I do not understand why some people say that we should not complain about the sims 4.
The purpose of the complaints is not to depress the sims 4 players. Instead, try to get EA's attention to what could be improved so that the sims 4 becomes a much nicer and more enjoyable game. So please stop seeing the sims 4 criticisms as if they were personal criticism. It is not so. Not for me.
Moreover, from my point of view, the sims 4 is not a little fun due to the lack of an open world but due to the lack of functionality and interactivity. Lacks that, after 4 years, can not yet be there.
In regards to the open worlds in Sims 3, I found a person on a well known CC site who has fixed the routing issues with many of the worlds (both worlds that came from the game itself and store worlds) and I play with her fixed worlds in my games. Yes, even Isla Paradiso which everyone says is a huge mess in terms of routing, etc. So, fixes to any Sims version can be done IF there was an editor (like when you write and publish a book) and someone was willing to recode the game. Twillian (NRAAS) fixed many of the issues with his game mods for Sims 3. Sims 2 for me was fixed by Aspyr who ported the games to the Mac OS.
Second Star to the Right and Straight on 'til Morning.
The sims in sims 4 don't feel that authentic to me, as they all have pretty much the same choices and reactions to things. Like I literally started a new household with a girl and her cat, and the third day of living there, she burns her food and a fire starts in the kitchen (only stays in the kitchen). So she takes like 10 minutes to stop looking at the fire and leave the house, but even though i told her to pick up the cat (who was sitting right next to her), she just runs out. And then 10 minutes later standing outside, she runs back in a grabs the cat. Then she stands outside looking at the house with the cat, and then after a while she sets the cat down, runs back into the house, stands in the MIDDLE of the fire trying to hose everything down with a fire extinguisher, and obviously dies in the process. The worst part of it all is that she had the genius trait....
At least it was kinda funny? i guess?
Its just the lack of experience in gameplay, It would have been better to extinguish herself first then she would not have died, the house burning is not a big deal, things just need to be replaced. Then she could take two showers and, good as new. I was not playing a household, I was just a visitor of the family and my friend's father started a fire, he caught on fire and I thought I could do nothing, but I clicked on him and yes I could extinguish the fire on him.
When someone dies, don't save just exit and return and all is back.
Also, once, while I was not at my home lot but working, I return home and my little dog was dirty, she has been dirty before but this was worst, and my cat had run away. I saw the Butler, she gave me no indication that it had been a fire, that I notice because sims often show a fire bubble in their chat. When I went upstairs later my large bedroom had caught fire. and everything in it was burned. So I understood why my cat ran.
we'll give you a full refund. Just make sure you make your request within 24 hours after you first launch the game, within seven days from your date of purchase, or within seven days from the game's release date if you pre-ordered, whichever comes first.
Who said EA doesn't have a sense of humor
things I liked from the sims 3 I would like to see back is festivals
the ones in city living aren't as good
and random death like death by satellite and bed and shark
and also I want something like world adventures
I liked that a lot from sims 2 I want fears and slow dancing and death by illness
from sims 1 I want death by hamster
Please don’t try and speak for others, forcing them (‘those people’) to contradict something they never even said or thought. Sims 4 definitely is a step back, compared to both Sims 2 and 3. Sims 2 and 3 I see as equal. One beats the other in some areas and vice versa. Sorry but this really is about Sims 4 for people, not about Sims 2 or 3.
The sad thing is that you're proving everything I said correct. It's not a statement of fact that TS4 is a step back. It's your opinion. I respect it, but that is all it is. It doesn't give you the right to impose that opinion on me or anyone else as actual fact. You are the one speaking for others, not me.
In contrast, what I said about the scapegoating of TS4 is, and I quote myself, "I feel that".
That's not me saying "it is that way." I'm not saying "a lot of people do this" or "everyone thinks this". I'm saying what *I* believe based on the things I read on this forum on a regular basis. I then went on to say "those people" (ie, the ones that, in my opinion, feel that way about TS4 for that reason, act in that manner). At no point did I say everyone who likes TS3 acts that way. I just said that in my opinion there are people who feel that way and thus act in that regard. If that is an incorrect judgement then it is. I can only form my opinion based on the actions of other people, which is what I have done. It's genuinely just me trying to explain why so many people behave in such an incomprehensible way around this game, because otherwise why would you hate on TS4 just because you liked TS3 better? If that isn't the explanation for some of the really hostile behaviour on this forum (including yours), then what is the reason? I can only hypothesise, because frankly, I don't understand it at all.
I am also rather concerned about your inability to discern two different posters and posts in your reply, as well. It sort of indicates you don't see either of us as people, but just 'things to be argued with' because our views maybe contradict your own. I did notice that you only apologised to the other poster, and not to me. I am sure that was an oversight, but it was me you were attacking, and it isn't the first time you've jumped to conclusions about my comments and have launched into attack mode without stopping to find out all the details or read the post properly, either. On that occasion it was because I said I found TS3 unplayable, and you read that as criticism of TS3, rather than an indictment of my old computer, which couldn't cope with running it. Jumping to conclusions and misreading posts seems to be a common theme for you.
On the subject of TS3, I find the whole matter really silly because I remember when TS3 came out. I remember all the bugs and issues with TS2 as well. Because I remember that, I find this debate ridiculous. There was a ton of hostility towards TS3 in the early days, because it was so different to TS2 and there were a bevy of problems related to it. A lot of people abandoned TS3 and went back to TS2 because it was seen as 'better'. But my memories of TS2 (which I genuinely love) is that my gameplay was extensively supported by mods and custom content. I haven't had to do that with TS4. I find I am able to play it without mods and custom content. I don't know if that says something about me as a player or whether it is something about the game, but it's still the case. I will always love TS2, but I can accept TS4 as a relative and play it without any negative grievances. I don't understand the negativity towards TS4. I genuinely don't understand why it matters so much to poke holes in its gameplay at every single possible opportunity. I can understand choosing not to play it because you hate it, or you hate its format, or any of those things. And I can understand being frustrated with bugs, but the Sims has always had bugs in every game of the franchise. If you have played TS from the start, you basically know that TS4's bugs are no worse than those encountered in previous games. The reason I played with so many mods in TS2 was partly on that account.
On the flipside of that, there were just as many people who were absolutely smitten by TS3 and hated on TS2 extensively. TS3 had better graphics, better gameplay, less buggy, etc etc. And so there were disagreements then about the same kind of things. Reality is that they are just different. Equals, yes. I agree with you on that. But different. TS4 is also in my opinion equal, but different. It has strengths in some areas and weaknesses in others, just as its predecessors did. Right now, the bugs are immediately frustrating as they have no obvious fix. And I will say that I know TS4 has come a long way from the bare base game that it began with, adding in things that should have been there from the start. I totally understand people who were annoyed with that.
What I don't understand is why any of this has to become hostile. If it's not about feeling resentful towards EA over TS4 (as actually some of the posts subsequent to mine also indicate, calling the EA approach to pack speed pathetic and so on), then what is it about? I don't see why it's necessary to constantly undermine TS4, and by extension, its players. It's a game and people enjoy it. That's their right, they should be able to do that and post about it without worrying someone's going to rip their head off for daring to like the 'unpopular relation' in the family tree. The game has problems, yes. But it's still in progress, and really they all do. And really, so does life. Honestly, the real world has so many bigger issues to deal with than which TS game is best. I'll reiterate what I said before - whatever your personal preferences, it's absolutely never okay to go in and attack someone else for their preferences or treat them with less respect than you would treat someone who agrees with you. It's ok to disagree with someone, but only if you do so with respect.
I also want to clarify that what I posted above and and what I am posting now is really NOT aimed at 'most people' in this thread. In my opinion up till the last few pages, this thread was genuinely answering and discussing the question raised at the start. I don't have an issue with anyone who has explained their personal reasons for not liking TS4 or the issues they've had in a calm and respectful way. That's fine. It's your opinion. Share it. No reason not to. All those opinions are valid. Also, in the interests of fairness, it is absolutely not ok to call fans of TS3 or people who don't like TS4 names either. That's not cool, I don't support that and nothing I have said is intended to imply that I think it's fine for fans of TS4 to behave like heathens either. It's not an us vs them situation and it never should be. Someone explaining why they like TS3 better than TS4 is not automatically out to get TS4 fans. I think we need the distinction between those who clearly are and those who clearly just want to get their views across (on both 'sides', if we even need sides). It's what I said before - devs are going to be more interested in coherent critical discussion and ideas rather than arguments about what is best.
I'm also 'old' in relative terms to this forum and game, and I prefer TS4 to TS3, so that logic of age is really irrelevant. You like what you like, end of. It's just about how that like is expressed with people of differing perceptions.
What I object to is the steamrollering attempts of a small minority of people to derail this kind of discussion and make it an argument about what game is best, making the whole tone confrontational. People need to have the right to criticise a game or love a game without the fear or risk of being flamebaited or attacked.
@aricarai - yeah, I maybe should have been more clear in my explanation of the TS2 connection. I know there are a lot of in-game details that are different but I am generally okay with accepting that as just how this version of TS is operating. I like some things more in TS4 and I like some things less. That's life, I suppose. I come from another community with stuff that crosses four generations and there has always been some tension involved between fans of different generations, although I have been involved with it for long enough now to be part of a community area where we just embrace all versions and accept they're different and get on with it. But I like - and am very happy - that we can agree to disagree on this
So in essence, what you are asking us to do is be satisfied with a game that doesn't meet the expectations of a segment of the Sims playing community. In essence YOU are satisfied with the status quo. In other words, "We like it so don't complain about it...and go back to playing your previous iteration...while we get the benefits of updates and other stuff...essentially: quit complaining." Well I, as a TS3 player, am not satisfied with the STATUS QUO and I EXPECT BETTER from the game that was SUPPOSED to be a sequel to the game I play.
A certain individual stated this to the SWBF2 community however it can very much be applicable here to the Sims community.
We are trying to run the company with an ear to the consumer at all times, not only in the testing phase but when the game is up and running. We're trying to build games that last for years, not for months... If we're not making mistakes along the way and learning from them, that's when you should worry about us.
They are NOT listening to a segment of the consumer base. THEY ARE NOT LEARNING FROM THEIR MISTAKES...and ABOVE ALL THEIR ENTIRE ATTITUDE towards that segment of the consumer base is demeaning and insulting.
If that is the way that they're going to treat their consumer base, my money talks a heck of a lot more than anything I could complain about here. And that's that PLUM will freeze over before I put down good money earned on TS4. And if their intention is to sink the Sims franchise...by not listening to a section of their consumer base THEN SO BE IT!
Always "River McIrish" ...and maybe some Bebe Hart. ~innocent expression~
@ Vraie - Is anyone attacking anyone here? I must have missed those posts because I can't find any attacks or name calling anywhere. All I'm seeing are players' thoughts about Sims 4. It might be helpful to use quotes if you are referring to specific attacks or name calling. The quote you used doesn't seem to be relevant to your words somehow.
Some of the reasons I'm personally disappointed in Sims 4 is not because it hasn't improved in many areas because it definitely has! There are indeed some brilliant improvements so there is no way I could say I 'hate' Sims 4 because I don't. If anything, I 'love' some of the improvements, no doubt about that!
However .... I'm disappointed that no matter what traits I give my sims, they all act (and walk) the same the majority of the time. I'm disappointed that I can't colour objects or change the texture of objects myself. (This is a HUGE disappointment for me) I'm disappointed that I can't edit a town - there is no town, and I can't edit the neighbourhood either! That is really not good! It's a major disappointment actually. I can't add a little cafe in the neighbourhood area, I can't add toilets, I can't add a bench so my sims can sit there while I photograph them. My sims can't do anything except walk around it and chat with other sims.
I'm disappointed that my retail shops act out like coffee shop breaks - all the sims huddle together chatting and joking instead of buying what my sim is selling. Retail, as it stands at the moment, is more about selling expensive items that people have to think about, like insurance for example, rather than buying a cake, a newspaper, some groceries or book. I don't know anyone who wants sales talk in their local supermarket or gift shop.
I'm disappointed that I can't add a lot anywhere in a neighbourhood, but am stuck to what is already there.
I'm disappointed that when trying to play a hotel, none of my sims sit in the dining room to eat, preferring to shoot off, plate in hand, and interrupt another sim who is busy doing something else. So instead of using the nice dining room I created, my sims are all over the house, standing up, plate in hand. I'm disappointed that despite building a rather nice kitchen, locked for only my hotel chef, my chef sim took the salad bowl right across to the other side of the house to complete the fruit salad on the bar in the piano lounge and then left it there on the bar.
I'm disappointed that I can't take my sims to town and chat with random people outside the book store, or pop into the consignment store to sell some stuff. I'm disappointed my sims can't take handiness classes or gardening classes or meet up outside the local bistro where sims can meet up and sit outside or even take a cooking class. I'm disappointed they can't take a tour backstage at the town hall or theatre. I'm disappointed there are no police, firemen or postmen around - there's never anything in my post box. Whenever I check it, it says nothing has arrived. I'm disappointed that I can't register my author/painter sim as self employed - they're unemployed apparently. I'm disappointed there is no graveyard, and no accessible police station or hospital. I'm disappointed there is no school. Or cars. Or bikes. Or travelling around anywhere except walk. I'm disappointed that despite the fact so many houses in the real world have a car or a driveway, nothing like that exists in the game.
Mostly, I'm finding it very difficult to keep building the same houses over and over again that 'have' to match up with the surrounding neighbourhood. It's becoming boring. No more can I add a tiny lot up on a cliff, or between those houses, or down there on the beach as in Sunset Valley. I was so used to visiting Sunset Valley, I actually felt I knew all the sims there - it was like going home. Sims 4 doesn't feel like this. It's impersonal. And I'm afraid it doesn't keep my interest for long.
I could go on like this for ages - it's just so darn disappointing, despite all the excellent improvements. Oh well......
If I may, there has been ( and still is, to an extent ) an underlying tone on the forums that if you like the Sims4, your ... wrong. It is hard to put into words and it isn't a good feeling yo have. So I can fully understand that sense of "we should be ashamed for liking it". If you do like the Sims4, you do often feel alienated and/or isolated from this community. It is a sad state of affairs, you have to grow a thicker skin or just leave. So, even though it wasn't specifically pointed out in this particular thread ... it has in many others.
As to the second part ... about how no one in the thread stated they 'hate' sims4. I do find it ironic that it is the threads title. I mean ... it is the whole title of the thread. I find it funny. While the vast majority has said their disappointments, there was this on why it was hated.
You know, I wasn't planning to post here originally (as I have no idea what to say in response to the OP), but I just want to drop in to say how much I agree with this. I haven't seen anyone outright insulting or belittling ts4 fans here, nor do I believe that it's anyone's intention to. But still, the feeling of alienation remains for a lot of us. It is just so easy to develop that mindset of "we should be ashamed for liking it" when you see people being objective about how something you really like is lacking so much in comparison to something else; it really does make you feel 'wrong' for liking/preferring it, and it's a really hard feeling to shake off, that no amount of "just like what you like" would ever alleviate. What makes it worst is that we can't just outright admit that "we hate people pointing out facts about how lacking our favorite game is because it makes us feel bad" - no, we stand the risk of being called whiny then. But the truth of the matter is, we do feel that way. We do hate seeing our game get shredded to smithereens by facts, because we know deep down that there's no way to debunk any of that and there's nothing we can do about it. Being unable to stand up for something you like is one of the worst feelings ever (especially if you feel so passionate about it), regardless of how many times we preach to ourselves "we don't care that it's bad, we still like it" over and over.
It gets especially painful when you see comments like "EA is ripping us off with this game"/"this game is nothing but a cash-grab" being thrown around. These commentors are probably just being objective when saying that, sure, but to us, it makes us feel as if we're liking something that's not meant to be liked - as if we've fallen in love with a rip-off; a farce. The mere ploy of a company to get more money. Perhaps this makes you mad, but then what can you say back to them? That "they're being disrespectful"? But they're just being objective. That "it's not a cash-grab/rip-off?". Then you'll be seen as defending the company, because unfortunately the facts aren't on your side, so you'll be deemed foolish in doing so.
But enough with that self-defeating attitude; let's just talk about this forum itself. So, why do some ts4 fans feel alienated here? It makes no sense. We've got lots of threads just for fans of the game out there to share their experiences - we've got the "What happened in your game today?" thread, we've got some screenshots threads, and if we're lucky, we may even get the occasional "what do you like about ts4" sort of threads that we could spill all our love into. But what if we wanna step out of that? What if we want to partake in some actual discussion? Actually, scratch that, what if we just want to experience a bit of the "S4 PC Feedback" or "Rumor and Speculations" threads? I don't care what anyone else here says; it's clear as day that criticisms are generally much more welcomed here than praise. Just look at this thread alone, observe how posts with the most critical tones get the highest number of "Likes", "Awesomes", etc., and observe how posts with supportive tones towards the game receive much less appraisal than that. "So what?", you say, "that just goes to show how unhappy people are with the game" - yes, that is the point. The reason why so many ts4 fans feel almost afraid to step in here. You can argue with me all you like, but the truth of the matter remains - we feel outnumbered, we feel alienated, and we certainly don't feel welcomed here. And the most confusing, annoying part for us is that there's no one to blame. Disappointed people can't help how they feel; so we can't blame them if whatever input we provide here is just going to stick out like a sore thumb - there's really nothing we can do about it. The only thing we can do here is to help ourselves by growing a thicker skin or just leaving as @Gruffman says. And some of us just don't like being limited to options like that.
I'm sorry if all of this comes off as guilt-tripping, that really isn't my intention. Just, as someone who has constantly felt this way ever since joining these forums, I just want to say that I can totally see how people who like ts4 would feel hyper-sensitive to criticism towards it and see all of it as "hate", when people here are just really passionate about the game improving and are thus voicing their disappointment. It's irrational, yes, but it is what it is.
Quote: 'The reason why so many ts4 fans feel almost afraid to step in here. You can argue with me all you like, but the truth of the matter remains - we feel outnumbered, we feel alienated, and we certainly don't feel welcomed here. And the most confusing, annoying part for us is that there's no one to blame. Disappointed people can't help how they feel; so we can't blame them if whatever input we provide here is just going to stick out like a sore thumb - there's really nothing we can do about it. The only thing we can do here is to help ourselves by growing a thicker skin or just leaving as @Gruffman says. And some of us just don't like being limited to options like that.'
It might more accurate to say 'I' instead of 'we'. It can't be nice for players who are enjoying the game to find it being spoilt by players who are not enjoying the game. But the reverse is also true. It can't be nice for players who are disappointed with the game to find happy players berating them for being unhappy. It's actually quite sad that EA pulled in long term fans with previous versions of the game and then dropped them like hot bricks with Sims 4. I am one of those players - EA pulled me in with Sims 3 with all the unlimited gameplay and building opportunities and then shoved me away without so much as a backward glance. They literally took away nearly everything that caused me to become a fan in the first place.
Any player who is disappointed in Sims 4 is not thinking about the players who enjoy playing Sims 4, believe me! This has nothing to do with other players' enjoyment - my posts are not addressed to other players but to EA themselves. It's about the disappointed players' enjoyment. When I just wrote my last post, I wasn't thinking about other players enjoying the game. I was speaking from the heart about why it isn't working for me and the reason I did that is because I truly do want to enjoy the game again. I spent hours and hours and hours on Sims 3 and was really looking forward to Sims 4. Now, it's left this massive hole in my gaming life which I would like to fill up again. Other players don't have the power to do this - EA have that power and it is to EA that I address my thoughts.
The problem here is that EA/Maxis when they decided to create Sims 3 is that they created a segment of the Sims gaming community that is fiercely loyal to Open World and CASt. They created the segment of that community and NOW they're spitting in the face of that community saying that "Oh, Open World was a step too far"...and essentially saying that "You're going to have to take what we give you." essentially telling them that despite the fact that there are other games out there that have been coded for open world, they give us the tripe that Open World is too difficult for the Sims. That's the reason why there is the ire that there is from the TS3 community. We feel snubbed, slighted and being told to "play your game" and "don't criticize ours" makes us extremely angry. We see the potential of the game, yet EA decided, for what reason, to strip the game to its bare bones. THAT IS THE INSULT that we are enraged over. And then to top it off to have an EA executive tell us that "We're Listening"...and see this continue: that enrages us to no end.
Always "River McIrish" ...and maybe some Bebe Hart. ~innocent expression~
@Lavenderlights I understand your reasoning and position, but if you feel so upset by others dislike of the game that its causing you to not like it yourself or feel like you shouldnt play it, then there's either truth to the criticism and you can decide to like the game anyway despite the drawbacks, or you can just not go on the feedback forum where we will list our feedback. Or just play the game instead of being upset that ther people are upset about the game on here. If you enjoy Sims 4, play and enjoy it. If you want to share your fun experiences with the game, share it. Nevertheless, im still going to add my input on what I think can improve this game or the next one.
The Sims has currently lost its identity. Bring it back for TS5
If I may, there has been ( and still is, to an extent ) an underlying tone on the forums that if you like the Sims4, your ... wrong. It is hard to put into words and it isn't a good feeling yo have. So I can fully understand that sense of "we should be ashamed for liking it". If you do like the Sims4, you do often feel alienated and/or isolated from this community. It is a sad state of affairs, you have to grow a thicker skin or just leave. So, even though it wasn't specifically pointed out in this particular thread ... it has in many others.
As to the second part ... about how no one in the thread stated they 'hate' sims4. I do find it ironic that it is the threads title. I mean ... it is the whole title of the thread. I find it funny. While the vast majority has said their disappointments, there was this on why it was hated.
You know, I wasn't planning to post here originally (as I have no idea what to say in response to the OP), but I just want to drop in to say how much I agree with this. I haven't seen anyone outright insulting or belittling ts4 fans here, nor do I believe that it's anyone's intention to. But still, the feeling of alienation remains for a lot of us. It is just so easy to develop that mindset of "we should be ashamed for liking it" when you see people being objective about how something you really like is lacking so much in comparison to something else; it really does make you feel 'wrong' for liking/preferring it, and it's a really hard feeling to shake off, that no amount of "just like what you like" would ever alleviate. What makes it worst is that we can't just outright admit that "we hate people pointing out facts about how lacking our favorite game is because it makes us feel bad" - no, we stand the risk of being called whiny then. But the truth of the matter is, we do feel that way. We do hate seeing our game get shredded to smithereens by facts, because we know deep down that there's no way to debunk any of that and there's nothing we can do about it. Being unable to stand up for something you like is one of the worst feelings ever (especially if you feel so passionate about it), regardless of how many times we preach to ourselves "we don't care that it's bad, we still like it" over and over.
It gets especially painful when you see comments like "EA is ripping us off with this game"/"this game is nothing but a cash-grab" being thrown around. These commentors are probably just being objective when saying that, sure, but to us, it makes us feel as if we're liking something that's not meant to be liked - as if we've fallen in love with a rip-off; a farce. The mere ploy of a company to get more money. Perhaps this makes you mad, but then what can you say back to them? That "they're being disrespectful"? But they're just being objective. That "it's not a cash-grab/rip-off?". Then you'll be seen as defending the company, because unfortunately the facts aren't on your side, so you'll be deemed foolish in doing so.
But enough with that self-defeating attitude; let's just talk about this forum itself. So, why do some ts4 fans feel alienated here? It makes no sense. We've got lots of threads just for fans of the game out there to share their experiences - we've got the "What happened in your game today?" thread, we've got some screenshots threads, and if we're lucky, we may even get the occasional "what do you like about ts4" sort of threads that we could spill all our love into. But what if we wanna step out of that? What if we want to partake in some actual discussion? Actually, scratch that, what if we just want to experience a bit of the "S4 PC Feedback" or "Rumor and Speculations" threads? I don't care what anyone else here says; it's clear as day that criticisms are generally much more welcomed here than praise. Just look at this thread alone, observe how posts with the most critical tones get the highest number of "Likes", "Awesomes", etc., and observe how posts with supportive tones towards the game receive much less appraisal than that. "So what?", you say, "that just goes to show how unhappy people are with the game" - yes, that is the point. The reason why so many ts4 fans feel almost afraid to step in here. You can argue with me all you like, but the truth of the matter remains - we feel outnumbered, we feel alienated, and we certainly don't feel welcomed here. And the most confusing, annoying part for us is that there's no one to blame. Disappointed people can't help how they feel; so we can't blame them if whatever input we provide here is just going to stick out like a sore thumb - there's really nothing we can do about it. The only thing we can do here is to help ourselves by growing a thicker skin or just leaving as @Gruffman says. And some of us just don't like being limited to options like that.
I'm sorry if all of this comes off as guilt-tripping, that really isn't my intention. Just, as someone who has constantly felt this way ever since joining these forums, I just want to say that I can totally see how people who like ts4 would feel hyper-sensitive to criticism towards it and see all of it as "hate", when people here are just really passionate about the game improving and are thus voicing their disappointment. It's irrational, yes, but it is what it is.
@Lavenderlights - this was an interesting read and I gave it an insightful because it's confirmation of what I see a lot of around the forums and explained what others feel - even though it's not something I fully wrap my head around.
Now, I will say, I don't fully understand how people can feel personally attacked for liking a game when others give constructive criticisms or facts about the game itself (not the people that play it), but I've heard this sentiment echoed a lot around the forums. I don't understand why it's taken so personally and seen has a bad thing when people want the game to improve, but that's just me. If someone slates TS3, I just let them get on with it and respond with my opinions or views if I'm so inclined. It really doesn't affect me when people don't like TS3, but that's just me and obviously others react to things differently than myself. I find perspectives on both sides of the spectrum to be really interesting - I always want to know why someone might dislike a specific game or really love one - I find things like that super insightful.
Referencing the part of yours that I bolded: you probably didn't use the best example by talking about this thread. If you look at the OP and the title of this thread, people are answering the question in the title, which is going to be answered in a "critical" way. There's not many answers in here that out and out scream "I LOVE TS4" because that's not really what the OP wanted to know.
I'm glad you can see it, too, as people being passionate about the game improving! As someone else said, the people would post constructive criticism and give feedback wouldn't be here if they didn't love this franchise!
I don't think anyone should be ashamed of liking a video game -- I like Sims 4, though I'm a vocal critic of it as well because it absolutely could be better. And my version of "better" I don't think is controversial.
Would anyone really hate it, for instance, if whims were based on aspirations and what the sim's current interest is? (inc dreaded Sims 3 comparison since I just recently stopped playing 4 because of bugs and started playing 3 again) Playing Sims 3 for just a few hours (I'm not plagued by many of the bugs there that plague others because I use mods for any game I play), I'm reminded how much better the whims/wishes are in Sims 3. The wishes seem inspired by current mood, but specific as to what is causing this mood (disliking someone leads them to want to see the particular sim dead or wanting to get into a fight with them; cheating on someone prompts wishes to apologize to that sim); the lifetime wish; traits; and what they've been currently doing. I have a bookworm/author sim going on in Sims 3, and she keeps getting wishes to read x amount of books and to write certain genres of books. Their thought bubbles are germaine to whatever is going on at the moment. Their dream bubbles are a lot more focused on both the here-and-now and the future. There is even fear, and reactions to things that scare you.
I wish they would also bring back the animations. Sims 3 dropped a lot of them from Sims 2, but Sims 4 dropped even more. Bring back some of the romantic interactions that are now gone. Bring back the ability to do more things together.
Even without the above (and I can't imagine people would not like a Sims 4 which had those), Sims 4 is very buggy. The same thing that people objected about earlier iterations has come to plague Sims 4. And the bugs in Sims 4 that I'm coming across are frustrating to the point where I just shut off the game and moved onto something different. I never had that happen in either Sims 2 or Sims 3. I've been frustrated by their bugs as well, but mods could keep them in check.
For example:
In TS4 you can watch your sims in the spa, have family dinners, go shopping for clothes, run your own business, take your sims on actual dates, invest time in your toddlers,kids,etc... , have pets that are actually invested in your sims, you can have REAL apartments, the professions are actually more fun, the game overall is more challenging, and you can take your sims out to clubs and bars and they ACTUALLY socialize and dance.
Compared to TS3 where... Your sims go to the rabbit hole 'spa,' and just get a moodlet, you can't really go shopping at all, you can't run your own business, your sims can't go on immersive dates, the toddlers are a cake walk and the kids just ignore you, the pets are practically unbothered by the sims, you have fake apartments with no real change in the sim's life style (no rats, no real neighbors, etc..), the professions are really just distractions and tasks you do outside of the rabbit holes so you feel like you're going to work with your sims, TS3 is somewhat challenging but you can get bored easily, in TS3 the clubs are just boring.... Remember the launch of Late Night and all of the "empty club" threads? Yeah.... Boring.
You do get a spa in TS3, If you purchase to install the necessary DLC (which is no different from what you're doing with SPA DAY GAME PACK, that provides a sauna, a massage table, which I believe all that comes with sunlight tides world. Again, you can run a business If you have Savy Seller Collection purchase and installed.
Reasons TS4 is hated: It’s a fashion simulator, barely offering anything new to the table for the actual LIVE mode gameplay: Based of MY observations, many decide to choose to play TS4, because over CAS, Aesthetic/Graphics, and… couldn’t recall the other reason. The Gameplay is shallow and don’t see it dominating in that area when comparing to TS1/TS2/TS3 Limited Sandbox; Little Customization/Flexibility in options and tools: So much advertised on "you ruling", but the only 'you rule' aspect of the slogan comes to true is CAS and The Sims game is just basically back to square one. The Sims 4 ain't The Sims FOUR, with how many strip downs/omissions it receives from the through the whole series. As a TS2 player, I can’t say TS4 fails to bring the sufficient freedom what they would expect from a sequel, unlike TS2 (exception would be CAS). A clear and bright example would be apartments: you can build an whole apartments/penthouses/skyscrapers from scratch from the very ground to the sky (TS2: with the help of cheats), however in TS4 you can’t and stuck with premade apartments/penthouses in a premade world and uneditable apartments. TS2 has terrain tools… enough said. TS2, you have access to buy, place, move and remove down an elevator, in TS4 you can only dream about. Barely groundbreaking, but the game pays the price for many strip downs and omissions its direction took from the sims series: It has nothing and barely noticeable groundbreaking additions to the so-called "sequel". Emotions are nothing more than a borked feature and technically sims always had emotions. Ironically, some players made valid points how TS2/TS3 have real emotions than the mechanic that was marketed like "OMG, THIS IS THE BEST ABOUT that past games missed the park. GO BUY IT! for TS4. Multitasking? Lol, I can think of more ways of what benefitial multitasking can include than the stuff the game has now and most of times multitasking isn't actually a what its term suggests: If a sim is switching the task between A and B instead than simultaneously (for example, If a sim cooks, then stops just to chit chat, and then returns to continue on preparing the meal - let me tell you, that ain'tmultitasking. As for iconic omissions of the game, I don’t think I need remind people of what on they are because you can search them out by just looking through the forums of complaints. Some person reported that TS4 has one of the worst A.I’s in the Sims series history: Go read #DeservedCritism ‘s thread. Verdict (there are too many reasons to cover why the game is hated, but I’ll leave it for another rant): Cons outweigh the Pros: Little/No replayability (no long-lasting rewards for completing a certain task, thus lack of motivation/purpose to do anything), not that many challenges, a lot missed marks/opportunities for creating fleshed out features/mechanics/additions to make up for a loss/skipped feature, very buggy game...
Wow now multitasking makes sense. They are not really multitasking. I kept wondering why is it taking Sims so long to do stuff when they are chatting and why they removed social from the bowling. They are literally stop to do one task and then the next.
I have noticed when I take my Sims to a restaurant they usually finish their drink then start eating and chatting stops then from eating and then they resume. There is definitely an illusion of multitasking but you are right @DragonCat159, they are not multitasking.
The problem here is that EA/Maxis when they decided to create Sims 3 is that they created a segment of the Sims gaming community that is fiercely loyal to Open World and CASt. They created the segment of that community and NOW they're spitting in the face of that community saying that "Oh, Open World was a step too far"...and essentially saying that "You're going to have to take what we give you." essentially telling them that despite the fact that there are other games out there that have been coded for open world, they give us the tripe that Open World is too difficult for the Sims. That's the reason why there is the ire that there is from the TS3 community. We feel snubbed, slighted and being told to "play your game" and "don't criticize ours" makes us extremely angry. We see the potential of the game, yet EA decided, for what reason, to strip the game to its bare bones. THAT IS THE INSULT that we are enraged over. And then to top it off to have an EA executive tell us that "We're Listening"...and see this continue: that enrages us to no end.
Absolutely! EA were happy to take my money when I was buying everything they offered for Sims 3 and then, without a word, swiped it all away from under my nose with Sims 4. And they knew it! Do they care? Well, up to now they don't seem to care at all! Not a word - nothing! They know for sure how many players are unhappy with some of their decisions. It's up to them now to put it right. It's not up to the players. People enjoying Sims 4 shouldn't take it personally when other players voice their unhappiness with the way things have turned out in Sims 4. Disappointed players are not aiming their thoughts at them - they are pointing the finger directly at EA, who know what they should do about it. They should put it right! Either within this particular game or in the next one which I hope they are creating! I just hope that the reason for not seeing much output for Sims 4 is because they're secretly working on a new Sims 5 which has all the things a Sims game should have and not make the same mistake again. When you read all the comments in threads like this, it's obvious that they haven't lost their old and loyal fanbase yet. We're still here complaining, but at least if we are complaining it means we are still here - still loyal - and still waiting for them to put things right.
Now, I will say, I don't fully understand how people can feel personally attacked for liking a game when others give constructive criticisms or facts about the game itself (not the people that play it), but I've heard this sentiment echoed a lot around the forums. I don't understand why it's taken so personally and seen has a bad thing when people want the game to improve, but that's just me.
I think thats part of the issue too, people taking it personally. My criticism against TS4 is not criticism against you as an individual. People take it as that, and some nonfans of TS4 also take it too far. If theres no name calling or malicious speech, then theres no reason to be upset by the critism of the game.
The Sims has currently lost its identity. Bring it back for TS5
The release was bogus. No toddlers, no pools, no ghosts ... there was so much missing out of the base game ... plus the way it was handled with all the 'we can't talk about X' left a bad taste in peoples mouth. People felt deceived and lied to. The PR handling of the game was .... and still is, bad. The release was horrible.
It took out a few key features that were from Sims3, specifically open world and CAST. In many ways, it felt backwards and a throwback to Sims2. While graphically the game is better, the lack of information with no real logical reason as to why it was done. For some of us, the loss of the open world concept isn't that big of a deal, for others it was a deal breaker.
Content and releases. There are times that the game gets ... stagnant with the releases of new content. Add in the price of that content ( EP's costing as much as the base game currently ) with the questionable quality of the content leaves us consumers ... angry. I paid "X" amount for the base game ... now I have to pay that same amount for cats/dogs to make the game feel more complete. That would be acceptable if the thing being released was so ... perfect and flawless, and it just isn't.
Bad decisions, with no logical reasons why. I will use City Living ... which is a great EP, provided you live only in San Myshuno. You can't have apartments in any other city ... why. I can't build an apartment building ... again, why. If I want to have the upstairs of a house be an apartment, I can't. I can't give keys out to other sims unless I own an apartment. So much of a great opportunity just wasted. I can't customize my areas, I can't build as I want to. I can't place things in common areas. I can't modify any of the structures ... no.
I can't wait for seasons to come out ... it makes me wonder if seasons will be tied to a specific town, just like city living and apartments. Sadly, I can see that happening with the way everything else for the game has been done.
If they tie seasons to a specific town, that is when I will be done with Sims 4 for good. I really hope they have good settings for changing the seasons too because I will be annoyed if I am playing one house in Summer and rotate to the next house and it is Fall. I want my all my Sims to experience the season before it changes.
Now, I will say, I don't fully understand how people can feel personally attacked for liking a game when others give constructive criticisms or facts about the game itself (not the people that play it), but I've heard this sentiment echoed a lot around the forums. I don't understand why it's taken so personally and seen has a bad thing when people want the game to improve, but that's just me.
I think thats part of the issue too, people taking it personally. My criticism against TS4 is not criticism against you as an individual. People take it as that, and some nonfans of TS4 also take it too far. If theres no name calling or malicious speech, then theres no reason to be upset by the critism of the game.
Exactly. I don’t understand why people get upset over it. If I say I think the sims 4 whims system is trash for example, that is not an insult to anyone who plays the game. I used to love the sims 4. When I did enjoy it it didn’t bother me one iota that people gave feedback for it. It wasn’t about me as a player. Heck there are loads of video games I like, I don’t care if someone says it’s rubbish, I didn’t play a part in development, why should I feel bad?
I think @DeservedCriticism’s post (Not In this thread but in other threads) about the link to people taking video game failures or criticisms as personal failure is spot on.
So in essence, what you are asking us to do is be satisfied with a game that doesn't meet the expectations of a segment of the Sims playing community. In essence YOU are satisfied with the status quo. In other words, "We like it so don't complain about it...and go back to playing your previous iteration...while we get the benefits of updates and other stuff...essentially: quit complaining." Well I, as a TS3 player, am not satisfied with the STATUS QUO and I EXPECT BETTER from the game that was SUPPOSED to be a sequel to the game I play.
A certain individual stated this to the SWBF2 community however it can very much be applicable here to the Sims community.
We are trying to run the company with an ear to the consumer at all times, not only in the testing phase but when the game is up and running. We're trying to build games that last for years, not for months... If we're not making mistakes along the way and learning from them, that's when you should worry about us.
They are NOT listening to a segment of the consumer base. THEY ARE NOT LEARNING FROM THEIR MISTAKES...and ABOVE ALL THEIR ENTIRE ATTITUDE towards that segment of the consumer base is demeaning and insulting.
If that is the way that they're going to treat their consumer base, my money talks a heck of a lot more than anything I could complain about here. And that's that PLUM will freeze over before I put down good money earned on TS4. And if their intention is to sink the Sims franchise...by not listening to a section of their consumer base THEN SO BE IT!
but you just said yourself your not a segment of the consumer base anymore there making the game for people who like it
not people who want it to be like something else it will never be ts3 just like ts3 will never be ts4 and so on
every sims game is different and the truth is if you don't like it now you likely never will
they said from the start some people will like it some people won't
@Sucom You're right, I shouldn't be so quick to project myself onto others. I was mostly taking into consideration my own feelings when I was explaining how people may be hypersensitive to criticism towards the game and label it as "hate", but I realize that may not be the best approach.
And I believe it when you say you're not directing your posts to any of the players I get that you are unhappy with the way the game is now and are just voicing out your concerns.
@StrawberryYogurt I don't mind others voicing their dislike of the game, nor am I upset by it; and I do still play and enjoy my game very much. I was just giving my perspective on how all the criticisms may drive some ts4 fans away. I admit that I have felt driven away by this forum in the past, but now i'm better at accepting it all as part of the parcel. As for going into the feedback section, I suppose you're right that it's best to avoid it seeing as I don't have much feedback to give anyway, but there are times when a thread catches my attention and I want to offer my input in it. And the overwhelming amount of vitriol there can admittedly be pretty off-putting.
Nevertheless, I'm happy to see passionate members like you around who cares about the future of the game
@aricarai Thank you for hearing me out I don't think it's so much a case of feeling personally attacked by criticism towards the game, but more-so a case of feeling..."alienated" just because your opinions on the game are so vastly different from everyone else's here. It's kind of reminiscent of how we all felt back then when we were so desperate to fit in in high school but just didn't. That, mixed with the sense of feeling "wrong" about liking the game in the face of objective facts against it. At least, that's more accurate for me.
And yeah, lol. This thread probably isn't the best example if I want to point out how criticism always make up the majority of the posts here. And it's good that you're interested in understanding all sides of an argument - you seem to be a very insightful person
So in essence, what you are asking us to do is be satisfied with a game that doesn't meet the expectations of a segment of the Sims playing community. In essence YOU are satisfied with the status quo. In other words, "We like it so don't complain about it...and go back to playing your previous iteration...while we get the benefits of updates and other stuff...essentially: quit complaining." Well I, as a TS3 player, am not satisfied with the STATUS QUO and I EXPECT BETTER from the game that was SUPPOSED to be a sequel to the game I play.
A certain individual stated this to the SWBF2 community however it can very much be applicable here to the Sims community.
We are trying to run the company with an ear to the consumer at all times, not only in the testing phase but when the game is up and running. We're trying to build games that last for years, not for months... If we're not making mistakes along the way and learning from them, that's when you should worry about us.
They are NOT listening to a segment of the consumer base. THEY ARE NOT LEARNING FROM THEIR MISTAKES...and ABOVE ALL THEIR ENTIRE ATTITUDE towards that segment of the consumer base is demeaning and insulting.
If that is the way that they're going to treat their consumer base, my money talks a heck of a lot more than anything I could complain about here. And that's that PLUM will freeze over before I put down good money earned on TS4. And if their intention is to sink the Sims franchise...by not listening to a section of their consumer base THEN SO BE IT!
but you just said yourself your not a segment of the consumer base anymore there making the game for people who like it
not people who want it to be like something else it will never be ts3 just like ts3 will never be ts4 and so on
every sims game is different and the truth is if you don't like it now you likely never will
they said from the start some people will like it some people won't
,,,and that is the problem, @comicsforlife. They created a fanbase that wanted Open World, CASt and flexibility, then they turned around and spit at that fanbase and said that it was "too hard" to do. That is basically a CROCK...seeing the kind of games that they produce for other franchises.
If you're happy to tell those who liked the open world concept "The future Sims iterations will never be like TS3 and you're just going to have to stomach it..." tough... When you alienate an entire segment of a franchise that likes a certain aspect of game-play then you have to suffer the ramifications of an undeniably angered group. I'm sure that "Some will like it; some won't" excuse is good enough for most people who are satisfied with the stripped down game that they received, but we aren't. We expect to see better and that voice is going to increase as dissatisfied members of the TS4 community start to return to their previously liked iterations. And we are seeing that right now. Including several who have returned to TS3.
Always "River McIrish" ...and maybe some Bebe Hart. ~innocent expression~
So in essence, what you are asking us to do is be satisfied with a game that doesn't meet the expectations of a segment of the Sims playing community. In essence YOU are satisfied with the status quo. In other words, "We like it so don't complain about it...and go back to playing your previous iteration...while we get the benefits of updates and other stuff...essentially: quit complaining." Well I, as a TS3 player, am not satisfied with the STATUS QUO and I EXPECT BETTER from the game that was SUPPOSED to be a sequel to the game I play.
A certain individual stated this to the SWBF2 community however it can very much be applicable here to the Sims community.
We are trying to run the company with an ear to the consumer at all times, not only in the testing phase but when the game is up and running. We're trying to build games that last for years, not for months... If we're not making mistakes along the way and learning from them, that's when you should worry about us.
They are NOT listening to a segment of the consumer base. THEY ARE NOT LEARNING FROM THEIR MISTAKES...and ABOVE ALL THEIR ENTIRE ATTITUDE towards that segment of the consumer base is demeaning and insulting.
If that is the way that they're going to treat their consumer base, my money talks a heck of a lot more than anything I could complain about here. And that's that PLUM will freeze over before I put down good money earned on TS4. And if their intention is to sink the Sims franchise...by not listening to a section of their consumer base THEN SO BE IT!
but you just said yourself your not a segment of the consumer base anymore there making the game for people who like it
not people who want it to be like something else it will never be ts3 just like ts3 will never be ts4 and so on
every sims game is different and the truth is if you don't like it now you likely never will
they said from the start some people will like it some people won't
,,,and that is the problem, @comicsforlife. They created a fanbase that wanted Open World, CASt and flexibility, then they turned around and spit at that fanbase and said that it was "too hard" to do. That is basically a CROCK...seeing the kind of games that they produce for other franchises.
If you're happy to tell those who liked the open world concept "The future Sims iterations will never be like TS3 and you're just going to have to stomach it..." tough... When you alienate an entire segment of a franchise that likes a certain aspect of game-play then you have to suffer the ramifications of an undeniably angered group. I'm sure that "Some will like it; some won't" excuse is good enough for most people who are satisfied with the stripped down game that they received, but we aren't. We expect to see better and that voice is going to increase as dissatisfied members of the TS4 community start to return to their previously liked iterations. And we are seeing that right now. Including several who have returned to TS3.
Exactly. They created a game that gave almost unlimited creativity and the current iteration is a step back in that sense. Not being able to recolour every item, every hair colour to your hearts desire and every piece of clothing is a step back. Replacing it with swatches sure isn’t a step forward.
But now they are effectively ignoring those that did enjoy that. And I think almost insulting the fan base by saying a colour wheel isn’t possible for sims but we can have one for cats and dogs? Talk about a kick in the teeth.
So in essence, what you are asking us to do is be satisfied with a game that doesn't meet the expectations of a segment of the Sims playing community. In essence YOU are satisfied with the status quo. In other words, "We like it so don't complain about it...and go back to playing your previous iteration...while we get the benefits of updates and other stuff...essentially: quit complaining." Well I, as a TS3 player, am not satisfied with the STATUS QUO and I EXPECT BETTER from the game that was SUPPOSED to be a sequel to the game I play.
A certain individual stated this to the SWBF2 community however it can very much be applicable here to the Sims community.
We are trying to run the company with an ear to the consumer at all times, not only in the testing phase but when the game is up and running. We're trying to build games that last for years, not for months... If we're not making mistakes along the way and learning from them, that's when you should worry about us.
They are NOT listening to a segment of the consumer base. THEY ARE NOT LEARNING FROM THEIR MISTAKES...and ABOVE ALL THEIR ENTIRE ATTITUDE towards that segment of the consumer base is demeaning and insulting.
If that is the way that they're going to treat their consumer base, my money talks a heck of a lot more than anything I could complain about here. And that's that PLUM will freeze over before I put down good money earned on TS4. And if their intention is to sink the Sims franchise...by not listening to a section of their consumer base THEN SO BE IT!
but you just said yourself your not a segment of the consumer base anymore there making the game for people who like it
not people who want it to be like something else it will never be ts3 just like ts3 will never be ts4 and so on
every sims game is different and the truth is if you don't like it now you likely never will
they said from the start some people will like it some people won't
,,,and that is the problem, @comicsforlife. They created a fanbase that wanted Open World, CASt and flexibility, then they turned around and spit at that fanbase and said that it was "too hard" to do. That is basically a CROCK...seeing the kind of games that they produce for other franchises.
If you're happy to tell those who liked the open world concept "The future Sims iterations will never be like TS3 and you're just going to have to stomach it..." tough... When you alienate an entire segment of a franchise that likes a certain aspect of game-play then you have to suffer the ramifications of an undeniably angered group. I'm sure that "Some will like it; some won't" excuse is good enough for most people who are satisfied with the stripped down game that they received, but we aren't. We expect to see better and that voice is going to increase as dissatisfied members of the TS4 community start to return to their previously liked iterations. And we are seeing that right now. Including several who have returned to TS3.
if I can not prove what they say is untrue beyond a reasonable doubt then I with hold my judgment
if ts4 stops selling they will stop making it but at the moment there happy with how its doing
we can not say for sure which sims game is liked the most
even if we new the sells of each and sims 4 sold the most it would not mean it was liked the most only that it sold more
I don't think they ever said there will never be an open world again I know how you feel I'm a big batman fan and the writers for that right now make me sick what made me feel better though was one of the writers
that was not happy with the way things are going he said this is the way popcultur works and even if they turn your favorite hero in to a monster
as long as you keep them the same in your heart they will never die and things will always come back around
I hope that helps @Nikkei_Simmer
Comments
The purpose of the complaints is not to depress the sims 4 players. Instead, try to get EA's attention to what could be improved so that the sims 4 becomes a much nicer and more enjoyable game. So please stop seeing the sims 4 criticisms as if they were personal criticism. It is not so. Not for me.
Moreover, from my point of view, the sims 4 is not a little fun due to the lack of an open world but due to the lack of functionality and interactivity. Lacks that, after 4 years, can not yet be there.
Its just the lack of experience in gameplay, It would have been better to extinguish herself first then she would not have died, the house burning is not a big deal, things just need to be replaced. Then she could take two showers and, good as new. I was not playing a household, I was just a visitor of the family and my friend's father started a fire, he caught on fire and I thought I could do nothing, but I clicked on him and yes I could extinguish the fire on him.
When someone dies, don't save just exit and return and all is back.
Also, once, while I was not at my home lot but working, I return home and my little dog was dirty, she has been dirty before but this was worst, and my cat had run away. I saw the Butler, she gave me no indication that it had been a fire, that I notice because sims often show a fire bubble in their chat. When I went upstairs later my large bedroom had caught fire. and everything in it was burned. So I understood why my cat ran.
Who said EA doesn't have a sense of humor
the ones in city living aren't as good
and random death like death by satellite and bed and shark
and also I want something like world adventures
I liked that a lot from sims 2 I want fears and slow dancing and death by illness
from sims 1 I want death by hamster
The sad thing is that you're proving everything I said correct. It's not a statement of fact that TS4 is a step back. It's your opinion. I respect it, but that is all it is. It doesn't give you the right to impose that opinion on me or anyone else as actual fact. You are the one speaking for others, not me.
In contrast, what I said about the scapegoating of TS4 is, and I quote myself, "I feel that".
That's not me saying "it is that way." I'm not saying "a lot of people do this" or "everyone thinks this". I'm saying what *I* believe based on the things I read on this forum on a regular basis. I then went on to say "those people" (ie, the ones that, in my opinion, feel that way about TS4 for that reason, act in that manner). At no point did I say everyone who likes TS3 acts that way. I just said that in my opinion there are people who feel that way and thus act in that regard. If that is an incorrect judgement then it is. I can only form my opinion based on the actions of other people, which is what I have done. It's genuinely just me trying to explain why so many people behave in such an incomprehensible way around this game, because otherwise why would you hate on TS4 just because you liked TS3 better? If that isn't the explanation for some of the really hostile behaviour on this forum (including yours), then what is the reason? I can only hypothesise, because frankly, I don't understand it at all.
I am also rather concerned about your inability to discern two different posters and posts in your reply, as well. It sort of indicates you don't see either of us as people, but just 'things to be argued with' because our views maybe contradict your own. I did notice that you only apologised to the other poster, and not to me. I am sure that was an oversight, but it was me you were attacking, and it isn't the first time you've jumped to conclusions about my comments and have launched into attack mode without stopping to find out all the details or read the post properly, either. On that occasion it was because I said I found TS3 unplayable, and you read that as criticism of TS3, rather than an indictment of my old computer, which couldn't cope with running it. Jumping to conclusions and misreading posts seems to be a common theme for you.
On the subject of TS3, I find the whole matter really silly because I remember when TS3 came out. I remember all the bugs and issues with TS2 as well. Because I remember that, I find this debate ridiculous. There was a ton of hostility towards TS3 in the early days, because it was so different to TS2 and there were a bevy of problems related to it. A lot of people abandoned TS3 and went back to TS2 because it was seen as 'better'. But my memories of TS2 (which I genuinely love) is that my gameplay was extensively supported by mods and custom content. I haven't had to do that with TS4. I find I am able to play it without mods and custom content. I don't know if that says something about me as a player or whether it is something about the game, but it's still the case. I will always love TS2, but I can accept TS4 as a relative and play it without any negative grievances. I don't understand the negativity towards TS4. I genuinely don't understand why it matters so much to poke holes in its gameplay at every single possible opportunity. I can understand choosing not to play it because you hate it, or you hate its format, or any of those things. And I can understand being frustrated with bugs, but the Sims has always had bugs in every game of the franchise. If you have played TS from the start, you basically know that TS4's bugs are no worse than those encountered in previous games. The reason I played with so many mods in TS2 was partly on that account.
On the flipside of that, there were just as many people who were absolutely smitten by TS3 and hated on TS2 extensively. TS3 had better graphics, better gameplay, less buggy, etc etc. And so there were disagreements then about the same kind of things. Reality is that they are just different. Equals, yes. I agree with you on that. But different. TS4 is also in my opinion equal, but different. It has strengths in some areas and weaknesses in others, just as its predecessors did. Right now, the bugs are immediately frustrating as they have no obvious fix. And I will say that I know TS4 has come a long way from the bare base game that it began with, adding in things that should have been there from the start. I totally understand people who were annoyed with that.
What I don't understand is why any of this has to become hostile. If it's not about feeling resentful towards EA over TS4 (as actually some of the posts subsequent to mine also indicate, calling the EA approach to pack speed pathetic and so on), then what is it about? I don't see why it's necessary to constantly undermine TS4, and by extension, its players. It's a game and people enjoy it. That's their right, they should be able to do that and post about it without worrying someone's going to rip their head off for daring to like the 'unpopular relation' in the family tree. The game has problems, yes. But it's still in progress, and really they all do. And really, so does life. Honestly, the real world has so many bigger issues to deal with than which TS game is best. I'll reiterate what I said before - whatever your personal preferences, it's absolutely never okay to go in and attack someone else for their preferences or treat them with less respect than you would treat someone who agrees with you. It's ok to disagree with someone, but only if you do so with respect.
I also want to clarify that what I posted above and and what I am posting now is really NOT aimed at 'most people' in this thread. In my opinion up till the last few pages, this thread was genuinely answering and discussing the question raised at the start. I don't have an issue with anyone who has explained their personal reasons for not liking TS4 or the issues they've had in a calm and respectful way. That's fine. It's your opinion. Share it. No reason not to. All those opinions are valid. Also, in the interests of fairness, it is absolutely not ok to call fans of TS3 or people who don't like TS4 names either. That's not cool, I don't support that and nothing I have said is intended to imply that I think it's fine for fans of TS4 to behave like heathens either. It's not an us vs them situation and it never should be. Someone explaining why they like TS3 better than TS4 is not automatically out to get TS4 fans. I think we need the distinction between those who clearly are and those who clearly just want to get their views across (on both 'sides', if we even need sides). It's what I said before - devs are going to be more interested in coherent critical discussion and ideas rather than arguments about what is best.
I'm also 'old' in relative terms to this forum and game, and I prefer TS4 to TS3, so that logic of age is really irrelevant. You like what you like, end of. It's just about how that like is expressed with people of differing perceptions.
What I object to is the steamrollering attempts of a small minority of people to derail this kind of discussion and make it an argument about what game is best, making the whole tone confrontational. People need to have the right to criticise a game or love a game without the fear or risk of being flamebaited or attacked.
@aricarai - yeah, I maybe should have been more clear in my explanation of the TS2 connection. I know there are a lot of in-game details that are different but I am generally okay with accepting that as just how this version of TS is operating. I like some things more in TS4 and I like some things less. That's life, I suppose. I come from another community with stuff that crosses four generations and there has always been some tension involved between fans of different generations, although I have been involved with it for long enough now to be part of a community area where we just embrace all versions and accept they're different and get on with it. But I like - and am very happy - that we can agree to disagree on this
A certain individual stated this to the SWBF2 community however it can very much be applicable here to the Sims community.
They are NOT listening to a segment of the consumer base. THEY ARE NOT LEARNING FROM THEIR MISTAKES...and ABOVE ALL THEIR ENTIRE ATTITUDE towards that segment of the consumer base is demeaning and insulting.
If that is the way that they're going to treat their consumer base, my money talks a heck of a lot more than anything I could complain about here. And that's that PLUM will freeze over before I put down good money earned on TS4. And if their intention is to sink the Sims franchise...by not listening to a section of their consumer base THEN SO BE IT!
Always "River McIrish" ...and maybe some Bebe Hart. ~innocent expression~
However .... I'm disappointed that no matter what traits I give my sims, they all act (and walk) the same the majority of the time. I'm disappointed that I can't colour objects or change the texture of objects myself. (This is a HUGE disappointment for me) I'm disappointed that I can't edit a town - there is no town, and I can't edit the neighbourhood either! That is really not good! It's a major disappointment actually. I can't add a little cafe in the neighbourhood area, I can't add toilets, I can't add a bench so my sims can sit there while I photograph them. My sims can't do anything except walk around it and chat with other sims.
I'm disappointed that my retail shops act out like coffee shop breaks - all the sims huddle together chatting and joking instead of buying what my sim is selling. Retail, as it stands at the moment, is more about selling expensive items that people have to think about, like insurance for example, rather than buying a cake, a newspaper, some groceries or book. I don't know anyone who wants sales talk in their local supermarket or gift shop.
I'm disappointed that I can't add a lot anywhere in a neighbourhood, but am stuck to what is already there.
I'm disappointed that when trying to play a hotel, none of my sims sit in the dining room to eat, preferring to shoot off, plate in hand, and interrupt another sim who is busy doing something else. So instead of using the nice dining room I created, my sims are all over the house, standing up, plate in hand. I'm disappointed that despite building a rather nice kitchen, locked for only my hotel chef, my chef sim took the salad bowl right across to the other side of the house to complete the fruit salad on the bar in the piano lounge and then left it there on the bar.
I'm disappointed that I can't take my sims to town and chat with random people outside the book store, or pop into the consignment store to sell some stuff. I'm disappointed my sims can't take handiness classes or gardening classes or meet up outside the local bistro where sims can meet up and sit outside or even take a cooking class. I'm disappointed they can't take a tour backstage at the town hall or theatre. I'm disappointed there are no police, firemen or postmen around - there's never anything in my post box. Whenever I check it, it says nothing has arrived. I'm disappointed that I can't register my author/painter sim as self employed - they're unemployed apparently. I'm disappointed there is no graveyard, and no accessible police station or hospital. I'm disappointed there is no school. Or cars. Or bikes. Or travelling around anywhere except walk.
Mostly, I'm finding it very difficult to keep building the same houses over and over again that 'have' to match up with the surrounding neighbourhood. It's becoming boring. No more can I add a tiny lot up on a cliff, or between those houses, or down there on the beach as in Sunset Valley. I was so used to visiting Sunset Valley, I actually felt I knew all the sims there - it was like going home. Sims 4 doesn't feel like this. It's impersonal. And I'm afraid it doesn't keep my interest for long.
I could go on like this for ages - it's just so darn disappointing, despite all the excellent improvements. Oh well......
It gets especially painful when you see comments like "EA is ripping us off with this game"/"this game is nothing but a cash-grab" being thrown around. These commentors are probably just being objective when saying that, sure, but to us, it makes us feel as if we're liking something that's not meant to be liked - as if we've fallen in love with a rip-off; a farce. The mere ploy of a company to get more money. Perhaps this makes you mad, but then what can you say back to them? That "they're being disrespectful"? But they're just being objective. That "it's not a cash-grab/rip-off?". Then you'll be seen as defending the company, because unfortunately the facts aren't on your side, so you'll be deemed foolish in doing so.
But enough with that self-defeating attitude; let's just talk about this forum itself. So, why do some ts4 fans feel alienated here? It makes no sense. We've got lots of threads just for fans of the game out there to share their experiences - we've got the "What happened in your game today?" thread, we've got some screenshots threads, and if we're lucky, we may even get the occasional "what do you like about ts4" sort of threads that we could spill all our love into. But what if we wanna step out of that? What if we want to partake in some actual discussion? Actually, scratch that, what if we just want to experience a bit of the "S4 PC Feedback" or "Rumor and Speculations" threads? I don't care what anyone else here says; it's clear as day that criticisms are generally much more welcomed here than praise. Just look at this thread alone, observe how posts with the most critical tones get the highest number of "Likes", "Awesomes", etc., and observe how posts with supportive tones towards the game receive much less appraisal than that. "So what?", you say, "that just goes to show how unhappy people are with the game" - yes, that is the point. The reason why so many ts4 fans feel almost afraid to step in here. You can argue with me all you like, but the truth of the matter remains - we feel outnumbered, we feel alienated, and we certainly don't feel welcomed here. And the most confusing, annoying part for us is that there's no one to blame. Disappointed people can't help how they feel; so we can't blame them if whatever input we provide here is just going to stick out like a sore thumb - there's really nothing we can do about it. The only thing we can do here is to help ourselves by growing a thicker skin or just leaving as @Gruffman says. And some of us just don't like being limited to options like that.
I'm sorry if all of this comes off as guilt-tripping, that really isn't my intention. Just, as someone who has constantly felt this way ever since joining these forums, I just want to say that I can totally see how people who like ts4 would feel hyper-sensitive to criticism towards it and see all of it as "hate", when people here are just really passionate about the game improving and are thus voicing their disappointment. It's irrational, yes, but it is what it is.
Quote: 'The reason why so many ts4 fans feel almost afraid to step in here. You can argue with me all you like, but the truth of the matter remains - we feel outnumbered, we feel alienated, and we certainly don't feel welcomed here. And the most confusing, annoying part for us is that there's no one to blame. Disappointed people can't help how they feel; so we can't blame them if whatever input we provide here is just going to stick out like a sore thumb - there's really nothing we can do about it. The only thing we can do here is to help ourselves by growing a thicker skin or just leaving as @Gruffman says. And some of us just don't like being limited to options like that.'
It might more accurate to say 'I' instead of 'we'. It can't be nice for players who are enjoying the game to find it being spoilt by players who are not enjoying the game. But the reverse is also true. It can't be nice for players who are disappointed with the game to find happy players berating them for being unhappy. It's actually quite sad that EA pulled in long term fans with previous versions of the game and then dropped them like hot bricks with Sims 4. I am one of those players - EA pulled me in with Sims 3 with all the unlimited gameplay and building opportunities and then shoved me away without so much as a backward glance. They literally took away nearly everything that caused me to become a fan in the first place.
Any player who is disappointed in Sims 4 is not thinking about the players who enjoy playing Sims 4, believe me! This has nothing to do with other players' enjoyment - my posts are not addressed to other players but to EA themselves. It's about the disappointed players' enjoyment. When I just wrote my last post, I wasn't thinking about other players enjoying the game. I was speaking from the heart about why it isn't working for me and the reason I did that is because I truly do want to enjoy the game again. I spent hours and hours and hours on Sims 3 and was really looking forward to Sims 4. Now, it's left this massive hole in my gaming life which I would like to fill up again. Other players don't have the power to do this - EA have that power and it is to EA that I address my thoughts.
Always "River McIrish" ...and maybe some Bebe Hart. ~innocent expression~
Personality,depth,humor,consequences,lore,customization.
@Lavenderlights - this was an interesting read and I gave it an insightful because it's confirmation of what I see a lot of around the forums and explained what others feel - even though it's not something I fully wrap my head around.
Now, I will say, I don't fully understand how people can feel personally attacked for liking a game when others give constructive criticisms or facts about the game itself (not the people that play it), but I've heard this sentiment echoed a lot around the forums. I don't understand why it's taken so personally and seen has a bad thing when people want the game to improve, but that's just me. If someone slates TS3, I just let them get on with it and respond with my opinions or views if I'm so inclined. It really doesn't affect me when people don't like TS3, but that's just me and obviously others react to things differently than myself. I find perspectives on both sides of the spectrum to be really interesting - I always want to know why someone might dislike a specific game or really love one - I find things like that super insightful.
Referencing the part of yours that I bolded: you probably didn't use the best example by talking about this thread. If you look at the OP and the title of this thread, people are answering the question in the title, which is going to be answered in a "critical" way. There's not many answers in here that out and out scream "I LOVE TS4" because that's not really what the OP wanted to know.
I'm glad you can see it, too, as people being passionate about the game improving! As someone else said, the people would post constructive criticism and give feedback wouldn't be here if they didn't love this franchise!
Would anyone really hate it, for instance, if whims were based on aspirations and what the sim's current interest is? (inc dreaded Sims 3 comparison since I just recently stopped playing 4 because of bugs and started playing 3 again) Playing Sims 3 for just a few hours (I'm not plagued by many of the bugs there that plague others because I use mods for any game I play), I'm reminded how much better the whims/wishes are in Sims 3. The wishes seem inspired by current mood, but specific as to what is causing this mood (disliking someone leads them to want to see the particular sim dead or wanting to get into a fight with them; cheating on someone prompts wishes to apologize to that sim); the lifetime wish; traits; and what they've been currently doing. I have a bookworm/author sim going on in Sims 3, and she keeps getting wishes to read x amount of books and to write certain genres of books. Their thought bubbles are germaine to whatever is going on at the moment. Their dream bubbles are a lot more focused on both the here-and-now and the future. There is even fear, and reactions to things that scare you.
I wish they would also bring back the animations. Sims 3 dropped a lot of them from Sims 2, but Sims 4 dropped even more. Bring back some of the romantic interactions that are now gone. Bring back the ability to do more things together.
Even without the above (and I can't imagine people would not like a Sims 4 which had those), Sims 4 is very buggy. The same thing that people objected about earlier iterations has come to plague Sims 4. And the bugs in Sims 4 that I'm coming across are frustrating to the point where I just shut off the game and moved onto something different. I never had that happen in either Sims 2 or Sims 3. I've been frustrated by their bugs as well, but mods could keep them in check.
Wow now multitasking makes sense. They are not really multitasking. I kept wondering why is it taking Sims so long to do stuff when they are chatting and why they removed social from the bowling. They are literally stop to do one task and then the next.
I have noticed when I take my Sims to a restaurant they usually finish their drink then start eating and chatting stops then from eating and then they resume. There is definitely an illusion of multitasking but you are right @DragonCat159, they are not multitasking.
Absolutely! EA were happy to take my money when I was buying everything they offered for Sims 3 and then, without a word, swiped it all away from under my nose with Sims 4. And they knew it! Do they care? Well, up to now they don't seem to care at all! Not a word - nothing! They know for sure how many players are unhappy with some of their decisions. It's up to them now to put it right. It's not up to the players. People enjoying Sims 4 shouldn't take it personally when other players voice their unhappiness with the way things have turned out in Sims 4. Disappointed players are not aiming their thoughts at them - they are pointing the finger directly at EA, who know what they should do about it. They should put it right! Either within this particular game or in the next one which I hope they are creating! I just hope that the reason for not seeing much output for Sims 4 is because they're secretly working on a new Sims 5 which has all the things a Sims game should have and not make the same mistake again. When you read all the comments in threads like this, it's obvious that they haven't lost their old and loyal fanbase yet. We're still here complaining, but at least if we are complaining it means we are still here - still loyal - and still waiting for them to put things right.
I think thats part of the issue too, people taking it personally. My criticism against TS4 is not criticism against you as an individual. People take it as that, and some nonfans of TS4 also take it too far. If theres no name calling or malicious speech, then theres no reason to be upset by the critism of the game.
Personality,depth,humor,consequences,lore,customization.
If they tie seasons to a specific town, that is when I will be done with Sims 4 for good. I really hope they have good settings for changing the seasons too because I will be annoyed if I am playing one house in Summer and rotate to the next house and it is Fall. I want my all my Sims to experience the season before it changes.
Exactly. I don’t understand why people get upset over it. If I say I think the sims 4 whims system is trash for example, that is not an insult to anyone who plays the game. I used to love the sims 4. When I did enjoy it it didn’t bother me one iota that people gave feedback for it. It wasn’t about me as a player. Heck there are loads of video games I like, I don’t care if someone says it’s rubbish, I didn’t play a part in development, why should I feel bad?
I think @DeservedCriticism’s post (Not In this thread but in other threads) about the link to people taking video game failures or criticisms as personal failure is spot on.
but you just said yourself your not a segment of the consumer base anymore there making the game for people who like it
not people who want it to be like something else it will never be ts3 just like ts3 will never be ts4 and so on
every sims game is different and the truth is if you don't like it now you likely never will
they said from the start some people will like it some people won't
And I believe it when you say you're not directing your posts to any of the players
@StrawberryYogurt I don't mind others voicing their dislike of the game, nor am I upset by it; and I do still play and enjoy my game very much. I was just giving my perspective on how all the criticisms may drive some ts4 fans away. I admit that I have felt driven away by this forum in the past, but now i'm better at accepting it all as part of the parcel. As for going into the feedback section, I suppose you're right that it's best to avoid it seeing as I don't have much feedback to give anyway, but there are times when a thread catches my attention and I want to offer my input in it. And the overwhelming amount of vitriol there can admittedly be pretty off-putting.
Nevertheless, I'm happy to see passionate members like you around who cares about the future of the game
@aricarai Thank you for hearing me out
And yeah, lol. This thread probably isn't the best example if I want to point out how criticism always make up the majority of the posts here. And it's good that you're interested in understanding all sides of an argument - you seem to be a very insightful person
EDIT: Thought of a better way to put things.
,,,and that is the problem, @comicsforlife. They created a fanbase that wanted Open World, CASt and flexibility, then they turned around and spit at that fanbase and said that it was "too hard" to do. That is basically a CROCK...seeing the kind of games that they produce for other franchises.
If you're happy to tell those who liked the open world concept "The future Sims iterations will never be like TS3 and you're just going to have to stomach it..." tough... When you alienate an entire segment of a franchise that likes a certain aspect of game-play then you have to suffer the ramifications of an undeniably angered group. I'm sure that "Some will like it; some won't" excuse is good enough for most people who are satisfied with the stripped down game that they received, but we aren't. We expect to see better and that voice is going to increase as dissatisfied members of the TS4 community start to return to their previously liked iterations. And we are seeing that right now. Including several who have returned to TS3.
Always "River McIrish" ...and maybe some Bebe Hart. ~innocent expression~
Exactly. They created a game that gave almost unlimited creativity and the current iteration is a step back in that sense. Not being able to recolour every item, every hair colour to your hearts desire and every piece of clothing is a step back. Replacing it with swatches sure isn’t a step forward.
But now they are effectively ignoring those that did enjoy that. And I think almost insulting the fan base by saying a colour wheel isn’t possible for sims but we can have one for cats and dogs? Talk about a kick in the teeth.
if I can not prove what they say is untrue beyond a reasonable doubt then I with hold my judgment
if ts4 stops selling they will stop making it but at the moment there happy with how its doing
we can not say for sure which sims game is liked the most
even if we new the sells of each and sims 4 sold the most it would not mean it was liked the most only that it sold more
I don't think they ever said there will never be an open world again I know how you feel I'm a big batman fan and the writers for that right now make me sick what made me feel better though was one of the writers
that was not happy with the way things are going he said this is the way popcultur works and even if they turn your favorite hero in to a monster
as long as you keep them the same in your heart they will never die and things will always come back around
I hope that helps @Nikkei_Simmer