You know what I've seen 100 times more? People being dishonest about the state of the game. That's more disheartening to me.
Are you talking about Maxis? The Devs? Or people here? If you are talking about Maxis/EA that because it's big business. Companies do it all the time. If you are talking about the Devs, they have to in order to keep their jobs. If you are talking about the people here it's because they really want this game to work or not and will say anything to influence (positively or negatively) the opinions of others.
I am on the fence with the game myself. There are some things I like ... there are some same issues such as the jump bug that should have been eliminated since the Sims 2 and I don't like...there are plenty of things I have not tried in this game that people have said they don't like. But still I sit on the fence. It seems in their haste to satisfy the consumer demand they put out a half 🐸🐸🐸🐸 product but that doesn't mean it can't get better. Look the IPhone 6 just came out two/three days ago and already they have issues. Who in the hell is going to pay $600 for a phone that bends when you put it in your back pocket? But I disgress and do so for a reason. A little optimism would go a long way for those of us who did take the risk and put out a lot of money for a game that may be just as big of an epic fail as Sims City. As well as a little respect for those who really have valid reasons for not liking the game. I don't hate on anybody that does not like this base game because I am sure they have very good reasons for their disappointment that was not my point at all. I tried to answered the thread with a comment and got pulled into the great debate about the good/bad/ugly of this game which is something I really tried to avoid all this time.
I have seen you and so many people going after people on this board every day it's pretty disheartening. It seems to me that you are trolling to start a disagreement with anyone who has something to say that does not fit to your liking. I saw a number of you guys beating up on cinebar and rbridges430 this morning in her Simmers Who Returned TS4 thread and here you are at me this afternoon. You don't know me and you called me Pathetic....I don't know you and I called you a troll. Fair enough? It's not necessary that you (not you) have to take a stance on every comment just because you don't like it. Was it really necessary for you to come after me today? Don't think so.
Does that explain it well enough for you?
Beating up on Cinebar? What is wrong with you? Cinebar and I are on great terms!
About that thread, it was an obvious flame bait. And I only said that you can go play TS4 if you like kt that much, you called me names first.
You know what I've seen 100 times more? People being dishonest about the state of the game. That's more disheartening to me.
Are you talking about Maxis? The Devs? Or people here? If you are talking about Maxis/EA that because it's big business. Companies do it all the time. If you are talking about the Devs, they have to in order to keep their jobs. If you are talking about the people here it's because they really want this game to work or not and will say anything to influence (positively or negatively) the opinions of others.
I am on the fence with the game myself. There are some things I like ... there are some same issues such as the jump bug that should have been eliminated since the Sims 2 and I don't like...there are plenty of things I have not tried in this game that people have said they don't like. But still I sit on the fence. It seems in their haste to satisfy the consumer demand they put out a half 🐸🐸🐸🐸 product but that doesn't mean it can't get better. Look the IPhone 6 just came out two/three days ago and already they have issues. Who in the hell is going to pay $600 for a phone that bends when you put it in your back pocket? But I disgress and do so for a reason. A little optimism would go a long way for those of us who did take the risk and put out a lot of money for a game that may be just as big of an epic fail as Sims City.
And this is my concern... what will happen now, why is EA so plum silent about Sims 4. Sorry i only see the bad news and this is almost the same like Sim City 2013. It will fail when nothing happens with Sims 4.
I have seen you and so many people going after people on this board every day it's pretty disheartening. It seems to me that you are trolling to start a disagreement with anyone who has something to say that does not fit to your liking. I saw a number of you guys beating up on cinebar and rbridges430 this morning in her Simmers Who Returned TS4 thread and here you are at me this afternoon. You don't know me and you called me Pathetic....I don't know you and I called you a troll. Fair enough? It's not necessary that you (not you) have to take a stance on every comment just because you don't like it. Was it really necessary for you to come after me today? Don't think so.
Does that explain it well enough for you?
Beating up on Cinebar? What is wrong with you? Cinebar and I are on great terms!
About that thread, it was an obvious flame bait. And I only said that you can go play TS4 if you like kt that much, you called me names first.
I said you guys not you in particular...I read the whole thread...No I did not call you names first...I asked you why were you commenting and why are you trolling the boards? Oh right....Because you can....I did not pointedly call you out as a troll...I spoke of your action.
I have seen you and so many people going after people on this board every day it's pretty disheartening. It seems to me that you are trolling to start a disagreement with anyone who has something to say that does not fit to your liking. I saw a number of you guys beating up on cinebar and rbridges430 this morning in her Simmers Who Returned TS4 thread and here you are at me this afternoon. You don't know me and you called me Pathetic....I don't know you and I called you a troll. Fair enough? It's not necessary that you (not you) have to take a stance on every comment just because you don't like it. Was it really necessary for you to come after me today? Don't think so.
Does that explain it well enough for you?
Basically people are talking to you this way because my response did not warrant the rude reaction i got from you. Nothing in my post suggested to be talked to that way by you and you chose to do that anyway. I still haven't spoken to you in any rude way. So simply put they're responding to you because of what you posted. Than you furthered that by labeling someone a troll who is not. Furthering the hostility you promoted but now not against me but towards others. Then accusing him of attacking someone that he did not. You constantly pulling the conversation to being about something other than sims 4 and open worlds when people are still trying to remain on topic. You're going to find that people aren't finding you a victim here. I'm sorry to say but i have to agree if you dish out such harsh words towards an individual that has not done or said anything towards you, why then when others treat you in the same manner you treated me can you not handle it?
However for the sake of the conversation to go back on track. I will be the bigger person here. I am very sorry if you felt offended and challenged by my statement. That was not my objective, my objective was to show that the game hasn't improved. I was not questioning your love for sims 4, but was putting the perspective out there the games are no different from each other. Now I am not sorry for the discussion I meant. Because i don't find there to be progression I don't find a reason to progress with the series. That is my choice and something dev's will have to insure doesn't happen with majority of simmers in the future. Me not moving on to the next series is not an offensive statement and should not have been taken as such. It didn't warrant the backlash i got from you at all. That's my final say about it.
Everyone please go back on topic, have a better discussion than this. Use your report button instead so that it doesn't turn into a flame war if it hasn't already. Hard to argue without a person to argue with isn't it.
You know what I've seen 100 times more? People being dishonest about the state of the game. That's more disheartening to me.
Are you talking about Maxis? The Devs? Or people here? If you are talking about Maxis/EA that because it's big business. Companies do it all the time. If you are talking about the Devs, they have to in order to keep their jobs. If you are talking about the people here it's because they really want this game to work or not and will say anything to influence (positively or negatively) the opinions of others.
I am on the fence with the game myself. There are some things I like ... there are some same issues such as the jump bug that should have been eliminated since the Sims 2 and I don't like...there are plenty of things I have not tried in this game that people have said they don't like. But still I sit on the fence. It seems in their haste to satisfy the consumer demand they put out a half 🐸🐸🐸🐸 product but that doesn't mean it can't get better. Look the IPhone 6 just came out two/three days ago and already they have issues. Who in the hell is going to pay $600 for a phone that bends when you put it in your back pocket? But I disgress and do so for a reason. A little optimism would go a long way for those of us who did take the risk and put out a lot of money for a game that may be just as big of an epic fail as Sims City.
And this is my concern... what will happen now, why is EA so plum silent about Sims 4. Sorry i only see the bad news and this is almost the same like Sim City 2013. It will fail when nothing happens with Sims 4.
And you may be right but only time will tell....I pray it is not an epic failure because that would really burn my britches.
I have seen you and so many people going after people on this board every day it's pretty disheartening. It seems to me that you are trolling to start a disagreement with anyone who has something to say that does not fit to your liking. I saw a number of you guys beating up on cinebar and rbridges430 this morning in her Simmers Who Returned TS4 thread and here you are at me this afternoon. You don't know me and you called me Pathetic....I don't know you and I called you a troll. Fair enough? It's not necessary that you (not you) have to take a stance on every comment just because you don't like it. Was it really necessary for you to come after me today? Don't think so.
Does that explain it well enough for you?
Beating up on Cinebar? What is wrong with you? Cinebar and I are on great terms!
About that thread, it was an obvious flame bait. And I only said that you can go play TS4 if you like kt that much, you called me names first.
I said you guys not you in particular...I read the whole thread...No I did not call you names first...I asked you why were you commenting and why are you trolling the boards? Oh right....Because you can....I did not pointedly call you out as a troll...I spoke of your action.
Trolling is different than sticking up for yourself.
I have seen you and so many people going after people on this board every day it's pretty disheartening. It seems to me that you are trolling to start a disagreement with anyone who has something to say that does not fit to your liking. I saw a number of you guys beating up on cinebar and rbridges430 this morning in her Simmers Who Returned TS4 thread and here you are at me this afternoon. You don't know me and you called me Pathetic....I don't know you and I called you a troll. Fair enough? It's not necessary that you (not you) have to take a stance on every comment just because you don't like it. Was it really necessary for you to come after me today? Don't think so.
Does that explain it well enough for you?
Beating up on Cinebar? What is wrong with you? Cinebar and I are on great terms!
About that thread, it was an obvious flame bait. And I only said that you can go play TS4 if you like kt that much, you called me names first.
And I know it was flamebait hence my lack of response.
You know what I've seen 100 times more? People being dishonest about the state of the game. That's more disheartening to me.
Are you talking about Maxis? The Devs? Or people here? If you are talking about Maxis/EA that because it's big business. Companies do it all the time. If you are talking about the Devs, they have to in order to keep their jobs. If you are talking about the people here it's because they really want this game to work or not and will say anything to influence (positively or negatively) the opinions of others.
I am on the fence with the game myself. There are some things I like ... there are some same issues such as the jump bug that should have been eliminated since the Sims 2 and I don't like...there are plenty of things I have not tried in this game that people have said they don't like. But still I sit on the fence. It seems in their haste to satisfy the consumer demand they put out a half 🐸🐸🐸🐸 product but that doesn't mean it can't get better. Look the IPhone 6 just came out two/three days ago and already they have issues. Who in the hell is going to pay $600 for a phone that bends when you put it in your back pocket? But I disgress and do so for a reason. A little optimism would go a long way for those of us who did take the risk and put out a lot of money for a game that may be just as big of an epic fail as Sims City.
And this is my concern... what will happen now, why is EA so plum silent about Sims 4. Sorry i only see the bad news and this is almost the same like Sim City 2013. It will fail when nothing happens with Sims 4.
And you may be right but only time will tell....I pray it is not an epic failure because that would really burn my britches.
Games need to fail. In fact the sooner they do the quicker they improve. It's important cycle of game development. The quicker you learn not to do something the better the game gets.
You know what I've seen 100 times more? People being dishonest about the state of the game. That's more disheartening to me.
Are you talking about Maxis? The Devs? Or people here?
The fans.
Well that goes both ways does it not? Those who like it will say what they will to lure people in to buy it those who don't like it will say what they will to dishearten people. I am a big fan of the Sims as a whole series but I am very limited with my response to this particular game. I am not sitting here jumping up and down saying I love it. It's awesome and so on. I say not soooo fast....Let's look deeper and see how it plays. So far/So good. Does it have everything I want...Not by far. I took me two days to figure out how to use the darn controls to move in and out of the screen. I had to come on the board to ask how to change the lifecycle settings. The only post I have ever made on this game besides the one today asking about how to separate your household was why in the heck didn't EA/Maxis provide everyone with the guide for free.
I do not believe that a game should be so hard to learn to play right out the box. But since I overcame learning how to play the XBOX when I was a Playstation gamer for years I figured I give it a fair shot.
Anavastia/Bobyo2001 let it go...No one is talking about it anymore. Bobyo2001 you asked for an explanation I gave you mines and that is all.
You know what I've seen 100 times more? People being dishonest about the state of the game. That's more disheartening to me.
Are you talking about Maxis? The Devs? Or people here?
The fans.
Well that goes both ways does it not?
I don't know man, I consider myself a diehard simmer and it still bothers when I see people say things about previous games or this game that aren't true in attempt to defend things that I at least think most of us would agree on needing improvement in the series. Coming up with these long winded rationalizations on why we need the game to be less in this or that area. I'm a fan but I'm not a fanboy. I think fanboys are bad for games, especially when developers decide to listen to them.
You know what I've seen 100 times more? People being dishonest about the state of the game. That's more disheartening to me.
Are you talking about Maxis? The Devs? Or people here? If you are talking about Maxis/EA that because it's big business. Companies do it all the time. If you are talking about the Devs, they have to in order to keep their jobs. If you are talking about the people here it's because they really want this game to work or not and will say anything to influence (positively or negatively) the opinions of others.
I am on the fence with the game myself. There are some things I like ... there are some same issues such as the jump bug that should have been eliminated since the Sims 2 and I don't like...there are plenty of things I have not tried in this game that people have said they don't like. But still I sit on the fence. It seems in their haste to satisfy the consumer demand they put out a half 🐸🐸🐸🐸 product but that doesn't mean it can't get better. Look the IPhone 6 just came out two/three days ago and already they have issues. Who in the hell is going to pay $600 for a phone that bends when you put it in your back pocket? But I disgress and do so for a reason. A little optimism would go a long way for those of us who did take the risk and put out a lot of money for a game that may be just as big of an epic fail as Sims City.
And this is my concern... what will happen now, why is EA so plum silent about Sims 4. Sorry i only see the bad news and this is almost the same like Sim City 2013. It will fail when nothing happens with Sims 4.
And you may be right but only time will tell....I pray it is not an epic failure because that would really burn my britches.
Games need to fail. In fact the sooner they do the quicker they improve. It's important cycle of game development. The quicker you learn not to do something the better the game gets.
Hi Ana,
basically this video is right. The difference between this and what EA does, however, is the missing close feedback integration into small development cycles. Unfortunately this is something which can hardly be done by a game company. That strategy is better for software companies who are working on a specific customer project. The customer gets either access to an issue tracker where he can report any kind of bugs and requests and direct face to face communication. Small development cycles grant for fast reactions on this kind of feedback.
Game companies can't do it this way for obvious reasons and so they should not roll out a game that's at least "ok" or grade C (regarding to that video). Additional to that they should be capable and willing to do patches in a reasonable amount of time. Not every 6 months but once a month or even weekly, depending on the amount and severity of the reported issues.
Meh and when you've been gaming for as long as i have and as much as i have the game becomes pretty basic and easy to navigate. Learning curve never has been an issue for me as far as gaming is concerned. Pretty much get the gist of it all without buying it. So something more than that has to have stronger appeal.
I think people begin to think the reasoning behind sims 4's base game not having a long list of criteria is why many hate it. Not so. Break down the list and you'll find why it's a game not liked by so many. Again many people in fact millions of people play sims as a series for simulation play. Simply put because the gaming market is so overly saturated with rpg games, sports, games, and fps shooters. Sims becomes a breath of fresh air of uniqueness. Take the uniqueness out and you destroy the niche market that's attracted to the core part of play. Which is suppose to be simulation. When the simulation portion of the game has not shown improvement than there's a problem. sims 4 is that game that made all the classic mistakes one should not take. Dangerously so in a saturated market. Not everyone is going to give a game a fair shot that is already deemed to be poor in quality according to to it's genre. That is more than fair as is, why because it shows Maxis this is what they're looking for out the game. This is what you didn't provide so it cost you in sales.
So that's why it's important to fail. Although it's a classic mistake to make it doesn't mean new developers won't make it. So the sooner they learn the quicker the know what not to do with the game. The quicker the can move on to working on improving it. I don't mean that with expansions like many of the simmers here seem to think.
Yes content through time can make a game seem to improve. However all it is is content that expands upon the base game. With just options for you to do a bit more. It actually doesn't progress a game forward at all, why because expansions are the foundation basically they kind of play it can do is going to be repeated in the expansions and so are it's limitations. So a base game is crucial as a starting point. So where are simmers looking to for progression now because we learned this quite a long time ago. It's going to be with sims 5. EA is probably placing that bet that if they add in content that people are upset about that they'll come back. Problem is you might get a few simmers bite that hook but not all. Why because they know better. They know that any content pushed through the expansions are going to lack because they don't get much time to make expansions. They know a lot of content will be divided up and sold at higher pricing online. They also know that sims 4 cannot offer anymore than what it's designed to do so anything that was missed there is a strong chance it will not be in the game with the series ever.
So trust lost here we are. Discussing if it was the right idea for the dev team to rush the game out and close the worlds. I think time has already said no it wasn't the right idea. So they failed, and that's okay. Hopefully the lesson is learned and things can be improved.
You know what I've seen 100 times more? People being dishonest about the state of the game. That's more disheartening to me.
Are you talking about Maxis? The Devs? Or people here?
The fans.
Well that goes both ways does it not?
I don't know man, I consider myself a diehard simmer and it still bothers when I see people say things about previous games or this game that aren't true in attempt to defend things that I at least think most of us would agree on needing improvement in the series. Coming up with these long winded rationalizations on why we need the game to be less in this or that area. I'm a fan but I'm not a fanboy. I think fanboys are bad for games, especially when developers decide to listen to them.
That is true...I was reading a thread today where a commentor was talking about how the sims should be able to hold their baby while burning food as an example of advanced multi-tasking and I was like....HUH? I think of the most part where I see most of the disappointment from people across the board is promises from both the fans and the developers of things that just cannot, has not or will never be done. Someone showed an old clip of the Sims 2 and showed someone slapping another sim in the head while seated. That was never in the game, the sim flashing her boobs, never in the game. This is very misleading for those who have never played the Sims 2. They see this and have the expectation that this is an interaction in the game and when they never see it...DISAPPOINTMENT. Honestly, I don't know about this game I have not read enough threads to see where people are saying this game can do things that I know for a fact cannot be done. I know for a fact there are a lot of things that MAXIS/EA promised would be in the game that is not even in it...Like Basketball. I don't like the fact that some people are defending this by saying ohhhh they had to give up something to get the game out on time or to make the game work better/faster. We have no idea what they were doing all these years. It might look good on paper but once they put it together it just did not work. IMO if they can't get it to work then they should just say so instead of misleading.
You know what I've seen 100 times more? People being dishonest about the state of the game. That's more disheartening to me.
Are you talking about Maxis? The Devs? Or people here? If you are talking about Maxis/EA that because it's big business. Companies do it all the time. If you are talking about the Devs, they have to in order to keep their jobs. If you are talking about the people here it's because they really want this game to work or not and will say anything to influence (positively or negatively) the opinions of others.
I am on the fence with the game myself. There are some things I like ... there are some same issues such as the jump bug that should have been eliminated since the Sims 2 and I don't like...there are plenty of things I have not tried in this game that people have said they don't like. But still I sit on the fence. It seems in their haste to satisfy the consumer demand they put out a half 🐸🐸🐸🐸 product but that doesn't mean it can't get better. Look the IPhone 6 just came out two/three days ago and already they have issues. Who in the hell is going to pay $600 for a phone that bends when you put it in your back pocket? But I disgress and do so for a reason. A little optimism would go a long way for those of us who did take the risk and put out a lot of money for a game that may be just as big of an epic fail as Sims City.
And this is my concern... what will happen now, why is EA so plum silent about Sims 4. Sorry i only see the bad news and this is almost the same like Sim City 2013. It will fail when nothing happens with Sims 4.
And you may be right but only time will tell....I pray it is not an epic failure because that would really burn my britches.
Games need to fail. In fact the sooner they do the quicker they improve. It's important cycle of game development. The quicker you learn not to do something the better the game gets.
Hi Ana,
basically this video is right. The difference between this and what EA does, however, is the missing close feedback integration into small development cycles. Unfortunately this is something which can hardly be done by a game company. That strategy is better for software companies who are working on a specific customer project. The customer gets either access to an issue tracker where he can report any kind of bugs and request and direct face to face communication. Small development cycles grant for fast reactions on this kind of feedback.
Game companies can't do it this way for obvious reasons and so they should not roll out a game that's at least "ok" or grade C (regarding to that video). Additional to that they should be capable willing of doing patches in a reasonable amount of time. Not every 6 months but once a month or even weekly, depending on the amount and severity of the reported issues.
Yay Cryon I had hoped you'd give your imput about the discussion. Oh i very agree. Given the size of the company and capabilities of man power the game should be patched more than twice a month.
i was just speaking more so on terms this is something a dev learns on a personal level to fail faster.
I agree on a large scale EA took the risk to release a grade C game. This is why they got the backlash they did. These are classic 101 game mistakes they should have never taken with being such a large company with so much at their disposal. I mean honestly between you and I don't even think they should have rehashed the mmo.
Frankly my feelings are the project should have been canned and started over. Why risk everything on knowing it could be a fatal blow to the series.
My feelings on the matter was the open world was more than possible to be improved, i think EA wanted to make that blow to the franchise to be honest. I know that may sound weird why would they. Think about it this way if i can make millions off a game that id on't have to put much effort into and those fans that i retain are more than willing to shell out millions in my cash shop than even with 30 percent retention i still can make the same amount of money with sims 4 at lower cost to the franchise.
I had long wondered if this is the move EA chose to do when they're getting ready to close down a series.
I don't know but it would seem with the amount of money sims pulls in a year that the game very will can support innovation and advancement with a very good engine to run it all. I still am puzzled to this day why do this with the series.
I think its much more complicated than that. I feel like this game would have been multiplayer if it weren't for fanboys. I think the developers took multiplayer away because they were listening to them. I think that whether any of us liked the idea of Sims being multiplayer or not that them removing it was a bad mistake. They had a vision for the game, and fanboys blurred that vision. I'd even be willing to bet that with TS4 having been out for a bit, some people who were originally resistant to multiplayer would go for it now if it could be done all over again had they known how it was going to turn out. That's just one example. The other much more obvious example is rationalizing and defending a game's shortcomings, like the loss of control over Sims in multiple locations being explained away as though its not a big deal.
Right on @Anavastia.
I'm all with you. Please don't understand my comment as disagreement. The message of this video is truly one of our (the developers) mantras . I just wanted to point out some details that could possibly lead to false expectations with the fans.
@Vlaxitov: I like your new avatar. It reminds me of something. Hmmm... what could it be...?
About this game being MMO: According to the amount of posts you made I guess you haven't been on board when we had a huge debate over this idea. The vast majority is against multiplayer for very good reasons. Did you know Sims can be a way of therapy?
Sorry I have to abort. Got to go...
EDIT: No really. Maybe someone else can continue on this. Ana maybe? I know you have been with us all along back then.
Bye for now guys. *waves*
Right on @Anavastia.
I'm all with you. Please don't understand my comment as disagreement. The message of this video is truly one of our (the developers) mantras . I just wanted to point out some details that could possibly lead to false expectations with the fans.
What do you think about the open world Cryon? Do you think Maxis could have done emotions, with the open world and higher graphics if they had cleaned up the coding and maybe changed the way the world loaded as a whole?
I would have loved if sims would had advanced to having a huge map like skyrim where we could drive our cars down road ways to other towns or cities. Or gone first person view and explored the open terrain. i kind of felt that would have been advancement not this.
I think its much more complicated than that. I feel like this game would have been multiplayer if it weren't for fanboys. I think the developers took multiplayer away because they were listening to them. I think that whether any of us liked the idea of Sims being multiplayer or not that them removing it was a bad mistake. They had a vision for the game, and fanboys blurred that vision. I'd even be willing to bet that now that TS4 has been out for a bit, some people who were originally resistant to multiplayer would go for it now if it could be done all over again had they known how it was going to turn out. That's just one example. The other much more obvious example is rationalizing and defending a game's shortcomings, like the loss of control over Sims in multiple locations being explained away as though its not a big deal.
I agree with this....I was hoping for Multiplayer functionality since the Sims 2 because they made it for the consoles and that did not happen. I guess since they announced that is was not going to have multiplayer functionality I really forgot about it but you're right the same fanboys that pushed for the game to be released the way it is are more than likely the ones who 86'd the multiplayer capabilities. Which would have been so awesome.
Let me say this....I am not going to defend any shortcomings of any game...I have been a gamer for way too long not to speak the truth. If I like something I will say it...If it sucks I will say it. This whole bit about the open world...meh....I like it more here in the Sims 4 than I liked it in the Sims 3...the Sims 3 world just became too busy for me...doesn't mean I didn't know how to play the game like someone indicated. It means I have a preference visually. I don't like the fact that the Sims just walk off into the sunset (so to speak) when the go to school or work and not have a car/bus to come pick them up in the Sims 4. I loved that in the Sims 3 because they did not have it in the Sims 2.
the one thing that does get my goat in general is making assumptions of what is going to be in this game. If they did not give what was promised the first time what makes you think they are going to give it to you later?
I think its much more complicated than that. I feel like this game would have been multiplayer if it weren't for fanboys. I think the developers took multiplayer away because they were listening to them. I think that whether any of us liked the idea of Sims being multiplayer or not that them removing it was a bad mistake. They had a vision for the game, and fanboys blurred that vision. I'd even be willing to bet that now that TS4 has been out for a bit, some people who were originally resistant to multiplayer would go for it now if it could be done all over again had they known how it was going to turn out. That's just one example. The other much more obvious example is rationalizing and defending a game's shortcomings, like the loss of control over Sims in multiple locations being explained away as though its not a big deal.
I agree with this....I was hoping for Multiplayer functionality since the Sims 2 because they made it for the consoles and that did not happen. I guess since they announced that is was not going to have multiplayer functionality I really forgot about it but you're right the same fanboys that pushed for the game to be released the way it is are more than likely the ones who 86'd the multiplayer capabilities. Which would have been so awesome.
Let me say this....I am not going to defend any shortcomings of any game...I have been a gamer for way too long not to speak the truth. If I like something I will say it...If it sucks I will say it. This whole bit about the open world...meh....I like it more here in the Sims 4 than I liked it in the Sims 3...the Sims 3 world just became too busy for me...doesn't mean I didn't know how to play the game like someone indicated. It means I have a preference visually. I don't like the fact that the Sims just walk off into the sunset (so to speak) when the go to school or work and not have a car/bus to come pick them up in the Sims 4. I loved that in the Sims 3 because they did not have it in the Sims 2.
the one thing that does get my goat in general is making assumptions of what is going to be in this game. If they did not give what was promised the first time what makes you think they are going to give it to you later?
And quess what, they halted this idea cause of the Sim City Failure, i hated the Server they were so unstable in the first weeks i couldn't play even 10 min without any crashes...
Why are people lying about the open-ness of this world?? There is a loading screen in between EVERY. SINGLE. LOT. That is the definition of a "closed world". You cannot travel to your next door neighbor without a loading screen. You cannot jog to the other side of the map without a loading screen. You can't visit the shops and walk between each one without loading screens. <br />
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Personally, my heart sunk when I realized open world was gone and the create-a-pattern tool was axed. But honestly I'm most confused about how many people are defending the closed world, calling it "more open than TS3", or saying the loading screens are so fast they're inconsequential (hint: they're not). Just because I can travel to other worlds it's suddenly "more open"? I've only had a desire to do that once every 6 months of gameplay, MAYBE, but walking down the street or collecting gems was constant! <br />
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Not to mention, before this game came out the major outrage was that there were no toddlers or pools? Really? Those are things that could easily be added into an expansion (granted I agree it's silly for us to have to pay for them again). But they're not going to redesign the entire game to bring back open world. That is gone for good and THAT is where we should be outraged!<br />
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I get that this is "easier" on low-end machines. I do, and I try to sympathize. But I don't have a low-end machine, I bought a good machine the second it couldn't handle TS3 to its fullest. Anyone who wants to be a serious gamer knows by now they can't depend on low-end machines when every single computer game these days is more and more demanding. Shouldn't we be improving and streamlining the major concepts instead of hacking them up for the sake of people who couldn't even play older games?<br />
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Long story short, am I really the only one who is crushed by this? Is everyone drinking some kool-aid that I missed out on?? Don't get me wrong, there are a few things about this game I've preferred over TS3 so far, but I feel like we've lost all the incredible immersion and we're back to staying isolated at home, which does NOT make up for the few things I like :-(
It's a semi-opened world. A mix of TS2 and TS3. But still it sucks.
Comments
Are you talking about Maxis? The Devs? Or people here? If you are talking about Maxis/EA that because it's big business. Companies do it all the time. If you are talking about the Devs, they have to in order to keep their jobs. If you are talking about the people here it's because they really want this game to work or not and will say anything to influence (positively or negatively) the opinions of others.
I am on the fence with the game myself. There are some things I like ... there are some same issues such as the jump bug that should have been eliminated since the Sims 2 and I don't like...there are plenty of things I have not tried in this game that people have said they don't like. But still I sit on the fence. It seems in their haste to satisfy the consumer demand they put out a half 🐸🐸🐸🐸 product but that doesn't mean it can't get better. Look the IPhone 6 just came out two/three days ago and already they have issues. Who in the hell is going to pay $600 for a phone that bends when you put it in your back pocket? But I disgress and do so for a reason. A little optimism would go a long way for those of us who did take the risk and put out a lot of money for a game that may be just as big of an epic fail as Sims City. As well as a little respect for those who really have valid reasons for not liking the game. I don't hate on anybody that does not like this base game because I am sure they have very good reasons for their disappointment that was not my point at all. I tried to answered the thread with a comment and got pulled into the great debate about the good/bad/ugly of this game which is something I really tried to avoid all this time.
Beating up on Cinebar? What is wrong with you? Cinebar and I are on great terms!
About that thread, it was an obvious flame bait. And I only said that you can go play TS4 if you like kt that much, you called me names first.
And this is my concern... what will happen now, why is EA so plum silent about Sims 4. Sorry i only see the bad news and this is almost the same like Sim City 2013. It will fail when nothing happens with Sims 4.
The fans.
I said you guys not you in particular...I read the whole thread...No I did not call you names first...I asked you why were you commenting and why are you trolling the boards? Oh right....Because you can....I did not pointedly call you out as a troll...I spoke of your action.
Basically people are talking to you this way because my response did not warrant the rude reaction i got from you. Nothing in my post suggested to be talked to that way by you and you chose to do that anyway. I still haven't spoken to you in any rude way. So simply put they're responding to you because of what you posted. Than you furthered that by labeling someone a troll who is not. Furthering the hostility you promoted but now not against me but towards others. Then accusing him of attacking someone that he did not. You constantly pulling the conversation to being about something other than sims 4 and open worlds when people are still trying to remain on topic. You're going to find that people aren't finding you a victim here. I'm sorry to say but i have to agree if you dish out such harsh words towards an individual that has not done or said anything towards you, why then when others treat you in the same manner you treated me can you not handle it?
However for the sake of the conversation to go back on track. I will be the bigger person here. I am very sorry if you felt offended and challenged by my statement. That was not my objective, my objective was to show that the game hasn't improved. I was not questioning your love for sims 4, but was putting the perspective out there the games are no different from each other. Now I am not sorry for the discussion I meant. Because i don't find there to be progression I don't find a reason to progress with the series. That is my choice and something dev's will have to insure doesn't happen with majority of simmers in the future. Me not moving on to the next series is not an offensive statement and should not have been taken as such. It didn't warrant the backlash i got from you at all. That's my final say about it.
Everyone please go back on topic, have a better discussion than this. Use your report button instead so that it doesn't turn into a flame war if it hasn't already. Hard to argue without a person to argue with isn't it.
And you may be right but only time will tell....I pray it is not an epic failure because that would really burn my britches.
Trolling is different than sticking up for yourself.
And I know it was flamebait hence my lack of response.
Games need to fail. In fact the sooner they do the quicker they improve. It's important cycle of game development. The quicker you learn not to do something the better the game gets.
Well that goes both ways does it not? Those who like it will say what they will to lure people in to buy it those who don't like it will say what they will to dishearten people. I am a big fan of the Sims as a whole series but I am very limited with my response to this particular game. I am not sitting here jumping up and down saying I love it. It's awesome and so on. I say not soooo fast....Let's look deeper and see how it plays. So far/So good. Does it have everything I want...Not by far. I took me two days to figure out how to use the darn controls to move in and out of the screen. I had to come on the board to ask how to change the lifecycle settings. The only post I have ever made on this game besides the one today asking about how to separate your household was why in the heck didn't EA/Maxis provide everyone with the guide for free.
I do not believe that a game should be so hard to learn to play right out the box. But since I overcame learning how to play the XBOX when I was a Playstation gamer for years I figured I give it a fair shot.
Anavastia/Bobyo2001 let it go...No one is talking about it anymore. Bobyo2001 you asked for an explanation I gave you mines and that is all.
I don't know man, I consider myself a diehard simmer and it still bothers when I see people say things about previous games or this game that aren't true in attempt to defend things that I at least think most of us would agree on needing improvement in the series. Coming up with these long winded rationalizations on why we need the game to be less in this or that area. I'm a fan but I'm not a fanboy. I think fanboys are bad for games, especially when developers decide to listen to them.
basically this video is right. The difference between this and what EA does, however, is the missing close feedback integration into small development cycles. Unfortunately this is something which can hardly be done by a game company. That strategy is better for software companies who are working on a specific customer project. The customer gets either access to an issue tracker where he can report any kind of bugs and requests and direct face to face communication. Small development cycles grant for fast reactions on this kind of feedback.
Game companies can't do it this way for obvious reasons and so they should not roll out a game that's at least "ok" or grade C (regarding to that video). Additional to that they should be capable and willing to do patches in a reasonable amount of time. Not every 6 months but once a month or even weekly, depending on the amount and severity of the reported issues.
I think people begin to think the reasoning behind sims 4's base game not having a long list of criteria is why many hate it. Not so. Break down the list and you'll find why it's a game not liked by so many. Again many people in fact millions of people play sims as a series for simulation play. Simply put because the gaming market is so overly saturated with rpg games, sports, games, and fps shooters. Sims becomes a breath of fresh air of uniqueness. Take the uniqueness out and you destroy the niche market that's attracted to the core part of play. Which is suppose to be simulation. When the simulation portion of the game has not shown improvement than there's a problem. sims 4 is that game that made all the classic mistakes one should not take. Dangerously so in a saturated market. Not everyone is going to give a game a fair shot that is already deemed to be poor in quality according to to it's genre. That is more than fair as is, why because it shows Maxis this is what they're looking for out the game. This is what you didn't provide so it cost you in sales.
So that's why it's important to fail. Although it's a classic mistake to make it doesn't mean new developers won't make it. So the sooner they learn the quicker the know what not to do with the game. The quicker the can move on to working on improving it. I don't mean that with expansions like many of the simmers here seem to think.
Yes content through time can make a game seem to improve. However all it is is content that expands upon the base game. With just options for you to do a bit more. It actually doesn't progress a game forward at all, why because expansions are the foundation basically they kind of play it can do is going to be repeated in the expansions and so are it's limitations. So a base game is crucial as a starting point. So where are simmers looking to for progression now because we learned this quite a long time ago. It's going to be with sims 5. EA is probably placing that bet that if they add in content that people are upset about that they'll come back. Problem is you might get a few simmers bite that hook but not all. Why because they know better. They know that any content pushed through the expansions are going to lack because they don't get much time to make expansions. They know a lot of content will be divided up and sold at higher pricing online. They also know that sims 4 cannot offer anymore than what it's designed to do so anything that was missed there is a strong chance it will not be in the game with the series ever.
So trust lost here we are. Discussing if it was the right idea for the dev team to rush the game out and close the worlds. I think time has already said no it wasn't the right idea. So they failed, and that's okay. Hopefully the lesson is learned and things can be improved.
That is true...I was reading a thread today where a commentor was talking about how the sims should be able to hold their baby while burning food as an example of advanced multi-tasking and I was like....HUH? I think of the most part where I see most of the disappointment from people across the board is promises from both the fans and the developers of things that just cannot, has not or will never be done. Someone showed an old clip of the Sims 2 and showed someone slapping another sim in the head while seated. That was never in the game, the sim flashing her boobs, never in the game. This is very misleading for those who have never played the Sims 2. They see this and have the expectation that this is an interaction in the game and when they never see it...DISAPPOINTMENT. Honestly, I don't know about this game I have not read enough threads to see where people are saying this game can do things that I know for a fact cannot be done. I know for a fact there are a lot of things that MAXIS/EA promised would be in the game that is not even in it...Like Basketball. I don't like the fact that some people are defending this by saying ohhhh they had to give up something to get the game out on time or to make the game work better/faster. We have no idea what they were doing all these years. It might look good on paper but once they put it together it just did not work. IMO if they can't get it to work then they should just say so instead of misleading.
Yay Cryon I had hoped you'd give your imput about the discussion. Oh i very agree. Given the size of the company and capabilities of man power the game should be patched more than twice a month.
i was just speaking more so on terms this is something a dev learns on a personal level to fail faster.
I agree on a large scale EA took the risk to release a grade C game. This is why they got the backlash they did. These are classic 101 game mistakes they should have never taken with being such a large company with so much at their disposal. I mean honestly between you and I don't even think they should have rehashed the mmo.
Frankly my feelings are the project should have been canned and started over. Why risk everything on knowing it could be a fatal blow to the series.
My feelings on the matter was the open world was more than possible to be improved, i think EA wanted to make that blow to the franchise to be honest. I know that may sound weird why would they. Think about it this way if i can make millions off a game that id on't have to put much effort into and those fans that i retain are more than willing to shell out millions in my cash shop than even with 30 percent retention i still can make the same amount of money with sims 4 at lower cost to the franchise.
I had long wondered if this is the move EA chose to do when they're getting ready to close down a series.
I don't know but it would seem with the amount of money sims pulls in a year that the game very will can support innovation and advancement with a very good engine to run it all. I still am puzzled to this day why do this with the series.
I think its much more complicated than that. I feel like this game would have been multiplayer if it weren't for fanboys. I think the developers took multiplayer away because they were listening to them. I think that whether any of us liked the idea of Sims being multiplayer or not that them removing it was a bad mistake. They had a vision for the game, and fanboys blurred that vision. I'd even be willing to bet that with TS4 having been out for a bit, some people who were originally resistant to multiplayer would go for it now if it could be done all over again had they known how it was going to turn out. That's just one example. The other much more obvious example is rationalizing and defending a game's shortcomings, like the loss of control over Sims in multiple locations being explained away as though its not a big deal.
I'm all with you. Please don't understand my comment as disagreement. The message of this video is truly one of our (the developers) mantras . I just wanted to point out some details that could possibly lead to false expectations with the fans.
About this game being MMO: According to the amount of posts you made I guess you haven't been on board when we had a huge debate over this idea. The vast majority is against multiplayer for very good reasons. Did you know Sims can be a way of therapy?
Sorry I have to abort. Got to go...
EDIT: No really. Maybe someone else can continue on this. Ana maybe? I know you have been with us all along back then.
Bye for now guys. *waves*
What do you think about the open world Cryon? Do you think Maxis could have done emotions, with the open world and higher graphics if they had cleaned up the coding and maybe changed the way the world loaded as a whole?
I would have loved if sims would had advanced to having a huge map like skyrim where we could drive our cars down road ways to other towns or cities. Or gone first person view and explored the open terrain. i kind of felt that would have been advancement not this.
Oh I won't hesitate to say you are my sensei.
I agree with this....I was hoping for Multiplayer functionality since the Sims 2 because they made it for the consoles and that did not happen. I guess since they announced that is was not going to have multiplayer functionality I really forgot about it but you're right the same fanboys that pushed for the game to be released the way it is are more than likely the ones who 86'd the multiplayer capabilities. Which would have been so awesome.
Let me say this....I am not going to defend any shortcomings of any game...I have been a gamer for way too long not to speak the truth. If I like something I will say it...If it sucks I will say it. This whole bit about the open world...meh....I like it more here in the Sims 4 than I liked it in the Sims 3...the Sims 3 world just became too busy for me...doesn't mean I didn't know how to play the game like someone indicated. It means I have a preference visually. I don't like the fact that the Sims just walk off into the sunset (so to speak) when the go to school or work and not have a car/bus to come pick them up in the Sims 4. I loved that in the Sims 3 because they did not have it in the Sims 2.
the one thing that does get my goat in general is making assumptions of what is going to be in this game. If they did not give what was promised the first time what makes you think they are going to give it to you later?
And quess what, they halted this idea cause of the Sim City Failure, i hated the Server they were so unstable in the first weeks i couldn't play even 10 min without any crashes...
It's a semi-opened world. A mix of TS2 and TS3. But still it sucks.