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Does the "Legacy Edition" of the Sims 4 confirm we are at *least* halfway through The Sims 4's life?
jackjack_k
Posts: 8,601 Member
As we know, in June, the 32bit versions of the Sims 4 will be no longer updated on Windows and non-metal Macs will no longer be supported also.
Interestingly though, 32 bit applications are NOT being phased out of the Windows space, meaning The Sims 4 *could* continue as it has since Cats & Dogs with a simple performance warning, AND Open-GL isn't being removed from MacOS anytime soon, so the "end" of The Sims 4 for non-metal macs seems rather fast when most Mac developers are still using OpenGL for porting games even in 2019.
So the thing is, The Sims 4 is about to celebrate it's 5th year. The only reason why EA would drop 32bit & non-metal Mac support by "choice" would potentially be because they want to expand the game beyond the system limitations it already faces. Which makes complete sense.
What doesn't make complete sense, is to do it for a game that's closer to the finish line than its starting point. Why remove limitations and cut off a part of the user base for a game to end relatively soon, for a change to a game that will only affect the last few packs?
Now, we could all be surprised and find out the game doesn't change at all, EA still aims for the same system requirements, it just doesn't want to deal with performance complaints on older machines. This is also likely, however there is one fault with that logic.
If we are closer to the end than the start of The Sims 4, and EA have no plans to increase the requirements to play the game and make the game more demanding as a whole, then why not ride the game out until the end and save it? Why remove a part of your player base, and lose potential sales, for no reason at all, "just because" when the game has a planned end?
For me, all of this tells me that EA are at *least* making a lot of under-the-hood changes to the game (ones that are at least of significant cost) so that the game can be continued to be added onto for years to come. They also *may* take advantage of higher specs as well. But to me, to promote a "legacy edition" of the game for older users, means the game has quite a lifespan ahead of it.
Wouldn't it be weird if the "Legacy Edition" only contained 2 or so more EP's and a couple of GPs/SPs less than the full version? What would be the point in cutting those users off for such a small amount of content?
What are your thoughts?
Interestingly though, 32 bit applications are NOT being phased out of the Windows space, meaning The Sims 4 *could* continue as it has since Cats & Dogs with a simple performance warning, AND Open-GL isn't being removed from MacOS anytime soon, so the "end" of The Sims 4 for non-metal macs seems rather fast when most Mac developers are still using OpenGL for porting games even in 2019.
So the thing is, The Sims 4 is about to celebrate it's 5th year. The only reason why EA would drop 32bit & non-metal Mac support by "choice" would potentially be because they want to expand the game beyond the system limitations it already faces. Which makes complete sense.
What doesn't make complete sense, is to do it for a game that's closer to the finish line than its starting point. Why remove limitations and cut off a part of the user base for a game to end relatively soon, for a change to a game that will only affect the last few packs?
Now, we could all be surprised and find out the game doesn't change at all, EA still aims for the same system requirements, it just doesn't want to deal with performance complaints on older machines. This is also likely, however there is one fault with that logic.
If we are closer to the end than the start of The Sims 4, and EA have no plans to increase the requirements to play the game and make the game more demanding as a whole, then why not ride the game out until the end and save it? Why remove a part of your player base, and lose potential sales, for no reason at all, "just because" when the game has a planned end?
For me, all of this tells me that EA are at *least* making a lot of under-the-hood changes to the game (ones that are at least of significant cost) so that the game can be continued to be added onto for years to come. They also *may* take advantage of higher specs as well. But to me, to promote a "legacy edition" of the game for older users, means the game has quite a lifespan ahead of it.
Wouldn't it be weird if the "Legacy Edition" only contained 2 or so more EP's and a couple of GPs/SPs less than the full version? What would be the point in cutting those users off for such a small amount of content?
What are your thoughts?
Jackeline. She/Her.
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I accidentally posted too quick
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We're probably are a little over the half way point.I think this game has a seven to six year life span
I think it’s way too soon to assume the end of 32bit support is going to eliminate limitations or produce some massive shift in the game’s capabilities. We don’t know that, and frankly I don’t think it’s reasonable to jump the gun and assume it will. The under the hood changes happened in 2015, the game has been 64bit since then but they did nothing with that until C&D in 2017. Let’s remain realistic here Jack.
Personally I think the game is reaching a point where the studio is having a lot of problems maintaining it. Clearly they are contracted to keep building it, but performance and quality are steadily on the decline, bugs aren’t being fixed, and content is not coming out nearly at the rate it was even a few years ago. Why drop 32bit? Well it means the studio will have to do less optimization, and they won’t have to worry about everything they add on top of each other crashing the game by trying to use 4GB or more of memory. Anyone expecting this to somehow molt Sims 4 into a new game, or a different game, you will be disappointed.
OpenGL is no longer being updated, which means newer games should probably use Metal, but as most of Apple's applications still use Open GL, it will be supported for years to come. To transfer a game from OpenGL to Metal now, when the game came is closer to its end point than its start point, makes no sense. It would be like EA making The Sims 3 64 bit on Mac so it's still supported, only to remove it a year from now from sale.
Surely, if they are going to future-proof the Sims 4 on Mac now, so that when Open GL is officially removed from MacOS in a few years time it's playable, it means there's a significant future for the Sims 4. Because let's be real, EA don't care about "quality of life" updates for Mac users.
EA are spending money right now porting the game to a completely different API, so they can continue to sell the game when OpenGL is removed. Yet with The Sims 3, they are still selling it on Mac, even though the game stopped working correctly halfway through the original run, and will completely fail to load without hacking the game on Macs older than 2012.
EA didn't feel the need to update anything about the game to support newer Macs for Sims 3 (all they had to do was update the patcher tool and support new graphics cards) while they had 1 - 2 years worth of content to push, I doubt they're making a whole new move to an API for 2 years of content due to a change of heart?
Also, I agree. I don't think this will change much about the game being non-metal and 32 bit players. That's the point I'm making. I doubt there will be major upgrades post this patch, so IF there's only 2 or so years left, it doesn't make sense to do this unless there IS a major upgrade (unlikely) or they're doing this to support the game for a much longer time (more likely).
The Sims 4 is one of the only existing games to be moving from OpenGL to Metal. They're doing it way before everyone else. If everyone else was doing it, then we would know Apple has internally given an end date. But as no one is doing it, OpenGL is here to stay and EA for whatever reason are deciding to futlureproof themselves, which they didn't for The Sims 3. They obviously didn't think it was worth it for 3 Expansion Packs, 2 Stuff Packs and 2 years of monthly store content.
So unless the player base for the Sims 4 is significantly higher than 3's was, I can't see them having such a change of heart unless there's a whole lot more coming than 2 or so years worth of content.
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Why would they cut off 32bit on PC? I would say because it just doesn’t make sense to tailor the game to it anymore. PC is the only platform that has ever had a 32bit version, and we don’t even know what percentage of players make up that chunk. If they had a huge number of players running the game on 32bit then we wouldn’t see it dropped, but since they can do that it tells me they don’t stand to lose much. Doesn’t mean they have a long road ahead, it just means they won’t need to limit the game to 4GB of memory for the future packs they come out with. Going full 64bit certainly isn’t going to solve the bugs running rampant in the game.
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It's not as if they didn't tell it several times. The Sims 4 is here for a long time
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The Sims 4 General DiscussionOkay, let me think ...
I guess 5 years may not be enough to do them particularly if we will get a Game Pack for each occult instead of one Expansion Pack.
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The Sims 4 General DiscussionI think Maxis kind of painted themselves into a corner when it comes to game pack themes. Releasing vampires as a separate game pack set the expectation that future occults (witches, mermaids, werewolves, etc.) will also get their own standalone packs. Given the current development pace, it may take three years or more to get all of the occults simmers have requested. And that’s IF all of the game packs are about occults.
Then there’s also the matter of each vacation spot getting its own dedicated pack à la Jungle Adventure. Many simmers want to see a beach style location with water activities and the like, but others want to see more unexplored places like East Asia, Nordic countries, and the Mediterranean, just to name a few. There’s even a thread here on the forums asking for more “non-American” worlds.
And there are miscellaneous themes that aren’t big enough for expansions like romance, or hobbies, or farming (I personally don’t see it as an expansion).
Throw in expansion packs and stuff packs in between and it becomes obvious that not everyone is going to get what they want in a feasible time frame. Regardless of what the devs tell us or what simmers hope for, the engine has the final say. We’re already 27 packs in and we’ll be at 30 by October. All of that DLC adds weight to an engine that was shaky to begin with and has continuously been cracking under the pressure. It wouldn’t surprise me if they eventually patched in a pack selector advising you not to play with all the packs at once for performance like the dreaded 1.69 patch for the Sims 3.
I think that’s why there was such an outcry with the release of Strangerville. There are so many other themes simmers want to see covered and I think most everyone is aware that there isn’t enough time or “pack spaces” to realistically see them all come to fruition. So when something like Strangerville comes out and “takes” one of these spots, it potentially jeopardizes a theme another group wanted, kinda like the bracket they had recently where a theme “loses” (I think this was a spot on accidental allegory for the state of the game).
With all that said yes, I believe the Sims 4 is more than halfway through its lifecycle. I’d give it 2 1/2 to 3 more years at most, with some sort of announcement about the future of the franchise (Sims 5? Sims online? Sims VR? End of the series as we know it? Idk) coming in late 2021 or early 2022. That would make the game about 8 years old and double the lifespan of previous entries. If it’s not considered “complete” by then, I don’t know if it ever will be.
They said 3 years of content, but that may just mean that's as far in advance they plan. Could be 5 or more.
It could be what's coming requires 64-bit for certain features; for examply you can theoretically run Cats & Dogs under 32-bit but if you try to create large dogs the game crashes. So maybe a Rural Life with horses (that are larger than large dogs) could be in the pipeline, I think we're probably farther along than halfway but they've done as much as they can with 32-bit; the issues they had with C&D might have been part of the impetus to start looking into full 64-bit along with Apple moving from OpenGL to Metal. Apple was the first to run 64-bit so it might not be too long till Microsoft follows suit and drops OpenGL for something else.
Fun must be always -- Tomas Hertl (San Jose Sharks hockey player)
Yes - more or less all companies are dropping 32 bit and in fact many already did drop support of it - I know you can no longer get updates of 32 bit video card drivers and most 32 bit motherboard are no longer updated. Big Game studios have dropped 32 bit games period - EA is one the last big game studios to drop it as most others already did drop it.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
In dreams - I LIVE!
In REALITY, I simply exist.....
I wish The sims 4 would already have come to an end to be honest. Im tired of it and the 'fixing' and adding in this stage just doesnt do it for me. It's like trying to fix a relationship when it TRULY sucked at the beginning. My memories and the base got ruined and it's better to start fresh and new, then to collect broken parts and try to glue it on this matter.
I think the fear of simmers with a fresh new game of lacking important content such as basic weather, animals, uni, generations, should be fixed by the devs once and for all. The base game SHOULD no matter what be awesome and The sims franchise should only grow as time moves forward and things change. It is not acceptable anymore to have a sims 1 basegame (even though it was much better than TS4 base game
They can at least give warm/cold weather, rabbit hole uni so sims can have degrees that help them with jobs, basic small pets like birds/hamsters/ real fishes etc.).
I mean enough things for us to explore and do so sims vary in personality/hobbies and life paths with a meaning and effect on others. EP's should be FUN additions to your interest or not, not fixes. Let's get that clear.
Same, the FIRST characteristic I'll watch whether buy TS5 or not is the personalities system.
EA always officially announces a new series at about 14 months or so before its release date. Even Sims 4 which had the shortest official announcement of 13 months announced it "officially at the August 2013 Gamescom and it released on in September 2014. But well before the official announcement, months earlier during the E3 of 2013 the info had already leaked and Guru's were answering some question about it.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
In dreams - I LIVE!
In REALITY, I simply exist.....
That statement is a year old. So, one down and how many more? Funny, I didn't see a lot of content (packs) that stood up to that claim.
Grant tweeted and then deleted that we still have over 3 years of content for Sims 4 as of yesterday.
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EP06 Get Famous in 2018 then 4 EPs are left at least (2019, 2020, 2021 and 2022).
They can release a bit more but I doubt it will reach a total of 15 EPs.
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The Sims 4 General DiscussionThis.
But it's like they said, nothing is certain. My guess is TS4 will run for as long as TS5 is still in development which might take more 3 years. 2022 could be the end.
TS4 has had a 5 year run, which is the same time as others, and now more. So I'm not mad about it getting over, although it does feel lacking still compared to previous entries, I'm afraid it might always feel that way.
It doesn't matter if he deleted it, he said it over a year ago. Look at what they did release since then Get Famous (a one career GP linear play) and Strangerville. A year has gone by since he said it, and that's what was released since then. (don't count free content, many don't even want that stuff, ever or would prefer a choice to not install it). He was talking about packs...so..2 packs thus far in over a year since that statement. Yes, I guess they can drag it out for another five at that rate.
If you want to pay $120 US for a base game, sure we can have all that stuff. But then you'd have people complaining that they don't want pets/uni/etc. in their game and you're making them pay for content they won't use. You know, like the pet accessories in My First Pet for those who don't own C&D. Or people who are still complaining about toddlers being "forced" on them when they never wanted them in the first place.
A base game is a base for future content -- always has been. You have your Sims in CAS, with basic clothing because no one wants nekkid Sims, plus basic personality. You have Build Mode so Sims have a roof over their heads, and Buy Mode for furniture and stuff. You have ways to make money. You have skills to build and become a more well-rounded Sim. You have fully fledged life stages out of the box/download (hello toddlers taking two extra years). Most important, you have the initial programming on which the developers (and skill mod developers) can expand the game.
Fun must be always -- Tomas Hertl (San Jose Sharks hockey player)
If you look at the last year or so we got 2 EPs last year -- Seasons and Get Famous -- and it's possible we get 2 EPs this year; they've already announced we'll be getting an EP, GP and SP in the first 6 months of the new fiscal year, and I can't see them missing out on the holiday shopping season in November so an EP around US Thanksgiving seems likely. That could also mean a GP in January and maybe an SP in March right before end of FY20. Perhaps in recent reorganizations they decided to put more staff on EPs so they could do more, while cutting back on SPs. And with Sims Mobile being moved to Firemonkeys for future development, some of the Sims Mobile team is moving over to Sims 4. 2 of each type of pack works fine for me, with gaps filled in by free content releases like the freelancer system and such. (A freelance system could possibly mean that more vacation GPs might be in the pipeline -- setting your own work schedule and such ties in really well with going out to see the world.)
Fun must be always -- Tomas Hertl (San Jose Sharks hockey player)