But we all must realize that our memories most often are not entirely accurate. Nostalgia has a way of deceiving us into thinking that "the good old days" were better than they actually were. I remember how I was disappointed with Sims 2 because it did not give me the same enjoyment as Sims 1. It felt like something was missing. Same for Sims 3. Sims 4 may be step back in some peoples eyes, but in my opinion the sims themselves are better. Just my opinion though. Could Sims 4 be better? Sure. Will it get better? Time will tell.
But we all must realize that our memories most often are not entirely accurate. Nostalgia has a way of deceiving us into thinking that "the good old days" were better than they actually were. I remember how I was disappointed with Sims 2 because it did not give me the same enjoyment as Sims 1. It felt like something was missing. Same for Sims 3. Sims 4 may be step back in some peoples eyes, but in my opinion the sims themselves are better. Just my opinion though. Could Sims 4 be better? Sure. Will it get better? Time will tell.
True memory is flawed more than not. However, if you play all the games from time to time then it has nothing to do with memory and you can make sound judgment of what's good about a new game or not.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
Personally I like that kind of stuff for my sims. The careers seems neat. I'll find out soon!
I like the GTW careers, but they should give those who don't want to do what is set up to do their own thing. I however like it set up the way it is. And, I'm not big on questing.
Sure. Everyone's judgement is different though. I feel that the humor was the best in Sims 1. It's over the top campiness was hilarious to me. The simlish was always funny and I never got tired of listening to it. For me Sims 2 lacked that. But Sims 2 was a great game in other ways. I loved Sims 3 for the open world and CAST, but that also seemed to make the game more difficult for my computer to handle. The sims in Sims 3 were the worst for me. They looked and acted totally artificial from my perspective. I could never get into playing them and would give up after a short time. Even after I spent weeks setting up the world to play in. The sims in Sims 4 look and act so much better. Could they be better? Sure. But that is true about everything. The game runs smoothly on my computer and I rarely get any corruption of a save file like I did in Sims 3. So far I am liking the direction that Sims 4 is going in. Am I happy about all of the decisions the development team is making? No. But they have their reasons for making the decisions they make. When I played Sims 3 I never connected to the Internet. My play style was not recorded in their telemetry. After reading that telemetry played a large role in many of their design decisions I now connect to the Net when I play Sims 4. Some people do not like that, but that is how they make their design decisions. People can voice their complaints with this game on the forums all they want, but that is not the voice that gets heard.
@danacnbrett I feel the same, that the Sims themselves are better. I feel like they have so much more character! I could use some more personality customisation though, like more aspirations and traits, and maybe things like the TS2 turn-ons where you can choose what your sim finds attractive, or interests that I can set in CAS. But I find the Sims so much more engaging than in previous games.
@danacnbrett I feel the same, that the Sims themselves are better. I feel like they have so much more character! I could use some more personality customisation though, like more aspirations and traits, and maybe things like the TS2 turn-ons where you can choose what your sim finds attractive, or interests that I can set in CAS. But I find the Sims so much more engaging than in previous games.
@danacnbrett I feel the same, that the Sims themselves are better. I feel like they have so much more character! I could use some more personality customisation though, like more aspirations and traits, and maybe things like the TS2 turn-ons where you can choose what your sim finds attractive, or interests that I can set in CAS. But I find the Sims so much more engaging than in previous games.
I think what you are describing is over the top animations that convey personality. I have yet to see anything unique about any of these sims. Every single one of them will have the exact same reactions to the exact same situations. They will never deviate from the "standard". The traits mean absolutely zilch. Their memories have nothing to do with their lives and do not shape who they become. Their whims also have nothing to do with their lives. What TS4 sims are is a highly customizable robot, but a robot nonetheless. Not even decent AI to go with it.
Stop on your tracks! It's not quests. It's WORK. Everyone has assignments in real life. I'm sure you could call doing your work "questing" because you usually do predetermined chores for someone. It's still miles better than disappearing on the edge of the lot or in a rabbithole.
Stop on your tracks! It's not quests. It's WORK. Everyone has assignments in real life. I'm sure you could call doing your work "questing" because you usually do predetermined chores for someone. It's still miles better than disappearing on the edge of the lot or in a rabbithole.
depends, if my predetermined tasks are not on the same neighborhood as the rest of my family, the rest of my family will dumb themselves and forget to do their things. So in TS4 it's not better unless you're playing one sim :I
Also not everyone's work involves tasks outside of work. My job might, but for example my significant other is an admin and he doesn't get assignments outside of work hours.
@danacnbrett I feel the same, that the Sims themselves are better. I feel like they have so much more character! I could use some more personality customisation though, like more aspirations and traits, and maybe things like the TS2 turn-ons where you can choose what your sim finds attractive, or interests that I can set in CAS. But I find the Sims so much more engaging than in previous games.
I think what you are describing is over the top animations that convey personality. I have yet to see anything unique about any of these sims. Every single one of them will have the exact same reactions to the exact same situations. They will never deviate from the "standard". The traits mean absolutely zilch. Their memories have nothing to do with their lives and do not shape who they become. Their whims also have nothing to do with their lives. What TS4 sims are is a highly customizable robot, but a robot nonetheless. Not even decent AI to go with it.
I do understand this perspective and I partially agree with some of the points. As I said, I would like some more tailoring and customisation for personalities, and I'd appreciate a fourth trait slot because then I could pick a trait from each category.
However, I like the animations a lot. I really do. And I like being able to see the Sims' emotions on their faces and in their physical language. When they pull a face, it makes me laugh, and I like to think up a reason why they might be feeling that way. Are they upset with another Sim? Did something happen that could explain why they feel that way? It's as though they have their inner thoughts and feelings, and I feel that gives them real character. It's as thought I have control over their actions, but not their thoughts, and that makes them feel more 'alive' to me. I get very quickly emotionally invested in their lives.
This is my favourite series, and this is mainly because I feel connected to my Sims in a way I never have before. For all the stuff I had in TS3, I never felt connected to my Sims, they felt very robotic to me: pausing and standing around blankly as the processor tried to load the next interaction; walking robotically from point a to b; getting stuck behind a plate; I never liked the way they looked; the camera was terrible and I struggled to get the right angle; all sims had the same animation for the same interaction... the Sims were cold and their every move was calculable.
And I do not find they have the exact same reaction to the same interaction, in fact, this was a complaint I had about TS3 and I find I could play out the same scenario with several Sims and have a different experience each time because of the emotions, and because of the animations, and because there's just the right amount of unpredictability which means an NPC might do something a little bit crazy.
Ok... so you don't like the game. I get it. But what I was describing was my experience of the game, and my personal reaction to it. What I was describing was how the game appeals to the things that I feel are important, and how the game addressed important issues I had with TS3. Does it tick all my boxes? No. And so I will continue to vocalise the aspects that I think could be improved. And if they want to add more over the top animations in the future then that works for me because my Sims are expressive, and emotional, and amusing, and wonderful.
edits: due to early-morning, pre-caffeine spelling errors.
Stop on your tracks! It's not quests. It's WORK. Everyone has assignments in real life. I'm sure you could call doing your work "questing" because you usually do predetermined chores for someone. It's still miles better than disappearing on the edge of the lot or in a rabbithole.
I agree with this. Also the sims 3 careers all had quests except they were called opportunities but it was things you had to do if you wanted that promotion or raise your grade in school. So it's not new in the sims 4 by any stretch.
@danacnbrett I feel the same, that the Sims themselves are better. I feel like they have so much more character! I could use some more personality customisation though, like more aspirations and traits, and maybe things like the TS2 turn-ons where you can choose what your sim finds attractive, or interests that I can set in CAS. But I find the Sims so much more engaging than in previous games.
I think what you are describing is over the top animations that convey personality. I have yet to see anything unique about any of these sims. Every single one of them will have the exact same reactions to the exact same situations. They will never deviate from the "standard". The traits mean absolutely zilch. Their memories have nothing to do with their lives and do not shape who they become. Their whims also have nothing to do with their lives. What TS4 sims are is a highly customizable robot, but a robot nonetheless. Not even decent AI to go with it.
I do understand this perspective and I partially agree with some of the points. As I said, I would like some more tailoring and customisation for personalities, and I'd appreciate a fourth trait slot because then I could pick a trait from each category.
However, I like the animations a lot. I really do. And I like being able to see the Sims' emotions on their faces and in their physical language. When they pull a face, it makes me laugh, and I like to think up a reason why they might be feeling that way. Are they upset with another Sim? Did something happen that could explain why they feel that way? It's as though they have their inner thoughts and feelings, and I feel that gives them real character. It's as thought I have control over their actions, but not their thoughts, and that makes them feel more 'alive' to me. I get very quickly emotionally invested in their lives.
This is my favourite series, and this is mainly because I feel connected to my Sims in a way I never have before. For all the stuff I had in TS3, I never felt connected to my Sims, they felt very robotic to me: pausing and standing around blankly as the processor tried to load the next interaction; walking robotically from point a to b; getting stuck behind a plate; I never liked the way they looked; the camera was terrible and I struggled to get the right angle; all sims had the same animation for the same interaction... the Sims were cold and their every move was calculable.
And I do not find they have the exact same reaction to the same interaction, in fact, this was a complaint I had about TS3 and I find I could play out the same scenario with several Sims and have a different experience each time because of the emotions, and because of the animations, and because there's just the right amount of unpredictability which means an NPC might do something a little bit crazy.
Ok... so you don't like the game. I get it. But what I was describing was my experience of the game, and my personal reaction to it. What I was describing was how the game appeals to the things that I feel are important, and how the game addressed important issues I had with TS3. Does it tick all my boxes? No. And so I will continue to vocalise the aspects that I think could be improved. And if they want to add more over the top animations in the future then that works for me because my Sims are expressive, and emotional, and amusing, and wonderful.
edits: due to early-morning, pre-caffeine spelling errors.
Again. I couldn't agree with you more. Sims 4 sims are the best of the series. They could use a little more tweeking but still better than the past 3 versions.
Stop on your tracks! It's not quests. It's WORK. Everyone has assignments in real life. I'm sure you could call doing your work "questing" because you usually do predetermined chores for someone. It's still miles better than disappearing on the edge of the lot or in a rabbithole.
I agree with this. Also the sims 3 careers all had quests except they were called opportunities but it was things you had to do if you wanted that promotion or raise your grade in school. So it's not new in the sims 4 by any stretch.
Very true. Even Sims 1 had goals you had to achieve if you wanted a promotion. How is having to reach a certain level in a skill or having to befriend a certain number of friends any different to having to perform certain tasks? It is not different. The only difference is how it is displayed in the U.I..
@danacnbrett I feel the same, that the Sims themselves are better. I feel like they have so much more character! I could use some more personality customisation though, like more aspirations and traits, and maybe things like the TS2 turn-ons where you can choose what your sim finds attractive, or interests that I can set in CAS. But I find the Sims so much more engaging than in previous games.
I think what you are describing is over the top animations that convey personality. I have yet to see anything unique about any of these sims. Every single one of them will have the exact same reactions to the exact same situations. They will never deviate from the "standard". The traits mean absolutely zilch. Their memories have nothing to do with their lives and do not shape who they become. Their whims also have nothing to do with their lives. What TS4 sims are is a highly customizable robot, but a robot nonetheless. Not even decent AI to go with it.
I do understand this perspective and I partially agree with some of the points. As I said, I would like some more tailoring and customisation for personalities, and I'd appreciate a fourth trait slot because then I could pick a trait from each category.
However, I like the animations a lot. I really do. And I like being able to see the Sims' emotions on their faces and in their physical language. When they pull a face, it makes me laugh, and I like to think up a reason why they might be feeling that way. Are they upset with another Sim? Did something happen that could explain why they feel that way? It's as though they have their inner thoughts and feelings, and I feel that gives them real character. It's as thought I have control over their actions, but not their thoughts, and that makes them feel more 'alive' to me. I get very quickly emotionally invested in their lives.
This is my favourite series, and this is mainly because I feel connected to my Sims in a way I never have before. For all the stuff I had in TS3, I never felt connected to my Sims, they felt very robotic to me: pausing and standing around blankly as the processor tried to load the next interaction; walking robotically from point a to b; getting stuck behind a plate; I never liked the way they looked; the camera was terrible and I struggled to get the right angle; all sims had the same animation for the same interaction... the Sims were cold and their every move was calculable.
And I do not find they have the exact same reaction to the same interaction, in fact, this was a complaint I had about TS3 and I find I could play out the same scenario with several Sims and have a different experience each time because of the emotions, and because of the animations, and because there's just the right amount of unpredictability which means an NPC might do something a little bit crazy.
Ok... so you don't like the game. I get it. But what I was describing was my experience of the game, and my personal reaction to it. What I was describing was how the game appeals to the things that I feel are important, and how the game addressed important issues I had with TS3. Does it tick all my boxes? No. And so I will continue to vocalise the aspects that I think could be improved. And if they want to add more over the top animations in the future then that works for me because my Sims are expressive, and emotional, and amusing, and wonderful.
edits: due to early-morning, pre-caffeine spelling errors.
See I had a very different experience from you. My favorite game of the series was TS2. It was very easy to get into and all of my sims were unique in their responses to the world around them. I mean sure the animations were the same, but they had different idles and their wants were based on player choices. I could have two romance sims, one that was a player and one that had been faithful to his girlfriend since highschool. The player would roll all the wants to woohoo the town while the faithful would roll wants to go on dates with and woohoo his significant other. Their memories would be different. So their lives would be different.
I was not a fan of TS3 at all. Like you, they were very robotic to me. I hated that pause they did before moving on to another interaction. I complained about it a lot actually. I was looking forward to TS4 since about the time WA came out and was all RPG-ish (which is my least favorite genre of game).
Well when TS4 came out I gave it a very long try. I tried and tried. Even changed my play style to accommodate culling and other issues I had. But to me, these sims were the most robotic of any of the games. As a person who generally plays a whole town, it annoyed me right off the bat that the sims walking around in the open areas were just illusionary fodder. In the early code, I remember that the game had to generate x amount of emotions. It was like 1 angry, 3 sad, the rest happy. I can't remember exactly. But that bothered me because those sims weren't feeling emotional responses from a situation, they were just generated like that for no apparent reason. Then my own sims didn't have any personality, at least not to me. They all pulled the same faces. They all acted the same no matter the traits. And eventually I felt like you played one, you played them all. I got really bored with TS4. Now obviously we play very differently. I am a simulation player who enjoys rotating through the world. TS4 does not offer anything for me.
And now I gave TS3 another go just because it is complete and I feel ok modding core parts of it. For example, I reduced the size of bounding boxes so there are fewer collisions and foot tapping. Actually got rid of the foot tap animation altogether. And then added a bunch of mods from the community. And that made the game much more enjoyable for me. I have definitely grown to appreciate TS3's merits more than I used to. And they still don't have the same level of responses as TS2 did, but they do better than TS4 sims for me. With a house full of kids, they aren't all the same. I have had one kid that painted all the time. On his own. Then he started to roll wants to visit the gallery, take painting classes, etc. One of his siblings liked the drum toy. She was the only one to ever use it. One was always cleaning up after everyone. Those were all autonomous interactions which I felt defined their character. It got me attached to them so that when they grew up into adults, I felt like I watched who they became. I knew what kind of sims they'd want to date and who wouldn't work out with them. For me that makes a more interesting sim life.
I agree with this. Also the sims 3 careers all had quests except they were called opportunities but it was things you had to do if you wanted that promotion or raise your grade in school. So it's not new in the sims 4 by any stretch.
I would say TS3 was the most flexible when it came to how you play. You didn't have to accept or do a single opportunity to get promoted, it was a way to get extra money/ relationship, or get promoted faster. There were tasks, such as having a relationship with your boss, or charisma at a certain level, however you could get promoted without having that. As your preparation was rated in different levels, as long as you went to work in good mood, chose to work hard and didn't have everything else in absolute red (for example, if I need to have 6 charisma points, but I have 4 that puts me into good-neutral, meaning it will not influence my performance badly when I go to work) you could get promoted.
Yeah, I can see what people mean when they talk about the wants and wishes of their Sims. I did like that the TS2 wishes were usually more tailored to their lifetime aspiration and personality. TS3 was terrible because they'd update the wishes to increase the chance of wishing for new features whenever there was a new pack, so it got a bit spammy and was more based on what was new, rather than what your Sim wanted. Honestly, I think I started ignoring the wants while playing TS3, and so I barely take note of them now, so I guess it doesn't bother me as much as it does others (I've seen/heard it mentioned by several players). But it should definitely be tweaked to be more personality based.
I did like WA, and I did like the quests, but what felt restrictive to me was that I couldn't just take a family vacation to the new worlds. It would have been better if Sims could just travel freely to the worlds, but have the option to explore tombs and complete quests if they wanted to. I'm ok with optional quests and challenges, but as long as they don't restrict more sandbox style play.
I quite like that townies wander round in different moods, again I like to imagine what had happened to them to put them in that mood, and work it into my story-line if I can. Is Nancy mad because an art deal fell through? Is Katrina flirty because she's heading out to a night on the town? I remember when I first got the game I'd forget about my active family because I was so amused just people-watching! I'm a rotational player and it's strange because my various Sims usually autonomously act in the way I'd choose for them to act. It's like the game just knows what personality I have in mind for them. I'm sorry that your experience is so different to mine, because I really wish everyone could enjoy it as much as I do.
Oh, did you mod out the foot tapping? I saw that in one of Ani's LPs. Is it the one that replaces it with a personality idle instead? I do still love TS3, and it really is a great game. I miss so much of my content. But I go back to it and (for me) it's so laggy and feels so robotic. And I miss so much from TS4. I remember when I first heard TS4 didn't have an open world or a colour wheel I was so mad! I didn't think I could ever love it without those things. But having played it for so long now, I can see the merits, because I go back to TS3 and it is painfully slow to load things! CAS takes an age (even with Nraas) and the open world is frustrating as I switch to another lot and then have to impatiently pause while the lots render. Admittedly, I do try and run it with ALL THE THINGS!!! and if I took out my store content and mods it would be quicker. But then why play it if I have to uninstall things? I do still play it... but it's just so clunky. :-(
I loved TS2 at the time (I was one of the ones who raged against TS3 at first) but again, when I go back to it, the graphics are so bad, CAS is inferior, and it honestly just bores me so quickly now. People say it had so much more, and that TS4 gives us less content per pack, but I don't think that's true. I would concede that TS2 retail and apartments go more in-depth, but then we didn't get open careers with OFB, and we didn't get festivals with Apartment Life. Perhaps they spread their time more broadly with TS4, or perhaps we just have higher expectations, I don't know. I wish things were 'perfect' but I don't think that's a realistic mindset. I figure it's better to vocalise what I do and do not like, and what could be done to improve the areas I feel aren't up to scratch. I feel it's more productive to pull my socks up and say, 'right, what can we do about this', than lament what could have been.
Yeah, I can see what people mean when they talk about the wants and wishes of their Sims. I did like that the TS2 wishes were usually more tailored to their lifetime aspiration and personality. TS3 was terrible because they'd update the wishes to increase the chance of wishing for new features whenever there was a new pack, so it got a bit spammy and was more based on what was new, rather than what your Sim wanted. Honestly, I think I started ignoring the wants while playing TS3, and so I barely take note of them now, so I guess it doesn't bother me as much as it does others (I've seen/heard it mentioned by several players). But it should definitely be tweaked to be more personality based.
from my experience my sims would only wish for what I would make them do. On my werewolf sim I started transforming her often to play with the werewolf itself a bit, a few transforms later she started wishing to transform. My genie sim had no wish to do anything with the water until I sent him snorkeling and he found a seashell. Now he wants to find more seashells. All of my couples with a good relationship tend to want to spend time together. All my sims that I'm pushing hard at their careers develop wishes to get promoted.
With TS4 I tend to get completely random wishes. If my sim is inspired and they're an aspiring cook, they will want to paint instead of cook. Often times children will have too adult wishes with things like "let's relax in the mud bath!".
I agree with this. Also the sims 3 careers all had quests except they were called opportunities but it was things you had to do if you wanted that promotion or raise your grade in school. So it's not new in the sims 4 by any stretch.
I would say TS3 was the most flexible when it came to how you play. You didn't have to accept or do a single opportunity to get promoted, it was a way to get extra money/ relationship, or get promoted faster. There were tasks, such as having a relationship with your boss, or charisma at a certain level, however you could get promoted without having that. As your preparation was rated in different levels, as long as you went to work in good mood, chose to work hard and didn't have everything else in absolute red (for example, if I need to have 6 charisma points, but I have 4 that puts me into good-neutral, meaning it will not influence my performance badly when I go to work) you could get promoted.
This. I almost never did any of the opportunities and my sims still got promotions and raises all the time. Show up and work...that's really all it took. Took longer than if you went that extra mile, but it would still happen.
Yeah, I can see what people mean when they talk about the wants and wishes of their Sims. I did like that the TS2 wishes were usually more tailored to their lifetime aspiration and personality. TS3 was terrible because they'd update the wishes to increase the chance of wishing for new features whenever there was a new pack, so it got a bit spammy and was more based on what was new, rather than what your Sim wanted. Honestly, I think I started ignoring the wants while playing TS3, and so I barely take note of them now, so I guess it doesn't bother me as much as it does others (I've seen/heard it mentioned by several players). But it should definitely be tweaked to be more personality based.
I did like WA, and I did like the quests, but what felt restrictive to me was that I couldn't just take a family vacation to the new worlds. It would have been better if Sims could just travel freely to the worlds, but have the option to explore tombs and complete quests if they wanted to. I'm ok with optional quests and challenges, but as long as they don't restrict more sandbox style play.
I quite like that townies wander round in different moods, again I like to imagine what had happened to them to put them in that mood, and work it into my story-line if I can. Is Nancy mad because an art deal fell through? Is Katrina flirty because she's heading out to a night on the town? I remember when I first got the game I'd forget about my active family because I was so amused just people-watching! I'm a rotational player and it's strange because my various Sims usually autonomously act in the way I'd choose for them to act. It's like the game just knows what personality I have in mind for them. I'm sorry that your experience is so different to mine, because I really wish everyone could enjoy it as much as I do.
Oh, did you mod out the foot tapping? I saw that in one of Ani's LPs. Is it the one that replaces it with a personality idle instead? I do still love TS3, and it really is a great game. I miss so much of my content. But I go back to it and (for me) it's so laggy and feels so robotic. And I miss so much from TS4. I remember when I first heard TS4 didn't have an open world or a colour wheel I was so mad! I didn't think I could ever love it without those things. But having played it for so long now, I can see the merits, because I go back to TS3 and it is painfully slow to load things! CAS takes an age (even with Nraas) and the open world is frustrating as I switch to another lot and then have to impatiently pause while the lots render. Admittedly, I do try and run it with ALL THE THINGS!!! and if I took out my store content and mods it would be quicker. But then why play it if I have to uninstall things? I do still play it... but it's just so clunky. :-(
I loved TS2 at the time (I was one of the ones who raged against TS3 at first) but again, when I go back to it, the graphics are so bad, CAS is inferior, and it honestly just bores me so quickly now. People say it had so much more, and that TS4 gives us less content per pack, but I don't think that's true. I would concede that TS2 retail and apartments go more in-depth, but then we didn't get open careers with OFB, and we didn't get festivals with Apartment Life. Perhaps they spread their time more broadly with TS4, or perhaps we just have higher expectations, I don't know. I wish things were 'perfect' but I don't think that's a realistic mindset. I figure it's better to vocalise what I do and do not like, and what could be done to improve the areas I feel aren't up to scratch. I feel it's more productive to pull my socks up and say, 'right, what can we do about this', than lament what could have been.
Even in TS2 the wants were spammy when you added a new pack. That was the game's way of trying to get the player to use the new content. Like look at me...SHINY! If you ignored and kept on what you were doing before then, they would eventually normalize. Did that with TS3. And even that game had wants tailored to player actions. I think that is why so many people have a problem with the way whims work. Because we are used to the way things worked in the past and this new random system just doesn't make any sense to us.
I will absolutely admit that I gave up on TS4 around January of this year. I used it to build during the summer while family visited, but I still got very bored. I could never play so I built a lot of things. Then I got disheartened because I wanted to play with what I built, but would get annoyed very quickly. I may give TS4 a try when everything is out and I can mod it without fear of impending updates. Until then, though, it's just not what I like in SIM games. I really like simulations to work properly and they aren't in this iteration.
And with that I say that it is unfortunate that you have such issues with TS3. In hindsight, I think it is a great game overall if only people could experience it without the bugs or lag or loading times or whatever the issues. It runs pretty smoothly for me, but I also take the time to make sure that my world is optimized and computer is well equipped. My precious will always be TS2 (still build and play with that game regularly).
I hope that I can eventually enjoy TS4. I was hoping this new EP would be the one that brought me back to the game, but it's not. And since the political career is now in this, it doesn't look like I will ever get Town Life, which is what I have been looking forward to most. Because those are the simulations I have been waiting for.
Stop on your tracks! It's not quests. It's WORK. Everyone has assignments in real life. I'm sure you could call doing your work "questing" because you usually do predetermined chores for someone. It's still miles better than disappearing on the edge of the lot or in a rabbithole.
I think the difference between sandbox and linear is huge in TS4. Example: Yes, in TS2 or TS3 you needed certain skills to level up. That's fine. But it didn't tell you which instrument, what object and how many hours to do that. Because the other games are more sandbox you got to choose how you would accomplish this, right? Even if there were few objects you still got to choose which ones and how and when or if never.
In TS4 (especially at release) you were told what object, how many times, when etc. Especially in GTW or it won't count. That is very much linear play and never fun for sandbox players. There is a huge difference whether people acknowledge it or not.
Linear play with parties or it won't count. Example in TS4: Your Sims may have already eaten at the dinner party because you want to play it your way, however, it's not going to count until the game requirements tell you to eat. That's linear play and what makes this game too rigid and too linear for a single player/life simulator/sandbox game. No one needs to say well ignore the requirements, if you do you are locked out of gaining a reward where as in TS2 you weren't. Good party you get your reward. ETA: Up to you what made a good party in TS2. As long as your Sims in the house kept up all motives and saw the other guests motives are taken care of equals good party. Who can't understand sandbox? Or understand how it works and how to play it? That give you more opportunity to actually have fun rather than grind.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
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True memory is flawed more than not. However, if you play all the games from time to time then it has nothing to do with memory and you can make sound judgment of what's good about a new game or not.
I totally agree.
I think what you are describing is over the top animations that convey personality. I have yet to see anything unique about any of these sims. Every single one of them will have the exact same reactions to the exact same situations. They will never deviate from the "standard". The traits mean absolutely zilch. Their memories have nothing to do with their lives and do not shape who they become. Their whims also have nothing to do with their lives. What TS4 sims are is a highly customizable robot, but a robot nonetheless. Not even decent AI to go with it.
depends, if my predetermined tasks are not on the same neighborhood as the rest of my family, the rest of my family will dumb themselves and forget to do their things. So in TS4 it's not better unless you're playing one sim :I
Also not everyone's work involves tasks outside of work. My job might, but for example my significant other is an admin and he doesn't get assignments outside of work hours.
I do understand this perspective and I partially agree with some of the points. As I said, I would like some more tailoring and customisation for personalities, and I'd appreciate a fourth trait slot because then I could pick a trait from each category.
However, I like the animations a lot. I really do. And I like being able to see the Sims' emotions on their faces and in their physical language. When they pull a face, it makes me laugh, and I like to think up a reason why they might be feeling that way. Are they upset with another Sim? Did something happen that could explain why they feel that way? It's as though they have their inner thoughts and feelings, and I feel that gives them real character. It's as thought I have control over their actions, but not their thoughts, and that makes them feel more 'alive' to me. I get very quickly emotionally invested in their lives.
This is my favourite series, and this is mainly because I feel connected to my Sims in a way I never have before. For all the stuff I had in TS3, I never felt connected to my Sims, they felt very robotic to me: pausing and standing around blankly as the processor tried to load the next interaction; walking robotically from point a to b; getting stuck behind a plate; I never liked the way they looked; the camera was terrible and I struggled to get the right angle; all sims had the same animation for the same interaction... the Sims were cold and their every move was calculable.
And I do not find they have the exact same reaction to the same interaction, in fact, this was a complaint I had about TS3 and I find I could play out the same scenario with several Sims and have a different experience each time because of the emotions, and because of the animations, and because there's just the right amount of unpredictability which means an NPC might do something a little bit crazy.
Ok... so you don't like the game. I get it. But what I was describing was my experience of the game, and my personal reaction to it. What I was describing was how the game appeals to the things that I feel are important, and how the game addressed important issues I had with TS3. Does it tick all my boxes? No. And so I will continue to vocalise the aspects that I think could be improved. And if they want to add more over the top animations in the future then that works for me because my Sims are expressive, and emotional, and amusing, and wonderful.
edits: due to early-morning, pre-caffeine spelling errors.
I agree with this. Also the sims 3 careers all had quests except they were called opportunities but it was things you had to do if you wanted that promotion or raise your grade in school. So it's not new in the sims 4 by any stretch.
Again. I couldn't agree with you more. Sims 4 sims are the best of the series. They could use a little more tweeking but still better than the past 3 versions.
Very true. Even Sims 1 had goals you had to achieve if you wanted a promotion. How is having to reach a certain level in a skill or having to befriend a certain number of friends any different to having to perform certain tasks? It is not different. The only difference is how it is displayed in the U.I..
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See I had a very different experience from you. My favorite game of the series was TS2. It was very easy to get into and all of my sims were unique in their responses to the world around them. I mean sure the animations were the same, but they had different idles and their wants were based on player choices. I could have two romance sims, one that was a player and one that had been faithful to his girlfriend since highschool. The player would roll all the wants to woohoo the town while the faithful would roll wants to go on dates with and woohoo his significant other. Their memories would be different. So their lives would be different.
I was not a fan of TS3 at all. Like you, they were very robotic to me. I hated that pause they did before moving on to another interaction. I complained about it a lot actually. I was looking forward to TS4 since about the time WA came out and was all RPG-ish (which is my least favorite genre of game).
Well when TS4 came out I gave it a very long try. I tried and tried. Even changed my play style to accommodate culling and other issues I had. But to me, these sims were the most robotic of any of the games. As a person who generally plays a whole town, it annoyed me right off the bat that the sims walking around in the open areas were just illusionary fodder. In the early code, I remember that the game had to generate x amount of emotions. It was like 1 angry, 3 sad, the rest happy. I can't remember exactly. But that bothered me because those sims weren't feeling emotional responses from a situation, they were just generated like that for no apparent reason. Then my own sims didn't have any personality, at least not to me. They all pulled the same faces. They all acted the same no matter the traits. And eventually I felt like you played one, you played them all. I got really bored with TS4. Now obviously we play very differently. I am a simulation player who enjoys rotating through the world. TS4 does not offer anything for me.
And now I gave TS3 another go just because it is complete and I feel ok modding core parts of it. For example, I reduced the size of bounding boxes so there are fewer collisions and foot tapping. Actually got rid of the foot tap animation altogether. And then added a bunch of mods from the community. And that made the game much more enjoyable for me. I have definitely grown to appreciate TS3's merits more than I used to. And they still don't have the same level of responses as TS2 did, but they do better than TS4 sims for me. With a house full of kids, they aren't all the same. I have had one kid that painted all the time. On his own. Then he started to roll wants to visit the gallery, take painting classes, etc. One of his siblings liked the drum toy. She was the only one to ever use it. One was always cleaning up after everyone. Those were all autonomous interactions which I felt defined their character. It got me attached to them so that when they grew up into adults, I felt like I watched who they became. I knew what kind of sims they'd want to date and who wouldn't work out with them. For me that makes a more interesting sim life.
I would say TS3 was the most flexible when it came to how you play. You didn't have to accept or do a single opportunity to get promoted, it was a way to get extra money/ relationship, or get promoted faster. There were tasks, such as having a relationship with your boss, or charisma at a certain level, however you could get promoted without having that. As your preparation was rated in different levels, as long as you went to work in good mood, chose to work hard and didn't have everything else in absolute red (for example, if I need to have 6 charisma points, but I have 4 that puts me into good-neutral, meaning it will not influence my performance badly when I go to work) you could get promoted.
Yeah, I can see what people mean when they talk about the wants and wishes of their Sims. I did like that the TS2 wishes were usually more tailored to their lifetime aspiration and personality. TS3 was terrible because they'd update the wishes to increase the chance of wishing for new features whenever there was a new pack, so it got a bit spammy and was more based on what was new, rather than what your Sim wanted. Honestly, I think I started ignoring the wants while playing TS3, and so I barely take note of them now, so I guess it doesn't bother me as much as it does others (I've seen/heard it mentioned by several players). But it should definitely be tweaked to be more personality based.
I did like WA, and I did like the quests, but what felt restrictive to me was that I couldn't just take a family vacation to the new worlds. It would have been better if Sims could just travel freely to the worlds, but have the option to explore tombs and complete quests if they wanted to. I'm ok with optional quests and challenges, but as long as they don't restrict more sandbox style play.
I quite like that townies wander round in different moods, again I like to imagine what had happened to them to put them in that mood, and work it into my story-line if I can. Is Nancy mad because an art deal fell through? Is Katrina flirty because she's heading out to a night on the town? I remember when I first got the game I'd forget about my active family because I was so amused just people-watching! I'm a rotational player and it's strange because my various Sims usually autonomously act in the way I'd choose for them to act. It's like the game just knows what personality I have in mind for them. I'm sorry that your experience is so different to mine, because I really wish everyone could enjoy it as much as I do.
Oh, did you mod out the foot tapping? I saw that in one of Ani's LPs. Is it the one that replaces it with a personality idle instead? I do still love TS3, and it really is a great game. I miss so much of my content. But I go back to it and (for me) it's so laggy and feels so robotic. And I miss so much from TS4. I remember when I first heard TS4 didn't have an open world or a colour wheel I was so mad! I didn't think I could ever love it without those things. But having played it for so long now, I can see the merits, because I go back to TS3 and it is painfully slow to load things! CAS takes an age (even with Nraas) and the open world is frustrating as I switch to another lot and then have to impatiently pause while the lots render. Admittedly, I do try and run it with ALL THE THINGS!!! and if I took out my store content and mods it would be quicker. But then why play it if I have to uninstall things? I do still play it... but it's just so clunky. :-(
I loved TS2 at the time (I was one of the ones who raged against TS3 at first) but again, when I go back to it, the graphics are so bad, CAS is inferior, and it honestly just bores me so quickly now. People say it had so much more, and that TS4 gives us less content per pack, but I don't think that's true. I would concede that TS2 retail and apartments go more in-depth, but then we didn't get open careers with OFB, and we didn't get festivals with Apartment Life. Perhaps they spread their time more broadly with TS4, or perhaps we just have higher expectations, I don't know. I wish things were 'perfect' but I don't think that's a realistic mindset. I figure it's better to vocalise what I do and do not like, and what could be done to improve the areas I feel aren't up to scratch. I feel it's more productive to pull my socks up and say, 'right, what can we do about this', than lament what could have been.
from my experience my sims would only wish for what I would make them do. On my werewolf sim I started transforming her often to play with the werewolf itself a bit, a few transforms later she started wishing to transform. My genie sim had no wish to do anything with the water until I sent him snorkeling and he found a seashell. Now he wants to find more seashells. All of my couples with a good relationship tend to want to spend time together. All my sims that I'm pushing hard at their careers develop wishes to get promoted.
With TS4 I tend to get completely random wishes. If my sim is inspired and they're an aspiring cook, they will want to paint instead of cook. Often times children will have too adult wishes with things like "let's relax in the mud bath!".
This. I almost never did any of the opportunities and my sims still got promotions and raises all the time. Show up and work...that's really all it took. Took longer than if you went that extra mile, but it would still happen.
Yep it seems they will check what the players hate the most and keep doing it and adding it again!
I don't hate it the most.
Even in TS2 the wants were spammy when you added a new pack. That was the game's way of trying to get the player to use the new content. Like look at me...SHINY! If you ignored and kept on what you were doing before then, they would eventually normalize. Did that with TS3. And even that game had wants tailored to player actions. I think that is why so many people have a problem with the way whims work. Because we are used to the way things worked in the past and this new random system just doesn't make any sense to us.
I will absolutely admit that I gave up on TS4 around January of this year. I used it to build during the summer while family visited, but I still got very bored. I could never play so I built a lot of things. Then I got disheartened because I wanted to play with what I built, but would get annoyed very quickly. I may give TS4 a try when everything is out and I can mod it without fear of impending updates. Until then, though, it's just not what I like in SIM games. I really like simulations to work properly and they aren't in this iteration.
And with that I say that it is unfortunate that you have such issues with TS3. In hindsight, I think it is a great game overall if only people could experience it without the bugs or lag or loading times or whatever the issues. It runs pretty smoothly for me, but I also take the time to make sure that my world is optimized and computer is well equipped. My precious will always be TS2 (still build and play with that game regularly).
I hope that I can eventually enjoy TS4. I was hoping this new EP would be the one that brought me back to the game, but it's not. And since the political career is now in this, it doesn't look like I will ever get Town Life, which is what I have been looking forward to most. Because those are the simulations I have been waiting for.
Good for you, I hope future packs will be filled with tasks and quests if you like them.
Thank you. I hope so too. I'm getting older and my imagination is not what it used to be, so having the tasks give me a direction to go in.
I think the difference between sandbox and linear is huge in TS4. Example: Yes, in TS2 or TS3 you needed certain skills to level up. That's fine. But it didn't tell you which instrument, what object and how many hours to do that. Because the other games are more sandbox you got to choose how you would accomplish this, right? Even if there were few objects you still got to choose which ones and how and when or if never.
In TS4 (especially at release) you were told what object, how many times, when etc. Especially in GTW or it won't count. That is very much linear play and never fun for sandbox players. There is a huge difference whether people acknowledge it or not.
Linear play with parties or it won't count. Example in TS4: Your Sims may have already eaten at the dinner party because you want to play it your way, however, it's not going to count until the game requirements tell you to eat. That's linear play and what makes this game too rigid and too linear for a single player/life simulator/sandbox game. No one needs to say well ignore the requirements, if you do you are locked out of gaining a reward where as in TS2 you weren't. Good party you get your reward. ETA: Up to you what made a good party in TS2. As long as your Sims in the house kept up all motives and saw the other guests motives are taken care of equals good party. Who can't understand sandbox? Or understand how it works and how to play it? That give you more opportunity to actually have fun rather than grind.