Some of you voting "Unnecessary" because you equate the word "Abuse" with the word "violence" need to read a book.
Also, I'm in favor of this; don't buy and show where you stand as a consumer. If you pay for content and still cry about it because it plum and S4 does too, thats on you!
Excuse me? Avid reader here, what does that have to do with anything? Sorry, but if you think EA are abusing you, you’re really out of whack. They’re taking advantage of the position they hold over this game genre, yeah, but it’s not abuse. None of us are actually being forced to be here or buy anything. We do it because we choose to.
If anything I’d say EA walk over their customers, but abuse? No way.
ABUSE
noun
noun: abuse; plural noun: abuses
/əˈbjuːs/
1. the improper use of something.
The average person doesn’t think of EA when they hear abuse, let me tell you. I really hope none of y’all know what real abuse can look like, because this isn’t it. Not one bit. There is a BIG difference between what EA are doing and actual mental, physical/sexual or substance abuse, which is what 99% of people are going to think of when they see that hashtag.
Abuse? Lol don’t make me laugh. And I’ve been abused, I know what it actually is like and I 100% do not feel like EA are abusing me. I don’t *have* to buy anything. I can just never think of them again. It has no impact of my life or wellbeing.
I still think of my abuser 20 years down the line. Trust me, EA are *nice* compared to what real abuse does to a person.
Can you be more entitled than that?
Why do 99% of people will assume the word "abuse" is being used as a verb instead of a noun in this topic?
This really isn’t the place for discussion like this. The thread needs to be closed, and if you think EA are abusing you, don’t buy their games. Problem solved. Wait for another sims type game because they’ll be one eventually, or play the ones we have, I do.
—T
Maybe it is! If we are free to do it we can take part, or if we disagree with the word we can change to other like #EAListen or something and simple mute the one that is triggering you.This is an issue with two sides and if people can't find a middle term in it we have a problem! It will be drama vs drama and in that case it could be abusive to any people who will find it offensive in any way.
Keep in mind that im not here to attack you and Im really sorry for everything that happened to you. But we have to keep in mind that things are not so simple that way and we all have one thing in common! We all love this franchise and we all want the best for it despite the version we play. If I feel something is wrong I will do anything to try at least change something!
I made this post to make a peaceful conversation about what is planned to happen tomorrow on social media! You all can participate despite the hashtag you use! What really matters here is trying to make EA listen! If you really understand what is the idea behind of this you can take it in a way whatever you want!
Its easy to say not buy but you know this is the only game of this genre in the market and if you are an old player you already saw this same company doing things way better! There are tones of people that maybe were always defending this franchise that has been totally exploited because they have fear of what happened to old maxis brands like SimCity or Spore? Or they are just new players or people that started with The Sims 3 but they had a bad experience with it for some reason...
Things go behind simple when a fanbase is passionate about the game. I will tell you it would be much easier if I had another choices and just leave this community forever but you maybe know that doesn't work like this in reality! Believe me! I would rather not be doing this and take my time in other things but I feel like we need to do something!
In conclusion both sides have valid points and if we start arguing who is right or not nothing will change and more years of exploiting The Sims franchise will continue!
Maybe it is shocking but at least is making an impact already! This community is talking about this right now and only tomorrow we will see what will happen. #EAListen is the word I choosed to use and despite tat I also understand the one with the "abuse word and I don't feel the need to tell another people to things how I think because thats not part of who I am!
Sorry for this long post and also sorry for my english because Im obviously not a native speaker.
I wish you all a good day!
I do not assume. 99% of the time, abuse means something violent or along the lines of.
Do you honestly mean to tell me that when you see the word abuse, you think of EA taking advantage of their customer base? Because I don’t, and nobody in their right mind would either. Seeing the word abuse does not bring up thoughts of video gaming.
Like I said, I know what it feels like and this isn’t it. You’re trying to make light of a word that the VAST majority of the public view as something quite serious. Not a video game company. Verb or noun? Are you for real?
I’m actually rather appalled at a lot of you. EA are not abusing you. I’ll be the first person to criticise them, and demand better quality content, but abuse? You think EA are abusing you? Are you being serious?
Real abuse can destroy an entire family, devastate it, and you think this is what EA are doing? The only thing they are destroying is their own reputation.
—T
I’m Spanish and what I actually thought was that EA was taking advantage of their consumers. It also can mean violence, sexual abuse and so on, when looking it up on the dictionary it has the same meanings as in English, but I think the difference is that we keep using the other meanings, so we don’t associate it with the sexual and violent meaning unless in context. I saw one comment where a French user stated the same.
We also say “abusar de su poder” (take advantage of their power) when talking about big corporations.
True! I speak european portuguese and its exactly the same!
I have no idea what to vote to be honest. I have no idea how popular the hashtag is and how many people share the emotion. I’m not a fan of the word abuse here, not because I fail to understand a word can have several meanings or think it can only be used for the strongest one (from now on when we say abuse we only mean the very worst case of abuse and whenever we use the word we have a respectful minute of silence first), but rather because also in the meaning of the word ‘misuse’, I don’t think it’s as simple as that. I think EA is convinced they are doing the right, modern, young, flashy thing for this franchise and clearly they have a point. This whole gamechangers nonsense for instance, that program, I just can’t get my head around the very principle it’s a good idea to favour a small group of Special Fans, hand them everything for free, listen to only them (black door? black door!) and form this clique like atmosphere around them. If every fan out there was a tiny bit like me the result would be hilarious because it would have no affect at all, it rather would completely backfire even. And there’s the thing: clearly not everybody is like me, people apparently love it. People can write down walls of thorough, very constructive feedback here, as soon as some charismatic boy or girl on YouTube fills 20 minutes to say the very same thing (or utter nonsense, that too) it all of a sudden is gospel. And right there for me is where the actual problem lies (and where I begin to feel like an alien who is unable to participate in this poll). Fans apparently loving to be treated like this. Fans going more an more over the topish crazy over stuff that was just... there in the past.
Oh, that’s a bare game... meh.
Oh, swimming pools: yaaay!
Wait what, toddlers: squeeee!
Terrain tools? Scream!!
Stairs: I’M CRYING!!! AND I’M MAKING THIS VIDEO IN WHICH YOU ALL CAN SEE I’M ACTUALLY CRYING! STAIRS!
Who am I to tell EA to listen if this clearly works this way. They run a business, if it works this way it does, good job. I mean, I’m gone (well, my money is) but what do they care As long as enough people buy and scream and cry over stuff that’s just quietly been hanging in there in the earlier games from the very beginning, they have no reason to change a thing. That’s how companies work.
All I can think when I see that hashtag now is sorry guys, but we told you so years ago, when ‘potential’ still was the magic word.
There is this really strange psychological thing going on among fans that’s just really not rational. And it’s a direct result of the way EA is releasing this game. Don’t get me wrong, from a marketing perspective I tip my hat. As a Sims fan though, I think it’s a very sad development.
I have no idea what to vote to be honest. I have no idea how popular the hashtag is and how many people share the emotion. I’m not a fan of the word abuse here, not because I fail to understand a word can have several meanings or think it can only be used for the strongest one (from now on when we say abuse we only mean the very worst case of abuse and whenever we use the word we have a respectful minute of silence first), but rather because also in the meaning of the word ‘misuse’, I don’t think it’s as simple as that. I think EA is convinced they are doing the right, modern, young, flashy thing for this franchise and clearly they have a point. This whole gamechangers nonsense for instance, that program, I just can’t get my head around the very principle it’s a good idea to favour a small group of Special Fans, hand them everything for free, listen to only them (black door? black door!) and form this clique like atmosphere around them. If every fan out there was a tiny bit like me the result would be hilarious because it would have no affect at all, it rather would completely backfire even. And there’s the thing: clearly not everybody is like me, people apparently love it. People can write down walls of thorough, very constructive feedback here, as soon as some charismatic boy or girl on YouTube fills 20 minutes to say the very same thing (or utter nonsense, that too) it all of a sudden is gospel. And right there for me is where the actual problem lies (and where I begin to feel like an alien who is unable to participate in this poll). Fans apparently loving to be treated like this. Fans going more an more over the topish crazy over stuff that was just... there in the past.
Oh, that’s a bare game... meh.
Oh, swimming pools: yaaay!
Wait what, toddlers: squeeee!
Terrain tools? Scream!!
Stairs: I’M CRYING!!! AND I’M MAKING THIS VIDEO IN WHICH YOU ALL CAN SEE I’M ACTUALLY CRYING! STAIRS!
Who am I to tell EA to listen if this clearly works this way. They run a business, if it works this way it does, good job. I mean, I’m gone (well, my money is) but what do they care As long as enough people buy and scream and cry over stuff that’s just quietly been hanging in there in the earlier games from the very beginning, they have no reason to change a thing. That’s how companies work.
All I can think when I see that hashtag now is sorry guys, but we told you so years ago, when ‘potential’ still was the magic word.
There is this really strange psychological thing going on among fans that’s just really not rational. And it’s a direct result of the way EA is releasing this game. Don’t get me wrong, from a marketing perspective I tip my hat. As a Sims fan though, I think it’s a very sad development.
And also, a lot of players have said and implied that they just can't stop buying, even though they hate the way things are going because maybe it'll get better, they have to complete the collection, they love the gurus and don't want them out of a job, we won't get The Sims 5 if The Sims 4 isn't successful.
This isn't the first time a Stolkhom Syndrome comparison or reference has been made. It's been made over the course of The Sims 4 and even before The Sims 4 was released and sometimes even the players who always buy and had strongly defended the game at the beginning were the ones who said it about themselves.
With Sims 4 MFP the main comments that stood out to me the most on here, Twitter, and Facebook were variations, 'I hate I'm going to support this,' or, 'Sadly, I'm going to buy it.'
And I didn't get it. You should be happy to buy a pack but there were people hating themselves because they were going to cave and buy it even though they disagreed with it. So why not stop buying? It makes no sense to me. I can honestly say never spent one dime on The Sims 4 because I'm tired of their practices and I won't spend money on The Sims 5 if they keep up the same trend but some players, self admittedly, cannot stop buying, no matter how much they disagree with certain practices or even if they don't like a certain pack.
I'm not going so far as to say it's some strange psychological phenomenon because I'm in no way qualified to make that judgement but from where I stand the hashtag 'keepyourwalletclosed' would seem to have more of an impact.
At this point in the game's development most players should have a pretty good idea of what a new pack is going to bring. And if they don't there are always plenty of reviews to peruse before purchasing. Yet still they purchase. And end up disappointed, time after time, after time. And yes, this is the only simulation game of it's type. And yes, it may have been on sale, or a gift, but that's still considered a purchase and supporting the game.
Personally, I just think it is hope, fueled with hype, and then followed with disappointment. Which then again leads to hope, fueled by hype, and then followed by disappointment.
I'm not going so far as to say it's some strange psychological phenomenon because I'm in no way qualified to make that judgement but from where I stand the hashtag 'keepyourwalletclosed' would seem to have more of an impact.
At this point in the game's development most players should have a pretty good idea of what a new pack is going to bring. And if they don't there are always plenty of reviews to peruse before purchasing. Yet still they purchase. And end up disappointed, time after time, after time. And yes, this is the only simulation game of it's type. And yes, it may have been on sale, or a gift, but that's still considered a purchase and supporting the game.
Not claiming any qualification there, it’s just an observation (and like @ApparentlyAwesome says not mine) that has been baffling me increasingly. When it happened to toddlers (squeeeee!) I could understand that, also because they were so wonderfully done. But after that it became just stranger and stranger to me. Seeing how people completely hyped over stuff that was’t revolutionary at all in relation to the earlier games. That just simply comes down to people being mainly fed with hunger, teasers and promises. A clever way to not just give it to them the way they used to, just like that and immediately, but pretend it’s really hard if not impossible to do and then, when nobody expects it, they just present it, almost casually. I’m not a participant of this hashtag myself, but when a word like abuse is being connected to EA (in the meaning taking advantage of, exploiting, misusing), this is the association that springs to mind.
(not in the sense that EA is actually literally hijacking people obviously, because of course it’s just a game, this is all metaphorical; but within that given, I see a pattern that doesn’t feel completely acceptable to me)
As for the hashtag ‘keepyourwalletclosed’, a lot of people are (that’s no effort I can assure you). But a lot of people are not, so it doesn’t have any effect. And if that would imply it’s just a great game that everybody who’s buying is satisfied and happy with, that would be fine. I even can understand why people keep buying, it isn’t all bad of course and when you basically enjoy the game why wouldn’t you. That’s just clearly not the case though, please don’t tell me it is when even gamechangers have started sending out the same messages that untill now were just reserved for ‘Negative Nancies’.
I'm not going so far as to say it's some strange psychological phenomenon because I'm in no way qualified to make that judgement but from where I stand the hashtag 'keepyourwalletclosed' would seem to have more of an impact.
At this point in the game's development most players should have a pretty good idea of what a new pack is going to bring. And if they don't there are always plenty of reviews to peruse before purchasing. Yet still they purchase. And end up disappointed, time after time, after time. And yes, this is the only simulation game of it's type. And yes, it may have been on sale, or a gift, but that's still considered a purchase and supporting the game.
Not claiming any qualification there, it’s just an observation (and like @ApparentlyAwesome says not mine) that has been baffling me increasingly. When it happened to toddlers (squeeeee!) I could understand that, also because they were so wonderfully done. But after that it became just stranger and stranger to me. Seeing how people completely hyped over stuff that was’t revolutionary at all in relation to the earlier games. That just simply comes down to people being mainly fed with hunger, teasers and promises. A clever way to not just give it to them the way they used to, just like that and immediately, but pretend it’s really hard if not impossible to do and then, when nobody expects it, they just present it, almost casually. I’m not a participant of this hashtag myself, but when a word like abuse is being connected to EA (in the meaning taking advantage of, exploiting, misusing), this is the association that springs to mind.
(not in the sense that EA is actually literally hijacking people obviously, because of course it’s just a game, this is all metaphorical; but within that given, I see a pattern that doesn’t feel completely acceptable to me)
As for the hashtag ‘keepyourwalletclosed’, a lot of people are (that’s no effort I can assure you). But a lot of people are not, so it doesn’t have any effect. And if that would imply it’s just a great game that everybody who’s buying is satisfied and happy with, that would be fine. I even can understand why people keep buying, it isn’t all bad of course and when you basically enjoy the game why wouldn’t you. That’s just clearly not the case though, please don’t tell me it is when even gamechangers have started sending out the same messages that untill now were just reserved for ‘Negative Nancies’.
I am not going to lie, I did get hyped over stairs because the way we can tweak them in a different way. I did get a bit sentimental over Realms of Magic because I knew my ex-Maxoid friend would have loved the pack and a lot of aspects were similar to the designs he created in a MMO I would play.
I was a bit confused with the use of Stockholm Syndrome since it relates to a relationship between hostages that develop a psychological alliance with their captors during captivity. I'm not imprisoned yet although I know people all over the world are held in captivity due to keeping true to their human rights. But I guess that situation of those things happening did push me to be vocal when I can because with all the craziness going on in the world, won't take much for people to turn on one another. It didn't with the Sims community. I won't be participating in this because of a promise made to a friend, but I did share the video on BobSquad discord. No idea if it will get reshared, but word of mouth and visuals are the biggest assets to use in social media tools to get change these days. Why it took this long for game changers to speak out, I don't know, but I am happy they are. It is kind of a better late than never scenario I guess. I just know it takes more than one Simmer to get change but a whole community. I am just going about it in a different way with a bread crumb effect. Talk about something enough and people will join in I've learned. Like it is not what you say but how you say it.
“Although the world is full of suffering, it is full also of the overcoming of it.” –Helen Keller
Personally, I just think it is hope, fueled with hype, and then followed with disappointment. Which then again leads to hope, fueled by hype, and then followed by disappointment.
Just like gambling addiction... The hope of a win, fueled by the hype of getting what seems like a good result, followed by disappointment, leading to hope of a better result next time.
I'm not going so far as to say it's some strange psychological phenomenon because I'm in no way qualified to make that judgement but from where I stand the hashtag 'keepyourwalletclosed' would seem to have more of an impact.
At this point in the game's development most players should have a pretty good idea of what a new pack is going to bring. And if they don't there are always plenty of reviews to peruse before purchasing. Yet still they purchase. And end up disappointed, time after time, after time. And yes, this is the only simulation game of it's type. And yes, it may have been on sale, or a gift, but that's still considered a purchase and supporting the game.
Not claiming any qualification there, it’s just an observation (and like @ApparentlyAwesome says not mine) that has been baffling me increasingly. When it happened to toddlers (squeeeee!) I could understand that, also because they were so wonderfully done. But after that it became just stranger and stranger to me. Seeing how people completely hyped over stuff that was’t revolutionary at all in relation to the earlier games. That just simply comes down to people being mainly fed with hunger, teasers and promises. A clever way to not just give it to them the way they used to, just like that and immediately, but pretend it’s really hard if not impossible to do and then, when nobody expects it, they just present it, almost casually. I’m not a participant of this hashtag myself, but when a word like abuse is being connected to EA (in the meaning taking advantage of, exploiting, misusing), this is the association that springs to mind.
(not in the sense that EA is actually literally hijacking people obviously, because of course it’s just a game, this is all metaphorical; but within that given, I see a pattern that doesn’t feel completely acceptable to me)
As for the hashtag ‘keepyourwalletclosed’, a lot of people are (that’s no effort I can assure you). But a lot of people are not, so it doesn’t have any effect. And if that would imply it’s just a great game that everybody who’s buying is satisfied and happy with, that would be fine. I even can understand why people keep buying, it isn’t all bad of course and when you basically enjoy the game why wouldn’t you. That’s just clearly not the case though, please don’t tell me it is when even gamechangers have started sending out the same messages that untill now were just reserved for ‘Negative Nancies’.
I am not going to lie, I did get hyped over stairs because the way we can tweak them in a different way. I did get a bit sentimental over Realms of Magic because I knew my ex-Maxoid friend would have loved the pack and a lot of aspects were similar to the designs he created in a MMO I would play.
I was a bit confused with the use of Stockholm Syndrome since it relates to a relationship between hostages that develop a psychological alliance with their captors during captivity. I'm not imprisoned yet although I know people all over the world are held in captivity due to keeping true to their human rights. But I guess that situation of those things happening did push me to be vocal when I can because with all the craziness going on in the world, won't take much for people to turn on one another. It didn't with the Sims community. I won't be participating in this because of a promise made to a friend, but I did share the video on BobSquad discord. No idea if it will get reshared, but word of mouth and visuals are the biggest assets to use in social media tools to get change these days. Why it took this long for game changers to speak out, I don't know, but I am happy they are. It is kind of a better late than never scenario I guess. I just know it takes more than one Simmer to get change but a whole community. I am just going about it in a different way with a bread crumb effect. Talk about something enough and people will join in I've learned. Like it is not what you say but how you say it.
I’m not blaming players for getting hyped, I blame the company that consciously develops this game in a way that encourages it. I’m an observer, not a participant, and to be honest I’m glad. I would have felt so bad if this had been going on during Sims 3, because I love that game. So it’s got nothing to do with loving the game. They started this hyping thing at the end of Sims 3 and since it only concerned Store stuff, it didn’t really affect me, though I did buy the glassblowing station because of it, but after that disappointment I didn’t fall for it anymore. Which was easy enough, Sims 3 was a rich and complete game by then.
Sims 4 is not, Sims 4 mainly promises. I see the pattern over and over again and also how it increases. Developers claiming the new pack is better than anything they ever did before and fans hyping. I don’t remember them saying that when they were releasing packs for Sims 3, did they? And did they about Sims 2 packs in relation to Sims 1? I just can’t imagine. Now they do, they constantly slate their own past in order to sell the new stuff. So people hype and the hype is bigger with every new pack. I’m not blaming players, I fell for it too once and bought JA, because that kind of gameplay happened to be my weak spot. And I even was sort of hyping the first few hours while playing because I was having fun and the jungle was a beautiful experience. The disappointment that kicked in once I realized that this was it, this was the whole experience, came as a shock. And no, I’m not exaggerating there. It felt like a cold shower.
And then there’s the features I used in my example. I perfectly understand why you got hyped over stairs, you had to wait for them for five years. They do what Sims 3 stairs do outside, take corners when you pull them down (maybe improved, I haven’t tried them myself but I’d expect them to be improved since they’re in a successor). Why did they take so many years to add L-shaped stairs? Why did terrain tools take so many years when both Sims 2 and 3 simply had that from the beginning? I predict bunk beds. I predict gamechangers making videos pulling their hair out when they hear about that, bunk beds (because crying won’t do anymore, we had squeeing, we had screaming, we had crying, must surpass that). And people saying that’s totally logical, players being excited they finally have bunk beds. The thing is, it’s not logical. Nobody went completely bananas back in 2011 when Generations came with bunk beds. That was just ‘yaay, bunk beds, that will save me room!’ So, what changed. The way EA releases their stuff, that is what changed. This hashtag is about EA, not about players. Nobody blames players.
Quite frankly, though I feel kind of supported by the fact gamechangers are speaking out now (to silence the “there’s just five whiners here on the forums, the rest of the community is glorified” claims), I also really don’t care about them. Because that’s another thing I completely don’t get. The power of a group of players like you and me who are being treated by EA to sell their stuff to people. I don’t value their opinions any more or less than the opinions of people on here. And it doesn’t take me twenty minutes of my time to read those opinions, like those videos regularly do.
It is not Stockholm syndrome. If I were going to toss any term around, it would be that the sunken cost fallacy is definitely in play, and I think that is deliberate. You see many games preying on that aspect -- it's part of the reason some people get addicted to gambling. Video game developers deliberately have tapped into that.
But Sims 4 isn't even that bad when it comes to that. What Sims 4 has is a monopoly in a popular genre that for some reason video games developers don't want to admit is popular. It's free money, basically. Yes, you can vote with your wallet, but there's nothing else out there.
“The sunk cost effect is the general tendency for people to continue an endeavor, or continue consuming or pursuing an option, if they’ve invested time or money or some resource in it,” says Christopher Olivola, an assistant professor of marketing at Carnegie Mellon’s Tepper School of Business.
“What’s done is done,” Olivola says. “There’s nothing you can do to regain money that’s lost — and pursuing something that makes you unhappy not only isn’t going to get your money back, but it’s also going to make you worse off. You’re just digging a deeper hole.”
I'm not going so far as to say it's some strange psychological phenomenon because I'm in no way qualified to make that judgement but from where I stand the hashtag 'keepyourwalletclosed' would seem to have more of an impact.
At this point in the game's development most players should have a pretty good idea of what a new pack is going to bring. And if they don't there are always plenty of reviews to peruse before purchasing. Yet still they purchase. And end up disappointed, time after time, after time. And yes, this is the only simulation game of it's type. And yes, it may have been on sale, or a gift, but that's still considered a purchase and supporting the game.
Not claiming any qualification there, it’s just an observation (and like @ApparentlyAwesome says not mine) that has been baffling me increasingly. When it happened to toddlers (squeeeee!) I could understand that, also because they were so wonderfully done. But after that it became just stranger and stranger to me. Seeing how people completely hyped over stuff that was’t revolutionary at all in relation to the earlier games. That just simply comes down to people being mainly fed with hunger, teasers and promises. A clever way to not just give it to them the way they used to, just like that and immediately, but pretend it’s really hard if not impossible to do and then, when nobody expects it, they just present it, almost casually. I’m not a participant of this hashtag myself, but when a word like abuse is being connected to EA (in the meaning taking advantage of, exploiting, misusing), this is the association that springs to mind.
(not in the sense that EA is actually literally hijacking people obviously, because of course it’s just a game, this is all metaphorical; but within that given, I see a pattern that doesn’t feel completely acceptable to me)
As for the hashtag ‘keepyourwalletclosed’, a lot of people are (that’s no effort I can assure you). But a lot of people are not, so it doesn’t have any effect. And if that would imply it’s just a great game that everybody who’s buying is satisfied and happy with, that would be fine. I even can understand why people keep buying, it isn’t all bad of course and when you basically enjoy the game why wouldn’t you. That’s just clearly not the case though, please don’t tell me it is when even gamechangers have started sending out the same messages that untill now were just reserved for ‘Negative Nancies’.
I am not going to lie, I did get hyped over stairs because the way we can tweak them in a different way. I did get a bit sentimental over Realms of Magic because I knew my ex-Maxoid friend would have loved the pack and a lot of aspects were similar to the designs he created in a MMO I would play.
I was a bit confused with the use of Stockholm Syndrome since it relates to a relationship between hostages that develop a psychological alliance with their captors during captivity. I'm not imprisoned yet although I know people all over the world are held in captivity due to keeping true to their human rights. But I guess that situation of those things happening did push me to be vocal when I can because with all the craziness going on in the world, won't take much for people to turn on one another. It didn't with the Sims community. I won't be participating in this because of a promise made to a friend, but I did share the video on BobSquad discord. No idea if it will get reshared, but word of mouth and visuals are the biggest assets to use in social media tools to get change these days. Why it took this long for game changers to speak out, I don't know, but I am happy they are. It is kind of a better late than never scenario I guess. I just know it takes more than one Simmer to get change but a whole community. I am just going about it in a different way with a bread crumb effect. Talk about something enough and people will join in I've learned. Like it is not what you say but how you say it.
I’m not blaming players for getting hyped, I blame the company that consciously develops this game in a way that encourages it. I’m an observer, not a participant, and to be honest I’m glad. I would have felt so bad if this had been going on during Sims 3, because I love that game. So it’s got nothing to do with loving the game. They started this hyping thing at the end of Sims 3 and since it only concerned Store stuff, it didn’t really affect me, though I did buy the glassblowing station because of it, but after that disappointment I didn’t fall for it anymore. Which was easy enough, Sims 3 was a rich and complete game by then.
Sims 4 is not, Sims 4 mainly promises. I see the pattern over and over again and also how it increases. Developers claiming the new pack is better than anything they ever did before and fans hyping. I don’t remember them saying that when they were releasing packs for Sims 3, did they? And did they about Sims 2 packs in relation to Sims 1? I just can’t imagine. Now they do, they constantly slate their own past in order to sell the new stuff. So people hype and the hype is bigger with every new pack. I’m not blaming players, I fell for it too once and bought JA, because that kind of gameplay happened to be my weak spot. And I even was sort of hyping the first few hours while playing because I was having fun and the jungle was a beautiful experience. The disappointment that kicked in once I realized that this was it, this was the whole experience, came as a shock. And no, I’m not exaggerating there. It felt like a cold shower.
And then there’s the features I used in my example. I perfectly understand why you got hyped over stairs, you had to wait for them for five years. They do what Sims 3 stairs do outside, take corners when you pull them down (maybe improved, I haven’t tried them myself but I’d expect them to be improved since they’re in a successor). Why did they take so many years to add L-shaped stairs? Why did terrain tools take so many years when both Sims 2 and 3 simply had that from the beginning? I predict bunk beds. I predict gamechangers making videos pulling their hair out when they hear about that, bunk beds (because crying won’t do anymore, we had squeeing, we had screaming, we had crying, must surpass that). And people saying that’s totally logical, players being excited they finally have bunk beds. The thing is, it’s not logical. Nobody went completely bananas back in 2011 when Generations came with bunk beds. That was just ‘yaay, bunk beds, that will save me room!’ So, what changed. The way EA releases their stuff, that is what changed. This hashtag is about EA, not about players. Nobody blames players.
Quite frankly, though I feel kind of supported by the fact gamechangers are speaking out now (to silence the “there’s just five whiners here on the forums, the rest of the community is glorified” claims), I also really don’t care about them. Because that’s another thing I completely don’t get. The power of a group of players like you and me who are being treated by EA to sell their stuff to people. I don’t value their opinions any more or less than the opinions of people on here. And it doesn’t take me twenty minutes of my time to read those opinions, like those videos regularly do.
Yeah I agree on the over hyped thing. I saw that with Star Wars costumes and ever since then I don't get into the hype. I actually quite like watching LGR's videos because he tends to have an unbiased opinion about packs except the SPs of course which I'm in the same wavelength with, RIP Ralph. The stairs are u-shaped too. I don't know why it feels like everything takes longer with Sims 4 than previous iterations even bug fixes. Actually been having an issue with Sims not wanting to cook or eat lately which I don't know what that is about. Honestly they better give better bunk beds this time around and I shared enough pictures of ideas for them. I do get that hyped for the pack and then the day after that it dies down fast and goes quickly back to speculation and complaining about bugs yet doing nothing about those said bugs in the process.
Yeah that seems like a more accurate description @simgirl1010 and one I can relate to with business. It is a total brand loyalty thing why people keep buying and because of lack of competition, people don't have a lot of other games to go to. I mean with Epic Games giving away games for free now ever since Origin stopped doing that, I have a nice range of games to play and stream now. I understand every iteration brings a brand new generation of Simmers and honestly a big chunk of the Sims community was probably in diapers when the first Sims game came out, so of course we aren't going to like the same things or have the same gaming experience. I was raised in a generation of 8-bit graphics, so was the peak of gaming as far as mechanics and timing and dealing with no save files. Now everything in gaming is if something looks pretty or not and honestly think it is hurting the gaming industry and making them slack on gameplay design. Thankfully Indie developers are coming through with games and bringing the gaming back into games again with beautiful stories with games like Celeste and Gris and Last Day of June that makes me feel emotions down to the core of my being again. Even Stardew Valley gives me so many feels with emotions.
Sims 4 is just missing that je ne sais quoi that the first two games had and even the third game had touched on. There is just such beauty in failure and the biggest fault with the Sims 4 is it is trying too hard to be perfect that Gurus have forgotten that the best of games are not perfect or tell perfect stories where everyone has a happy ending. The deepest of stories has highs and lows and everything in between and the people to share it with. Graphics alone don't make a game great, it is the details of the core game that does and no amount of DLC can alter that.
“Although the world is full of suffering, it is full also of the overcoming of it.” –Helen Keller
“The sunk cost effect is the general tendency for people to continue an endeavor, or continue consuming or pursuing an option, if they’ve invested time or money or some resource in it,” says Christopher Olivola, an assistant professor of marketing at Carnegie Mellon’s Tepper School of Business.
“What’s done is done,” Olivola says. “There’s nothing you can do to regain money that’s lost — and pursuing something that makes you unhappy not only isn’t going to get your money back, but it’s also going to make you worse off. You’re just digging a deeper hole.”
Yeah, sorry, I didn't think it was that obscure a term, but I suppose it is. I think as more and more games add loot boxes, gamers will hear it more and more. And people definitely need to be aware of that part of our basic psychology.
While generally I hear it referred to when discussing gamblers and investors, loot boxes have the same effect, though I could make a reasonable argument that loot boxes are gambling as well. With Sims 4, it's a bit less so. While I do think there are people buying packs hoping that it will somehow make a game they think is so-so better (I unfortunately have fallen into this category), I also think there are probably more who enjoy the game and just want more content.
Can we drop the ‘abuse’ part of this hashtag? I think all visions on that subject have been shared and it’s draws away the attention of what it’s actually about: EA most definitely taking advantage of their monopoly position. Still not sure how we as individual players can influence that (I mean, I haven’t been buying for ages myself and it doesn’t help one bit) but thát is the issue they want to adress. It’s not abuse in the violence meaning of the word and I don’t think anyone claims it is. I do see some form of Stockholm Syndrom among players though and I just do find that.... fascinating?
I’ve never looked at this way, you’re right. It *is* kinda like that. Not literally of course, but no matter how annoyed with EA... here I still am, wanting more.
You know, I’m just going to take a good look at myself, and see if this is he person I want to be. I love the sims, I do. I wouldn’t be here arguing with people if I didn’t. And I wouldn’t even mind, you guys are just the players, like me, none of us even get a say, why are *we* arguing amongst ourselves? It’s gross. But this just isn’t worth it. We are fighting over a bare bones game, still hoping a new one will fix the problems, when it goes way beyond the game.
I’ve had enough, tbh. I could quite happily just go the rest of my life playing TS2. Less stress.
I have no idea what to vote to be honest. I have no idea how popular the hashtag is and how many people share the emotion. I’m not a fan of the word abuse here, not because I fail to understand a word can have several meanings or think it can only be used for the strongest one (from now on when we say abuse we only mean the very worst case of abuse and whenever we use the word we have a respectful minute of silence first), but rather because also in the meaning of the word ‘misuse’, I don’t think it’s as simple as that. I think EA is convinced they are doing the right, modern, young, flashy thing for this franchise and clearly they have a point. This whole gamechangers nonsense for instance, that program, I just can’t get my head around the very principle it’s a good idea to favour a small group of Special Fans, hand them everything for free, listen to only them (black door? black door!) and form this clique like atmosphere around them. If every fan out there was a tiny bit like me the result would be hilarious because it would have no affect at all, it rather would completely backfire even. And there’s the thing: clearly not everybody is like me, people apparently love it. People can write down walls of thorough, very constructive feedback here, as soon as some charismatic boy or girl on YouTube fills 20 minutes to say the very same thing (or utter nonsense, that too) it all of a sudden is gospel. And right there for me is where the actual problem lies (and where I begin to feel like an alien who is unable to participate in this poll). Fans apparently loving to be treated like this. Fans going more an more over the topish crazy over stuff that was just... there in the past.
Oh, that’s a bare game... meh.
Oh, swimming pools: yaaay!
Wait what, toddlers: squeeee!
Terrain tools? Scream!!
Stairs: I’M CRYING!!! AND I’M MAKING THIS VIDEO IN WHICH YOU ALL CAN SEE I’M ACTUALLY CRYING! STAIRS!
Who am I to tell EA to listen if this clearly works this way. They run a business, if it works this way it does, good job. I mean, I’m gone (well, my money is) but what do they care As long as enough people buy and scream and cry over stuff that’s just quietly been hanging in there in the earlier games from the very beginning, they have no reason to change a thing. That’s how companies work.
All I can think when I see that hashtag now is sorry guys, but we told you so years ago, when ‘potential’ still was the magic word.
There is this really strange psychological thing going on among fans that’s just really not rational. And it’s a direct result of the way EA is releasing this game. Don’t get me wrong, from a marketing perspective I tip my hat. As a Sims fan though, I think it’s a very sad development.
And also, a lot of players have said and implied that they just can't stop buying, even though they hate the way things are going because maybe it'll get better, they have to complete the collection, they love the gurus and don't want them out of a job, we won't get The Sims 5 if The Sims 4 isn't successful.
This isn't the first time a Stolkhom Syndrome comparison or reference has been made. It's been made over the course of The Sims 4 and even before The Sims 4 was released and sometimes even the players who always buy and had strongly defended the game at the beginning were the ones who said it about themselves.
With Sims 4 MFP the main comments that stood out to me the most on here, Twitter, and Facebook were variations, 'I hate I'm going to support this,' or, 'Sadly, I'm going to buy it.'
And I didn't get it. You should be happy to buy a pack but there were people hating themselves because they were going to cave and buy it even though they disagreed with it. So why not stop buying? It makes no sense to me. I can honestly say never spent one dime on The Sims 4 because I'm tired of their practices and I won't spend money on The Sims 5 if they keep up the same trend but some players, self admittedly, cannot stop buying, no matter how much they disagree with certain practices or even if they don't like a certain pack.
Yeah this is a huge problem amongst the fan base. I just can’t fathom how somebody can literally say “this pack looks rubbish but I’ll buy it anyway” (and yes I’ve seen people actually say this. Out loud. In front of people) and then actually buy the pack. Madness.
I have no idea what to vote to be honest. I have no idea how popular the hashtag is and how many people share the emotion. I’m not a fan of the word abuse here, not because I fail to understand a word can have several meanings or think it can only be used for the strongest one (from now on when we say abuse we only mean the very worst case of abuse and whenever we use the word we have a respectful minute of silence first), but rather because also in the meaning of the word ‘misuse’, I don’t think it’s as simple as that. I think EA is convinced they are doing the right, modern, young, flashy thing for this franchise and clearly they have a point. This whole gamechangers nonsense for instance, that program, I just can’t get my head around the very principle it’s a good idea to favour a small group of Special Fans, hand them everything for free, listen to only them (black door? black door!) and form this clique like atmosphere around them. If every fan out there was a tiny bit like me the result would be hilarious because it would have no affect at all, it rather would completely backfire even. And there’s the thing: clearly not everybody is like me, people apparently love it. People can write down walls of thorough, very constructive feedback here, as soon as some charismatic boy or girl on YouTube fills 20 minutes to say the very same thing (or utter nonsense, that too) it all of a sudden is gospel. And right there for me is where the actual problem lies (and where I begin to feel like an alien who is unable to participate in this poll). Fans apparently loving to be treated like this. Fans going more an more over the topish crazy over stuff that was just... there in the past.
Oh, that’s a bare game... meh.
Oh, swimming pools: yaaay!
Wait what, toddlers: squeeee!
Terrain tools? Scream!!
Stairs: I’M CRYING!!! AND I’M MAKING THIS VIDEO IN WHICH YOU ALL CAN SEE I’M ACTUALLY CRYING! STAIRS!
Who am I to tell EA to listen if this clearly works this way. They run a business, if it works this way it does, good job. I mean, I’m gone (well, my money is) but what do they care As long as enough people buy and scream and cry over stuff that’s just quietly been hanging in there in the earlier games from the very beginning, they have no reason to change a thing. That’s how companies work.
All I can think when I see that hashtag now is sorry guys, but we told you so years ago, when ‘potential’ still was the magic word.
There is this really strange psychological thing going on among fans that’s just really not rational. And it’s a direct result of the way EA is releasing this game. Don’t get me wrong, from a marketing perspective I tip my hat. As a Sims fan though, I think it’s a very sad development.
And also, a lot of players have said and implied that they just can't stop buying, even though they hate the way things are going because maybe it'll get better, they have to complete the collection, they love the gurus and don't want them out of a job, we won't get The Sims 5 if The Sims 4 isn't successful.
This isn't the first time a Stolkhom Syndrome comparison or reference has been made. It's been made over the course of The Sims 4 and even before The Sims 4 was released and sometimes even the players who always buy and had strongly defended the game at the beginning were the ones who said it about themselves.
With Sims 4 MFP the main comments that stood out to me the most on here, Twitter, and Facebook were variations, 'I hate I'm going to support this,' or, 'Sadly, I'm going to buy it.'
And I didn't get it. You should be happy to buy a pack but there were people hating themselves because they were going to cave and buy it even though they disagreed with it. So why not stop buying? It makes no sense to me. I can honestly say never spent one dime on The Sims 4 because I'm tired of their practices and I won't spend money on The Sims 5 if they keep up the same trend but some players, self admittedly, cannot stop buying, no matter how much they disagree with certain practices or even if they don't like a certain pack.
Yeah this is a huge problem amongst the fan base. I just can’t fathom how somebody can literally say “this pack looks rubbish but I’ll buy it anyway” (and yes I’ve seen people actually say this. Out loud. In front of people) and then actually buy the pack. Madness.
—T
I agree, I don't really understand that kind of approach.
Granted, I had next to no interest in GF and do have it now. But then, it cost me 5€, so there's that. So to an extent I understand the urge to complete the collection, I just don't ever see myself doing something like this at full price of the packs.
@Felicity I actually do enjoy Sims4 but it has failed to grow, content wise, as Sims2 and 3 grew with the addition of new packs. The expansion packs in 2 and 3 took me months of playing them before I felt I had experienced all those had to offer. And they actually expanded the game. Now the packs are built to appeal to some, but not to all, players. Any expansion done to the game now, is done through updates and patches. And those are free. Why buy anything new, when we get more for free, is how I feel at this point. Down the road if a new pack does appeal to me and I believe it will add something new to my game, I'll wait for it to go on sale at half price. The days of buying new packs at full price are over. That's why I cannot wrap my brain around the fact so many players are still falling for the hype that inevitably leads to disappointment and even anger; yet they continue to believe the next pack will miraculously transform a so-so game into a great game. This is especially true when the gurus start tweeting little hints and teasers, which then leads us down a winding, dark path littered with speculation and unfounded rumors that always leads to the forum blowing up. So, yes, I do believe it is time to take this beyond the forums, and let EA know exactly how much we dislike the way it does business, but in a global arena, and across every media platform out there.
This is not the first time EA has had to change its business practices. It has happened before, and things did change for the better. For a couple of years. Understanding EA does not have total power over any of us is the key. We have options and the freedom to exercise those options at any time. EA is a corporation and cannot survive without the financial support of the people buying its products. Yes, Sims4 is just a game, but it is a product EA publishes and we buy it. We have the right to expect satisfaction in what we buy. Overall customer satisfaction in Sims4 is very low at the moment. Because we continue to buy new packs that do not meet our expectations, and in spite of all the hype surrounding each new pack, it never measures up to what we were lead to believe it would be. I can't handle being disappointed time after time before throwing up my hands in disgust and closing my wallet. Which is exactly what I have done after Island Living and the Moschino stuff pack were released. I thought about buying RoM but it wasn't up to my standards so I passed on it. And it wasn't that difficult to do. Say no to spending money on poorly made products. It is just that simple. If we don't hold off on blindly purchasing everything EA puts out, nothing will ever change. If one can't say no, wait until that pack goes on sale and maybe then the disappointment won't hurt quite as much. As for myself, I am taking back my power by making sure my credit card stays in my wallet.
It is not Stockholm syndrome. If I were going to toss any term around, it would be that the sunken cost fallacy is definitely in play, and I think that is deliberate. You see many games preying on that aspect -- it's part of the reason some people get addicted to gambling. Video game developers deliberately have tapped into that.
But Sims 4 isn't even that bad when it comes to that. What Sims 4 has is a monopoly in a popular genre that for some reason video games developers don't want to admit is popular. It's free money, basically. Yes, you can vote with your wallet, but there's nothing else out there.
Good point (the sunk cost fallacy), there’s most definitely that. That just explains the continuing buying though doesn’t it (and it only applies to those who are not satisfied with the game, not the ones that just continue buying because they genuinely like the content)? But the increasing over the top enthousiasm for something that was just there in the past, the “I have elbows” phenomenon, that seems like a different mechanism to me.
I don’t care what you call it, I just see it happening and I don’t like it.
It is not Stockholm syndrome. If I were going to toss any term around, it would be that the sunken cost fallacy is definitely in play, and I think that is deliberate. You see many games preying on that aspect -- it's part of the reason some people get addicted to gambling. Video game developers deliberately have tapped into that.
But Sims 4 isn't even that bad when it comes to that. What Sims 4 has is a monopoly in a popular genre that for some reason video games developers don't want to admit is popular. It's free money, basically. Yes, you can vote with your wallet, but there's nothing else out there.
Good point (the sunk cost fallacy), there’s most definitely that. That just explains the continuing buying though doesn’t it (and it only applies to those who are not satisfied with the game, not the ones that just continue buying because they genuinely like the content)? But the increasing over the top enthousiasm for something that was just there in the past, the “I have elbows” phenomenon, that seems like a different mechanism to me.
I don’t care what you call it, I just see it happening and I don’t like it.
I think it's basic lower expectations along with social media/peer pressure. I hope this doesn't tick anyone off, but social media and game changers are brilliant for marketing. People are social creatures, and other people's opinions often affect our own (as much as we like to think we're all independent thinkers and come to our own unbiased conclusions, our community often influences our opinions). You can see this in wider culture, where it's not a hive mind, but what is acceptable is different between various cultures and subcultures. I think social media has its own societies with varying cultures, and people who identify with various parts will be influenced by opinions of other people in those cultures.
Me of 10 years ago would not have even paid attention to the Sims 4; my video game buying habits are far different now that I'm on game forums than they were when I was not. I used to never get excited about upcoming games -- when a game looked interesting and went on sale, provided it wasn't completely panned by reviewers, I'd get it. If I wasn't blown away by the game, I'd be annoyed that I spent the money then go back to a different game. But I enjoy the social aspect of forums. However, another thing with Sims 4 that I've noticed; if I wait a week, I lose interest in buying a pack as the bug reports come in.
It is not Stockholm syndrome. If I were going to toss any term around, it would be that the sunken cost fallacy is definitely in play, and I think that is deliberate. You see many games preying on that aspect -- it's part of the reason some people get addicted to gambling. Video game developers deliberately have tapped into that.
But Sims 4 isn't even that bad when it comes to that. What Sims 4 has is a monopoly in a popular genre that for some reason video games developers don't want to admit is popular. It's free money, basically. Yes, you can vote with your wallet, but there's nothing else out there.
Good point (the sunk cost fallacy), there’s most definitely that. That just explains the continuing buying though doesn’t it (and it only applies to those who are not satisfied with the game, not the ones that just continue buying because they genuinely like the content)? But the increasing over the top enthousiasm for something that was just there in the past, the “I have elbows” phenomenon, that seems like a different mechanism to me.
I don’t care what you call it, I just see it happening and I don’t like it.
I think it's basic lower expectations along with social media/peer pressure. I hope this doesn't tick anyone off, but social media and game changers are brilliant for marketing. People are social creatures, and other people's opinions often affect our own (as much as we like to think we're all independent thinkers and come to our own unbiased conclusions, our community often influences our opinions). You can see this in wider culture, where it's not a hive mind, but what is acceptable is different between various cultures and subcultures. I think social media has its own societies with varying cultures, and people who identify with various parts will be influenced by opinions of other people in those cultures.
Me of 10 years ago would not have even paid attention to the Sims 4; my video game buying habits are far different now that I'm on game forums than they were when I was not. I used to never get excited about upcoming games -- when a game looked interesting and went on sale, provided it wasn't completely panned by reviewers, I'd get it. If I wasn't blown away by the game, I'd be annoyed that I spent the money then go back to a different game. But I enjoy the social aspect of forums. However, another thing with Sims 4 that I've noticed; if I wait a week, I lose interest in buying a pack as the bug reports come in.
Absolutely true (bold), but another aspect undoubtedly is the fact that people are left with a feeling something won’t be added, they’ll have to learn and accept it’s not in the game, and then all of a sudden when they least expect it (after years of waiting) they get it anyway. That is a marketing trick of course. To make something common (in terms of nothing new, nothing never done before) feel like a very special gift. A gift players have to feel really grateful for.
The social hyping definitely is an ingredient too, you’re right about that. That’s why I know exactly when that started: the Store sets early 2014. Introduced by riddles on Twitter, they’d never done that before. And it made you feel like this was something really special, you had to get it! I seriously fell for it and bought that first set. And was very underwhelmed (and as you may know Store set don’t come cheap). There’s a very ‘agressive’, convincing strategy behind that kind of advertising.
It is not Stockholm syndrome. If I were going to toss any term around, it would be that the sunken cost fallacy is definitely in play, and I think that is deliberate. You see many games preying on that aspect -- it's part of the reason some people get addicted to gambling. Video game developers deliberately have tapped into that.
But Sims 4 isn't even that bad when it comes to that. What Sims 4 has is a monopoly in a popular genre that for some reason video games developers don't want to admit is popular. It's free money, basically. Yes, you can vote with your wallet, but there's nothing else out there.
Good point (the sunk cost fallacy), there’s most definitely that. That just explains the continuing buying though doesn’t it (and it only applies to those who are not satisfied with the game, not the ones that just continue buying because they genuinely like the content)? But the increasing over the top enthousiasm for something that was just there in the past, the “I have elbows” phenomenon, that seems like a different mechanism to me.
I don’t care what you call it, I just see it happening and I don’t like it.
I think it's basic lower expectations along with social media/peer pressure. I hope this doesn't tick anyone off, but social media and game changers are brilliant for marketing. People are social creatures, and other people's opinions often affect our own (as much as we like to think we're all independent thinkers and come to our own unbiased conclusions, our community often influences our opinions). You can see this in wider culture, where it's not a hive mind, but what is acceptable is different between various cultures and subcultures. I think social media has its own societies with varying cultures, and people who identify with various parts will be influenced by opinions of other people in those cultures.
Me of 10 years ago would not have even paid attention to the Sims 4; my video game buying habits are far different now that I'm on game forums than they were when I was not. I used to never get excited about upcoming games -- when a game looked interesting and went on sale, provided it wasn't completely panned by reviewers, I'd get it. If I wasn't blown away by the game, I'd be annoyed that I spent the money then go back to a different game. But I enjoy the social aspect of forums. However, another thing with Sims 4 that I've noticed; if I wait a week, I lose interest in buying a pack as the bug reports come in.
Absolutely true (bold), but another aspect undoubtedly is the fact that people are left with a feeling something won’t be added, they’ll have to learn and accept it’s not in the game, and then all of a sudden when they least expect it (after years of waiting) they get it anyway. That is a marketing trick of course. To make something common (in terms of nothing new, nothing never done before) feel like a very special gift. A gift players have to feel really grateful for.
The social hyping definitely is an ingredient too, you’re right about that. That’s why I know exactly when that started: the Store sets early 2014. Introduced by riddles on Twitter, they’d never done that before. And it made you feel like this was something really special, you had to get it! I seriously fell for it and bought that first set. And was very underwhelmed (and as you may know Store set don’t come cheap). There’s a very ‘agressive’, convincing strategy behind that kind of advertising.
The Sims 3 store... It showed me something about myself I didn't like. I was very lucky that I had the time to watch ads and play around with the daily deals and CYS cascades, but I still bought a couple of the big sim point bundles. It's very easy to get caught in the excitement (and I'm not sure why it was exciting), and when the goodie boxes came out, I also bought a few -- fortunately, I was lucky and able to combine them with CYS cascades. So as much as I like to think I'd never get caught up with loot boxes, I got caught up with loot boxes, luckily I didn't lose much, and I know to not buy any type of game currency for any reason.
Towards the end, they were doing this "make a deal" spin type thing; my last few spins, they just gave me the rest of the items. It was amusing, but it also made me realize just how all of those things are designed to suck people in and forget they're spending real money.
@Felicity I didn't quite fall down that rabbit hole but I've gotten so close with Freeplay's "bundles" and such.
It's so annoying that microtransactions are so popular with developers/publishers (and they're popular because people do spend money on them), especially when it gets to the point where you can't actually do things without paying extra (90% of all mobile games, ever). And it's way too easy to think "hey, this is only 2$, it's fine" until you end up doing it 40 times or more. This is why I'm hoping that kinda system - per item or small bundle of items prices - comes to The Sims. But well, hopes and dreams and all that.
@Felicity I didn't quite fall down that rabbit hole but I've gotten so close with Freeplay's "bundles" and such.
It's so annoying that microtransactions are so popular with developers/publishers (and they're popular because people do spend money on them), especially when it gets to the point where you can't actually do things without paying extra (90% of all mobile games, ever). And it's way too easy to think "hey, this is only 2$, it's fine" until you end up doing it 40 times or more. This is why I'm hoping that kinda system - per item or small bundle of items prices - comes to The Sims. But well, hopes and dreams and all that.
It's funny, for me it was like solving a puzzle. Using daily deals to start the CYS cascades and seeing how much I could get for free while strategically spending simpoints. Between that and ads, many, I wasted a lot of time, but at that point, I had nothing but time anyway. I spent over $300 on the store, but it could have been much, much worse. And I still use it. I'm pretty sure I have spent the same or more on the Sims 4.
I remember when the Sims 4 "beta" came out -- it was CAS. I had no intention of buying Sims 4 at that point as I was still happily playing Sims 3, but once I learned that the beta was actually fairly small, I was curious. The way Maxis handled it made a lot of people angry, but I think it also was very effective at drawing people in. People generally want to feel like they're part of a special group, so as the beta expanded, people were feeling good about getting in. Really, though CAS is pretty good in Sims 4, I think they got a lot more people into it by releasing it the way they did.
Comments
True! I speak european portuguese and its exactly the same!
There is this really strange psychological thing going on among fans that’s just really not rational. And it’s a direct result of the way EA is releasing this game. Don’t get me wrong, from a marketing perspective I tip my hat. As a Sims fan though, I think it’s a very sad development.
And also, a lot of players have said and implied that they just can't stop buying, even though they hate the way things are going because maybe it'll get better, they have to complete the collection, they love the gurus and don't want them out of a job, we won't get The Sims 5 if The Sims 4 isn't successful.
This isn't the first time a Stolkhom Syndrome comparison or reference has been made. It's been made over the course of The Sims 4 and even before The Sims 4 was released and sometimes even the players who always buy and had strongly defended the game at the beginning were the ones who said it about themselves.
With Sims 4 MFP the main comments that stood out to me the most on here, Twitter, and Facebook were variations, 'I hate I'm going to support this,' or, 'Sadly, I'm going to buy it.'
And I didn't get it. You should be happy to buy a pack but there were people hating themselves because they were going to cave and buy it even though they disagreed with it. So why not stop buying? It makes no sense to me. I can honestly say never spent one dime on The Sims 4 because I'm tired of their practices and I won't spend money on The Sims 5 if they keep up the same trend but some players, self admittedly, cannot stop buying, no matter how much they disagree with certain practices or even if they don't like a certain pack.
At this point in the game's development most players should have a pretty good idea of what a new pack is going to bring. And if they don't there are always plenty of reviews to peruse before purchasing. Yet still they purchase. And end up disappointed, time after time, after time. And yes, this is the only simulation game of it's type. And yes, it may have been on sale, or a gift, but that's still considered a purchase and supporting the game.
(not in the sense that EA is actually literally hijacking people obviously, because of course it’s just a game, this is all metaphorical; but within that given, I see a pattern that doesn’t feel completely acceptable to me)
As for the hashtag ‘keepyourwalletclosed’, a lot of people are (that’s no effort I can assure you). But a lot of people are not, so it doesn’t have any effect. And if that would imply it’s just a great game that everybody who’s buying is satisfied and happy with, that would be fine. I even can understand why people keep buying, it isn’t all bad of course and when you basically enjoy the game why wouldn’t you. That’s just clearly not the case though, please don’t tell me it is when even gamechangers have started sending out the same messages that untill now were just reserved for ‘Negative Nancies’.
I was a bit confused with the use of Stockholm Syndrome since it relates to a relationship between hostages that develop a psychological alliance with their captors during captivity. I'm not imprisoned yet although I know people all over the world are held in captivity due to keeping true to their human rights. But I guess that situation of those things happening did push me to be vocal when I can because with all the craziness going on in the world, won't take much for people to turn on one another. It didn't with the Sims community. I won't be participating in this because of a promise made to a friend, but I did share the video on BobSquad discord. No idea if it will get reshared, but word of mouth and visuals are the biggest assets to use in social media tools to get change these days. Why it took this long for game changers to speak out, I don't know, but I am happy they are. It is kind of a better late than never scenario I guess. I just know it takes more than one Simmer to get change but a whole community. I am just going about it in a different way with a bread crumb effect. Talk about something enough and people will join in I've learned. Like it is not what you say but how you say it.
Just like gambling addiction... The hope of a win, fueled by the hype of getting what seems like a good result, followed by disappointment, leading to hope of a better result next time.
Sims 4 is not, Sims 4 mainly promises. I see the pattern over and over again and also how it increases. Developers claiming the new pack is better than anything they ever did before and fans hyping. I don’t remember them saying that when they were releasing packs for Sims 3, did they? And did they about Sims 2 packs in relation to Sims 1? I just can’t imagine. Now they do, they constantly slate their own past in order to sell the new stuff. So people hype and the hype is bigger with every new pack. I’m not blaming players, I fell for it too once and bought JA, because that kind of gameplay happened to be my weak spot. And I even was sort of hyping the first few hours while playing because I was having fun and the jungle was a beautiful experience. The disappointment that kicked in once I realized that this was it, this was the whole experience, came as a shock. And no, I’m not exaggerating there. It felt like a cold shower.
That’s packs: rumours, ‘leaking’, teasers, hyping, buying, playing, disappointment.
And then there’s the features I used in my example. I perfectly understand why you got hyped over stairs, you had to wait for them for five years. They do what Sims 3 stairs do outside, take corners when you pull them down (maybe improved, I haven’t tried them myself but I’d expect them to be improved since they’re in a successor). Why did they take so many years to add L-shaped stairs? Why did terrain tools take so many years when both Sims 2 and 3 simply had that from the beginning? I predict bunk beds. I predict gamechangers making videos pulling their hair out when they hear about that, bunk beds (because crying won’t do anymore, we had squeeing, we had screaming, we had crying, must surpass that). And people saying that’s totally logical, players being excited they finally have bunk beds. The thing is, it’s not logical. Nobody went completely bananas back in 2011 when Generations came with bunk beds. That was just ‘yaay, bunk beds, that will save me room!’ So, what changed. The way EA releases their stuff, that is what changed. This hashtag is about EA, not about players. Nobody blames players.
Quite frankly, though I feel kind of supported by the fact gamechangers are speaking out now (to silence the “there’s just five whiners here on the forums, the rest of the community is glorified” claims), I also really don’t care about them. Because that’s another thing I completely don’t get. The power of a group of players like you and me who are being treated by EA to sell their stuff to people. I don’t value their opinions any more or less than the opinions of people on here. And it doesn’t take me twenty minutes of my time to read those opinions, like those videos regularly do.
But Sims 4 isn't even that bad when it comes to that. What Sims 4 has is a monopoly in a popular genre that for some reason video games developers don't want to admit is popular. It's free money, basically. Yes, you can vote with your wallet, but there's nothing else out there.
Sunk Cost Fallacy
“The sunk cost effect is the general tendency for people to continue an endeavor, or continue consuming or pursuing an option, if they’ve invested time or money or some resource in it,” says Christopher Olivola, an assistant professor of marketing at Carnegie Mellon’s Tepper School of Business.
“What’s done is done,” Olivola says. “There’s nothing you can do to regain money that’s lost — and pursuing something that makes you unhappy not only isn’t going to get your money back, but it’s also going to make you worse off. You’re just digging a deeper hole.”
https://www.google.com/amp/s/time.com/5347133/sunk-cost-fallacy-decisions/?amp=true
Yeah that seems like a more accurate description @simgirl1010 and one I can relate to with business. It is a total brand loyalty thing why people keep buying and because of lack of competition, people don't have a lot of other games to go to. I mean with Epic Games giving away games for free now ever since Origin stopped doing that, I have a nice range of games to play and stream now. I understand every iteration brings a brand new generation of Simmers and honestly a big chunk of the Sims community was probably in diapers when the first Sims game came out, so of course we aren't going to like the same things or have the same gaming experience. I was raised in a generation of 8-bit graphics, so was the peak of gaming as far as mechanics and timing and dealing with no save files. Now everything in gaming is if something looks pretty or not and honestly think it is hurting the gaming industry and making them slack on gameplay design. Thankfully Indie developers are coming through with games and bringing the gaming back into games again with beautiful stories with games like Celeste and Gris and Last Day of June that makes me feel emotions down to the core of my being again. Even Stardew Valley gives me so many feels with emotions.
Sims 4 is just missing that je ne sais quoi that the first two games had and even the third game had touched on. There is just such beauty in failure and the biggest fault with the Sims 4 is it is trying too hard to be perfect that Gurus have forgotten that the best of games are not perfect or tell perfect stories where everyone has a happy ending. The deepest of stories has highs and lows and everything in between and the people to share it with. Graphics alone don't make a game great, it is the details of the core game that does and no amount of DLC can alter that.
Yeah, sorry, I didn't think it was that obscure a term, but I suppose it is. I think as more and more games add loot boxes, gamers will hear it more and more. And people definitely need to be aware of that part of our basic psychology.
While generally I hear it referred to when discussing gamblers and investors, loot boxes have the same effect, though I could make a reasonable argument that loot boxes are gambling as well. With Sims 4, it's a bit less so. While I do think there are people buying packs hoping that it will somehow make a game they think is so-so better (I unfortunately have fallen into this category), I also think there are probably more who enjoy the game and just want more content.
I’ve never looked at this way, you’re right. It *is* kinda like that. Not literally of course, but no matter how annoyed with EA... here I still am, wanting more.
You know, I’m just going to take a good look at myself, and see if this is he person I want to be. I love the sims, I do. I wouldn’t be here arguing with people if I didn’t. And I wouldn’t even mind, you guys are just the players, like me, none of us even get a say, why are *we* arguing amongst ourselves? It’s gross. But this just isn’t worth it. We are fighting over a bare bones game, still hoping a new one will fix the problems, when it goes way beyond the game.
I’ve had enough, tbh. I could quite happily just go the rest of my life playing TS2. Less stress.
—T
Yeah this is a huge problem amongst the fan base. I just can’t fathom how somebody can literally say “this pack looks rubbish but I’ll buy it anyway” (and yes I’ve seen people actually say this. Out loud. In front of people) and then actually buy the pack. Madness.
—T
I agree, I don't really understand that kind of approach.
Granted, I had next to no interest in GF and do have it now. But then, it cost me 5€, so there's that. So to an extent I understand the urge to complete the collection, I just don't ever see myself doing something like this at full price of the packs.
This is not the first time EA has had to change its business practices. It has happened before, and things did change for the better. For a couple of years. Understanding EA does not have total power over any of us is the key. We have options and the freedom to exercise those options at any time. EA is a corporation and cannot survive without the financial support of the people buying its products. Yes, Sims4 is just a game, but it is a product EA publishes and we buy it. We have the right to expect satisfaction in what we buy. Overall customer satisfaction in Sims4 is very low at the moment. Because we continue to buy new packs that do not meet our expectations, and in spite of all the hype surrounding each new pack, it never measures up to what we were lead to believe it would be. I can't handle being disappointed time after time before throwing up my hands in disgust and closing my wallet. Which is exactly what I have done after Island Living and the Moschino stuff pack were released. I thought about buying RoM but it wasn't up to my standards so I passed on it. And it wasn't that difficult to do. Say no to spending money on poorly made products. It is just that simple. If we don't hold off on blindly purchasing everything EA puts out, nothing will ever change. If one can't say no, wait until that pack goes on sale and maybe then the disappointment won't hurt quite as much. As for myself, I am taking back my power by making sure my credit card stays in my wallet.
I don’t care what you call it, I just see it happening and I don’t like it.
I think it's basic lower expectations along with social media/peer pressure. I hope this doesn't tick anyone off, but social media and game changers are brilliant for marketing. People are social creatures, and other people's opinions often affect our own (as much as we like to think we're all independent thinkers and come to our own unbiased conclusions, our community often influences our opinions). You can see this in wider culture, where it's not a hive mind, but what is acceptable is different between various cultures and subcultures. I think social media has its own societies with varying cultures, and people who identify with various parts will be influenced by opinions of other people in those cultures.
Me of 10 years ago would not have even paid attention to the Sims 4; my video game buying habits are far different now that I'm on game forums than they were when I was not. I used to never get excited about upcoming games -- when a game looked interesting and went on sale, provided it wasn't completely panned by reviewers, I'd get it. If I wasn't blown away by the game, I'd be annoyed that I spent the money then go back to a different game. But I enjoy the social aspect of forums. However, another thing with Sims 4 that I've noticed; if I wait a week, I lose interest in buying a pack as the bug reports come in.
The social hyping definitely is an ingredient too, you’re right about that. That’s why I know exactly when that started: the Store sets early 2014. Introduced by riddles on Twitter, they’d never done that before. And it made you feel like this was something really special, you had to get it! I seriously fell for it and bought that first set. And was very underwhelmed (and as you may know Store set don’t come cheap). There’s a very ‘agressive’, convincing strategy behind that kind of advertising.
The Sims 3 store... It showed me something about myself I didn't like. I was very lucky that I had the time to watch ads and play around with the daily deals and CYS cascades, but I still bought a couple of the big sim point bundles. It's very easy to get caught in the excitement (and I'm not sure why it was exciting), and when the goodie boxes came out, I also bought a few -- fortunately, I was lucky and able to combine them with CYS cascades. So as much as I like to think I'd never get caught up with loot boxes, I got caught up with loot boxes, luckily I didn't lose much, and I know to not buy any type of game currency for any reason.
Towards the end, they were doing this "make a deal" spin type thing; my last few spins, they just gave me the rest of the items. It was amusing, but it also made me realize just how all of those things are designed to suck people in and forget they're spending real money.
And that's my confession of the day
It's so annoying that microtransactions are so popular with developers/publishers (and they're popular because people do spend money on them), especially when it gets to the point where you can't actually do things without paying extra (90% of all mobile games, ever). And it's way too easy to think "hey, this is only 2$, it's fine" until you end up doing it 40 times or more. This is why I'm hoping that kinda system - per item or small bundle of items prices - comes to The Sims. But well, hopes and dreams and all that.
It's funny, for me it was like solving a puzzle. Using daily deals to start the CYS cascades and seeing how much I could get for free while strategically spending simpoints. Between that and ads, many, I wasted a lot of time, but at that point, I had nothing but time anyway. I spent over $300 on the store, but it could have been much, much worse. And I still use it. I'm pretty sure I have spent the same or more on the Sims 4.
I remember when the Sims 4 "beta" came out -- it was CAS. I had no intention of buying Sims 4 at that point as I was still happily playing Sims 3, but once I learned that the beta was actually fairly small, I was curious. The way Maxis handled it made a lot of people angry, but I think it also was very effective at drawing people in. People generally want to feel like they're part of a special group, so as the beta expanded, people were feeling good about getting in. Really, though CAS is pretty good in Sims 4, I think they got a lot more people into it by releasing it the way they did.