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Between2Worlds [Story] 06/04

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  • mercuryfoammercuryfoam Posts: 1,156 Member
    @AdamsEve1231 Ah thank you. I think you mentioned you've quite the schedule. I don't have arcs per se, but every 5 chapters have a central-ish theme or connecting point. So 5, 10 and 15 are good break points. To break it up even further, a 3:2 chapter ratio works (i.e. ch 1-3, then 4-5; ch 6-8, 9-10). :smiley:
  • mercuryfoammercuryfoam Posts: 1,156 Member
    Don't mind me as I put bloopers! (Don't worry, no spoilers!) I was trying to pose the AC when Vlad came out of nowhere and bombed the picture. As if my story isn't low key enough, this just looks sinister! :joy:

    TS4-x64-2020-06-16-06-33-56.jpg
  • AdamsEve1231AdamsEve1231 Posts: 7,035 Member
    Don't mind me as I put bloopers! (Don't worry, no spoilers!) I was trying to pose the AC when Vlad came out of nowhere and bombed the picture. As if my story isn't low key enough, this just looks sinister! :joy:

    TS4-x64-2020-06-16-06-33-56.jpg

    Ah...Vlad! Ever the mood killer! :D
    With these forums closing down, stay connected.

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  • candycottonchucandycottonchu Posts: 906 Member
    edited June 2020
    @mercuryfoam omg this is hilarious! :joy:
    Vlad is one of the townies I cull first when starting a new save ehehe
  • _sims_Yimi_sims_Yimi Posts: 1,747 Member
    Don't mind me as I put bloopers! (Don't worry, no spoilers!) I was trying to pose the AC when Vlad came out of nowhere and bombed the picture. As if my story isn't low key enough, this just looks sinister! :joy:

    TS4-x64-2020-06-16-06-33-56.jpg

    That is hilarious :D poor Vlad just really, really, REALLY wants to be a part of things.
    J6AKQqX.jpg
    Hosting D&D sessions on the side. Interested in playing through some fantasy-themed shenanigans? Send me a message 😘
  • mercuryfoammercuryfoam Posts: 1,156 Member
    @candycottonchu I never understood what culling is for. What does it do?? I might want to apply it in my game from the sound of it. :o

    @_sims_Yimi lol yeah!! I make it a point not to touch premades though. I see them as "nobility". First families of the sims realm. Like I can never never play Mortimer and Bella goth for sure. Those sims exist deserve to have their portraits in a museum. Actually... I think I'm gonna do that..:lol:
  • ThePlumbobThePlumbob Posts: 4,971 Member
    Ok I know I've already gushed on your blog and in PMs, but the completionist side of me feels the need to come over and fangirl over here as well 😆 This has been such an amazing (albeit turbulent) ride! I love how you marry up all the different elements in the story to create a unique blend of, well, worlds :) I just hate that I'm caught up now, boo - I was dreading that as I was reading through.

    Lol that pic with Vlad :DAnd then Vlad came along and drained them all - that would have been quite the plot twist :D:D:D Maybe Vlad is just upset that it's not him inflicting evil on the world for once and is hinting at wanting a starring role haha!
  • mercuryfoammercuryfoam Posts: 1,156 Member
    @ThePlumbob Thank you for stopping by! I'm glad you enjoy the story and its turbulent ride.
    And then Vlad came along and drained them all
    Lol that would be the ultimate s***ker punch. Probably won't forgive myself either.

    I don't play premades, but that's actually a good idea to include Vlad in future stories. Though I'd probably cure him :lol:
  • ThePlumbobThePlumbob Posts: 4,971 Member
    I don't play premades, but that's actually a good idea to include Vlad in future stories. Though I'd probably cure him :lol:

    Gosh, cured Vlad, would that even be Vlad? He'd have an identity crisis or something :D (Sorry for the OT, could not help myself!)
  • ThePlumbobThePlumbob Posts: 4,971 Member
    Ahem... I highly approve of this new profile picture :D<3
  • mercuryfoammercuryfoam Posts: 1,156 Member
    @ThePlumbob I was speechless when I aged him up :love: He's so adorable as a kid. I still can't believe I got him through dice rolls.

    :wink: That's the full picture.
    Curtis2.jpg
  • ThePlumbobThePlumbob Posts: 4,971 Member
    No way, dice rolls??? There's clearly some witchcraft going on! Anywho, this is fine, I've had simcrushes before, I can handle myself! Let me just collect my jaw and I'll be off :D
  • candycottonchucandycottonchu Posts: 906 Member
    ohhhh, that jaw suits him :smirk:
  • mercuryfoammercuryfoam Posts: 1,156 Member
    Hey everyone!

    Now that I'm at the end of Season 1, I've drafted a monstrous list of questions and thought I'd share here too if you guys would like to give your comments/feedback on what you think about B2W :blush:

    As most of you know, this is my first writing experience and while I've learnt a lot from writing, I'm sure I can learn much more from your responses. Most of you have actually given me your feedback after every chapter and especially the final chapter. Thank you so much I loved reading everything and felt like a happy sponge! But if you want to give critique, this is the best time to do so! Otherwise if there's anything bothering you, they may be brought into Season 2! :#:astonished:

    You can pick which questions to respond to (or simply respond to all of them and lose a precious day of your life. :tongue: Thank you so much @ThePlumbob for the great idea and @ThePlumbob @_sims_Yimi for already tackling the questions! And to @Maladi777 You were already giving critique as you read so I want to give you a big hug and shoutout here anyway <3:smiley:

    Endgame Story Analysis Questions
    I overwhelmed myself writing this so I can't imagine you answering them all. Just pick and choose if interested :smile:

    General:
    1. Did you enjoy the story?
    2. What was your favourite part, and which was your least favourite part?
    3. How do you feel about the ending?
    4. Do you feel like the story was different from what you expected when you started?
    5. What do you think of the darkness from chapter 6 until the end? Was the darkness too much, not much, present but not bad, present but bad? etc
    6. What are your predictions for S2? Feel free to answer everything else before attempting this. :lol:


    Story:
    - What did you think about the comic strip ch. 6.4? Did it adequately summarise Curtis's role? Were there any plot holes? Any thoughts on its delivery?
    - What do you think of Athena and Curtis's Not-date scene at the promenade?
    - What do you think of the progression of Athena and Curtis’s relationship from strangers to lovers?
    - Did it flow realistically? Did any parts feel forced or too fast?
    - Their romance was never intended to be ‘pure’, even if it started out that way. Did you catch it as a reader? Did you realise at any point a shift beginning to happen? Where? Did you catch yourself responding to it?
    - How would you describe their romance/relationship?
    - Grim's explanation of the cycle of life/death: Do you have any pressing questions? What else would you have liked to know?
    - What do you think of Curtis's neighborhood shown from Athena's perspective? Was it believable? Did it make you respond in any way? (thoughts or feelings) Was it effective in its delivery of mood/message/setting? Did it make what comes after (Mercy) believable/possible?
    - What is your view on ‘Mercy’ chapters (Assault)? Were they handled appropriately? Can they be handled better? Did they deter you from reading further? Did they change your impression of the story? Were you expecting them?
    - What is your view on ‘Memories’ chapter (Curtis)? Were they handled appropriately? Were they portrayed realistically? Were they and the characters portrayed believable? Were the scenes portrayed, haunting enough for Curtis to revolve his entire life around revenge and locking Scorcher away?
    - There is a darkness that looms over chapters 14.4, 16.4 and 16.5. Was the mood obvious to you or too subtle? Did it affect these chapters and your desire to read them?
    What do you think of Avery's revelation/Athena losing her memory in Chapters 15.1 - 15.4. How was the pacing? Did it feel realistic? Did any feel forced? What do you think of Avery's backstory? Was it believable that Athena didn't realise what she was doing?
    - What do you think of the NSFW poem chapter? Was the poem hard to decipher? Did the pictures make the process tougher? Was it a cringe chapter?
    Did all of these scenarios make sense to you? Were they believable?
    - Curtis kept in the dark about his identity
    - Curtis having his own home
    - Curtis being able to survive despite his lifestyle at such a young age
    - Curtis’s complete out of character aggression, manipulation and exploitation of Athena at Trevor’s house
    - Athena’s complete out of character aggression, loosened and unhinged behavior at Trevor’s house
    - Trevor’s fixation on Athena


    Writing
    - Were there any themes that stood out for you in this story? How do you think I handled them?
    - What do you think of my balancing action/non-action scenes, thrill/non-thrill? Were you able to wind down before the next one, or is the story's arrangement fine with you? Some have told me they needed to take a break from the story because it was so uh full on(?). How was it for you?
    - There’s a shift in my writing style/length between chapter 1-5 and the rest of the story. I also experimented with different mediums. What do you think of:
    • The comic strip? Was its organisation easy to follow? Were the Speech bubbles clear who’s talking and who’s next?
    • Picture Sequences: Did you prefer the speech text organised around the subject in the picture? Or placed at the bottom and color coded?
    • Do you like this randomness of switching mediums? :lol:
    • At some point I tried to add more descriptions/elaboration of the setting and ambience than moving the story along. (Chapter 14.2 and 14.21) What do you think of the writing in these chapters compared to the rest of my writing? Do you have a preference? (If there’s no difference you can say that too. :lol: )
    - I overly rely on pictures to describe the setting than write it out. Does this style work for you?
    - Romance is hard to write and personal. There are some scenes and pictures that were too much for me in the story, but I’m a conservative person. How were they for you? Were any of them cringey? If yes, which one? so I can work on those. And do you have suggestions?


    Character:
    1. What are Athena's strengths and weaknesses? What do you think of Athena’s Character progression/development? How would you describe her?
    - Is her character realistic? Is she adequately fleshed out for reader understanding?
    - Any bits of her that you find confusing?
    - What kind of person do you think she has become at the end of this story? What kind of person do you predict her to be in B2W?
    - She insists that Curtis is relatable and her soulmate at the lighthouse scene. Did you find her insistence of them being made for each other believable? Do you have a theory why she thinks so? (I’ve never elaborated on this)

    2. What are Curtis's strength and weaknesses? What do you think of Curtis’s Character progression/development? How would you describe him?
    - Is he realistic and adequately fleshed out for reader understanding?
    - Did you find it strange that he cared for Athena with his background staring at violence every day?

    I know I did a lot of explaining of Masato and Kirino’s character in the comments. But without the comments and purely relying on story:
    3.Is Masato a believable character?Does his character/personality, his motivations, and actions make sense to you? Is his love for Kirino surprising? Does his metaphoric speech make sense to you? Did the final reveal provide ample explanation of all the schemey scenes he was portrayed in throughout the story? Did everything make sense?

    4.Is Kirino a believable character? Does her character, desires and actions (including final action :( ) make sense to you?
    - Did her scene at the end come as a complete surprise? Were there enough clues given throughout the story for you to find her condition at the end believable/acceptable?
    - Was her ‘flashback’ chapter believable?
    - Do you think she loves Masato (at the end)?

    5.Were Masato and Kirino’s complicated relationship believable?

    6.Is Scorcher a believable character? Does his character, desires and actions make sense to you? (I think I gave him a monologue and two lines of dialogue explaining his perspective on life lol)

    7. What do you think about Kian? Then Carly?

    8. What do you think/feel about Dew?

    9. What do you think about Grim?

    And here is a happy gameplay picture that has nothing to do with Season 2 storyline :lol:

    B2-W-S2-Rescaled.jpg
  • ThePlumbobThePlumbob Posts: 4,971 Member
    Hi lovely, re-posting my original fanmail feedback here:

    General
    1. Did you enjoy the story?
    Yes. But you know that already! :) It’s unlike any other simlit I’ve read, probably because of the intertwining of the magical and the mobster underworld. Neither of those elements felt underdeveloped. Also your characters are really easy to get emotionally invested in, and you’re very good at creating multi-dimensional villains.

    2. What was your favourite part, and which was your least favourite part?
    Oh, that’s hard, I liked so many! I really liked Merchant of Time Part 2 (Is that weird? It was arguably the darkest part of the story, but really well written, and filled so many missing pieces, and I loved learning more about Masato and Kirino’s past.). I loved the lighthouse chapters, obviously Curtis and Athena finally kissing for the first time was something that was built up, and then the dramatic confrontation in the graveyard afterwards was really captivating. Also really enjoyed Curtis and Athena’s non-date. Oh, and the first introduction of Curtis and Kian was pretty awesome, they made such an impression.

    Least favourite part was probably the finale, but I’ll get into that later. Other than that, the parts with Athena finding her footing in the new school were not something that hugely spoke to me, but I understand how and why it was an important part of her journey and had to be shown (it’s likely because I’ve been out of high school for a very long time, and because when I was in high school, I was not very popular at all haha).

    3. How do you feel about the ending?
    I would have preferred for Curtis and Athena to go their separate ways at the end of season one (that’s not to say I would mind them finding each other later) – but you already know that. The culmination of Masato’s storyline was really satisfying, as was the grim reveal. I liked the hooks for season 2 as well, making it clear there’s more of both worlds to come, though Kian’s potential storyline already has my stomach tied up in a twist :D

    4. Do you feel like the story was different from what you expected when you started?
    I actually didn’t have any expectations when I started reading at all. I remember thinking that you did a really good job at introducing the reader to an established family (this is so hard to do if you weren’t intending on writing a story about said characters in the first place, and a lot of people don’t pull it off, so they are in an uphill struggle to try to get their readers get as invested in their characters as they are), and you immediately established a connection with Athena through her journal entries. Well and after that, it got even better :) But I was pretty open to whatever was going to come.

    5. What do you think of the darkness from chapter 6 until the end? Was the darkness too much, not much, present but not bad, present but bad? Etc
    I thought you did this really well. Yes things got progressively darker, but It felt gradual and not shoehorned in, a natural progression of the established storylines and settings. You also did a great job with foreshadowing a lot of it, so I was mentally prepared for the events of Mercy. I actually really admired how you handled the dark aspects of the story.

    6. What are your predictions for S2?
    I have no predictions, but things I would like seeing explored would be the aftermath of Masato’s plans coming to fruition, and whether that brought him any satisfaction (my guess is no lol), Athena’s pursuit of untamed magic – I’m guessing she will to some degree become “power-hungry,” and might need to do some soul searching about who she truly is. Heck, I can see her becoming the villain and Curtis the “good guy” trying to save the world (wasn’t that kind of thing always his motivation anyway? On a smaller, more personal scale, trying to avenge those he’s seen harmed).

    Oh, and I want Kian to be very happy and unharmed, k thanx :D:D

    Story
    What did you think about the comic strip ch. 6.4? Did it adequately summarise Curtis's role? Were there any plot holes? Any thoughts on its delivery?
    Curtis’s part was pretty clear, as was his struggle of his conscience to deal with the consequences of what he contributed to. I did not fully understand Fisheye's operation but got the general feeling. Some of the multispeech bubbles were hard for me to follow, but I don’t typically read comics, so that’s to be expected. Oh, and on the first read I did not realise there were multiple pages to that part, my bad haha.

    What do you think of Athena and Curtis's Not-date scene at the promenade?
    I loved that chapter, it was really cute and showed how young they both were, just a nice illusion of a sweet teen romance for a bit. It was also a big step for them bonding, with Curtis letting Athena in and taking her to the grave. And the sunset pictures were really pretty, some of the prettiest sceneries in the story.

    What do you think of the progression of Athena and Curtis’s relationship from strangers to lovers? Did it flow realistically? Did any parts feel forced or too fast?
    For me it all flowed really well until the final chapter. The instant attraction, the intrigue building up, them getting to know each other and falling for each other – likely accelerated due to the shared trauma was very believable, it was hard not to root for them and was built up really well.

    I also really liked that them finally getting together and sleeping together for the first time was ultimately hollow and unfulfilling for both of them (ok, really liked is probably a weird way of putting it :D I have an appreciation for things that are sad in a beautiful way, I guess).

    So I bought into their rise, and into their fall, a hundred percent. I think my issue with the final chapter was that you did such a great job convincing me to root for them, and then such a great job at convincing me that they (well, mainly Athena) changed too much for it to work, that I struggled to buy into them saying ah well, it’s fine, we care about each other anyway so let’s give this a shot.

    Maybe it’s a pacing issue. Because the end part sped over several months of them dating, we didn’t really get to see the parts of the relationship of the “new” Athena with Curtis, so it was hard to see why they would want to keep going. Them wanting to stay together didn’t feel earned.

    Their romance was never intended to be ‘pure’, even if it started out that way. Did you catch it as a reader? Did you realise at any point a shift beginning to happen? Where? Did you catch yourself responding to it? (I.e. you were rooting for them then decided not to; or other change of perspectives; like suspicion or started disliking certain characters etc)
    Well, yes, haha. I don’t really think that any relationship can stay “pure” sunshine and rainbows anyway (not that these two got many rainbows going on in their lives, but I suppose that’s exactly what that romance was to them initially, a ray of light in the darkness).

    Yes, I stopped rooting for them after Athena’s memory loss, but not because of the relationship loss, more so, because there was a whole new relationship to root for (albeit technically between the same people), one that we did not see grow and evolve like the first time around. I guess if you and/or a significant other lost your memories, would you fall in love again? Maybe, maybe not – boils down to whether we fall in love because of your personality or because of your shared experiences. I think both play a role, as does timing. But I could probably go really deep into that rabbit hole and there’s still a million more questions!

    I will say this though, contrary to the many many things I have said – and this may surprise you -I do still root for them in the long haul. I would like them to fail the sprint in order to get to the marathon. Because no marathon can be ran if you break your leg in the first mile because you grossly underestimated what you can do. Actually, that’s probably a bad analogy. I want them to break that leg, but meet at the finish line. Something to that effect. I hope you know what I’m trying to convey (poorly) :D

    How would you describe their romance/relationship?
    Stubborn :D From Athena’s side, especially, basically throughout.

    I think initially their relationship formed because they both desperately needed something, someone to give things meaning, to make life bearable. Because of that and the fact they were both attractive and misunderstood. Then as they opened each other, it got more substance.

    For Curtis, their relationship was what kept him alive (and that’s disregarding the fact this was literally why grim did not reap his soul) – he said himself he didn’t have much of a reason to live other than vengeance. Anyway, I’m dwelling on this.

    What do you think of Curtis's neighborhood shown from Athena's perspective? Was it believable? Did it make you respond in any way? (thoughts or feelings) Was it effective in its delivery of mood/message/setting/danger? Did it make what comes after (Mercy) believable/possible?
    It was the most effective way to show it, through the eyes of someone not desensitized to it all. Just seeing it as Curtis for the first time would not have really delivered to the same effect. And yes, definitely felt incredibly tense and dangerous throughout.

    What is your view on ‘Mercy’ chapters (Assault)? Were they handled appropriately? Can they be handled better? Did they deter you from reading further? Did they change your impression of the story? Were you expecting them?
    It was handled very well, and yes I saw it coming – but not in a “so predictable” kind of way, more so like “ok, I can mentally prepare for this” kind of way. I don’t think there was a better way you could have handled it. I can’t say that I expected it at the start of the story, but the way you got to it was well executed.

    What is your view on ‘Memories’ chapter (Curtis)? Were they handled appropriately? Were they portrayed realistically? Were they and the characters portrayed believable? Were the scenes portrayed, haunting enough for Curtis to revolve his entire life around revenge and locking Scorcher away?
    Oh yeah, definitely believable that he would want revenge – it’s almost not a case of “was it believable that he was traumatised?”, but “was it believable that he did not turn out to be a sociopath?" (I’m guessing this may get censored, we’ll see). But then the answer to that was in there too, and that answer is Kian (and Rue to some degree).

    There is a darkness that looms over chapters 14.4, 16.4 and 16.5. Was the mood obvious to you or too subtle? Did it affect these chapters and your desire to read them?
    I’d say pretty obvious. I guess I could see someone missing it in 16.4 and 16.5 but I don’t think it needs dumbing down, it would do more harm than good.

    What do you think of Avery's revelation/Athena losing her memory in Chapters 15.1 - 15.4. How was the pacing? Did it feel realistic? Did any feel forced? What do you think of Avery's backstory? Was it believable that Athena didn't realise what she was doing?
    I’m trying to remember how much we knew about how Avery left the magic realm at that point. The trade-off made sense and provided a good setup for Athena’s own, without that stepping stone the revelation of Athena losing her memories wouldn’t have the same impact.

    I do think it was believable, because Athena’s relationship with her mother was really not the closest to begin with. Athena completely bought into Avery’s front, which is what alienated them – perhaps if Athena were older, she’d understand better, but Athena was always very focused on her own motivations and narrative.

    What do you think of the NSFW poem chapter? Was the poem hard to decipher? Did the pictures make the process tougher? Was it a cringe chapter?
    It was very tasteful, and the poem was really well written. The chapter was heart-breaking and I loved it.

    Did all of these scenarios make sense to you? Were they believable? Did any feel forced?

    - Curtis kept in the dark about his identity – Makes complete sense. If you’re a cog in a big masterplan of an evil mastermind, obviously you’re not going to know about it if they’re any good at what they do.

    - Curtis having his own home – Yes, makes sense. I mean, I would imagine his job pays pretty well.

    - Curtis being able to survive despite his lifestyle at such a young age – Probably the one that requires the most suspense of disbelief out of these, given how young he was at the beginning, but given his special abilities and his importance to Kirino, it’s not unbelievable.

    - Curtis’s complete out of character aggression, manipulation and exploitation of Athena at Trevor’s house – oh definitely, he was desperate, and desperation brings out the worst in people. He had just killed the scorcher, his soul motivation for existing, with that gone, how could he allow Athena to just walk away in that moment? I wouldn’t say it was exploitation, exactly, though, I mean, is it exploitation when it’s mutual? It was exactly what she was looking for that night, after all.

    - Athena’s complete out of character aggression, loosened and unhinged behavior at Trevor’s house – yes, she just lost a big part of herself and had a huge confrontation with her mother. Teenagers act up over much less existential things.

    - Trevor’s fixation on Athena – Trevor has had most things served to him an a silver platter. Of course he will fixate on the one thing he can’t have.

    I'll do Writing and Characters over the weekend at some point :)

    Also, that teaser image of Athena for next season is gorgeous!
  • Maladi777Maladi777 Posts: 4,393 Member
    edited July 2020
    Haha. Congrats on enduring all my blunt comments. Not many can say they did and remained friends with me after that. :D
    You keep saying this was your first writing experience and my brain refuses to accept it. She's pulling your leg, it keeps saying. So if it's really so (pardon my inherent skepticism, can't be helped), hats off to you for putting together such an ambitious story and for executing it so well. There were so many layers to this story and my heart quivered with excitement as they were peeled off one by one. You managed to surprise me several times and that's a huge win for you, my friend.
    Now on to your questions. I think I'm gonna answer the first part for now and the next ones maybe later.
    General:
    1. Did you enjoy the story? I did. Some parts more than others.
    2. What was your favourite part, and which was your least favourite part? I enjoyed Masato and Kirino's parts most toward the end. And of course Julian's parts, because I find it hard to resist hadsome investigators obviously. All scenes with Grim were also very enjoyable, I liked the whole aura of mystery around him. As for parts I didn't enjoy. The teenage romance. If you asked me couple years ago, I'd probably answer differently. You can blame my age for craving more adult romance.
    3. How do you feel about the ending? You already know my feelings regarding Curtisena. I was very 'loud' about it in my comments. I don't want them together. Not at the moment at least. I'm excited about Julian's disappearance.
    4. Do you feel like the story was different from what you expected when you started? Definitely. And I'm happy about it. To include the whole crime organisation part was a great idea and exactly what I enjoy reading.
    5. What do you think of the darkness from chapter 6 until the end? Was the darkness too much, not much, present but not bad, present but bad? I'm not squeamish. I prefer darker themes and less happy endings. There are plenty of light happy stories out there, I believe. If I wanted that, I'd go elsewhere. Frankly, if anyone complains about it, they have a variety of other stories to choose from. I'm in the right place here.
    6. What are your predictions for S2? Feel free to answer everything else before attempting this. I won't write my predictions, only my thoughts what I'd like to see happen in S2. And please, don't let my wishes force you to change your plans or anything. Inspiration is fine, but I already told you that making changes for the sake of readers' satisfaction is a bad idea. You should always write the story you enjoy telling no matter what.
    I mentioned it before that 'd like to see Athena and Curtis on opposite sides. Either knowingly or unknowingly working against each other in some way. It could be that Athena is part of a project (magic related?) that interfers with the goals of Curtis and his crime gang. I want to see them both grow as characters. I want Athena to harden, be less of the girl who used to throw herself head first in the danger. I want to see her become a woman who isn't emotionally dependent on anyone and if she is, it's only because she chose to, not because she lost control.
    I want to see a new interesting villain. Someone highly intelligent and dangerous (an opponent for Masato maybe?), because there is such a lack of those in simlit.
    I want to see Kian go through some life changing experience. Maybe during the search for his father? I want him to have to make some difficult choices. I want him to come out of it changed.
    I want all three friends to go on their individual quests so that all of them are very different people when they meet again.
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    HEFFNER LEGACYSimblrHeffner Legacy Discussion │ Origin ID: Maladi
  • ThePlumbobThePlumbob Posts: 4,971 Member
    Maladi777 wrote: »
    And please, don't let my wishes force you to change your plans or anything. Inspiration is fine, but I already told you that making changes for the sake of readers' satisfaction is a bad idea. You should always write the story you enjoy telling no matter what.

    I agree with this a hundred percent. Obviously it's a good thing that you're wanting to learn and grow and are so open to all kinds of feedback, but please don't compromise your vision for what the readers want - not only would that be torture for you since you'll never ever please everyone, but it would almost inevitably be detrimental to your work. With simlit of course the temptation is always there since you're getting feedback as you write, but it is your story to tell. I'm not saying it's a good idea to try to make an initial concept work at all costs if your characters grow in a different direction (HIMYM ending comes to mind here), but it needs to come from you. As a reader, being given something you "want" without the author being "behind it" is actually a pretty unsatisfying, even if it's what you asked for in the first place.

    Ok, that's just a lot of general talk. What I'm trying to say is don't overthink it. You gave us season one from the sheer brilliance of your mind. Clearly your process as is works, so don't focus on the "what to improve" bit too much :)
  • _sims_Yimi_sims_Yimi Posts: 1,747 Member
    ThePlumbob wrote: »
    Maladi777 wrote: »
    And please, don't let my wishes force you to change your plans or anything. Inspiration is fine, but I already told you that making changes for the sake of readers' satisfaction is a bad idea. You should always write the story you enjoy telling no matter what.

    I agree with this a hundred percent. Obviously it's a good thing that you're wanting to learn and grow and are so open to all kinds of feedback, but please don't compromise your vision for what the readers want - not only would that be torture for you since you'll never ever please everyone, but it would almost inevitably be detrimental to your work. With simlit of course the temptation is always there since you're getting feedback as you write, but it is your story to tell. I'm not saying it's a good idea to try to make an initial concept work at all costs if your characters grow in a different direction (HIMYM ending comes to mind here), but it needs to come from you. As a reader, being given something you "want" without the author being "behind it" is actually a pretty unsatisfying, even if it's what you asked for in the first place.

    Ok, that's just a lot of general talk. What I'm trying to say is don't overthink it. You gave us season one from the sheer brilliance of your mind. Clearly your process as is works, so don't focus on the "what to improve" bit too much :)

    Agreed. There's also the overall storyline to think of. For example - just because I say that I want Carly to become the new Miss Universe Grim reaper, make everything glittery pink and start harassing Athena to stay away from Kian with a sparkly scythe, that doesn't mean that I know what works for your story (this obviously wouldn't, but that was the point XD). People tend to be great at telling you what they like, less good at analyzing WHY they like something, and terrible at predicting what they'll like in the future. Plus, we don't have the big picture in our heads like you do. Our ideas may actually be detrimental to the storyline somewhere down the road, and we wouldn't know it.
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  • ThePlumbobThePlumbob Posts: 4,971 Member
    _sims_Yimi wrote: »
    For example - just because I say that I want Carly to become the new Miss Universe Grim reaper, make everything glittery pink and start harassing Athena to stay away from Kian with a sparkly scythe, that doesn't mean that I know what works for your story (this obviously wouldn't, but that was the point XD).

    @_sims_Yimi That's a season 2 prediction and a half 😂
  • candycottonchucandycottonchu Posts: 906 Member
    okay, first of all, that is a LOT of questions :D And I understand, it's the first story you have ever written, and you need the feedback.
    okay let me try.

    General
    General:
    1. Did you enjoy the story?
    Yes. You have managed to surprise me many times with interesting twists and tackled subjects I would have never expected. And I also enjoyed all characters you have. They each have their own personality, and you stick to it.

    2. What was your favourite part, and which was your least favourite part?
    It's a while ago, but the first that comes to my mind is the chapter with the school scenes. I really loved them. They reminded me of old high school manga, and I really enjoyed how lighthearted and easy it was, despite having their own drama. That Athena became friends with the girls that originally disliked her is also something I really enjoyed. I am sick of all those petty school rivalries :D
    As for what were my least favourite parts, I think the whole part after that long Interlude in CH15.5, with a few exceptions (the masakiri story was awesome & broke my heart). I felt a lot of it there was rushed, and plot points that promised to make more impact on the story, like Athena's memory loss, ended up being just a triviality.

    3. How do you feel about the ending?
    See above.

    4. Do you feel like the story was different from what you expected when you started?
    yes, you have surprised me over and over again while I was reading xD
    I had expected to see much more magic, but it was rather unimportant.

    5. What do you think of the darkness from chapter 6 until the end? Was the darkness too much, not much, present but not bad, present but bad? etc
    I like that you never trivialized anything evil that happened. It didn't feel like a cheap device to cause drama, but on the contrary very real. I like how realistic is the reaction of your characters to the dark stuff that happens, Athena's teenage naivety and inability to grasp the whole reality and danger of it (again, that part where she saves Leona just to see her beat up and kill (?) the attacker and is so dumbfounded made me giggle) and also Curtis' numbness to the abuse of all the girls, the death of the drug victims, and his whole world, it is awesome character depiction.

    6. What are your predictions for S2? Feel free to answer everything else before attempting this. :lol:
    Honestly, I have no idea xD Except I am afraid that that kiss scene on TV will cause Curtis to make a scene again. I'd be disappointed.

    Okay I gtg now, I'll probably answer more later :)
  • mercuryfoammercuryfoam Posts: 1,156 Member
    @Maladi777 @ThePlumbob @_sims_Yimi

    Thank you very much for the reminder! I'll definitely keep in mind to take feedback constructively but not compromise my own vision. I'm not sure about the ending of HIMYM but I've seen GoT's ending and I don't want that for my story for sure. Feels like the director lost their own passion for their story and made some weird finale there.

    Also @_sims_Yimi , I'll let you know when B2W becomes Barbie2Wainbows. We'll have a pink glitterbomb party in Slyvian Glade. Btw all is welcome! Don't miss out on the Sparkly Scythe door gifts. (just a minature model, please don't get too excited)

    I'll be replying everyone (slowly) so sorry in advance if I seem like I'm spamming my own thread. :joy: And thank you for taking on the questions. You guys are crazy! (I'll advice you to pick and choose the questions for your sanity but I can see you guys lost it somewhere along with mine. :lol: )
  • _sims_Yimi_sims_Yimi Posts: 1,747 Member
    @mercuryfoam I'm game as long as I get to bring my gnome army. :smirk:
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    Hosting D&D sessions on the side. Interested in playing through some fantasy-themed shenanigans? Send me a message 😘
  • ThePlumbobThePlumbob Posts: 4,971 Member
    I was gonna say, I hope the gnomes are coming!

    What is this sanity you speak of?
  • mercuryfoammercuryfoam Posts: 1,156 Member
    @DeafSimmer :smiley: Thank you for your reply!
    Well, when I saw "Mage in training" or whatever it is on the last banner, I expected a little more chapters than what I saw about the magic side of things. I'm not trying to sound critical, but I'm just expressing my honesty here.
    Ah you’re absolutely right. When I created that banner I was wondering if it was the right phrase to describe her. I forgot about it and now that I have a good think about it, it really wasn’t. I didn’t quite know how I would balance the aspects of Magic and Crime together and by the time I had a good gripe on it I forgot about the banner and simply left it there. I’m definitely not going to do that for S2, I’ve realised I’m no good at writing small blurbs or taglines so I'll forgo them altogether next season hehe.
    To be honest, I think Athena might have had a crush on Curtis after he defended her from the gang in that alley in the first few chapters. It seemed a bit like a "rescue romance" thing, but I don't really have a problem with that. There's just something about the damsel in distress trope that I enjoyed, even if it can be a little overused.
    You’re definitely on to something there. She caught herself thinking of Curtis cordially, during the the park scene. So yeah, she definitely has a crush on him at that point. Ah I’m glad you like the trope used. It definitely started out that way, thankfully Athena adopted the mindset to improve herself so she doesn’t stay stagnant throughout the story.
    When I think about it, it seems that she's trying not to get into as much danger, but is drawn to it for a mysterious reason. I had thought that she might have been cursed in some sort of way. As to her strengths and weaknesses, she seemed a little heady sometimes when she could have at least listened to Grim's warnings. But she was a teenager, so yeah. I couldn't say much about that one dark chapter, but it was pretty awful what she had gone through. No woman should go through that.
    I still remember you were the earliest person in the comments to point out Athena’s unluckiness. I was really impressed and I’m like “Oooh boy, I’m only revealling it in ch 13 I hope you won’t feel too frustrated to be kept hanging.” Ah so true that she’s a hard-headed person.
    At the end of the story, she seemed to have developed a bit of an edge, and I think it's a result of her getting older and learning a bit more magic. As for the upcoming season, I predict her to be more powerful and experienced if there's indeed a time skip.
    I’m not too sure what an edge means but I think you’ll be pleasantly surprised. Hopefully? xD

    Thank you for your feedback. It was great hearing from you. I appreciate your sharing of insights and that was really fun! :)


    @ThePlumbob
    Thank you I loved reading your responses (again) :smiley:
    Oh, that’s hard, I liked so many! I really liked Merchant of Time Part 2 (Is that weird? It was arguably the darkest part of the story, but really well written, and filled so many missing pieces, and I loved learning more about Masato and Kirino’s past.). I loved the lighthouse chapters, obviously Curtis and Athena finally kissing for the first time was something that was built up, and then the dramatic confrontation in the graveyard afterwards was really captivating. Also really enjoyed Curtis and Athena’s non-date. Oh, and the first introduction of Curtis and Kian was pretty awesome, they made such an impression.
    Ahh I don’t think it’s weird. I kinda like that part. It wraps up on itself like a little side story.  I'm so glad! This story has so little sweet moments that when those moments come they have to deliver themselves  !
    Least favourite part was probably the finale, but I’ll get into that later. Other than that, the parts with Athena finding her footing in the new school were not something that hugely spoke to me, but I understand how and why it was an important part of her journey and had to be shown (it’s likely because I’ve been out of high school for a very long time, and because when I was in high school, I was not very popular at all haha).
    I’m definitely on the sidelines in highschool, but my sisters were in the popular clique and gosh the drama. I drew from their experiences. I will answer that bit about the ending more descriptively later!
    I actually didn’t have any expectations when I started reading at all. I remember thinking that you did a really good job at introducing the reader to an established family (this is so hard to do if you weren’t intending on writing a story about said characters in the first place, and a lot of people don’t pull it off, so they are in an uphill struggle to try to get their readers get as invested in their characters as they are), and you immediately established a connection with Athena through her journal entries. Well and after that, it got even better
    Oof Thank you! I’m glad it was effective. I rewrote the beginning because her diary chapter was actually a pretty confrontational chapter. I wrote down the entire scene of Clarissa and friends. 
    I thought you did this really well. Yes things got progressively darker, but It felt gradual and not shoehorned in, a natural progression of the established storylines and settings. You also did a great job with foreshadowing a lot of it, so I was mentally prepared for the events of Mercy. I actually really admired how you handled the dark aspects of the story.
    Thank you this is so good to know! I am trying to lighten/balance things up in S2 (as you know) but if I can’t at least I know I didn’t do too shabbily for S1 so I have a good fallback (So far I'm at the mindset of I probably can't light this up but I'm sure I 'll find a way.) 
    I have no predictions, but things I would like seeing explored would be the aftermath of Masato’s plans coming to fruition, and whether that brought him any satisfaction (my guess is no lol), Athena’s pursuit of untamed magic – I’m guessing she will to some degree become “power-hungry,” and might need to do some soul searching about who she truly is. Heck, I can see her becoming the villain and Curtis the “good guy” trying to save the world (wasn’t that kind of thing always his motivation anyway? On a smaller, more personal scale, trying to avenge those he’s seen harmed). Oh, and I want Kian to be very happy and unharmed, k thanx 
    Ahh I love your predictions. I can't respond to it but I really like listening to them. I’m glad you shared them and you def will see some of those happening. I especially like that flip you did with AC haha! so creative! But I don't think what I have fits that model, you’ll just have to find out. As for Kian  you’ll find out too.


    Story
    Curtis’s part was pretty clear, as was his struggle of his conscience to deal with the consequences of what he contributed to. I did not fully understand Fisheye's operation but got the general feeling. Some of the multispeech bubbles were hard for me to follow, but I don’t typically read comics, so that’s to be expected. Oh, and on the first read I did not realise there were multiple pages to that part, my bad haha.
    I really, really appreciate your feedback here and in wp. I’ve identified a few areas I can turn into action, change panelling layout, speech bubbles and definitely, definitely the part about wp page buttons hidden below related posts. So silly of wordpress to have its layout like that.
    For me it all flowed really well until the final chapter. The instant attraction, the intrigue building up, them getting to know each other and falling for each other – likely accelerated due to the shared trauma was very believable, it was hard not to root for them and was built up really well. I also really liked that them finally getting together and sleeping together for the first time was ultimately hollow and unfulfilling for both of them (ok, really liked is probably a weird way of putting it  I have an appreciation for things that are sad in a beautiful way, I guess).

    So I bought into their rise, and into their fall, a hundred percent. I think my issue with the final chapter was that you did such a great job convincing me to root for them, and then such a great job at convincing me that they (well, mainly Athena) changed too much for it to work, that I struggled to buy into them saying ah well, it’s fine, we care about each other anyway so let’s give this a shot.

    Maybe it’s a pacing issue. Because the end part sped over several months of them dating, we didn’t really get to see the parts of the relationship of the “new” Athena with Curtis, so it was hard to see why they would want to keep going. Them wanting to stay together didn’t feel earned.

    Ahh that is true, thank you so much for your honesty. You’re right about it all. I could’ve fleshed out their dating scenes to make it more believable but I didn’t so the ending was incredibly unbelievable, or believable depending on how you look at it.

    So what I intended for the end was for it to be an idealised make-up from both parties. In the final chapter, we have Curtis who despite whatever Athena tells him, absolves her of all blame and is adamant on staying with her. Then we have Athena who sincerely confesses to him of her deception, but then flips around and says okay lets stay together. From a third party perspective, it IS unbelievable. I think you pointed in your comments that you smelled rat (along with almost everyone haha). I totally agree actually. It’s unbelievable as a third party watching the scene play out, but believable I think, when we look from their perspectives, Grim has just grilled Curtis for Athena’s benefit and used his guilt against him while Athena still harbors a fear of being alone. (I just had a sudden thought that this whole scene could be described as unreliable narration, not me though the characters are doing it. Ok fine me too)  What do you think? I could be trying to bluff my way out of here haha! I wonder if there's a better way to deliver this part. It might not be character motivations that make this part unbelievable, maybe I could have structured it differently.
    I guess if you and/or your SO lost your memories, would you fall in love again. Maybe, maybe not – boils down to whether we fall in love because of your personality or because of your shared experiences. I think both play a role, as does timing. But I could probably go really deep into that rabbit hole and there’s still a million more questions!

    I will say this though, contrary to the many many things I have said – and this may surprise you -I do still root for them in the long haul. I would like them to fail the sprint in order to get to the marathon. Because no marathon can be ran if you break your leg in the first mile because you grossly underestimated what you can do. Actually, that’s probably a bad analogy. I want them to break that leg, but meet at the finish line. Something to that effect. I hope you know what I’m trying to convey (poorly)
    OOh that is such food for thought. Personality or shared experience? I’m going to sit on that. Yeah I already have a dozen questions just from that can of worms you opened. (What about how the person makes you feel!? Ahh voice shadup)

    Naww totally see what you’re getting at! Sometimes we have to stop what we’re doing to get a full picture. In Athena and Curtis’s case they’re so hellbent on continuing they’ll just face the same problem over and over again. They need that thinking space if they ever want their relationship to work.
    Stubborn  From Athena’s side, especially, basically throughout.
    I think initially their relationship formed because they both desperately needed something, someone to give things meaning, to make life bearable. Because of that and the fact they were both attractive and misunderstood. Then as they opened each other, it got more substance.

    For Curtis, their relationship was what kept him alive (and that’s disregarding the fact this was literally why grim did not reap his soul) – he said himself he didn’t have much of a reason to live other than vengeance. Anyway, I’m dwelling on this.
    Rofl stubborn is a great descriptor hahaha. And man I can’t change anything of what you wrote. Here's a cookie instead :cookie:<3
    It was the most effective way to show it, through the eyes of someone not desensitized to it all. Just seeing it as Curtis for the first time would not have really delivered to the same effect. And yes, definitely felt incredibly tense and dangerous throughout.
    Thank you. :smile:
    It was handled very well, and yes I saw it coming – but not in a “so predictable” kind of way, more so like “ok, I can mentally prepare for this” kind of way. I don’t think there was a better way you could have handled it. It is something I have personal experience with (not exactly the same situation, but similar enough), but I felt warned and it was not triggering. I can’t say that I expected it at the start of the story, but the way you got to it was well executed.
    Thank you very much! When I wrote this part I wanted to make sure I was being responsible with its handling. And this makes me feel better about it. Mercy is personal to me and is a real problem that needs to be addressed. Yimi made a compelling argument of how this issue is handled irresponsibly in literature and I was very worried I'd fall in the same category because my intention was never that at all. So thank you. I really value your feedback.

    LOL yeah I did think about that sociopath bit. I’m surprised it didn’t get censored. I had a good read about sociopaths when I crafted this scene and Scorcher because I wanted to make sure Curtis doesn't become a Sociopath lol so I was reading a paper about child abuse and trauma. I’m glad you found that they worked because sometimes even when research is done, what I have in my head doesn't flow properly on paper.  I guess thats why most of my questions are focused on whether the plot made sense.
    I’m trying to remember how much we knew about how Avery left the magic realm at that point. The trade-off made sense and provided a good setup for Athena’s own, without that stepping stone the revelation of Athena losing her memories wouldn’t have the same impact.
    I do think it was believable, because Athena’s relationship with her mother was really not the closest to begin with. Athena completely bought into Avery’s front, which is what alienated them – perhaps if Athena were older, she’d understand better, but Athena was always very focused on her own motivations and narrative.
    Do you mean Avery’s front by her cheerful disposition? Or do you mean Avery’s front by her pretending they had no connection with the Magic Realm anymore? And you’re too nice on Athena. You can call her self-centered if you want. She does have a lot of flaws. 
    It was very tasteful, and the poem was really well written. The chapter was heart-breaking and I loved it.
    Ahh I’m glad it was okay. Those were one of my YOLO chapters that were based on a whim. I never realised how whimsical I am until I started writing B2W.
    - Curtis’s complete out of character aggression, manipulation and exploitation of Athena at Trevor’s house – oh definitely, he was desperate, and desperation brings out the worst in people. He had just killed the scorcher, his soul motivation for existing, with that gone, how could he allow Athena to just walk away in that moment? I wouldn’t say it was exploitation, exactly, though, I mean, is it exploitation when it’s mutual? It was exactly what she was looking for that night, after all.

    - Athena’s complete out of character aggression, loosened and unhinged behavior at Trevor’s house – yes, she just lost a big part of herself and had a huge confrontation with her mother. Teenagers act up over much less existential things.

    Thank you so much for explaining deeper. Sometimes when I craft the characters’ actions, I’d think to myself that it makes sense to me that they’ll choose to act a certain way, but I don’t understand why. So it does take someone else to point out how they’re feeling in that moment/prioritised aspect that makes me go ‘OOOOOHH’. Yeah I rely on intuition sometimes I guess. Don’t quote me on that I do think deeply of my character’s actions  . This explains my whims. OOkey.
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