So I said I wouldn't post on here that much anymore, but this needs to be said. The question of "Do you even own the game?" as a way to shoot down people who are against the Sims 4 is a very weak and rude way of trying to win an arguement with someone who against Sims
A long time ago, yes, you needed to purchase a game or play a demo to see if it was good or not, but nowadays, we have Youtube, we have more HONEST reviewers, we got Twitch. All these things help a consumer in determining whether a game is worth their money. In today's economy, people don't want to purchase a game on the CHANCE that they MIGHT like it. People want confirmation and enough knowledge to know whether a game is worth the cash. Questioning whether someone purchased the game or not to validate their opinion on it, is just plain inconsiderate and desperate to try and make your side of the argument more dominant. If someone was judging the game came off troll-like obviously not knowing a single thing about the game, then yes, that question may be appropriate, but don't use it on someone who put in the time to research the game that they were considering purchasing -_-
I'm not going to get into comparisons between games because I don't see that this is what this thread is about.
I do agree with what you've said people have researched the game and decided it isn't for them and as you say in this economy why would they buy on the off chance. I've also noticed that when people do buy the game and come on to say they don't like it they get shot down with "well you should have researched it then". Kind of a no win situation there.
I would think that EA would welcome threads by people who didn't buy the game stating exactly why without being shot down in flames and the thread ending up being deleted.
I think we all need to respect each individuals opinion and allow those opinions to be heard. I took the chance on buying Sims 4 and I do really like it. I don't have to defend that opinion and a different opinion isn't going to detract from my enjoyment of the game, let people have their say and respect their right to do so.
You summed it up perfectly. Thank you :-) the same as I respect that some people love 4 and I'm happy for them, that doesn't negate my poor experience with 4. It's sad people continue with that mindset.
I agree with the OP it's often used in a derogatory context when as I've said all along-we are all sims fans wherever we fell into loving the series. That gives us a say just as valid as anyone else's. I bought 4, it was obviously made to exclude players like me so of course I'm not happy. That's a simple concept, as sad as it is for me to say.
Yes. I own the game. And NO, I don't play it that much.
Sims 4 still didn't get me. It's missing too much to get me into playing it. (Hint: Generational gameplay, toddlers etc.) Maybe the first EP will change that, but I won't get my hopes up.
Sims 1 and 2 and even 3 still got me into playing it, but Sims 4 does not.
Sims 3 was not perfect at all, but it had improvements over other series. Create A Style, Open World. Sims 4 has nothing. Oh yeah, A gallery and some annoying bipolar emotion system. Oh and the ''Multitasking''.
I am not going to flame people who do enjoy the game though. I think it's all up to preference.
> @Jarsie9 said: > You Tube is useful for selling people on The Sims 4. That's why EA didn't let YouTube take down all the Let's Plays. I'm sure many people decided to buy based on watching at least a couple of Let's Plays. > > But as far as all the discussion goes, while it might annoy the heck out of some of the TS4 lovers, make sure you keep an eye on the forums. If they're a lot quieter, it may not be a positive thing. I've been watching the number of threads in General Discussion, and while most are positive TS4 topics, the number of negative TS4 topics is dwindling...and I don't think this is a good thing. You might think that it's because people got tired of all the "bashing" and you might be right. But, remember, even when people bought the game and played the game and found out they didn't like the game (aka Buyer's Remorse), they got put down badly by people who just *LOVELOVELOVE* the game. > > And maybe the reason that people aren't posting as much anymore is because they got tired and decided to go back to TS2/TS3 or some other game. But you should be happy that they're following your advice, because they're no longer cluttering up the forums with "negative/whiny/complaining" threads. > > On the other hand, you might start being a little bit concerned, because from what I'm seeing in some of the threads, some fans are feeling ignored and some are feeling that by now, EA isn't listening. And then again, those who bought the game and wish they hadn't are far less likely to buy an expansion pack. In other words, if enough of the fan base doesn't care enough to express an opinion on why they don't like this game and prefers to go elsewhere...that might be great for you TS4 lovers...you'll think you won the Forum Wars. > > But, in reality, the Forums are dying. You may not see it now, but you will...especially if they don't erupt into flames when the first expansion pack is announced. > > ETA: While it may seem that this has nothing to do with the original post, I think it's an observation that needed to be made.
I think EA got the message by now. Now let's wait and see if they act upon it. Rehearsing the same stuff all over again isn't of much help.
> @Jarsie9 said:<br />
> You Tube is useful for selling people on The Sims 4. That's why EA didn't let YouTube take down all the Let's Plays. I'm sure many people decided to buy based on watching at least a couple of Let's Plays.<br />
> <br />
> But as far as all the discussion goes, while it might annoy the heck out of some of the TS4 lovers, make sure you keep an eye on the forums. If they're a lot quieter, it may not be a positive thing. I've been watching the number of threads in General Discussion, and while most are positive TS4 topics, the number of negative TS4 topics is dwindling...and I don't think this is a good thing. You might think that it's because people got tired of all the "bashing" and you might be right. But, remember, even when people bought the game and played the game and found out they didn't like the game (aka Buyer's Remorse), they got put down badly by people who just *LOVELOVELOVE* the game.<br />
> <br />
> And maybe the reason that people aren't posting as much anymore is because they got tired and decided to go back to TS2/TS3 or some other game. But you should be happy that they're following your advice, because they're no longer cluttering up the forums with "negative/whiny/complaining" threads.<br />
> <br />
> On the other hand, you might start being a little bit concerned, because from what I'm seeing in some of the threads, some fans are feeling ignored and some are feeling that by now, EA isn't listening. And then again, those who bought the game and wish they hadn't are far less likely to buy an expansion pack. In other words, if enough of the fan base doesn't care enough to express an opinion on why they don't like this game and prefers to go elsewhere...that might be great for you TS4 lovers...you'll think you won the Forum Wars.<br />
> <br />
> But, in reality, the Forums are dying. You may not see it now, but you will...especially if they don't erupt into flames when the first expansion pack is announced.<br />
> <br />
> ETA: While it may seem that this has nothing to do with the original post, I think it's an observation that needed to be made.<br />
<br />
I think EA got the message by now. Now let's wait and see if they act upon it. Rehearsing the same stuff all over again isn't of much help.
Some of us think if we don't say anything for any length of time EA will assume we are happy customers and gladly ignore our issues. Seems that way so far given that they could tell us pools and 2 careers were coming.
I think EA got the message by now. Now let's wait and see if they act upon it. Rehearsing the same stuff all over again isn't of much help.
Thank you for telling me to shut up. I'm sure you're tired of reading it. But you missed the point of my post, okay? The point is that EA isn't going to "act on it", no matter how many times we "rehearse" it.
So, if your message to me is "shut up and let's wait and see what EA's going to do", then that's the kind of arrogant dismissive attitude that I've come to expect from the pro-TS4 side. And, you know what? It's not changing my opinion one iota. Shutting up and waiting to see what they're going to do is not really an option. Because, as I said in my post earlier, the day we shut up is the day that EA knows that they've already lost.
EA Marketing Department Motto:
"We Don't Care If You LIKE The Game, Just As Long As You BUY The Game!"
I Disapprove (Naturally) I Took The Pledge!
I thought the game looked alright when I watched the live streams and other people playing it. I soon got bored of it when I personally purchased it. There is definitely a difference watching someone else playing it and offering their opinion on it.
I do feel that the phrase "do you even have the game" is somewhat justified based on my own experience. (My opinion, please do not jump down my throat!)
Did i said "shut up" ? I said there was no point in repeating the same debate all over again, with the same argument, with both side not managing to convince the other anyway. Don't make me say what I didn't say... And remember, development take time... Because you've ask for toodlers and they're not there yet don't mean EA didn't hear at all.
And sorry, I don't believe in the "yelling on internet make companies move". Sony left us with a buggy phone update; Yelling, yelling, and here goes... noting... I can find tons of occurrences like that...
I actually look for the posts of both people who have and haven't bought it, because both have valid points to share. Those who haven't bought it didn't buy it for a reason, and I'm always curious to read why and what game changes would convince them to buy it. They also seems to be pretty vocal about what they want in the game, which is a good thing. I want EA to hear the players voices, even if they are simmers and don't own TS4, and people can still have a valid opinion of the game bases simply on its features, even though they've never played it. Now for those who do own the game, they have good points too, and their posts seem to focus on what aspects and small nuances of the game they like and don't.
I'm not an advocate of posts trying to tell people to post a certain way, or telling people that only owners of the game should post, so if that's the point OP has here, I agree that it shouldn't happen. We are all here to discuss the game, and if people don't like something on here (I don't enjoy certain posts myself) then a good option is to ignore or report if necessary, and move on. Trying to control the actions of people online is akin to trying to fill a cup with holes with water.
I have no idea- you said you knew and yet was curious. I can only read what you type.
When you ask... 'Have you even played the game?" That makes people defensive and feel attacked.
If you ask someone..."What are you thoughts of the game." That opens dialog and gives people a chance to open up.
I have seen a post with a comment like that. I don't know if it's the one you're talking about. O.O
My question was, "Have you played the game yet?" or "Have you had the chance to play the game yet?"
I don't remember the exact wording. I was simply curious because I was familiar with the poster and was attempting to be 'friendly?'
Needless to say, I don't care about being friendly with that poster any more.
What I do know is that people have a tendency to read into things. This is a forum. Words are words and questions are questions.
Just be honest. I can't see how a fight can start with that. It's when people go on the defense and start over-explaining things that a fight starts.
If you see the person you're talking to is getting out of hand, run! Don't stay and fight or try to justify yourself. This is a digital forum. Call it quits and get some sleep like I did, and never revisit that thread again.
I am that poster and i did not take it as friendly because your later comments after you asked that question. All this said to me is clearly you felt i had no right to give my experience and feeling on a game i did not play. You even went as far as to feel insulted because i hadn't wasted my money on the game.
That is is what the op is speaking of. Players using this type of rhetoric to try and shut down other posters. Then you continue to berate my conversation by saying i can only speculate when in fact there is a huge amount of information that the web provides about the sims 4, that gives you enough knowledge to form an opinion and judge what type of experience you will have with the game.
What is the difference in watching someone else play the game or going to a friends house to watch that game being played. Nothing, it's not going to change or be any different than what i will play because i can see the gameplay for myself and there for have already experienced the game. No you would not listen to reason on any of that and in the end we just agreed to disagree.
Frankly, I'm tired of people asking me that question, because i know it's headed towards a rude and off topic discussion. They already know the answer since you're familiar with me as a poster than you're familiar with the fact i did not buy the game. If you didn't know than you're not familiar with me at all. People should be respectful of other posters even if they haven't bought the game. Asking that kind of question to prove a point is not asking out of curiosity. It's clearly to try to shame the person into silence. Or to put pressure on them to buy a game they already don't like. I should not have to buy a game in order to voice out my opinion on it. I refuse to give in to such grade school peer pressure.
All that kind of hostility does is push me in the opposite direction of the game in the first place. It makes me want to buy it less not more. Why because i have to question why a fanbase is so defensive over a game if it is so fun to play that they have to bully a player into purchasing it. If the game is that good than it will sell on it's own merits it doesn't need other people to come save or defend it. Yes these are my feelings about people who do this. Because the question never ends at oh okay you didn't buy it. It the comment made to me afterwards that becomes completely offensive and rude. then it's never one person either, a team then gangs up on that player relentlessly. That is not curiosity not in the least.
It doesn't really matter whether you buy the game or not, you know that, don't you? Because, having bought the game, you are expected to *like* the game, and heaven help you if you buy the game and then find out you don't like the game...and you have the *nerve* to make a post saying that "Well, I bought this game, and I've played this game, and I don't *like* this game, and here's why..."
And no matter how intelligent a reason you give, if you dare to compare it to its predecessors, what you're going to get in return is: "Well, if you don't like The Sims 4, go back and play the Sims 2/the Sims 3 and go away and stop trying to ruin our enjoyment of The Sims 4."
Or, another variation: "This is a *different* game. It's not the Sims 2/the Sims 3, so you can't expect to play it the same way, etc. etc." OR: "Have you tried doing this challenge/that challenge/making a Sim with random traits?" and endless suggestions that tell you how you should be playing the game to get the most fun out of it.
So, it's really a lose/lose situation here. If you don't like the game, based purely on your research, you're wrong and don't know what you're talking about, and if you bought the game and don't like the game based purely on your gameplay, you're wrong and don't know what you're talking about.
And this is what passes for debate on a lot of these posts (but not all of them...some of them are actually serious discussions, if you ignore the occasional one-sentence poster).
EA Marketing Department Motto:
"We Don't Care If You LIKE The Game, Just As Long As You BUY The Game!"
I Disapprove (Naturally) I Took The Pledge!
I honestly do not play the game that much either anymore. It has some good things such as CAS and build/buy tools, Multitasking, but it has left quite a lot out it does not hold my interest for very long. That is sad, because I could play the past sims base games for hours.
By calling someone a sheep, a hater, a bully, or a troll because they have a different opinion then your own only escalates the problem. Those words get thrown around here like frisbies. Same with telling people not to voice their opinion, or that if they don't own the game they don't have a creditable opinion because they haven't played the game. They are all fighting words. It doesn't matter which side says them. I do not subscribe to that. I will go after the real trolls like the plum troll for instance. But Jarsie is right. If EA does not listen and we do shut up, then the game is already lost.
> @Katlyn2525 said: > I honestly do not play the game that much either anymore. It has some good things such as CAS and build/buy tools, Multitasking, but it has left quite a lot out it does not hold my interest for very long. That is sad, because I could play the past sims base games for hours. > > By calling someone a sheep, a hater, a bully, or a troll because they have a different opinion then your own only escalates the problem. Those words get thrown around here like frisbies. Same with telling people not to voice their opinion, or that if they don't own the game they don't have a creditable opinion because they haven't played the game. They are all fighting words. It doesn't matter which side says them. I do not subscribe to that. I will go after the real trolls like the plum troll for instance. But Jarsie is right. If EA does not listen and we do shut up, then the game is already lost.
Exactly. Point is, you can express you option (be it "I like the game" or "I don't like the game") without being harsh / rude or whatever else.
Did i said "shut up" ? I said there was no point in repeating the same debate all over again, with the same argument, with both side not managing to convince the other anyway. Don't make me say what I didn't say... <br />
And remember, development take time...<br />
Because you've ask for toodlers and they're not there yet don't mean EA didn't hear at all.<br />
<br />
And sorry, I don't believe in the "yelling on internet make companies move". <br />
Sony left us with a buggy phone update; Yelling, yelling, and here goes... noting... I can find tons of occurrences like that...
I didn't ask for toddlers, although they should have been in the game in the first place. I'm talking on principle here about the toddlers. And saying "development takes time" not only sounds patronizing, but it's a cop-out. If toddlers were meant to be in the game, then they should have been left in the game, even if they were going to be limited like the babies. The generational players might not have liked it, but at least they'd still be playing.
And, maybe "yelling on the internet" may not make companies move, but a clear indication that "if this doesn't get fixed, you can forget getting any more money from me" might actually work. So, if Sony left you with a buggy update, you and other customers complained about it (as you had every right to do), and nothing happened, did that make you eager to rush out and buy the latest model (I'm assuming cell phone, here) or did you go out and buy from another company?
So, basically, what I interpret you saying is that arguing is not going to solve anything, so let's just sit back and wait to see what EA is going to do. Well, (again, my opinion) what EA's execs will *probably* do (again, my opinion) is nothing, because they'll figure that the natives are no longer restless and therefore, they can just carry on with whatever their "vision" of the Sims franchise is (probably adding more online elements).
And the thing is, even with the rehearsing, at least it indicates our continued interest, but with two previous games to compete with, it's not that hard to walk away and stop buying anything TS4...and that's exactly what EA doesn't want, but that's exactly what our stopping with rehearsing the same thing over and over will tell them...that we no longer care about TS4, when we can play with 2 other iterations instead and not have to spend another dime.
EA Marketing Department Motto:
"We Don't Care If You LIKE The Game, Just As Long As You BUY The Game!"
I Disapprove (Naturally) I Took The Pledge!
It doesn't really matter whether you buy the game or not, you know that, don't you? Because, having bought the game, you are expected to *like* the game, and heaven help you if you buy the game and then find out you don't like the game...and you have the *nerve* to make a post saying that "Well, I bought this game, and I've played this game, and I don't *like* this game, and here's why..."
And no matter how intelligent a reason you give, if you dare to compare it to its predecessors, what you're going to get in return is: "Well, if you don't like The Sims 4, go back and play the Sims 2/the Sims 3 and go away and stop trying to ruin our enjoyment of The Sims 4."
Or, another variation: "This is a *different* game. It's not the Sims 2/the Sims 3, so you can't expect to play it the same way, etc. etc." OR: "Have you tried doing this challenge/that challenge/making a Sim with random traits?" and endless suggestions that tell you how you should be playing the game to get the most fun out of it.
So, it's really a lose/lose situation here. If you don't like the game, based purely on your research, you're wrong and don't know what you're talking about, and if you bought the game and don't like the game based purely on your gameplay, you're wrong and don't know what you're talking about.
And this is what passes for debate on a lot of these posts (but not all of them...some of them are actually serious discussions, if you ignore the occasional one-sentence poster).
The sad part of this is having to try to play challenges is so silly because people keep trying to force the way they play the game on to me which i have 0 interest in. I'm not a new simmer im an old time simmer like the rest of you. My interests in the game is completely different from the people who like it. So when I'm watching developer play throughs, review play throughs, friends play throughs, etc. i can already see that i don't like the game and I know specifically why. 1. the game doesn't cater to any of my play interests what so ever.
What people should know is im a gamer, i will play a wide range of video games. So my appeal to sims is not experiencing outside genres converted into it. I specifically like the life simulation of the game. So when that had massive cuts as i'm watching the play throughs im not interested in a huge portion of the what the game is offering. This is the first time that's ever happened to me with this series at the base game. So regardless of what people want me to try, i don't want to try those things. I don't see why people can't understand that feeling but i think you nailed it.
Basically it's a conversation that is never going to win with people who just lovelove about this game and refuse to understand the other posters feelings and just looking for an excuse to shut them down or silence them. it never matters if you buy the game or not they're still going to look for an excuse to shut a player down.
Haven't read any posts but the first couple - I agree, question is irrelevant to counter if a player believe they would like a game or not.
You (or more I in this case as it's personal taste) do not have to read a romance novel to know I wouldn't enjoy it.
One does not have to pick up a porcupine to know that it would hurt.
one does not have to touch a hot eye on a stove to know it would burn
One does not have to watch a Syfy original movie to know it's going to be bad.
One does not have to eat spoiled food to know it's bad.
One does not have to own a game to know whether or not they would like it. Does it help, yes but is it a requirement, no.
As noted there are tons of reviews, lets plays, videos, screenshots, one can make an opinion without purchasing.
If you feel otherwise, ask yourself, have you never passed up something because it didn't look good?
You'll note these are all negative examples I gave, that's because even though I like the game, we are going from a standpoint of someone who is passing it up.
It's kind of sad that I have to point out that anything I say is only just my opinion and may be a different one from someone else.
I think EA got the message by now. Now let's wait and see if they act upon it. Rehearsing the same stuff all over again isn't of much help.
Thank you for telling me to shut up. I'm sure you're tired of reading it. But you missed the point of my post, okay? The point is that EA isn't going to "act on it", no matter how many times we "rehearse" it.
So, if your message to me is "shut up and let's wait and see what EA's going to do", then that's the kind of arrogant dismissive attitude that I've come to expect from the pro-TS4 side. And, you know what? It's not changing my opinion one iota. Shutting up and waiting to see what they're going to do is not really an option. Because, as I said in my post earlier, the day we shut up is the day that EA knows that they've already lost.
Seriously? This from the woman who only yesterday told someone, "This is actually a useless topic...Why recycle the same old same old? You're not likely to learn anything new, so I honestly don't know what you think you can accomplish here other than to keep the forum active." Pot, kettle, etc. I just thought people should know.
Circling back to topic: I can understand why people might want to know if a poster is speaking from the position of game owner/player or educated observer, but I don't think it should be a criteria for whether one can/should post an opinion. I also think people need to be careful about the way the phrase the question, if they feel the need to ask, and that those being asked should look carefully at the context and wording of the question before taking offense.
@DevilH4: I agree and I would even go further and say it's a 🐸🐸🐸🐸 argument. The facts about this game are well known (i.e. cartoony graphics, closed world). One does not need to shove his money down EA's throat to know this. Buying and playing this game does NOT change those facts in any way.
So I said I wouldn't post on here that much anymore, but this needs to be said. The question of "Do you even own the game?" as a way to shoot down people who are against the Sims 4 is a very weak and rude way of trying to win an arguement with someone who against Sims
A long time ago, yes, you needed to purchase a game or play a demo to see if it was good or not, but nowadays, we have Youtube, we have more HONEST reviewers, we got Twitch. All these things help a consumer in determining whether a game is worth their money. In today's economy, people don't want to purchase a game on the CHANCE that they MIGHT like it. People want confirmation and enough knowledge to know whether a game is worth the cash. Questioning whether someone purchased the game or not to validate their opinion on it, is just plain inconsiderate and desperate to try and make your side of the argument more dominant. If someone was judging the game came off troll-like obviously not knowing a single thing about the game, then yes, that question may be appropriate, but don't use it on someone who put in the time to research the game that they were considering purchasing -_-
Interesting. I asked a player if they played the game yet simply as a question because I knew that they hadn't previously. As time went by and they were still posting, it was just a simply question. I was actually curious and it wasn't to prove a point. Yet they jumped down my throat. Is this not yet another flame bait thread?
Even if you asked out of curiosity you know very well there ARE people who say "you can't judge before you played it". I have seen it with my own eyes many times. The OP is referring to those persons. If you are not among them, fine but then you can't take yourself as measure of things and hence your argument is invalid.
EDIT: I just came across Ana's post and it seems you are not as innocent as you pretend here.
> @Jarsie9 said: > EowynCarter wrote: » > > Did i said "shut up" ? I said there was no point in repeating the same debate all over again, with the same argument, with both side not managing to convince the other anyway. Don't make me say what I didn't say...
> And remember, development take time...
> Because you've ask for toodlers and they're not there yet don't mean EA didn't hear at all.
>
> And sorry, I don't believe in the "yelling on internet make companies move".
> Sony left us with a buggy phone update; Yelling, yelling, and here goes... noting... I can find tons of occurrences like that... > > > > > I didn't ask for toddlers, although they should have been in the game in the first place. I'm talking on principle here about the toddlers. And saying "development takes time" not only sounds patronizing, but it's a cop-out. If toddlers were meant to be in the game, then they should have been left in the game, even if they were going to be limited like the babies. The generational players might not have liked it, but at least they'd still be playing. > > And, maybe "yelling on the internet" may not make companies move, but a clear indication that "if this doesn't get fixed, you can forget getting any more money from me" might actually work. So, if Sony left you with a buggy update, you and other customers complained about it (as you had every right to do), and nothing happened, did that make you eager to rush out and buy the latest model (I'm assuming cell phone, here) or did you go out and buy from another company? > > So, basically, what I interpret you saying is that arguing is not going to solve anything, so let's just sit back and wait to see what EA is going to do. Well, (again, my opinion) what EA's execs will *probably* do (again, my opinion) is nothing, because they'll figure that the natives are no longer restless and therefore, they can just carry on with whatever their "vision" of the Sims franchise is (probably adding more online elements). > > And the thing is, even with the rehearsing, at least it indicates our continued interest, but with two previous games to compete with, it's not that hard to walk away and stop buying anything TS4...and that's exactly what EA doesn't want, but that's exactly what our stopping with rehearsing the same thing over and over will tell them...that we no longer care about TS4, when we can play with 2 other iterations instead and not have to spend another dime. Well, yes, arguing between each other, with EA hardly reading our discussion, not going to change stuff much.
Putting toddler, even in a "crippled" form, would have required taking off something else. What they should have is report the launch to finished properly. it clearly was rushed.
As to the phone, i got one from an other company, tired of the sola that had became unusable. Still own that phone almost two years later. And, well, I don't think sony cares at all.
I think EA got the message by now. Now let's wait and see if they act upon it. Rehearsing the same stuff all over again isn't of much help.
Thank you for telling me to shut up. I'm sure you're tired of reading it. But you missed the point of my post, okay? The point is that EA isn't going to "act on it", no matter how many times we "rehearse" it.
So, if your message to me is "shut up and let's wait and see what EA's going to do", then that's the kind of arrogant dismissive attitude that I've come to expect from the pro-TS4 side. And, you know what? It's not changing my opinion one iota. Shutting up and waiting to see what they're going to do is not really an option. Because, as I said in my post earlier, the day we shut up is the day that EA knows that they've already lost.
Seriously? This from the woman who only yesterday told someone, "This is actually a useless topic...Why recycle the same old same old? You're not likely to learn anything new, so I honestly don't know what you think you can accomplish here other than to keep the forum active." Pot, kettle, etc. I just thought people should know.
Circling back to topic: I can understand why people might want to know if a poster is speaking from the position of game owner/player or educated observer, but I don't think it should be a criteria for whether one can/should post an opinion. I also think people need to be careful about the way the phrase the question, if they feel the need to ask, and that those being asked should look carefully at the context and wording of the question before taking offense.
I don't actually see your point here, Jarsie was frustrated and I understand that-that some people continue to ask the same question of those who are disappointed when they've been here and seen exactly what they have said over the past few months. She may not have handled it in the best way according to you or others but when you've had months of being belittled for your opinions it does begin to grate. It's not the pot calling the kettle black. People want to know things are being worked on for sure. Until we get there these begging threads will continue just because if we shut up then EA will forget us pretty quickly. It's not a personal attack on you or your experience of the game that people feel differently :-)
Besides that was yesterday, best to let things go or we get threads after thread talking about people's past mistakes and arguments and never move on. Our forum is getting better recently and it would be a shame to ruin that.
I think it's a matter of context in some cases. If a poster is having a to and fro with someone who is rather aggressive in their manner then suddenly asking that question is almost saying 'if you don't then you don't belong'. We are all sims fans or we wouldn't be here. Like others have said it's not even like that's the end of it-we get the same attitude towards players like me who are disappointed even with owning 4. It's a case of a true no win situation for fans who aren't cheerleaders.
Even if you asked out of curiosity you know very well there ARE people who say "you can't judge before you played it"
I would never tell anyone they need to try it but I'm one of those people that did need to try it. My pre-order stance was that I needed hands on time of my own because while I take opinions and reviews into account I like to make up my own mind about things. I found it wasn't what I thought it would be like. I'm not one of the people who had to have pools and toddlers and I still find the game lacking. It's simply just boring for me. It's really disappointing.
There are the people who say it's just a base game but to tell the truth the TS2 and TS3 base game both gave me a lot of hours in fun play time. I just don't know if EPs will add to TS4 or not. It's really going to depend on if the devs listen to the fan base and try to correct the situation. If EPs just add, as I suspect, more scripted game play it will be the last money EA will see from me.
"People really love to explore 'failure states. In fact, the failure states are really much more interesting than the success states." ~ Will Wright
Seriously? This from the woman who only yesterday told someone, "This is actually a useless topic...Why recycle the same old same old? You're not likely to learn anything new, so I honestly don't know what you think you can accomplish here other than to keep the forum active." Pot, kettle, etc. I just thought people should know.
Circling back to topic: I can understand why people might want to know if a poster is speaking from the position of game owner/player or educated observer, but I don't think it should be a criteria for whether one can/should post an opinion. I also think people need to be careful about the way the phrase the question, if they feel the need to ask, and that those being asked should look carefully at the context and wording of the question before taking offense.
And, since pots are going to be calling kettles, here, I believe this was your response to me:
"Why do you care what <OP> posts? Why do you find it necessary to jump into threads only to criticize the OP and the idea presented? Is it because "nobody is yelling at anybody," so you want to try to get some of that going?
If you truly no longer care and are tired of this discussion, I have a great suggestion: Don't come here. Don't post. Find something to do that you DO care about and that does not tire you."
I didn't tell the OP to shut up. I asked why the OP was making the thread in the first place, since they have already been in numerous threads where the question has been asked before on what it would take for some players to feel the base game was complete. That's a whole different thing from saying "Shut up!" But, YOU, on the other hand, told me to "go away!" So, I did. But I don't apologize for asking the necessity of posing the question again. The only reason I could think of is that the OP wanted attention. Well, the OP got the attention. But there wasn't anything new to be learned from the information presented since it was all old information that everyone already knows. It would be different if the OP was new, but since this person has participated in numerous "here's what we want, EA!" threads, I didn't see where they needed any more enlightenment.
EA Marketing Department Motto:
"We Don't Care If You LIKE The Game, Just As Long As You BUY The Game!"
I Disapprove (Naturally) I Took The Pledge!
Comments
-Some are waiting to see if perhaps a future EP will catch their attention and then purchase the game.
-Some know the game isn't for them.
Everyone has their own opinions on the game, even some of those who play it have noticed pros and cons about the game.
I would probably be able to buy more games.
Origin ID: Gabby-Abeille
You summed it up perfectly. Thank you :-) the same as I respect that some people love 4 and I'm happy for them, that doesn't negate my poor experience with 4. It's sad people continue with that mindset.
I agree with the OP it's often used in a derogatory context when as I've said all along-we are all sims fans wherever we fell into loving the series. That gives us a say just as valid as anyone else's. I bought 4, it was obviously made to exclude players like me so of course I'm not happy. That's a simple concept, as sad as it is for me to say.
https://twitter.com/sparkfairy1
Sims 4 still didn't get me. It's missing too much to get me into playing it. (Hint: Generational gameplay, toddlers etc.) Maybe the first EP will change that, but I won't get my hopes up.
Sims 1 and 2 and even 3 still got me into playing it, but Sims 4 does not.
Sims 3 was not perfect at all, but it had improvements over other series. Create A Style, Open World. Sims 4 has nothing. Oh yeah, A gallery and some annoying bipolar emotion system. Oh and the ''Multitasking''.
I am not going to flame people who do enjoy the game though. I think it's all up to preference.
> You Tube is useful for selling people on The Sims 4. That's why EA didn't let YouTube take down all the Let's Plays. I'm sure many people decided to buy based on watching at least a couple of Let's Plays.
>
> But as far as all the discussion goes, while it might annoy the heck out of some of the TS4 lovers, make sure you keep an eye on the forums. If they're a lot quieter, it may not be a positive thing. I've been watching the number of threads in General Discussion, and while most are positive TS4 topics, the number of negative TS4 topics is dwindling...and I don't think this is a good thing. You might think that it's because people got tired of all the "bashing" and you might be right. But, remember, even when people bought the game and played the game and found out they didn't like the game (aka Buyer's Remorse), they got put down badly by people who just *LOVELOVELOVE* the game.
>
> And maybe the reason that people aren't posting as much anymore is because they got tired and decided to go back to TS2/TS3 or some other game. But you should be happy that they're following your advice, because they're no longer cluttering up the forums with "negative/whiny/complaining" threads.
>
> On the other hand, you might start being a little bit concerned, because from what I'm seeing in some of the threads, some fans are feeling ignored and some are feeling that by now, EA isn't listening. And then again, those who bought the game and wish they hadn't are far less likely to buy an expansion pack. In other words, if enough of the fan base doesn't care enough to express an opinion on why they don't like this game and prefers to go elsewhere...that might be great for you TS4 lovers...you'll think you won the Forum Wars.
>
> But, in reality, the Forums are dying. You may not see it now, but you will...especially if they don't erupt into flames when the first expansion pack is announced.
>
> ETA: While it may seem that this has nothing to do with the original post, I think it's an observation that needed to be made.
I think EA got the message by now. Now let's wait and see if they act upon it. Rehearsing the same stuff all over again isn't of much help.
Some of us think if we don't say anything for any length of time EA will assume we are happy customers and gladly ignore our issues. Seems that way so far given that they could tell us pools and 2 careers were coming.
https://twitter.com/sparkfairy1
Thank you for telling me to shut up. I'm sure you're tired of reading it. But you missed the point of my post, okay? The point is that EA isn't going to "act on it", no matter how many times we "rehearse" it.
So, if your message to me is "shut up and let's wait and see what EA's going to do", then that's the kind of arrogant dismissive attitude that I've come to expect from the pro-TS4 side. And, you know what? It's not changing my opinion one iota. Shutting up and waiting to see what they're going to do is not really an option. Because, as I said in my post earlier, the day we shut up is the day that EA knows that they've already lost.
"We Don't Care If You LIKE The Game, Just As Long As You BUY The Game!"
I Disapprove (Naturally)
I Took The Pledge!
I soon got bored of it when I personally purchased it. There is definitely a difference watching someone else playing it and offering their opinion on it.
I do feel that the phrase "do you even have the game" is somewhat justified based on my own experience. (My opinion, please do not jump down my throat!)
And remember, development take time...
Because you've ask for toodlers and they're not there yet don't mean EA didn't hear at all.
And sorry, I don't believe in the "yelling on internet make companies move".
Sony left us with a buggy phone update; Yelling, yelling, and here goes... noting... I can find tons of occurrences like that...
I'm not an advocate of posts trying to tell people to post a certain way, or telling people that only owners of the game should post, so if that's the point OP has here, I agree that it shouldn't happen. We are all here to discuss the game, and if people don't like something on here (I don't enjoy certain posts myself) then a good option is to ignore or report if necessary, and move on. Trying to control the actions of people online is akin to trying to fill a cup with holes with water.
I am that poster and i did not take it as friendly because your later comments after you asked that question. All this said to me is clearly you felt i had no right to give my experience and feeling on a game i did not play. You even went as far as to feel insulted because i hadn't wasted my money on the game.
That is is what the op is speaking of. Players using this type of rhetoric to try and shut down other posters. Then you continue to berate my conversation by saying i can only speculate when in fact there is a huge amount of information that the web provides about the sims 4, that gives you enough knowledge to form an opinion and judge what type of experience you will have with the game.
What is the difference in watching someone else play the game or going to a friends house to watch that game being played. Nothing, it's not going to change or be any different than what i will play because i can see the gameplay for myself and there for have already experienced the game. No you would not listen to reason on any of that and in the end we just agreed to disagree.
Frankly, I'm tired of people asking me that question, because i know it's headed towards a rude and off topic discussion. They already know the answer since you're familiar with me as a poster than you're familiar with the fact i did not buy the game. If you didn't know than you're not familiar with me at all. People should be respectful of other posters even if they haven't bought the game. Asking that kind of question to prove a point is not asking out of curiosity. It's clearly to try to shame the person into silence. Or to put pressure on them to buy a game they already don't like. I should not have to buy a game in order to voice out my opinion on it. I refuse to give in to such grade school peer pressure.
All that kind of hostility does is push me in the opposite direction of the game in the first place. It makes me want to buy it less not more. Why because i have to question why a fanbase is so defensive over a game if it is so fun to play that they have to bully a player into purchasing it. If the game is that good than it will sell on it's own merits it doesn't need other people to come save or defend it. Yes these are my feelings about people who do this. Because the question never ends at oh okay you didn't buy it. It the comment made to me afterwards that becomes completely offensive and rude. then it's never one person either, a team then gangs up on that player relentlessly. That is not curiosity not in the least.
It doesn't really matter whether you buy the game or not, you know that, don't you? Because, having bought the game, you are expected to *like* the game, and heaven help you if you buy the game and then find out you don't like the game...and you have the *nerve* to make a post saying that "Well, I bought this game, and I've played this game, and I don't *like* this game, and here's why..."
And no matter how intelligent a reason you give, if you dare to compare it to its predecessors, what you're going to get in return is: "Well, if you don't like The Sims 4, go back and play the Sims 2/the Sims 3 and go away and stop trying to ruin our enjoyment of The Sims 4."
Or, another variation: "This is a *different* game. It's not the Sims 2/the Sims 3, so you can't expect to play it the same way, etc. etc." OR: "Have you tried doing this challenge/that challenge/making a Sim with random traits?" and endless suggestions that tell you how you should be playing the game to get the most fun out of it.
So, it's really a lose/lose situation here. If you don't like the game, based purely on your research, you're wrong and don't know what you're talking about, and if you bought the game and don't like the game based purely on your gameplay, you're wrong and don't know what you're talking about.
And this is what passes for debate on a lot of these posts (but not all of them...some of them are actually serious discussions, if you ignore the occasional one-sentence poster).
"We Don't Care If You LIKE The Game, Just As Long As You BUY The Game!"
I Disapprove (Naturally)
I Took The Pledge!
By calling someone a sheep, a hater, a bully, or a troll because they have a different opinion then your own only escalates the problem. Those words get thrown around here like frisbies. Same with telling people not to voice their opinion, or that if they don't own the game they don't have a creditable opinion because they haven't played the game. They are all fighting words. It doesn't matter which side says them. I do not subscribe to that. I will go after the real trolls like the plum troll for instance. But Jarsie is right. If EA does not listen and we do shut up, then the game is already lost.
> I honestly do not play the game that much either anymore. It has some good things such as CAS and build/buy tools, Multitasking, but it has left quite a lot out it does not hold my interest for very long. That is sad, because I could play the past sims base games for hours.
>
> By calling someone a sheep, a hater, a bully, or a troll because they have a different opinion then your own only escalates the problem. Those words get thrown around here like frisbies. Same with telling people not to voice their opinion, or that if they don't own the game they don't have a creditable opinion because they haven't played the game. They are all fighting words. It doesn't matter which side says them. I do not subscribe to that. I will go after the real trolls like the plum troll for instance. But Jarsie is right. If EA does not listen and we do shut up, then the game is already lost.
Exactly. Point is, you can express you option (be it "I like the game" or "I don't like the game") without being harsh / rude or whatever else.
I didn't ask for toddlers, although they should have been in the game in the first place. I'm talking on principle here about the toddlers. And saying "development takes time" not only sounds patronizing, but it's a cop-out. If toddlers were meant to be in the game, then they should have been left in the game, even if they were going to be limited like the babies. The generational players might not have liked it, but at least they'd still be playing.
And, maybe "yelling on the internet" may not make companies move, but a clear indication that "if this doesn't get fixed, you can forget getting any more money from me" might actually work. So, if Sony left you with a buggy update, you and other customers complained about it (as you had every right to do), and nothing happened, did that make you eager to rush out and buy the latest model (I'm assuming cell phone, here) or did you go out and buy from another company?
So, basically, what I interpret you saying is that arguing is not going to solve anything, so let's just sit back and wait to see what EA is going to do. Well, (again, my opinion) what EA's execs will *probably* do (again, my opinion) is nothing, because they'll figure that the natives are no longer restless and therefore, they can just carry on with whatever their "vision" of the Sims franchise is (probably adding more online elements).
And the thing is, even with the rehearsing, at least it indicates our continued interest, but with two previous games to compete with, it's not that hard to walk away and stop buying anything TS4...and that's exactly what EA doesn't want, but that's exactly what our stopping with rehearsing the same thing over and over will tell them...that we no longer care about TS4, when we can play with 2 other iterations instead and not have to spend another dime.
"We Don't Care If You LIKE The Game, Just As Long As You BUY The Game!"
I Disapprove (Naturally)
I Took The Pledge!
The sad part of this is having to try to play challenges is so silly because people keep trying to force the way they play the game on to me which i have 0 interest in. I'm not a new simmer im an old time simmer like the rest of you. My interests in the game is completely different from the people who like it. So when I'm watching developer play throughs, review play throughs, friends play throughs, etc. i can already see that i don't like the game and I know specifically why. 1. the game doesn't cater to any of my play interests what so ever.
What people should know is im a gamer, i will play a wide range of video games. So my appeal to sims is not experiencing outside genres converted into it. I specifically like the life simulation of the game. So when that had massive cuts as i'm watching the play throughs im not interested in a huge portion of the what the game is offering. This is the first time that's ever happened to me with this series at the base game. So regardless of what people want me to try, i don't want to try those things. I don't see why people can't understand that feeling but i think you nailed it.
Basically it's a conversation that is never going to win with people who just lovelove about this game and refuse to understand the other posters feelings and just looking for an excuse to shut them down or silence them. it never matters if you buy the game or not they're still going to look for an excuse to shut a player down.
Pretty much how I fell. Haha.
You (or more I in this case as it's personal taste) do not have to read a romance novel to know I wouldn't enjoy it.
One does not have to pick up a porcupine to know that it would hurt.
one does not have to touch a hot eye on a stove to know it would burn
One does not have to watch a Syfy original movie to know it's going to be bad.
One does not have to eat spoiled food to know it's bad.
One does not have to own a game to know whether or not they would like it. Does it help, yes but is it a requirement, no.
As noted there are tons of reviews, lets plays, videos, screenshots, one can make an opinion without purchasing.
If you feel otherwise, ask yourself, have you never passed up something because it didn't look good?
You'll note these are all negative examples I gave, that's because even though I like the game, we are going from a standpoint of someone who is passing it up.
Seriously? This from the woman who only yesterday told someone, "This is actually a useless topic...Why recycle the same old same old? You're not likely to learn anything new, so I honestly don't know what you think you can accomplish here other than to keep the forum active." Pot, kettle, etc. I just thought people should know.
Circling back to topic: I can understand why people might want to know if a poster is speaking from the position of game owner/player or educated observer, but I don't think it should be a criteria for whether one can/should post an opinion. I also think people need to be careful about the way the phrase the question, if they feel the need to ask, and that those being asked should look carefully at the context and wording of the question before taking offense.
EDIT: I just came across Ana's post and it seems you are not as innocent as you pretend here.
> EowynCarter wrote: »
>
> Did i said "shut up" ? I said there was no point in repeating the same debate all over again, with the same argument, with both side not managing to convince the other anyway. Don't make me say what I didn't say...
> And remember, development take time...
> Because you've ask for toodlers and they're not there yet don't mean EA didn't hear at all.
>
> And sorry, I don't believe in the "yelling on internet make companies move".
> Sony left us with a buggy phone update; Yelling, yelling, and here goes... noting... I can find tons of occurrences like that...
>
>
>
>
> I didn't ask for toddlers, although they should have been in the game in the first place. I'm talking on principle here about the toddlers. And saying "development takes time" not only sounds patronizing, but it's a cop-out. If toddlers were meant to be in the game, then they should have been left in the game, even if they were going to be limited like the babies. The generational players might not have liked it, but at least they'd still be playing.
>
> And, maybe "yelling on the internet" may not make companies move, but a clear indication that "if this doesn't get fixed, you can forget getting any more money from me" might actually work. So, if Sony left you with a buggy update, you and other customers complained about it (as you had every right to do), and nothing happened, did that make you eager to rush out and buy the latest model (I'm assuming cell phone, here) or did you go out and buy from another company?
>
> So, basically, what I interpret you saying is that arguing is not going to solve anything, so let's just sit back and wait to see what EA is going to do. Well, (again, my opinion) what EA's execs will *probably* do (again, my opinion) is nothing, because they'll figure that the natives are no longer restless and therefore, they can just carry on with whatever their "vision" of the Sims franchise is (probably adding more online elements).
>
> And the thing is, even with the rehearsing, at least it indicates our continued interest, but with two previous games to compete with, it's not that hard to walk away and stop buying anything TS4...and that's exactly what EA doesn't want, but that's exactly what our stopping with rehearsing the same thing over and over will tell them...that we no longer care about TS4, when we can play with 2 other iterations instead and not have to spend another dime.
Well, yes, arguing between each other, with EA hardly reading our discussion, not going to change stuff much.
Putting toddler, even in a "crippled" form, would have required taking off something else. What they should have is report the launch to finished properly. it clearly was rushed.
As to the phone, i got one from an other company, tired of the sola that had became unusable. Still own that phone almost two years later. And, well, I don't think sony cares at all.
I don't actually see your point here, Jarsie was frustrated and I understand that-that some people continue to ask the same question of those who are disappointed when they've been here and seen exactly what they have said over the past few months. She may not have handled it in the best way according to you or others but when you've had months of being belittled for your opinions it does begin to grate. It's not the pot calling the kettle black. People want to know things are being worked on for sure. Until we get there these begging threads will continue just because if we shut up then EA will forget us pretty quickly. It's not a personal attack on you or your experience of the game that people feel differently :-)
Besides that was yesterday, best to let things go or we get threads after thread talking about people's past mistakes and arguments and never move on. Our forum is getting better recently and it would be a shame to ruin that.
I think it's a matter of context in some cases. If a poster is having a to and fro with someone who is rather aggressive in their manner then suddenly asking that question is almost saying 'if you don't then you don't belong'. We are all sims fans or we wouldn't be here. Like others have said it's not even like that's the end of it-we get the same attitude towards players like me who are disappointed even with owning 4. It's a case of a true no win situation for fans who aren't cheerleaders.
https://twitter.com/sparkfairy1
I would never tell anyone they need to try it but I'm one of those people that did need to try it. My pre-order stance was that I needed hands on time of my own because while I take opinions and reviews into account I like to make up my own mind about things. I found it wasn't what I thought it would be like. I'm not one of the people who had to have pools and toddlers and I still find the game lacking. It's simply just boring for me. It's really disappointing.
There are the people who say it's just a base game but to tell the truth the TS2 and TS3 base game both gave me a lot of hours in fun play time. I just don't know if EPs will add to TS4 or not. It's really going to depend on if the devs listen to the fan base and try to correct the situation. If EPs just add, as I suspect, more scripted game play it will be the last money EA will see from me.
And, since pots are going to be calling kettles, here, I believe this was your response to me:
"Why do you care what <OP> posts? Why do you find it necessary to jump into threads only to criticize the OP and the idea presented? Is it because "nobody is yelling at anybody," so you want to try to get some of that going?
If you truly no longer care and are tired of this discussion, I have a great suggestion: Don't come here. Don't post. Find something to do that you DO care about and that does not tire you."
I didn't tell the OP to shut up. I asked why the OP was making the thread in the first place, since they have already been in numerous threads where the question has been asked before on what it would take for some players to feel the base game was complete. That's a whole different thing from saying "Shut up!" But, YOU, on the other hand, told me to "go away!" So, I did. But I don't apologize for asking the necessity of posing the question again. The only reason I could think of is that the OP wanted attention. Well, the OP got the attention. But there wasn't anything new to be learned from the information presented since it was all old information that everyone already knows. It would be different if the OP was new, but since this person has participated in numerous "here's what we want, EA!" threads, I didn't see where they needed any more enlightenment.
"We Don't Care If You LIKE The Game, Just As Long As You BUY The Game!"
I Disapprove (Naturally)
I Took The Pledge!