Changed tuning IDs breaks custom content

IngeJones

@SimGuruModSquad I'd just like to bring to your attention the huge problem some of these patches bring to custom content - and I am not just talking about mods which we already accept can be broken by behaviour changes. In this latest case it's lighting. The tuning IDs of all lights have been changed, meaning that ALL custom lights, of which there are some thousands, are all unusable and need updating. This is due merely to having their tuning IDs changed, which seems a small thing but means all those files being remade and reuploaded, if indeed those creators are still even around. It has also spoiled many many shared lots which used these custom lights. Would it not have been possible to leave the tuning IDs the same and simply updated the tuning resource body?

_orangemittens_

The problem isn't that EA's lamp tuning names/IDs have been changed. The problem is that the old tuning names/ID's were removed from the game files leaving CC lamps that depend on those tuning names/IDs as items that will cause a script call failure when a player attempts to place them in the game.

The issue does not require creators to remake/reupload their lamps. Studio released a batch fix last night that will update every affected lamp's Object Definition resource so everyone can update their own game files in seconds, and creators won't need to worry about this at all. If creators do decide to share fixed versions all they have to do is reupload the ones Studio fixed.

If EA was feeling generous it would be nice to have the old tuning names/IDs restored to the game files so that batch fixing was not compulsory if a player wants their old lights back. If EA was feeling super-generous they could update the old tuning names/IDs so they offered the same functionality as the tuning the EA lamps are now using offers. This would make it so batch fixing wasn't needed at all. Neither of these things is necessary for functional old CC lamps however.

Jagwithtude

_orangemittens_ wrote: »

The problem isn't that EA's lamp tuning names/IDs have been changed. The problem is that the old tuning names/ID's were removed from the game files leaving CC lamps that depend on those tuning names/IDs as items that will cause a script call failure when a player attempts to place them in the game.

The issue does not require creators to remake/reupload their lamps. Studio released a batch fix last night that will update every affected lamp's Object Definition resource so everyone can update their own game files in seconds, and creators won't need to worry about this at all. If creators do decide to share fixed versions all they have to do is reupload the ones Studio fixed.

If EA was feeling generous it would be nice to have the old tuning names/IDs restored to the game files so that batch fixing was not compulsory if a player wants their old lights back. If EA was feeling super-generous they could update the old tuning names/IDs so they offered the same functionality as the tuning the EA lamps are now using offers. This would make it so batch fixing wasn't needed at all. Neither of these things is necessary for functional old CC lamps however.

And I wish to give you a great big thank you Orangemittens, I up graded to Jackpot last night and batch fixed my lights (35 of them were "broken") I also fixed my dining chairs and CAS CC for all genders. It feels great to have my game working like it should again.

IngeJones

Yeah I have used the batchfix, thanks to the Studio team But my main point is I wish EA had thought about the consequences and handled this differently - as you outline, OM.

SimGuruEugi

Hello!

Yes, there was a substantial change to tuning related to lights. Specifically, ~130 object tuning resources were deleted because they contained duplicate information, meaning the tuning could be consolidated into fewer instances. This is beneficial to the player as it reduces load times, and it's beneficial to development as it makes the system more maintainable.

We're committed to supporting your modding efforts, but there will be times, such as this one, when we make changes that require existing mods to be updated (this was the main reason behind automatically disabling mods after patches).

Let me know if you have more questions about the lighting changes. It seems that @_orangemittens_ has a good fix for this.

Thanks!

_orangemittens_

Thank you for explaining. It seems that running a batch-fix that takes seconds is little enough to do in exchange for faster load times. The effort your team has put into maintaining backward compatibility for CC is much appreciated, and everyone understands it isn't always possible to do so while adding improvements to the game.

Forest_Ninja

SimGuruEugi wrote: »

Hello!

Yes, there was a substantial change to tuning related to lights. Specifically, ~130 object tuning resources were deleted because they contained duplicate information, meaning the tuning could be consolidated into fewer instances. This is beneficial to the player as it reduces load times, and it's beneficial to development as it makes the system more maintainable.

We're committed to supporting your modding efforts, but there will be times, such as this one, when we make changes that require existing mods to be updated (this was the main reason behind automatically disabling mods after patches).

Let me know if you have more questions about the lighting changes. It seems that @_orangemittens_ has a good fix for this.

Thanks!

You could give us a list of functions for creation and editing of tuned objects and wrappers so we don't ever need to concern ourselves with resource IDs or XML editing... That would be highly appreciated!

SimGuruEugi

Forest_Ninja wrote: »

SimGuruEugi wrote: »

Hello!

Yes, there was a substantial change to tuning related to lights. Specifically, ~130 object tuning resources were deleted because they contained duplicate information, meaning the tuning could be consolidated into fewer instances. This is beneficial to the player as it reduces load times, and it's beneficial to development as it makes the system more maintainable.

We're committed to supporting your modding efforts, but there will be times, such as this one, when we make changes that require existing mods to be updated (this was the main reason behind automatically disabling mods after patches).

Let me know if you have more questions about the lighting changes. It seems that @_orangemittens_ has a good fix for this.

Thanks!

You could give us a list of functions for creation and editing of tuned objects and wrappers so we don't ever need to concern ourselves with resource IDs or XML editing... That would be highly appreciated!

I'm not sure I understand. Tuning instances are XML resources and need to be authored. There are no functions that create tuning for objects.

pandie00

Ty so much @_orangemittens_ you saved my day...

ureshii_wa

''.''

IngeJones

@SimGuruEugi would it be possible to make available in this section a more complete change list per patch, so that people making tools and cc, and even using cc, would get an idea of what might affect them specifically? I appreciate that the general "What's changed" that gets posted is pitched so that normal players don't get bored reading too much detail, but it doesn't mention this change at all, and it's turned out to have a very significant impact

SimGuruEugi

ureshii_wa wrote: »

SimGuruEugi wrote: »

Hello!

Yes, there was a substantial change to tuning related to lights. Specifically, ~130 object tuning resources were deleted because they contained duplicate information, meaning the tuning could be consolidated into fewer instances. This is beneficial to the player as it reduces load times, and it's beneficial to development as it makes the system more maintainable.

We're committed to supporting your modding efforts, but there will be times, such as this one, when we make changes that require existing mods to be updated (this was the main reason behind automatically disabling mods after patches).

Let me know if you have more questions about the lighting changes. It seems that @_orangemittens_ has a good fix for this.

Thanks!

@SimGuruEugi Does this mean that EA has no intention of patch fixing this cc lights issue themselves in future? & that we have no choice but to do the studio fix? Just want to know so I'm not left hanging indefinitely while I was thinking EA would fix it..

Mod creators have to update their mods to be compatible with patches. We wouldn't fix CC ourselves.

SimGuruEugi

IngeJones wrote: »

@SimGuruEugi would it be possible to make available in this section a more complete change list per patch, so that people making tools and cc, and even using cc, would get an idea of what might affect them specifically? I appreciate that the general "What's changed" that gets posted is pitched so that normal players don't get bored reading too much detail, but it doesn't mention this change at all, and it's turned out to have a very significant impact

I'll investigate the feasibility of providing more information that might be of interest to modders (e.g. deleted tuning instances).

stanfordmd09

@_orangemittens_ What are those who have macs to do? I do not have parallels or bootcamp or whatever it is called to installed the program to get the batch. I also have hundreds of lights and it would be too tedious and painstaking to find every single light and redownload them. I feel like us mac users as just being left aside and its not fair (not at all saying this is your fault)

IngeJones

I am sorry @stanfordmd09 that a mac suddenly appeared in your possession instead of the windows PC you chose so that you could run all the things you knew would be easier to run under Windows Life can deal these surprises, I know.

_orangemittens_

@stanfordmd09, a Mac version of Studio is underway and our hope is that Mac users won't have much longer to wait. The Mac version will, of course, include all the batch fixers that the Windows version has.

egwarhammer

_orangemittens_ wrote: »

@stanfordmd09, a Mac version of Studio is underway and our hope is that Mac users won't have much longer to wait. The Mac version will, of course, include all the batch fixers that the Windows version has.

I don't have a Mac, and don't know any more about them than to offer people the Mac forum link for issues... but I am STILL tickled to see this in print!

Thanks for sharing!

Forest_Ninja

stanfordmd09 wrote: »

@_orangemittens_ What are those who have macs to do? I do not have parallels or bootcamp or whatever it is called to installed the program to get the batch. I also have hundreds of lights and it would be too tedious and painstaking to find every single light and redownload them. I feel like us mac users as just being left aside and its not fair (not at all saying this is your fault)

_orangemittens_ wrote: »

@stanfordmd09, a Mac version of Studio is underway and our hope is that Mac users won't have much longer to wait. The Mac version will, of course, include all the batch fixers that the Windows version has.

egwarhammer wrote: »

_orangemittens_ wrote: »

@stanfordmd09, a Mac version of Studio is underway and our hope is that Mac users won't have much longer to wait. The Mac version will, of course, include all the batch fixers that the Windows version has.

I don't have a Mac, and don't know any more about them than to offer people the Mac forum link for issues... but I am STILL tickled to see this in print!

Thanks for sharing!

I agree that it's delightful to see the creators of unofficial add-ons and utilities taking ownership of the state of their own work. The SimGurus have done an exemplary job supporting personal projects and it certainly isn't possible to expand any version of the sims without extension and conversion of data, especially tuning. It would be absurd to accuse the devs of failure for following standard practices or to expect special communication regarding asset management.

stanfordmd09

@_orangemittens_ thank you, I look forward to the update for it to become available for mac!

_orangemittens_

Hi @stanfordmd09 and @egwarhammer, the new Sims 4 Studio for Mac (Appleseed) went up last night for beta testing. Anyone who uses Mac is welcome to download and give it a try. It has all the batch fixers the Windows version has, a full resource editor, and can do recolors of EA CAS and CC CAS items.