This just makes me wonder what the people who were supposed to be working on toddlers were so busy working on. What was the thing that took away the "time" to put toddlers in the game because I want to see it and judge for myself if it was worth skipping an entire lifestage. I mean 5 years wasn't enough time for them?
They haven't had 5 years, they've had less than 2 years. The first 3 years were spent on making a scrapped online game.
I understand that. But I don't think EA understands that. They have from the start vehemently denied the fact that this game was ever online only and seem to have gotten amnesia or something. They have never admitted to online gameplay and although the general concensus agree that it was a thing EA seems to think we are stupid enough to believe that they actually worked on this game for 5 straight years. I want them to stop lying to us, admit that it was online only, that they are scrambling to make amends, and that they screwed up. I'm tired of the lies.
I didn't get any answers from it. Sounds like they have problems that don't concern the customer.
That's how I feel.
If they didn't have the right amount of people in the right departments (which is what it sounds like), then it sounds like the company should be looking at how to fix this. It does sound a bit worrisome to hear this as a customer, I think I would have preferred not to know.
I agree as well. I always prefer to know, though, and I think it clears up a lot of confusion, even if the situation feels absolutely hopeless now.
Basically they're confirming what we know; that they were rushed and mismanaged. I really feel for the gurus but I'm really mourning for this game. Imagine what we could have had if they'd been given enough time.
Sorry, but it sounds like they haven't got the sizes of their teams right. If the FX guys are asking for more to do and the guys who put in toddlers and pools don't have the time, then you need more pool guys and fewer FX guys (this type of thing happens all the time where I work). And whilst I'm sure they toddler / pool guys cost more, do they cost more than the sales lost through a rushed game? At this point, with the extreme fan backlash I'm fairly sure they would have been worth the cost.
That's what I was thinking as I was reading this. If you have one or two teams that are overloaded... hire more people for those teams!
Time is NOT an excuse, it is just them explaining why they couldn't put certain things in by the release date.
It doesn't explain things like the loss of the open world, the limitations on Lot size, building height, etc., etc.
EA set a time goal because they want their profits to keep rolling in like clockwork, and I'm sure a lot of people are going to help them with that even if it means a rubbish game.
The developers of The Sims 4 are either rubbish or too weak willed to stand up to their superiors or don't care what the players want/think... Those are their 3 options so which one is it EAxis?
While I appreciate Graham's explanation, it's really not good enough at this point. (And that isn't his fault; it's the company he works for.)
In no other industry, at literally no other job, would it be acceptable to say, "Sorry, we ran out of time on this project, but please pay us anyway." Nope. No other job would allow you to still ask to be paid the same amount for spending less time on something. People in other industries get fired over stuff like this all the time. You don't like meeting deadlines while still maintaining the quality of your work? "Tough cookies," says every other industry except the gaming industry, "you don't have what it takes to survive in this workplace."
If you can't meet a deadline while still maintaining quality, then the deadline is either too strict, or there's something wrong with the management, and with EA, I think it's definitely both.
It still appalls me that EA thinks they can release incomplete games and still tout corporate values like "consumers first." Sure, some people will buy TS4 because they buy anything with The Sims on it, but how long is that realistically gonna last? Not forever, I can tell you that much. Besides that, how could you take pride in your work knowing it sucked, even if a million people bought it? People also buy lots of furniture from Walmart; that doesn't mean it's high quality. I don't know, these are my long and disorganized thoughts.
This just makes me wonder what the people who were supposed to be working on toddlers were so busy working on. What was the thing that took away the "time" to put toddlers in the game because I want to see it and judge for myself if it was worth skipping an entire lifestage. I mean 5 years wasn't enough time for them?
They haven't had 5 years, they've had less than 2 years. The first 3 years were spent on making a scrapped online game.
I understand that. But I don't think EA understands that. They have from the start vehemently denied the fact that this game was ever online only and seem to have gotten amnesia or something. They have never admitted to online gameplay and although the general concensus agree that it was a thing EA seems to think we are stupid enough to believe that they actually worked on this game for 5 straight years. I want them to stop lying to us, admit that it was online only, they are scrambling to make amends, and that they screwed up. I'm tired of the lies.
Yes exactly this. Geez how hard is iit to say " my bad sorry" we will make it up to you. The new CEO has only been there a few months, why not say "look the guy before me screwed the pooch, but we will make it right." Geez all he is doing is compounding the problem. :roll: That makes him no better then the guy before him, despite the lies he throws at the press.
I am not bashing Graham. He's one of my favorites.
I am questioning their project plan. How did they ever let their project get so far behind that the only way to crash it to get it back on schedule was to cut HUGE amounts of functionality?
Furthermore considering that they did not announce their release date until a few weeks ago, why did they not lengthen their timeline to allow for smaller cuts to functionality? They didn't have a drop dead date to adhere to. For all the world knew, the release was "Fall 2014". They have tons of time to get this out before Christmas sales.
I understood the process because of what I do when I'm not being TheMomminator. I question their decision making process and project management. Did they just figure that they could make these huge cuts then come back with an EP? Was that a win-win for them because they get the base game out on time then get to soak us for an EP that returns base game functionality? Did they honestly think we'd just accept this then pay full price for a base game and full price for an EP?
Thanks for sharing. Poor Guru's we know it isn't your fault.
THIS Unfortunately it's the devs that will suffer the most from EA's bad business practices and thats a shame because they are so talented. They deserve so much better than EA.
Yeah blah blah blah. We know it was a salvaged online bork up. They just need to admit it. Surely by now they know we have figured this out.
What I hate is this is the official sub forum for this game. Why don't they make a sticky locked post and put their info and news here. Why must info always come from some third party site.
They do comment and do some ambiguous Q&A but it's always all over they place making us run from pillar to post to find it.
This always does my head in :?
Who is he actually addressing . . .us the community? If so simguru . . .log in and post your comments here in the threads Hydra has at the top of the forum.
Nope, If I wanted a half done game because the people producing it didn't know how to organise departments I'd buy some indie awfulness off steam. At least most of those amateur companies don't try to slip a half baked game through without having the price reflect the quality of the product.
I await real information of what we are actually going to get for the proposed cost of this travesty, until then get to work.
Did they just figure that they could make these huge cuts then come back with an EP? Was that a win-win for them because they get the base game out on time then get to soak us for an EP that returns base game functionality? Did they honestly think we'd just accept this then pay full price for a base game and full price for an EP?
Yes to all of the above because that is exactly what will happen. Despite all of the backlash from the community, people will still buy this game whenever it is released, and those same people will buy the EP when it is released. This is why I and so many others are begging for a delay (though I am not hopeful). If it's delayed, everyone wins. The developers get to release a game they're proud of. EA makes more money. And all the consumers will buy a game that they are happy with.
I am not bashing Graham. He's one of my favorites.
I am questioning their project plan. How did they ever let their project get so far behind that the only way to crash it to get it back on schedule was to cut HUGE amounts of functionality?
Furthermore considering that they did not announce their release date until a few weeks ago, why did they not lengthen their timeline to allow for smaller cuts to functionality? They didn't have a drop dead date to adhere to. For all the world knew, the release was "Fall 2014". They have tons of time to get this out before Christmas sales.
I understood the process because of what I do when I'm not being TheMomminator. I question their decision making process and project management. Did they just figure that they could make these huge cuts then come back with an EP? Was that a win-win for them because they get the base game out on time then get to soak us for an EP that returns base game functionality? Did they honestly think we'd just accept this then pay full price for a base game and full price for an EP?
Plus I think they still misunderstand their fan base. Whilst they *might* get away with that explanation to teenagers, a lot of us are older and have experience running projects in other fields.
Did they just figure that they could make these huge cuts then come back with an EP? Was that a win-win for them because they get the base game out on time then get to soak us for an EP that returns base game functionality? Did they honestly think we'd just accept this then pay full price for a base game and full price for an EP?
Yes, yes, and yes. They figure that The Sims is such a hit franchise that everybody here and elsewhere would buy it, regardless of what was actually in it and how it played. And that has certainly been true in the past, so I can see why they thought it wouldn't matter that TS4 was stripped of many features. Unfortunately, they're banking on the fact that this will last forever, and I'm sorry to say that it won't. Maybe it worked for TS3, maybe it will work for TS4 (though that's doubtful at this point), but it will not work forever, and eventually their luck WILL run out. It's a matter of time, unless they decide to pull up their socks and start making quality games again.
And I don't mind waiting a long time for a really excellent game, I really don't. The solution is either keep the short timelines and add TONS more staff to accommodate the strict schedule (which means investing more in staff, which they probably don't want to do), or lengthen the timeline and allow the current size of staff to develop the game fully (which means investing more in the game itself, which they probably don't want to do).
Remember around about the time The Sims 4 was announced, lots of Gurus got fired and posted on twitter about how much of a mess the development is for the Sims 4? I guess they weren't being bitter.
Plus I think they still misunderstand their fan base. Whilst they *might* get away with that explanation to teenagers, a lot of us are older and have experience running projects in other fields.
EA are seriously in a PR meltdown at the moment.
They are busying themselves with peeing on our shoes and expecting to be thanked for the rain.
Time is NOT an excuse, it is just them explaining why they couldn't put certain things in by the release date.
It doesn't explain things like the loss of the open world, the limitations on Lot size, building height, etc., etc.
EA set a time goal because they want their profits to keep rolling in like clockwork, and I'm sure a lot of people are going to help them with that even if it means a rubbish game.
The developers of The Sims 4 are either rubbish or too weak willed to stand up to their superiors or don't care what the players want/think... Those are their 3 options so which one is it EAxis?
You act like it's easy to make a game that simulates life.
Comments
I understand that. But I don't think EA understands that. They have from the start vehemently denied the fact that this game was ever online only and seem to have gotten amnesia or something. They have never admitted to online gameplay and although the general concensus agree that it was a thing EA seems to think we are stupid enough to believe that they actually worked on this game for 5 straight years. I want them to stop lying to us, admit that it was online only, that they are scrambling to make amends, and that they screwed up. I'm tired of the lies.
I agree as well. I always prefer to know, though, and I think it clears up a lot of confusion, even if the situation feels absolutely hopeless now.
Basically they're confirming what we know; that they were rushed and mismanaged. I really feel for the gurus but I'm really mourning for this game. Imagine what we could have had if they'd been given enough time.
By their own admission, they "didn't have time." So while it may feel "finished" to you, the developers themselves are admitting that it is not.
He said it was possible. He didn't say they were going to do it.
"We've been attributing the state of The Sims 4 to greed but I think it's time to give sheer incompetence another look."
-Honeywell
To find these sims4 creations type SOULB1 under origin ID.
That's what I was thinking as I was reading this. If you have one or two teams that are overloaded... hire more people for those teams!
but it does concern the customer. If the teams aren't managed well the customer suffers because things have to be left out of the game
It doesn't explain things like the loss of the open world, the limitations on Lot size, building height, etc., etc.
EA set a time goal because they want their profits to keep rolling in like clockwork, and I'm sure a lot of people are going to help them with that even if it means a rubbish game.
The developers of The Sims 4 are either rubbish or too weak willed to stand up to their superiors or don't care what the players want/think... Those are their 3 options so which one is it EAxis?
In no other industry, at literally no other job, would it be acceptable to say, "Sorry, we ran out of time on this project, but please pay us anyway." Nope. No other job would allow you to still ask to be paid the same amount for spending less time on something. People in other industries get fired over stuff like this all the time. You don't like meeting deadlines while still maintaining the quality of your work? "Tough cookies," says every other industry except the gaming industry, "you don't have what it takes to survive in this workplace."
If you can't meet a deadline while still maintaining quality, then the deadline is either too strict, or there's something wrong with the management, and with EA, I think it's definitely both.
It still appalls me that EA thinks they can release incomplete games and still tout corporate values like "consumers first." Sure, some people will buy TS4 because they buy anything with The Sims on it, but how long is that realistically gonna last? Not forever, I can tell you that much. Besides that, how could you take pride in your work knowing it sucked, even if a million people bought it? People also buy lots of furniture from Walmart; that doesn't mean it's high quality. I don't know, these are my long and disorganized thoughts.
Not their choice. The devs may feel that they need more time but the release date is determined by the publisher.
EA chooses the release date and EA makes the budget. Just because the devs want more time or feel they need more time doesn't mean they get it.
I am questioning their project plan. How did they ever let their project get so far behind that the only way to crash it to get it back on schedule was to cut HUGE amounts of functionality?
Furthermore considering that they did not announce their release date until a few weeks ago, why did they not lengthen their timeline to allow for smaller cuts to functionality? They didn't have a drop dead date to adhere to. For all the world knew, the release was "Fall 2014". They have tons of time to get this out before Christmas sales.
I understood the process because of what I do when I'm not being TheMomminator. I question their decision making process and project management. Did they just figure that they could make these huge cuts then come back with an EP? Was that a win-win for them because they get the base game out on time then get to soak us for an EP that returns base game functionality? Did they honestly think we'd just accept this then pay full price for a base game and full price for an EP?
Im not blaming them. EA knew they didnt have enough time. A release date should of never been given.
To find these sims4 creations type SOULB1 under origin ID.
What I hate is this is the official sub forum for this game. Why don't they make a sticky locked post and put their info and news here. Why must info always come from some third party site.
They do comment and do some ambiguous Q&A but it's always all over they place making us run from pillar to post to find it.
This always does my head in :?
Who is he actually addressing . . .us the community? If so simguru . . .log in and post your comments here in the threads Hydra has at the top of the forum.
Nope, If I wanted a half done game because the people producing it didn't know how to organise departments I'd buy some indie awfulness off steam. At least most of those amateur companies don't try to slip a half baked game through without having the price reflect the quality of the product.
I await real information of what we are actually going to get for the proposed cost of this travesty, until then get to work.
Yes to all of the above because that is exactly what will happen. Despite all of the backlash from the community, people will still buy this game whenever it is released, and those same people will buy the EP when it is released. This is why I and so many others are begging for a delay (though I am not hopeful). If it's delayed, everyone wins. The developers get to release a game they're proud of. EA makes more money. And all the consumers will buy a game that they are happy with.
Plus I think they still misunderstand their fan base. Whilst they *might* get away with that explanation to teenagers, a lot of us are older and have experience running projects in other fields.
EA are seriously in a PR meltdown at the moment.
Yes, yes, and yes. They figure that The Sims is such a hit franchise that everybody here and elsewhere would buy it, regardless of what was actually in it and how it played. And that has certainly been true in the past, so I can see why they thought it wouldn't matter that TS4 was stripped of many features. Unfortunately, they're banking on the fact that this will last forever, and I'm sorry to say that it won't. Maybe it worked for TS3, maybe it will work for TS4 (though that's doubtful at this point), but it will not work forever, and eventually their luck WILL run out. It's a matter of time, unless they decide to pull up their socks and start making quality games again.
And I don't mind waiting a long time for a really excellent game, I really don't. The solution is either keep the short timelines and add TONS more staff to accommodate the strict schedule (which means investing more in staff, which they probably don't want to do), or lengthen the timeline and allow the current size of staff to develop the game fully (which means investing more in the game itself, which they probably don't want to do).
They are busying themselves with peeing on our shoes and expecting to be thanked for the rain.
Agreed, their PR team don't even want to talk
They promised a video 2 days ago now
....
and we're still waiting
http://forum.thesims3.com/jforum/posts/list/760916.page
To find these sims4 creations type SOULB1 under origin ID.