Will my little werewolf have a fated mate that is not attracted to her? You could flirt with a werewolf that is not attracted to your sim and I don't remember how the fated mate thing works.
It is important to acknowledge that these are steps in a journey that we are still mapping out. There is much further to go, and while I can’t get into the details of where exactly we go next, please know that we are committed to continuing to improve our representation of the LGBTQIA+ community.
This is so exciting. I'm eager to see what the next steps are.
I can understand that if you're playing a sim as a hardlined orientation, it would be frustrating under the current system, if they start autonomously flirting and get involved with an orientation that you have forbade them from being romantic with.
So it does make sense to do something that would limit their romance partners. So I have proposed an alternative and I'll post it again.
If you romance them with a certain type of person, such as men with men or men with women or whatever, the more they do that, the more they will autonomously be attracted to that type. Even NPC's would eventually figure out what they like and don't like.
But that would mean that there isn't necessarily a list of pre-defined labels.
It's pretty much training them, just like washing hands and clearing dishes. This training system is already in the game.
Awesome, I have found that the Sims franchise was always friendly towards the idea because in the past, my Sims would be attracted to all kinds of sims (back when Sims had attractions). But I'm glad that it is now a lucid, explicit gameplay option. This, plus the pronouns, are things that have really set Sims 4 apart from previous Sims games.
Shame there is no opt out. Just like I was afraid of, labels are now officially required even in my fantasy world.
All new premades now and going forward will have this configured, so you have to go in and change or delete everyone to keep romance open like it was before.
It definitely could be worse, but I cannot help but be disappointed.
If you watch the video, all premade sims are on the default. Which is, "willing to mess around with anyone" and that is how Sims have always been. Just don't mess with that part of CAS if you don't want your Sims to have a label. But Sims have always had a label, and that was Bisexual. I've always had Sims that were supposed to be gay be attracted to members of the opposite sex and vise versa, and it used to annoy me. Even though I'm over it, I'm glad my Sims will now follow the script. But most of my Sims will probably be pan-everything since I don't like to limit their opportunities (meaning I'll keep it in the default setting).
Remember, the default setting is: not Romantically Attracted to Anyone(Still exploring) Willing to Mess Around With Male and Female.
Its a good start and i absolutely love sims finally having some opinions on who they may romance
I wish there was also way to choose if the sims are up for more than one romantic relationship or not though
and way to choose their opinions on lifestates as well so say we could choose if our sims would be up to woohoo greg or not
or say choose that our occults maybe don't wanna be woohooty with human sim or something
In SIms 4, it seems like my Sims can date with multiple people without hurting their feelings as long as they aren't going steady or married. Or do you want Married Sims to be able to have multiple spouses and partners?
Sims hasn't done that one yet.
I'm really happy to have this feature available. I look forward to changing my sims to reflect who I actually think they are, which the game has never allowed before. An I like the friends with benefits feature. I have a couple I have been pretending were just that for a while even though the game required a romance bar. I'm looking forward to asking to just be friends and woohoo partners.
I don't like the idea of premades with set sexualities because it's introducing a canon reality and making me play the designers' vision instead of mine. For the same reason I wish we could make our own werewolf packs and not be limited to the ones that fit their story. Right now I could decide that if Supriya Delgato was widowed, divorced or had an affair her next partner could be a woman, and that would be valid. Morgan Fyres can be lesbian, straight, bi, pan or whatever and all versions are equally valid. But Molly Prescott is now canonically lesbian and changing her to be willing to date men would be a less valid choice than giving her a girlfriend. It would feel weird, and I can almost guarantee posting stories about it will get you called homophobic, at least in some circles.
I've enjoyed being able to play any story I want with any premade. I've completely ignored all inter-family drama written into the bios, never worried about who Siobhan Fyres was supposedly dating already, don't think of Johnny Zest as a Landgraab... I do what I want. But changing someone's canon sexuality, in today's political and social environment, hits different. And if I'm not comfortable changing them, that's just another little thing chipping away at my ability to make the game my own. But this version of the game has been leaning that way since they refused to allow us to build our own worlds, and they've recently doubled down on that with the amount of lore and the things you can't change (like werewolf packs) that go with it. So I think it is what it is.
At least my existing sims can have their sexualities respected by the game now, so overall it's still a net positive I think.
Just a question though - do we have to use a cheat to change these settings? Or can we just go through Manage Households and update everyone?
Just a question though - do we have to use a cheat to change these settings? Or can we just go through Manage Households and update everyone?
You can change a sim's gender and pronouns right now from Manage Households. I would be very surprised if orientation were not the same way.
I also want to point out that video games tend to be made under time crunch and people are often lazy. High School years wants to show off the new pronoun and sexuality features, and in the future I expect every now and then to see a they/them sim or a gay sim whose preferences outright exclude opposite sex partners. In the same way that the ability to decouple gender from fashion style and physical frame did not cause a flood of gender nonconforming sims, I don't expect the devs to bother with explicit sexualities in most cases. It just won't be worth the bother of manually toggling those switches, and very unlikely that simmers would care enough about any specific cases to raise a stink about it.
I personally don't think that NPC Sims should have set sexual orientations. It kind of ruins the fun in putting them in relationships, especially since I do a lot of challenges like the 100 Baby Challenge when I play. I would rather this be an optional thing in that case since it would be annoying for my kind of play style to have to change everyone manually.
Still, I do think that making this optional in CAS was a good idea. That still allows people to do whatever they want with the Sims that they make! This feature will be nice, but I just think that there could be a few things that can be changed to make it really good. I mostly just wish there was a toggle for NPC Sims so that we can all still do what we want with them without being forced to go into CAS to change them.
My Teen Global Superstar, Rock Star already has two Obsessed (male) Fans who try to hit on him. He is constantly fending them off. Should be interesting when he goes to school in the new pack.
No matter what we all think, I feel sorry for the devs at this point. They are in a lose/lose situation. No matter what way they decide to go about this, setting sexual orientations or not for premades and NPCs, they are going to catch unnecessary flack. Each viewpoint has its faction that thinks the devs should respect their viewpoint and make everybody else adapt. Just let them implement this their way and if your view of how this should be done is the way they choose to go great, if not, it's all good too. Seriously is arguing back and forth that "I shouldn't have to do this or that, you should", accomplishing anything other than fostering hard feelings and wasting an afternoon? There is more to discuss here than who should have to change what. Discussing the feature itself and what the devs should focus on next in improving attraction and inclusivity is more constructive. Like it or not the game is about to get a lot more much needed and long overdue improvements and upgrades to these areas of CAS and more I'm sure.
I'm going to tick off some people but so be it. This thread is starting to feel toxic when it should feel liberating, exciting, and joyful. I got that off my chest, on with the rest of my weekend.🙂
I think it just highlights why with things like this it's so important to get community feedback first really. I remember with the pronouns update, as we all saw a preview of their plans everyone could give feedback on the execution then. I think a lot of the feedback they got from that may have not been what they were expecting, but it seemed like they actually listened and made changes based on what people were saying so then most people seemed happy when it actually released.
That's why it's so important to get feedback first, especially with inclusion related issues. They can't predict how everyone will feel, and I think as this thread and the pronoun update shows it's not black and white and there's often a lot of opinions that aren't what they're expecting.
No matter what we all think, I feel sorry for the devs at this point. They are in a lose/lose situation. No matter what way they decide to go about this, setting sexual orientations or not for premades and NPCs, they are going to catch unnecessary flack. Each viewpoint has its faction that thinks the devs should respect their viewpoint and make everybody else adapt. Just let them implement this their way and if your view of how this should be done is the way they choose to go great, if not, it's all good too. Seriously is arguing back and forth that "I shouldn't have to do this or that, you should", accomplishing anything other than fostering hard feelings and wasting an afternoon? There is more to discuss here than who should have to change what. Discussing the feature itself and what the devs should focus on next in improving attraction and inclusivity is more constructive. Like it or not the game is about to get a lot more much needed and long overdue improvements and upgrades to these areas of CAS and more I'm sure.
I'm going to tick off some people but so be it. This thread is starting to feel toxic when it should feel liberating, exciting, and joyful. I got that off my chest, on with the rest of my weekend.🙂
I think it just highlights why with things like this it's so important to get community feedback first really. I remember with the pronouns update, as we all saw a preview of their plans everyone could give feedback on the execution then. I think a lot of the feedback they got from that may have not been what they were expecting, but it seemed like they actually listened and made changes based on what people were saying so then most people seemed happy when it actually released.
That's why it's so important to get feedback first, especially with inclusion related issues. They can't predict how everyone will feel, and I think as this thread and the pronoun update shows it's not black and white and there's often a lot of opinions that aren't what they're expecting.
It's an emotionally charged subject so it really needs a lot of vetting to be sure it can be done with as much compassion, understanding, and respect as possible. This subject and others related to it are deeply personal and highly emotional for myself and others. It hits right at the heart of who we are. I truly appreciate that we're getting things like this, it's hard to explain to somebody who hasn't experienced it themselves or with a close friend or family member why it matters so much. But it does and like you I love how they're going about this.
Its a relief that only premades (sims that come with an expansion), not all townies may come with this for those who like the original system. Its optional in the sense its only for the premades going forward, not townies, and you can edit them in CAS or choose not to use the system alltogether. Correct?
Its a nice system for those who want it, but the statement made here couldve been more clear, and the insinuation of it being untoggable because itd be they believe it'd be morally wrong was unnecessary/debatable and led to further confusion.
The Sims has currently lost its identity. Bring it back for TS5
Its a relief that only premades (sims that come with an expansion), not all townies may come with this for those who like the original system. Its optional in the sense its only for the premades going forward, not townies, and you can edit them in CAS or choose not to use the system alltogether. Correct?
Its a nice system for those who want it, but the statement made here couldve been more clear, and the insinuation of it being untoggable because itd be they believe it'd be morally wrong was unnecessary/debatable and led to further confusion.
Exactly, this could have been announced a lot better.
However, no, we can not choose to not use the system. It's going to be hard programmed in BUT since we only need to change premades, it makes it easier, if still inconvenient.
Its a relief that only premades (sims that come with an expansion), not all townies may come with this for those who like the original system. Its optional in the sense its only for the premades going forward, not townies, and you can edit them in CAS or choose not to use the system alltogether. Correct?
Its a nice system for those who want it, but the statement made here couldve been more clear, and the insinuation of it being untoggable because itd be they believe it'd be morally wrong was unnecessary and led to further confusion.
That's correct. Just like the pronouns you don't have to choose not to use it, you have to actively choose to use it. The only exception will be all future premades. If you don't want to use it you'll have to change some of them I'm sure but, I don't think you'll have to change all of them. Pansexuality is a sim's preset, but it's also an option in this system, so no doubt some premades will come setup that way.
I also have a feeling that the vast majority of premade sims in future packs will be passively pansexual. Just because it isn't worth anyone's while to toggle that extra switch while creating them. So while the option exists and I could see it being used a handful more times over the game's lifespan, sims suddenly and arbitrarily rejecting you over gender preferences is going to be vanishingly rare.
Premades coming with a set sexual orientation could be annoying for me. Like say I want Molly's mom to be a lesbian, and Molly to be straight. (Only half a hypothetical, because I really was planning on making Mei a lesbian. Molly can be whatever, she's annoying and I don't care about her.) Sure, I could just check or uncheck some boxes. But having set sexualities (unless they're willing to explore) would kind of pressure me to play them how they're "meant" to be played. I know this is a "me" problem though, and giving a sim a confirmed sexual orientation would help flesh them out. It's just something I'll have to get over, because I don't think it's really a flaw on the game's part.
Post edited by Gordy on
The Sims 4 hasn't introduced a new musical instrument since 2017
ok, great, where are wheelchairs? where are hearing aids, amputees, and service dogs? i will never be able to make a sim that looks like me at this rate since all of their concern lies in the lgbtq+ stuff. i know they mentioned the mobility petition in a live stream, but they didn't seem too concerned about it. i'm afraid that they're going to put all of their hard work into this, but then slap a crappy looking wheelchair model in the game and call it representation. idk, i might be the only upset one
ok, great, where are wheelchairs? where are hearing aids, amputees, and service dogs? i will never be able to make a sim that looks like me at this rate since all of their concern lies in the lgbtq+ stuff. i know they mentioned the mobility petition in a live stream, but they didn't seem too concerned about it. i'm afraid that they're going to put all of their hard work into this, but then slap a crappy looking wheelchair model in the game and call it representation. idk, i might be the only upset one
I'm physically disabled and gay so I get where you're coming from. Pragmatically speaking, and this is a very tiresome refrain I realize (ie "it's just too much work to accomadate you" is a pervasive implicit norm), changing some code to implement a sexuality system vs the animation work required to create a meaningful mobility system (or even 'just' someone who uses a wheelchair) are completely different levels of work.
I'm pleasantly surprised they even acknowledged the mobility petition though, I'd have thought that was something they just ignored completely.
I do not mind sexual orientation in this game but for me it is overly focused on, everything else outside of sexual orientation is secondary and may get overlooked like in the announcement trailer.
Post edited by Goldmoldar on
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I do not mind sexual orientation in this game but for me it is overly focused on everything else outside of sexual orientation is secondary and may get overlooked like in the announcement trailer.
To your point, this is still a thing:
Point being there are more gamecentric issues that should be addressed. And apparently the resources aren't available to do both so I think the priority should be fixing what's been broken for years and close to a decade now instead of any new features.
"Build a house on a broken foundation and it will fall." Bugs breed new bugs.
Comments
Will my little werewolf have a fated mate that is not attracted to her? You could flirt with a werewolf that is not attracted to your sim and I don't remember how the fated mate thing works.
This is so exciting. I'm eager to see what the next steps are.
So it does make sense to do something that would limit their romance partners. So I have proposed an alternative and I'll post it again.
If you romance them with a certain type of person, such as men with men or men with women or whatever, the more they do that, the more they will autonomously be attracted to that type. Even NPC's would eventually figure out what they like and don't like.
But that would mean that there isn't necessarily a list of pre-defined labels.
It's pretty much training them, just like washing hands and clearing dishes. This training system is already in the game.
If you watch the video, all premade sims are on the default. Which is, "willing to mess around with anyone" and that is how Sims have always been. Just don't mess with that part of CAS if you don't want your Sims to have a label. But Sims have always had a label, and that was Bisexual. I've always had Sims that were supposed to be gay be attracted to members of the opposite sex and vise versa, and it used to annoy me. Even though I'm over it, I'm glad my Sims will now follow the script. But most of my Sims will probably be pan-everything since I don't like to limit their opportunities (meaning I'll keep it in the default setting).
Remember, the default setting is: not Romantically Attracted to Anyone(Still exploring) Willing to Mess Around With Male and Female.
In SIms 4, it seems like my Sims can date with multiple people without hurting their feelings as long as they aren't going steady or married. Or do you want Married Sims to be able to have multiple spouses and partners?
Sims hasn't done that one yet.
I don't like the idea of premades with set sexualities because it's introducing a canon reality and making me play the designers' vision instead of mine. For the same reason I wish we could make our own werewolf packs and not be limited to the ones that fit their story. Right now I could decide that if Supriya Delgato was widowed, divorced or had an affair her next partner could be a woman, and that would be valid. Morgan Fyres can be lesbian, straight, bi, pan or whatever and all versions are equally valid. But Molly Prescott is now canonically lesbian and changing her to be willing to date men would be a less valid choice than giving her a girlfriend. It would feel weird, and I can almost guarantee posting stories about it will get you called homophobic, at least in some circles.
I've enjoyed being able to play any story I want with any premade. I've completely ignored all inter-family drama written into the bios, never worried about who Siobhan Fyres was supposedly dating already, don't think of Johnny Zest as a Landgraab... I do what I want. But changing someone's canon sexuality, in today's political and social environment, hits different. And if I'm not comfortable changing them, that's just another little thing chipping away at my ability to make the game my own. But this version of the game has been leaning that way since they refused to allow us to build our own worlds, and they've recently doubled down on that with the amount of lore and the things you can't change (like werewolf packs) that go with it. So I think it is what it is.
At least my existing sims can have their sexualities respected by the game now, so overall it's still a net positive I think.
Just a question though - do we have to use a cheat to change these settings? Or can we just go through Manage Households and update everyone?
You can change a sim's gender and pronouns right now from Manage Households. I would be very surprised if orientation were not the same way.
I also want to point out that video games tend to be made under time crunch and people are often lazy. High School years wants to show off the new pronoun and sexuality features, and in the future I expect every now and then to see a they/them sim or a gay sim whose preferences outright exclude opposite sex partners. In the same way that the ability to decouple gender from fashion style and physical frame did not cause a flood of gender nonconforming sims, I don't expect the devs to bother with explicit sexualities in most cases. It just won't be worth the bother of manually toggling those switches, and very unlikely that simmers would care enough about any specific cases to raise a stink about it.
Still, I do think that making this optional in CAS was a good idea. That still allows people to do whatever they want with the Sims that they make! This feature will be nice, but I just think that there could be a few things that can be changed to make it really good. I mostly just wish there was a toggle for NPC Sims so that we can all still do what we want with them without being forced to go into CAS to change them.
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I think it just highlights why with things like this it's so important to get community feedback first really. I remember with the pronouns update, as we all saw a preview of their plans everyone could give feedback on the execution then. I think a lot of the feedback they got from that may have not been what they were expecting, but it seemed like they actually listened and made changes based on what people were saying so then most people seemed happy when it actually released.
That's why it's so important to get feedback first, especially with inclusion related issues. They can't predict how everyone will feel, and I think as this thread and the pronoun update shows it's not black and white and there's often a lot of opinions that aren't what they're expecting.
It's an emotionally charged subject so it really needs a lot of vetting to be sure it can be done with as much compassion, understanding, and respect as possible. This subject and others related to it are deeply personal and highly emotional for myself and others. It hits right at the heart of who we are. I truly appreciate that we're getting things like this, it's hard to explain to somebody who hasn't experienced it themselves or with a close friend or family member why it matters so much. But it does and like you I love how they're going about this.
Its a nice system for those who want it, but the statement made here couldve been more clear, and the insinuation of it being untoggable because itd be they believe it'd be morally wrong was unnecessary/debatable and led to further confusion.
Personality,depth,humor,consequences,lore,customization.
Exactly, this could have been announced a lot better.
However, no, we can not choose to not use the system. It's going to be hard programmed in BUT since we only need to change premades, it makes it easier, if still inconvenient.
That's correct. Just like the pronouns you don't have to choose not to use it, you have to actively choose to use it. The only exception will be all future premades. If you don't want to use it you'll have to change some of them I'm sure but, I don't think you'll have to change all of them. Pansexuality is a sim's preset, but it's also an option in this system, so no doubt some premades will come setup that way.
I can't imagine being so bothered by sims with different sexualities that I would want to delete them, but the option does exist
The Sims 4 hasn't introduced a new musical instrument since 2017
I'm physically disabled and gay so I get where you're coming from. Pragmatically speaking, and this is a very tiresome refrain I realize (ie "it's just too much work to accomadate you" is a pervasive implicit norm), changing some code to implement a sexuality system vs the animation work required to create a meaningful mobility system (or even 'just' someone who uses a wheelchair) are completely different levels of work.
I'm pleasantly surprised they even acknowledged the mobility petition though, I'd have thought that was something they just ignored completely.
To your point, this is still a thing:
Point being there are more gamecentric issues that should be addressed. And apparently the resources aren't available to do both so I think the priority should be fixing what's been broken for years and close to a decade now instead of any new features.
"Build a house on a broken foundation and it will fall." Bugs breed new bugs.