Will add my rave to the list. To me, the difference between TS2 & TS4 is like that between a Rolls Royce and a Toyota. Some other TS1 distinctives: The type of host podium determined what type of restaurant you got, fancy or Joe's Diner. Each type of clothing had a distinctive rack. There were real sidewalk vendor carts where one could get burgers or hot dogs. There were 3 types of fast food counters - pastry, ice cream, and sandwiches - and each of them had several options. There was a little pond where you could either feed the fish or sail a little boat. There was a little shack where you could get fish food, the boats, or picknic baskets that actually enabled a picknic.
I've seen a few discussions about Create A World recently and if it will come out for TS4. I can't recall which guru said it so I'm having difficulty finding the tweet, but they have said that releasing CAW would be a possibility at some point in the future. I personally think it will be an endgame prospect, only coming along once the official content is out of the way; being able to download free worlds would be a much better option for those who are interested in packs like Island Watching Living as it would mean they don't have to spend money.
TS4 has the ability to travel between neighbourhoods at any time, which is an advantage over previous titles as there's more open to you as a player, but it was possible in TS3 - but only if you were willing to use mods. Even in TS3, with certain packs you had a few locations opened up like the World Adventures destinations and the future in Into The Future. In the original game there were subhoods like Studio Town and Magic Town, all of which offered unique and exclusive things to do, and then in TS2 you had subhoods as well like the University district, Downtown, Bluewater Village and more.
The developers have stated in the past that making worlds on the scale of Windenburg in TS4 is difficult to do due to their size and scale. Going by that, any CAW tool would most likely have its limitations in regards to making large neighbourhoods. TS4 generally relies more on having many individual neighbourhoods to visit rather than one built up one.
So here's Windenburg, which has 14 residential lots and 13 community lots for a total of 27 lots. It's around this scale that worlds in TS4 are considered to be large.
This is Simmer Teolida's, a player with a soft spot for urban development, plan for a neighbourhood in TS2. The base game came with CAW and this started from a blank map. When completed, this world would consist of 231 lots, 55 tower blocks, 599 walk-up blocks and 164 houses. Buildings in TS2 could be built up to 14 storeys high following University using the sethighestallowedlevel cheat, so urban projects and high rises were possible.
Here's the finished result.
Every floor of every building in this neighbourhood is fully interactable. If you can see a building then you can visit that building, edit every part of that building and interact with that building. Pair this with subhoods, which also come with a lot of space to make use of, and you can quite easily surpass TS4 in lot count even with all of its neighbourhoods being joined.
Impressive! In addition, if you have Sim City 4, you can make more maps. With enough time, skill, and patience you could make any city on the planet and have it in your game, though London would probably take an awful lot of maps and 'worlds' to do.
This is a great post and only makes me wish I could play TS2 to see all of this for myself. Alas, I don't have a copy. But it does make me realize (not that I didn't before) that even TS3 is vastly superior to TS4, even if TS3 is lacking features that TS2 had.
Realm of Magic, for me, will be the last pack I purchase for TS4, especially at full price. It's hard to want to support a game that even the developers don't seem to care that much about. Or at least, are constantly creating content that's always, as you've called TS4 Sims, skin deep.
I don't do any storytelling or blogging now but back in the day when I did I was ecstatic when my sims' thought bubbles aligned with whatever story I was playing out. And also provided ideas for subsequent gameplay.
Yes, I believed this, too. lol I was like how did you know that? lol It was exactly what I was thinking I should do next etc.
Then attonish me by looking in the camera (back at me) and doing it again or winking..I was like omg, Maxis is in my mind! lol
Edit to add: so I don't spam this thread. TS2 Sims could jump over things unlike TS4 which Sims just go through them. In NL when they all want to sit at the table with the sectional booth, one will jump over the table to get the seat closest to the wall which is blocked by the table. I'm disppointed this was never expanded (jumping fences etc.) in the game, and I don't see any of that sort of AI in TS4. Only markers removed so they can walk through (clip) an object.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
There is way too much clipping in 4. I routinely see things that in 2 could onlly be done by adding some ghost traits (walk through walls/objects/people) in Simpe. In 2 sims actually need to pick up dishes to wash, in 4 they levitate as soon as the sim is even remotely close by. Way too many areas of superiority to list, but the general feeling is that those devs watched how real people do things and then coded so sims would do it the same way. Don't have that feeling now in 4, too loose and sloppy.
There is way too much clipping in 4. I routinely see things that in 2 could onlly be done by adding some ghost traits (walk through walls/objects/people) in Simpe. In 2 sims actually need to pick up dishes to wash, in 4 they levitate as soon as the sim is even remotely close by. Way too many areas of superiority to list, but the general feeling is that those devs watched how real people do things and then coded so sims would do it the same way. Don't have that feeling now in 4, too loose and sloppy.
TS2 has a lot of animations that TS4 doesn't and that's where my feeling of cutting corners comes from. In 2 a Sim would open a wardrobe/pull out a drawer before changing clothes, after which they'd close it again. In 4 they just stand in front of the wardrobe without ever actually touching it.
In 2 a Sim would open drawers in counters to take out utensils when cooking and would actually open the cupboard section to get things like bowls. In 4 what they need to use just magically appears and they don't interact with counters at all.
In 2, as Cinebar said, Sims would play games like pool or chess in a highly detailed fashion; you could watch every single individual move and the game would play out from start to finish. In 4 they take one move in games and the whole board has changed.
In 2 you had to tune pianos after prolonged use. Sims would open up their tops and fiddle around with the mechanisms, testing keys every now and then to make sure it sounded decent. No maintenance whatsoever in 4. On the subject of maintenance you had to actually water flowers and shrubs in your garden - you had to make an effort to keep it looking nice. In 4 you just put down decorative plants and boom, done. In 2 you also had to wind clocks and they actually told the in game time if maintained. Grandfather clocks even chimed at the correct times.
TS2 had so much more love and care put into it. Little details all added up for a higher quality product.
Will add my rave to the list. To me, the difference between TS2 & TS4 is like that between a Rolls Royce and a Toyota. Some other TS1 distinctives: The type of host podium determined what type of restaurant you got, fancy or Joe's Diner. Each type of clothing had a distinctive rack. There were real sidewalk vendor carts where one could get burgers or hot dogs. There were 3 types of fast food counters - pastry, ice cream, and sandwiches - and each of them had several options. There was a little pond where you could either feed the fish or sail a little boat. There was a little shack where you could get fish food, the boats, or picknic baskets that actually enabled a picknic.
I drive a Toyota. The experience is nothing like Sims 4 I assure you.
Am simply comparing the difference between the ultimate luxury car with one designed for ordinary mortals and applying that gap to that between TS2 & 4. If the Toyota experience was anything like the TS4 experience, Toyota would not be selling cars any longer. TS2 is like Old World craftsmanship compared to TS4's quick and dirty.
Principle of Entropy: Right on! Love, care, and attention to even the little details makes all the difference. How much of the shortfall lies with the devs and how much with EA, have no idea.
Am simply comparing the difference between the ultimate luxury car with one designed for ordinary mortals and applying that gap to that between TS2 & 4. If the Toyota experience was anything like the TS4 experience, Toyota would not be selling cars any longer. TS2 is like Old World craftsmanship compared to TS4's quick and dirty.
I understand what you’re saying but I’m not sure if I fully agree with the comparison. Toyota is solid and reliable. Sims 4 is not. Sims 2 is. I disagree we need ‘ultimate luxury’, we need solid and reliable, we need quality. I’m an ordinary mortal and I’d love a game designed for me. Sims 2, if anything, was for ordinary mortals too. Sims 2 actually was Toyota, Sims 4 just an attempt to recreate a Toyota but it only looks like a Toyota, it doesn’t drive like one.
(Sims 3 in this comparison would be a Citroën (in the seventies): innovative, daring, but with unfortunate flaws)(I love Citroëns from the seventies).
Sidebar: I thought that it was only me who noticed the empty venues. The liveliness of public lots was one of the things that TS4 had going for it. These days, I try to take screenshots at public venues but, they are strangely empty in comparison to how they used to be. I have to use mods to spawn more Sims because the game doesn't. I wonder what changed?
I've noticed this too!
I was really excited when I first sent my sim out on the town in sims 4 and the venue they went to was PACKED, unlike sims 3 where you'd get the notice that it was a hot spot, and your sim would walk in and stare at the DJ who was the only one in there and then turn around and leave lol.
But lately this seems to be shifting... is it because there's more lots now for sims to pick from? I thought sims kinda... just Loaded In when you were loading the lot / traveling...
Am simply comparing the difference between the ultimate luxury car with one designed for ordinary mortals and applying that gap to that between TS2 & 4. If the Toyota experience was anything like the TS4 experience, Toyota would not be selling cars any longer. TS2 is like Old World craftsmanship compared to TS4's quick and dirty.
I understand what you’re saying but I’m not sure if I fully agree with the comparison. Toyota is solid and reliable. Sims 4 is not. Sims 2 is. I disagree we need ‘ultimate luxury’, we need solid and reliable, we need quality. I’m an ordinary mortal and I’d love a game designed for me. Sims 2, if anything, was for ordinary mortals too. Sims 2 actually was Toyota, Sims 4 just an attempt to recreate a Toyota but it only looks like a Toyota, it doesn’t drive like one.
(Sims 3 in this comparison would be a Citroën (in the seventies): innovative, daring, but with unfortunate flaws)(I love Citroëns from the seventies).
For me Sims 4 is like an Hyundai or Kia for me and yes Sims 2 an Toyota and you are right as long as you keep up with the maintenance shedule it will serve you well and I do drive an Toyota, Sims 3 more like an Buick for me.
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Am simply comparing the difference between the ultimate luxury car with one designed for ordinary mortals and applying that gap to that between TS2 & 4. If the Toyota experience was anything like the TS4 experience, Toyota would not be selling cars any longer. TS2 is like Old World craftsmanship compared to TS4's quick and dirty.
I understand what you’re saying but I’m not sure if I fully agree with the comparison. Toyota is solid and reliable. Sims 4 is not. Sims 2 is. I disagree we need ‘ultimate luxury’, we need solid and reliable, we need quality. I’m an ordinary mortal and I’d love a game designed for me. Sims 2, if anything, was for ordinary mortals too. Sims 2 actually was Toyota, Sims 4 just an attempt to recreate a Toyota but it only looks like a Toyota, it doesn’t drive like one.
(Sims 3 in this comparison would be a Citroën (in the seventies): innovative, daring, but with unfortunate flaws)(I love Citroëns from the seventies).
For me Sims 4 is like an Hyundai or Kia for me and yes Sims 2 an Toyota and you are right as long as you keep up with the maintenance shedule it will serve you well and I do drive an Toyota, Sims 3 more like an Buick for me.
Haha, I don’t know the characteristics of a Buick I fear.
Am simply comparing the difference between the ultimate luxury car with one designed for ordinary mortals and applying that gap to that between TS2 & 4. If the Toyota experience was anything like the TS4 experience, Toyota would not be selling cars any longer. TS2 is like Old World craftsmanship compared to TS4's quick and dirty.
I understand what you’re saying but I’m not sure if I fully agree with the comparison. Toyota is solid and reliable. Sims 4 is not. Sims 2 is. I disagree we need ‘ultimate luxury’, we need solid and reliable, we need quality. I’m an ordinary mortal and I’d love a game designed for me. Sims 2, if anything, was for ordinary mortals too. Sims 2 actually was Toyota, Sims 4 just an attempt to recreate a Toyota but it only looks like a Toyota, it doesn’t drive like one.
(Sims 3 in this comparison would be a Citroën (in the seventies): innovative, daring, but with unfortunate flaws)(I love Citroëns from the seventies).
For me Sims 4 is like an Hyundai or Kia for me and yes Sims 2 an Toyota and you are right as long as you keep up with the maintenance shedule it will serve you well and I do drive an Toyota, Sims 3 more like an Buick for me.
Haha, I don’t know the characteristics of a Buick I fear.
I always saw older people driving Buicks like the Lacrosse which I wanted one because of the handling when I was coming up. I think Buick went out of business, nope they still building them.
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There is way too much clipping in 4. I routinely see things that in 2 could onlly be done by adding some ghost traits (walk through walls/objects/people) in Simpe. In 2 sims actually need to pick up dishes to wash, in 4 they levitate as soon as the sim is even remotely close by. Way too many areas of superiority to list, but the general feeling is that those devs watched how real people do things and then coded so sims would do it the same way. Don't have that feeling now in 4, too loose and sloppy.
I put some of the blame of the slot popping on players/consumers. They did read feedback, and over time I think Maxis got it into their heads that players felt too much time was spent on animations they could eliminate in a future game. I can't tell you how many times players would say they played in ultra speed. (They miss so much). They would say it took too long for this or that. So, TS4 shows up to leave out so many animations such as getting a pot out of the cabinet, getting clothes out of a drawer, actually touching and picking up dishes, actually having to walk to a trash can or a pc, having to walk to a phone (none in TS4) to answer a phone, no touching or using a car door handle in TS3 etc.
I can think those comments and gripes that changed the game came from those who played the games in ultra speed to be able to complete goals and never stop to smell the roses. They were never happy with the time it took to simulate an animation and here we are today, with games that have hardly any simulation in them and people seem quite content with those browser game/mobile game short cuts. Or TS4 wouldn't have made so much money. But for someone like me I don't see a point in a life simulator removing the simulation. A different type player they had garnered are who are driving developers to make such short cuts and they are happy with those short cuts or we would see more feedback, and to me if you start implementing every genre out there into The Sims you wind up with what we have now. Short cuts and fluff, and less gameplay. Others don't miss the simulation, I do. But this started in TS3, long before TS3 with complaints of the time it took to walk, and do something. They can say it was open world, and budget and performance and all that, but a different type player started playing back in 2004, and we started to see more and more complaints and mods to just cut out simulation and get to the goals and add in every questy genre there is to a life simulator.
ETA: and developers do look at mods consumers use. Never having to walk to a dresser (TS4 doesn't even need a dresser) and just clicking on the Sim to change outfit is from a mod created back in TS2. But Maxis goes even futher and just removes the animation of the dresser. The dresser, now, is just fluff and not even needed. Of course I appreciate not having to buy a dresser for my Sim since there is no point in it anymore, but it's a life simulator, the changing clothes of the Sim should have remained a cheat and the need for a dresser should have remained. But that is in direct feedback from players and they don't even realise their Sim doesn't need a dresser at all anymore and it's just decor in that respect. More clutter though you can click it, but even it's animations are removed. And no one but me is fussing about a float that a click instantly gives a Sim the sunblock they need...they don't even have to get off their duff. But no one complains about that one but me. That is the whole problem, no one cares anymore. Only a handful.
Post edited by Cinebar on
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
I see myself as one of the handful, one that appreciates the details of simulation. Depending on the game I sometimes have objectives, but still like to go at a normal pace and enjoy the ride. It's the journey that matters. Never noticed the TS3 changes as was still in 2 (never got into 3, too incompatible with my play style), so going to 4 was like hitting a stone wall. Pretty, but. I think part of it is the culture change. Those of us of the older generation know that it takes time to get things done, whether a game or dinner (let alone the big things like strong close relationships or sollid careers). We now live in a culture that idolizes instant gratification, so it is not surprising that attitude is reflected in games. I fear that any TS5 will be even worse, rather than the restoration various folks here think/hope it will be.
Am simply comparing the difference between the ultimate luxury car with one designed for ordinary mortals and applying that gap to that between TS2 & 4. If the Toyota experience was anything like the TS4 experience, Toyota would not be selling cars any longer. TS2 is like Old World craftsmanship compared to TS4's quick and dirty.
I understand what you’re saying but I’m not sure if I fully agree with the comparison. Toyota is solid and reliable. Sims 4 is not. Sims 2 is. I disagree we need ‘ultimate luxury’, we need solid and reliable, we need quality. I’m an ordinary mortal and I’d love a game designed for me. Sims 2, if anything, was for ordinary mortals too. Sims 2 actually was Toyota, Sims 4 just an attempt to recreate a Toyota but it only looks like a Toyota, it doesn’t drive like one.
(Sims 3 in this comparison would be a Citroën (in the seventies): innovative, daring, but with unfortunate flaws)(I love Citroëns from the seventies).
For me Sims 4 is like an Hyundai or Kia for me and yes Sims 2 an Toyota and you are right as long as you keep up with the maintenance shedule it will serve you well and I do drive an Toyota, Sims 3 more like an Buick for me.
Haha, I don’t know the characteristics of a Buick I fear.
In the old days a Buick was aimed at the 'we made it' crowd, the upper middle class, hence older folks 40s and up. Maybe my original comparison should have been more on the lines (being an American car type) a Chevy/Ford/Plymouth vs a Yugo. Will admit TS4 looks better than Yugos.
Just realised that I forgot to cover the fury system and to add more detail to the fact that relationships weren't mutual in the early games. The fury system used to lead to all sorts of chaos if you didn't take measures against it once it came into play, especially if it was triggered between Sims in the same household. Drama actually had a lasting impact and varying impacts depending on what had actually happened; a simple argument would trigger the fury state for around a day or so whilst something major like cheating would trigger it for an in game week. Non-mutual relationships also mean by default that there's more to consider when making friends.
Mean interactions in TS4 in general feel very watered down and very weak. The word I've always used to describe it is sterilised. I can't for the life of me remember which member of the team said it, but I remember a discussion where it was said that certain interactions in the mean category were deemed as abusive. I specifically remember how scenes like below were mentioned (with pointing, flinching and the like) and labelled as abusive. That was also why the slap interaction was moved to the new mischief category from the mean category.
Considering what's actually possible in TS4 if you want to go the vengeful deity route, I find that pretty laughable.
As far as comparsion:
Connection between the sims in the world.
In the sims 3 when your Sim gossips with another sims, a little notification would show up and it was like ''Miss crumplebottom is actually rich''.
Which when you would check that household out, you would see it was actually the truth. Such a nice little detail and made me feel, the sims living in this town know each other.
In the Sims 2 ... there was a big green ?arrow? in the world view, which showed the gamer, which sims know each other.
now they can not even make sure that sims that should have a relationship to each other have one. (Gallery Sims)
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Its sad. Maxis and the developers dont acknowledge sims and personalities at all. You can litterally write a wall of text and all they care is add inclusive stuff and create a safe space, while leave the most disered wishes up to the modders.
I mean can they at least tell us that it is not possible to change the things, like they did confirm that open world will never happen in the sims 4? Because after 5years in, its just plain ridicoulous.
I think (and kinda hope) that university goes the same path as island living. leaving simmers bored after 2 days. I hope that the real 🐸🐸🐸🐸 storm arrives about wanting sims with more personalities.
I thought 2019 was pretty lazy for the sims4. a lot of reused animations, a lot of little effort.
They just add new stuff, but it ends up doing THE SAME THING.
They dont think the dlcs through and it comes off halfed baked.
The community now days has low expectations of future packs, just because the past shows us, how little of detail they put into it overall...
Happy simming (or not since i needed a break from playing.
Sims4-fatigued)
Suspect your 'kinda hope' is accurate, regardless of what the next pack is (has EA officially said University, or is this just mass 'I want university, so that's what it's going to be' fantasy). The track record is too consistent, lots of hype with little actual delivery.
And no one but me is fussing about a float that a click instantly gives a Sim the sunblock they need...they don't even have to get off their duff. But no one complains about that one but me. That is the whole problem, no one cares anymore. Only a handful.
I agree with everything that you said in your post. Yet, I'm a bit surprised by this last bit. Do you mean that clicking on the float automatically applies sunblock with no animation of putting it on? If so, that well and truly bites. If you mean that they don't have to go and get the sunblock from somewhere else, yeah, that's been a longstanding issue with the series. The Sims' pockets seem to function like some kind of Tardis (or a bag of holding for fellow D&D fans).
There is way too much clipping in 4. I routinely see things that in 2 could onlly be done by adding some ghost traits (walk through walls/objects/people) in Simpe. In 2 sims actually need to pick up dishes to wash, in 4 they levitate as soon as the sim is even remotely close by. Way too many areas of superiority to list, but the general feeling is that those devs watched how real people do things and then coded so sims would do it the same way. Don't have that feeling now in 4, too loose and sloppy.
TS2 has a lot of animations that TS4 doesn't and that's where my feeling of cutting corners comes from. In 2 a Sim would open a wardrobe/pull out a drawer before changing clothes, after which they'd close it again. In 4 they just stand in front of the wardrobe without ever actually touching it.
In 2 a Sim would open drawers in counters to take out utensils when cooking and would actually open the cupboard section to get things like bowls. In 4 what they need to use just magically appears and they don't interact with counters at all.
In 2, as Cinebar said, Sims would play games like pool or chess in a highly detailed fashion; you could watch every single individual move and the game would play out from start to finish. In 4 they take one move in games and the whole board has changed.
In 2 you had to tune pianos after prolonged use. Sims would open up their tops and fiddle around with the mechanisms, testing keys every now and then to make sure it sounded decent. No maintenance whatsoever in 4. On the subject of maintenance you had to actually water flowers and shrubs in your garden - you had to make an effort to keep it looking nice. In 4 you just put down decorative plants and boom, done. In 2 you also had to wind clocks and they actually told the in game time if maintained. Grandfather clocks even chimed at the correct times.
TS2 had so much more love and care put into it. Little details all added up for a higher quality product.
I always forgot to water flowers, lol, and they would die and have to remove the plots, lol. But I really enjoyed the weeds that grew from cat pee or my Sim's accidents and or spills and rain puddles, it made a great lot filled with weeds, they had to pick.
I really enjoyed, as silly as it is, when my Sim would get out of bed and directed (click on closet) to get dressed they would move clothes on the racks and look like they were picking an outfit. Little details really do matter to me. And I'm not one to fuss about things like but it takes too much time! lol, Simulation is the whole point to me, maybe not others. I raved the day TS4 came along and didn't even animate clocks, that still grinds my gears to the hilt. lol Excellence-TS2 clocks keep the time with the game clock. That is depth to detail.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
Comments
TS4 has the ability to travel between neighbourhoods at any time, which is an advantage over previous titles as there's more open to you as a player, but it was possible in TS3 - but only if you were willing to use mods. Even in TS3, with certain packs you had a few locations opened up like the World Adventures destinations and the future in Into The Future. In the original game there were subhoods like Studio Town and Magic Town, all of which offered unique and exclusive things to do, and then in TS2 you had subhoods as well like the University district, Downtown, Bluewater Village and more.
The developers have stated in the past that making worlds on the scale of Windenburg in TS4 is difficult to do due to their size and scale. Going by that, any CAW tool would most likely have its limitations in regards to making large neighbourhoods. TS4 generally relies more on having many individual neighbourhoods to visit rather than one built up one.
So here's Windenburg, which has 14 residential lots and 13 community lots for a total of 27 lots. It's around this scale that worlds in TS4 are considered to be large.
This is Simmer Teolida's, a player with a soft spot for urban development, plan for a neighbourhood in TS2. The base game came with CAW and this started from a blank map. When completed, this world would consist of 231 lots, 55 tower blocks, 599 walk-up blocks and 164 houses. Buildings in TS2 could be built up to 14 storeys high following University using the sethighestallowedlevel cheat, so urban projects and high rises were possible.
Here's the finished result.
Every floor of every building in this neighbourhood is fully interactable. If you can see a building then you can visit that building, edit every part of that building and interact with that building. Pair this with subhoods, which also come with a lot of space to make use of, and you can quite easily surpass TS4 in lot count even with all of its neighbourhoods being joined.
Here's Teoalida's website if you want to see more.
https://teoalida.com/thesims/starlingsprings-urban-city/
Realm of Magic, for me, will be the last pack I purchase for TS4, especially at full price. It's hard to want to support a game that even the developers don't seem to care that much about. Or at least, are constantly creating content that's always, as you've called TS4 Sims, skin deep.
Yes, I believed this, too. lol I was like how did you know that? lol It was exactly what I was thinking I should do next etc.
Then attonish me by looking in the camera (back at me) and doing it again or winking..I was like omg, Maxis is in my mind! lol
Edit to add: so I don't spam this thread. TS2 Sims could jump over things unlike TS4 which Sims just go through them. In NL when they all want to sit at the table with the sectional booth, one will jump over the table to get the seat closest to the wall which is blocked by the table. I'm disppointed this was never expanded (jumping fences etc.) in the game, and I don't see any of that sort of AI in TS4. Only markers removed so they can walk through (clip) an object.
TS2 has a lot of animations that TS4 doesn't and that's where my feeling of cutting corners comes from. In 2 a Sim would open a wardrobe/pull out a drawer before changing clothes, after which they'd close it again. In 4 they just stand in front of the wardrobe without ever actually touching it.
In 2 a Sim would open drawers in counters to take out utensils when cooking and would actually open the cupboard section to get things like bowls. In 4 what they need to use just magically appears and they don't interact with counters at all.
In 2, as Cinebar said, Sims would play games like pool or chess in a highly detailed fashion; you could watch every single individual move and the game would play out from start to finish. In 4 they take one move in games and the whole board has changed.
In 2 you had to tune pianos after prolonged use. Sims would open up their tops and fiddle around with the mechanisms, testing keys every now and then to make sure it sounded decent. No maintenance whatsoever in 4. On the subject of maintenance you had to actually water flowers and shrubs in your garden - you had to make an effort to keep it looking nice. In 4 you just put down decorative plants and boom, done. In 2 you also had to wind clocks and they actually told the in game time if maintained. Grandfather clocks even chimed at the correct times.
TS2 had so much more love and care put into it. Little details all added up for a higher quality product.
(Sims 3 in this comparison would be a Citroën (in the seventies): innovative, daring, but with unfortunate flaws)(I love Citroëns from the seventies).
I've noticed this too!
I was really excited when I first sent my sim out on the town in sims 4 and the venue they went to was PACKED, unlike sims 3 where you'd get the notice that it was a hot spot, and your sim would walk in and stare at the DJ who was the only one in there and then turn around and leave lol.
But lately this seems to be shifting... is it because there's more lots now for sims to pick from? I thought sims kinda... just Loaded In when you were loading the lot / traveling...
For me Sims 4 is like an Hyundai or Kia for me and yes Sims 2 an Toyota and you are right as long as you keep up with the maintenance shedule it will serve you well and I do drive an Toyota, Sims 3 more like an Buick for me.
I always saw older people driving Buicks like the Lacrosse which I wanted one because of the handling when I was coming up. I think Buick went out of business, nope they still building them.
I put some of the blame of the slot popping on players/consumers. They did read feedback, and over time I think Maxis got it into their heads that players felt too much time was spent on animations they could eliminate in a future game. I can't tell you how many times players would say they played in ultra speed. (They miss so much). They would say it took too long for this or that. So, TS4 shows up to leave out so many animations such as getting a pot out of the cabinet, getting clothes out of a drawer, actually touching and picking up dishes, actually having to walk to a trash can or a pc, having to walk to a phone (none in TS4) to answer a phone, no touching or using a car door handle in TS3 etc.
I can think those comments and gripes that changed the game came from those who played the games in ultra speed to be able to complete goals and never stop to smell the roses. They were never happy with the time it took to simulate an animation and here we are today, with games that have hardly any simulation in them and people seem quite content with those browser game/mobile game short cuts. Or TS4 wouldn't have made so much money. But for someone like me I don't see a point in a life simulator removing the simulation. A different type player they had garnered are who are driving developers to make such short cuts and they are happy with those short cuts or we would see more feedback, and to me if you start implementing every genre out there into The Sims you wind up with what we have now. Short cuts and fluff, and less gameplay. Others don't miss the simulation, I do. But this started in TS3, long before TS3 with complaints of the time it took to walk, and do something. They can say it was open world, and budget and performance and all that, but a different type player started playing back in 2004, and we started to see more and more complaints and mods to just cut out simulation and get to the goals and add in every questy genre there is to a life simulator.
ETA: and developers do look at mods consumers use. Never having to walk to a dresser (TS4 doesn't even need a dresser) and just clicking on the Sim to change outfit is from a mod created back in TS2. But Maxis goes even futher and just removes the animation of the dresser. The dresser, now, is just fluff and not even needed. Of course I appreciate not having to buy a dresser for my Sim since there is no point in it anymore, but it's a life simulator, the changing clothes of the Sim should have remained a cheat and the need for a dresser should have remained. But that is in direct feedback from players and they don't even realise their Sim doesn't need a dresser at all anymore and it's just decor in that respect. More clutter though you can click it, but even it's animations are removed. And no one but me is fussing about a float that a click instantly gives a Sim the sunblock they need...they don't even have to get off their duff. But no one complains about that one but me. That is the whole problem, no one cares anymore. Only a handful.
In the old days a Buick was aimed at the 'we made it' crowd, the upper middle class, hence older folks 40s and up. Maybe my original comparison should have been more on the lines (being an American car type) a Chevy/Ford/Plymouth vs a Yugo. Will admit TS4 looks better than Yugos.
Mean interactions in TS4 in general feel very watered down and very weak. The word I've always used to describe it is sterilised. I can't for the life of me remember which member of the team said it, but I remember a discussion where it was said that certain interactions in the mean category were deemed as abusive. I specifically remember how scenes like below were mentioned (with pointing, flinching and the like) and labelled as abusive. That was also why the slap interaction was moved to the new mischief category from the mean category.
Considering what's actually possible in TS4 if you want to go the vengeful deity route, I find that pretty laughable.
I wish they would overhaul the personalities and implement even just some of these features from TS2 but I dont even think its possible at this point.
Connection between the sims in the world.
In the sims 3 when your Sim gossips with another sims, a little notification would show up and it was like ''Miss crumplebottom is actually rich''.
Which when you would check that household out, you would see it was actually the truth. Such a nice little detail and made me feel, the sims living in this town know each other.
In the Sims 2 ... there was a big green ?arrow? in the world view, which showed the gamer, which sims know each other.
now they can not even make sure that sims that should have a relationship to each other have one. (Gallery Sims)
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Its sad. Maxis and the developers dont acknowledge sims and personalities at all. You can litterally write a wall of text and all they care is add inclusive stuff and create a safe space, while leave the most disered wishes up to the modders.
I mean can they at least tell us that it is not possible to change the things, like they did confirm that open world will never happen in the sims 4? Because after 5years in, its just plain ridicoulous.
I think (and kinda hope) that university goes the same path as island living. leaving simmers bored after 2 days. I hope that the real 🐸🐸🐸🐸 storm arrives about wanting sims with more personalities.
I thought 2019 was pretty lazy for the sims4. a lot of reused animations, a lot of little effort.
They just add new stuff, but it ends up doing THE SAME THING.
They dont think the dlcs through and it comes off halfed baked.
The community now days has low expectations of future packs, just because the past shows us, how little of detail they put into it overall...
Happy simming (or not since i needed a break from playing.
Sims4-fatigued)
I agree with everything that you said in your post. Yet, I'm a bit surprised by this last bit. Do you mean that clicking on the float automatically applies sunblock with no animation of putting it on? If so, that well and truly bites. If you mean that they don't have to go and get the sunblock from somewhere else, yeah, that's been a longstanding issue with the series. The Sims' pockets seem to function like some kind of Tardis (or a bag of holding for fellow D&D fans).
I always forgot to water flowers, lol, and they would die and have to remove the plots, lol. But I really enjoyed the weeds that grew from cat pee or my Sim's accidents and or spills and rain puddles, it made a great lot filled with weeds, they had to pick.
I really enjoyed, as silly as it is, when my Sim would get out of bed and directed (click on closet) to get dressed they would move clothes on the racks and look like they were picking an outfit. Little details really do matter to me. And I'm not one to fuss about things like but it takes too much time! lol, Simulation is the whole point to me, maybe not others. I raved the day TS4 came along and didn't even animate clocks, that still grinds my gears to the hilt. lol Excellence-TS2 clocks keep the time with the game clock. That is depth to detail.