has to share that with your OS as well) - a 64 bit game can utilize all the ram your pc can handle. The more ram your pc has the more sims, houses, programming - you name it - can be handled by the game as long as your pc meets the game recommended requirements.. Lack of ram causes pcs to crash more than any other reason outside of excess heat or component failures. Error 12 is an indication of not enough ram - and that just happened to be Sims 3 most frequent error. That game was starved for ram.
Also keep in mind 32 bit games are really slow compared to 64bit games. So there is no good reason why this game should have performance issues after it was overhauled to run in 64 bit regardless of game engine. Ask yourself - what is the actual reason if there is one why they would make this kind of decision now - after finally giving you tools to use on the games lots. Where do we rule this game and make it our own if they take away your drawing board - which in this case is the lots we actually use to do that ruling from. What good is having a tool to do your thing with if they take away your palette and easel?
It's not a movie, it's a game where creators can mold the lots - the playing field on. You get the tools but at the same time they take away the places you can use them - drastically limiting you as the player again. I cannot understand any one being happy with this.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
In dreams - I LIVE!
In REALITY, I simply exist.....
We don't know, nobody could know the actual reason. It is certaintly I think the world was planned to have this amount if neighborhoods from the beginning.
They plan things in advance and not just after we finish this part we move on, to the next and see how many we can create. Nope before they started the pack everything that was already there is already planned.
Their wnvironment team is responsible for creating worlds, and this pack was in development possibly before the release of seasons. In that case During the development of Brindleton Bay, They are also developing Selvadorada, and adjusting the worlds for Seasons. After
the release of Cats and Dogs focus must be put on Selvadorada and Present worlds. As packs start to develop this things are known in advance so its possible that they must have been decided to plan only this amount of lots in the world, if you think of it, While they are finishing up the worlds for Seasons, Del Sol Valley is not just the world that is in development. World for EP7 of Even GP6 might be in development. As Seasons was release the environment team possibly shifted their rescources to Finisihing up the planned content for this world, and some might even went to other worlds in development. And by that time finishing up their planned world content.
TLDR I dont think they runned out of time. Every content is being planned in advanced based on their schedule. They know from the beginning what content will they include based on their rescources. If it was rushed it should lack detail
, just like Oasis Springs feels rushed.
http://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/924539/features-that-needs-depth-and-ways-to-improve
Okay, but I'm not talking about performance issues there. TS3 was using a game engine made for open neighborhoords. TS4 is not.
Coding such a core feature in the engine would take time and effort, and when you have your new engine ready, you have your existing game built on the previous version, what do you do then ?
I still hope they manage to do it someday though.
Preach it, because you are exactly right. I assume they want to keep the loading of the game to a minium of zero for laptops. And I think many aren't even using the 64 bit version of TS4 like most of us with a desktop. That was like give a dog a bone to eventually add 64bit for TS4. It's still running on 32 bit probably for all laptop users, if truth be known.
What difference does that make? It makes no difference on the kind of engine Sims 3 had - 64 bit is 64 bit - and allows things 32 bit does not. That's as bad as the" performance issue in the future" answer we got from them as to why we get so few lot in this world.. If you don't know, don't just throw anything out there. I happen to know better. I built my first pc back in 1984 before we had a windows operating system. Took machine basic back before that in 1981. Went back to college in 1989 and took computer sciences. Jeez - it's okay not to know something - but wild guesses isn't a solution. I was not even suggesting an open world - is the point. It was their answer to why we only get 6 residential lots. Not enough lots is the problem - and has nothing to do with this game engine or needing an open world game engine. I mean are you really okay with 6 residential lots and 3-4 of them already filled with game sims? I was asking about just adding 3 more residential lots.
No disrespect intended but, this is very unsavory to me when they give answers I can't believe as I know better.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
In dreams - I LIVE!
In REALITY, I simply exist.....
Wow take a chill pill. I did not quote you at first because the general discussion was about the possibility and consequences of open worldness and that's what I came to discuss.
I did not ask for an record of things you were doing before I was born, especially considering game engines "make no difference for you". Since, you know, that's what I was trying to talk about.
You do you, but don't aggro me because you're mad about a world size. Jesus.
Except the person you replied to was talking about performance issues and you tried to say it was a different engine as if that mattered. If TS3 can run on a crappier machine then TS4 even with it's glaring issues then there is no reason TS4 should have ANY performance issues with worlds in terms of a lot of lots. If it does it's because the engine isn't made well and they should stop making stuff for TS4. Work on TS5 or fix their issues instead of making small worlds while making excuses for why they can't do things like more open neighborhoods or more lots. TS3 is a crap engine too.
Some stores will let you so long as it's not already been bought/used/played. Since there hasn't been a code given yet talking to support I probably can. I've done it before. I don't know if you can through origin though as I've never tried through that. I always buy mine from key websites.
I hadn't seen this tweet. My dreams were just unexpectedly crushed
So basically you think they will continue to limit the game as if the 64bit version didn't exist, just so it can be run on laptops?
I guess no big improvements are to be expected for future EPs then
I’d just like to specify non-gaming laptops. I run my game 64-bit on ultra just fine on my laptop.
Same here.
complete forum tutorial
Thank you @MDianaSanders for halloween-fying Golluma
This. Totally agree.
(I would kill for the sims 3 being 64 bit, but never going to happen)
Origin could easily update Sims 3 to be 64 bit still.
You are probably one of the few who own a gaming laptop and an exception. I have spent a lot of time in the last three years over in tech and bug threads, and what I saw almost daily was Rose telling those who were playing the game to reset it back to 32 bit. That wasn't a rare occurrence but I saw it often in those threads.
I don’t see how they can sit at their desks and continue to try and sell people on this games long bright future if they’re already stunting expansions under the excuse of performance concerns. Almost like we have heard that *several* times in the past...
At what point does it register that the game is just poorly designed and they’re reaching the point where patronizing PR can’t hide that?
I sadly agree with what you are saying. The game is well beyond the point of being able to hide it's short comings.
I would have figured that someone with such a background would know that actually the engine does matter....like a lot. In fact the main reason why we are here with 11 lots is in fact engine limitations on the amount of households in a neighborhood, and the amount of sims available to player in all of the worlds. The guru's are quite worried about the next 3 years and how the engine will handle ever increasing sims limit. We have 180 allotted to us at the moment. Again you said this isn't an engine issue when in fact its entirely an engine issue. Also you are absolutely right in saying that 32 bit to 64 bit is cause for the elimination of some constraints and instability issues. However game engines, CPU power, GPU power, and VRAM amount also play a role in limitations of the game. Specifically GPU and CPU processing. These are all factors in this discussion.
Most of here appreciate your expertise but the other poster was just trying to point out an observation or make a point. No need for personal attacks.
The 180 Sim limit went away years ago, FYI. Details here: https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/905991/culling-relationship-culling-decay-current-status/p1
Currently, there's a default cap of 80 or 200 on your "favorite" (protected from culling) Sims. That cap can be manually turned off. The full population cap before culling begins is 675. It was last raised when Seasons was released.
There have been gradual performance increases all along as the game has developed, and increases in what the game can handle (without mods) in terms of population... and, obviously, lots for that population to live in. Looks like they hit more of a roadblock this time than with other EPs. EP releases have regularly seen population cap increases. I get the impression that they've left things open in terms of communicating this because the software engineers may or may not be able to break the current roadblock quickly. I suspect that as a result they've shifted some of what might have been space in this EP into some of what's being developed for the future rather than use more of it now and have even tinier worlds coming up before that roadblock is broken.
As for the game engine, it's not something that's 100% set in stone. I suspect that terrain editing, for example, is a major edit to the game engine.
Totally agree that they're dealing with performance limitations caused by what Simmers play on. There's only so far they probably cut lower-end computers off before too much of the games purchasing base disappears for development to continue at all. It's likely either nobody gets a Sims game or higher-end computer owners give up something so there can be one for everyone. Unfortunate reality, but a probably one.