I agree OP. And also they left out the family tree, dish washer/trash compactor, firemen, and burglars - these simple-easy-base game things. Are there any police?
Anyway, this game was rushed, and it's sad because it could've been the best! They should've delayed it.
I really want those things, they could add so much despite being so "small" I hope they are something that just gets patched in instead of needing an expansion pack to get something as basic as dishwashers and trash compactors, along with these basic NPC's
A reminder that an expansion pack is coming along, and yet somehow there are still no Dishwashers.
Latest news: EA stares into the Abys, ArenaNet looking to takeover The Sims franchise just kidding
@Deshong04 wrote: » (In General) I wonder does many even play other games besides TS because I often observe that most that accept EA's ill business practices are the very ones who seem to play TS only
I get that feeling too sometimes. Not to be rude or anything, but I find some peoples standards
pretty low. When I read things like :"The Sims 4 is the best game I ever played!!!"
I'm thinking: "Wow, you haven't been around much have you?" O_O
But I suspect they are pretty young, actually haven't been around much indeed
so who can blame them really haha.
Are you serious about AreaNet? It's kind of scary to think of another company with the game. I think they'd definitely take it online...and in that new direction we were all against.
Hmm, I'm pretty sure it's not true but I think depending on who it was who got it a new company taking on The Sims could actually be a really good thing. Not only would we get a completely fresh from the beginning game but there aren't many developers out there who hold the same aggressive nickel and diming business model EA does (Activision and Ubisoft being notable exceptions - if they got the game then RIP The Sims) because (IMO) for the most part that kind of model doesn't work due to competition, it's only when you hold the keys to an entire gaming genre (like EA does with football, The Sims etc & like Activision had with Rock Band) that you get nonsense business models like that.
Those are my observations on it anyway.
Just imagine if somebody like Bethesta or Rockstar got the game.
2K or Valve really.
Bethesda is not someone I'd trust with Sims though.
I wouldn't trust Bethesda with making a Sims with less bugs, because if you bought Skyrim on its release date... yeah....
That would be my exact point and more so, while I think Bethesda makes great open worlds, I find the actual content in them is very...lackluster. It's generally the modders which turn their games into insanely crazy masterpieces.
EA really needs a competitor for TS. If people want to play this genre, The Sims is pretty much the only one of its kind. Competition is healthy and we would likely see far bigger strides in creativity and general improvements with this franchise. Just look at how stale EA's Madden series has become.
EA really needs a competitor for TS. If people want to play this genre, The Sims is pretty much the only one of its kind. Competition is healthy and we would likely see far bigger strides in creativity and general improvements with this franchise. Just look at how stale EA's Madden series has become.
I'm working on it right now and I call it: The Soapies.
Diswashers will be included, as are popcorn and candlesticks.
Anyway, I couldn't agree more.
EA really needs a competitor for TS. If people want to play this genre, The Sims is pretty much the only one of its kind. Competition is healthy and we would likely see far bigger strides in creativity and general improvements with this franchise. Just look at how stale EA's Madden series has become.
I still don't get why the babies have to jump into childhood..ie no toddlers. By that reasoning why didn't kids jump straight into adulthood and skip the teenage years altogether. They really should have done something to distinguish them. Hopefully we get our toddlers back.
There was a line about "we didn't want to shoehorn toddlers in, therefore we left them out." Yet the teens seem to be shoehorned in (almost indistinguishable from adults, except they vanish for school instead of work and their WooHoo interaction is renamed).
Are you serious about AreaNet? It's kind of scary to think of another company with the game. I think they'd definitely take it online...and in that new direction we were all against.
Look closer ^_^
Latest news: EA stares into the Abys, ArenaNet looking to takeover The Sims franchise just kidding
Bwahaha! I saw ArenaNet and all I could think of was...Guild Wars. LOL. Not for my sims game!
The problem is equating "missing" features to cutting corners.
Every sequel in a franchise has "missing" features from previous games. In cases where there are no missing features it's usually almost an exact copy of the previous game, like Call of Duty games.
People are upset that EA decided to try something new and fresh instead of rehashing the same thing for 15+ years.
I can agree with this on everything except toddlers. They simply shouldn't have made a release date or told about the Sims 4 until all lifestages were in. If they aren't added correctly, then they won't add more content via Eps ect. I think both toddlers and adolescents should've been added in the basegame even if it would've been bare bones for them.
I don't mind pools and hot tubs that can be added, as I understand the concept that different things are in different basegames. The CAS is fab.; I like how wishes and changing life wishes are handled now; and the pre-made rooms/build is wonderful; so I understand trade-off in that sense. If open world or color wheel ect. was a problem for the game as a whole, I can live with that after finally figuring out about holding down the left and right mouse buttons to move around as we did in Sims 3. One problem with this is no tilt to see inside rooms and not enough colors added to clothes/shoes/items ect. since there is no color wheel.
I was an avid Sims 3 fan and still am, but I also like the Sims 4 and understand that it needs patches just like all predecessors and that more EPs ect. will round it out more. No use in fussing about what can't be changed, but instead request content and inform of problems. Talking about Sims 5 and other threads/posts ect. is just childish and not an opinion. Being useful in suggestions would be a better use in time posting.
I still don't get why the babies have to jump into childhood..ie no toddlers. By that reasoning why didn't kids jump straight into adulthood and skip the teenage years altogether. They really should have done something to distinguish them. Hopefully we get our toddlers back.
There was a line about "we didn't want to shoehorn toddlers in, therefore we left them out." Yet the teens seem to be shoehorned in (almost indistinguishable from adults, except they vanish for school instead of work and their WooHoo interaction is renamed).
Hopefully, we get toddlers and adolescents. I heard somewhere that they made teens around the same size as adults to be able to add adolescents later and to be able to share clothes easier.
Latest news: EA stares into the Abys, ArenaNet looking to takeover The Sims franchise just kidding
@Deshong04 wrote: » (In General) I wonder does many even play other games besides TS because I often observe that most that accept EA's ill business practices are the very ones who seem to play TS only
I get that feeling too sometimes. Not to be rude or anything, but I find some peoples standards
pretty low. When I read things like :"The Sims 4 is the best game I ever played!!!"
I'm thinking: "Wow, you haven't been around much have you?" O_O
But I suspect they are pretty young, actually haven't been around much indeed
so who can blame them really haha.
Are you serious about AreaNet? It's kind of scary to think of another company with the game. I think they'd definitely take it online...and in that new direction we were all against.
Hmm, I'm pretty sure it's not true but I think depending on who it was who got it a new company taking on The Sims could actually be a really good thing. Not only would we get a completely fresh from the beginning game but there aren't many developers out there who hold the same aggressive nickel and diming business model EA does (Activision and Ubisoft being notable exceptions - if they got the game then RIP The Sims) because (IMO) for the most part that kind of model doesn't work due to competition, it's only when you hold the keys to an entire gaming genre (like EA does with football, The Sims etc & like Activision had with Rock Band) that you get nonsense business models like that.
Those are my observations on it anyway.
Just imagine if somebody like Bethesta or Rockstar got the game.
2K or Valve really.
Bethesda is not someone I'd trust with Sims though.
valve? they can't count to 3 so you'll get 2 expansion packs and the 3rd would never come
7 years with no news on half life 2 episode 3 (or half life 3)
One problem with this is no tilt to see inside rooms and not enough colors added to clothes/shoes/items ect. since there is no color wheel.
@davina1221 I recently found out that you can tilt the camera. First you have to put the camera in TS3 mode, which is found in the options tab of the menu. Then you need to hold down the mouse wheel button and move the mouse up and down to adjust the camera tilt. I prefer the TS4 camera system better, and there is no camera tilt in the TS4 camera mode, but I was happy to see the tilt option is in the game. IN TS3 I always used the on-screen camera buttons, which included the tilt, but on-screen tilt buttons are not available no matter which camera mode you have it in.
One problem with this is no tilt to see inside rooms and not enough colors added to clothes/shoes/items ect. since there is no color wheel.
@davina1221 I recently found out that you can tilt the camera. First you have to put the camera in TS3 mode, which is found in the options tab of the menu. Then you need to hold down the mouse wheel button and move the mouse up and down to adjust the camera tilt. I prefer the TS4 camera system better, and there is no camera tilt in the TS4 camera mode, but I was happy to see the tilt option is in the game. IN TS3 I always used the on-screen camera buttons, which included the tilt, but on-screen tilt buttons are not available no matter which camera mode you have it in.
I should probably give TS4 camera a try. I heard that the controls were very different and decided to switch to TS3 camera without even trying it. That may be a sign of my age and unwillingness to try new things. LOL :P
Latest news: EA stares into the Abys, ArenaNet looking to takeover The Sims franchise just kidding
@Deshong04 wrote: » (In General) I wonder does many even play other games besides TS because I often observe that most that accept EA's ill business practices are the very ones who seem to play TS only
I get that feeling too sometimes. Not to be rude or anything, but I find some peoples standards
pretty low. When I read things like :"The Sims 4 is the best game I ever played!!!"
I'm thinking: "Wow, you haven't been around much have you?" O_O
But I suspect they are pretty young, actually haven't been around much indeed
so who can blame them really haha.
Are you serious about AreaNet? It's kind of scary to think of another company with the game. I think they'd definitely take it online...and in that new direction we were all against.
Hmm, I'm pretty sure it's not true but I think depending on who it was who got it a new company taking on The Sims could actually be a really good thing. Not only would we get a completely fresh from the beginning game but there aren't many developers out there who hold the same aggressive nickel and diming business model EA does (Activision and Ubisoft being notable exceptions - if they got the game then RIP The Sims) because (IMO) for the most part that kind of model doesn't work due to competition, it's only when you hold the keys to an entire gaming genre (like EA does with football, The Sims etc & like Activision had with Rock Band) that you get nonsense business models like that.
Those are my observations on it anyway.
Just imagine if somebody like Bethesta or Rockstar got the game.
2K or Valve really.
Bethesda is not someone I'd trust with Sims though.
valve? they can't count to 3 so you'll get 2 expansion packs and the 3rd would never come
7 years with no news on half life 2 episode 3 (or half life 3)
Yes yes, I make HL3 jokes all the time too. Valve is a huge group of devs however and while the HL gang apparently like to troll their fanbase eternally, there are plenty of solid groups in there who churn out content at a good pace with excellent quality
Not only would we get a completely fresh from the beginning game but there aren't many developers out there who hold the same aggressive nickel and diming business model EA does (Activision and Ubisoft being notable exceptions - if they got the game then RIP The Sims) because (IMO) for the most part that kind of model doesn't work due to competition, it's only when you hold the keys to an entire gaming genre (like EA does with football, The Sims etc & like Activision had with Rock Band) that you get nonsense business models like that.
Actually - EA had Rock Band, before MadCatz (last makers of the instruments) took over as publisher/distributor after Rock Band 3 was out. Rock Band 3 suffered from the final rush like The Sims 4 did, only not as much. At least the game engine works well and most of the problems are janky animations.
Activision had Guitar Hero, and milked it to death, making entire disc games for what could have easily been distributed as store DLC.
EA didn't run Rock Band into the ground as badly as Activision did at least but yes, both companies are probably the 2 biggest examples of corporate greed/impatience sadly.
I feel like EA is far less slimy than Activision but that doesn't excuse the mistakes they make as well.
Boggles me how a company (even the shareholders) can look, see how their customers are/what they want and STILL push these crappy deadlines/content cut type cycles on people.
What's worse is as I say that, I know the answer boils down to "Because we let them and not enough people answer with their wallets" >_<
I agree with you 100%. I can see why they took out open world - but toddlers? Pools? Etc? How is that possibly making the game laggy or whatever? Never did so in Sims 3/2... Excuses. And this game is beautiful to me too! With those minor features still there (or major!) it would be 100x better & much awesome.
EA has become like other large companies and that is the bottom line first and the rest second.They are lazy and cheap it's that simple.
There is no good enough excuse for no dishwasher and the lack of household items like a fire pit. The build tools are really good but the small lots are a pain.I like building decks and porches but they remain empty no porch swing.
God 🐸🐸🐸🐸 this. The "it's too hard!" excuses are absolutely hilarious. "My job was too hard! That's a completely reasonable excuse! Now, pay full retail RRP for this game so I can get paid for LITERALLY HALF 🐸🐸🐸🐸 WHAT I DO FOR A LIVING."
Seriously. You cannot start a project by yourself, complain that what you set out to do was too difficult, and then still expect full recognition. Delay the game. Hire more staff with the literal PILES of money the previous games have made. Work harder. There are so many things that could have been done to get everything you'd expect from the game in the game, but they chose not to do that and release the game in the state it was anyway.
I might sound angry, but that's because at no point whatsoever did EA or Maxis say "Well, y'know, we never actually intended to put them in in the first place. There were never going to be pools or toddlers in this one". Every single time it's been brought up, they've (essentially) said "the engine we built sucks, so it wasn't actually possible". The implication is they meant to, but they didn't. And there definitely would have been a fix if they had wanted to fix it, for us.
Where did they say it was too hard versus they couldn't do it in the scope of time they had? Do you think given the past games had those life states with different animations that maybe they know how to do it but if EA is kicking it out the door come hell or high water at the release date they HAD to pick and choose what went in?
You being angry doesn't change that and twisting the words from "We had to pick what went in" aka we ran out of time to "It's too hard to do!" does a disservice to you and the devs.
And the reasoning of "Hire more devs" is a logical fallacy. Blizzard recently bumped the WoW studio up from 150ish to 200+ and that is the single biggest reason they have had to delay WoD so heavily. Why? Because even if you bring in talented people, you still have to teach those people the engine you're working with, get them integrated and a whole slew of other things.
Simply throwing manpower at a problem does not make it necessarily work or get done faster.
While I must say that I am still enjoying the new game overall, I am getting SICK of the guru's talking about how missing features were removed because it is "too hard" or "takes too long" or was a "trade off".
The open world is understandable, because it truly WAS a mess. However, for everything else, such as the teen height, town sizes, small lots, toddlers, pools, etc. it sounds more like excuses for cut corners and lazy design. You know why? Because if certain features required more resources, they should have HIRED MORE PEOPLE. Or better yet, they should have NOT laid off all those devs a while back.
Seriously, The Sims 3 squeezed every last dime from our wallets, releasing an endless amount of expansions and stuff packs, and charging ridiculous prices for store content. Where exactly did all that money go? You would think that they'd AT LEAST use some of it to ensure that their dev team was properly staffed for the "next gen" installment. And if the devs blame time constraints for leaving out 10 year old features, then there is clearly an issue regarding upper management, resource allocation, and staffing.
As someone stated in another thread, it would be one thing if Sims 4 was made by a bunch of Indie developers on a kickstarter budget. But The Sims is one of EA's biggest cash cows. It is one of the last franchises that should be complaining about how things require too much work.
I realize that the actual developers had no control over this. But I'm really starting to believe those laid-off devs who were complaining about toxic upper management, office politics, etc. There is really no reason for a AAA game of this budget to be cutting this many corners.
the open world could of been improved and had bugs and issues ironed out instead of just removing it along with everything else
the devs probably wanted a delay to get the game to the level they wanted but EA said no.. they are already delaying battlefield hardline no way they where going to have 2 games delayed.
I am just about to say, why the no open world is understandable excuse while the rest is not .
What was the trade off to get such bad clipping? Take the clipping back!
If I am not mistaken it's to solve the routing issues. I think Grant commented on this on another thread "I purchased it, I returned it", or something like that.
Comments
I really want those things, they could add so much despite being so "small" I hope they are something that just gets patched in instead of needing an expansion pack to get something as basic as dishwashers and trash compactors, along with these basic NPC's
That would be my exact point and more so, while I think Bethesda makes great open worlds, I find the actual content in them is very...lackluster. It's generally the modders which turn their games into insanely crazy masterpieces.
I'm working on it right now and I call it: The Soapies.
Diswashers will be included, as are popcorn and candlesticks.
Anyway, I couldn't agree more.
Yes!
Totally on the money!
https://twitter.com/sparkfairy1
Bwahaha! I saw ArenaNet and all I could think of was...Guild Wars. LOL. Not for my sims game!
I can agree with this on everything except toddlers. They simply shouldn't have made a release date or told about the Sims 4 until all lifestages were in. If they aren't added correctly, then they won't add more content via Eps ect. I think both toddlers and adolescents should've been added in the basegame even if it would've been bare bones for them.
I don't mind pools and hot tubs that can be added, as I understand the concept that different things are in different basegames. The CAS is fab.; I like how wishes and changing life wishes are handled now; and the pre-made rooms/build is wonderful; so I understand trade-off in that sense. If open world or color wheel ect. was a problem for the game as a whole, I can live with that after finally figuring out about holding down the left and right mouse buttons to move around as we did in Sims 3. One problem with this is no tilt to see inside rooms and not enough colors added to clothes/shoes/items ect. since there is no color wheel.
I was an avid Sims 3 fan and still am, but I also like the Sims 4 and understand that it needs patches just like all predecessors and that more EPs ect. will round it out more. No use in fussing about what can't be changed, but instead request content and inform of problems. Talking about Sims 5 and other threads/posts ect. is just childish and not an opinion. Being useful in suggestions would be a better use in time posting.
Hopefully, we get toddlers and adolescents. I heard somewhere that they made teens around the same size as adults to be able to add adolescents later and to be able to share clothes easier.
valve? they can't count to 3 so you'll get 2 expansion packs and the 3rd would never come
7 years with no news on half life 2 episode 3 (or half life 3)
@davina1221 I recently found out that you can tilt the camera. First you have to put the camera in TS3 mode, which is found in the options tab of the menu. Then you need to hold down the mouse wheel button and move the mouse up and down to adjust the camera tilt. I prefer the TS4 camera system better, and there is no camera tilt in the TS4 camera mode, but I was happy to see the tilt option is in the game. IN TS3 I always used the on-screen camera buttons, which included the tilt, but on-screen tilt buttons are not available no matter which camera mode you have it in.
I should probably give TS4 camera a try. I heard that the controls were very different and decided to switch to TS3 camera without even trying it. That may be a sign of my age and unwillingness to try new things. LOL :P
Yes yes, I make HL3 jokes all the time too. Valve is a huge group of devs however and while the HL gang apparently like to troll their fanbase eternally, there are plenty of solid groups in there who churn out content at a good pace with excellent quality
EA didn't run Rock Band into the ground as badly as Activision did at least but yes, both companies are probably the 2 biggest examples of corporate greed/impatience sadly.
I feel like EA is far less slimy than Activision but that doesn't excuse the mistakes they make as well.
Boggles me how a company (even the shareholders) can look, see how their customers are/what they want and STILL push these crappy deadlines/content cut type cycles on people.
What's worse is as I say that, I know the answer boils down to "Because we let them and not enough people answer with their wallets" >_<
There is no good enough excuse for no dishwasher and the lack of household items like a fire pit. The build tools are really good but the small lots are a pain.I like building decks and porches but they remain empty no porch swing.
Where did they say it was too hard versus they couldn't do it in the scope of time they had? Do you think given the past games had those life states with different animations that maybe they know how to do it but if EA is kicking it out the door come hell or high water at the release date they HAD to pick and choose what went in?
You being angry doesn't change that and twisting the words from "We had to pick what went in" aka we ran out of time to "It's too hard to do!" does a disservice to you and the devs.
And the reasoning of "Hire more devs" is a logical fallacy. Blizzard recently bumped the WoW studio up from 150ish to 200+ and that is the single biggest reason they have had to delay WoD so heavily. Why? Because even if you bring in talented people, you still have to teach those people the engine you're working with, get them integrated and a whole slew of other things.
Simply throwing manpower at a problem does not make it necessarily work or get done faster.
That...scares me.
I am just about to say, why the no open world is understandable excuse while the rest is not
I am there with you, I really do
I have read this thread until your comment (page 5). I haven't seen anyone fighting. They are having a discussion.
Now...I am going to read the rest of it
Pretty much - couple of replies that are iffy in here but overall it's a pretty great discussion
If I am not mistaken it's to solve the routing issues. I think Grant commented on this on another thread "I purchased it, I returned it", or something like that.
I like this comment very much