It's not being bias to say no one I know wanted this type pack. We operate in the world we live in. So, show me on this forum where anyone asked or said omg, Maxis, please make a SW pack about the new Disney theme park, and make sure it's story driven, and the aliens are Sims in costumes (if your Sim married one would they have an alien?) etc. etc. And then show me where it got a huge amount of support. Now, if you can't point out where those threads exists and or requests and or twitter feeds where thousands approved, liked, supported a request for JTB (A Disney park snafu) then it is only be biased on the other foot, hoping to rescuse Maxis from this debocale. Because we all know actually no one asked for this. Or we would see the links to where someone did. (The only place it may have appeared before developing was in a survey by a Sim fan, where it got less than 3K likes). To be fair I'll give everyone who is saying people are being biased for disliking it, time to find the thread on Reddit, FB, Twitter, Instagram, Youtube or where ever, begging Maxis to develop a SW pack with only three lots, fake aliens, story driven, fake backdrop game. One doesn't exist. What does exists are threads upon threads about cars, babies, farming etc. Everywhere. Where is this infamous thread where people were begging Maxis to build a SW pack? No where.
You know what I see, it's just like when EAxis, even though everyone was telling them what they wanted for the next iteration said nope, we are building a multiplayer...though there may have been only a handful at the time who would have wanted it, the rest of the Simmer world (no matter where they post) was saying no, but EAxis went ahead with Project Olympus, now known as TS4, the salvaged multiplayer. It's the same difference.
And another thing about it's nice to get new players, yes, for EAxis. I'm a single player how does getting new players help me play my game? Because you know what, if they listened to their core, they wouldn't need new players. They would have all the money they wanted or needed to keep producing, but greed won. It's not the pack or being entitled, it's the direction, they still string along their customer base, with little speeches of how they hear you. Well, after six years aren't we all tired of saying what we want improved, changed, fixed? Why did we even have to do that in the first place? That is the question. Why did anybody have to remind EAxis, no we don't want any thing but a life simulator.
Because no, it's not being entitled because we know their success was built on the backs of their fans, who gave them twenty years of suggestions and ways to improve the UI, the games, the packs or whatever. Those who have been around a very long time know some gameplay and UI improvements and or whatever, even new ideas, came from players who have been giving them feedback for years. Does anyone think Maxis came up with all that TS4 is right now, I have to laugh. Everything about Maxis in the first fifteen years was suggestions by fans. Not the in grand ideas of developers.
TS4 is a different story in some cases, but still all those improvements so many enjoy were suggestions by their long time fans.
ETA: Just look at what wasn't successful (money) for Maxis, the packs no one wanted (otherwise maybe a few).
The ideas and suggestions players made (huge numbers of fans) were well received. (Money)
But the packs they decided to do without any input from fans are a bust.
Katy Perry Sweet Treats is a good example, not even offered for years anymore. Failed.
Others they have had to bundle to get people to even try. Their ideas without any fan knowledge seem to fail.
You often make some really good points that I agree with, but oh dear, are you kidding me with this? Now you want "proof" that players asked for this exact pack? I'm sorry, but who are you to climb up on a throne to inspect and judge the requests of other Sims players? Did people request the exact content of Parenthood or did they just ask for Generations and more family play? I don't remember ever seeing a request for the exact Character Values system. Guess that pack is worthless trash that "nobody asked for", right? Or the club system that so many players use? Or the Calendar system in Seasons? I didn't see one request for that, yet I've seen a lot of people praise it. Sorry Cinebar, but you contradict yourself by saying it's the players' requests that make the game, yet you're moving the goal posts as you see fit so you can refuse to acknowledge the requests you don't like and dictate your own perception of what the game should be. And the thing is, that's not even altogether true. The players didn't develop the game, nor did they request or demand everything that came in past games. That's some far reaching. And if this game only followed the demands of the noisy, errantly perceived "majority", it would only replicate and never refresh and players would get bored. The game would cease to represent the progress or tropes of the modern world, or to try new and exciting things. To tell the truth, I think a lot of people just have a hard time with change in general.
The fact is, some people asked for more Star Wars content. Many didn't expect it because they knew it was unlikely or that there were players on these Forums who would throw a toddler level spam fit if something was made that didn't cater to their personal tastes or wasn't included in the checklists of previous iterations, so it wasn't pushed as aggressively. Many people have been asking for "something new and different", but there are some players who can't seem to live with the fact that other players might want something they don't...and actually get it. It's almost like a childish refusal to share. And I admit, I used to think that way too, but there comes a point when the truth is right there in your face and denying it only does more damage to the self. And in the end, it's just a game. it's a luxury, not a right. It's a choice. It's supposed to entertain. Don't let it get personal.
It doesn't matter who or how the Star Wars pack was requested. Some people wanted more Star Wars. The developers wanted Star Wars. I know people hate that and don't think the devs have a right to make content they themselves want, but the game is not a commission. None of the Sims games were. There were never any guarantees. Sims 4 is not Sims 2 or 3. It hasn't been for six years. I'll just reiterate that. Six. Years. It never will be, even if they add chemistry and free babies and cars and deeper traits and new emotions. It's a completely different game. It's time to get over it and stop with the passive aggressive shade to other players. It is Bias.
The most simple answer to your main question is that people in this fandom just love to complain in general. Everyone is a critic and a whiny baby in this fandom. They could have been given EVERYTHING they wanted before this pack and they would still complain about it. I try not to listen to the noise much.
We did and I'm sure you like TS3 Katy Perry Sweat Treats according to your argument A pack revolving an advertisement (the star wars game) that have hardly anthing in common with the Sims genre isn't gonna, ESPECIALLY when game play sucks, is superficial and not deep (refer to constructive comments and threads pertaining to this pack).
It's not being bias to say no one I know wanted this type pack. We operate in the world we live in. So, show me on this forum where anyone asked or said omg, Maxis, please make a SW pack about the new Disney theme park, and make sure it's story driven, and the aliens are Sims in costumes (if your Sim married one would they have an alien?) etc. etc. And then show me where it got a huge amount of support. Now, if you can't point out where those threads exists and or requests and or twitter feeds where thousands approved, liked, supported a request for JTB (A Disney park snafu) then it is only be biased on the other foot, hoping to rescuse Maxis from this debocale. Because we all know actually no one asked for this. Or we would see the links to where someone did. (The only place it may have appeared before developing was in a survey by a Sim fan, where it got less than 3K likes). To be fair I'll give everyone who is saying people are being biased for disliking it, time to find the thread on Reddit, FB, Twitter, Instagram, Youtube or where ever, begging Maxis to develop a SW pack with only three lots, fake aliens, story driven, fake backdrop game. One doesn't exist. What does exists are threads upon threads about cars, babies, farming etc. Everywhere. Where is this infamous thread where people were begging Maxis to build a SW pack? No where.
You know what I see, it's just like when EAxis, even though everyone was telling them what they wanted for the next iteration said nope, we are building a multiplayer...though there may have been only a handful at the time who would have wanted it, the rest of the Simmer world (no matter where they post) was saying no, but EAxis went ahead with Project Olympus, now known as TS4, the salvaged multiplayer. It's the same difference.
And another thing about it's nice to get new players, yes, for EAxis. I'm a single player how does getting new players help me play my game? Because you know what, if they listened to their core, they wouldn't need new players. They would have all the money they wanted or needed to keep producing, but greed won. It's not the pack or being entitled, it's the direction, they still string along their customer base, with little speeches of how they hear you. Well, after six years aren't we all tired of saying what we want improved, changed, fixed? Why did we even have to do that in the first place? That is the question. Why did anybody have to remind EAxis, no we don't want any thing but a life simulator.
Because no, it's not being entitled because we know their success was built on the backs of their fans, who gave them twenty years of suggestions and ways to improve the UI, the games, the packs or whatever. Those who have been around a very long time know some gameplay and UI improvements and or whatever, even new ideas, came from players who have been giving them feedback for years. Does anyone think Maxis came up with all that TS4 is right now, I have to laugh. Everything about Maxis in the first fifteen years was suggestions by fans. Not the in grand ideas of developers.
TS4 is a different story in some cases, but still all those improvements so many enjoy were suggestions by their long time fans.
ETA: Just look at what wasn't successful (money) for Maxis, the packs no one wanted (otherwise maybe a few).
The ideas and suggestions players made (huge numbers of fans) were well received. (Money)
But the packs they decided to do without any input from fans are a bust.
Katy Perry Sweet Treats is a good example, not even offered for years anymore. Failed.
Others they have had to bundle to get people to even try. Their ideas without any fan knowledge seem to fail.
You often make some really good points that I agree with, but oh dear, are you kidding me with this? Now you want "proof" that players asked for this exact pack? I'm sorry, but who are you to climb up on a throne to inspect and judge the requests of other Sims players? Did people request the exact content of Parenthood or did they just ask for Generations and more family play? I don't remember ever seeing a request for the exact Character Values system. Guess that pack is worthless trash that "nobody asked for", right? Or the club system that so many players use? Or the Calendar system in Seasons? I didn't see one request for that, yet I've seen a lot of people praise it. Sorry Cinebar, but you contradict yourself by saying it's the players' requests that make the game, yet you're moving the goal posts as you see fit so you can refuse to acknowledge the requests you don't like and dictate your own perception of what the game should be. And the thing is, that's not even altogether true. The players didn't develop the game, nor did they request or demand everything that came in past games. That's some far reaching. And if this game only followed the demands of the noisy, errantly perceived "majority", it would only replicate and never refresh and players would get bored. The game would cease to represent the progress or tropes of the modern world, or to try new and exciting things. To tell the truth, I think a lot of people just have a hard time with change in general.
The fact is, some people asked for more Star Wars content. Many didn't expect it because they knew it was unlikely or that there were players on these Forums who would throw a toddler level spam fit if something was made that didn't cater to their personal tastes or wasn't included in the checklists of previous iterations, so it wasn't pushed as aggressively. Many people have been asking for "something new and different", but there are some players who can't seem to live with the fact that other players might want something they don't...and actually get it. It's almost like a childish refusal to share. And I admit, I used to think that way too, but there comes a point when the truth is right there in your face and denying it only does more damage to the self. And in the end, it's just a game. it's a luxury, not a right. It's a choice. It's supposed to entertain. Don't let it get personal.
It doesn't matter who or how the Star Wars pack was requested. Some people wanted more Star Wars. The developers wanted Star Wars. I know people hate that and don't think the devs have a right to make content they themselves want, but the game is not a commission. None of the Sims games were. There were never any guarantees. Sims 4 is not Sims 2 or 3. It hasn't been for six years. I'll just reiterate that. Six. Years. It never will be, even if they add chemistry and free babies and cars and deeper traits and new emotions. It's a completely different game. It's time to get over it and stop with the passive aggressive shade to other players. It is Bias.
Careful @LiElf ..... you too are benefiting from the random placement of the goal post.... which in this reply of yours it seems to be placed comfortably for you as well.
There is a major different between asking for generational play and getting "Parenthood" EP, and asking for more Star Wars stuff and getting a "Star Wars" GP. And that major difference can be seen by crossover license limitations imposed on us by the Star Wars brand name.
If this was about a Star Wars stuff pack... I wouldn't waste my time complaining about it to this length. I'd mention my lack of interest in such stuff, and then move on. Which is exactly what I did for the Moschino SP.... which I still purchased. And if this was a Star Wars SP I would have already purchased it as well.
I don't mind having more content in my game... even if it's something I don't like currently. Because, who knows, I might find some gameplay use for it later.... maybe a year or two down the road. Stuff packs are great for this kind of thing. Even Katy Perry Sweet Treats was a SP.
The problem here is.... the Brand Names are now making it's way into other packs. I don't have much expectations about a stuff pack, but when it comes to a GP, I am guilty of having higher expectations. For example.... if we are given a new world in the GP.... loaded down with new BB items, then I certainly expect to be able to build on that new world.... especially, and I emphasize on the word "especially" ... if that new BB stuff is theme related and tailor made for the new world we got.
Could you imagine the confusion amongst us simmers if "Outdoor Retreat" was offered with a really great list of camping and vacation BB.... but we weren't able to use any of it on that new world? Lets share with everyone that starting next week we won't be able to use any of the BB content from ROM in Glimmerbrook and see how that works out.
Because of (likely) licensing the new world of Batuu is (probably) copyrighted, leaving us with no legal, or personal Right, or option whatsoever to change the new world in any way. This type of legal restrictions wasn't imposed onto us by the Parenthood EP.
What's annoying... is that EA/Maxis could have done the Star Wars world the same way as ROM. We could have been given a copyrighted world of legal restrictions called "Batuu" (unchangeable like the magic realm), and a galatic world leading into the world of Batuu (like Glimmerbrook) allowing us a place as well to build and live on. A place to use all that BB stuff in an area that would have complimented the entire pack and gameplay. There are so many things wrong with the design of this pack that it's difficult to decide where to start listing.
I understand that you like Star Wars, and I respect that you like the pack. To some degree I do as well. I'm not totally against you here. In fact, i'm actually trying to defend you as you are making some interesting points. But, unfortunately, I don't see you as offering the same compromise. Reading your posts on this thread you so far accused both @SimmerGeorge, and @Cinebar of moving the goal posts to fit their own bias.... when in fact, you are doing the exact same thing in your defending of a pack that you like. And that's fair enough... defend your interests. I'll even help you do that. But not to the point of alienating my interests in the process.
I'm not happy with branding affecting the Sims' franchise, and though I can choose to turn a blind eye to it when it's limited to stuff packs, having crossover licensing now affecting our Game Packs as well... i'm sorry, Star Wars or not.... i'm not happy about it.
-My number one reason I think it's a bad idea is because Sims 4 is currently a buggy mess, and as others have said each new release breaks more things. In my opinion development on new releases should be stalled for a bit while they fix all of the bugs and make the game work properly again. Yes this would mean little or no new content for a while, but all things considered new players buying some of Sims 4's older packs are buying a broken product, which I feel at least by my countries laws of consumer protection would be pretty illegal.
-Looking at the reviews there seems to be a lot of rabbit holes, I know it's just a game pack but Jungle Adventure didn't have this many rabbit holes. I've also heard it already is causing issues for Sims who want to take Occults with them to Baatu (for example they have all their abilities removed which means vampires can't eat, but you can't bring plasma packs with you to fix this because none of your personal inventory comes with you to Baatu)
-The aliens are just costumes, I mean sure they said that wearing those costumes changes how they're treated but why not just make a star wars alien life state where you can pick many different types of aliens to play as?
-Personal cars have usually been an expansion item which makes me feel justified in complaining that we got this pack before we got a pack that included cars. When Sims 4 released the immediate backlash was; where are the pools? where are the toddlers? where are the cars? Well we've got pools and toddlers now but still no cars? I do realise that they'll need to make a significant overhaul to the entire game and all it's expansions to do cars properly at this point but my main gripe is that they should have knuckled down and got it done years ago because they've created more work for themselves with every expansion they've released. Also before anyone says that Sims 4 is not open world and therefore does not need cars; sims 2 wasn't open world either and had cars. Sims 1 also at least had car pooling. And thinking about it cars would have been a perfect addition to the Eco Living EP because they could have had both electric and fuel powered cars.
-While the poll that showed that Star Wars was not a desired pack was not an EA released poll, and also likely this was already under development. I do think that EA/The Sims team probably should have figured this wasn't going to be a popular move. There's plenty of activity in the speculations and rumour/ideas area of this forum that would give them some direction as to what the consumers want and I don't see a lot of Star Wars getting mentioned there. I know some people say "well they don't have to cater to us, it's their game not ours." but that doesn't show a very good understanding of business practices. Yes it's their game to develop but what use is there selling a product that doesn't appeal to your consumers? Not just that but it also causes you to lose the faith of your consumer base? It just isn't a very good move business wise unless whoever paid them to make this pack (Disney) gave them a good deal of money to offset the losses this pack would cause. But again that's not good because it's a very short term gain for a long term loss.
This isn't one of my points so I'm not dot pointing it but also I dislike the whole "don't like it don't buy it attitude", yeah of course don't buy it if you're absolutely sure you're going to hate it (duh) but people seem to forget that as consumers we can complain and give feedback? Yes some people do need to remember to do so constructively and to think out their argument a bit better but it's very very important that we voice our opinions on the product we're being sold even if they're negative ones.
Anyway I could go on about how the Sims 4 is devoid of life and etc but that would make this a very long bit of feedback. I think I've said enough.
It's not being bias to say no one I know wanted this type pack. We operate in the world we live in. So, show me on this forum where anyone asked or said omg, Maxis, please make a SW pack about the new Disney theme park, and make sure it's story driven, and the aliens are Sims in costumes (if your Sim married one would they have an alien?) etc. etc. And then show me where it got a huge amount of support. Now, if you can't point out where those threads exists and or requests and or twitter feeds where thousands approved, liked, supported a request for JTB (A Disney park snafu) then it is only be biased on the other foot, hoping to rescuse Maxis from this debocale. Because we all know actually no one asked for this. Or we would see the links to where someone did. (The only place it may have appeared before developing was in a survey by a Sim fan, where it got less than 3K likes). To be fair I'll give everyone who is saying people are being biased for disliking it, time to find the thread on Reddit, FB, Twitter, Instagram, Youtube or where ever, begging Maxis to develop a SW pack with only three lots, fake aliens, story driven, fake backdrop game. One doesn't exist. What does exists are threads upon threads about cars, babies, farming etc. Everywhere. Where is this infamous thread where people were begging Maxis to build a SW pack? No where.
You know what I see, it's just like when EAxis, even though everyone was telling them what they wanted for the next iteration said nope, we are building a multiplayer...though there may have been only a handful at the time who would have wanted it, the rest of the Simmer world (no matter where they post) was saying no, but EAxis went ahead with Project Olympus, now known as TS4, the salvaged multiplayer. It's the same difference.
And another thing about it's nice to get new players, yes, for EAxis. I'm a single player how does getting new players help me play my game? Because you know what, if they listened to their core, they wouldn't need new players. They would have all the money they wanted or needed to keep producing, but greed won. It's not the pack or being entitled, it's the direction, they still string along their customer base, with little speeches of how they hear you. Well, after six years aren't we all tired of saying what we want improved, changed, fixed? Why did we even have to do that in the first place? That is the question. Why did anybody have to remind EAxis, no we don't want any thing but a life simulator.
Because no, it's not being entitled because we know their success was built on the backs of their fans, who gave them twenty years of suggestions and ways to improve the UI, the games, the packs or whatever. Those who have been around a very long time know some gameplay and UI improvements and or whatever, even new ideas, came from players who have been giving them feedback for years. Does anyone think Maxis came up with all that TS4 is right now, I have to laugh. Everything about Maxis in the first fifteen years was suggestions by fans. Not the in grand ideas of developers.
TS4 is a different story in some cases, but still all those improvements so many enjoy were suggestions by their long time fans.
ETA: Just look at what wasn't successful (money) for Maxis, the packs no one wanted (otherwise maybe a few).
The ideas and suggestions players made (huge numbers of fans) were well received. (Money)
But the packs they decided to do without any input from fans are a bust.
Katy Perry Sweet Treats is a good example, not even offered for years anymore. Failed.
Others they have had to bundle to get people to even try. Their ideas without any fan knowledge seem to fail.
You often make some really good points that I agree with, but oh dear, are you kidding me with this? Now you want "proof" that players asked for this exact pack? I'm sorry, but who are you to climb up on a throne to inspect and judge the requests of other Sims players? Did people request the exact content of Parenthood or did they just ask for Generations and more family play? I don't remember ever seeing a request for the exact Character Values system. Guess that pack is worthless trash that "nobody asked for", right? Or the club system that so many players use? Or the Calendar system in Seasons? I didn't see one request for that, yet I've seen a lot of people praise it. Sorry Cinebar, but you contradict yourself by saying it's the players' requests that make the game, yet you're moving the goal posts as you see fit so you can refuse to acknowledge the requests you don't like and dictate your own perception of what the game should be. And the thing is, that's not even altogether true. The players didn't develop the game, nor did they request or demand everything that came in past games. That's some far reaching. And if this game only followed the demands of the noisy, errantly perceived "majority", it would only replicate and never refresh and players would get bored. The game would cease to represent the progress or tropes of the modern world, or to try new and exciting things. To tell the truth, I think a lot of people just have a hard time with change in general.
The fact is, some people asked for more Star Wars content. Many didn't expect it because they knew it was unlikely or that there were players on these Forums who would throw a toddler level spam fit if something was made that didn't cater to their personal tastes or wasn't included in the checklists of previous iterations, so it wasn't pushed as aggressively. Many people have been asking for "something new and different", but there are some players who can't seem to live with the fact that other players might want something they don't...and actually get it. It's almost like a childish refusal to share. And I admit, I used to think that way too, but there comes a point when the truth is right there in your face and denying it only does more damage to the self. And in the end, it's just a game. it's a luxury, not a right. It's a choice. It's supposed to entertain. Don't let it get personal.
It doesn't matter who or how the Star Wars pack was requested. Some people wanted more Star Wars. The developers wanted Star Wars. I know people hate that and don't think the devs have a right to make content they themselves want, but the game is not a commission. None of the Sims games were. There were never any guarantees. Sims 4 is not Sims 2 or 3. It hasn't been for six years. I'll just reiterate that. Six. Years. It never will be, even if they add chemistry and free babies and cars and deeper traits and new emotions. It's a completely different game. It's time to get over it and stop with the passive aggressive shade to other players. It is Bias.
Careful @LiElf ..... you too are benefiting from the random placement of the goal post.... which in this reply of yours it seems to be placed comfortably for you as well.
There is a major different between asking for generational play and getting "Parenthood" EP, and asking for more Star Wars stuff and getting a "Star Wars" GP. And that major difference can be seen by crossover license limitations imposed on us by the Star Wars brand name.
If this was about a Star Wars stuff pack... I wouldn't waste my time complaining about it to this length. I'd mention my lack of interest in such stuff, and then move on. Which is exactly what I did for the Moschino SP.... which I still purchased. And if this was a Star Wars SP I would have already purchased it as well.
I don't mind having more content in my game... even if it's something I don't like currently. Because, who knows, I might find some gameplay use for it later.... maybe a year or two down the road. Stuff packs are great for this kind of thing. Even Katy Perry Sweet Treats was a SP.
The problem here is.... the Brand Names are now making it's way into other packs. I don't have much expectations about a stuff pack, but when it comes to a GP, I am guilty of having higher expectations. For example.... if we are given a new world in the GP.... loaded down with new BB items, then I certainly expect to be able to build on that new world.... especially, and I emphasize on the word "especially" ... if that new BB stuff is theme related and tailor made for the new world we got.
Could you imagine the confusion amongst us simmers if "Outdoor Retreat" was offered with a really great list of camping and vacation BB.... but we weren't able to use any of it on that new world? Lets share with everyone that starting next week we won't be able to use any of the BB content from ROM in Glimmerbrook and see how that works out.
Because of (likely) licensing the new world of Batuu is (probably) copyrighted, leaving us with no legal, or personal Right, or option whatsoever to change the new world in any way. This type of legal restrictions wasn't imposed onto us by the Parenthood EP.
What's annoying... is that EA/Maxis could have done the Star Wars world the same way as ROM. We could have been given a copyrighted world of legal restrictions called "Batuu" (unchangeable like the magic realm), and a galatic world leading into the world of Batuu (like Glimmerbrook) allowing us a place as well to build and live on. A place to use all that BB stuff in an area that would have complimented the entire pack and gameplay. There are so many things wrong with the design of this pack that it's difficult to decide where to start listing.
I understand that you like Star Wars, and I respect that you like the pack. To some degree I do as well. I'm not totally against you here. In fact, i'm actually trying to defend you as you are making some interesting points. But, unfortunately, I don't see you as offering the same compromise. Reading your posts on this thread you so far accused both @SimmerGeorge, and @Cinebar of moving the goal posts to fit their own bias.... when in fact, you are doing the exact same thing in your defending of a pack that you like. And that's fair enough... defend your interests. I'll even help you do that. But not to the point of alienating my interests in the process.
I'm not happy with branding affecting the Sims' franchise, and though I can choose to turn a blind eye to it when it's limited to stuff packs, having crossover licensing now affecting our Game Packs as well... i'm sorry, Star Wars or not.... i'm not happy about it.
Okay, first, I'm sorry, this is wicked long and I didn't intend it to be.
I'm not really sure how I've moved the goal posts, so if you want to be more specific, I'm willing to listen. (Not sarcasm, being genuine.)
You did bring up my comparison of Parenthood to a Generations request, so that's fair. The point I was trying to make with that though, is that she was trying to prove that "nobody asked" for the pack, just because no one detailed it down to the last character. And players make general requests all the time. Like just saying, "family play", or "more build stuff", or "I want something new and different". But it's common for players to not go into minute details of what they want. So it was unreasonable, I felt, for her to go on about "show me the thread to prove someone asked for this", but with all of these extra conditions attached, when I'm quite sure she's aware that players don't blueprint or map out every request. Sometimes we don't even know what it is we want ourselves. Sometimes we just throw something out there, hoping someone on the dev team catches it.
I can tell you from my own perspective that I wanted more Star Wars themes in the game. I asked for more outfits, and I had some discussions here and there with others who dared to admit to wanting it as well. I'm pretty sure I remember a player mentioning wanting a full Star Wars pack at some point, but I can tell you that I never ever truly thought they'd do one. If I had, I'd have seriously asked for it, and more than likely would have made a lot of suggestions.
But as for brands themselves, I've seen brand requests from players as well. Things like the return of H&M or Ikea, or Harry Potter or Marvel and DC. And I've noticed that some people will argue that one brand "belongs" in Sims more than another, maybe because some are more "dollhouse" or maybe because we've had some of those brands in games in the past? But who's really to say which one "belongs", if any? The Sims has been branching out with each iteration, growing the game and its potential for a variety of simulations and gameplay and themes. Maybe some people would love to be able to simulate the world of Harry Potter or Tolkien or the Marvel Universe and connect it to their main game so they can use the things they like and send some of their own existing Sims on an adventure.
And I think that's also one of the things people are having an issue with, the "adventure" simulations. I can't help but notice that we, of the older player base, don't like change. Many of us have past games that we love, and want to see a continuation. Understandable. But we've also known from the beginning that Sims 4 was different. And as it has bumped and bruised its way through the years, it has become more and more apparent that The Sims just can't, it just won't, be what it used to be. Not in this iteration. But it can be its own thing. It can have its own purpose and its own unique form of entertainment. But to do that, it has to be allowed to be what it is and to test its own boundaries because in essence, it's kind of a new thing.
I get some people not wanting brands in the game at all, so if you feel that way I can respect that. I didn't think I wanted them either until the survey came out last year and I really thought about it more and realized that a lot of my passions are also "brands", like Star Wars. I've also had to realize that the way I play and enjoy Sims 4 is very different from when I played TS2. When I try to play the way I used to, I get bored. But when I throw my expectations away and keep an open mind and let the pack show me what it wants to do, I find myself having a really good time. (And it's usually the GPs.) So I've been making a conscious effort to try to put my own past game version biases aside and approach the game with different eyes. I know a lot of people don't want to do this, they want to dig in their heels and demand a return to previous game mechanics. But that's just not realistic. Maybe with Sims 5 one day, who knows. By then, the newer players will probably want something different anyway because they'll already have Sims 4 and the company isn't going to want to copy/paste the Sims 4 experience all over again. So there is some hope for that.
And regarding biases, we all have them. Every player. That's what I was trying to point out, I wasn't excluding myself, though I did attempt an objective comparison of the different types of gameplay between GPs, trying to show that the community is not united in an opinion of what "good" gameplay is, thereby exemplifying that a variety of gameplay styles is needed, depending on what is being produced. But when someone tries to manipulate other players into a boycott against their own game enjoyment by using the "bigger picture" argument, it's selfish.
I'll be honest in saying that there certainly are things in the Star Wars pack that I would have preferred done differently. I have always hated rabbit hole venues, and I've noticed more of them showing up in the packs since last year. I would normally rather deal with loading screens, honestly. And I think we should have had Force users and yes, it would have been nice to have a few more lots that can be changed. But like I said above, I've been trying to open my mind a bit more and stop fighting the game to play it the way I used to. So when I sat down to play this Star Wars pack, I could see the vision the developers had with it. True, I could also see where the budget or time fell short, but that quickly got overshadowed by the smoothness of the execution. Where I expected some of the standard invasive TS4 gameplay disruptions like "grab water", changing clothes to swim or for weather, freezing or too hot, badly dressed townies, the Landgraabs showing up and breaking immersion, Vampires walking around with umbrellas, etc, etc,...they were all miraculously absent, which is astounding. I am truly able to actually immerse in the moment without those frustrating interruptions and it is glorious. I never knew this game could be capable of such smooth gameplay.
Now, would I want a repeat of this gameplay structure? I honestly don't know anymore. Last month I would have probably said no. But my enjoyment doesn't lie. I think that as far as GPs are concerned, I'm okay with the experiments, as long as the EPs still remain a more neutral overall theme and adhere as much as they can to "tradition" and majority player requests with new lots and standard gameplay. And that's pretty much what they've been doing all along for the most part anyway so I guess I'm good with it for now. But I do hope the upcoming EP contains some big ticket content for those who felt left out this time around. I won't even complain if I don't like it, since everyone had to suffer through Star Wars.
I wonder if some people even read the discussions on this forum and take other people’s posts into consideration.
I guess not, because how else do we always end up with “NOBODY ASKED FOR THIS”.
At this stage I have no butt left from laughing, which is a pity, because it looked good on me.
Maybe you would like to be the first one to post the link showing clearly that someone did ask for this. Until then I have no choice but wonder which discussion on this forum we should be taking into consideration.
An official Sims survey was sent out to the players a good while back. It included an open question asking folks to enter what kind of branded content they would like to see in future packs. Star Wars was one of them.
I’m basing this knowledge on posts around the forum of people who were willing to share what they’ve entered.
I’m basing this on my own answer to that question. I asked for Star Wars.
Can I provide you with the results of the survey? No. Do I care to find all those discussions where people say they entered Star Wars? No. They’re out there in the many JtB related threads. Have a read through them. Or you can simply choose to believe me or not.
That Nobody asked for Star Wars is simply not true.
Some folks asked for it.
I wonder if some people even read the discussions on this forum and take other people’s posts into consideration.
I guess not, because how else do we always end up with “NOBODY ASKED FOR THIS”.
At this stage I have no butt left from laughing, which is a pity, because it looked good on me.
Maybe you would like to be the first one to post the link showing clearly that someone did ask for this. Until then I have no choice but wonder which discussion on this forum we should be taking into consideration.
An official Sims survey was sent out to the players a good while back. It included an open question asking folks to enter what kind of branded content they would like to see in future packs. Star Wars was one of them.
I’m basing this knowledge on posts around the forum of people who were willing to share what they’ve entered.
I’m basing this on my own answer to that question. I asked for Star Wars.
Can I provide you with the results of the survey? No. Do I care to find all those discussions where people say they entered Star Wars? No. They’re out there in the many JtB related threads. Have a read through them. Or you can simply choose to believe me or not.
That Nobody asked for Star Wars is simply not true.
Some folks asked for it.
The point I was hoping to make was.....
Suggesting that I, or someone else is wrong, while not taking the time to back up your accusation with at least 1 piece of evidence.... is a conversation that I have a difficult time taking serious.
You say that people are wrong in their claim that "nobody asked for this". Then suggest that "they" can run around doing the leg work proving that "you" are right in your accusation against them... well... with all due respect.... do it yourself.
If you want to accuse me of being wrong.... fair enough... do that. But you will be bringing "me" the evidence of that.... not the other way around.
I wonder if some people even read the discussions on this forum and take other people’s posts into consideration.
I guess not, because how else do we always end up with “NOBODY ASKED FOR THIS”.
At this stage I have no butt left from laughing, which is a pity, because it looked good on me.
Maybe you would like to be the first one to post the link showing clearly that someone did ask for this. Until then I have no choice but wonder which discussion on this forum we should be taking into consideration.
An official Sims survey was sent out to the players a good while back. It included an open question asking folks to enter what kind of branded content they would like to see in future packs. Star Wars was one of them.
I’m basing this knowledge on posts around the forum of people who were willing to share what they’ve entered.
I’m basing this on my own answer to that question. I asked for Star Wars.
Can I provide you with the results of the survey? No. Do I care to find all those discussions where people say they entered Star Wars? No. They’re out there in the many JtB related threads. Have a read through them. Or you can simply choose to believe me or not.
That Nobody asked for Star Wars is simply not true.
Some folks asked for it.
The point I was hoping to make was.....
Suggesting that I, or someone else is wrong, while not taking the time to back up your accusation with at least 1 piece of evidence.... is a conversation that I have a difficult time taking serious.
You say that people are wrong in their claim that "nobody asked for this". Then suggest that "they" can run around doing the leg work proving that "you" are right in your accusation against them... well... with all due respect.... do it yourself.
If you want to accuse me of being wrong.... fair enough... do that. But you will be bringing "me" the evidence of that.... not the other way around.
The evidence is in the people around you telling you they asked for it. It doesn't get more direct than that.
I wonder if some people even read the discussions on this forum and take other people’s posts into consideration.
I guess not, because how else do we always end up with “NOBODY ASKED FOR THIS”.
At this stage I have no butt left from laughing, which is a pity, because it looked good on me.
Maybe you would like to be the first one to post the link showing clearly that someone did ask for this. Until then I have no choice but wonder which discussion on this forum we should be taking into consideration.
An official Sims survey was sent out to the players a good while back. It included an open question asking folks to enter what kind of branded content they would like to see in future packs. Star Wars was one of them.
I’m basing this knowledge on posts around the forum of people who were willing to share what they’ve entered.
I’m basing this on my own answer to that question. I asked for Star Wars.
Can I provide you with the results of the survey? No. Do I care to find all those discussions where people say they entered Star Wars? No. They’re out there in the many JtB related threads. Have a read through them. Or you can simply choose to believe me or not.
That Nobody asked for Star Wars is simply not true.
Some folks asked for it.
The point I was hoping to make was.....
Suggesting that I, or someone else is wrong, while not taking the time to back up your accusation with at least 1 piece of evidence.... is a conversation that I have a difficult time taking serious.
You say that people are wrong in their claim that "nobody asked for this". Then suggest that "they" can run around doing the leg work proving that "you" are right in your accusation against them... well... with all due respect.... do it yourself.
If you want to accuse me of being wrong.... fair enough... do that. But you will be bringing "me" the evidence of that.... not the other way around.
The evidence is in the people around you telling you they asked for it. It doesn't get more direct than that.
What i'm accepting, is that people asked for more Star Wars stuff. Though I didn't see the posts directly asking for this stuff I do believe that it may have happened. So i'm not going to question that part of it.
What I don't see evidence of... is the request for Star Wars "branding"... and for it to completely consume a GP. I'm not referring to Star Wars stuff... i'm referring to the branding itself ... that imposed onto us a lot of restrictions.
ETA: I would have been great with a stuff pack full of Star Wars stuff. The community probably would have been less toxic about it as well.
I wonder if some people even read the discussions on this forum and take other people’s posts into consideration.
I guess not, because how else do we always end up with “NOBODY ASKED FOR THIS”.
At this stage I have no butt left from laughing, which is a pity, because it looked good on me.
Maybe you would like to be the first one to post the link showing clearly that someone did ask for this. Until then I have no choice but wonder which discussion on this forum we should be taking into consideration.
An official Sims survey was sent out to the players a good while back. It included an open question asking folks to enter what kind of branded content they would like to see in future packs. Star Wars was one of them.
I’m basing this knowledge on posts around the forum of people who were willing to share what they’ve entered.
I’m basing this on my own answer to that question. I asked for Star Wars.
Can I provide you with the results of the survey? No. Do I care to find all those discussions where people say they entered Star Wars? No. They’re out there in the many JtB related threads. Have a read through them. Or you can simply choose to believe me or not.
That Nobody asked for Star Wars is simply not true.
Some folks asked for it.
The point I was hoping to make was.....
Suggesting that I, or someone else is wrong, while not taking the time to back up your accusation with at least 1 piece of evidence.... is a conversation that I have a difficult time taking serious.
You say that people are wrong in their claim that "nobody asked for this". Then suggest that "they" can run around doing the leg work proving that "you" are right in your accusation against them... well... with all due respect.... do it yourself.
If you want to accuse me of being wrong.... fair enough... do that. But you will be bringing "me" the evidence of that.... not the other way around.
The evidence is in the people around you telling you they asked for it. It doesn't get more direct than that.
What i'm accepting, is that people asked for more Star Wars stuff. Though I didn't see the posts directly asking for this stuff I do believe that it may have happened. So i'm not going to question that part of it.
What I don't see evidence of... is the request for Star Wars "branding"... and for it to completely consume a GP. I'm not referring to Star Wars stuff... i'm referring to the branding itself ... that imposed onto us a lot of restrictions.
ETA: I would have been great with a stuff pack full of Star Wars stuff. The community probably would have been less toxic about it as well.
Isn't asking for more Star Wars also asking for the Star Wars "brand"? The entire saga and anything affiliated is part of the brand. So if someone just wants more Star Wars, as much as the devs are willing to give, then it's the same as asking for the Star Wars brand, yes?
I wonder if some people even read the discussions on this forum and take other people’s posts into consideration.
I guess not, because how else do we always end up with “NOBODY ASKED FOR THIS”.
At this stage I have no butt left from laughing, which is a pity, because it looked good on me.
Maybe you would like to be the first one to post the link showing clearly that someone did ask for this. Until then I have no choice but wonder which discussion on this forum we should be taking into consideration.
An official Sims survey was sent out to the players a good while back. It included an open question asking folks to enter what kind of branded content they would like to see in future packs. Star Wars was one of them.
I’m basing this knowledge on posts around the forum of people who were willing to share what they’ve entered.
I’m basing this on my own answer to that question. I asked for Star Wars.
Can I provide you with the results of the survey? No. Do I care to find all those discussions where people say they entered Star Wars? No. They’re out there in the many JtB related threads. Have a read through them. Or you can simply choose to believe me or not.
That Nobody asked for Star Wars is simply not true.
Some folks asked for it.
The point I was hoping to make was.....
Suggesting that I, or someone else is wrong, while not taking the time to back up your accusation with at least 1 piece of evidence.... is a conversation that I have a difficult time taking serious.
You say that people are wrong in their claim that "nobody asked for this". Then suggest that "they" can run around doing the leg work proving that "you" are right in your accusation against them... well... with all due respect.... do it yourself.
If you want to accuse me of being wrong.... fair enough... do that. But you will be bringing "me" the evidence of that.... not the other way around.
The evidence is in the people around you telling you they asked for it. It doesn't get more direct than that.
What i'm accepting, is that people asked for more Star Wars stuff. Though I didn't see the posts directly asking for this stuff I do believe that it may have happened. So i'm not going to question that part of it.
What I don't see evidence of... is the request for Star Wars "branding"... and for it to completely consume a GP. I'm not referring to Star Wars stuff... i'm referring to the branding itself ... that imposed onto us a lot of restrictions.
ETA: I would have been great with a stuff pack full of Star Wars stuff. The community probably would have been less toxic about it as well.
Isn't asking for more Star Wars also asking for the Star Wars "brand"? The entire saga and anything affiliated is part of the brand. So if someone just wants more Star Wars, as much as the devs are willing to give, then it's the same as asking for the Star Wars brand, yes?
If you're referring to the storm trooper outfit shipped with the base game as branding.... then yes. I agree. If offering us some more of these type of outfits in a stuff pack is branding, than again, yes. I agree. And as I already explained.... if this was a stuff pack like the previous branding addons...... I for one wouldn't be here contesting to this degree.
You are getting into specifics that I will quickly agree with.... simply because technically you are correct on at least some of these points.
However, not everyone has gone to business school, and not everyone is going to automatically think of the legal aspects of branding, or the idea of it in general with their random post of..... I wish we had more Star Wars stuff.
Then when the Star Wars GP comes out as it did.... its possible that some of the very people who may have even requested Star Wars stuff... will claim they never asked for this.... because to them... they didn't connect the dots with asking for a few added outfits.... with the legalities of branding.
Its the ole' social political argument of ... "What did they know at the time of ....."
I wonder if some people even read the discussions on this forum and take other people’s posts into consideration.
I guess not, because how else do we always end up with “NOBODY ASKED FOR THIS”.
At this stage I have no butt left from laughing, which is a pity, because it looked good on me.
Maybe you would like to be the first one to post the link showing clearly that someone did ask for this. Until then I have no choice but wonder which discussion on this forum we should be taking into consideration.
An official Sims survey was sent out to the players a good while back. It included an open question asking folks to enter what kind of branded content they would like to see in future packs. Star Wars was one of them.
I’m basing this knowledge on posts around the forum of people who were willing to share what they’ve entered.
I’m basing this on my own answer to that question. I asked for Star Wars.
Can I provide you with the results of the survey? No. Do I care to find all those discussions where people say they entered Star Wars? No. They’re out there in the many JtB related threads. Have a read through them. Or you can simply choose to believe me or not.
That Nobody asked for Star Wars is simply not true.
Some folks asked for it.
The point I was hoping to make was.....
Suggesting that I, or someone else is wrong, while not taking the time to back up your accusation with at least 1 piece of evidence.... is a conversation that I have a difficult time taking serious.
You say that people are wrong in their claim that "nobody asked for this". Then suggest that "they" can run around doing the leg work proving that "you" are right in your accusation against them... well... with all due respect.... do it yourself.
If you want to accuse me of being wrong.... fair enough... do that. But you will be bringing "me" the evidence of that.... not the other way around.
I wonder if some people even read the discussions on this forum and take other people’s posts into consideration.
I guess not, because how else do we always end up with “NOBODY ASKED FOR THIS”.
At this stage I have no butt left from laughing, which is a pity, because it looked good on me.
Maybe you would like to be the first one to post the link showing clearly that someone did ask for this. Until then I have no choice but wonder which discussion on this forum we should be taking into consideration.
An official Sims survey was sent out to the players a good while back. It included an open question asking folks to enter what kind of branded content they would like to see in future packs. Star Wars was one of them.
I’m basing this knowledge on posts around the forum of people who were willing to share what they’ve entered.
I’m basing this on my own answer to that question. I asked for Star Wars.
Can I provide you with the results of the survey? No. Do I care to find all those discussions where people say they entered Star Wars? No. They’re out there in the many JtB related threads. Have a read through them. Or you can simply choose to believe me or not.
That Nobody asked for Star Wars is simply not true.
Some folks asked for it.
The point I was hoping to make was.....
Suggesting that I, or someone else is wrong, while not taking the time to back up your accusation with at least 1 piece of evidence.... is a conversation that I have a difficult time taking serious.
You say that people are wrong in their claim that "nobody asked for this". Then suggest that "they" can run around doing the leg work proving that "you" are right in your accusation against them... well... with all due respect.... do it yourself.
If you want to accuse me of being wrong.... fair enough... do that. But you will be bringing "me" the evidence of that.... not the other way around.
Seeing this.... I can remember that conversation very well. And.... just to say... thanks for posting the link. Much respect for that.
I will point out though... that this conversation is dated around, and including, September 2 (of this year), which (for some of it) is "after" the offical EA post sharing news about the upcoming GP of Star Wars on September 1.
There is a refrence to requesting Star Wars stuff posted on September 1.
@LiElf (page 1)
I feel like all the times on these Forums that I tried to say I wanted more Star Wars content, even if it was just a few more costumes, my request just got buried in an ocean of cries for babies and bunk beds, lol.
Last post on page 4... Asked by @Cynna
Has EA/Maxis ever included a Star Wars theme in any of there their surveys? Admittedly, I've taken a few of them, but not all. Has anything even close to a Star Wars theme been put up for consideration in the past?
Replies on page 5 by: @Mareah
I think the closest was them asking what brands would you want to see them collaborate with. Some people say they wrote down star wars and/or disney. I have no idea how long ago did that survey get puplished tho. Maybe they were working on this pack way before that.
@CAPTAIN_NXR7
There was an open question in one of the surveys regarding which brand folks would like to see in the sims. Apparently that's where some would have filled in Star Wars. Possibly me included.
@j1z1
Oh yeah, I remember that. I think I did too. Sorreh
Oh, for the record lol... i've have never claimed that "nobody asked for this". I questioned the lack of evidence to the contrary... but as for the claim itself. Nope.... never said it.
@muzickmage
I feel like a true scoundrel for somehow getting you to do all the work and provide the details of the evidence. JtB has a terrible influence on me!
I do respect and appreciate you posting this though. These are the conversations I meant.
I remember more discussions where others claimed to have asked for SW or Disney way back in the speculation threads. Unfortunately my post history doesn’t even allow me to go back that far. It’s also incredibly hard to track down these discussions through the search bar since it only gives me options to pick from the most recent topics. Forgetting the titles of these threads doesn’t make it any easier.
At least the evidence that we do have teaches us that the claim ‘Nobody asked for this’ is indeed incorrect. And that was all I was trying to say.
The issue for me is that they did not fuse SW and the sims together so that you may integrate it into everyday or even occult gameplay. They seem like two separate things, which seems pointless and this could’ve been made a spin off game. Your sim does not have an option to devote their life to being a jedi as a career or even get to live in the world, it’s literally based on the disney theme park. It was designed lovely, but it holds little substance from what I’ve seen in videos.
The build/buy mode items hold no place in any world either (unless I decided to demolish all builds in strangerville and make my own post-apocalyptic world from scratch, which is way too much effort to make a GP work).
I don't really understand people complaining that the build/buy does not fit anywhere else since it is themed. Do people not use the magic items anywhere else because they are themed? What about the GTW stuff that is themed to fit around hospitals, labs and a police station?
There are a few decor pieces for stormtrooper helmet storage etc which I can understand people not wanting to use elsewhere, but the rest of it seems fine... well, to me, anyway *shrugs*
I don't really understand people complaining that the build/buy does not fit anywhere else since it is themed. Do people not use the magic items anywhere else because they are themed? What about the GTW stuff that is themed to fit around hospitals, labs and a police station?
There are a few decor pieces for stormtrooper helmet storage etc which I can understand people not wanting to use elsewhere, but the rest of it seems fine... well, to me, anyway *shrugs*
You're absolutely right. The majority of people decide to 'hate' the pack out of principle, however, a true builder who loves Sci-Fi would want to snatch this one up without hesitation. You don't even have to travel to Batuu to get pleasure out of this DLC. There is so much scope for these items. There is nothing that screams 'Star Wars' about most of them. That entire modular curved bar is worth a tenner! (Well that's just me getting excited.)
I totally understand people may not want to spend $20 on a collection of Sci-Fi objects, but I can imagine a lot of them getting it on sale once they see the incredible builds that will be shared on the gallery.
Building is also gameplay.
Builders are also simmers.
Comments
https://mobile.twitter.com/SimGuruRomeo/status/1301904548450111491
Ok, I had already seen about those. I thought there was something new but thank you anyway!
You often make some really good points that I agree with, but oh dear, are you kidding me with this? Now you want "proof" that players asked for this exact pack? I'm sorry, but who are you to climb up on a throne to inspect and judge the requests of other Sims players? Did people request the exact content of Parenthood or did they just ask for Generations and more family play? I don't remember ever seeing a request for the exact Character Values system. Guess that pack is worthless trash that "nobody asked for", right? Or the club system that so many players use? Or the Calendar system in Seasons? I didn't see one request for that, yet I've seen a lot of people praise it. Sorry Cinebar, but you contradict yourself by saying it's the players' requests that make the game, yet you're moving the goal posts as you see fit so you can refuse to acknowledge the requests you don't like and dictate your own perception of what the game should be. And the thing is, that's not even altogether true. The players didn't develop the game, nor did they request or demand everything that came in past games. That's some far reaching. And if this game only followed the demands of the noisy, errantly perceived "majority", it would only replicate and never refresh and players would get bored. The game would cease to represent the progress or tropes of the modern world, or to try new and exciting things. To tell the truth, I think a lot of people just have a hard time with change in general.
The fact is, some people asked for more Star Wars content. Many didn't expect it because they knew it was unlikely or that there were players on these Forums who would throw a toddler level spam fit if something was made that didn't cater to their personal tastes or wasn't included in the checklists of previous iterations, so it wasn't pushed as aggressively. Many people have been asking for "something new and different", but there are some players who can't seem to live with the fact that other players might want something they don't...and actually get it. It's almost like a childish refusal to share. And I admit, I used to think that way too, but there comes a point when the truth is right there in your face and denying it only does more damage to the self. And in the end, it's just a game. it's a luxury, not a right. It's a choice. It's supposed to entertain. Don't let it get personal.
It doesn't matter who or how the Star Wars pack was requested. Some people wanted more Star Wars. The developers wanted Star Wars. I know people hate that and don't think the devs have a right to make content they themselves want, but the game is not a commission. None of the Sims games were. There were never any guarantees. Sims 4 is not Sims 2 or 3. It hasn't been for six years. I'll just reiterate that. Six. Years. It never will be, even if they add chemistry and free babies and cars and deeper traits and new emotions. It's a completely different game. It's time to get over it and stop with the passive aggressive shade to other players. It is Bias.
Careful @LiElf ..... you too are benefiting from the random placement of the goal post.... which in this reply of yours it seems to be placed comfortably for you as well.
There is a major different between asking for generational play and getting "Parenthood" EP, and asking for more Star Wars stuff and getting a "Star Wars" GP. And that major difference can be seen by crossover license limitations imposed on us by the Star Wars brand name.
If this was about a Star Wars stuff pack... I wouldn't waste my time complaining about it to this length. I'd mention my lack of interest in such stuff, and then move on. Which is exactly what I did for the Moschino SP.... which I still purchased. And if this was a Star Wars SP I would have already purchased it as well.
I don't mind having more content in my game... even if it's something I don't like currently. Because, who knows, I might find some gameplay use for it later.... maybe a year or two down the road. Stuff packs are great for this kind of thing. Even Katy Perry Sweet Treats was a SP.
The problem here is.... the Brand Names are now making it's way into other packs. I don't have much expectations about a stuff pack, but when it comes to a GP, I am guilty of having higher expectations. For example.... if we are given a new world in the GP.... loaded down with new BB items, then I certainly expect to be able to build on that new world.... especially, and I emphasize on the word "especially" ... if that new BB stuff is theme related and tailor made for the new world we got.
Could you imagine the confusion amongst us simmers if "Outdoor Retreat" was offered with a really great list of camping and vacation BB.... but we weren't able to use any of it on that new world? Lets share with everyone that starting next week we won't be able to use any of the BB content from ROM in Glimmerbrook and see how that works out.
Because of (likely) licensing the new world of Batuu is (probably) copyrighted, leaving us with no legal, or personal Right, or option whatsoever to change the new world in any way. This type of legal restrictions wasn't imposed onto us by the Parenthood EP.
What's annoying... is that EA/Maxis could have done the Star Wars world the same way as ROM. We could have been given a copyrighted world of legal restrictions called "Batuu" (unchangeable like the magic realm), and a galatic world leading into the world of Batuu (like Glimmerbrook) allowing us a place as well to build and live on. A place to use all that BB stuff in an area that would have complimented the entire pack and gameplay. There are so many things wrong with the design of this pack that it's difficult to decide where to start listing.
I understand that you like Star Wars, and I respect that you like the pack. To some degree I do as well. I'm not totally against you here. In fact, i'm actually trying to defend you as you are making some interesting points. But, unfortunately, I don't see you as offering the same compromise. Reading your posts on this thread you so far accused both @SimmerGeorge, and @Cinebar of moving the goal posts to fit their own bias.... when in fact, you are doing the exact same thing in your defending of a pack that you like. And that's fair enough... defend your interests. I'll even help you do that. But not to the point of alienating my interests in the process.
I'm not happy with branding affecting the Sims' franchise, and though I can choose to turn a blind eye to it when it's limited to stuff packs, having crossover licensing now affecting our Game Packs as well... i'm sorry, Star Wars or not.... i'm not happy about it.
-My number one reason I think it's a bad idea is because Sims 4 is currently a buggy mess, and as others have said each new release breaks more things. In my opinion development on new releases should be stalled for a bit while they fix all of the bugs and make the game work properly again. Yes this would mean little or no new content for a while, but all things considered new players buying some of Sims 4's older packs are buying a broken product, which I feel at least by my countries laws of consumer protection would be pretty illegal.
-Looking at the reviews there seems to be a lot of rabbit holes, I know it's just a game pack but Jungle Adventure didn't have this many rabbit holes. I've also heard it already is causing issues for Sims who want to take Occults with them to Baatu (for example they have all their abilities removed which means vampires can't eat, but you can't bring plasma packs with you to fix this because none of your personal inventory comes with you to Baatu)
-The aliens are just costumes, I mean sure they said that wearing those costumes changes how they're treated but why not just make a star wars alien life state where you can pick many different types of aliens to play as?
-Personal cars have usually been an expansion item which makes me feel justified in complaining that we got this pack before we got a pack that included cars. When Sims 4 released the immediate backlash was; where are the pools? where are the toddlers? where are the cars? Well we've got pools and toddlers now but still no cars? I do realise that they'll need to make a significant overhaul to the entire game and all it's expansions to do cars properly at this point but my main gripe is that they should have knuckled down and got it done years ago because they've created more work for themselves with every expansion they've released. Also before anyone says that Sims 4 is not open world and therefore does not need cars; sims 2 wasn't open world either and had cars. Sims 1 also at least had car pooling. And thinking about it cars would have been a perfect addition to the Eco Living EP because they could have had both electric and fuel powered cars.
-While the poll that showed that Star Wars was not a desired pack was not an EA released poll, and also likely this was already under development. I do think that EA/The Sims team probably should have figured this wasn't going to be a popular move. There's plenty of activity in the speculations and rumour/ideas area of this forum that would give them some direction as to what the consumers want and I don't see a lot of Star Wars getting mentioned there. I know some people say "well they don't have to cater to us, it's their game not ours." but that doesn't show a very good understanding of business practices. Yes it's their game to develop but what use is there selling a product that doesn't appeal to your consumers? Not just that but it also causes you to lose the faith of your consumer base? It just isn't a very good move business wise unless whoever paid them to make this pack (Disney) gave them a good deal of money to offset the losses this pack would cause. But again that's not good because it's a very short term gain for a long term loss.
This isn't one of my points so I'm not dot pointing it but also I dislike the whole "don't like it don't buy it attitude", yeah of course don't buy it if you're absolutely sure you're going to hate it (duh) but people seem to forget that as consumers we can complain and give feedback? Yes some people do need to remember to do so constructively and to think out their argument a bit better but it's very very important that we voice our opinions on the product we're being sold even if they're negative ones.
Anyway I could go on about how the Sims 4 is devoid of life and etc but that would make this a very long bit of feedback. I think I've said enough.
Okay, first, I'm sorry, this is wicked long and I didn't intend it to be.
I'm not really sure how I've moved the goal posts, so if you want to be more specific, I'm willing to listen. (Not sarcasm, being genuine.)
You did bring up my comparison of Parenthood to a Generations request, so that's fair. The point I was trying to make with that though, is that she was trying to prove that "nobody asked" for the pack, just because no one detailed it down to the last character. And players make general requests all the time. Like just saying, "family play", or "more build stuff", or "I want something new and different". But it's common for players to not go into minute details of what they want. So it was unreasonable, I felt, for her to go on about "show me the thread to prove someone asked for this", but with all of these extra conditions attached, when I'm quite sure she's aware that players don't blueprint or map out every request. Sometimes we don't even know what it is we want ourselves. Sometimes we just throw something out there, hoping someone on the dev team catches it.
I can tell you from my own perspective that I wanted more Star Wars themes in the game. I asked for more outfits, and I had some discussions here and there with others who dared to admit to wanting it as well. I'm pretty sure I remember a player mentioning wanting a full Star Wars pack at some point, but I can tell you that I never ever truly thought they'd do one. If I had, I'd have seriously asked for it, and more than likely would have made a lot of suggestions.
But as for brands themselves, I've seen brand requests from players as well. Things like the return of H&M or Ikea, or Harry Potter or Marvel and DC. And I've noticed that some people will argue that one brand "belongs" in Sims more than another, maybe because some are more "dollhouse" or maybe because we've had some of those brands in games in the past? But who's really to say which one "belongs", if any? The Sims has been branching out with each iteration, growing the game and its potential for a variety of simulations and gameplay and themes. Maybe some people would love to be able to simulate the world of Harry Potter or Tolkien or the Marvel Universe and connect it to their main game so they can use the things they like and send some of their own existing Sims on an adventure.
And I think that's also one of the things people are having an issue with, the "adventure" simulations. I can't help but notice that we, of the older player base, don't like change. Many of us have past games that we love, and want to see a continuation. Understandable. But we've also known from the beginning that Sims 4 was different. And as it has bumped and bruised its way through the years, it has become more and more apparent that The Sims just can't, it just won't, be what it used to be. Not in this iteration. But it can be its own thing. It can have its own purpose and its own unique form of entertainment. But to do that, it has to be allowed to be what it is and to test its own boundaries because in essence, it's kind of a new thing.
I get some people not wanting brands in the game at all, so if you feel that way I can respect that. I didn't think I wanted them either until the survey came out last year and I really thought about it more and realized that a lot of my passions are also "brands", like Star Wars. I've also had to realize that the way I play and enjoy Sims 4 is very different from when I played TS2. When I try to play the way I used to, I get bored. But when I throw my expectations away and keep an open mind and let the pack show me what it wants to do, I find myself having a really good time. (And it's usually the GPs.) So I've been making a conscious effort to try to put my own past game version biases aside and approach the game with different eyes. I know a lot of people don't want to do this, they want to dig in their heels and demand a return to previous game mechanics. But that's just not realistic. Maybe with Sims 5 one day, who knows. By then, the newer players will probably want something different anyway because they'll already have Sims 4 and the company isn't going to want to copy/paste the Sims 4 experience all over again. So there is some hope for that.
And regarding biases, we all have them. Every player. That's what I was trying to point out, I wasn't excluding myself, though I did attempt an objective comparison of the different types of gameplay between GPs, trying to show that the community is not united in an opinion of what "good" gameplay is, thereby exemplifying that a variety of gameplay styles is needed, depending on what is being produced. But when someone tries to manipulate other players into a boycott against their own game enjoyment by using the "bigger picture" argument, it's selfish.
I'll be honest in saying that there certainly are things in the Star Wars pack that I would have preferred done differently. I have always hated rabbit hole venues, and I've noticed more of them showing up in the packs since last year. I would normally rather deal with loading screens, honestly. And I think we should have had Force users and yes, it would have been nice to have a few more lots that can be changed. But like I said above, I've been trying to open my mind a bit more and stop fighting the game to play it the way I used to. So when I sat down to play this Star Wars pack, I could see the vision the developers had with it. True, I could also see where the budget or time fell short, but that quickly got overshadowed by the smoothness of the execution. Where I expected some of the standard invasive TS4 gameplay disruptions like "grab water", changing clothes to swim or for weather, freezing or too hot, badly dressed townies, the Landgraabs showing up and breaking immersion, Vampires walking around with umbrellas, etc, etc,...they were all miraculously absent, which is astounding. I am truly able to actually immerse in the moment without those frustrating interruptions and it is glorious. I never knew this game could be capable of such smooth gameplay.
Now, would I want a repeat of this gameplay structure? I honestly don't know anymore. Last month I would have probably said no. But my enjoyment doesn't lie. I think that as far as GPs are concerned, I'm okay with the experiments, as long as the EPs still remain a more neutral overall theme and adhere as much as they can to "tradition" and majority player requests with new lots and standard gameplay. And that's pretty much what they've been doing all along for the most part anyway so I guess I'm good with it for now. But I do hope the upcoming EP contains some big ticket content for those who felt left out this time around. I won't even complain if I don't like it, since everyone had to suffer through Star Wars.
An official Sims survey was sent out to the players a good while back. It included an open question asking folks to enter what kind of branded content they would like to see in future packs. Star Wars was one of them.
I’m basing this knowledge on posts around the forum of people who were willing to share what they’ve entered.
I’m basing this on my own answer to that question. I asked for Star Wars.
Can I provide you with the results of the survey? No. Do I care to find all those discussions where people say they entered Star Wars? No. They’re out there in the many JtB related threads. Have a read through them. Or you can simply choose to believe me or not.
That Nobody asked for Star Wars is simply not true.
Some folks asked for it.
The point I was hoping to make was.....
Suggesting that I, or someone else is wrong, while not taking the time to back up your accusation with at least 1 piece of evidence.... is a conversation that I have a difficult time taking serious.
You say that people are wrong in their claim that "nobody asked for this". Then suggest that "they" can run around doing the leg work proving that "you" are right in your accusation against them... well... with all due respect.... do it yourself.
If you want to accuse me of being wrong.... fair enough... do that. But you will be bringing "me" the evidence of that.... not the other way around.
The evidence is in the people around you telling you they asked for it. It doesn't get more direct than that.
What i'm accepting, is that people asked for more Star Wars stuff. Though I didn't see the posts directly asking for this stuff I do believe that it may have happened. So i'm not going to question that part of it.
What I don't see evidence of... is the request for Star Wars "branding"... and for it to completely consume a GP. I'm not referring to Star Wars stuff... i'm referring to the branding itself ... that imposed onto us a lot of restrictions.
ETA: I would have been great with a stuff pack full of Star Wars stuff. The community probably would have been less toxic about it as well.
Isn't asking for more Star Wars also asking for the Star Wars "brand"? The entire saga and anything affiliated is part of the brand. So if someone just wants more Star Wars, as much as the devs are willing to give, then it's the same as asking for the Star Wars brand, yes?
If you're referring to the storm trooper outfit shipped with the base game as branding.... then yes. I agree. If offering us some more of these type of outfits in a stuff pack is branding, than again, yes. I agree. And as I already explained.... if this was a stuff pack like the previous branding addons...... I for one wouldn't be here contesting to this degree.
You are getting into specifics that I will quickly agree with.... simply because technically you are correct on at least some of these points.
However, not everyone has gone to business school, and not everyone is going to automatically think of the legal aspects of branding, or the idea of it in general with their random post of..... I wish we had more Star Wars stuff.
Then when the Star Wars GP comes out as it did.... its possible that some of the very people who may have even requested Star Wars stuff... will claim they never asked for this.... because to them... they didn't connect the dots with asking for a few added outfits.... with the legalities of branding.
Its the ole' social political argument of ... "What did they know at the time of ....."
In fact, you took part in one of those discussions...
https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/comment/17640721#Comment_17640721
Seeing this.... I can remember that conversation very well. And.... just to say... thanks for posting the link. Much respect for that.
I will point out though... that this conversation is dated around, and including, September 2 (of this year), which (for some of it) is "after" the offical EA post sharing news about the upcoming GP of Star Wars on September 1.
https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/980643/strap-in-for-the-sims-4-star-wars-journey-to-batuu-gameplay#latest
And because of/after the OP sharing the video promotion of it in their opening post.
That being said.....
I am going to re-read through the postings. You're offering a fair argument that I have to double check.
(Be back soon lol)
There is a refrence to requesting Star Wars stuff posted on September 1.
@LiElf (page 1)
I feel like all the times on these Forums that I tried to say I wanted more Star Wars content, even if it was just a few more costumes, my request just got buried in an ocean of cries for babies and bunk beds, lol.
I'm going full Scoundrel for the first visit. That Falcon is MINE.
https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/980643/strap-in-for-the-sims-4-star-wars-journey-to-batuu-gameplay/p1
There are references of a "survey" that existed (at some point in time) concerning the request for type of branding the community would like to see in the sims' game.
Last post on page 4... Asked by @Cynna
Has EA/Maxis ever included a Star Wars theme in any of there their surveys? Admittedly, I've taken a few of them, but not all. Has anything even close to a Star Wars theme been put up for consideration in the past?
Replies on page 5 by:
@Mareah
I think the closest was them asking what brands would you want to see them collaborate with. Some people say they wrote down star wars and/or disney. I have no idea how long ago did that survey get puplished tho. Maybe they were working on this pack way before that.
@CAPTAIN_NXR7
There was an open question in one of the surveys regarding which brand folks would like to see in the sims. Apparently that's where some would have filled in Star Wars. Possibly me included.
@j1z1
Oh yeah, I remember that. I think I did too. Sorreh
@LiElf
Ditto
@Haflinger
I may have done something like that too.
https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/980534/feeling-salty-about-journey-to-batuu/p5
This alone provides evidence that the claim of ... "nobody asked for this".... is wrong. I count 4 people just on this who posts directly that "they" themselves requested "Star Wars" as a brand they would like to see (above/before others) in the game of sims.
4 people is enough to prove that the claim of "nobody" is incorrect. I jumped on the badwagon and requested proof.... and there it is.
Again @CAPTAIN_NXR7 .... thanks for the link.
ETA:
I'm not sure when the survey mentioned was posted by EA.... so far... i've only found these ones.
..... April 28, 2020.
https://simscommunity.info/2020/04/28/the-sims-4-survey-vote-for-potential-new-features-and-improvements/
..... May, 2019
..... January, 2020
https://simscommunity.info/tag/community-survey/
Just saying.
I feel like a true scoundrel for somehow getting you to do all the work and provide the details of the evidence. JtB has a terrible influence on me!
I do respect and appreciate you posting this though. These are the conversations I meant.
I remember more discussions where others claimed to have asked for SW or Disney way back in the speculation threads. Unfortunately my post history doesn’t even allow me to go back that far. It’s also incredibly hard to track down these discussions through the search bar since it only gives me options to pick from the most recent topics. Forgetting the titles of these threads doesn’t make it any easier.
At least the evidence that we do have teaches us that the claim ‘Nobody asked for this’ is indeed incorrect. And that was all I was trying to say.
The build/buy mode items hold no place in any world either (unless I decided to demolish all builds in strangerville and make my own post-apocalyptic world from scratch, which is way too much effort to make a GP work).
There are a few decor pieces for stormtrooper helmet storage etc which I can understand people not wanting to use elsewhere, but the rest of it seems fine... well, to me, anyway *shrugs*
You're absolutely right. The majority of people decide to 'hate' the pack out of principle, however, a true builder who loves Sci-Fi would want to snatch this one up without hesitation. You don't even have to travel to Batuu to get pleasure out of this DLC. There is so much scope for these items. There is nothing that screams 'Star Wars' about most of them. That entire modular curved bar is worth a tenner! (Well that's just me getting excited.)
I totally understand people may not want to spend $20 on a collection of Sci-Fi objects, but I can imagine a lot of them getting it on sale once they see the incredible builds that will be shared on the gallery.
Building is also gameplay.
Builders are also simmers.