I’m both glad that Russian players will get to play it, but also sad that the couple were erased from the cover in such a manner.
If it was going to be censored anyway, then why did EA act all brave about a stand in their statement and cause so much drama?
If they had just pushed ahead with a release in the region from the get go with the couple erased from the cover, they'd have gotten a ton of venom spewed their way for doing it.
Instead, they said they weren't going to release it, and got a ton of venom spewed their way. But now they can step forward and say "we're sorry, we thought we were doing the right thing, but here's the compromise so that we can release it"
Everyone gets happy they opted to release it, and they get very little flak for erasing the couple from the cover. Plus they get all this free marketing via social media due to all the controversy.
If I didn't know better I'd think they had it all planned to go down like this from the start.
That's a very good point and it's quite possibly true. EA may have known in advance in order to release it to Russian players, the cover art would need to be changed to not show the same sex couple on the cover in case under 18 people could possibly view it.
So, knowing this and how people would have serious backlash for the erasure of the same sex couple, they decided to make a statement about not releasing the pack to Russian players, knowing full well that it would cause another big outburst for the unfairness of Russian players not getting the pack.
Now, they can release the pack with the originally planned "non-same sex couple" on the cover, and appear to have had a change of heart, and I'm sure there will be a lot less people complaining about the cover art being changed if Russian players are not excluded.
It very well could be a big marketing ploy. But, we'll probably never know.
The fact remains it all stressed out Russian simmers such as myself and many of my friends and our foreign frinds and supporters as hell.
It took so much effort to first understand what was going on, then explain it to everyone else.
The first 24 hours we faced so much blame and hate as if every Russian simmer personally signed the law and we couldn't tell right from wrong.
Now everyone I know who is affected by this - not only Russians but their foreign friends too - are deflated and exhausted.
Everyone says "we may get the pack but it's unthinkable to just run the game and go celebrate a wedding like nothing happened".
For many of us, like myself, this game is a matter of emotional support and comfort, so we'll eventually move on from this situation an go back to playing, but the excitement is dead now.
> @Morkovka said: > The fact remains it all stressed out Russian simmers such as myself and many of my friends and our foreign frinds and supporters as hell. > It took so much effort to first understand what was going on, then explain it to everyone else. > The first 24 hours we faced so much blame and hate as if every Russian simmer personally signed the law and we couldn't tell right from wrong. > Now everyone I know who is affected by this - not only Russians but their foreign friends too - are deflated and exhausted. > Everyone says "we may get the pack but it's unthinkable to just run the game and go celebrate a wedding like nothing happened". > For many of us, like myself, this game is a matter of emotional support and comfort, so we'll eventually move on from this situation an go back to playing, but the excitement is dead now.
I am a foreign friend. I am glad you will get the pack. I was even more glad to see you have a lot more foreign friends than anyone realised - especially EA. I hope you have some great weddings :smile:
Don't forget there are other problematic areas in the world. Hungary has the same law as Russia since July 2021. But Hungary doesn't have its own localisation of the game (which already made many Hungarian Sims fans mad back in 2014, when EA announced it) and neither do Hungary has its own Origin store, they are using EU-wide Irish store. So, it will be interesting to see what EA will do in Hungary.
And then, there's EA Polish branch, which has a history of LGBT erasure in their promotions, including not translating a whole patch notes that mentioned new LGBT content. And this affected other areas which are under this branch, including my country, Czechia. I did complain about this in past and it seems they finally got better. They did translate that announcement about Russia (at least to Czech language, did not check if they did to Polish language). But with their history of LGBT erasure, I wouldn't be surprised if they will try to pull some stunt with this GP :-(
> @Morkovka said:
> The fact remains it all stressed out Russian simmers such as myself and many of my friends and our foreign frinds and supporters as hell.
> It took so much effort to first understand what was going on, then explain it to everyone else.
> The first 24 hours we faced so much blame and hate as if every Russian simmer personally signed the law and we couldn't tell right from wrong.
> Now everyone I know who is affected by this - not only Russians but their foreign friends too - are deflated and exhausted.
> Everyone says "we may get the pack but it's unthinkable to just run the game and go celebrate a wedding like nothing happened".
> For many of us, like myself, this game is a matter of emotional support and comfort, so we'll eventually move on from this situation an go back to playing, but the excitement is dead now.
I am a foreign friend. I am glad you will get the pack. I was even more glad to see you have a lot more foreign friends than anyone realised - especially EA. I hope you have some great weddings
We’re all simmers. We shouldn’t be foreigners to one another. Simming (gaming) knows no borders. At least it shouldn’t and I feel this entire ordeal went peach-wise.
I’m surprised that the team felt the need to make a clear statement with that cover, yet their letter was incredibly vague. No clarity at all.
This should have been the other way around. If, from the very start, they had just left the design of the cover open to interpretation (the way it is without the couple), since our stories are our in fact our own, not EA’s, there wouldn’t have been so much distress amongst players. Release could have gone ahead as planned.
EA’s job is to facilitate us with game tools, not make political / social statements.
Doing all this work as a PR stunt as others mentioned, is incredibly unfair to the simmers AND the developers. Was the emotional stress imposed on both players and sim gurus worth it? I doubt it. The wedding pack as highly requested content would have been sold regardless.
But we still don’t really know why all this happened. It remains a subject of speculation.
Has it been confirmed that the pack will be released in Russia?
I’m both glad that Russian players will get to play it, but also sad that the couple were erased from the cover in such a manner.
If it was going to be censored anyway, then why did EA act all brave about a stand in their statement and cause so much drama?
If they had just pushed ahead with a release in the region from the get go with the couple erased from the cover, they'd have gotten a ton of venom spewed their way for doing it.
Instead, they said they weren't going to release it, and got a ton of venom spewed their way. But now they can step forward and say "we're sorry, we thought we were doing the right thing, but here's the compromise so that we can release it"
Everyone gets happy they opted to release it, and they get very little flak for erasing the couple from the cover. Plus they get all this free marketing via social media due to all the controversy.
If I didn't know better I'd think they had it all planned to go down like this from the start.
That's probably what happen .Which sad, but likely.
I’m both glad that Russian players will get to play it, but also sad that the couple were erased from the cover in such a manner.
If it was going to be censored anyway, then why did EA act all brave about a stand in their statement and cause so much drama?
If they had just pushed ahead with a release in the region from the get go with the couple erased from the cover, they'd have gotten a ton of venom spewed their way for doing it.
Instead, they said they weren't going to release it, and got a ton of venom spewed their way. But now they can step forward and say "we're sorry, we thought we were doing the right thing, but here's the compromise so that we can release it"
Everyone gets happy they opted to release it, and they get very little flak for erasing the couple from the cover. Plus they get all this free marketing via social media due to all the controversy.
If I didn't know better I'd think they had it all planned to go down like this from the start.
That's probably what happen .Which sad, but likely.
Nah, is because they taken a poor interpretation of law, to justify a sanction against Russia
I think sometimes we forget that the Sims is just a game, and that the Wedding Pack is a very small part of that game. A cover featuring two women's marriage is a good thing and should be seen as harmless/celebrated. The only reason the cover is seen as "political" or controversial is because gay people are oppressed. This oppression is so normalized and society is so okay with it and with excluding gay people that some have suggested it was weird/controversial of EA to make a cover like that in the first place. What's actually awful is that it seems to be considered "unfit for children" and 18+ in Russia (which is ), but in other places, it's completely banned. I can see why marketers, other employees, and even a greedy company wouldn't want to change even a cover when changing it can be interpreted as giving into the worst sort of capitalist fever dream and erasing gay people for money and so that others can play a $20 add-on to a game. But we still haven't even confirmed the scope of what's been asked to change, so we don't even know that it's just a cover...
I understand that this situation is nuanced because LGBTQA+ people can find representation in the content and gameplay of the actual game, so maybe the cover or whatever else has to be sacrificed for it/the greater good, and that makes sense but I'm uncomfortable by how many people don't seem to agree that there should be a limit to how much is sacrificed so that everyone can play. For example, I feel bad for the potentially millions in the UAE and China who can't play the Sims at all, but I definitely don't think we should pretend like gay relationships are dirty and remove them so that they can. It's just too bad for them, honestly, but again it's just a game... There's something icky to me about ignoring or just going along with ridiculous stuff for a game or profit. Companies should also support their employees and many of EA's employees are probably members of the LGBTQA+ community. It would be awful to make them remove the possibility of recreating people/families like themselves in a life simulation game that tolerates vampires and witches because some ridiculous laws (China/UAE) say that gay people are anti-family, unfit for children, disgusting, etc. for existing in the way that they do. Of course, tons of people in China and the UAE aren't homophobic and hate/protest that their countries have these sort of laws, but that doesn't mean that EA should change the game to suit those regions.
I've been region-locked from games before and it's just not that big of a deal - we play or do something else.
EA needs to give an explanation to simmers in russia of why they can't get the pack, it must be horrible hearing everyone else getting excited but they can't, we're supposed to be one community, it doesn't matter what's happening IRL, we're all simmers on here and we've really invested in those games
@haneul Let's kindly agree to disagree on this one.
In my opinion it's not up to EA at all to support or not support regions, laws or governments.
It's a commercial game company, not a political party, not a human rights organasation, not a peacemaking force and not a charity, it's a commercial game company and the only group they absolutely must support is their players/customers.
I would have liked the blank cover as the original. That way they give MWS back to the player to make their own stories. The trailer would still be there. They could have said "now make your own stories" accompained by whatever social statement they desired to make. Simmers would have focused on what was in the GP rather than who was on the cover.
It was better than releasing a letter as if the sims on the cover were fixed protagonists. And using that to justify the exclusion of paying customers. Not to mention weddings have always existed in the game.
@haneul Let's kindly agree to disagree on this one.
In my opinion it's not up to EA at all to support or not support regions, laws or governments.
It's a commercial game company, not a political party, not a human rights organasation, not a peacemaking force and not a charity, it's a commercial game company and the only group they absolutely must support is their players/customers.
I agree that it's not a charity. I just don't see anything charitable about any of this. Gay people exist. It makes sense to have them in a life simulation game. Where is the HR aspect or charity?
I also agree that EA is a corporation and people should not depend on it to stand up for human rights at all, not one bit. That's not EA's job. But I do think that there's a limit to craven profit-driven behavior, because if not the next move is to remove LGBTQA+ relationships and other things completely from the game so that 1) minors can purchase it in Russia and 2) EA can make more sales by appealing more directly to the giant market that is China.
@haneul Let's kindly agree to disagree on this one.
In my opinion it's not up to EA at all to support or not support regions, laws or governments.
It's a commercial game company, not a political party, not a human rights organasation, not a peacemaking force and not a charity, it's a commercial game company and the only group they absolutely must support is their players/customers.
Also how is not releasing the game supports anyone?It does not help lgbt people in that country.
@haneul Let's kindly agree to disagree on this one.
In my opinion it's not up to EA at all to support or not support regions, laws or governments.
It's a commercial game company, not a political party, not a human rights organasation, not a peacemaking force and not a charity, it's a commercial game company and the only group they absolutely must support is their players/customers.
Then where have you been for the last 4 decades? Games not being available in various regions or countries is not something that's at all uncommon. And I'm not talking about governments or laws; Game publishers make decisions, every day, that exclude various regions and countries. They also make decisions every day about exactly which languages get a translation, most languages don't...ever...for any games.
Let's face it, most of the people who are up in arms right now have been happily oblivious to this reality for all this time, and even now when it is pointed out, all we see are dodges rather than any concern over any of those other occurrences of the same exact thing. So what I see is not much actual concern, but a very full bandwagon.
Which is great, for the Russian simmers, and in that respect I'm on board too.
Then where have you been for the last 4 decades? Games not being available in various regions or countries is not something that's at all uncommon...
I don't see how our messages contradict, but rather complement each other.
You're talking on a bigger global scale, while I take a much narrower approach talking about interests and contunuous support of players who already spent all that money on this specific product.
Also I'm a directly affected party, so this too may make my position less objective and more defensive.
I really dont want to antagonize anyone here of all things, sorry.
I don't see how our messages contradict, but rather complement each other.
You're talking on a bigger global scale, while I take a much narrower approach talking about interests and contunuous support of players who already spent all that money on this specific product.
Also I'm a directly affected party, so this too may make my position less objective and more defensive.
I really dont want to antagonize anyone here of all things, sorry.
No need to to apologize, nor worry about antagonizing me. I actually fully support your cause.
I just think people are being disingenuous in their support by bringing up issues like "EA shouldn't be the one who gets to decide to release it" ...because, let's face it, EA always is the one who decides where their games are released. "It's not fair" is also not a very good argument...life as a whole isn't fair, so it doesn't carry any weight.
The real argument people should be making is the true argument. Which you did, by acknowledging what you care about is whether you get this pack or not. And that's perfectly fair to care about.
I guess my point is that people shouldn't be cloaking it in language that makes it seem like it's some larger crusade for righteousness. Firstly, that's not needed for their desire to have the game released in Russia be valid. And secondly, it's a 🐸🐸🐸🐸 poor crusade for righteousness if the only place cared about is Russia and the only game cared about is this one single game pack.
So, all I'm saying is...People just need to be honest about why they care instead of pulling in every reason plus the kitchen sink to try to justify it. The group in favor of releasing the game in Russia are upset with the lack of honesty from EA, so as I see it, they need to stay honest themselves.
All I can say at this point is I would've thought they'd have learnt from how badly they dealt with other controversies. Seems not. Completely blanking your player base for a full week and working on things quietly is not the way to deal with a scandal.. Like cmon you don't even have to work in PR to see that this is not the way to go to save face
@haneul Let's kindly agree to disagree on this one.
In my opinion it's not up to EA at all to support or not support regions, laws or governments.
It's a commercial game company, not a political party, not a human rights organasation, not a peacemaking force and not a charity, it's a commercial game company and the only group they absolutely must support is their players/customers.
Agreed 100%
The Sims has currently lost its identity. Bring it back for TS5
Definitely TS1 was timeless with its neutral covers without any sims on them. If EA did something similar for TS4 there would be no problem to sell the game on troublesome markets:
Comments
That's a very good point and it's quite possibly true. EA may have known in advance in order to release it to Russian players, the cover art would need to be changed to not show the same sex couple on the cover in case under 18 people could possibly view it.
So, knowing this and how people would have serious backlash for the erasure of the same sex couple, they decided to make a statement about not releasing the pack to Russian players, knowing full well that it would cause another big outburst for the unfairness of Russian players not getting the pack.
Now, they can release the pack with the originally planned "non-same sex couple" on the cover, and appear to have had a change of heart, and I'm sure there will be a lot less people complaining about the cover art being changed if Russian players are not excluded.
It very well could be a big marketing ploy. But, we'll probably never know.
It took so much effort to first understand what was going on, then explain it to everyone else.
The first 24 hours we faced so much blame and hate as if every Russian simmer personally signed the law and we couldn't tell right from wrong.
Now everyone I know who is affected by this - not only Russians but their foreign friends too - are deflated and exhausted.
Everyone says "we may get the pack but it's unthinkable to just run the game and go celebrate a wedding like nothing happened".
For many of us, like myself, this game is a matter of emotional support and comfort, so we'll eventually move on from this situation an go back to playing, but the excitement is dead now.
> The fact remains it all stressed out Russian simmers such as myself and many of my friends and our foreign frinds and supporters as hell.
> It took so much effort to first understand what was going on, then explain it to everyone else.
> The first 24 hours we faced so much blame and hate as if every Russian simmer personally signed the law and we couldn't tell right from wrong.
> Now everyone I know who is affected by this - not only Russians but their foreign friends too - are deflated and exhausted.
> Everyone says "we may get the pack but it's unthinkable to just run the game and go celebrate a wedding like nothing happened".
> For many of us, like myself, this game is a matter of emotional support and comfort, so we'll eventually move on from this situation an go back to playing, but the excitement is dead now.
I am a foreign friend. I am glad you will get the pack. I was even more glad to see you have a lot more foreign friends than anyone realised - especially EA. I hope you have some great weddings :smile:
And then, there's EA Polish branch, which has a history of LGBT erasure in their promotions, including not translating a whole patch notes that mentioned new LGBT content. And this affected other areas which are under this branch, including my country, Czechia. I did complain about this in past and it seems they finally got better. They did translate that announcement about Russia (at least to Czech language, did not check if they did to Polish language). But with their history of LGBT erasure, I wouldn't be surprised if they will try to pull some stunt with this GP :-(
We’re all simmers. We shouldn’t be foreigners to one another. Simming (gaming) knows no borders. At least it shouldn’t and I feel this entire ordeal went peach-wise.
I’m surprised that the team felt the need to make a clear statement with that cover, yet their letter was incredibly vague. No clarity at all.
This should have been the other way around. If, from the very start, they had just left the design of the cover open to interpretation (the way it is without the couple), since our stories are our in fact our own, not EA’s, there wouldn’t have been so much distress amongst players. Release could have gone ahead as planned.
EA’s job is to facilitate us with game tools, not make political / social statements.
Doing all this work as a PR stunt as others mentioned, is incredibly unfair to the simmers AND the developers. Was the emotional stress imposed on both players and sim gurus worth it? I doubt it. The wedding pack as highly requested content would have been sold regardless.
But we still don’t really know why all this happened. It remains a subject of speculation.
Has it been confirmed that the pack will be released in Russia?
That's probably what happen .Which sad, but likely.
Nah, is because they taken a poor interpretation of law, to justify a sanction against Russia
I understand that this situation is nuanced because LGBTQA+ people can find representation in the content and gameplay of the actual game, so maybe the cover or whatever else has to be sacrificed for it/the greater good, and that makes sense but I'm uncomfortable by how many people don't seem to agree that there should be a limit to how much is sacrificed so that everyone can play. For example, I feel bad for the potentially millions in the UAE and China who can't play the Sims at all, but I definitely don't think we should pretend like gay relationships are dirty and remove them so that they can. It's just too bad for them, honestly, but again it's just a game... There's something icky to me about ignoring or just going along with ridiculous stuff for a game or profit. Companies should also support their employees and many of EA's employees are probably members of the LGBTQA+ community. It would be awful to make them remove the possibility of recreating people/families like themselves in a life simulation game that tolerates vampires and witches because some ridiculous laws (China/UAE) say that gay people are anti-family, unfit for children, disgusting, etc. for existing in the way that they do. Of course, tons of people in China and the UAE aren't homophobic and hate/protest that their countries have these sort of laws, but that doesn't mean that EA should change the game to suit those regions.
I've been region-locked from games before and it's just not that big of a deal - we play or do something else.
In my opinion it's not up to EA at all to support or not support regions, laws or governments.
It's a commercial game company, not a political party, not a human rights organasation, not a peacemaking force and not a charity, it's a commercial game company and the only group they absolutely must support is their players/customers.
It was better than releasing a letter as if the sims on the cover were fixed protagonists. And using that to justify the exclusion of paying customers. Not to mention weddings have always existed in the game.
Edit: clarity
I also agree that EA is a corporation and people should not depend on it to stand up for human rights at all, not one bit. That's not EA's job. But I do think that there's a limit to craven profit-driven behavior, because if not the next move is to remove LGBTQA+ relationships and other things completely from the game so that 1) minors can purchase it in Russia and 2) EA can make more sales by appealing more directly to the giant market that is China.
Also how is not releasing the game supports anyone?It does not help lgbt people in that country.
Then where have you been for the last 4 decades? Games not being available in various regions or countries is not something that's at all uncommon. And I'm not talking about governments or laws; Game publishers make decisions, every day, that exclude various regions and countries. They also make decisions every day about exactly which languages get a translation, most languages don't...ever...for any games.
Let's face it, most of the people who are up in arms right now have been happily oblivious to this reality for all this time, and even now when it is pointed out, all we see are dodges rather than any concern over any of those other occurrences of the same exact thing. So what I see is not much actual concern, but a very full bandwagon.
Which is great, for the Russian simmers, and in that respect I'm on board too.
The Winters family Tree --- My Mods
You're talking on a bigger global scale, while I take a much narrower approach talking about interests and contunuous support of players who already spent all that money on this specific product.
Also I'm a directly affected party, so this too may make my position less objective and more defensive.
I really dont want to antagonize anyone here of all things, sorry.
No need to to apologize, nor worry about antagonizing me. I actually fully support your cause.
I just think people are being disingenuous in their support by bringing up issues like "EA shouldn't be the one who gets to decide to release it" ...because, let's face it, EA always is the one who decides where their games are released. "It's not fair" is also not a very good argument...life as a whole isn't fair, so it doesn't carry any weight.
The real argument people should be making is the true argument. Which you did, by acknowledging what you care about is whether you get this pack or not. And that's perfectly fair to care about.
I guess my point is that people shouldn't be cloaking it in language that makes it seem like it's some larger crusade for righteousness. Firstly, that's not needed for their desire to have the game released in Russia be valid. And secondly, it's a 🐸🐸🐸🐸 poor crusade for righteousness if the only place cared about is Russia and the only game cared about is this one single game pack.
So, all I'm saying is...People just need to be honest about why they care instead of pulling in every reason plus the kitchen sink to try to justify it. The group in favor of releasing the game in Russia are upset with the lack of honesty from EA, so as I see it, they need to stay honest themselves.
The Winters family Tree --- My Mods
Agreed 100%
Personality,depth,humor,consequences,lore,customization.
Agreed which why I made poll whether some think the "inclusivity" focus is harmful or helpful?
https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/995980/the-sims-4-focused-aim-execution-on-inclusivity-representation-helpful-or-harmful#latest
Personality,depth,humor,consequences,lore,customization.
We've updated the Sims blog post here. Thank you to everyone for your patience with this and with the technical issues today.
And thanks to the international Sims Community for your help, you are the best!