Hey everyone, just wanted to come on here to say, we DO want your feedback. Constructive criticism is always welcome. We do read your posts, we do pay attention. As I've said in many other places, we cannot always respond. We would prefer not to say anything until we have something definitive to say. We are looking at so many things in the game. Fixing bugs is a priority, as is adding new gameplay elements and expanding the content. We have been working hard on the Mac version of the game and have released new content every month since launch. We will continue to bring players new content as well as addressing bugs. Your feedback is invaluable.
OFF TOPIC: Oh, and if someone can tell me how to get my signature pic to actually align on the left, I would be really grateful.
I'm not on a bandwagon. I played the game, and I didn't care for it as a whole. I liked CAS, I thought the kids were very well done, but I lost interest in the game. Some people happen to share my opinion, that doesn't make it a "bandwagon," it's just that with any game some people will like it and some people won't.
Maybe it's not that people feel like they have to dislike it because everyone else does, maybe it just doesn't resonate with as much of the audience as TS1 - 3 did. In my mind they took some baffling steps backwards. It's easy to say "it's a new game," sure. But it's also a part of a series. If you're going to come out with the next game in the series and put a substantial price tag on it, well, you should make sure that there's a good reason to buy it. "Not that bad" but not that good either. It's just simple business. Who's going to buy the next version of Photoshop if it does less than its predecessor, for instance? You're not going to see anyone sell "New and improved, now with fewer features than the last one!" I gave TS4 a chance, but every time I played I found myself struggling to enjoy it. And I finally realized if I had to try that hard, I may as well just shelve the game and play something else.
I don't think the negative reaction is all about jumping on a bandwagon. I think it's simply the fallout of a few missteps in development. If it had more to offer more people would like it.
I'm not on a bandwagon. I played the game, and I didn't care for it as a whole. I liked CAS, I thought the kids were very well done, but I lost interest in the game. Some people happen to share my opinion, that doesn't make it a "bandwagon," it's just that with any game some people will like it and some people won't.
Maybe it's not that people feel like they have to dislike it because everyone else does, maybe it just doesn't resonate with as much of the audience as TS1 - 3 did. In my mind they took some baffling steps backwards. It's easy to say "it's a new game," sure. But it's also a part of a series. If you're going to come out with the next game in the series and put a substantial price tag on it, well, you should make sure that there's a good reason to buy it. "Not that bad" but not that good either. It's just simple business. Who's going to buy the next version of Photoshop if it does less than its predecessor, for instance? You're not going to see anyone sell "New and improved, now with fewer features than the last one!" I gave TS4 a chance, but every time I played I found myself struggling to enjoy it. And I finally realized if I had to try that hard, I may as well just shelve the game and play something else.
I don't think the negative reaction is all about jumping on a bandwagon. I think it's simply the fallout of a few missteps in development. If it had more to offer more people would like it.
A grounded response. I dropped TS4 two weeks after release. I've been playing TS3 and other games in the meantime between then and now. Recently returned back to TS4 and I find myself enjoying it. I think it has a lot to do with realising that I don't have to embrace TS4 solely in lieu of other versions.
I think that's something a lot of other people have yet to realise. You're not a Simmer because you play with the latest shiney in the series, but you're a Simmer because you love the Sims. And of the Sims there's plenty to go around.
I find Sims 4 to be quite fun...I enjoy the emotions because they make for an interesting gameplay, and the way the Sims look? Wow! They're beautiful. The #1 reason I got this game was because of the pretty much fully customizable CAS...being able to drag their features exactly how you want them? Makes for many more unique Sims. With 2 and 3 pretty much all we had were some presets, and with 3 there were sliders, but that doesn't beat what we have with 4.
Also, the ability to change aspirations! I love that! Its more realistic because normal people don't choose just one thing they want for their entire life. Also, it makes playing with children more fun in my opinion. The different childhood aspirations gives me a goal to work toward. I'm currently trying to get at least one child to fulfill all the aspirations....because why not?
Yeah, it stinks that theres no toddlers and open world, but that's not really as big of a deal to me as it seems to be to other simmers...I don't get frustrated really because I began to view this game as a completely new game rather than as a continuation of the Sims series. It really helps with being able to enjoy the good aspects of it (for there are many), instead of focusing on the downsides.
I feel as if there is a huge bandwagon in regards to TS4. People feel like they have to hate it because it seems like everyone else does. I myself have fallen prey to this mindset while reading people's opinions, but then I went back and played again and thought "hmm, its really not so bad..."
The fact of the matter is, EA took a new approach to the game which, apparently, failed. They can see that they failed and all they can do now is try to make it better, and they ARE trying. Because of the games' horrible reception, the budget is now quite low. Its going to be harder to fix the base game AND release an expansion, which seems to be what the simmers are demanding. They can't please everyone. All they can do is their best.
So instead of complaining about what we don't like and what might not be able to be changed, let's focus on what we DO like and maybe everyone will be able to enjoy the game more. The simgurus can hear us and they know what we want. Telling them a trillion times the same thing isn't going to accomplish anything.
I was going to let this just sit right here, however, I am going to respond. No, it's not a bad game 'IF' it had been sold for Console and or Tablet.
What you find appealing is generally what players who enjoyed The Sims on console like in those versions. I suppose as a Character Creation it is anywhere from o.k. to meh. Because, as nice as it is to push and pull on Sims, the lack of personality given to them diminishes the whole concept wouldn't you have to agree? And as much as you can model them in ways we couldn't do before, it's somewhat lack luster to say 'customization' when you can't really customize anything about them other than body parts. So, that's a 'meh'.
I have a zillion 'O.K.' games. And you know what, I rarely play them. I start to play them and think, meh, I will play something I find amazing and more appealing.
Considering the 'aspirations' and thinking 'real people' don't aspire to do 'one' thing in their life tells me you haven't been around long, people who have aspired to reach one goal in their life, no matter how far or out of reach are actually very lucky they got to spend their entire life chasing their dream, when the most of us 'must' change many times before we find that 'one aspiration' and or lucky enough to be able to pursue it. So, that's not exactly true nor keeping true with 'real life' in this game, if you can just swamp on a dime, and abandon your core being.
That's why the other games had cheats to change. Or either given in a reward to change with an object or gained reward somehow.
Staying on point about the 'aspirations' it seems people who do love the console games do find the grind of these appealing and that is because they are played out much like the busy work in console games.
I don't know about you or anyone else, but no, I'm not part of a 'group think'. Or mob mentality. I can actually reason and work out things for myself without outside influence. And I would say if I think something is just 'O.K' I'm probably not going to use that product again, and or go to that place again, or try that thing again. No matter what it is.
If EA would like me to actually 'view' this game as a different game once removed from the series, like a distant cousin, then it would have been better for them to not have called it The Sims '4'. But sold it on console or tablet and or even Co op, because to be honest it would have been a better game if it had been for console.
Because like me, those who have played this series for years, (many) when we want to get our game time on, for the 'PC Series' we actually prefer to do that on the PC, where the game is fully fleshed out and offers much more in 'life simulation' than say what the console versions did.
So, it's not a matter of hate, and or mob mentality, it's that most of us have played all versions of these games, even on their phones, and we know what is what, and we see this one isn't for PC.
I disagree that its what we wanted I am all for new and different. This game isn't like the rest and it shouldn't be just because it is a sequel to the series but I was expecting it to have everything past games had. I really don't think its like a console version or a mobile game if it was then I would definitely hate it. But going into the series you very much expect certain things and have your own expectations and it didn't meet yours. But not all of us feel this game is not good. I love the way it is and personally having way to many options to customize is overwhelming to me. The open world in TS3 was ok but it made the game lag for some without having mods it was basically a nightmare to play. Toddlers I really despise they are cute and adorable but they are also the one of the age groups I could do without. I always felt like I was raising satans children in my game. I don't like rotational play so its fine we are confined to playing just one house. The loading screens are tolerable at the moment but if this game gets more content who know how much people will tolerate right now TS2 loads faster for me. I am not saying the game doesn't have flaws or bugs that I feel I shouldn't have to use a mod to fix it. But it also has a lot of potential to be better then all the sims games. Time will tell for some and the ones that already love the game like me we will keep enjoying it.
I never got the "The Sims 4 is a completely different game" argument. What is so different in it? Emotions? Multitasking? Build mode and CAS?
How about all the things that are exactly like the predecessors? The world functionality is exactly like that of The Sims 1 (a game that is, mind you, from 2000). The object-like babies and no family trees are, surprise surprise, from The Sims 1. The closed worlds are once again from The Sims 1 and The Sims 2. No terrain editing is...well, that was something that was IN The Sims 1, so I guess that's a bad one to pick. There's much more of the gameplay that behaves like the predecessors as well, so I fail to see how this is a "completely new Sims game."
There's also the "potential" argument. Well that one is quite subjective really. You may see a lot of potential, some may not. I see potential for the game to be acceptably decent, I don't see potential for it to surpass its predecessors. I also don't see my play style returning anytime soon either.
The formula they kept in The Sims 2 was ideal and logical, and ever since The Sims 2 they've been unable to reproduce it. They cannot create a balanced game, period. If X features worked great in the core of The Sims 1, 2 and 3, it'd make sense to adopt them into the sequel. If Y features were potentially great concepts but flawed in the execution (open worlds for example), it'd make sense to overhaul them and not go backwards. There's so much feedback from 14 years of this franchise that I honestly don't know how they've gotten so lost. Then there's the fact that they don't seem to be very good at game development, and that the publisher is constantly making poor management decisions which relatively affect the development team.
Anyways, I'm not on any bandwagon. I as well as everyone else can make an informed decision of whether they consider the game great, fantastic, okay, sub-par or downright awful. I spent years learning most of everything regarding The Sims 3 and while it did enable me to overhaul the game to my liking, it showed me just how bad they coded so many things and the same is happening here already. The fact that the same database structure and prone corruptions from 2004 are still present in 2015 is baffling and shows a lack of progression and learning. I'm perfectly fine skipping TS4 all together, I don't feel like I'm missing out on anything that the predecessors don't already have and better. I don't feel like I can mod and overhaul the game to my liking either, too many restrictions and limits. The only reason why there's a small spark of hope that they can turn this around is because I love the franchise and have been involved in it for 13 years.
I would like to post in support of the OP and I think he/she should keep her/his signature intact - EA still need a bit of slap if they are going to restore their rep with gamers.
I am a newcomer to the Sims, but not other game forums. Two things have really stood out to me. The first, is that many players of the sims do not appear to play another game and, secondly, there is a suspicion against mods. This means that long time player have high expectations, IMO. In my experience, high expectations lead to the greatest disappointments.
I bought this game for about the same price as I bought BulletStorm when it came out. I loved that game for all it's trashiness - a playthrough is about six hours, four or five if you know what you are doing ( could provide many more examples). The enjoyable playtime I have had from the Sims 4 has blown this way and I'm still far from done
I bought this game on a whim, if I am gonna be honest, thinking it would provide some amusement for a cold, wet weekend and kind of assumed it would end up the following week gathering virtual dust like a lot of the games in my Steam library. It hasn't.
The AI totally fascinated me. I was one of those that used to mess around with them embedded java artificial life programs that were knocking about in the 90s - flocking birds, foxes and rabbits, and such like.
Yeah, of course these Sims do dumb stuff - it's computer code. Still, a very, very interesting development in game tech, IMO. Cool 🐸🐸🐸🐸.
I have posted before the Technical Simulation discussion on this site is awesome until it gets derailed at about page 20. The stuff these guys are trying to do is is brilliant, IMO. If anyone with some power is reading, please, please more discussions like that- very heavily moderated.
Did they completely pull it off. No, they didn't, for whatever reason. Those reasons will always be speculative to us, regardless of how long threads grow. We can take informed guesses. Unfocused by management because of focus on mobile, young, old, kidults, aliens (choose your guess); not enough money; no management will, etc etc etc.
Previous games don't disintegrate when a new ones came out. They are still available to play. Hell, EA virtually gave me my TS2 UC. I can play it in all it's glory. I, personally, don't want another exactly like that, but prettier. I want something new, something experimental. Sims 4 has provided that, IMO. It is far from perfect and I could go into a long rant about what is wrong with it, but as the OP has pointed out, I think that message has been delivered. Whether a satisfactory reply is forthcoming remains to be seen.
My hope is that they continue to put the bulk of their effort into the Sims themselves, because if they nail that, then later generations of the game will be truly incredible, IMO.
Awake.
Shake dreams from your hair
My pretty child, my sweet one.
Choose the day and choose the sign of your day
The day's divinity.... The Ghost Song - Jim Morrison
My belief on these forums is that if you dislike the game, that's fine. Make as many threads as you want discussing why you dislike it, just don't call people names, tell them they have to dislike it too, or tell them how they have to play their game.
If you like the game, that's fine. Make as many threads as you want discussing why you like it, just don't call people names, tell them they have to it too, or tell others how they have to play their game.
Personally, I like sims 4. On the forums I don't see myself on a "side." I'm okay discussing with anyone on the forums. I step out of the post if mud slinging starts happening, even if it's not towards me. I actually have taken a few breaks from this forum. In the beginning there were trolls on both "sides" that really ruined the forum experience for me. I have also taken a break when I couldn't stand all the name calling, again from both "sides." I may take another break soon with the chaos that is starting to happen once more because of the whole expansion pack delay announcement. I personally don't understand why people get so upset at other simmers, why simmers start calling each other names, start acting like they are somehow more superior over others. We are all simmers even if not currently playing sims 4, many are still playing the sims. Now I'm not saying all simmers do this, but it seems to be pretty common.
My belief on these forums is that if you dislike the game, that's fine. Make as many threads as you want discussing why you dislike it, just don't call people names, tell them they have to dislike it too, or tell them how they have to play their game.
If you like the game, that's fine. Make as many threads as you want discussing why you like it, just don't call people names, tell them they have to it too, or tell others how they have to play their game.
Personally, I like sims 4. On the forums I don't see myself on a "side." I'm okay discussing with anyone on the forums. I step out of the post if mud slinging starts happening, even if it's not towards me. I actually have taken a few breaks from this forum. In the beginning there were trolls on both "sides" that really ruined the forum experience for me. I have also taken a break when I couldn't stand all the name calling, again from both "sides." I may take another break soon with the chaos that is starting to happen once more because of the whole expansion pack delay announcement. I personally don't understand why people get so upset at other simmers, why simmers start calling each other names, start acting like they are somehow more superior over others. We are all simmers even if not currently playing sims 4, many are still playing the sims. Now I'm not saying all simmers do this, but it seems to be pretty common.
Hooray! Well said @Clk1143 someone else who sees through the 'sides' fallacy. Thank you
@Clk1143 very well put! I also think we could all be more understanding when someone makes a mistake. Goodness knows I've let my frustration show before and have poorly worded posts many times - but the lovely thing was, even when I worded things so they sounded really bad, the person I was responding to just asked what I meant and I was able to fix my post and there were no hard feelings. It has happened that way more than once. And I've seen a lot of people apologize as well when they've said something they shouldn't have. There are so many wonderful, forgiving people here - if someone makes a mistake and someone else tries to hold it against them later when they already apologized, others will step in. We could use more of that. More forgiveness, and more humility.
My belief on these forums is that if you dislike the game, that's fine. Make as many threads as you want discussing why you dislike it, just don't call people names, tell them they have to dislike it too, or tell them how they have to play their game.
If you like the game, that's fine. Make as many threads as you want discussing why you like it, just don't call people names, tell them they have to it too, or tell others how they have to play their game.
Personally, I like sims 4. On the forums I don't see myself on a "side." I'm okay discussing with anyone on the forums. I step out of the post if mud slinging starts happening, even if it's not towards me. I actually have taken a few breaks from this forum. In the beginning there were trolls on both "sides" that really ruined the forum experience for me. I have also taken a break when I couldn't stand all the name calling, again from both "sides." I may take another break soon with the chaos that is starting to happen once more because of the whole expansion pack delay announcement. I personally don't understand why people get so upset at other simmers, why simmers start calling each other names, start acting like they are somehow more superior over others. We are all simmers even if not currently playing sims 4, many are still playing the sims. Now I'm not saying all simmers do this, but it seems to be pretty common.
Hooray! Well said @Clk1143 someone else who sees through the 'sides' fallacy. Thank you
I'm just curious if i got up and said the same thing these people are saying but for the negative side.
Let's say someone made a thread and was like no one wants to here over and over you like the game EA gets the point. Go Away. Or the whole no one should take you seriously, no one should listen to you, EA doesn't care about what you have to say. Or If I was to say im tired of the mob attitude you positive people have every time you post you think it's suppose to be some trend to like the game. Everyone just jumps on some bandwagon and doesn't think for themselves. What if i made such a rude and hurtful post towards that group.
Then equally other people come into my thread promoting this same thought process encouraging it as if it's okay and they're justified to do so. Just to say if the shoe was on the other foot. What do you think would happen as this is just an example. I'd be lucky i didn't walk away from this forum with a ban. I just feel why should this person receive praise for spreading the same hate they propose to be against. Equally why is there a double standard where this is viewed as okay for one group to antagonize other members of the forum but not the other? I just wanted to ask about that double standard here.
I'm so glad they changed this game. I'm getting bored of the traditional sandbox gameplay honestly. The rpg feeling this game provided made it even more enjoyable! I'm having tons of fun and hours played into it already.
What kind of Sims game are they doing next? Sims first-person shooter? Sims Angry Birds? Sims third-person horror game? So many possibilities!
I'm so glad they changed this game. I'm getting bored of the traditional sandbox gameplay honestly. The rpg feeling this game provided made it even more enjoyable! I'm having tons of fun and hours played into it already.
What kind of Sims game are they doing next? Sims first-person shooter? Sims Angry Birds? Sims third-person horror game? So many possibilities!
My belief on these forums is that if you dislike the game, that's fine. Make as many threads as you want discussing why you dislike it, just don't call people names, tell them they have to dislike it too, or tell them how they have to play their game.
If you like the game, that's fine. Make as many threads as you want discussing why you like it, just don't call people names, tell them they have to it too, or tell others how they have to play their game.
Personally, I like sims 4. On the forums I don't see myself on a "side." I'm okay discussing with anyone on the forums. I step out of the post if mud slinging starts happening, even if it's not towards me. I actually have taken a few breaks from this forum. In the beginning there were trolls on both "sides" that really ruined the forum experience for me. I have also taken a break when I couldn't stand all the name calling, again from both "sides." I may take another break soon with the chaos that is starting to happen once more because of the whole expansion pack delay announcement. I personally don't understand why people get so upset at other simmers, why simmers start calling each other names, start acting like they are somehow more superior over others. We are all simmers even if not currently playing sims 4, many are still playing the sims. Now I'm not saying all simmers do this, but it seems to be pretty common.
This is a very good post. You should give yourself a thumbs-up next time you pass a mirror.
My belief on these forums is that if you dislike the game, that's fine. Make as many threads as you want discussing why you dislike it, just don't call people names, tell them they have to dislike it too, or tell them how they have to play their game.
If you like the game, that's fine. Make as many threads as you want discussing why you like it, just don't call people names, tell them they have to it too, or tell others how they have to play their game.
Personally, I like sims 4. On the forums I don't see myself on a "side." I'm okay discussing with anyone on the forums. I step out of the post if mud slinging starts happening, even if it's not towards me. I actually have taken a few breaks from this forum. In the beginning there were trolls on both "sides" that really ruined the forum experience for me. I have also taken a break when I couldn't stand all the name calling, again from both "sides." I may take another break soon with the chaos that is starting to happen once more because of the whole expansion pack delay announcement. I personally don't understand why people get so upset at other simmers, why simmers start calling each other names, start acting like they are somehow more superior over others. We are all simmers even if not currently playing sims 4, many are still playing the sims. Now I'm not saying all simmers do this, but it seems to be pretty common.
Well said.
I think conflict arises when people from either side start presenting an opinion or conjecture as fact. I have also seen people on the forum respond to other's opinions in a bullying-like manner, mocking or insulting them. That is rather sad.
Examples:
"The Sims 4 is a flop."
"The Sims 4 is a great game, anyone who says otherwise hasn't played through all the content."
"You have no right to post here with your opinion if you haven't played it or played X amount of hours."
"The Sims 4 will get toddlers soon and I know it because of xxxx tweet"
Like responses usually result in the thread being turned into a flame war or people getting offended. It's not going to change anytime soon either.
Myself, I find the game boring at times and ok at other times. But just OK. There are parts that I think are improvements from all three of the other games. There are parts that I think are a huge step back. I am not happy with the way that EA / Maxis are relating to their customers or conveying information. I am on the forum because I have loved the sims since I was 9 or 10 years old. I really like the franchise and although I am disheartened at the direction it seems to be taking, at the same time I am hopeful that they will turn it around.
I would like to post in support of the OP and I think he/she should keep her/his signature intact - EA still need a bit of slap if they are going to restore their rep with gamers.
I am a newcomer to the Sims, but not other game forums. Two things have really stood out to me. The first, is that many players of the sims do not appear to play another game and, secondly, there is a suspicion against mods. This means that long time player have high expectations, IMO. In my experience, high expectations lead to the greatest disappointments.
I bought this game for about the same price as I bought BulletStorm when it came out. I loved that game for all it's trashiness - a playthrough is about six hours, four or five if you know what you are doing ( could provide many more examples). The enjoyable playtime I have had from the Sims 4 has blown this way and I'm still far from done
I bought this game on a whim, if I am gonna be honest, thinking it would provide some amusement for a cold, wet weekend and kind of assumed it would end up the following week gathering virtual dust like a lot of the games in my Steam library. It hasn't.
The AI totally fascinated me. I was one of those that used to mess around with them embedded java artificial life programs that were knocking about in the 90s - flocking birds, foxes and rabbits, and such like.
Yeah, of course these Sims do dumb stuff - it's computer code. Still, a very, very interesting development in game tech, IMO. Cool 🐸🐸🐸🐸.
I have posted before the Technical Simulation discussion on this site is awesome until it gets derailed at about page 20. The stuff these guys are trying to do is is brilliant, IMO. If anyone with some power is reading, please, please more discussions like that- very heavily moderated.
Did they completely pull it off. No, they didn't, for whatever reason. Those reasons will always be speculative to us, regardless of how long threads grow. We can take informed guesses. Unfocused by management because of focus on mobile, young, old, kidults, aliens (choose your guess); not enough money; no management will, etc etc etc.
Previous games don't disintegrate when a new ones came out. They are still available to play. Hell, EA virtually gave me my TS2 UC. I can play it in all it's glory. I, personally, don't want another exactly like that, but prettier. I want something new, something experimental. Sims 4 has provided that, IMO. It is far from perfect and I could go into a long rant about what is wrong with it, but as the OP has pointed out, I think that message has been delivered. Whether a satisfactory reply is forthcoming remains to be seen.
My hope is that they continue to put the bulk of their effort into the Sims themselves, because if they nail that, then later generations of the game will be truly incredible, IMO.
Have you played Sims 2? Take the time and play it. The AI is what I loved in Sims 1 and Sims 2. Three was a less win and this did not make it over the weekend. To say this is awesome with out looking to see what others are talking about, and say they are only disappointed from overly high expectations is not true, nor is it fair.
@Anavastia it's happened to everyone. Not just people who dislike the game-I've seen it happen to those who like the game too. People have acted without proper decorum-even people who subsequently I've seen are perfectly reasonable simmers got drawn in. It's why I decided to let it all go and start again.
I hold no ill will towards anyone, I've been very hurt plenty of times but what does grudges get you? Nothing.
So I look forward to better from everyone. No one is perfect and like @blueasbutterfly said it's easy to make a mistake and for others to jump on you but actually we get further if we open a dialogue and move on.
If we discuss honestly without insulting others-then if someone pops in a thread and insults everyone or you it's clear who has the problem and when reported it's much easier to deal with it
@Anavastia it's happened to everyone. Not just people who dislike the game-I've seen it happen to those who like the game too. People have acted without proper decorum-even people who subsequently I've seen are perfectly reasonable simmers got drawn in. It's why I decided to let it all go and start again.
I hold no ill will towards anyone, I've been very hurt plenty of times but what does grudges get you? Nothing.
So I look forward to better from everyone. No one is perfect and like @blueasbutterfly said it's easy to make a mistake and for others to jump on you but actually we get further if we open a dialogue and move on.
If we discuss honestly without insulting others-then if someone pops in a thread and insults everyone or you it's clear who has the problem and when reported it's much easier to deal with it
Yes but those people get ban's, their threads deleted and into trouble. I'm asking why threads like this are okay but others are not. If we're going to promote forum peace than first thing should happen is were ourselves should be the first to encourage it. I just wanted to show how the shoe being on the other foot is just as hurtful as what this op has said.
I will report this thread because i feel like the forum environment is hostile enough as it is. We don't need this right now. Equally neither do dev's. It's not fair to people who are trying to communicate or working at fixing things to have people misrepresent them like this. Or feel this is okay to do in their name. I just don't like it.
@Anavastia it's happened to everyone. Not just people who dislike the game-I've seen it happen to those who like the game too. People have acted without proper decorum-even people who subsequently I've seen are perfectly reasonable simmers got drawn in. It's why I decided to let it all go and start again.
I hold no ill will towards anyone, I've been very hurt plenty of times but what does grudges get you? Nothing.
So I look forward to better from everyone. No one is perfect and like @blueasbutterfly said it's easy to make a mistake and for others to jump on you but actually we get further if we open a dialogue and move on.
If we discuss honestly without insulting others-then if someone pops in a thread and insults everyone or you it's clear who has the problem and when reported it's much easier to deal with it
Yes but those people get ban's, their threads deleted and into trouble. I'm asking why threads like this are okay but others are not. If we're going to promote forum peace than first thing should happen is were ourselves should be the first to encourage it. I just wanted to show how the shoe being on the other foot is just as hurtful as what this op has said.
I will report this thread because i feel like the forum environment is hostile enough as it is. We don't need this right now. Equally neither do dev's. It's not fair to people who are trying to communicate or working at fixing things to have people misrepresent them like this. Or feel this is okay to do in their name. I just don't like it.
I would sooner advice to just ignore people, the tool is there. I agree with your post, getting people banned is not the way to go and it proves that nobody here has learned from recent history, when trying to get people banned was a sport. It's indeed along the lines of 'you don't like my opinion, I report you for whatever reason'.
Sims 4 isn't a bad game. I'm reminded of that every time that I play. It has great potential.
My sims are so life-like now in their facial expressions and antics. It runs so smoothly on my computer, making for a happy PC and me.
We all have our opinions and we all deserve to say it. I'm happy that people enjoy the game; I enjoy it as well. Sims 4 is not that bad, but, to me, it could be better. It could also be worst.
I want more sand-box options, after all they say that you are in control, but I also like watching the little movie of one of my families travelling and one of my sims cooking or... farting. When I read that Sims 4 has an RPG feel, I can agree with that. With one sim, it really feels like an RPG where you need to advance in levels. It isn't like this in other games. (At least to me.)
I agree with the OP. Sims 4 isn't that bad of a game.
My belief on these forums is that if you dislike the game, that's fine. Make as many threads as you want discussing why you dislike it, just don't call people names, tell them they have to dislike it too, or tell them how they have to play their game.
If you like the game, that's fine. Make as many threads as you want discussing why you like it, just don't call people names, tell them they have to it too, or tell others how they have to play their game.
Personally, I like sims 4. On the forums I don't see myself on a "side." I'm okay discussing with anyone on the forums. I step out of the post if mud slinging starts happening, even if it's not towards me. I actually have taken a few breaks from this forum. In the beginning there were trolls on both "sides" that really ruined the forum experience for me. I have also taken a break when I couldn't stand all the name calling, again from both "sides." I may take another break soon with the chaos that is starting to happen once more because of the whole expansion pack delay announcement. I personally don't understand why people get so upset at other simmers, why simmers start calling each other names, start acting like they are somehow more superior over others. We are all simmers even if not currently playing sims 4, many are still playing the sims. Now I'm not saying all simmers do this, but it seems to be pretty common.
Well said.
I think conflict arises when people from either side start presenting an opinion or conjecture as fact. I have also seen people on the forum respond to other's opinions in a bullying-like manner, mocking or insulting them. That is rather sad.
Examples:
"The Sims 4 is a flop."
"The Sims 4 is a great game, anyone who says otherwise hasn't played through all the content."
"You have no right to post here with your opinion if you haven't played it or played X amount of hours."
"The Sims 4 will get toddlers soon and I know it because of xxxx tweet"
Like responses usually result in the thread being turned into a flame war or people getting offended. It's not going to change anytime soon either.
Myself, I find the game boring at times and ok at other times. But just OK. There are parts that I think are improvements from all three of the other games. There are parts that I think are a huge step back. I am not happy with the way that EA / Maxis are relating to their customers or conveying information. I am on the forum because I have loved the sims since I was 9 or 10 years old. I really like the franchise and although I am disheartened at the direction it seems to be taking, at the same time I am hopeful that they will turn it around.
The bold part, is the root of all conflicts. Very well said.
People tend to phrase their opinions as facts, another examples following up yours are:
"The Sims 4 has the potential to be the best of the series."
"The Sims 4 is the best base game out of them all."
"The Sims 4 is a tablet or console game at best."
There ARE ways to do a neutral factual analysis of the game, none of which would end up in "The Sims 4 is awesome" nor "The Sims 4 is garbage." Such analysis, however, would require some knowledge regarding how game development works, and how the engine and framework of this and past iterations work so as to discuss the game from a programming perspective. This could end up in statements such as "The programming quality in 2 was rudimentary but effective", "The routing and database systems for The Sims 3 were very flawed.", "The Sims 4 did not innovate much at all and the same database issues and flawed engine are present.", etc.
Such analysis are scarce and rare and thus we are left with our opinions of the game. The way we express those opinions is where the problem is and if there's anyone to blame, is the community in general. There are no sides, there is no virtual war between two opposing masses. There are simply, as it is in most forum boards, a specific group which will believe their opinion to be a fact, and anyone else who thinks otherwise is wrong. Those who fall in that group know who they are, those who don't, know who they are as well.
One thing though, there IS a reason for the current state of the forum and the other outlets such as YouTube, Facebook, etc. It doesn't happen out of the blue, it doesn't happen without motive. Something triggered it, and that trigger is The Sims 4. While it isn't less true that The Sims 3 base game didn't have a red carpet flawless entrance, this time around it isn't only the community, but the developers and the publisher who are taking routes which give off the impression that something is off.
@Anavastia it's happened to everyone. Not just people who dislike the game-I've seen it happen to those who like the game too. People have acted without proper decorum-even people who subsequently I've seen are perfectly reasonable simmers got drawn in. It's why I decided to let it all go and start again.
I hold no ill will towards anyone, I've been very hurt plenty of times but what does grudges get you? Nothing.
So I look forward to better from everyone. No one is perfect and like @blueasbutterfly said it's easy to make a mistake and for others to jump on you but actually we get further if we open a dialogue and move on.
If we discuss honestly without insulting others-then if someone pops in a thread and insults everyone or you it's clear who has the problem and when reported it's much easier to deal with it
Yes but those people get ban's, their threads deleted and into trouble. I'm asking why threads like this are okay but others are not. If we're going to promote forum peace than first thing should happen is were ourselves should be the first to encourage it. I just wanted to show how the shoe being on the other foot is just as hurtful as what this op has said.
I will report this thread because i feel like the forum environment is hostile enough as it is. We don't need this right now. Equally neither do dev's. It's not fair to people who are trying to communicate or working at fixing things to have people misrepresent them like this. Or feel this is okay to do in their name. I just don't like it.
I agree some people take it to far but I love to debate with people but my debating is just fun and I try not to insult anyone on the forums for expressing their own opinion. I know that we all have our own which why the forums are fun to talk on.
@Anavastia I believe @SimGuruBChick left it up with a clear message all feedback from every single one of us is welcomed.
You couldn't get clearer than an official message direct from an official source
Just to add-I know the mods step in when it's needed, the fact is we don't get to know what's happened because it's personal and private so they don't publicly share. Bans are last resort and we only see that because it's obvious on previous posts.
I understand your frustration and I think generally people are starting to discuss things more effectively without mud slinging. Change won't happen overnight but I see green shoots of recovery
I figured that this went without saying, but of course I didn't mean offense by my post. I typed exactly what was on my mind, as I am this type of person IRL. If the things I say offend you, you're more than welcome not to look; just as people in my personal life are more than welcome not to listen.
Have a nice day/night, fellow simmers.
"Don't wish...Don't start.
Wishing only wounds the heart."
Ya it's not bad but its lack of content in relation to the other base games is disheartening to say the least. Definitely not worth the price for me. I'll buy Sims4 if it ever goes ≤ $20, which will probably be never.
Comments
That's a kick-plum looking sig!
A grounded response. I dropped TS4 two weeks after release. I've been playing TS3 and other games in the meantime between then and now. Recently returned back to TS4 and I find myself enjoying it. I think it has a lot to do with realising that I don't have to embrace TS4 solely in lieu of other versions.
I think that's something a lot of other people have yet to realise. You're not a Simmer because you play with the latest shiney in the series, but you're a Simmer because you love the Sims. And of the Sims there's plenty to go around.
How about all the things that are exactly like the predecessors? The world functionality is exactly like that of The Sims 1 (a game that is, mind you, from 2000). The object-like babies and no family trees are, surprise surprise, from The Sims 1. The closed worlds are once again from The Sims 1 and The Sims 2. No terrain editing is...well, that was something that was IN The Sims 1, so I guess that's a bad one to pick. There's much more of the gameplay that behaves like the predecessors as well, so I fail to see how this is a "completely new Sims game."
There's also the "potential" argument. Well that one is quite subjective really. You may see a lot of potential, some may not. I see potential for the game to be acceptably decent, I don't see potential for it to surpass its predecessors. I also don't see my play style returning anytime soon either.
The formula they kept in The Sims 2 was ideal and logical, and ever since The Sims 2 they've been unable to reproduce it. They cannot create a balanced game, period. If X features worked great in the core of The Sims 1, 2 and 3, it'd make sense to adopt them into the sequel. If Y features were potentially great concepts but flawed in the execution (open worlds for example), it'd make sense to overhaul them and not go backwards. There's so much feedback from 14 years of this franchise that I honestly don't know how they've gotten so lost. Then there's the fact that they don't seem to be very good at game development, and that the publisher is constantly making poor management decisions which relatively affect the development team.
Anyways, I'm not on any bandwagon. I as well as everyone else can make an informed decision of whether they consider the game great, fantastic, okay, sub-par or downright awful. I spent years learning most of everything regarding The Sims 3 and while it did enable me to overhaul the game to my liking, it showed me just how bad they coded so many things and the same is happening here already. The fact that the same database structure and prone corruptions from 2004 are still present in 2015 is baffling and shows a lack of progression and learning. I'm perfectly fine skipping TS4 all together, I don't feel like I'm missing out on anything that the predecessors don't already have and better. I don't feel like I can mod and overhaul the game to my liking either, too many restrictions and limits. The only reason why there's a small spark of hope that they can turn this around is because I love the franchise and have been involved in it for 13 years.
I am a newcomer to the Sims, but not other game forums. Two things have really stood out to me. The first, is that many players of the sims do not appear to play another game and, secondly, there is a suspicion against mods. This means that long time player have high expectations, IMO. In my experience, high expectations lead to the greatest disappointments.
I bought this game for about the same price as I bought BulletStorm when it came out. I loved that game for all it's trashiness - a playthrough is about six hours, four or five if you know what you are doing ( could provide many more examples). The enjoyable playtime I have had from the Sims 4 has blown this way and I'm still far from done
I bought this game on a whim, if I am gonna be honest, thinking it would provide some amusement for a cold, wet weekend and kind of assumed it would end up the following week gathering virtual dust like a lot of the games in my Steam library. It hasn't.
The AI totally fascinated me. I was one of those that used to mess around with them embedded java artificial life programs that were knocking about in the 90s - flocking birds, foxes and rabbits, and such like.
Yeah, of course these Sims do dumb stuff - it's computer code. Still, a very, very interesting development in game tech, IMO. Cool 🐸🐸🐸🐸.
I have posted before the Technical Simulation discussion on this site is awesome until it gets derailed at about page 20. The stuff these guys are trying to do is is brilliant, IMO. If anyone with some power is reading, please, please more discussions like that- very heavily moderated.
Did they completely pull it off. No, they didn't, for whatever reason. Those reasons will always be speculative to us, regardless of how long threads grow. We can take informed guesses. Unfocused by management because of focus on mobile, young, old, kidults, aliens (choose your guess); not enough money; no management will, etc etc etc.
Previous games don't disintegrate when a new ones came out. They are still available to play. Hell, EA virtually gave me my TS2 UC. I can play it in all it's glory. I, personally, don't want another exactly like that, but prettier. I want something new, something experimental. Sims 4 has provided that, IMO. It is far from perfect and I could go into a long rant about what is wrong with it, but as the OP has pointed out, I think that message has been delivered. Whether a satisfactory reply is forthcoming remains to be seen.
My hope is that they continue to put the bulk of their effort into the Sims themselves, because if they nail that, then later generations of the game will be truly incredible, IMO.
Shake dreams from your hair
My pretty child, my sweet one.
Choose the day and choose the sign of your day
The day's divinity....
The Ghost Song - Jim Morrison
If you like the game, that's fine. Make as many threads as you want discussing why you like it, just don't call people names, tell them they have to it too, or tell others how they have to play their game.
Personally, I like sims 4. On the forums I don't see myself on a "side." I'm okay discussing with anyone on the forums. I step out of the post if mud slinging starts happening, even if it's not towards me. I actually have taken a few breaks from this forum. In the beginning there were trolls on both "sides" that really ruined the forum experience for me. I have also taken a break when I couldn't stand all the name calling, again from both "sides." I may take another break soon with the chaos that is starting to happen once more because of the whole expansion pack delay announcement. I personally don't understand why people get so upset at other simmers, why simmers start calling each other names, start acting like they are somehow more superior over others. We are all simmers even if not currently playing sims 4, many are still playing the sims. Now I'm not saying all simmers do this, but it seems to be pretty common.
Hooray! Well said @Clk1143
https://twitter.com/sparkfairy1
I'm just curious if i got up and said the same thing these people are saying but for the negative side.
Let's say someone made a thread and was like no one wants to here over and over you like the game EA gets the point. Go Away. Or the whole no one should take you seriously, no one should listen to you, EA doesn't care about what you have to say. Or If I was to say im tired of the mob attitude you positive people have every time you post you think it's suppose to be some trend to like the game. Everyone just jumps on some bandwagon and doesn't think for themselves. What if i made such a rude and hurtful post towards that group.
Then equally other people come into my thread promoting this same thought process encouraging it as if it's okay and they're justified to do so. Just to say if the shoe was on the other foot. What do you think would happen as this is just an example. I'd be lucky i didn't walk away from this forum with a ban. I just feel why should this person receive praise for spreading the same hate they propose to be against. Equally why is there a double standard where this is viewed as okay for one group to antagonize other members of the forum but not the other? I just wanted to ask about that double standard here.
What kind of Sims game are they doing next? Sims first-person shooter? Sims Angry Birds? Sims third-person horror game? So many possibilities!
Sims tetris.
This is a very good post. You should give yourself a thumbs-up next time you pass a mirror.
Well said.
I think conflict arises when people from either side start presenting an opinion or conjecture as fact. I have also seen people on the forum respond to other's opinions in a bullying-like manner, mocking or insulting them. That is rather sad.
Examples:
"The Sims 4 is a flop."
"The Sims 4 is a great game, anyone who says otherwise hasn't played through all the content."
"You have no right to post here with your opinion if you haven't played it or played X amount of hours."
"The Sims 4 will get toddlers soon and I know it because of xxxx tweet"
Like responses usually result in the thread being turned into a flame war or people getting offended. It's not going to change anytime soon either.
Myself, I find the game boring at times and ok at other times. But just OK. There are parts that I think are improvements from all three of the other games. There are parts that I think are a huge step back. I am not happy with the way that EA / Maxis are relating to their customers or conveying information. I am on the forum because I have loved the sims since I was 9 or 10 years old. I really like the franchise and although I am disheartened at the direction it seems to be taking, at the same time I am hopeful that they will turn it around.
Have you played Sims 2? Take the time and play it. The AI is what I loved in Sims 1 and Sims 2. Three was a less win and this did not make it over the weekend. To say this is awesome with out looking to see what others are talking about, and say they are only disappointed from overly high expectations is not true, nor is it fair.
I hold no ill will towards anyone, I've been very hurt plenty of times but what does grudges get you? Nothing.
So I look forward to better from everyone. No one is perfect and like @blueasbutterfly said it's easy to make a mistake and for others to jump on you but actually we get further if we open a dialogue and move on.
If we discuss honestly without insulting others-then if someone pops in a thread and insults everyone or you it's clear who has the problem and when reported it's much easier to deal with it
https://twitter.com/sparkfairy1
Yes but those people get ban's, their threads deleted and into trouble. I'm asking why threads like this are okay but others are not. If we're going to promote forum peace than first thing should happen is were ourselves should be the first to encourage it. I just wanted to show how the shoe being on the other foot is just as hurtful as what this op has said.
I will report this thread because i feel like the forum environment is hostile enough as it is. We don't need this right now. Equally neither do dev's. It's not fair to people who are trying to communicate or working at fixing things to have people misrepresent them like this. Or feel this is okay to do in their name. I just don't like it.
I would sooner advice to just ignore people, the tool is there. I agree with your post, getting people banned is not the way to go and it proves that nobody here has learned from recent history, when trying to get people banned was a sport. It's indeed along the lines of 'you don't like my opinion, I report you for whatever reason'.
My sims are so life-like now in their facial expressions and antics. It runs so smoothly on my computer, making for a happy PC and me.
We all have our opinions and we all deserve to say it. I'm happy that people enjoy the game; I enjoy it as well. Sims 4 is not that bad, but, to me, it could be better. It could also be worst.
I want more sand-box options, after all they say that you are in control, but I also like watching the little movie of one of my families travelling and one of my sims cooking or... farting. When I read that Sims 4 has an RPG feel, I can agree with that. With one sim, it really feels like an RPG where you need to advance in levels. It isn't like this in other games. (At least to me.)
I agree with the OP. Sims 4 isn't that bad of a game.
Though, I must add, it certainly isn't the best.
People tend to phrase their opinions as facts, another examples following up yours are:
"The Sims 4 has the potential to be the best of the series."
"The Sims 4 is the best base game out of them all."
"The Sims 4 is a tablet or console game at best."
There ARE ways to do a neutral factual analysis of the game, none of which would end up in "The Sims 4 is awesome" nor "The Sims 4 is garbage." Such analysis, however, would require some knowledge regarding how game development works, and how the engine and framework of this and past iterations work so as to discuss the game from a programming perspective. This could end up in statements such as "The programming quality in 2 was rudimentary but effective", "The routing and database systems for The Sims 3 were very flawed.", "The Sims 4 did not innovate much at all and the same database issues and flawed engine are present.", etc.
Such analysis are scarce and rare and thus we are left with our opinions of the game. The way we express those opinions is where the problem is and if there's anyone to blame, is the community in general. There are no sides, there is no virtual war between two opposing masses. There are simply, as it is in most forum boards, a specific group which will believe their opinion to be a fact, and anyone else who thinks otherwise is wrong. Those who fall in that group know who they are, those who don't, know who they are as well.
One thing though, there IS a reason for the current state of the forum and the other outlets such as YouTube, Facebook, etc. It doesn't happen out of the blue, it doesn't happen without motive. Something triggered it, and that trigger is The Sims 4. While it isn't less true that The Sims 3 base game didn't have a red carpet flawless entrance, this time around it isn't only the community, but the developers and the publisher who are taking routes which give off the impression that something is off.
You couldn't get clearer than an official message direct from an official source
Just to add-I know the mods step in when it's needed, the fact is we don't get to know what's happened because it's personal and private so they don't publicly share. Bans are last resort and we only see that because it's obvious on previous posts.
I understand your frustration and I think generally people are starting to discuss things more effectively without mud slinging. Change won't happen overnight but I see green shoots of recovery
https://twitter.com/sparkfairy1
Sims 4 is far from the worst game out there, this much I'm sure I can believe. It's not, however, what it needs to be to be 'the next' Sims.
I figured that this went without saying, but of course I didn't mean offense by my post. I typed exactly what was on my mind, as I am this type of person IRL. If the things I say offend you, you're more than welcome not to look; just as people in my personal life are more than welcome not to listen.
Have a nice day/night, fellow simmers.
Wishing only wounds the heart."
Origin ID: Simintoxication