A pronoun/custom pronoun option bar in the settings I think would work really well. If its switched off, you wont see it in CAS, it wont show up next to your name, and it wont generate for random townies.
I thought they would be further along than showing us a concept art but I don't really like the placement near the name. I feel there should be a profile category in CAS. I would put information like pronouns, sexuality, relationship status, hometown, currently live and career in the profile. The hometown option is to create a background story. You could say your sims is from Strangerville but currently lives in Willow Creek. Then there could be an option to like or dislike hometown. Just a thought.
For me, It is ok to have this feature, but personally I do not understand the pronouns being an issue, because I live in a country where every pronoun is not gender specific. (the word "siya" can be for both genders). I am seeing a lot of issue in gender identification in america on the internet, but I do not understand the issue. However it does not mean that I do not support the addition of this feature. I am happy for the Simmers who have been wanting this, and maybe it was an issue that we are not experiencing in my language so why I do not fully understand.
In the End, I am glad that everyone can enjoy it. Wherever they are in the world.
Wait, this isn't going to be displayed next to our Sims' names in gameplay, will it? Because if it is, I will find that to be extremely invasive. I was thinking it would just edit messages that refer to the Sim's gender.
Wait, this isn't going to be displayed next to our Sims' names in gameplay, will it? Because if it is, I will find that to be extremely invasive. I was thinking it would just edit messages that refer to the Sim's gender.
Yeah im wondering if theyll end up putting it next to townies names where they usually put the sims ages (adult / young adult etc). If they make it an enabling/disabling feature that would be helpful.
The Sims has currently lost its identity. Bring it back for TS5
Looks good far, but I'm really curious to see how this is going to translate into other languages. The core concept is obviously based on the English language, where the dative and accusative cases are always the same ("them" in this particular case), but in my language, the dative and accusative cases are actually different words, so we would need a fourth option... and that's just German. I've heard of languages with even more cases.
The preview was better than I expected. I like the fact that it is completely customisable. Although I would have preferred to see this with the other gender options and not next to the name. I hope we can change these pronouns for servos as well.
What worries me a bit is that this will only be available in English. What does this mean for sims shared on the gallery when people play the game in different languages? What will I see when I download sims from people playing the game in English? Will I see the chosen pronouns or just get the default? Or will I see the custom ones but lack the interface to change them myself? Will English speaking simmers get sims with missing information if they download my sims? This is all really complex.
Looks good far, but I'm really curious to see how this is going to translate into other languages. The core concept is obviously based on the English language, where the dative and accusative cases are always the same ("them" in this particular case), but in my language, the dative and accusative cases are actually different words, so we would need a fourth option... and that's just German. I've heard of languages with even more cases.
Very good point. I knew German has dative and accusative but never realised the implication on needing a fourth pronoun for these kind of options.
That custom line where it says "They love the sims", is missing an s from loves the sims if you add a regular third person singular pronoun like she/he/zie /zir or whatever.
What worries me a bit is that this will only be available in English. What does this mean for sims shared on the gallery when people play the game in different languages? What will I see when I download sims from people playing the game in English? Will I see the chosen pronouns or just get the default? Or will I see the custom ones but lack the interface to change them myself? Will English speaking simmers get sims with missing information if they download my sims? This is all really complex.
The game will probably use the default settings for other languages that are not supported. When it comes to them supporting other languages I think they will have to go with a solution that will probably not be perfect.
When it comes to how well this will be supported...well...I expect this to be supported in the same way as some other features that Maxis have implemented in the past.
I think it’s great that they’re developing a customizable pronoun system for those who want it in their game. I also found it interesting to listen to the experts explaining about the various challenges they have to deal with and how they could potentially solve some of these language issues.
Regarding the concept of that new user interface…I’d have to agree with others and I really hope they’re going to get rid of a lot more than those huge WIP watermarks.
I absolutely despise messy UI and having to look at a pronoun display next to my sim’s name is gonna blubberize my brain. It’s such an unnecessary detail and it could have been anywhere but there. I truly hope they will take our feedback and change this, including the pronoun tooltips in live mode.
In my game I already know who’s a he and who’s a she. It’s really obvious. If it wasn’t obvious, it still wouldn’t matter. I’m the only person playing my game. It’s a single player game.
My RL job already requires me to be extremely careful about how I address people and for a simple guy like myself I’m doing a great job at that because I do respect people and their feelings. But sheesh please let my game be a friggin game.
I don’t need to be reminded of pronouns every single time I see a RL person, let alone a sim. I’m more interested in personalities than pronouns. Are you a decent human being? Yes? Now we can talk.
I didn’t talk until I was almost 4 years old, and really folks, sometimes I want to go back to my quieter self. Impossible to offend anyone.
You know this thing with Morgyn Ember? To me he’s a spell caster dude who wears make-up and he teaches my sims how to perform magic.
Others see Morgyn as non-binary or trans or whatever due to something in the gender settings (I still don’t have a clue what that is and frankly my dear I don’t give a darn) and that’s totally fine. Wonderful! So yes, I agree with others, move the pronoun customization to the gender setting for simmers who are very specific about gender details.
The messages are the most important element here right? And the simology? Not the friggin tooltips. Add an option under the friendly social interaction were we could ask about pronouns, if that’s important.
Oh Bella Goth, you’re a HE ?! I never would’ve thought. That’s grand. Lovely dress.
Back to my good friend Morgyn. Me referring to Morgyn as a dude or a lass or a chicken is not gonna offend Morgyn. I hope. Unless he knows. …
In my head he’s a he and the game doesn’t need to tell me he’s a they or a she because I won’t agree anyway. Sometimes it’s necessary to delete the dude for storytelling purposes. Sorry Morgs.
It’s great that they’re striving for advanced customization and that they’re developing options for those who want to modify pronouns and gender etc. but all this stuff is so in your face….there’s no reason for that whatsoever, is there now?
Regarding the concept of that new user interface…I’d have to agree with others and I really hope they’re going to get rid of a lot more than those huge WIP watermarks.
I absolutely despise messy UI and having to look at a pronoun display next to my sim’s name is gonna blubberize my brain. It’s such an unnecessary detail and it could have been anywhere but there. I truly hope they will take our feedback and change this, including the pronoun tooltips in live mode.
This is my feelings on it as well. I fully support and respect that they are doing what they are doing, but I don't want it constantly right there in my face. For the same reason that on games which offer the ability to customize the UI I always go with a minimalist approach. The less UI the better and this particular feature is definitely NOT something that needs to be constantly displayed.
Just like people who I know irl don't need to remind me what pronouns they prefer every single time they see me....that would be annoying to.
I'm thrilled to see this come to The Sims! I can see the problem with other languages - French has different endings for adjectives and verbs that form the past tense with être - I suppose that the default would be the masculine non-ending. Really, we have the same issue in English with some irregular verbs when used with they and them. (You can say "he/she/they did", but "he/she is" and "they are".) It could make for some amusing messages, but it's all good.
In my opinion this feature should be hidden in gender panel because in english you can have 3 options, but in polish we have technically 5 genders (3 singular + 2 plural) + a lot of conjugations.
To mimic english translation of:
Hello, I'm Bella Goth and my pronouns are she/her
it should be created:
Cześć, jestem Bella Ćwir i moje zaimki to: ona, jej, ją, niej, nią, tej, tę, tą, ta...
It doesn't have any sense. Especially I only did a couple of singular examples. Due to that non binary people use masculine end femine version of pronouns or they try to ommit any of them. For example you can replace the sentense "I was dreaming of it / marzyłem(am) o tym" for "It was my dream / to było moje marzenie".
For example you can replace the sentense "I was dreaming of it / marzyłem(am) o tym" for "It was my dream / to było moje marzenie".
Both of those still have two pronouns in English ('I', 'it' and 'it', 'my'), but I don't know how many they contain in Polish.
Out of interest, how do Polish non-binary folk typically list their pronouns? Do they go with all five, or a smaller selection from which more can be inferred?
What worries me a bit is that this will only be available in English. What does this mean for sims shared on the gallery when people play the game in different languages? What will I see when I download sims from people playing the game in English? Will I see the chosen pronouns or just get the default? Or will I see the custom ones but lack the interface to change them myself? Will English speaking simmers get sims with missing information if they download my sims? This is all really complex.
The game will probably use the default settings for other languages that are not supported. When it comes to them supporting other languages I think they will have to go with a solution that will probably not be perfect.
When it comes to how well this will be supported...well...I expect this to be supported in the same way as some other features that Maxis have implemented in the past.
You are probably right about the default settings. I'm still curious to see how it will implemented because as far as I know this is the first time since the start of the sims franchise that the game will have different possibilities for different languages.
@Sthenastia I had no idea polish was so complicated. Very interesting to read
I got a little silly in my game regarding the new pronouns. I made Alien Humanoid Robots that are Neutral Non-Genders (sort of). I made both of them the same type of look. They both can only sit when they go to the bathroom. However, neither one is completely male or female considering they aren't fully human. I also made both of them barren. I got inspired by Star Trek.
What worries me a bit is that this will only be available in English. What does this mean for sims shared on the gallery when people play the game in different languages? What will I see when I download sims from people playing the game in English? Will I see the chosen pronouns or just get the default? Or will I see the custom ones but lack the interface to change them myself? Will English speaking simmers get sims with missing information if they download my sims? This is all really complex.
The game will probably use the default settings for other languages that are not supported. When it comes to them supporting other languages I think they will have to go with a solution that will probably not be perfect.
When it comes to how well this will be supported...well...I expect this to be supported in the same way as some other features that Maxis have implemented in the past.
You are probably right about the default settings. I'm still curious to see how it will implemented because as far as I know this is the first time since the start of the sims franchise that the game will have different possibilities for different languages.
Yeah, we will see how this will work. I hope the people who wanted this feature will be happy because I gotta be honest... I miss the old days when we were all talking about packs.
It looks like the pronouns will be permanently displayed to the right of the sim's name. Frex:
And you can create customized pronouns Ze/Zim/Zeirs (for example.)( I'm also thinking aliens)
Buy the idea
Then to work in this way, allow we save our row/s of pronouns to re-use our custom pronouns or even endose to a specific occult
At your example per example, for aliens
I'm confused and don't understand? What does that mean that the pronouns a visible next to the name ingame? Is it like [Bella Goth (she/her)] when my sim met her? Has anybody a picture of it or is just a rumor? In cas for own sims, okay, sure why not, but ingame for the other non played sims? For me it doesn't makes any sense to see that ingame from other sims, since I can't speak or write directly to these sims. Then why should I see this on other sims? Any good reason?
I am OK with the way they are presented within the CAS UI like @Onverser post as it is pertinent info when creating/editing a sim. Wouldn't want that in Live Mode tho.
Awake.
Shake dreams from your hair
My pretty child, my sweet one.
Choose the day and choose the sign of your day
The day's divinity.... The Ghost Song - Jim Morrison
I am OK with the way they are presented within the CAS UI like @Onverser post as it is pertinent info when creating/editing a sim. Wouldn't want that in Live Mode tho.
I'm hoping if the pronouns are displayed in Live Mode, they're on a line under the name, rather than after it. Much as I like the addition, I can see it getting a little cluttered to have them after. Especially in the corner where you see everyone in the household.
But we only saw the CAS WIP, not how they're going to look in Live Mode, so it's mostly speculation on that part.
Comments
110% Agree.
For me, It is ok to have this feature, but personally I do not understand the pronouns being an issue, because I live in a country where every pronoun is not gender specific. (the word "siya" can be for both genders). I am seeing a lot of issue in gender identification in america on the internet, but I do not understand the issue. However it does not mean that I do not support the addition of this feature. I am happy for the Simmers who have been wanting this, and maybe it was an issue that we are not experiencing in my language so why I do not fully understand.
In the End, I am glad that everyone can enjoy it. Wherever they are in the world.
http://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/924539/features-that-needs-depth-and-ways-to-improve
Yeah im wondering if theyll end up putting it next to townies names where they usually put the sims ages (adult / young adult etc). If they make it an enabling/disabling feature that would be helpful.
Personality,depth,humor,consequences,lore,customization.
Looks good far, but I'm really curious to see how this is going to translate into other languages. The core concept is obviously based on the English language, where the dative and accusative cases are always the same ("them" in this particular case), but in my language, the dative and accusative cases are actually different words, so we would need a fourth option... and that's just German. I've heard of languages with even more cases.
Something wicked this way comes!
I don't use MCCC.
What worries me a bit is that this will only be available in English. What does this mean for sims shared on the gallery when people play the game in different languages? What will I see when I download sims from people playing the game in English? Will I see the chosen pronouns or just get the default? Or will I see the custom ones but lack the interface to change them myself? Will English speaking simmers get sims with missing information if they download my sims? This is all really complex.
Very good point. I knew German has dative and accusative but never realised the implication on needing a fourth pronoun for these kind of options.
That custom line where it says "They love the sims", is missing an s from loves the sims if you add a regular third person singular pronoun like she/he/zie /zir or whatever.
The game will probably use the default settings for other languages that are not supported. When it comes to them supporting other languages I think they will have to go with a solution that will probably not be perfect.
When it comes to how well this will be supported...well...I expect this to be supported in the same way as some other features that Maxis have implemented in the past.
I think it’s great that they’re developing a customizable pronoun system for those who want it in their game. I also found it interesting to listen to the experts explaining about the various challenges they have to deal with and how they could potentially solve some of these language issues.
Regarding the concept of that new user interface…I’d have to agree with others and I really hope they’re going to get rid of a lot more than those huge WIP watermarks.
I absolutely despise messy UI and having to look at a pronoun display next to my sim’s name is gonna blubberize my brain. It’s such an unnecessary detail and it could have been anywhere but there. I truly hope they will take our feedback and change this, including the pronoun tooltips in live mode.
In my game I already know who’s a he and who’s a she. It’s really obvious. If it wasn’t obvious, it still wouldn’t matter. I’m the only person playing my game. It’s a single player game.
My RL job already requires me to be extremely careful about how I address people and for a simple guy like myself I’m doing a great job at that because I do respect people and their feelings. But sheesh please let my game be a friggin game.
I don’t need to be reminded of pronouns every single time I see a RL person, let alone a sim. I’m more interested in personalities than pronouns. Are you a decent human being? Yes? Now we can talk.
I didn’t talk until I was almost 4 years old, and really folks, sometimes I want to go back to my quieter self. Impossible to offend anyone.
You know this thing with Morgyn Ember? To me he’s a spell caster dude who wears make-up and he teaches my sims how to perform magic.
Others see Morgyn as non-binary or trans or whatever due to something in the gender settings (I still don’t have a clue what that is and frankly my dear I don’t give a darn) and that’s totally fine. Wonderful! So yes, I agree with others, move the pronoun customization to the gender setting for simmers who are very specific about gender details.
The messages are the most important element here right? And the simology? Not the friggin tooltips. Add an option under the friendly social interaction were we could ask about pronouns, if that’s important.
Oh Bella Goth, you’re a HE ?! I never would’ve thought. That’s grand. Lovely dress.
Back to my good friend Morgyn. Me referring to Morgyn as a dude or a lass or a chicken is not gonna offend Morgyn. I hope. Unless he knows. …
In my head he’s a he and the game doesn’t need to tell me he’s a they or a she because I won’t agree anyway. Sometimes it’s necessary to delete the dude for storytelling purposes. Sorry Morgs.
It’s great that they’re striving for advanced customization and that they’re developing options for those who want to modify pronouns and gender etc. but all this stuff is so in your face….there’s no reason for that whatsoever, is there now?
This is my feelings on it as well. I fully support and respect that they are doing what they are doing, but I don't want it constantly right there in my face. For the same reason that on games which offer the ability to customize the UI I always go with a minimalist approach. The less UI the better and this particular feature is definitely NOT something that needs to be constantly displayed.
Just like people who I know irl don't need to remind me what pronouns they prefer every single time they see me....that would be annoying to.
The Winters family Tree --- My Mods
To mimic english translation of:
Hello, I'm Bella Goth and my pronouns are she/her
it should be created:
Cześć, jestem Bella Ćwir i moje zaimki to: ona, jej, ją, niej, nią, tej, tę, tą, ta...
It doesn't have any sense. Especially I only did a couple of singular examples. Due to that non binary people use masculine end femine version of pronouns or they try to ommit any of them. For example you can replace the sentense "I was dreaming of it / marzyłem(am) o tym" for "It was my dream / to było moje marzenie".
Out of interest, how do Polish non-binary folk typically list their pronouns? Do they go with all five, or a smaller selection from which more can be inferred?
You are probably right about the default settings. I'm still curious to see how it will implemented because as far as I know this is the first time since the start of the sims franchise that the game will have different possibilities for different languages.
@Sthenastia I had no idea polish was so complicated. Very interesting to read
Yeah, we will see how this will work. I hope the people who wanted this feature will be happy because I gotta be honest... I miss the old days when we were all talking about packs.
Buy the idea
Then to work in this way, allow we save our row/s of pronouns to re-use our custom pronouns or even endose to a specific occult
At your example per example, for aliens
Standard name length, no UI open:
Longer name with UI open:
Somebody else mentioned this:
Personality,depth,humor,consequences,lore,customization.
Shake dreams from your hair
My pretty child, my sweet one.
Choose the day and choose the sign of your day
The day's divinity....
The Ghost Song - Jim Morrison
I'll try Imgur instead, these should work:
https://i.imgur.com/xRvjz1I.png
https://i.imgur.com/ICDiCOg.png
https://i.imgur.com/BB0NlcF.png
https://i.imgur.com/SgXjdrz.png
I'm hoping if the pronouns are displayed in Live Mode, they're on a line under the name, rather than after it. Much as I like the addition, I can see it getting a little cluttered to have them after. Especially in the corner where you see everyone in the household.
But we only saw the CAS WIP, not how they're going to look in Live Mode, so it's mostly speculation on that part.