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Dissapointment with latest sims interview

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  • OEII1001OEII1001 Posts: 3,682 Member
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    Hoverael wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    Hoverael wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    I think that people are conflating the fact that the world of 2000 is different than that of 2014 or 2020 with the game not having features they would prefer. Is it your stance that The Sims 4 is inferior because of the gender patch, a reflection of the decline of print media, or an increase of dark skin tones; or is it your stance that The Sims 4 is inferior because it doesn't have the gameplay features you seek? I think the pearl clutching over "PC" is misplaced.

    ts4 is inferior? who said that?
    ts4 is inferior because of a gender patch? who said that as well?
    Ts4 is based on less game play features? who said that as well?

    you are making a lot of your own "conflating" points of view, if nothing else you are presuming to know for us what our points of view are? i don't need you to tell me what to think or what to believe thank you.

    So why are we talking about "political correctness"? Why is it a problem that there are gender options and more dark skin tones? How is this a problem? Again, I think you're conflating it with a perceived decline of quality, which even by the standards of the anti-Sims 4 crowd is about gameplay and not the gender patch.

    thats your point of view as you see it, not mine. conflated indeed.

    Then perhaps you would care to clarify your remarks. I look forward to reading them.
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    I can agree with this. Trends happen, last for a little while, and then disappear. How is that fun? They're in the game forever at that point, when the trend has become "old news".

    I definitely don't prefer trendiness in The Sims.

    Do you react with disgust when seeing the MP3 player in The Sims 2? I don't. The Sims 2 is a product of its time, as all games are.

    Here's the difference. In Sims 2, it was the choice of the player as to whether to purchase that. Just like it was the choice of the player if they wanted their sims to have cell phones. You bought them at the kiosk and YOU got to decide which sims you wanted to use them.

    Sure, you can opt for a sim to use sm in sims 4, but EVERY pack, and almost everything revolves around that in this iteration. You cannot escape it and play any other way. Your sim is born with a cell phone. And they auto use it for selfies, games, etc. The player is left with hitting the "cancel, cancel, cancel" action.

    Isn't that more of a reflection of the times rather than an indictment of gameplay? The advent of the SmartPhone has fundamentally changed the way that we communicate, or even handle day-to-day life, and not just for kids. We're Vegas natives, so when we went to Philadelphia for medical treatment for my wife we were all lost and turned around. So what did I do? I pulled out my phone, went to Google and used their GPS to locate not only where I was, but what direction I was facing. Disaster averted.

    I don't think that acknowledging the reality that this sort of technology has become integral to life in 2014 or 2020 is a gameplay issue. Maybe that's where we disagree. Maybe I am wrong. I always am.

    Here's where we differ. Humans are quite capable of maneuvering through life without the tech of today. Back in the day, we had MAPS. And the ability to ask directions. Reliance on tech isn't necessarily a good thing. It makes people stupid and unable to problem-solve and reliant.

    Perhaps the game should reflect some of the pitfalls of tech reliance that is occurring in the real world.

    Or maybe just include a trait that makes sims more prone to shake their fists at those crazy kids and their rock-n-roll.
  • OEII1001OEII1001 Posts: 3,682 Member
    edited February 2020
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    Hoverael wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    Hoverael wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    I think that people are conflating the fact that the world of 2000 is different than that of 2014 or 2020 with the game not having features they would prefer. Is it your stance that The Sims 4 is inferior because of the gender patch, a reflection of the decline of print media, or an increase of dark skin tones; or is it your stance that The Sims 4 is inferior because it doesn't have the gameplay features you seek? I think the pearl clutching over "PC" is misplaced.

    ts4 is inferior? who said that?
    ts4 is inferior because of a gender patch? who said that as well?
    Ts4 is based on less game play features? who said that as well?

    you are making a lot of your own "conflating" points of view, if nothing else you are presuming to know for us what our points of view are? i don't need you to tell me what to think or what to believe thank you.

    So why are we talking about "political correctness"? Why is it a problem that there are gender options and more dark skin tones? How is this a problem? Again, I think you're conflating it with a perceived decline of quality, which even by the standards of the anti-Sims 4 crowd is about gameplay and not the gender patch.

    thats your point of view as you see it, not mine. conflated indeed.

    Then perhaps you would care to clarify your remarks. I look forward to reading them.
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    I can agree with this. Trends happen, last for a little while, and then disappear. How is that fun? They're in the game forever at that point, when the trend has become "old news".

    I definitely don't prefer trendiness in The Sims.

    Do you react with disgust when seeing the MP3 player in The Sims 2? I don't. The Sims 2 is a product of its time, as all games are.

    Here's the difference. In Sims 2, it was the choice of the player as to whether to purchase that. Just like it was the choice of the player if they wanted their sims to have cell phones. You bought them at the kiosk and YOU got to decide which sims you wanted to use them.

    Sure, you can opt for a sim to use sm in sims 4, but EVERY pack, and almost everything revolves around that in this iteration. You cannot escape it and play any other way. Your sim is born with a cell phone. And they auto use it for selfies, games, etc. The player is left with hitting the "cancel, cancel, cancel" action.

    Isn't that more of a reflection of the times rather than an indictment of gameplay? The advent of the SmartPhone has fundamentally changed the way that we communicate, or even handle day-to-day life, and not just for kids. We're Vegas natives, so when we went to Philadelphia for medical treatment for my wife we were all lost and turned around. So what did I do? I pulled out my phone, went to Google and used their GPS to locate not only where I was, but what direction I was facing. Disaster averted.

    I don't think that acknowledging the reality that this sort of technology has become integral to life in 2014 or 2020 is a gameplay issue. Maybe that's where we disagree. Maybe I am wrong. I always am.

    Here's where we differ. Humans are quite capable of maneuvering through life without the tech of today. Back in the day, we had MAPS. And the ability to ask directions. Reliance on tech isn't necessarily a good thing. It makes people stupid and unable to problem-solve and reliant.

    Perhaps the game should reflect some of the pitfalls of tech reliance that is occurring in the real world.

    Or maybe just include a trait that makes sims more prone to shake their fists at those crazy kids and their rock-n-roll.

    *shake fist* Yeah, that will add a ton of gameplay won't it? Just another pie menu animation that does nothing, like the rest of it.

    Oh come on, that was funny and you know it. We're not even talking about gameplay, we're besmirching people who use their phones when lost rather than head to the gas station and peruse the AAA map section.

    EDIT: I just think that this particular example is a strange hill to die on. We sure did use maps, and we used them because we didn't have access to the Global Positioning System. If we had it, we would have used it due to the fact that it is objectively superior in every way.
  • SimAlexandriaSimAlexandria Posts: 4,845 Member
    edited February 2020
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    Hoverael wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    Hoverael wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    I think that people are conflating the fact that the world of 2000 is different than that of 2014 or 2020 with the game not having features they would prefer. Is it your stance that The Sims 4 is inferior because of the gender patch, a reflection of the decline of print media, or an increase of dark skin tones; or is it your stance that The Sims 4 is inferior because it doesn't have the gameplay features you seek? I think the pearl clutching over "PC" is misplaced.

    ts4 is inferior? who said that?
    ts4 is inferior because of a gender patch? who said that as well?
    Ts4 is based on less game play features? who said that as well?

    you are making a lot of your own "conflating" points of view, if nothing else you are presuming to know for us what our points of view are? i don't need you to tell me what to think or what to believe thank you.

    So why are we talking about "political correctness"? Why is it a problem that there are gender options and more dark skin tones? How is this a problem? Again, I think you're conflating it with a perceived decline of quality, which even by the standards of the anti-Sims 4 crowd is about gameplay and not the gender patch.

    thats your point of view as you see it, not mine. conflated indeed.

    Then perhaps you would care to clarify your remarks. I look forward to reading them.
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    I can agree with this. Trends happen, last for a little while, and then disappear. How is that fun? They're in the game forever at that point, when the trend has become "old news".

    I definitely don't prefer trendiness in The Sims.

    Do you react with disgust when seeing the MP3 player in The Sims 2? I don't. The Sims 2 is a product of its time, as all games are.

    Here's the difference. In Sims 2, it was the choice of the player as to whether to purchase that. Just like it was the choice of the player if they wanted their sims to have cell phones. You bought them at the kiosk and YOU got to decide which sims you wanted to use them.

    Sure, you can opt for a sim to use sm in sims 4, but EVERY pack, and almost everything revolves around that in this iteration. You cannot escape it and play any other way. Your sim is born with a cell phone. And they auto use it for selfies, games, etc. The player is left with hitting the "cancel, cancel, cancel" action.

    Isn't that more of a reflection of the times rather than an indictment of gameplay? The advent of the SmartPhone has fundamentally changed the way that we communicate, or even handle day-to-day life, and not just for kids. We're Vegas natives, so when we went to Philadelphia for medical treatment for my wife we were all lost and turned around. So what did I do? I pulled out my phone, went to Google and used their GPS to locate not only where I was, but what direction I was facing. Disaster averted.

    I don't think that acknowledging the reality that this sort of technology has become integral to life in 2014 or 2020 is a gameplay issue. Maybe that's where we disagree. Maybe I am wrong. I always am.

    Here's where we differ. Humans are quite capable of maneuvering through life without the tech of today. Back in the day, we had MAPS. And the ability to ask directions. Reliance on tech isn't necessarily a good thing. It makes people stupid and unable to problem-solve and reliant.

    Perhaps the game should reflect some of the pitfalls of tech reliance that is occurring in the real world.

    I in my late 30s and got my first cellphone a year ago. I still use my landline for all calls though as the cellphone doesn't have data on it or an actual phone number. Someone gave it to me and it can call 911 and connect to free wifi. I love it because there is free wifi where I work so I can now connect with my daughter when at work whereas I couldn't before, but honestly, it's sooo easy to get by without one still. I would love for my sims to be able to turn them off. It bugs me that toddlers own them especiallly, they can't use them by our command, but they still get calls on them and my adult Sims have been randomly called by toddlers to congratulate them many times... bizarre. I'd also rather not let kids use them other than a select few and I would disable from many adults too.
  • OEII1001OEII1001 Posts: 3,682 Member
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    Hoverael wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    Hoverael wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    I think that people are conflating the fact that the world of 2000 is different than that of 2014 or 2020 with the game not having features they would prefer. Is it your stance that The Sims 4 is inferior because of the gender patch, a reflection of the decline of print media, or an increase of dark skin tones; or is it your stance that The Sims 4 is inferior because it doesn't have the gameplay features you seek? I think the pearl clutching over "PC" is misplaced.

    ts4 is inferior? who said that?
    ts4 is inferior because of a gender patch? who said that as well?
    Ts4 is based on less game play features? who said that as well?

    you are making a lot of your own "conflating" points of view, if nothing else you are presuming to know for us what our points of view are? i don't need you to tell me what to think or what to believe thank you.

    So why are we talking about "political correctness"? Why is it a problem that there are gender options and more dark skin tones? How is this a problem? Again, I think you're conflating it with a perceived decline of quality, which even by the standards of the anti-Sims 4 crowd is about gameplay and not the gender patch.

    thats your point of view as you see it, not mine. conflated indeed.

    Then perhaps you would care to clarify your remarks. I look forward to reading them.
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    I can agree with this. Trends happen, last for a little while, and then disappear. How is that fun? They're in the game forever at that point, when the trend has become "old news".

    I definitely don't prefer trendiness in The Sims.

    Do you react with disgust when seeing the MP3 player in The Sims 2? I don't. The Sims 2 is a product of its time, as all games are.

    Here's the difference. In Sims 2, it was the choice of the player as to whether to purchase that. Just like it was the choice of the player if they wanted their sims to have cell phones. You bought them at the kiosk and YOU got to decide which sims you wanted to use them.

    Sure, you can opt for a sim to use sm in sims 4, but EVERY pack, and almost everything revolves around that in this iteration. You cannot escape it and play any other way. Your sim is born with a cell phone. And they auto use it for selfies, games, etc. The player is left with hitting the "cancel, cancel, cancel" action.

    Isn't that more of a reflection of the times rather than an indictment of gameplay? The advent of the SmartPhone has fundamentally changed the way that we communicate, or even handle day-to-day life, and not just for kids. We're Vegas natives, so when we went to Philadelphia for medical treatment for my wife we were all lost and turned around. So what did I do? I pulled out my phone, went to Google and used their GPS to locate not only where I was, but what direction I was facing. Disaster averted.

    I don't think that acknowledging the reality that this sort of technology has become integral to life in 2014 or 2020 is a gameplay issue. Maybe that's where we disagree. Maybe I am wrong. I always am.

    Here's where we differ. Humans are quite capable of maneuvering through life without the tech of today. Back in the day, we had MAPS. And the ability to ask directions. Reliance on tech isn't necessarily a good thing. It makes people stupid and unable to problem-solve and reliant.

    Perhaps the game should reflect some of the pitfalls of tech reliance that is occurring in the real world.

    Or maybe just include a trait that makes sims more prone to shake their fists at those crazy kids and their rock-n-roll.

    *shake fist* Yeah, that will add a ton of gameplay won't it? Just another pie menu animation that does nothing, like the rest of it.

    Oh come on, that was funny and you know it. We're not even talking about gameplay, we're besmirching people who use their phones when lost rather than head to the gas station and peruse the AAA map section.

    You're going way off topic.

    The topic was the article which talks about how the dev team are always looking for the latest trend. And how that drives what they create in the game.

    And how that removes OPTIONS for players. This game was not, and should not, be about "keeping up with the Trends'es" (Jones'). And if it's okay with you, I think I have a right to feel how I feel and how the game makes me feel when I play it.....

    c5vlPrP.png

    You're the one that talked about MAPS. I just pointed out that it was a bad example given the superiority of GPS.

    Again, a subtext is being inserted here. The article never talked about what you're talking about, and people are conflating their complaints about gameplay with the reality that video games reflect the time in which they were developed.
  • fullspiralfullspiral Posts: 14,717 Member
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    Hoverael wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    Hoverael wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    I think that people are conflating the fact that the world of 2000 is different than that of 2014 or 2020 with the game not having features they would prefer. Is it your stance that The Sims 4 is inferior because of the gender patch, a reflection of the decline of print media, or an increase of dark skin tones; or is it your stance that The Sims 4 is inferior because it doesn't have the gameplay features you seek? I think the pearl clutching over "PC" is misplaced.

    ts4 is inferior? who said that?
    ts4 is inferior because of a gender patch? who said that as well?
    Ts4 is based on less game play features? who said that as well?

    you are making a lot of your own "conflating" points of view, if nothing else you are presuming to know for us what our points of view are? i don't need you to tell me what to think or what to believe thank you.

    So why are we talking about "political correctness"? Why is it a problem that there are gender options and more dark skin tones? How is this a problem? Again, I think you're conflating it with a perceived decline of quality, which even by the standards of the anti-Sims 4 crowd is about gameplay and not the gender patch.

    thats your point of view as you see it, not mine. conflated indeed.

    Then perhaps you would care to clarify your remarks. I look forward to reading them.
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    I can agree with this. Trends happen, last for a little while, and then disappear. How is that fun? They're in the game forever at that point, when the trend has become "old news".

    I definitely don't prefer trendiness in The Sims.

    Do you react with disgust when seeing the MP3 player in The Sims 2? I don't. The Sims 2 is a product of its time, as all games are.

    Here's the difference. In Sims 2, it was the choice of the player as to whether to purchase that. Just like it was the choice of the player if they wanted their sims to have cell phones. You bought them at the kiosk and YOU got to decide which sims you wanted to use them.

    Sure, you can opt for a sim to use sm in sims 4, but EVERY pack, and almost everything revolves around that in this iteration. You cannot escape it and play any other way. Your sim is born with a cell phone. And they auto use it for selfies, games, etc. The player is left with hitting the "cancel, cancel, cancel" action.

    Isn't that more of a reflection of the times rather than an indictment of gameplay? The advent of the SmartPhone has fundamentally changed the way that we communicate, or even handle day-to-day life, and not just for kids. We're Vegas natives, so when we went to Philadelphia for medical treatment for my wife we were all lost and turned around. So what did I do? I pulled out my phone, went to Google and used their GPS to locate not only where I was, but what direction I was facing. Disaster averted.

    I don't think that acknowledging the reality that this sort of technology has become integral to life in 2014 or 2020 is a gameplay issue. Maybe that's where we disagree. Maybe I am wrong. I always am.

    Here's where we differ. Humans are quite capable of maneuvering through life without the tech of today. Back in the day, we had MAPS. And the ability to ask directions. Reliance on tech isn't necessarily a good thing. It makes people stupid and unable to problem-solve and reliant.

    Perhaps the game should reflect some of the pitfalls of tech reliance that is occurring in the real world.

    Or maybe just include a trait that makes sims more prone to shake their fists at those crazy kids and their rock-n-roll.

    *shake fist* Yeah, that will add a ton of gameplay won't it? Just another pie menu animation that does nothing, like the rest of it.

    Oh come on, that was funny and you know it. We're not even talking about gameplay, we're besmirching people who use their phones when lost rather than head to the gas station and peruse the AAA map section.

    You're going way off topic.

    The topic was the article which talks about how the dev team are always looking for the latest trend. And how that drives what they create in the game.

    And how that removes OPTIONS for players. This game was not, and should not, be about "keeping up with the Trends'es" (Jones'). And if it's okay with you, I think I have a right to feel how I feel and how the game makes me feel when I play it.....

    c5vlPrP.png

    You're the one that talked about MAPS. I just pointed out that it was a bad example given the superiority of GPS.

    Again, a subtext is being inserted here. The article never talked about what you're talking about, and people are conflating their complaints about gameplay with the reality that video games reflect the time in which they were developed.

    lol. Okay. I've seen the superiority of GPS send people over bridges, in to lakes, fields, in to traffic, whatever.

    But as you said earlier. Our discussion is over because you are not reading what the article said. It SAID, they are always looking at what is trending to keep the game current for the teens.
  • OEII1001OEII1001 Posts: 3,682 Member
    edited February 2020
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    Hoverael wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    Hoverael wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    I think that people are conflating the fact that the world of 2000 is different than that of 2014 or 2020 with the game not having features they would prefer. Is it your stance that The Sims 4 is inferior because of the gender patch, a reflection of the decline of print media, or an increase of dark skin tones; or is it your stance that The Sims 4 is inferior because it doesn't have the gameplay features you seek? I think the pearl clutching over "PC" is misplaced.

    ts4 is inferior? who said that?
    ts4 is inferior because of a gender patch? who said that as well?
    Ts4 is based on less game play features? who said that as well?

    you are making a lot of your own "conflating" points of view, if nothing else you are presuming to know for us what our points of view are? i don't need you to tell me what to think or what to believe thank you.

    So why are we talking about "political correctness"? Why is it a problem that there are gender options and more dark skin tones? How is this a problem? Again, I think you're conflating it with a perceived decline of quality, which even by the standards of the anti-Sims 4 crowd is about gameplay and not the gender patch.

    thats your point of view as you see it, not mine. conflated indeed.

    Then perhaps you would care to clarify your remarks. I look forward to reading them.
    fullspiral wrote: »
    OEII1001 wrote: »
    I can agree with this. Trends happen, last for a little while, and then disappear. How is that fun? They're in the game forever at that point, when the trend has become "old news".

    I definitely don't prefer trendiness in The Sims.

    Do you react with disgust when seeing the MP3 player in The Sims 2? I don't. The Sims 2 is a product of its time, as all games are.

    Here's the difference. In Sims 2, it was the choice of the player as to whether to purchase that. Just like it was the choice of the player if they wanted their sims to have cell phones. You bought them at the kiosk and YOU got to decide which sims you wanted to use them.

    Sure, you can opt for a sim to use sm in sims 4, but EVERY pack, and almost everything revolves around that in this iteration. You cannot escape it and play any other way. Your sim is born with a cell phone. And they auto use it for selfies, games, etc. The player is left with hitting the "cancel, cancel, cancel" action.

    Isn't that more of a reflection of the times rather than an indictment of gameplay? The advent of the SmartPhone has fundamentally changed the way that we communicate, or even handle day-to-day life, and not just for kids. We're Vegas natives, so when we went to Philadelphia for medical treatment for my wife we were all lost and turned around. So what did I do? I pulled out my phone, went to Google and used their GPS to locate not only where I was, but what direction I was facing. Disaster averted.

    I don't think that acknowledging the reality that this sort of technology has become integral to life in 2014 or 2020 is a gameplay issue. Maybe that's where we disagree. Maybe I am wrong. I always am.

    Here's where we differ. Humans are quite capable of maneuvering through life without the tech of today. Back in the day, we had MAPS. And the ability to ask directions. Reliance on tech isn't necessarily a good thing. It makes people stupid and unable to problem-solve and reliant.

    Perhaps the game should reflect some of the pitfalls of tech reliance that is occurring in the real world.

    Or maybe just include a trait that makes sims more prone to shake their fists at those crazy kids and their rock-n-roll.

    *shake fist* Yeah, that will add a ton of gameplay won't it? Just another pie menu animation that does nothing, like the rest of it.

    Oh come on, that was funny and you know it. We're not even talking about gameplay, we're besmirching people who use their phones when lost rather than head to the gas station and peruse the AAA map section.

    You're going way off topic.

    The topic was the article which talks about how the dev team are always looking for the latest trend. And how that drives what they create in the game.

    And how that removes OPTIONS for players. This game was not, and should not, be about "keeping up with the Trends'es" (Jones'). And if it's okay with you, I think I have a right to feel how I feel and how the game makes me feel when I play it.....

    c5vlPrP.png

    You're the one that talked about MAPS. I just pointed out that it was a bad example given the superiority of GPS.

    Again, a subtext is being inserted here. The article never talked about what you're talking about, and people are conflating their complaints about gameplay with the reality that video games reflect the time in which they were developed.

    lol. Okay. I've seen the superiority of GPS send people over bridges, in to lakes, fields, in to traffic, whatever.

    But as you said earlier. Our discussion is over because you are not reading what the article said. It SAID, they are always looking at what is trending to keep the game current for the teens.

    I've never seen someone get lost with a map. I've never gotten lost with a map. Never. That detour to south central was planned. TOTALLY PLANNED.

    I did read what the article said, and it didn't say what you seem to think it said. Maybe pointing this out was the crime.
  • SimTrippySimTrippy Posts: 7,651 Member
    edited February 2020
    LiELF wrote: »
    The way the internet generations are evolving (or devolving when it comes to social honesty, self-representation and emotional stamina and behaviors), if the game continues to emulate the sheltered lifestyle of falsehoods on social media, there's going to be no gameplay left whatsoever. The Sims 5 will literally be a virtual young adult Barbie dream house of superficiality with selective inclusivity, claiming to be diverse while catering to the immaturity of childish ideals.

    It's not that I'm exactly psyched about them focusing more on younger generations - even though it's not exactly hard to see why they do it, cause they do need to reel in new players over and over again, and it's arguably questionable how often we'll pay for exactly the same game and packs (1, 2, 3 .. 5 sims games?), but that's a different matter - but ... I'm also not fond of calling "internet generations" lacking compared to us. Isn't that, technically, what all "older" generations think about the young? And ... aren't we on the internet as well, typing here on this forum instead of, you know, out there socializing with like-minded people?

    I'm not trying to be contrarian or annoying, and I have my fair share of disappointments with this game, but I wouldn't underestimate younger generations just because they're young and doing things we may not always understand. People definitely didn't always understand us either, and most of us turned out just fine.

  • OEII1001OEII1001 Posts: 3,682 Member
    If you go back far enough in time you'd fine a group of elderly hominids besmirching those crazy kids for their fire and cooked meat. Takes the whole work out of eating, as if chewing for 45 minutes was a virtue.

    We're too hard on younger generations. We always have been. They'll do it to the others too.
  • AnnLee87AnnLee87 Posts: 2,475 Member
    "When The Sims released in 2005" Sorry, I am not reading an article that has incorrect information in the second sentence. Keep in mind that interviewers ask question about the way they want the article to go. People in interviews can be swayed and interviewers may only publish partial responses. They want people to read the article (clickbait) but I am not reading garbage and taking it to heart as fact. I am not doing it!
  • PlayerSinger2010PlayerSinger2010 Posts: 3,267 Member
    LiELF wrote: »
    From life simulator to trend simulator.

    How the mighty have fallen. :'(

    This is life. Whether you like it or not, influencers are a part of life. Cell phones are a part of life. Tech is a part of life. The LGBT community is now able to be more open without fear, unlike 20 years ago when the game was first released.

    The game has simply evolved and is now a reflection of modern life.

    TS2 was a reflection of early 00s life, with the introduction of cell phones (which weren't so common) and MP3 players, and terrible fashion.

    TS3 was a reflection of the 00-10s life, with the introduction of being able to take selfies, and again, the clothing. Technology became more important in the game as well.

    TS4 has a lot of issues, I admit that, and I want to see it fixed, but to call it a trend simulator is disingenuous.
  • OEII1001OEII1001 Posts: 3,682 Member
    edited February 2020
    LiELF wrote: »
    From life simulator to trend simulator.

    How the mighty have fallen. :'(

    This is life. Whether you like it or not, influencers are a part of life. Cell phones are a part of life. Tech is a part of life. The LGBT community is now able to be more open without fear, unlike 20 years ago when the game was first released.

    The game has simply evolved and is now a reflection of modern life.

    TS2 was a reflection of early 00s life, with the introduction of cell phones (which weren't so common) and MP3 players, and terrible fashion.

    TS3 was a reflection of the 00-10s life, with the introduction of being able to take selfies, and again, the clothing. Technology became more important in the game as well.

    TS4 has a lot of issues, I admit that, and I want to see it fixed, but to call it a trend simulator is disingenuous.

    I think so too. I really enjoy this game. In fact, it is my favorite iteration. Still, there's lots of stuff I'd like to see improved or changed. I just think that a lot of people here are trying to have a conversation that this article wasn't about. It talks about newspaper delivery, it mentions skin tones, and it obliquely mentions the gender patch. There's nothing here about trendsetters. The mention of teens is in reference to the concept of what jobs would look like five or ten years from now. There's not even an overtone of C&C.
  • LiELFLiELF Posts: 6,439 Member
    SimTrippy wrote: »
    LiELF wrote: »
    The way the internet generations are evolving (or devolving when it comes to social honesty, self-representation and emotional stamina and behaviors), if the game continues to emulate the sheltered lifestyle of falsehoods on social media, there's going to be no gameplay left whatsoever. The Sims 5 will literally be a virtual young adult Barbie dream house of superficiality with selective inclusivity, claiming to be diverse while catering to the immaturity of childish ideals.

    It's not that I'm exactly psyched about them focusing more on younger generations - even though it's not exactly hard to see why they do it, cause they do need to reel in new players over and over again, and it's arguably questionable how often we'll pay for exactly the same game and packs (1, 2, 3 .. 5 sims games?), but that's a different matter - but ... I'm also not fond of calling "internet generations" lacking compared to us. Isn't that, technically, what all "older" generations think about the young? And ... aren't we on the internet as well, typing here on this forum instead of, you know, out there socializing with like-minded people?

    I'm not trying to be contrarian or annoying, and I have my fair share of disappointments with this game, but I wouldn't underestimate younger generations just because they're young and doing things we may not always understand. People definitely didn't always understand us either, and most of us turned out just fine.

    I definitely get what you're saying and it's a fair point. I wasn't trying to trash a whole young generation, however, so my wording was probably too hasty and incorrect. I'll try to clarify without going on about it too much, but I don't know if I can explain it well. But I was referencing this quote from @fullspiral :

    "This game forces the social aspect of these sims which is a false dichotomy of the real world we live in as it is lived on line through the computer. People aren't actually social in the real world. And the lives they present on line on their simstagrams are mostly fake stories. I guess maybe that's why these sims seem so fake and shallow...."

    When I responded, I meant to refer to how online trends integrate with the false perceptions that people (of all ages) portray of themselves, not just "all of those darn kids", lol. That's why I used "generations" in the plural. I was trying to reference the illusion of the self on social media; for example, how people generally misrepresent themselves to make everything in their lives seem stellar and enviable when in reality, they might be struggling with finances or depression or any other life obstacle. I was also trying to reference social internet-based trends (which are indeed usually led by younger generations) where a virtual playground of social media sites dictate what's socially acceptable, and where disagreement or debate is often dramatized as hateful or malicious (and sometimes it is, surely, but often it's just discussion of an alternate perspective.) I feel that a company like EA, who when they say they cater to current "trends", it means including pandering to those types of illusions and close-mindedness in the name of representation, to gain social points with the online crowd, yet in gameplay terms, it also means moving away from some of the honest depictions of life, in the challenges, humor and obstacles that we used to have in previous games. Maybe that's looking too deep into a simple interview, but that's just what I see.

    My stance is, I absolutely support the continuing inclusion of races, cultures, and sexual identities, etc. in the future of the franchise. This is a given. And I understand (but may not necessarily like) updating fashion trends and the evolution of society and technology, although I would prefer options for playing retro households. But what I fear for the future of the game is having EA force my gameplay into a socio-political trend that feeds into the ideals of a focus group and strays from the honesty and relatability of life outside of the internet. I know, it sounds dramatic, lol. But it really isn't. I just feel that a game that wants to represent trends of life in modern times isn't going to be that interesting or entertaining in general because, from an outside perspective, the people aren't either.

    #Team Occult
  • LiELFLiELF Posts: 6,439 Member
    LiELF wrote: »
    From life simulator to trend simulator.

    How the mighty have fallen. :'(

    This is life. Whether you like it or not, influencers are a part of life. Cell phones are a part of life. Tech is a part of life. The LGBT community is now able to be more open without fear, unlike 20 years ago when the game was first released.

    The game has simply evolved and is now a reflection of modern life.

    TS2 was a reflection of early 00s life, with the introduction of cell phones (which weren't so common) and MP3 players, and terrible fashion.

    TS3 was a reflection of the 00-10s life, with the introduction of being able to take selfies, and again, the clothing. Technology became more important in the game as well.

    TS4 has a lot of issues, I admit that, and I want to see it fixed, but to call it a trend simulator is disingenuous.

    I didn't call TS4 a trend simulator. I was referring to a possible future Sims game becoming one. But honestly, I don't think it's disingenuous at all to use in reference to Sims 4. Throughout Sims 4's development, the devs have always talked about what's trending and putting trends into the game and promoting it as such. It's not like it's been a secret. I would even go so far to say that trends take priority over more important development decisions. My opinion, yes, but I'll stand by it. It doesn't mean I don't find enjoyment in the game overall, but I do have some strong opinions on things that I feel have been ignored in development for too long in favor of trend fluff.

    As for the rest of your post, I agree. As life progresses, it can be expected that the game will reflect that. Many changes have been good ones. But I also think it's a slippery slope because this iteration has more people claiming boredom than any other game has. If there's one word I don't think I've ever heard used to describe Sims 1, 2, or 3, it's "boring". But I see posts here all the time of people asking for suggestions on how to enjoy the Sims 4. And I think part of that is because modern, tech-obsessed society is kind of boring. There's only so many times I can find interest in watching my Sims stare at screens and do what I'm doing in the present, lol.
    #Team Occult
  • OEII1001OEII1001 Posts: 3,682 Member
    LiELF wrote: »
    LiELF wrote: »
    From life simulator to trend simulator.

    How the mighty have fallen. :'(

    This is life. Whether you like it or not, influencers are a part of life. Cell phones are a part of life. Tech is a part of life. The LGBT community is now able to be more open without fear, unlike 20 years ago when the game was first released.

    The game has simply evolved and is now a reflection of modern life.

    TS2 was a reflection of early 00s life, with the introduction of cell phones (which weren't so common) and MP3 players, and terrible fashion.

    TS3 was a reflection of the 00-10s life, with the introduction of being able to take selfies, and again, the clothing. Technology became more important in the game as well.

    TS4 has a lot of issues, I admit that, and I want to see it fixed, but to call it a trend simulator is disingenuous.

    I didn't call TS4 a trend simulator. I was referring to a possible future Sims game becoming one. But honestly, I don't think it's disingenuous at all to use in reference to Sims 4. Throughout Sims 4's development, the devs have always talked about what's trending and putting trends into the game and promoting it as such. It's not like it's been a secret. I would even go so far to say that trends take priority over more important development decisions. My opinion, yes, but I'll stand by it. It doesn't mean I don't find enjoyment in the game overall, but I do have some strong opinions on things that I feel have been ignored in development for too long in favor of trend fluff.

    As for the rest of your post, I agree. As life progresses, it can be expected that the game will reflect that. Many changes have been good ones. But I also think it's a slippery slope because this iteration has more people claiming boredom than any other game has. If there's one word I don't think I've ever heard used to describe Sims 1, 2, or 3, it's "boring". But I see posts here all the time of people asking for suggestions on how to enjoy the Sims 4. And I think part of that is because modern, tech-obsessed society is kind of boring. There's only so many times I can find interest in watching my Sims stare at screens and do what I'm doing in the present, lol.

    As a final attempt to engage, I think you're wrong about the assertion that things like dark skin tones and newspapsers -- what the article was about -- take precedence over the open world and personality matrix. What I read said that The Sims series evolves with its times, and I doubt that things like more dark skin tones are taking the place of the things that you want in the game. I don't think that what you want is fluff. I don't think things like the gender patch is fluff. And, in the end, I don't think that framing games development as a struggle between features and inclusivity is a useful dichotomy.
  • Sigzy05Sigzy05 Posts: 19,406 Member
    edited February 2020
    Maxis has had the wrong approach with TS4 since it was in production....honestly I'm done with 4...it's just no longer fun for me, it's too repetitive and these piecemeal packs don't do anything at all to improve on the things that the game needs improving. Also, the constant 🐸🐸🐸🐸 on their players have me not wanting to buy anything from EA anymore. Grant had a hand in it, since he infamously did not want dog houses in the game....and did not want to add any family gameplay (because it's not what the teens want)....between other things.
    mHdgPlU.jpg?1
  • Sigzy05Sigzy05 Posts: 19,406 Member
    fullspiral wrote: »
    LiELF wrote: »
    fullspiral wrote: »
    LiELF wrote: »
    From life simulator to trend simulator.

    How the mighty have fallen. :'(

    It's sad, really. I've said before that Sims 4 is nothing but restrictions on top of limitations. And their selling line of "You Rule" and "play with Life" is false advertising because we don't rule anything in this game. We can't even rule the clothing choices we make because the game overrides them.

    This game forces the social aspect of these sims which is a false dichotomy of the real world we live in as it is lived on line through the computer. People aren't actually social in the real world. And the lives they present on line on their simstagrams are mostly fake stories. I guess maybe that's why these sims seem so fake and shallow....

    Oh man. Your statement right here is the perfect example of an "ugly truth". So raw it's painful, yet undeniable.

    The way the internet generations are evolving (or devolving when it comes to social honesty, self-representation and emotional stamina and behaviors), if the game continues to emulate the sheltered lifestyle of falsehoods on social media, there's going to be no gameplay left whatsoever. The Sims 5 will literally be a virtual young adult Barbie dream house of superficiality with selective inclusivity, claiming to be diverse while catering to the immaturity of childish ideals.

    I'm not expecting the next Sims game to be something I want to play. There's just no human honesty, grit, or satirical humor in the gameplay anymore.

    The sims 5? I think you just described the Sims 4.

    They pretty much did, didn't they? xD That is exactly what TS4 has become. It's all about the unrealistically colourful and plastic-like build/buy. Instead of straight up having a color wheel for skin, they have swatches like it's makeup, and they will promote being inclusive when they add more. But whatever. People just don't realize it for some dumb reason. I guess they effe'd up the base game and now they have to have swatches but still.
    mHdgPlU.jpg?1
  • fullspiralfullspiral Posts: 14,717 Member
    LiELF wrote: »
    SimTrippy wrote: »
    LiELF wrote: »
    The way the internet generations are evolving (or devolving when it comes to social honesty, self-representation and emotional stamina and behaviors), if the game continues to emulate the sheltered lifestyle of falsehoods on social media, there's going to be no gameplay left whatsoever. The Sims 5 will literally be a virtual young adult Barbie dream house of superficiality with selective inclusivity, claiming to be diverse while catering to the immaturity of childish ideals.

    It's not that I'm exactly psyched about them focusing more on younger generations - even though it's not exactly hard to see why they do it, cause they do need to reel in new players over and over again, and it's arguably questionable how often we'll pay for exactly the same game and packs (1, 2, 3 .. 5 sims games?), but that's a different matter - but ... I'm also not fond of calling "internet generations" lacking compared to us. Isn't that, technically, what all "older" generations think about the young? And ... aren't we on the internet as well, typing here on this forum instead of, you know, out there socializing with like-minded people?

    I'm not trying to be contrarian or annoying, and I have my fair share of disappointments with this game, but I wouldn't underestimate younger generations just because they're young and doing things we may not always understand. People definitely didn't always understand us either, and most of us turned out just fine.

    I definitely get what you're saying and it's a fair point. I wasn't trying to trash a whole young generation, however, so my wording was probably too hasty and incorrect. I'll try to clarify without going on about it too much, but I don't know if I can explain it well. But I was referencing this quote from @fullspiral :

    "This game forces the social aspect of these sims which is a false dichotomy of the real world we live in as it is lived on line through the computer. People aren't actually social in the real world. And the lives they present on line on their simstagrams are mostly fake stories. I guess maybe that's why these sims seem so fake and shallow...."

    When I responded, I meant to refer to how online trends integrate with the false perceptions that people (of all ages) portray of themselves, not just "all of those darn kids", lol. That's why I used "generations" in the plural. I was trying to reference the illusion of the self on social media; for example, how people generally misrepresent themselves to make everything in their lives seem stellar and enviable when in reality, they might be struggling with finances or depression or any other life obstacle. I was also trying to reference social internet-based trends (which are indeed usually led by younger generations) where a virtual playground of social media sites dictate what's socially acceptable, and where disagreement or debate is often dramatized as hateful or malicious (and sometimes it is, surely, but often it's just discussion of an alternate perspective.) I feel that a company like EA, who when they say they cater to current "trends", it means including pandering to those types of illusions and close-mindedness in the name of representation, to gain social points with the online crowd, yet in gameplay terms, it also means moving away from some of the honest depictions of life, in the challenges, humor and obstacles that we used to have in previous games. Maybe that's looking too deep into a simple interview, but that's just what I see.

    My stance is, I absolutely support the continuing inclusion of races, cultures, and sexual identities, etc. in the future of the franchise. This is a given. And I understand (but may not necessarily like) updating fashion trends and the evolution of society and technology, although I would prefer options for playing retro households. But what I fear for the future of the game is having EA force my gameplay into a socio-political trend that feeds into the ideals of a focus group and strays from the honesty and relatability of life outside of the internet. I know, it sounds dramatic, lol. But it really isn't. I just feel that a game that wants to represent trends of life in modern times isn't going to be that interesting or entertaining in general because, from an outside perspective, the people aren't either.

    As a student of human psychology and human behaviour, I totally got you, just like you understood what I was saying.
  • goofycorinogoofycorino Posts: 7 New Member
    I don't mind the article, and I am glad that they are researching how teens think. I think the Devs need to expand that research into how the elderly think of "this day and age" as well as middle aged people. The Sims have various life stages and focusing on only the young adults causes a missed opportunity for the Devs to really build out a true life simulation in the game. I know they are trying, and I love them for it, I just think they should expand their research into all age groups, as well as, different life styles due to disabilities or mental challenges. I would love to see the burglar, fire fighter, and police start randomly showing up at my house in the the game. :)
  • FurSimsOfficialFurSimsOfficial Posts: 2,362 Member
    Everything new that is created is for the new generation. It is used to direct new people to behave a certain way. That's why they 'never listen'. Videogames are just a part of that as they are a BIG influence.

    You won't see a fashion show with clothes that are there to attract the elders.. no.
    You won't see music or videos clips in the media that elders are going to agree with.
    It's all for the young ones and the worst part of all is that they don't even give the young ones what they ask for, they give them what they want them to ask for.

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