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Negative Feedback Thoughts

charmed4life4charmed4life4 Posts: 121 Member
edited September 7 in The Sims 4 Game Feedback
*I will start by saying I do not condone any type of attacks on Gurus, YouTubers, or other simmers, however I have noticed that many who are defending EA/Maxis/Gurus are saying that the community is entitled for having genuine complaints with Sims 4.

I did the math and if a person is paying full price for every currently released pack (not including Star Wars) they would pay $729.65. For Sims 4 there for a total of the base game and 34 almost 35 packs.

Sims 3 on the other hand has 20 packs (expansion and stuff packs) I do not remember the original prices and my Origin account is charging $19.99 for all of them so please share the total cost if you know it :)

I believe if someone is putting all of this money into the game they have the right to speak their mind (as respectfully as possible). The fact that people are saying negative feedback shouldn't be shared is weird to me. I should be able to say "I'm disappointed in Sims 4" or "They should fix the problems/add what the community wants" without someone saying "if you don't like it don't buy it". I believe you learn more from negative feedback and to see those sharing it being told to basically shut up is crazy to me. I also don't remember the Sims 3 community being this toxic towards each other and EA. Then again other than lag issues I believe the Sims 3 team did a good job in addressing fan concerns and providing the community with a game that was enjoyable.

I tend to like to know the thought process behind things, so I would love to hear the thoughts on why people are frustrated with the negative feedback being shared. To those who have called out others for sharing negative feedback, why did you do it/were against what they had to say? I would also like to know if someone has shared feedback that is more attacking why did you share your thoughts in this way?

Hopefully we can keep things respectful and make this about learning about the "opposite" side in a sense.
Post edited by EA_Rtas on

Comments

  • NindigoNindigo Posts: 2,764 Member
    edited September 3
    A noble goal. Don't forget to take into account all the store stuff for TS3 - I've spent too much money there.

    I'm actually playing TS3 these days, and it does feel very rough around the edges when one has become used to TS4. In my opinion, EA charges way too much for it nowadays considering its age and considerable amount of script errors. I use NRaas mods to optimize its playability, but still. It's unstable compared to TS4. I have all packs for it except the Katy Perry one. I wasn't playing when it released and it was later made unavailable. Hopefully, that doesn't happen with any TS4 content. It's a completionist's nightmare.

    A lot of things should have and could have been fixed in TS3 before it was left. The same thing is happening with TS4. I don't know why fixing is so hard to do. I do know that my husband, who is developing software for welding machines, and his team can take several days sometimes to figure out and fix a bug in their program. When that happens he comes home very exhausted and frustrated. It's probably not much different when working with a game like TS4 which has a lot more programming going on than a welding machine. At some point, it's probably easier to leave some bugs alone (give up, essentially) or try to find an acceptable workaround while adding new content.

    I'm not saying this is an amazing strategy, because it's not. But I think it's sometimes the only worthwhile choice. If there is one thing I wish for this franchise, it's that bugfixing becomes more managable and is given higher priority. Something is a little messed up with the current time schedule, though. Three new packs are fired at us rapidly as if in a hurry. Maybe the next Sims game is closer around the corner than we realize. I don't know if I'll ever get into the next game in the series, but at least I can play TS4 without mods as it is. Even if it is a bit boring at times.

    Disclaimer: I would like to emphasize that I'm not out to dismiss anyone's feelings :| If it has happened anyway, I genuinely apologize. (Maybe I should put it in my signature)


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  • Chicklet453681Chicklet453681 Posts: 445 Member
    edited September 3
    I think the biggest problem is people are just sick and tired of the game being bugged. It's sad because you get so excited for new content and when you add it or they add a patch for it, many things break, that you would think would have no reason to break.

    And then people report the problems over and over and over, the same thing is happening in their game too, but nothing gets resolved. The least they could do on bug fixes is BE MORE TRANSPARENT! Tell people that they are trying to find a solution, it's just taking them awhile to figure out where the kink is in the pipeline that is causing the issue for seemingly unrelated bugs. So in their eyes, they are not listening, the only worry about money and not fixing the game, etc etc.

    So, some people have paid literally hundreds of dollars in content and their game is unusable or no longer functions the way that particular pack was supposed to. They need better QA protocols. Why not let some people in the community be your testers prior to release? Give them a copy of the pack for a limited number of hours to play then disable it to let them play thru it and then report back?
  • izecsonizecson Posts: 1,612 Member
    Here's the problem. Many people come here to talk about the fun times they're having in TS4, yet when you look at the board, more than half of the threads are complaint threads. IT'S TOO MUCH. It ruins the collective mood for everyone else.

    If people want to complain, that's fine...but can't we limit it to just a handful of threads instead of filling the board with them?

    Sometime there are only 3 of them at most at any given page of General Sims 4 Discussion and the rest are normal discussion topic, unless you knew very well that it's a complain thread and yet you still click on it.
    When can we get The Sims 3 Remastered Complete Edition 64 Bit?
  • AnnLee87AnnLee87 Posts: 2,331 Member
    I agree with @Nate_Whiplash1

    They combine a lot into one thread that is positive. In another thread we were discussing positive threads being plowed over with negative comments and then they get closed. If a thread is named anything positive it seems to attract haters and this brings it to a close. Some of the stuff in the general discussion area should actually be moved to feedback or other areas. Anything about EA or Maxis should be in feedback.

    I have a hard time understanding why someone would intentionally interject or derail a positive or upbeat thread just to close it down. Users have admitted to doing this because they have a right to free speech. So do the users that want positive or upbeat threads. I feel that there in no where to have a positive thread that's not about cake or "who should my Sim marry" kind of threads.
  • Chicklet453681Chicklet453681 Posts: 445 Member
    AnnLee87 wrote: »
    I agree with @Nate_Whiplash1

    They combine a lot into one thread that is positive. In another thread we were discussing positive threads being plowed over with negative comments and then they get closed. If a thread is named anything positive it seems to attract haters and this brings it to a close. Some of the stuff in the general discussion area should actually be moved to feedback or other areas. Anything about EA or Maxis should be in feedback.

    I have a hard time understanding why someone would intentionally interject or derail a positive or upbeat thread just to close it down. Users have admitted to doing this because they have a right to free speech. So do the users that want positive or upbeat threads. I feel that there in no where to have a positive thread that's not about cake or "who should my Sim marry" kind of threads.

    You are both right in my eyes. I'm really new to the forums, just started coming around before Nifty Knitting dropped. And I have seen in almost every single thread people are bashing this person for their thoughts or complaints which escalates and derails the entire thread.

    And I totally agree that a LOT of topics need to be put somewhere else.

    Maybe they need a "Talk about Packs - Negative Thoughts", "Talk about Packs - Positive Thoughts" section.

    There are like 25 different threads about SW on here, (some in General Chat, some in Feedback, some under Pack Discussion) and some are basically the same topic and there's the same people picking fights with the same people over the same thing in each thread. It's insane!

    I haven't been around long, so I'm wondering if it's always like this with each pack or is it especially bad because it's a SW pack?
  • AnnLee87AnnLee87 Posts: 2,331 Member
    @Chicklet453681 It's like this for just about all packs. Maybe not Seasons or Parenthood, but yeah. I welcome any pack. I may not like it but I can always find something in build/buy or CAS to like. It's too soon for me to know if I like SW because I have not seen it in action but I want the build items. I will find out more if they do a live stream.
  • ScobreScobre Posts: 19,281 Member
    edited September 3
    I feel like forums has become the Sims MMO in a way. Anyways good article about difference between negative and toxic behavior:
    https://hybrid.co.id/post/toxic-behavior-in-online-gaming-is-it-necessary

    Good rule of thumb I've learned is if someone can't pass the The Equal Employment Opportunity Act with their behavior and admit to not playing well with others, best to remove them from your life. My dad was a scuba instructor and said if someone is trying to drown you, kick them off. Always helped me when working with the state when dealing with people who can honestly be the most toxic and we are trained on how to deal with it which in some cases is not to feed the trolls. Forums has been a great training ground for professional work and I have learned a lot about customer service with it. Constructive feedback is good for any gaming company. Just when protesting happens with the Sims 4 that things become problematic with the witch hunts.
    “Although the world is full of suffering, it is full also of the overcoming of it.” –Helen Keller
  • BabykittyjadeBabykittyjade Posts: 1,600 Member
    Here's the problem. Many people come here to talk about the fun times they're having in TS4, yet when you look at the board, more than half of the threads are complaint threads. IT'S TOO MUCH. It ruins the collective mood for everyone else.

    If people want to complain, that's fine...but can't we limit it to just a handful of threads instead of filling the board with them?

    This. The only reason I joined this forum in the first place was to share ts4 love, joy, adventures and woes. And read of others. To vent when sims drive me crazy in a way only simmers can understand.

    But instead everyday I come it's just threads of increasing negativity one after another over and over never ending on and on forever and ever a torturous ending with no end to it until it becomes like this annoying run on sentence you just read.

    I'm okay with feedback and criticism,that's natural. But when you just consistantly find things to be angry about, nit picking every little thing, speaking ill of the gurus with no regards to how they might feel, and saying they should loose their job during a pandemic it's heart breaking. They are real people with feelings. This is just a game.

    Ts4 will NEVER be ts3 and simmers don't want to accept that. 😕

    Zombies, oh please oh please give us zombies!! :'(
  • RouensimsRouensims Posts: 2,418 Member
    edited September 3
    I used to belong to a different forum that had a separate criticism section. The no criticism rule in other sections of the forum was strictly enforced, and people could be suspended for breaking that rule. I know a lot of people here would hate that, but it actually worked quite well.
    Ooh Be Gah!! Whipna Choba-Dog? Whipna Choba-Dog!! :smiley:
  • SimKeatsSimKeats Posts: 2,165 Member
    I think if you want all puppies and rainbows in the forums, it would be more realistic to make a sub forum for positive only stuff, than it would be to expect people to keep frustration and their feelings on things to themselves. There are, after all, many forums run by others that can operate on whatever rules they feel like.
    I think it would be terrible PR if they discouraged feedback that not everyone likes.

    Believe it or not, the more someone is into a game, the more they are invested in it emotionally, the more likely they are to voice their opinion, negative or positive. The forum does also, provide us tools to filter out what we don't like. You aren't forced to read threads, and if you really find someone's behavior offensive, you can ignore them.

    What one person finds as a negative feedback, another might find as reassuring that they are not alone in how they feel. Not everyone has the same emotional maturity, especially on the internet. No matter how negative someone is they can't MAKE you unhappy, or angry, how you feel about others behavior is up to you.

    At the end of the day, complaining about people complaining, just continues the cycle of complaining.
    My experience is in this life, you can't expect anyone to behave any better than they absolutely have to, and even then, there is a reason why forums have moderators, and societies have police etc.
  • AnnLee87AnnLee87 Posts: 2,331 Member
    @SimKeats The same users are repeatedly going into threads just to derail it so it will be closed because they don't like or agree with the discussion.

    "all puppies and rainbows in the forums" This is not realistic.

    I don't want to avoid other users who are angry and unhappy. They teach me various things but sometimes I am not in the mood. Angry and unhappy users need to express themselves. IMO They need their own section. It's called feedback or something else. They don't need to be toxic and throwing up randomly in 20 different threads about the same thing.
  • CAPTAIN_NXR7CAPTAIN_NXR7 Posts: 1,565 Member
    SimKeats wrote: »
    I think if you want all puppies and rainbows in the forums, it would be more realistic to make a sub forum for positive only stuff, than it would be to expect people to keep frustration and their feelings on things to themselves. There are, after all, many forums run by others that can operate on whatever rules they feel like.
    I think it would be terrible PR if they discouraged feedback that not everyone likes.

    Believe it or not, the more someone is into a game, the more they are invested in it emotionally, the more likely they are to voice their opinion, negative or positive. The forum does also, provide us tools to filter out what we don't like. You aren't forced to read threads, and if you really find someone's behavior offensive, you can ignore them.

    The point is that there are many negative threads about exactly the same topic. E.g. there are 3 discussions about one single tweet. These kind of discussions often have a similar name.
    Constructive feedback, may it be negative or positive, should never be discouraged.
    But when folks are angry and frustrated it seems they’re not bothered to just keep participating in the one thread, instead they feel the need to start yet another one themselves, of exactly the same topic, to purposely add fuel to the inferno and gain popularity. That’s not constructive. That’s spamming the forum with negativity.
  • logionlogion Posts: 1,736 Member
    edited September 3
    @Nindigo I don't think that you are dismissive at all. And I think that some users have treated your responses pretty harshly lately. I think one problem is when you are quoting someone with a different opinion, they can see that as a way of getting "called out". People quoting each other back and forth about subjective opinions often never ends well.

    I'm usually pretty negative about the sims4, but I feel myself that we have gotten a lot of negative threads here lately. This is why I like the positive thoughts thread and the negative thoughts thread when a pack comes out.
    I haven't been around long, so I'm wondering if it's always like this with each pack or is it especially bad because it's a SW pack?

    I think it has been a lot lately because of their recent packs that they have released in 2020, while I admit that there was far bit of negativity around 2019 as well, it was mostly about the lack of content in their packs, like for example when Island Living was released. But now a lot of people are starting to get really displeased with Maxis overall.

    I kinda predicted this when they did their rebranding and they said that they were going to keep supporting the sims4 for many more years, what usually happens with franchises that go on for that long are that people tend to be less forgiving and more critical. People were asking about moving babies, cars etc. back then too, but they expected them to come later.

    That doesn't mean that people can't be happy though, so I apologize if my responses have been too negative lately. I don't mind people enjoying this latest Star Wars pack, I know a lot of people are excited about it and I am not going to ignore that.



  • TrashmagicTrashmagic Posts: 922 Member
    Mods usually handle these things so that's not a huge issue. Otherwise negative threads are easily ignored. I don't like the idea of "limiting" the amount of negative threads unless they're breaking the rules. (spam and such)

    If rules aren't being broken then it's time to focus on the things you enjoy and ignore those that you don't. It's simple.

    Op I agree with you so I guess I'm not adding much to the conversation.
    You open the closet, it's just a closet. You never find the monster that hides inside. Not until it jumps out at you.
  • NetzspannungNetzspannung Posts: 1,907 Member
    I have absolutely no issue with anyone sharing their feedback, be it positive or negative. I like to stay on the positive side myself because I enjoy the game. I also don't have it in me to get upset about a game, something that I chose to spend my spare time and money on and am by no means forced to endure. I think both positive and negative feedback are very important and trying to discourage it is not helpful at all.
    What I don't appreciate, however, is when people who clearly have no knowledge of their budget and time constraints make personal remarks like that the gurus are "lazy" or "liars" or call a pack "trash" because they don't like it. I guess that has to do with my job because it can happen that people take it personal when I cannot provide them with what they want exactly for reasons that are beyond my control. But I am getting better at not engaging with people on the forums anymore who express their frustrations in this manner.
    If I just posted an outfit you like, I have good news - there is more where that came from!
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    we all try ...
  • SilentKittySilentKitty Posts: 3,852 Member
    Here's the problem. Many people come here to talk about the fun times they're having in TS4, yet when you look at the board, more than half of the threads are complaint threads. IT'S TOO MUCH. It ruins the collective mood for everyone else.

    If people want to complain, that's fine...but can't we limit it to just a handful of threads instead of filling the board with them?

    This. The only reason I joined this forum in the first place was to share ts4 love, joy, adventures and woes. And read of others. To vent when sims drive me crazy in a way only simmers can understand.

    But instead everyday I come it's just threads of increasing negativity one after another over and over never ending on and on forever and ever a torturous ending with no end to it until it becomes like this annoying run on sentence you just read.

    I'm okay with feedback and criticism,that's natural. But when you just consistantly find things to be angry about, nit picking every little thing, speaking ill of the gurus with no regards to how they might feel, and saying they should loose their job during a pandemic it's heart breaking. They are real people with feelings. This is just a game.

    Ts4 will NEVER be ts3 and simmers don't want to accept that. 😕

    Hmm...I use the ignore-function quite liberally.

    This is my hobby, I come here to share the fun I have with my games. Some woes when a bug arises but mostly I am having a good time with my game and for me it is natural to share than enjoyment with others. My time and my energy is mine to manage, it is my responsibility to make sure that I leave the forum with enough energy to approach RL in the way I want to.

    So I stick to the threads where I believe that I can get a good discussion. I put ignore on posters that I feel are "screaming negatively". I find it much easier to navigate bugs and errors over on the Tech-site because then posters tend to be more dispassionate, working on getting a solution or stating something a problem clearly. That I have no problem with. It is just the aggressive screaming that I will not go near.

    Might be something to try. This is a hobby, it is meant to bring joy.
  • SimKeatsSimKeats Posts: 2,165 Member
    If there are many negative threads about exactly the same topic, that just shows that people feel strongly enough to engage on the topic. And as someone also pointed out, usually the mods handle such things, with thread merging, locking etc.
    I personally choose not to get upset if someone has a meltdown on the forums.
    Its fine to not like people ranting and raving. Expecting people to behave differently, even when they are not conducting their self in a civilized manner, is an exorcise in futility.

    I'm not telling anyone to have or not have an opinion. Just don't get worked up over it, spend your energy on what will make you happy.
    Especially if you are happy with the game and the direction it is going, its much easier to ignore harsh words and actually go play the game you like isn't it?
  • CAPTAIN_NXR7CAPTAIN_NXR7 Posts: 1,565 Member
    edited September 3
    SimKeats wrote: »
    If there are many negative threads about exactly the same topic, that just shows that people feel strongly enough to engage on the topic. And as someone also pointed out, usually the mods handle such things, with thread merging, locking etc.
    I personally choose not to get upset if someone has a meltdown on the forums.
    Its fine to not like people ranting and raving. Expecting people to behave differently, even when they are not conducting their self in a civilized manner, is an exorcise in futility.

    I'm not telling anyone to have or not have an opinion. Just don't get worked up over it, spend your energy on what will make you happy.
    Especially if you are happy with the game and the direction it is going, its much easier to ignore harsh words and actually go play the game you like isn't it?

    That’s true.
    Personally I’m not bothered by it ( the word I’d use is ‘entertained’) but it’s indeed easy enough to ignore the negativity and move on.
    When I notice I spend more time on this forum than actually playing the game, I’m going to have to start ask myself some questions. Luckily that’s not the case.
  • So_MoneySo_Money Posts: 2,402 Member
    I think what the forum really needs is more aggressive moderating. Someone should be consolidating these threads in a much more timely manner.
  • SilentKittySilentKitty Posts: 3,852 Member
    So_Money wrote: »
    I think what the forum really needs is more aggressive moderating. Someone should be consolidating these threads in a much more timely manner.

    Yes, I do believe that that would improve things.
  • OnverserOnverser Posts: 980 Member
    edited September 3
    I believe if someone is putting all of this money into the game they have the right to speak their mind (as respectfully as possible). The fact that people are saying negative feedback shouldn't be shared is weird to me. I should be able to say "I'm disappointed in Sims 4" or "They should fix the problems/add what the community wants" without someone saying "if you don't like it don't buy it". I believe you learn more from negative feedback and to see those sharing it being told to basically shut up is crazy to me.

    I think a lot of peoples issue is not so much people being disappointed, but how it's turned into a warzone. People feel like they aren't allowed their own opinion and are being silenced by those who feel differently. The amount of people who've been shouted down for trying to defend the pack or the devs is something else. As much as some people say it isn't, the atmosphere is definitely pretty toxic for those who have a different opinion.

    I think when it comes to the money thing, people forget that this is a game. It's not a small indie project that you're donating to support. You aren't paying for shares in the company and they've never promised that you'll get more say on the game if you spend more, you're paying for a product they provide. If you choose to spend hundreds on a game and continue spending even if you're disappointed, the only person to blame is yourself. The sad reality is they don't owe you anything no matter how much you spend.

    Disappointment and voicing your complaints is reasonable though, but I think people should stop making it an us vs them thing. People should leave others to their complaining, and people should leave others to like the pack in peace without being attacked for being a bootlicker or an apologist. It's a two way street.
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  • So_MoneySo_Money Posts: 2,402 Member
    edited September 3
    So_Money wrote: »
    I think what the forum really needs is more aggressive moderating. Someone should be consolidating these threads in a much more timely manner.

    Yes, I do believe that that would improve things.

    I’m a proponent of negative feedback (within reason), but there really ought to be an all-encompassing Criticism/Complaints/Venting thread. There’s a lot of redundancy on page one anymore.
  • logionlogion Posts: 1,736 Member
    edited September 3
    So_Money wrote: »
    So_Money wrote: »
    I think what the forum really needs is more aggressive moderating. Someone should be consolidating these threads in a much more timely manner.

    Yes, I do believe that that would improve things.

    I’m a proponent of negative feedback (within reason), but there really ought to be an all-encompassing Criticism/Complaints/Venting thread. There’s a lot of redundancy on page one anymore.

    Yeah, luckily there tend to be two created for every pack at least which keeps the amount of threads down a bit, like with this Star Wars pack there is the Journey To Batuu Positive Thoughts Thread and The one & only 'Star Wars: Journey to Batuu' complaining thread for example.
  • NindigoNindigo Posts: 2,764 Member
    Onverser wrote: »
    I believe if someone is putting all of this money into the game they have the right to speak their mind (as respectfully as possible). The fact that people are saying negative feedback shouldn't be shared is weird to me. I should be able to say "I'm disappointed in Sims 4" or "They should fix the problems/add what the community wants" without someone saying "if you don't like it don't buy it". I believe you learn more from negative feedback and to see those sharing it being told to basically shut up is crazy to me.

    I think a lot of peoples issue is not so much people being disappointed, but how it's turned into a warzone. People feel like they aren't allowed their own opinion and are being silenced by those who feel differently. The amount of people who've been shouted down for trying to defend the pack or the devs is something else. As much as some people say it isn't, the atmosphere is definitely pretty toxic for those who have a different opinion.

    I think when it comes to the money thing, people forget that this is a game. It's not a small indie project that you're donating to support. You aren't paying for shares in the company and they've never promised that you'll get more say on the game if you spend more, you're paying for a product they provide. If you choose to spend hundreds on a game and continue spending even if you're disappointed, the only person to blame is yourself. The sad reality is they don't owe you anything no matter how much you spend.

    Disappointment and voicing your complaints is reasonable though, but I think people should stop making it an us vs them thing. People should leave others to their complaining, and people should leave others to like the pack in peace without being attacked for being a bootlicker or an apologist. It's a two way street.

    This is all common sense to me, the part in bold very much so as well.


    Origin ID: Nindigo79

    A smile is the prettiest thing you can wear
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