All good points. I'll talk design about this. There are people who like both directions here but I'm sure we can find a middle ground solution as well.
Just FYI, for those looking for a cheat type solution, you can quit your job for a extended summer vacation and then start that job again at the same level when your vacation ends.
I think a cheat code would be the best, because it would be useful in all kind of situations, not just holidays, like an event you want to plan, some story you have in mind, etc.
There's a lot of people posting on Twitter that they're happy about how the new system works, so I'm even more convinced that a cheat to add vacation days or being able to take unpaid days off would be reasonable solutions.
Holidays should be paid, and not take from our Sims' vacation days, like in real life. I agree that we shouldn't be allowed to have unlimited paid holidays. However, a system that allows us a certain number of paid days off per Sim year for holidays (separate from vacation days), exact number of days depending on season length, would be a good solution, imo
While I think a cheat could be good just to have it would be kind of a bummer to need it. Having to reimburse all of my sims for each holiday is a little tedious in my larger households (and kids can't do the 'quit work' thing without a mod). I enjoy having my sims be diligent and save up their vacation days for big family vacations that they saved up for (I rarely use money cheats and usually on just one or two families). They can't have those vacations and also have off several holidays a year as it stands.
All good points. I'll talk design about this. There are people who like both directions here but I'm sure we can find a middle ground solution as well.
Just FYI, for those looking for a cheat type solution, you can quit your job for a extended summer vacation and then start that job again at the same level when your vacation ends.
Thanks for your responses!! It is good to hear that my game isn't glitching!
For everyone figuring out how to handle (if the setup isnt what they prefer)I personally am going to cheat/use a mod like mccc to add in those vacation days to make up for the holidays in my game that most people would have off for in RL - for my game it is leisure day, harvestfest, winterfest, new years & easter! So after each of those, if my sims get a vacation day deducted I will add that day back. Beyond that i have family day (mothers/fathers day combined), spooky day, and love day, those are not checked off for having off from work or school, so if my sims decide to take off those days anyway they will rightfully lose those vacation days!
It is funny to me because in RL i am a nurse in a hospital so this whole paid holiday off doesnt even apply to me! For me it's requirement to work every other major holiday (and make double doing so which makes up for it) but definitely no paid holidays off
I get that it would have been exploitable, but at the same time.. if you take too many holidays you wouldn't be able to increase your performance at work or school. The system already had measures to make the exploit unfavorable. I disagree with the design decision.
Yeah and of course if you really want to exploit you could simply just add more money with cheats or download a custom career that has you earn a lot of money for only a few hours of work. I mean we already have plenty of ways to exploit so this seems like a non-concern.
Holidays should be paid, and not take from our Sims' vacation days, like in real life.
Where do ya’ll work?! Federal or not, my paid time off bank gets dinged every holiday. Of course, I can accrue much more than 4 days in a year. Maybe they can just make the base amount of vacation days for each job/school situation higher? That might solve the issue without cheats. Maybe?
It's funny because I went with longer seasons so my Sim kids don't have to miss too much school... got to work on those grades ( same with adults, really. Got to go to work to eventually get promoted).
That's interesting. Today after seeing this discussion I observed one of my sims. She is a scientist. When Harvestfest started, she had 3 vacation days. After the clock reached 8.00 pm (when her work ends), she got paid and had 4 vacation days.
Ok then. So I have bug that increases the vacation days for sims...
(I'll never fix it!)
That's interesting. Today after seeing this discussion I observed one of my sims. She is a scientist. When Harvestfest started, she had 3 vacation days. After the clock reached 8.00 pm (when her work ends), she got paid and had 4 vacation days.
Ok then. So I have bug that increases the vacation days for sims...
(I'll never fix it!)
It's not a bug, Sims earn vacation days by working.
Holidays should be paid, and not take from our Sims' vacation days, like in real life.
Where do ya’ll work?! Federal or not, my paid time off bank gets dinged every holiday. Of course, I can accrue much more than 4 days in a year. Maybe they can just make the base amount of vacation days for each job/school situation higher? That might solve the issue without cheats. Maybe?
Maybe it's more of a question of where do you work? In the US of A, holidays (paid or not) are separate from vacation, no deducting from time off. Been that way in every company I've worked at, large or small, public or private, in a half-century of earning a living. EA's design choice flies in the face of standard practice, and quite possibly federal employment law. Not to mention the already shown lack of logic in view of the game's existing various means of free income.
I'm disappointed in this also. Yes I probably would have exploited it at times .. mostly for story telling or other challenge ideas, especially homeless ideas where I wanted to try to drag the kiddos along. But in saves where my sims lived normal lives I doubt I would have exploited it, for one I'd be too lazy to set them up that many holidays. I also thought it would be nice to have blocks of days off to mimic children's holidays from school.
I'm disappointed because I expected it mostly...
Maybe it's more of a question of where do you work? In the US of A, holidays (paid or not) are separate from vacation, no deducting from time off. Been that way in every company I've worked at, large or small, public or private, in a half-century of earning a living. EA's design choice flies in the face of standard practice, and quite possibly federal employment law. Not to mention the already shown lack of logic in view of the game's existing various means of free income.
I work for a community hospital actually. In the US of A. We have one lump amount for everything (sick time, pto, holidays etc.)
Here’s what I found by just googling:
“Traditionally, employers offered separate paid time off benefits to employees, such as paid vacation, sick leave and personal days. However, in the past decade, many companies have moved to a more flexible Paid Time Off or “PTO” benefit that incorporates all policies into one all-inclusive PTO plan.-Jul 12, 2016”
I also get quite a few hours put toward my lump sum weekly. Which maxes out at 400. So maybe I’m not doing so bad lol.
This is poor design choice. How will a rotational player get that many vacation days? And using up the vacation days every in-game year means no real vacation...
This is sad.
There's a lot of people posting on Twitter that they're happy about how the new system works, so I'm even more convinced that a cheat to add vacation days or being able to take unpaid days off would be reasonable solutions.
I wouldn’t say it’s the best solution. I know a lot of Simmers refuse to use cheat codes and although I’m not one of them, I’m a rotational player myself. Most of my Sims only earn 2 vacation days a week. And if I want to have more than 8 holidays in a year (my seasons are 2-week long) their vacation days will be used up in one rotation. I’ll have no vacations days left for REAL vacations.
This design is really disappointing for me... It even makes me want to rage delete all the holidays haha.
@SimGuruGeorge I personally don’t think a cheat code solves it all. Rotational players are having a hard time saving up vacation days with this design. I think holiday should be separated from vacation and Sims shouldn’t earn Simoleons on holidays.
So no abuse of holidays and you have your vacation days saved. For the time being my rotation families have all used up their vacation days and they have no way to take a long day off to the Jungle or the woods.
I work for a community hospital actually. In the US of A. We have one lump amount for everything (sick time, pto, holidays etc.)
That's so odd. But I guess being a hospital, it would be different.
I know many companies have moved to the PTO frame and instead of vacation days and sick days, they are lumped into one. But they still have certain paid holidays in which the company is closed and employees don't work (Christmas or the friday before or the Monday after if on a weekend, Thanksgiving and the day after,etc). If employees do work for whatever reason, they get time and a half or sometimes even double time.
I don't like how they set this up to rob our Sims of their vacation time. They only accrue so much over a period of time. Does it really matter if someone "abuses" it? If they don't go to work they don't progress, so isn't that a sort of punishment? Whatever happened to playing it our way?
To be fair, the game doesn't take into account of the 'value' of the holiday. Because irl, you might get paid for a holiday like Christmas or Thanksgiving, for example. But the majority of holidays per year don't give you time off or holiday pay. So I can see why you only get -x- amount of holidays paid in the game, and the rest you take an unpaid day off, if you're going to go that way. In my retail job, I only had Christmas day off guarunteed. One day out of the whole year. And I only got holiday pay for working Thanksgiving.
You don't get random "International Donut Day" off and paid for, you know. I'd say if they want to make it more like real life, then game-generated holidays could have vacation pay, and player created ones don't, as a sort of way to mimic 'federal holidays' vs. the random ones that aren't officially supported.
To be fair, the game doesn't take into account of the 'value' of the holiday. Because irl, you might get paid for a holiday like Christmas or Thanksgiving, for example. But the majority of holidays per year don't give you time off or holiday pay. So I can see why you only get -x- amount of holidays paid in the game, and the rest you take an unpaid day off, if you're going to go that way. In my retail job, I only had Christmas day off guarunteed. One day out of the whole year. And I only got holiday pay for working Thanksgiving.
You don't get random "International Donut Day" off and paid for, you know. I'd say if they want to make it more like real life, then game-generated holidays could have vacation pay, and player created ones don't, as a sort of way to mimic 'federal holidays' vs. the random ones that aren't officially supported.
I personally would have no problem with the Sims' holidays not being paid. It's the taking it out of accrued vacation time that I find unfair.
If I may add a suggestion based on the Australian system @SimGuruGeorge,
Over here for part time and full time jobs we have a set amount of holiday leave per year, and I think if you don't use it, it can roll over to the next year in some cases, also we have several different types of leave aside from that. We have a yearly allotment of sick leave, and compassionate leave that doesn't roll over, and if you have a child you can apply for maternity or paternity leave.
I think this would be a good idea, having a sim have a certain allotment of leave per the calendar year, 2 weeks minimum but as you level up in your career you can get a day more for your yearly leave per career level? Also the leave for sims with jobs can roll over to the next year and maybe cap out at 6 weeks? And maybe have the children be able to take 2 weeks worth of leave per calendar year?
Alternatively, put an option in the gameplay menu "Do calendar holidays use up vacation days? - Yes/No"
SimGuruNick and SimGuruArvin let me know about this thread. I just wanted to come in and say that using vacation days was intentional. If the system let a Sim take a day off without using vacation days then a player would be able to set up No work/school holidays everyday of the calendar. A Sim would be able to never work but still pull in a paycheck or pass school.
As it is now, a player can still setup infinite day off holidays, but if you go over the number of vacation days you have then no paycheck/school is earned for that day.
The checkbox on the holiday screen was put there to make taking a day off easier. That way, when a holiday approaches, you don't need to go to each one of your Sims and call in a vacation day.
-SimGuruGeorge
So make the holidays unpaid and give us back our vacation days. I don't like using cheats as regular gameplay. I'd have to use it constantly.
To be fair, the game doesn't take into account of the 'value' of the holiday. Because irl, you might get paid for a holiday like Christmas or Thanksgiving, for example. But the majority of holidays per year don't give you time off or holiday pay. So I can see why you only get -x- amount of holidays paid in the game, and the rest you take an unpaid day off, if you're going to go that way. In my retail job, I only had Christmas day off guarunteed. One day out of the whole year. And I only got holiday pay for working Thanksgiving.
You don't get random "International Donut Day" off and paid for, you know. I'd say if they want to make it more like real life, then game-generated holidays could have vacation pay, and player created ones don't, as a sort of way to mimic 'federal holidays' vs. the random ones that aren't officially supported.
I get what you're saying, but days off on holidays should not be deducted from our Sims' normal vacation days which are meant for going on actual vacations (Outdoor Retreat or Jungle Adventure). Holidays should be separate from vacation days.
I also think holidays should be paid really, but not an unlimited amount of course (to prevent abuse); so they could give us a certain amount of paid holidays per seasonal cycle, the exact number of days depending on the season length selected in the game options.
However, if we could have only one of the two - either holidays using vacation days but being paid, or holidays not using vacation days but being unpaid - I would choose the latter.
Comments
Just FYI, for those looking for a cheat type solution, you can quit your job for a extended summer vacation and then start that job again at the same level when your vacation ends.
Thanks for your responses!! It is good to hear that my game isn't glitching!
For everyone figuring out how to handle (if the setup isnt what they prefer)I personally am going to cheat/use a mod like mccc to add in those vacation days to make up for the holidays in my game that most people would have off for in RL - for my game it is leisure day, harvestfest, winterfest, new years & easter! So after each of those, if my sims get a vacation day deducted I will add that day back. Beyond that i have family day (mothers/fathers day combined), spooky day, and love day, those are not checked off for having off from work or school, so if my sims decide to take off those days anyway they will rightfully lose those vacation days!
It is funny to me because in RL i am a nurse in a hospital so this whole paid holiday off doesnt even apply to me! For me it's requirement to work every other major holiday (and make double doing so which makes up for it) but definitely no paid holidays off
Yeah and of course if you really want to exploit you could simply just add more money with cheats or download a custom career that has you earn a lot of money for only a few hours of work. I mean we already have plenty of ways to exploit so this seems like a non-concern.
Where do ya’ll work?! Federal or not, my paid time off bank gets dinged every holiday. Of course, I can accrue much more than 4 days in a year. Maybe they can just make the base amount of vacation days for each job/school situation higher? That might solve the issue without cheats. Maybe?
My Gallery
Ok then. So I have bug that increases the vacation days for sims...
(I'll never fix it!)
Maybe it's more of a question of where do you work? In the US of A, holidays (paid or not) are separate from vacation, no deducting from time off. Been that way in every company I've worked at, large or small, public or private, in a half-century of earning a living. EA's design choice flies in the face of standard practice, and quite possibly federal employment law. Not to mention the already shown lack of logic in view of the game's existing various means of free income.
I'm disappointed because I expected it mostly...
I work for a community hospital actually. In the US of A. We have one lump amount for everything (sick time, pto, holidays etc.)
Here’s what I found by just googling:
“Traditionally, employers offered separate paid time off benefits to employees, such as paid vacation, sick leave and personal days. However, in the past decade, many companies have moved to a more flexible Paid Time Off or “PTO” benefit that incorporates all policies into one all-inclusive PTO plan.-Jul 12, 2016”
I also get quite a few hours put toward my lump sum weekly. Which maxes out at 400. So maybe I’m not doing so bad lol.
My Gallery
This is sad.
I wouldn’t say it’s the best solution. I know a lot of Simmers refuse to use cheat codes and although I’m not one of them, I’m a rotational player myself. Most of my Sims only earn 2 vacation days a week. And if I want to have more than 8 holidays in a year (my seasons are 2-week long) their vacation days will be used up in one rotation. I’ll have no vacations days left for REAL vacations.
This design is really disappointing for me... It even makes me want to rage delete all the holidays haha.
So no abuse of holidays and you have your vacation days saved. For the time being my rotation families have all used up their vacation days and they have no way to take a long day off to the Jungle or the woods.
That's so odd. But I guess being a hospital, it would be different.
I know many companies have moved to the PTO frame and instead of vacation days and sick days, they are lumped into one. But they still have certain paid holidays in which the company is closed and employees don't work (Christmas or the friday before or the Monday after if on a weekend, Thanksgiving and the day after,etc). If employees do work for whatever reason, they get time and a half or sometimes even double time.
I don't like how they set this up to rob our Sims of their vacation time. They only accrue so much over a period of time. Does it really matter if someone "abuses" it? If they don't go to work they don't progress, so isn't that a sort of punishment? Whatever happened to playing it our way?
You don't get random "International Donut Day" off and paid for, you know.
I personally would have no problem with the Sims' holidays not being paid. It's the taking it out of accrued vacation time that I find unfair.
Over here for part time and full time jobs we have a set amount of holiday leave per year, and I think if you don't use it, it can roll over to the next year in some cases, also we have several different types of leave aside from that. We have a yearly allotment of sick leave, and compassionate leave that doesn't roll over, and if you have a child you can apply for maternity or paternity leave.
I think this would be a good idea, having a sim have a certain allotment of leave per the calendar year, 2 weeks minimum but as you level up in your career you can get a day more for your yearly leave per career level? Also the leave for sims with jobs can roll over to the next year and maybe cap out at 6 weeks? And maybe have the children be able to take 2 weeks worth of leave per calendar year?
Alternatively, put an option in the gameplay menu "Do calendar holidays use up vacation days? - Yes/No"
So make the holidays unpaid and give us back our vacation days. I don't like using cheats as regular gameplay. I'd have to use it constantly.
I also think holidays should be paid really, but not an unlimited amount of course (to prevent abuse); so they could give us a certain amount of paid holidays per seasonal cycle, the exact number of days depending on the season length selected in the game options.
However, if we could have only one of the two - either holidays using vacation days but being paid, or holidays not using vacation days but being unpaid - I would choose the latter.