If simmers put as much imagination into playing the game as they do "reading" into a single sentence, they might enjoy the game more.
That's kind of insulting as well. Honestly if it takes more imagination to play the Sims 4 than it does for a cardboard box, I fear for its future. Not like Simmers haven't tried different styles anyways. They have for nearly two years now. The Sims 4 is still limited in what it offers. It caters only to a small niche of play styles, mainly towards soloist achievers. Maybe it is time for Maxis to realize that they need to stop blaming the players and start taking the professional responsibility of the game themselves. Simmers already get bored frequently between pack releases and honestly there is something very wrong with that. Sims games should have Simmers have long-term satisfaction, not short-term. There are reasons why the Sims 2 is still very popular even to this day. Same with the Sims 3. Those games were built for the future in mind. The Sims 4 comes off as very archaic in the gaming world.
“Although the world is full of suffering, it is full also of the overcoming of it.” –Helen Keller
@Ianamus brought up Civ 6 including all the expansion content of Civ 5 and explained why--the content was already there so all they had to do was access the assets and set it up for the new version. They did this somewhat with TS3, from what I understanding, reusing a ton of animations from that game and porting them into 3. So, how many versions of the game do you want where they just reuse assets, put a new coat of paint on it, add a few new shinies and call it a day?
The sad thing is I think I would honestly enjoy the Sims 4 far more if it was just a copy of the Sims 3 with improved graphics and a few new features.
I don't play Civ 5 or Civ 6, but I'm guessing they were built on the same game engine so adding things from Civ 5 to Civ 6 would not be hard. The Sims 4, however, is built on a different game engine than S3 was so that is not possible. If you know so much about gaming, you should know this.
Civ 6 is being built with a new engine. You could have found that out with a simple google search, rather than automatically assuming I don't know what I'm talking about.
Oh, I would love to know that. Imagine they announce something like City EP with Sims 2 apartment style in sims 4. I am dreaming, hoping and anticipating that would come. Can't wait !
It amazes me, and not in a good way, that EA and its minions still, after all this time and all the outcry and discussion, refuse to comment definitely on the biggest elephant in the room I've ever seen, toddlers. I know not everyone wants them, but come ON. You'd have to be blind, deaf, and a hermit for the last two years not to have noticed it. Either they're working on them or not. Either the game can have them or it can't. TWO YEARS. Don't give us that line about "can't comment" -- EA can comment if they want, just like they comment on other things.
Also, finding out that SGDrake is not a "family player," while certainly her right, does not surprise me in the least. I gather the TS4 devs weren't family players either, and so, in the finest tradition of Final Fantasy Disease, if the devs don't want it, we can't have it either. In other words, what they want is the ONLY way to play the game. Babies as objects, no toddlers? They don't care so to them the game is fine as is.
Some of these same developers were doing TS3 and we got a Generations Expansion. You can't go by that.
@Ianamus brought up Civ 6 including all the expansion content of Civ 5 and explained why--the content was already there so all they had to do was access the assets and set it up for the new version. They did this somewhat with TS3, from what I understanding, reusing a ton of animations from that game and porting them into 3. So, how many versions of the game do you want where they just reuse assets, put a new coat of paint on it, add a few new shinies and call it a day?
The sad thing is I think I would honestly enjoy the Sims 4 far more if it was just a copy of the Sims 3 with improved graphics and a few new features.
I think there are quite a few people who would. And quite a few people who would love it if they'd just taken TS2 and updated for today's graphics. My question still stands, though--how many versions of the game do you want where they just reuse assets and update the graphics? Why would people want to keep purchasing the same game over and over with the same expansions, etc.?
Origin ID: ebuchala I'm not a psychopath. I'm a high-functioning psychopath. Reaper
If simmers put as much imagination into playing the game as they do "reading" into a single sentence, they might enjoy the game more.
That's kind of insulting as well. Honestly if it takes more imagination to play the Sims 4 than it does for a cardboard box, I fear for its future. Not like Simmers haven't tried different styles anyways. They have for nearly two years now. The Sims 4 is still limited in what it offers. It caters only to a small niche of play styles, mainly towards soloist achievers. Maybe it is time for Maxis to realize that they need to stop blaming the players and start taking the professional responsibility of the game themselves. Simmers already get bored frequently between pack releases and honestly there is something very wrong with that. Sims games should have Simmers have long-term satisfaction, not short-term. There are reasons why the Sims 2 is still very popular even to this day. Same with the Sims 3. Those games were built for the future in mind. The Sims 4 comes off as very archaic in the gaming world.
It's a game, of course it takes imagination. As for the cardboard box reference, how many times have you seen a very small child put the toy aside and play for hours with the box it came in. Cats can be satisfied with an empty box. Based on numerous posts I've read, many simmers seem to think if they turn on the game, it will entertain them. The game is a tool. If you don't know how to use the tool properly, don't get angry at the screwdriver because it's not sawing the wood.
if we only have news in october, that means we only have one expansion this year, since GT doesn't count, because sgould be release last year (December).... how sad... a year per expansion it's ridiculous... hope this one have more content and better thematic, for all the time we are wainting..
@Ianamus brought up Civ 6 including all the expansion content of Civ 5 and explained why--the content was already there so all they had to do was access the assets and set it up for the new version. They did this somewhat with TS3, from what I understanding, reusing a ton of animations from that game and porting them into 3. So, how many versions of the game do you want where they just reuse assets, put a new coat of paint on it, add a few new shinies and call it a day?
The sad thing is I think I would honestly enjoy the Sims 4 far more if it was just a copy of the Sims 3 with improved graphics and a few new features.
I think there are quite a few people who would. And quite a few people who would love it if they'd just taken TS2 and updated for today's graphics. My question still stands, though--how many versions of the game do you want where they just reuse assets and update the graphics? Why would people want to keep purchasing the same game over and over with the same expansions, etc.?
If Sims 4 on release was nothing more Sims 3 and all of it's expansions with updated graphics then future expansions would be have to be completely new. The fact that Sims 4's base game doesn't include any previous expansion features is the entire reason we have to purchase the same stuff repeatedly.
The only reason people didn't mind so much with Sims 3 was that the open-world nature was a very large change from Sims 2 that really added a lot to the game, so they were buying something new. Sims 4, meanwhile, cut a lot more from Sims 3's base game and added very little. For all their talk of new and different stuff the Sims 4 still plays like a Sims 3 with better graphics and half the features.
S4 has had two expansion packs that are completely new and a third that is said to be something we've never had before. Yet people continue to want old packs to make a return.
I agree,
When this series is done we would have spent, at the very least, about $300 with just the expansion packs.
It's a feature rich game at the end, but a $300 dollar game? They can at least throw in a weather system in the base game.
It's a game, of course it takes imagination. As for the cardboard box reference, how many times have you seen a very small child put the toy aside and play for hours with the box it came in. Cats can be satisfied with an empty box. Based on numerous posts I've read, many simmers seem to think if they turn on the game, it will entertain them. The game is a tool. If you don't know how to use the tool properly, don't get angry at the screwdriver because it's not sawing the wood.
Honestly I have more tools to play with my imagination in a Minecraft game. That's the thing, the Sims 4 lacks the tools to play around with. I mean there isn't even a terrain tool anymore or tools to place lots anymore. There is just "fluff" to make Sims look pretty. But there isn't that depth to actually build real stories with anymore. It's just a shallow emptiness. It's just become a RPG game to win. There are plenty of mobile games out there that provide the same "imagination" that the Sims 4 provides. The sad thing is, the Sims Freeplay has more tools for a variety of storytelling than the Sims 4 has and that's a mobile game. I think the Sims 4 has strayed away from the life simulation and sandbox genre. It's just become a play to win game just like all the other casual games out there. Once Simmers level up all the skills and do the job, they just start over and do it again to win. Pretty boring. I miss the darker elements other Sims games had.
Oh and the game does plenty of things without me. It can play itself so it takes no brain power to play. It even culls Sims and relationships itself too. Why the whole "You Rule" tagline is a big fat joke. The game rules and controls, not me. Funny how the use imagination is used, yet the Sims 4 requires so many scripts to follow for those that lack "imagination". I'm pretty sure the Sims 4 was designed for people who have the game tell them how to play step by step. Now how is that using imagination? Funny joke. If imagination means telling others how to play, then that isn't imagination at all. That's totalitarianism. Telling Simmers to do "challenges" to make the game interesting to them when there are Simmers that don't like the achievement style as it is, isn't a solution which I read a lot. Other common solution is modding things out. But how does that work for Simmers that don't like using mods or CC? That is when the whole alienation of play styles begins and when Simmers realize the newest iteration only appeals to a certain target market that doesn't include them.
I'm tired of customers being blamed for all of Maxis' mistakes by other customers. That is what happened to SimCity and I don't want it to happen again to the Sims. It is very unhealthy method and very sure way to kill any game or company. I know this isn't the way SimGuruDrake thinks. She actually holds Maxis responsible for part of the blame and I deeply respect that.
Post edited by Scobre on
“Although the world is full of suffering, it is full also of the overcoming of it.” –Helen Keller
S4 has had two expansion packs that are completely new and a third that is said to be something we've never had before. Yet people continue to want old packs to make a return.
This was only said by that Sims Latam source, and was never confirmed to be related to an EP.
That's my point. It's up to you to find a way to play that you enjoy, not to have the game do it for you.
Never said "I needed the game to do it for me".
You like to use the tool analogy?
Well if the "right tools" aren't there, you can't "use them", now can you? I am stuck compromising.
I'm playing the game, every so often, with what is there.
But there are things I'm missing, and can NOT do everything the way I would like to.
How I play, or how I feel, is not wrong. I don't tell you how you should be playing your game, and you don't need to tell me how to play mine...
@Ianamus brought up Civ 6 including all the expansion content of Civ 5 and explained why--the content was already there so all they had to do was access the assets and set it up for the new version. They did this somewhat with TS3, from what I understanding, reusing a ton of animations from that game and porting them into 3. So, how many versions of the game do you want where they just reuse assets, put a new coat of paint on it, add a few new shinies and call it a day?
The sad thing is I think I would honestly enjoy the Sims 4 far more if it was just a copy of the Sims 3 with improved graphics and a few new features.
I think there are quite a few people who would. And quite a few people who would love it if they'd just taken TS2 and updated for today's graphics. My question still stands, though--how many versions of the game do you want where they just reuse assets and update the graphics? Why would people want to keep purchasing the same game over and over with the same expansions, etc.?
If Sims 4 on release was nothing more Sims 3 and all of it's expansions with updated graphics then future expansions would be have to be completely new. The fact that Sims 4's base game doesn't include any previous expansion features is the entire reason we have to purchase the same stuff repeatedly.
The only reason people didn't mind so much with Sims 3 was that the open-world nature was a very large change from Sims 2 that really added a lot to the game, so they were buying something new. Sims 4, meanwhile, cut a lot more from Sims 3's base game and added very little. For all their talk of new and different stuff the Sims 4 still plays like a Sims 3 with better graphics and half the features.
I addressed the idea of getting everything from previous expansions in a new base game in my previous post. The game would be too rich for most people. Who's gonna want to spend $380 bucks on a base game? $200? No? Of course not.
And, personally, I don't feel like 4 plays like TS3 much at all. In fact, most people that I've seen on the forums wouldn't agree with that.
Origin ID: ebuchala I'm not a psychopath. I'm a high-functioning psychopath. Reaper
I addressed the idea of getting everything from previous expansions in a new base game in my previous post. The game would be too rich for most people. Who's gonna want to spend $380 bucks on a base game? $200? No? Of course not.
And, personally, I don't feel like 4 plays like TS3 much at all. In fact, most people that I've seen on the forums wouldn't agree with that.
Yeah I think the Sims 2 had a lot more in common with the Sims 3 than the Sims 4 does.
It is an interesting question though. For me priorities for all Sims base games are all life stages, normal careers, ghost, transportation (carpools, taxis, school buses), optional smartphone with land line option, memory system, failure system, family trees, and basic kitchen appliances and bathroom needs. I think I also need that intimacy between Sims as well whether it is romantic or friendship. I like when Sims cuddle and do real make outs and even goose each other sometimes. I need to know that Sims care for one another. I think the priorities of the Sims varies from Simmer to Simmer. I'm actually ok with having seasons be in an EP.
“Although the world is full of suffering, it is full also of the overcoming of it.” –Helen Keller
@SimGuruDrake I don't mind new things in Sims 4. I think it's great to have some surprises and fresh ideas, just not at the expense of some of the traditional content that I love and look forward to. I don't feel that just because something has been done before, like pets for example, it can't be refreshed and have a new spin on it. On the contrary, I look forward to the new creative ways that the old content could be incorporated.
Some of the main problems, in my opinion, are the rate of release of core content, the lack of depth of the gameplay, and whether it integrates well as part of the whole. I think that as players of past Sims games, many of us got used to big, meaty expansions being released fairly frequently, which kept things fresh all the time. These expansions added many facets of gameplay and interactions, building upon the flexible foundation that was already there, but also adding layers upon layers of new things to uncover and explore. And each expansion also managed to connect with and contribute to the others with a compatibility that made the whole thing a complete, single, extraordinary game.
I just don't feel that connection with our current expansions and game packs. They feel like they are all created as a stand-alone and not meant to merge together. When one is added, another is forgotten, and if you play the content of one, it doesn't tie in much or cross over with the rest. The exception to this is the clubs feature from Get Together, which is a great feature, but that expansion still feels like it should have had more to it.
Maybe part of the problem is that so many activities and interactions seem object-based, so that even if multiple sims are involved in a shared activity, they still don't feel like they are doing it *together*. They are merely doing it at the same time. It feels mechanical, superficial, and lonely. I want to see my Sims really INTERACT and REACT to each other.
Anyway, I hope I was able to explain my views in a way that made sense. I do love the Sims games, and I'm trying to keep from getting discouraged, and hold onto hope that the best is yet to come.
There are some old things that have such a big impact that they completely change the game. Seasons is one of these for me for example, different weather and seasons passing makes it a completely different game. So there're two main reasons I can think of that could make me prefer an old theme like Seasons over new experiences : I know how game-changer some of the old themes were, while I don't know yet whether the new experiences will be as impactful for me, and I'm afraid the old themes won't come back at all (so it's reassuring to have it now, because the future is unknown).
I definitely want new experiences too ! Ideally, I would want the old things I loved back, and the things I didn't like as much replaced with new things
So I'll give you a challenge here: What did you not like about Seasons? What did you like? What new experiences would you like to see from one of your favorite EPs?
Challenge accepted !
The main points of Seasons were the change of scenery with each seasons, seeing the neighborhoods change and the various activities that helped define each seasons. I didn't like the temperature system (too obscure because nothing was shown in the UI). Gardening and fishing are already there so that leaves room for something else. Careers and Simplants were not as iconic to the Season experience so these could be replaced too. Instead of these, I would make the seasons customization more in-depth, and add new destinations to showcase them.
Here's how it could be, loosely based on how much content there was in the first two TS4 EPs because I don't know what kind of budget I have
Weather (expanded from TS2) :
- Different type of weather : rain, snow, thunderstorm, sun, cloudy, fog
- Gives various moodlets
- Can includes extreme versions
Temperature system (expanded from TS2) :
- Automatically switch to the outdoor clothing category if too cold
- Gives moodlets if too hot/too cold
- Displayed on the UI (external temperature near time, internal temperature covered by a moodlet/on the Sims)
- Can be tied in with various ways to heat/refresh the houses
New clothing category (like TS2) :
- Outdoor
Seasons (expanded from TS2) :
- Wheel of seasons for each world (like in TS2) to let the player choose the seasons in WC, OS, WB, etc
- Determine the frequency for each type of weather and the temperature range
- Determine the luminosity, the sunrise and sunset times
- Three dots (...) to open more customizations and allow recreating various climates : hot/medium/cold and wet/medium/dry sliders to make variants of each season, change the frequency of weather/temperature
- New options in the gameplay panel : length of each seasons or on/off switch for the passing of seasons, on/off switch for extreme weather
New traits (New) :
- Sentitive to the heat
- Sensitive to the cold
New skills (New) :
- Major : Knitting/Sewing (Craft clothes, some with moodlets)
- Minor : Swimming (New swimming animations and new tricks), is unlocked by children after motor
New collections (New) :
- Shells or fallen leaves
New activities and objects (Some old, some new) :
- Snowman, ice skating, rake leaves, search for leaves/shells
- Lounge chairs, swimming pool slide, sewing machine, basketball hoop
New worlds, about Granite Fall size (New)
- A summery world : either a tropical or beach world (with a wet season and a dry season)
- A wintery world : inspired by nordic countries or alpine/mountain
New venue (like TS2) :
- Hotel with rooms/buffet table/reception
If they make seasons, I would kill for a way to finally set clothes for each season. The outerwear was nice, but seeing sims wearing their everyday long sleeves in summer or their everyday shorts in fall made me cringe. I could control that for my own sims but not for the townies, I need things to make sense! This is asking for too much but having 5 outfits per seasons would be awesome
Comments
If simmers put as much imagination into playing the game as they do "reading" into a single sentence, they might enjoy the game more.
The sad thing is I think I would honestly enjoy the Sims 4 far more if it was just a copy of the Sims 3 with improved graphics and a few new features.
Civ 6 is being built with a new engine. You could have found that out with a simple google search, rather than automatically assuming I don't know what I'm talking about.
Some of these same developers were doing TS3 and we got a Generations Expansion. You can't go by that.
I think there are quite a few people who would. And quite a few people who would love it if they'd just taken TS2 and updated for today's graphics. My question still stands, though--how many versions of the game do you want where they just reuse assets and update the graphics? Why would people want to keep purchasing the same game over and over with the same expansions, etc.?
I'm not a psychopath. I'm a high-functioning psychopath. Reaper
It's a game, of course it takes imagination. As for the cardboard box reference, how many times have you seen a very small child put the toy aside and play for hours with the box it came in. Cats can be satisfied with an empty box. Based on numerous posts I've read, many simmers seem to think if they turn on the game, it will entertain them. The game is a tool. If you don't know how to use the tool properly, don't get angry at the screwdriver because it's not sawing the wood.
If Sims 4 on release was nothing more Sims 3 and all of it's expansions with updated graphics then future expansions would be have to be completely new. The fact that Sims 4's base game doesn't include any previous expansion features is the entire reason we have to purchase the same stuff repeatedly.
The only reason people didn't mind so much with Sims 3 was that the open-world nature was a very large change from Sims 2 that really added a lot to the game, so they were buying something new. Sims 4, meanwhile, cut a lot more from Sims 3's base game and added very little. For all their talk of new and different stuff the Sims 4 still plays like a Sims 3 with better graphics and half the features.
Which means there is not supposed to be a "proper way" to play the game.
And toddlers!
That's my point. It's up to you to find a way to play that you enjoy, not to have the game do it for you.
Oh and the game does plenty of things without me. It can play itself so it takes no brain power to play. It even culls Sims and relationships itself too. Why the whole "You Rule" tagline is a big fat joke. The game rules and controls, not me. Funny how the use imagination is used, yet the Sims 4 requires so many scripts to follow for those that lack "imagination". I'm pretty sure the Sims 4 was designed for people who have the game tell them how to play step by step. Now how is that using imagination? Funny joke. If imagination means telling others how to play, then that isn't imagination at all. That's totalitarianism. Telling Simmers to do "challenges" to make the game interesting to them when there are Simmers that don't like the achievement style as it is, isn't a solution which I read a lot. Other common solution is modding things out. But how does that work for Simmers that don't like using mods or CC? That is when the whole alienation of play styles begins and when Simmers realize the newest iteration only appeals to a certain target market that doesn't include them.
I'm tired of customers being blamed for all of Maxis' mistakes by other customers. That is what happened to SimCity and I don't want it to happen again to the Sims. It is very unhealthy method and very sure way to kill any game or company. I know this isn't the way SimGuruDrake thinks. She actually holds Maxis responsible for part of the blame and I deeply respect that.
You like to use the tool analogy?
Well if the "right tools" aren't there, you can't "use them", now can you?
I am stuck compromising.
I'm playing the game, every so often, with what is there.
But there are things I'm missing, and can NOT do everything the way I would like to.
How I play, or how I feel, is not wrong.
I don't tell you how you should be playing your game, and you don't need to tell me how to play mine...
even answering the question builds hype around the new pack
It currently feels more like its gravel than sand.
I addressed the idea of getting everything from previous expansions in a new base game in my previous post. The game would be too rich for most people. Who's gonna want to spend $380 bucks on a base game? $200? No? Of course not.
And, personally, I don't feel like 4 plays like TS3 much at all. In fact, most people that I've seen on the forums wouldn't agree with that.
I'm not a psychopath. I'm a high-functioning psychopath. Reaper
It is an interesting question though. For me priorities for all Sims base games are all life stages, normal careers, ghost, transportation (carpools, taxis, school buses), optional smartphone with land line option, memory system, failure system, family trees, and basic kitchen appliances and bathroom needs. I think I also need that intimacy between Sims as well whether it is romantic or friendship. I like when Sims cuddle and do real make outs and even goose each other sometimes. I need to know that Sims care for one another. I think the priorities of the Sims varies from Simmer to Simmer. I'm actually ok with having seasons be in an EP.
Some of the main problems, in my opinion, are the rate of release of core content, the lack of depth of the gameplay, and whether it integrates well as part of the whole. I think that as players of past Sims games, many of us got used to big, meaty expansions being released fairly frequently, which kept things fresh all the time. These expansions added many facets of gameplay and interactions, building upon the flexible foundation that was already there, but also adding layers upon layers of new things to uncover and explore. And each expansion also managed to connect with and contribute to the others with a compatibility that made the whole thing a complete, single, extraordinary game.
I just don't feel that connection with our current expansions and game packs. They feel like they are all created as a stand-alone and not meant to merge together. When one is added, another is forgotten, and if you play the content of one, it doesn't tie in much or cross over with the rest. The exception to this is the clubs feature from Get Together, which is a great feature, but that expansion still feels like it should have had more to it.
Maybe part of the problem is that so many activities and interactions seem object-based, so that even if multiple sims are involved in a shared activity, they still don't feel like they are doing it *together*. They are merely doing it at the same time. It feels mechanical, superficial, and lonely. I want to see my Sims really INTERACT and REACT to each other.
Anyway, I hope I was able to explain my views in a way that made sense. I do love the Sims games, and I'm trying to keep from getting discouraged, and hold onto hope that the best is yet to come.
Challenge accepted !
The main points of Seasons were the change of scenery with each seasons, seeing the neighborhoods change and the various activities that helped define each seasons. I didn't like the temperature system (too obscure because nothing was shown in the UI). Gardening and fishing are already there so that leaves room for something else. Careers and Simplants were not as iconic to the Season experience so these could be replaced too. Instead of these, I would make the seasons customization more in-depth, and add new destinations to showcase them.
Here's how it could be, loosely based on how much content there was in the first two TS4 EPs because I don't know what kind of budget I have
Weather (expanded from TS2) :
- Different type of weather : rain, snow, thunderstorm, sun, cloudy, fog
- Gives various moodlets
- Can includes extreme versions
Temperature system (expanded from TS2) :
- Automatically switch to the outdoor clothing category if too cold
- Gives moodlets if too hot/too cold
- Displayed on the UI (external temperature near time, internal temperature covered by a moodlet/on the Sims)
- Can be tied in with various ways to heat/refresh the houses
New clothing category (like TS2) :
- Outdoor
Seasons (expanded from TS2) :
- Wheel of seasons for each world (like in TS2) to let the player choose the seasons in WC, OS, WB, etc
- Determine the frequency for each type of weather and the temperature range
- Determine the luminosity, the sunrise and sunset times
- Three dots (...) to open more customizations and allow recreating various climates : hot/medium/cold and wet/medium/dry sliders to make variants of each season, change the frequency of weather/temperature
- New options in the gameplay panel : length of each seasons or on/off switch for the passing of seasons, on/off switch for extreme weather
New traits (New) :
- Sentitive to the heat
- Sensitive to the cold
New skills (New) :
- Major : Knitting/Sewing (Craft clothes, some with moodlets)
- Minor : Swimming (New swimming animations and new tricks), is unlocked by children after motor
New collections (New) :
- Shells or fallen leaves
New activities and objects (Some old, some new) :
- Snowman, ice skating, rake leaves, search for leaves/shells
- Lounge chairs, swimming pool slide, sewing machine, basketball hoop
New worlds, about Granite Fall size (New)
- A summery world : either a tropical or beach world (with a wet season and a dry season)
- A wintery world : inspired by nordic countries or alpine/mountain
New venue (like TS2) :
- Hotel with rooms/buffet table/reception