All this thread has done (great post btw I agree fully) has made me realise how good TS2 is, also taught me some things I to this day didn’t know about it, and how *bad* TS4 looks to its ancestor games. Even TS1.
How can number 4 not be better than number 1? I don’t get it. TS4 should be 1,2 and 3 combined and then some on top of that. It’s so disappointing. Just makes me annoyed lol
—T
Technically most old games were made with more forethought than their newer versions. I have played games years ago I couldn't get enough of and then go play an newer version and hated it. As some developers sometimes see something they did previously less important - like Sims 2 sims pulling bowls out of cabinets and utensiles out of drawers are missed now they don't do that and took away some of the reality for players - because lets face it - real human do not pull utensiles and bowls out of the air - so yes it bothers us - but for some odd reason does not bother the creators of the game. The cutting corners in animations makes many games feel much less a game than they used to be, seeing in real life well we cannot make bowls materialize in thin air..
I don’t see what the excuse is in omitting these high quality, realistic animations. This is a life simulator, centered all around looking at these little people. That type of thing should be standard in this game, especially. Instead, there are too many shortcuts taken, things appearing out of air, proofing away, etc. Let’s not forget how choppy and poorly done Laundry Day animations are, eek.
There’s just no excuse. It’s cutting corners, simply put.
Are they though?
Watch your Sims very closely when they move laundry into the dryer or washer. Your Sims will move almost like they're stuttering around because of how poorly animated the stuff pack's animations are.
That pack is pretty basic all round, especially when you consider how a lot of stuff that was supposed to be in it got dropped. I'm willing to bet that a lot of the votes were aimed at the eco content rather than laundry.
Fine summation on how the community got conned. I suspect that laundry was what EA wanted all along but for some reason used the charade of a simmer led pack to do it. I find it interesting that none of the numbers were shown, only statements of 'results'. I was one of the voting simmers, and the whole thing smelled of fish left on a sunny dock too long in the summer. Also suspect that any voting rounds were decided by plurality, not majority. Stage by stage it was tracking towards Eco then all of a sudden...
I don't think traits belonged in The Sims 4, at least with their vision of emotions. We were given only a fraction of traits available from the huge list of TS3's traits, and each one felt less fleshed out than their TS3 version. Really, it just seems like they did not think the whole personality aspect of our Sims beyond emotions.
I think the solution is to work from TS2's personality point system upwards. Maybe they could infuse the interest system of TS2 with the trait system of TS3. I don't see much value in recycling emotions for TS5, that's for sure.
Their vision of emotions? That doesn't go beyond the animations of slamming a fridge, or stomping around, or sadly eating with quivering lips....
Emotions in TS4 are terrible. Sims don't have personalities due to how the moodlet based play works. Traits don't matter. Every Sim is whatever emotion they're currently experiencing, and every Sim responds to the same emotions in the same way, which is where complaints about all Sims being carbon copies - just with different paint jobs - comes from. It's so flimsy.
In TS3 Sims actually had emotions and responses that were determined by their traits. It wasn't a perfect system by any means but it was much better than what we have now, with the core of TS4 being dull.
Besides this all being false advertising of how the game really plays, note the mood bar, it says the bar falls and produces uncomfortable etc. The problem with TS4 to me is the mood bar rarely falls in my game, and the Sims were always elated and happy, happy. Uncomfortable (ooh, how much excitement something bad might happen is that?) is easily solved by walking to the next room with silly decor. The whole ad is such a joke, I can't even. And I have news for them, If I'm grumpy (from pain) I am not going to get sad first, before mean or angry, I'm going to get rude and more grumpy, instead of sad. They have no idea what happens to real people's emotions in my opinion. Grumpy brings smart alec remarks, short tempers, and irritation (especially if it's from any sort of pain when you can't do something) and produces less patience in a person. They really have no idea what happens and it's not 'sad' as the logical next step of emotions.
@Cinebar are you talking about TS3 or TS4 I'm confused.
In TS3 there's Grumpy and Hot Headed sims. I think Grumpy is more like gloomy but a bit more frustrated.
I don't think traits belonged in The Sims 4, at least with their vision of emotions. We were given only a fraction of traits available from the huge list of TS3's traits, and each one felt less fleshed out than their TS3 version. Really, it just seems like they did not think the whole personality aspect of our Sims beyond emotions.
I think the solution is to work from TS2's personality point system upwards. Maybe they could infuse the interest system of TS2 with the trait system of TS3. I don't see much value in recycling emotions for TS5, that's for sure.
Their vision of emotions? That doesn't go beyond the animations of slamming a fridge, or stomping around, or sadly eating with quivering lips....
Emotions in TS4 are terrible. Sims don't have personalities due to how the moodlet based play works. Traits don't matter. Every Sim is whatever emotion they're currently experiencing, and every Sim responds to the same emotions in the same way, which is where complaints about all Sims being carbon copies - just with different paint jobs - comes from. It's so flimsy.
In TS3 Sims actually had emotions and responses that were determined by their traits. It wasn't a perfect system by any means but it was much better than what we have now, with the core of TS4 being dull.
Besides this all being false advertising of how the game really plays, note the mood bar, it says the bar falls and produces uncomfortable etc. The problem with TS4 to me is the mood bar rarely falls in my game, and the Sims were always elated and happy, happy. Uncomfortable (ooh, how much excitement something bad might happen is that?) is easily solved by walking to the next room with silly decor. The whole ad is such a joke, I can't even. And I have news for them, If I'm grumpy (from pain) I am not going to get sad first, before mean or angry, I'm going to get rude and more grumpy, instead of sad. They have no idea what happens to real people's emotions in my opinion. Grumpy brings smart alec remarks, short tempers, and irritation (especially if it's from any sort of pain when you can't do something) and produces less patience in a person. They really have no idea what happens and it's not 'sad' as the logical next step of emotions.
@Cinebar are you talking about TS3 or TS4 I'm confused.
In TS3 there's Grumpy and Hot Headed sims. I think Grumpy is more like gloomy but a bit more frustrated.
Besides this all being false advertising of how the game really plays, note the mood bar, it says the bar falls and produces uncomfortable etc. The problem with TS4 to me is the mood bar rarely falls in my game, and the Sims were always elated and happy, happy. Uncomfortable (ooh, how much excitement something bad might happen is that?) is easily solved by walking to the next room with silly decor. The whole ad is such a joke, I can't even. And I have news for them, If I'm grumpy (from pain) I am not going to get sad first, before mean or angry, I'm going to get rude and more grumpy, instead of sad. They have no idea what happens to real people's emotions in my opinion. Grumpy brings smart alec remarks, short tempers, and irritation (especially if it's from any sort of pain when you can't do something) and produces less patience in a person. They really have no idea what happens and it's not 'sad' as the logical next step of emotions.
A lot of the things that you've mentioned don't exist in TS4. After that 'safe space' article, I understand why. There's no irritation, no fear, no shock, no surprise, no insecurity, no shyness, no annoyance, no sense of betrayal... The full range of human emotions was accounted for in previous games without even trying. It was all conveyed through animations that made sense according to the context of the moment. In TS4 -- the game that was sold on the basis of better emotions than ever before -- the Sims' emotions are stunted. Not only that, what emotions are left can easily be swayed by decor.
When No Man's Sky released, it was a mess. Over time, things were done to correct some of the greatest issues. These days, the game is better than it was at launch. In contrast, EA continues to ignore the greater issues which exist within the Sims themselves. Instead, they continue to add on DLC after DLC which, in my experience, only amplifies that the base game is still not working as advertised.
What mood bar? There is none. In my TS2, yes, but not 4. Apparently it's much easier to add DLC than fix the issues. In a rare play session today had a couple of surprises. (?!) One is that I actually saw a dog! Live and wandering around, and not in B Bay, either. I had taken my sim to geek con and the critter showed up at is was ending. Stayed around long enough for my sim to interact with it. Not seen that in years! The other is that not all the sims in the places we cant go are those fake ones. Again, after the con looked around the area, saw some sims down below and went checking. Two I believe were fake, though the game kept jumping to another level when I closed in. One of those jumps was down to where a guy was sleeping on a bench. Checked out, and he looked very well detailed for a fake. A couple of sim days later he walked by where my sim was, he's a townie. In the contradictions dept., the game thinks it's ok for good trait sims to have public enemy (or whatever its called) aspiration with the dastardly bonus trait! Not cool! Fixed as much as I could in CAS, will probably need cheat(s) to take care of the rest of it. Might be a fine mate for my sim if I can as otherwise they share a lot of the same qualities.
Kinda says something about the game if encountering a dog is the highlight of the year.
I think a mood bar works better than what we have presently in TS4 because there is a clear transition between going from a maxed bar to a depleted bar.
In The Sims 4, you can go from happy to angry or sad instantly. There is no buffer, despite the fact the very emotion for it exists in the game: the Fine emotion. Your Sim should have to pass through the fine emotion any time they transition through opposite emotions. Happy too often takes the place of the fine emotion, and it throws things off balance.
its interesting to me that the devs may have cut certain animations in lieu of complaints about 'how long it took to do xyz' yet they let sims take a millennia to do anything else for example:
sims 3: sims get out of bed 1 hour before carpool and in that time can toilet, shower AND COOK A MEAL FRESH AND EAT IT TOO
sims 4: HA good luck doing 1 of the above in that time
i didnt notice the lack of getting things like bowls out of cupboards but wouldnt mind getting them back. what annoys me more than that, is how gosh darned long it takes sims in this game to do anything.
- shower
- cook
- eat
- cancel an autonomous action
- respond to my directives
- anything involving multitasking
personalities in this game should definitely have been a combo of the previous 3 interations. sims in 1 were randomly assigned interests that would change if we bought them a magazine to read, the whole aspect of sims 2 as we've been discussing was wonderful, and add to that the trait system from sims 3 and we'd have more well rounded emotionally sound sims.
personally, i feel there are too many options in the friendly and funny socialisation options. so many seem to be the same and irrelevant and i find it disheartening that there is no 'chat' option. i dont want to have to click on something and hope they keep talking, i want a nice chat option. personally id get rid of most of those options and cull it straight down and then like in sims 3 have that special tab for the other trait/skill related nonsense
whims in my game have been turned off for 2 reasons atm. 1) they are super repetitive and irrelevant and 2) they werent working so why bother having them. the rewards store is a poor mans sims 2/3 rewards list. they dont really do anything or add anything of value. in sims 3 the collection finder was one of my faves and i would save and save until i got it
currently playing RoM i feel there is more they could have done to flesh out spellcasters. i do love the bloodline trait and how it seems to overrule other occults and be the dominant one yet i can change that if i want. im disappointed with the familiar in how its just there. summoned and an inanimate object essentially, i would have expected it to be able to be spoken to or something but no. i ended up adopting a cat for my sims familiar just so it would do more than float around
still waiting on fairies to come out and even tho im not a fan of them werewolves. id be happy for any other occult people wanted to be introduced but they need to be properly fleshed out
i also find it frustrating that as with anything it seems a vocal minority have had changes made that seem to have negatively impacted the series. (i say this from observations in the forums as i dont have twitter or keep upto date with sim news other than what i read here). we dont have burglars, fear, lazy animations, and it seems various actions have been moved. now dont get me wrong, im all for adding things in that even one person wants but removing things is different. we shouldnt lose animations that people who have the game on ultra speed miss anyway
as wed all be aware the sims is a LIFE SIMULATION game, ergo, people have actions that they must do in their day to day lives that our sims should as well. dont complain that getting a bowl takes .00005 seconds out of ur game, complain that currently they take an hour to even make toast and then another hour to eat it.
personality is nothing in this game. they may as well call personality: emotion. what kind of emotion will ur sims go thru today. and relationships is a big pain point. in sims 3 u had to work very very hard to get woohoo/try for baby to appear in ur options list, currently i can click on any item i want that allows it and boom woohoo engaged. there is no challenge, no pursuit. these sims are easy to get whereas i want a little playing hard to get with their relationships
eugh. ill end my rant on this as i feel ill end up on a tangent of irrelevancy if i dont but i hope my thoughts are conveyed logically
In addition to chat, TS2 has 'hang out' as a converstaion option. In 2 it's actually doing that, up to four sims sit on the ground (on rare occasions one or more will lie down) and chat until needs tank. I've seen these go from mid-morning until well into the night. A far cry from the 4 version.
In addition to chat, TS2 has 'hang out' as a converstaion option. In 2 it's actually doing that, up to four sims sit on the ground (on rare occasions one or more will lie down) and chat until needs tank. I've seen these go from mid-morning until well into the night. A far cry from the 4 version.
Ah yes, I love the hang out option, but it can either make or break the relationship hahahah. I remember trying to befriend someone and they just couldn't agree on anything lol So I was like, "This is just not going to work".
"Bada su the gorn bada su the brawn bada bady oda aba donk donk donk gerbits gerbits vo gerbits".
As long as they keep talking the short term relationship bar will rise, even if the topics don't mesh, unlike regular chats where the talking would stop once disagreement set in. There will be at least a foundation upon which to build. Speaking from own experience, not as a rule. Sims can be persnikity creatures.
TS4's traits are really, really weak compared to TS2's personality point system and TS3's trait system thanks in large part to the way that ambient emotional influences are handled. In TS2, we had Environment and Comfort as needs that could go down or up depending on the decor or the furniture they happened to be sitting or laying on. In TS3, Environment and Comfort were shifted into the moodlet system, but they didn't take over the sim's whole universe.
In TS4, environmental moodlets are completely out of control...especially the Happy ones. The ambient Happy moodlets are too strong, too numerous, and they NEVER wear off! They override negative emotion moodlets way too easily, buff other positive/productive moodlets like Focused and Playful, and they didn't even have the decency to give us a booster emotion for the negative emotions!
I've been complaining about this for years, but this is only because the traits system is so heavily dependent on the emotions system. The emotions system IS our sims' personalities in terms of gameplay, really. All Happy sims act the same and want the same things, all Sad sims do the same things and want the same things, all Flirty sims do the same things and want the same things, same with Focused, Uncomfortable, Energized, Embarrassed, and so-on. I mean, they didn't even program in different whims for sims in different moods based on their personality traits. Like, why is an Evil sim just as inclined to want to hug and compliment people when they're happy as a Good sim? An Evil sim should want to torment other sims when they're happy, not get all snuggly and nice with everyone!!
In the other games, a sim's personality shines through more in TS2 and TS3, while TS4's emotion system is a pale and sickly substitute for actual personality for our sims beyond our own head-canon. I mean, when you have to use a cheat from a mod to have your sim express anything beyond sickeningly bland positivity that would make Barney the Dinosaur go, "Oh. O.K., this level of good feels is just plain unrealistic, you guys!", then you know something went horribly wrong with this game's development...
TS4's traits are really, really weak compared to TS2's personality point system and TS3's trait system thanks in large part to the way that ambient emotional influences are handled. In TS2, we had Environment and Comfort as needs that could go down or up depending on the decor or the furniture they happened to be sitting or laying on. In TS3, Environment and Comfort were shifted into the moodlet system, but they didn't take over the sim's whole universe.
In TS4, environmental moodlets are completely out of control...especially the Happy ones. The ambient Happy moodlets are too strong, too numerous, and they NEVER wear off! They override negative emotion moodlets way too easily, buff other positive/productive moodlets like Focused and Playful, and they didn't even have the decency to give us a booster emotion for the negative emotions!
I've been complaining about this for years, but this is only because the traits system is so heavily dependent on the emotions system. The emotions system IS our sims' personalities in terms of gameplay, really. All Happy sims act the same and want the same things, all Sad sims do the same things and want the same things, all Flirty sims do the same things and want the same things, same with Focused, Uncomfortable, Energized, Embarrassed, and so-on. I mean, they didn't even program in different whims for sims in different moods based on their personality traits. Like, why is an Evil sim just as inclined to want to hug and compliment people when they're happy as a Good sim? An Evil sim should want to torment other sims when they're happy, not get all snuggly and nice with everyone!!
In the other games, a sim's personality shines through more in TS2 and TS3, while TS4's emotion system is a pale and sickly substitute for actual personality for our sims beyond our own head-canon. I mean, when you have to use a cheat from a mod to have your sim express anything beyond sickeningly bland positivity that would make Barney the Dinosaur go, "Oh. O.K., this level of good feels is just plain unrealistic, you guys!", then you know something went horribly wrong with this game's development...
exactly.
ive said this before, as im sure numerous people have, i could create a sim with no personality traits and it would be exactly the same as one with traits. a screenshot was posted earlier in this thread from the advertisement for sims4 where it was stated our sims will have "vibrant personalities with memories and real emotions who can multitask" to paraphrase.
.................................
really? is that so EA? are you sure? positive?
what we actually got is the horrible stereotype: of bipolar people and PMS. moodswing city. i know bipolar people and as a woman myself have experienced PMS and i can tell u neither the bipolar people or myself or other women's moods swing as horribly frequent as these sims. in fact as im sure alot of simmers would have noticed in their day to day travels that in most cases you cannot tell a person is bipolar or pmsing unless its super super SUPER extreme (but i digress, thats irrelevant to this topic). sure, i, like most people experience subtle mood changes based on my surroundings or what ive eaten and experienced for the day HOWEVER if im proper angry i will stay angry regardless of my surroundings. i may be calmer in a nicer environment but ill still be angry and it may take a few hours to calm down. if my family passed away a nice room may make me smile but it wont remove the fact my family is gone and ill still be devastated.
i give props to them for trying something new, i really do. the sims is 20 years old, in its 4 iteration and facing competition. it will take more than gorgeous graphics to keep people entertained, especially in the era of instant gratification but it didnt work. we all know it would take a massive update to fix the current personas of the sims and lets be real, given past history would probably break the game with bugs and glitches but something needs to be done. step by step. one update at a time. slowly implementing change is better than pretending there is no problem
reading some of the replies since my above post has made me come to the conclusion that strangerville had to be ea taking the p***. while i thoroughly enjoyed it, someone there had to realise the possessed sims being all the same is what the normal sims are like all the time. they all act the same and react the same to everything. if whims are on they all whim the same. whims are described as 'things ur sims want to do but u dont have to' and its been clear to me for a long time whims were an afterthought, a half baked attempt at capturing the sims 2 and 3 satisfaction/reward point system thing. its abundantly clear when sims leave their home lots and roll to buy pools, tvs, stereos etc because there isnt one on the lot. pure lunacy IMO especially since, dear sim, THAT ISNT UR HOME LOT!@ U DONT *OWN* ANYTHING ON THE LOT!!!
multitasking is also a joke. i tell my sims to read a book, and they dont even finish it. they dont autonomously tend to their needs. they just get lower and lower until theyre standing around about to wet themselves then flail their arms about because 'oh no i need to pee'. sims in sims 3 would for example: start a painting, if they needed to pee they would then im pretty sure theyd resume said painting.
its a joke. and i for one would be happy with massive downtime for things to be fixed
In addition to chat, TS2 has 'hang out' as a converstaion option. In 2 it's actually doing that, up to four sims sit on the ground (on rare occasions one or more will lie down) and chat until needs tank. I've seen these go from mid-morning until well into the night. A far cry from the 4 version.
Ah yes, I love the hang out option, but it can either make or break the relationship hahahah. I remember trying to befriend someone and they just couldn't agree on anything lol So I was like, "This is just not going to work".
If that was based on unmatching traits I’d love that. “Oh no these sims aren’t going to be friends by just sitting them down on the floor together, you’ll have to work on that one.”
Everything I would have added has already been said, but this is a great thread and it really highlights everything wrong with TS4 and puts it into perspective. The OP did a lot of work, and thanks for this.
I will just say that I agree with false advertising and it's no wonder they've changed their ad campaign now to "safe space". Much easier to change that than fix the issues with our so called "smarter" sims. If I had seen the ads for the game of now instead of the ones I saw back when they were promoting it during TS3 and launch, I probably wouldn't have as much as a problem because I wouldn't have expected it to be more.
These are the stupidest sims of the series thus far and were supposed to be the smartest? It's a joke yeah? I'm sorry but how come my vegetarian sim is sitting there with a sad moodlet for "going against principles" because she's vegetarian and eating meat leftovers even though she choose that herself and there was 3 other veg-safe dishes in the fridge? *hmmm* I shouldn't have to micro-manage the "smartest sims yet".
Like, why is an Evil sim just as inclined to want to hug and compliment people when they're happy as a Good sim? An Evil sim should want to torment other sims when they're happy, not get all snuggly and nice with everyone!!
Quoting the Evil trait from TS3:
"Evil Sims never get the Upset moodlet when fighting with a friend or family member, instead they will wish to see their ghost."
Evil Sims got unique wants in TS3 because of their trait and they could be pretty hardcore. In this case, there's only one way to see a living Sim's ghost; your Evil Sim was effectively wishing to see them die.
Quoting the Good trait from TS3:
"If the Good Sim has been made an enemy of by another Sim, the Good Sim will gain a wish to propose a truce with the newly made enemy."
Good Sims got unique wants in TS3 because of their trait. Rather than wanting to fight or be rude to an enemy like other Sims, they'd immediately get the want to rectify a bad relationship and make things work.
In TS4 all emotional whims are the same, as you rightly say, regardless of literally anything. It's pretty clear at this point that whims have been dropped anyway, so there's not much use in complaining about them.
This is a big issue in my opinion. You can see it manifesting right now on the forums - Realm Of Magic hadn't been out for that long and there were already many threads asking for the next pack. There's so little content gameplay wise that the developers are constantly coming out with more just to keep people satisfied or to present the image that they're dedicated, when a lot of the free stuff is just clothing or items that serve no actual impact on gameplay itself.
I've seen threads complaining the ROM is far too easy. I can guarantee that if any Simmer who joined the series with 4 went back and played Makin' Magic they'd be in for quite a shock. It was difficult, it took time, you had to work for things and actually search for the rarest ingredients or items. Making things far easier just ticks that instant gratification box and avoids complaints like "it's too hard!" which satisfies many people but makes the game dull for many others.
These are the stupidest sims of the series thus far and were supposed to be the smartest? It's a joke yeah? I'm sorry but how come my vegetarian sim is sitting there with a sad moodlet for "going against principles" because she's vegetarian and eating meat leftovers even though she choose that herself and there was 3 other veg-safe dishes in the fridge? *hmmm* I shouldn't have to micro-manage the "smartest sims yet"
I can't count the number times one of my lazy Sims in TS4 has autonomously used her roommate's treadmill in her house. Personalities just don't matter.
In addition to chat, TS2 has 'hang out' as a converstaion option. In 2 it's actually doing that, up to four sims sit on the ground (on rare occasions one or more will lie down) and chat until needs tank. I've seen these go from mid-morning until well into the night. A far cry from the 4 version.
Ah yes, I love the hang out option, but it can either make or break the relationship hahahah. I remember trying to befriend someone and they just couldn't agree on anything lol So I was like, "This is just not going to work".
If that was based on unmatching traits I’d love that. “Oh no these sims aren’t going to be friends by just sitting them down on the floor together, you’ll have to work on that one.”
That's exactly how it worked. It also depends not only on your sims personality but their interests and hobbies they would talk about as well. So if you have nothing in common at that's point welp it might not happen lol
"Bada su the gorn bada su the brawn bada bady oda aba donk donk donk gerbits gerbits vo gerbits".
I thoroughly enjoyed TS2. I appreciate the level of detail that has been pointed out. I also am at a point where I want more "to do" in TS4. There are lingering bugs that need to be fixed and sometimes they really get excessively silly and childish in ways that I often ignore.
That said, I enjoy playing TS4. I've taken some breaks. I got the game on a whim and actually my return to playing it in August was also kind of a whim. Despite the popular complaints about StrangerVille and it not being my normal playstyle, I had a lot of genuine fun when I played it through in August. Picking back up the game, there are weak points but generally, it's a lot of fun.
In terms of personalities and emotions, while I always welcome further character development, I actually like having flexibility rather than being completely bound by aspirations or rigid adherence to "personality". I actually like the subtlety that I can have with character development in TS4.
I like being able to see a gloomy sim laugh or an active sim flop on the sofa after a major work out because I've decided that they want to pet their dog or spend time with their SO or friend more than they want to work out. I like being able to make that decision.
I've said this but I'd really rather not have one favorite food and one favorite color, etc, for a sim. Astrology is a fun concept but its validity is debatable.
I think the interests and memories were great and while I'm open to some updates, I also like having more flexibility in this version.
Anyway, it's true that not long into playing this game, I liked how much freedom I have to adjust characters and to not have to slavishly grind aspirations. Honestly, a lot of times, I ignore them.
Do I want interests? Do I want Free Time and Generations? Do I want better reactions to events? Do I want newer animations that aren't too recycled and new aspects of the game that I haven't seen? Yeah, sure. What are my sims thinking and what do they want to do? I figure that out.
I actually do think that in newer content they are trying to add more negative events, challenges, danger and unpredictable outcomes. I appreciate some of that but I'm not playing the game to have constant bad things happen or to have to struggle constantly. I like being able to make a character and then change my mind as I go along. Sure, I'm open to having unexpected things happen, but I do think there is a certain freedom in this version that I enjoy.
I guess that if I made a lazy sim and I really wanted them to be a couch potato, that's where I would send them. I'd create those behaviors in the game. I'd actually probably switch autonomy off so they would sit continuously on the sofa when I send them there or I'd send them to the lounger. Yes, the bugs need fixing, but I'd work around the settings as much as possible to do what I want.
reading some of the replies since my above post has made me come to the conclusion that strangerville had to be ea taking the p***. while i thoroughly enjoyed it, someone there had to realise the possessed sims being all the same is what the normal sims are like all the time. they all act the same and react the same to everything.
Oh, man. The huge creepy and persistent smiles were the dead giveaway! Likewise, check out the Laundry Day release trailer. Someone at EA is definitely, as you say, taking the p___
Besides this all being false advertising of how the game really plays, note the mood bar, it says the bar falls and produces uncomfortable etc. The problem with TS4 to me is the mood bar rarely falls in my game, and the Sims were always elated and happy, happy. Uncomfortable (ooh, how much excitement something bad might happen is that?) is easily solved by walking to the next room with silly decor. The whole ad is such a joke, I can't even. And I have news for them, If I'm grumpy (from pain) I am not going to get sad first, before mean or angry, I'm going to get rude and more grumpy, instead of sad. They have no idea what happens to real people's emotions in my opinion. Grumpy brings smart alec remarks, short tempers, and irritation (especially if it's from any sort of pain when you can't do something) and produces less patience in a person. They really have no idea what happens and it's not 'sad' as the logical next step of emotions.
A lot of the things that you've mentioned don't exist in TS4. After that 'safe space' article, I understand why. There's no irritation, no fear, no shock, no surprise, no insecurity, no shyness, no annoyance, no sense of betrayal... The full range of human emotions was accounted for in previous games without even trying. It was all conveyed through animations that made sense according to the context of the moment. In TS4 -- the game that was sold on the basis of better emotions than ever before -- the Sims' emotions are stunted. Not only that, what emotions are left can easily be swayed by decor.
When No Man's Sky released, it was a mess. Over time, things were done to correct some of the greatest issues. These days, the game is better than it was at launch. In contrast, EA continues to ignore the greater issues which exist within the Sims themselves. Instead, they continue to add on DLC after DLC which, in my experience, only amplifies that the base game is still not working as advertised.
The problem is that no one was buying No Mans Sky and people were getting refunds. They HAD to turn it around or they would go bankrupt. The problem with simmers is that they buy...because they hope it gets better with the DLC.....instead of the opposite which is what people should do. No Mans Sky was a new IP no one was invested in it....emotionally.
Besides this all being false advertising of how the game really plays, note the mood bar, it says the bar falls and produces uncomfortable etc. The problem with TS4 to me is the mood bar rarely falls in my game, and the Sims were always elated and happy, happy. Uncomfortable (ooh, how much excitement something bad might happen is that?) is easily solved by walking to the next room with silly decor. The whole ad is such a joke, I can't even. And I have news for them, If I'm grumpy (from pain) I am not going to get sad first, before mean or angry, I'm going to get rude and more grumpy, instead of sad. They have no idea what happens to real people's emotions in my opinion. Grumpy brings smart alec remarks, short tempers, and irritation (especially if it's from any sort of pain when you can't do something) and produces less patience in a person. They really have no idea what happens and it's not 'sad' as the logical next step of emotions.
A lot of the things that you've mentioned don't exist in TS4. After that 'safe space' article, I understand why. There's no irritation, no fear, no shock, no surprise, no insecurity, no shyness, no annoyance, no sense of betrayal... The full range of human emotions was accounted for in previous games without even trying. It was all conveyed through animations that made sense according to the context of the moment. In TS4 -- the game that was sold on the basis of better emotions than ever before -- the Sims' emotions are stunted. Not only that, what emotions are left can easily be swayed by decor.
When No Man's Sky released, it was a mess. Over time, things were done to correct some of the greatest issues. These days, the game is better than it was at launch. In contrast, EA continues to ignore the greater issues which exist within the Sims themselves. Instead, they continue to add on DLC after DLC which, in my experience, only amplifies that the base game is still not working as advertised.
The problem is that no one was buying No Mans Sky and people were getting refunds. They HAD to turn it around or they would go bankrupt. The problem with simmers is that they buy...because they hope it gets better with the DLC.....instead of the opposite which is what people should do. No Mans Sky was a new IP no one was invested in it....emotionally.
Never mind the fact that each new DLC adds on more bugs and glitches compounding the problems. Rarely does the DLC make it better. It makes it more interesting for 5 minutes and then you realize that's broken too..
The problem is that no one was buying No Mans Sky and people were getting refunds. They HAD to turn it around or they would go bankrupt. The problem with simmers is that they buy...because they hope it gets better with the DLC.....instead of the opposite which is what people should do. No Mans Sky was a new IP no one was invested in it....emotionally.
Comments
Fine summation on how the community got conned. I suspect that laundry was what EA wanted all along but for some reason used the charade of a simmer led pack to do it. I find it interesting that none of the numbers were shown, only statements of 'results'. I was one of the voting simmers, and the whole thing smelled of fish left on a sunny dock too long in the summer. Also suspect that any voting rounds were decided by plurality, not majority. Stage by stage it was tracking towards Eco then all of a sudden...
@Cinebar are you talking about TS3 or TS4 I'm confused.
In TS3 there's Grumpy and Hot Headed sims. I think Grumpy is more like gloomy but a bit more frustrated.
A lot of the things that you've mentioned don't exist in TS4. After that 'safe space' article, I understand why. There's no irritation, no fear, no shock, no surprise, no insecurity, no shyness, no annoyance, no sense of betrayal... The full range of human emotions was accounted for in previous games without even trying. It was all conveyed through animations that made sense according to the context of the moment. In TS4 -- the game that was sold on the basis of better emotions than ever before -- the Sims' emotions are stunted. Not only that, what emotions are left can easily be swayed by decor.
When No Man's Sky released, it was a mess. Over time, things were done to correct some of the greatest issues. These days, the game is better than it was at launch. In contrast, EA continues to ignore the greater issues which exist within the Sims themselves. Instead, they continue to add on DLC after DLC which, in my experience, only amplifies that the base game is still not working as advertised.
Kinda says something about the game if encountering a dog is the highlight of the year.
In The Sims 4, you can go from happy to angry or sad instantly. There is no buffer, despite the fact the very emotion for it exists in the game: the Fine emotion. Your Sim should have to pass through the fine emotion any time they transition through opposite emotions. Happy too often takes the place of the fine emotion, and it throws things off balance.
sims 3: sims get out of bed 1 hour before carpool and in that time can toilet, shower AND COOK A MEAL FRESH AND EAT IT TOO
sims 4: HA good luck doing 1 of the above in that time
i didnt notice the lack of getting things like bowls out of cupboards but wouldnt mind getting them back. what annoys me more than that, is how gosh darned long it takes sims in this game to do anything.
- shower
- cook
- eat
- cancel an autonomous action
- respond to my directives
- anything involving multitasking
personalities in this game should definitely have been a combo of the previous 3 interations. sims in 1 were randomly assigned interests that would change if we bought them a magazine to read, the whole aspect of sims 2 as we've been discussing was wonderful, and add to that the trait system from sims 3 and we'd have more well rounded emotionally sound sims.
personally, i feel there are too many options in the friendly and funny socialisation options. so many seem to be the same and irrelevant and i find it disheartening that there is no 'chat' option. i dont want to have to click on something and hope they keep talking, i want a nice chat option. personally id get rid of most of those options and cull it straight down and then like in sims 3 have that special tab for the other trait/skill related nonsense
whims in my game have been turned off for 2 reasons atm. 1) they are super repetitive and irrelevant and 2) they werent working so why bother having them. the rewards store is a poor mans sims 2/3 rewards list. they dont really do anything or add anything of value. in sims 3 the collection finder was one of my faves and i would save and save until i got it
currently playing RoM i feel there is more they could have done to flesh out spellcasters. i do love the bloodline trait and how it seems to overrule other occults and be the dominant one yet i can change that if i want. im disappointed with the familiar in how its just there. summoned and an inanimate object essentially, i would have expected it to be able to be spoken to or something but no. i ended up adopting a cat for my sims familiar just so it would do more than float around
still waiting on fairies to come out and even tho im not a fan of them werewolves. id be happy for any other occult people wanted to be introduced but they need to be properly fleshed out
i also find it frustrating that as with anything it seems a vocal minority have had changes made that seem to have negatively impacted the series. (i say this from observations in the forums as i dont have twitter or keep upto date with sim news other than what i read here). we dont have burglars, fear, lazy animations, and it seems various actions have been moved. now dont get me wrong, im all for adding things in that even one person wants but removing things is different. we shouldnt lose animations that people who have the game on ultra speed miss anyway
as wed all be aware the sims is a LIFE SIMULATION game, ergo, people have actions that they must do in their day to day lives that our sims should as well. dont complain that getting a bowl takes .00005 seconds out of ur game, complain that currently they take an hour to even make toast and then another hour to eat it.
personality is nothing in this game. they may as well call personality: emotion. what kind of emotion will ur sims go thru today. and relationships is a big pain point. in sims 3 u had to work very very hard to get woohoo/try for baby to appear in ur options list, currently i can click on any item i want that allows it and boom woohoo engaged. there is no challenge, no pursuit. these sims are easy to get whereas i want a little playing hard to get with their relationships
eugh. ill end my rant on this as i feel ill end up on a tangent of irrelevancy if i dont but i hope my thoughts are conveyed logically
Ah yes, I love the hang out option, but it can either make or break the relationship hahahah. I remember trying to befriend someone and they just couldn't agree on anything lol So I was like, "This is just not going to work".
In TS4, environmental moodlets are completely out of control...especially the Happy ones. The ambient Happy moodlets are too strong, too numerous, and they NEVER wear off! They override negative emotion moodlets way too easily, buff other positive/productive moodlets like Focused and Playful, and they didn't even have the decency to give us a booster emotion for the negative emotions!
I've been complaining about this for years, but this is only because the traits system is so heavily dependent on the emotions system. The emotions system IS our sims' personalities in terms of gameplay, really. All Happy sims act the same and want the same things, all Sad sims do the same things and want the same things, all Flirty sims do the same things and want the same things, same with Focused, Uncomfortable, Energized, Embarrassed, and so-on. I mean, they didn't even program in different whims for sims in different moods based on their personality traits. Like, why is an Evil sim just as inclined to want to hug and compliment people when they're happy as a Good sim? An Evil sim should want to torment other sims when they're happy, not get all snuggly and nice with everyone!!
In the other games, a sim's personality shines through more in TS2 and TS3, while TS4's emotion system is a pale and sickly substitute for actual personality for our sims beyond our own head-canon. I mean, when you have to use a cheat from a mod to have your sim express anything beyond sickeningly bland positivity that would make Barney the Dinosaur go, "Oh. O.K., this level of good feels is just plain unrealistic, you guys!", then you know something went horribly wrong with this game's development...
exactly.
ive said this before, as im sure numerous people have, i could create a sim with no personality traits and it would be exactly the same as one with traits. a screenshot was posted earlier in this thread from the advertisement for sims4 where it was stated our sims will have "vibrant personalities with memories and real emotions who can multitask" to paraphrase.
.................................
really? is that so EA? are you sure? positive?
what we actually got is the horrible stereotype: of bipolar people and PMS. moodswing city. i know bipolar people and as a woman myself have experienced PMS and i can tell u neither the bipolar people or myself or other women's moods swing as horribly frequent as these sims. in fact as im sure alot of simmers would have noticed in their day to day travels that in most cases you cannot tell a person is bipolar or pmsing unless its super super SUPER extreme (but i digress, thats irrelevant to this topic). sure, i, like most people experience subtle mood changes based on my surroundings or what ive eaten and experienced for the day HOWEVER if im proper angry i will stay angry regardless of my surroundings. i may be calmer in a nicer environment but ill still be angry and it may take a few hours to calm down. if my family passed away a nice room may make me smile but it wont remove the fact my family is gone and ill still be devastated.
i give props to them for trying something new, i really do. the sims is 20 years old, in its 4 iteration and facing competition. it will take more than gorgeous graphics to keep people entertained, especially in the era of instant gratification but it didnt work. we all know it would take a massive update to fix the current personas of the sims and lets be real, given past history would probably break the game with bugs and glitches but something needs to be done. step by step. one update at a time. slowly implementing change is better than pretending there is no problem
reading some of the replies since my above post has made me come to the conclusion that strangerville had to be ea taking the p***. while i thoroughly enjoyed it, someone there had to realise the possessed sims being all the same is what the normal sims are like all the time. they all act the same and react the same to everything. if whims are on they all whim the same. whims are described as 'things ur sims want to do but u dont have to' and its been clear to me for a long time whims were an afterthought, a half baked attempt at capturing the sims 2 and 3 satisfaction/reward point system thing. its abundantly clear when sims leave their home lots and roll to buy pools, tvs, stereos etc because there isnt one on the lot. pure lunacy IMO especially since, dear sim, THAT ISNT UR HOME LOT!@ U DONT *OWN* ANYTHING ON THE LOT!!!
multitasking is also a joke. i tell my sims to read a book, and they dont even finish it. they dont autonomously tend to their needs. they just get lower and lower until theyre standing around about to wet themselves then flail their arms about because 'oh no i need to pee'. sims in sims 3 would for example: start a painting, if they needed to pee they would then im pretty sure theyd resume said painting.
its a joke. and i for one would be happy with massive downtime for things to be fixed
I will just say that I agree with false advertising and it's no wonder they've changed their ad campaign now to "safe space". Much easier to change that than fix the issues with our so called "smarter" sims. If I had seen the ads for the game of now instead of the ones I saw back when they were promoting it during TS3 and launch, I probably wouldn't have as much as a problem because I wouldn't have expected it to be more.
These are the stupidest sims of the series thus far and were supposed to be the smartest? It's a joke yeah? I'm sorry but how come my vegetarian sim is sitting there with a sad moodlet for "going against principles" because she's vegetarian and eating meat leftovers even though she choose that herself and there was 3 other veg-safe dishes in the fridge? *hmmm* I shouldn't have to micro-manage the "smartest sims yet".
Quoting the Evil trait from TS3:
"Evil Sims never get the Upset moodlet when fighting with a friend or family member, instead they will wish to see their ghost."
Evil Sims got unique wants in TS3 because of their trait and they could be pretty hardcore. In this case, there's only one way to see a living Sim's ghost; your Evil Sim was effectively wishing to see them die.
Quoting the Good trait from TS3:
"If the Good Sim has been made an enemy of by another Sim, the Good Sim will gain a wish to propose a truce with the newly made enemy."
Good Sims got unique wants in TS3 because of their trait. Rather than wanting to fight or be rude to an enemy like other Sims, they'd immediately get the want to rectify a bad relationship and make things work.
In TS4 all emotional whims are the same, as you rightly say, regardless of literally anything. It's pretty clear at this point that whims have been dropped anyway, so there's not much use in complaining about them.
This is a big issue in my opinion. You can see it manifesting right now on the forums - Realm Of Magic hadn't been out for that long and there were already many threads asking for the next pack. There's so little content gameplay wise that the developers are constantly coming out with more just to keep people satisfied or to present the image that they're dedicated, when a lot of the free stuff is just clothing or items that serve no actual impact on gameplay itself.
I've seen threads complaining the ROM is far too easy. I can guarantee that if any Simmer who joined the series with 4 went back and played Makin' Magic they'd be in for quite a shock. It was difficult, it took time, you had to work for things and actually search for the rarest ingredients or items. Making things far easier just ticks that instant gratification box and avoids complaints like "it's too hard!" which satisfies many people but makes the game dull for many others.
I can't count the number times one of my lazy Sims in TS4 has autonomously used her roommate's treadmill in her house. Personalities just don't matter.
That's exactly how it worked. It also depends not only on your sims personality but their interests and hobbies they would talk about as well. So if you have nothing in common at that's point welp it might not happen lol
That said, I enjoy playing TS4. I've taken some breaks. I got the game on a whim and actually my return to playing it in August was also kind of a whim. Despite the popular complaints about StrangerVille and it not being my normal playstyle, I had a lot of genuine fun when I played it through in August. Picking back up the game, there are weak points but generally, it's a lot of fun.
In terms of personalities and emotions, while I always welcome further character development, I actually like having flexibility rather than being completely bound by aspirations or rigid adherence to "personality". I actually like the subtlety that I can have with character development in TS4.
I like being able to see a gloomy sim laugh or an active sim flop on the sofa after a major work out because I've decided that they want to pet their dog or spend time with their SO or friend more than they want to work out. I like being able to make that decision.
I've said this but I'd really rather not have one favorite food and one favorite color, etc, for a sim. Astrology is a fun concept but its validity is debatable.
I think the interests and memories were great and while I'm open to some updates, I also like having more flexibility in this version.
Anyway, it's true that not long into playing this game, I liked how much freedom I have to adjust characters and to not have to slavishly grind aspirations. Honestly, a lot of times, I ignore them.
Do I want interests? Do I want Free Time and Generations? Do I want better reactions to events? Do I want newer animations that aren't too recycled and new aspects of the game that I haven't seen? Yeah, sure. What are my sims thinking and what do they want to do? I figure that out.
I actually do think that in newer content they are trying to add more negative events, challenges, danger and unpredictable outcomes. I appreciate some of that but I'm not playing the game to have constant bad things happen or to have to struggle constantly. I like being able to make a character and then change my mind as I go along. Sure, I'm open to having unexpected things happen, but I do think there is a certain freedom in this version that I enjoy.
I guess that if I made a lazy sim and I really wanted them to be a couch potato, that's where I would send them. I'd create those behaviors in the game. I'd actually probably switch autonomy off so they would sit continuously on the sofa when I send them there or I'd send them to the lounger. Yes, the bugs need fixing, but I'd work around the settings as much as possible to do what I want.
Oh, man. The huge creepy and persistent smiles were the dead giveaway!
The problem is that no one was buying No Mans Sky and people were getting refunds. They HAD to turn it around or they would go bankrupt. The problem with simmers is that they buy...because they hope it gets better with the DLC.....instead of the opposite which is what people should do. No Mans Sky was a new IP no one was invested in it....emotionally.
Never mind the fact that each new DLC adds on more bugs and glitches compounding the problems. Rarely does the DLC make it better. It makes it more interesting for 5 minutes and then you realize that's broken too..
True enough.