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Bills are suddenly insane - how are they calculated?

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SimmervilleSimmerville Posts: 11,644 Member
I think it's on time we get to know what triggers the high bills.

My poor farm family just got bills of §31,731. Their bills were never this high, maybe just §2.000-3000. I played the family a couple generations on the same lot, and they never had income from anything else than growing a few plants. They are poor, but make ends meet. Not anymore! The total worth of this lot is §61.000 meaning they are supposed to pay all they own once more every 2 weeks? Again and again? This must be wrong. I hope it's a glitch based on a weird idea from some programmer?

I have a huge castle in Brindleton Bay. The lot value is §582.887 and the bills are around §25000-§30.000. (Been a while though, perhaps I should prepare for §1.165.000 the next time?)

So why is a small farm charged the same as a castle? Farm does not even have a thermostat, the castle does have the thermostat. The farm counts 3 sims, the castle counts 5-7 sims. EA thinks these two lots are supposed to pay the same?

Is this a result of the University careers? Like, because some sims now can get a degree and earn better money from the start of their career all must pay 10 times more than before? These farmers can't afford university, and neither are they interested as they have no income from anything else than selling their produce and some collected stuff. It feels like this sort of households have been ditched by the game.

Suddenly getting bills 10 times higher than before, for no good reason (they don't own anything special, and bought nothing new in a very long time), makes me want to cheat every household §100.000.000 and ignore money in this game completely. The bill system needs to make semse, ad it should not be radically changed overnight just because of one new feature or new pack. Not all of us start a new save for every new pack. My save is 5 years old, and I will either keep playing it or leave the game for good.

Does anyone know how bills are calculated? I so wish that we could set this ourselves in the game settings!

PS: Forgot to mention, in the farm household inventory there is just one kids bed and one framed diploma. No values.
Simmerville on Youtube | My blog is updated weekly: Simmerville's Sims<br>a.jpg

Comments

  • PenguinFoopPenguinFoop Posts: 1,582 Member
    I think it's on time we get to know what triggers the high bills.

    (1) My poor farm family just got bills of §31,731. Their bills were never this high, maybe just §2.000-3000. I played the family a couple generations on the same lot, and they never had income from anything else than growing a few plants. They are poor, but make ends meet. Not anymore! The total worth of this lot is §61.000 meaning they are supposed to pay all they own once more every 2 weeks? Again and again? This must be wrong. I hope it's a glitch based on a weird idea from some programmer?

    I have a huge castle in Brindleton Bay. The lot value is §582.887 and the bills are around §25000-§30.000. (Been a while though, perhaps I should prepare for §1.165.000 the next time?)

    So why is a small farm charged the same as a castle? Farm does not even have a thermostat, the castle does have the thermostat. The farm counts 3 sims, the castle counts 5-7 sims. EA thinks these two lots are supposed to pay the same?

    (2) Is this a result of the University careers? Like, because some sims now can get a degree and earn better money from the start of their career all must pay 10 times more than before? These farmers can't afford university, and neither are they interested as they have no income from anything else than selling their produce and some collected stuff. It feels like this sort of households have been ditched by the game.

    Suddenly getting bills 10 times higher than before, for no good reason (they don't own anything special, and bought nothing new in a very long time), (3) makes me want to cheat every household §100.000.000 and ignore money in this game completely. (4)The bill system needs to make sense, and it should not be radically changed overnight just because of one new feature or new pack. (5) Not all of us start a new save for every new pack. My save is 5 years old, and I will either keep playing it or leave the game for good.

    (6) Does anyone know how bills are calculated? (7) I so wish that we could set this ourselves in the game settings!

    PS: Forgot to mention, in the farm household inventory there is just one kids bed and one framed diploma. No values.
    1. That is an insanely high amount for bills! My modern house is valued at 359,881 and the last bills were ~17,000. Yours seems like it must be a glitch.
    2. I sure hope not! I don't have University yet and now I'm questioning whether I ever will!
    3. One thing I am sure of is that the more simoleans your household has, the higher the bills as well. So giving yourself 1m would likely just increase your bill amount. I'm not 100% sure of this but it's been my understanding in previous versions.
    4. I agree completely on this point! Continuity is definitely needed across packs!
    5. I don't start a new save because of a new pack either so I'm with you there.
    6. I've been wondering this also!
    7. I don't think that the bill amount should be set by the player. That doesn't make sense to me.
  • NorthDakotaGamerNorthDakotaGamer Posts: 2,559 Member
    @Simmerville

    Perhaps check what is in the "family inventory" via build mode. The value of that is included in averaging your bill. Beyond that, your save may be glitched.
  • PenguinFoopPenguinFoop Posts: 1,582 Member
    @Simmerville

    Perhaps check what is in the "family inventory" via build mode. The value of that is included in averaging your bill. Beyond that, your save may be glitched.

    @Simmerville posted that the only things in the family inventory is a kid's bed and a framed diploma.


  • Huiiie_07Huiiie_07 Posts: 1,200 Member
    My first thought was that it was a thermostat that caused this high amount of bills, but since you said the house doesn't have one, I am pretty sure it must be a glitch. Since the bills seem to work fine for other lots, try saving your house to the library, bulldozing the current one and replace it. Maybe this resets the bills and makes them have a normal amount again when they come back.
    Origin ID: Huiiie_07

    I like to build stuff
  • Admiral8QAdmiral8Q Posts: 3,303 Member
    @Simmerville You could start a rebellion against the extortion tax-bills, but that doesn't usually end well...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9HpDlv0rGc
    Reticulating Splines...
    9ODVlJh.png


  • FengaxFengax Posts: 9 New Member
    To my knowledge, bills are calculated using your lot value, how much lighting you have in your house, how long each light is on, use of electronics (e.g thermostats) and your income.

    In your case, check if you have a lot of lighting or if you have a lot of electronics (like for instance multiple thermostats). Other than that, it is definitely weird and could possibly be a glitch.
  • Admiral8QAdmiral8Q Posts: 3,303 Member
    I found this, from a year ago. I'll summarize it.

    From the loose inaccurate information offered, the "bills" are not directly related to time in which plumbing and lighting are in use. Its called "bills", but, its more like "taxes".
    Reticulating Splines...
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  • Admiral8QAdmiral8Q Posts: 3,303 Member
    From: zoyathedestroyah

    I wish EA would just flat out plainly tell us how bills are supposed to be calculated EXACTLY, so, people can double check the math themselves, since, (like too many things Sims 4) its prone to bugging.

    I would say this for about anything. I like the idea of there being some mystery, wonder, and, surprise in the process, but, at this point, its obvious that bug vigilance is a thing, so: Its time they just publish the exact figures on everything somewhere; how long each action is supposed to take in each related condition and skill level, what every outcome of everything is supposed to be, and, just a bunch of stuff like that for double checking purposes.

    If you don't want it "spoiled" you wouldn't have to look, but, just a verified reference material for any "...or is it a bug?" type concerns.

    As for the bills: i am going to say that S88,000 is way too high, and, something IS indeed bugged.

    From the loose inaccurate information offered, the "bills" are not directly related to time in which plumbing and lighting are in use. Its called "bills", but, its more like "taxes".

    While they stubbornly will not say what affects the bills exactly and for how much, the gathered consensus and vague info offered point to it having everything to do with the net worth of the household.

    Its a percentage of the combined value of: the house and all items on the lot, all items in inventories, and, the household simolean balance.

    However: its not a flat percentage, because, then you could easily make comparisons with other players to lock down an approximation......no.

    As i read on some Sims site somewhere: "a certain percentage of a certain amount, and, a higher percentage of a certain amount past that......" , so, its like tax brackets, but, that your still paying the lower percentage on the "certain" lower amount makes it tough to pin down. It also does not help that: while the billing is weekly, its charging at a "certain" time each day, and, the net worth fluctuates slightly from day to day.

    That and, there is still the vague suspicion that lighting and plumbing usage may still be a small factor.

    From colloquial comparison: you would have to have a ridiculous mansion, 🐸🐸🐸🐸 tons of money, and, a crap ton of items. I wish i knew the exact figures, but...

    I can tell you: my sims house value is about S600,000, i have a low amount of inventory items/books/toys, ATM: household funds running between about S10,000 and S40,000 through the week, and, the bills are close to S25,000.
    Reticulating Splines...
    9ODVlJh.png


  • logionlogion Posts: 4,712 Member
    It is probably your household inventory. That includes things that are not on your lot but are just in the household inventory catalogue in build mode.
  • Admiral8QAdmiral8Q Posts: 3,303 Member
    logion wrote: »
    It is probably your household inventory. That includes things that are not on your lot but are just in the household inventory catalogue in build mode.

    It's a glitch.

    tenor.gif?itemid=5519836
    Reticulating Splines...
    9ODVlJh.png


  • akaniki0akaniki0 Posts: 470 Member
    Wierd, my sim ( though she lives in a modest home ) is worth $500.000 plus all her property and lot with every ammenity. She has tons of expensive paintings, the most expensive furniture and more than I want to count in her inventory. Her bills are always between 5 to 7 thousand.
  • DijktafoneDijktafone Posts: 775 Member
    Admiral8Q wrote: »
    @Simmerville You could start a rebellion against the extortion tax-bills, but that doesn't usually end well...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9HpDlv0rGc

    If only you knew what I do to these in Crusader Kings II >:)

    Bills tend to take everything into account: Household value, your inventory, your household inventory, your spare money, the inventory of your kids, the inventory of your cats... Things pile up, I'm at 15k bills atm, despite the lowered bills perk, for a household value of roughly 350/400k.

    But what you say OP is very strange. Just like if bills would naturally become more and more expansive over-time.
  • Admiral8QAdmiral8Q Posts: 3,303 Member
    At a value of well over 600k § The bills are about 30k to 60k, in my Calhouni science and art home. :tongue:
    No cats though. So that may be the issue here? (kidding)
    Reticulating Splines...
    9ODVlJh.png


  • Admiral8QAdmiral8Q Posts: 3,303 Member
    Here:

    In The Sims 4, bills come once per week. Bills can be paid with a cellphone, a computer or the mailbox. They can be paid by a Sim who is a teen or older. They also appear to be more expensive than previous games. Unlike previous games, items kept in inventory will still count towards the bills.

    Any money in the household, up to 9,999,999 (which is the maximum), does not count towards bills. Any inventory in the household and all sims inventory does. Also, from the get famous pack, if you put money into the vault, then that gets counted towards the value for bills.

    One thing to note, if you use the money vault from Get Famous and put a lot of money in there, that counts towards house value. I won the lottery once, made 1 million. Immediately purchased a vault and put the full million in there. My next bill was over $46,000. I ended up removing the vault.

    also, items in your personal inventories are calculated in household bills, especially items you harvest from your garden! If you want to keep bills down, don't have a lot of plants in your inventory, especially more expensive ones like dragonfruit.

    It has to do with your house value and the things inside your house, your bills are not affected by how much funds you have.

    So if you have alot of books, food in the fridge, upgrade components, rare items from adventures or work, even paintings and photos, that all counts towards the "bill/tax".
    Reticulating Splines...
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  • SimmervilleSimmerville Posts: 11,644 Member
    logion wrote: »
    It is probably your household inventory. That includes things that are not on your lot but are just in the household inventory catalogue in build mode.

    Household inventory contains just one kids bed and one framed diploma. I can't see how that should cause insane bills.
    Admiral8Q wrote: »
    Here:

    In The Sims 4, bills come once per week. Bills can be paid with a cellphone, a computer or the mailbox. They can be paid by a Sim who is a teen or older. They also appear to be more expensive than previous games. Unlike previous games, items kept in inventory will still count towards the bills.

    Any money in the household, up to 9,999,999 (which is the maximum), does not count towards bills. Any inventory in the household and all sims inventory does. Also, from the get famous pack, if you put money into the vault, then that gets counted towards the value for bills.

    One thing to note, if you use the money vault from Get Famous and put a lot of money in there, that counts towards house value. I won the lottery once, made 1 million. Immediately purchased a vault and put the full million in there. My next bill was over $46,000. I ended up removing the vault.

    also, items in your personal inventories are calculated in household bills, especially items you harvest from your garden! If you want to keep bills down, don't have a lot of plants in your inventory, especially more expensive ones like dragonfruit.

    It has to do with your house value and the things inside your house, your bills are not affected by how much funds you have.

    So if you have alot of books, food in the fridge, upgrade components, rare items from adventures or work, even paintings and photos, that all counts towards the "bill/tax".

    Personal inventories includes a few harvests, but everything that can be sold is sold because this house is poor and has no chance to save up anything. Harvests are used for fertilizing, so they are not massive either, perhapse 10-20 items total, and only the sorts like parsley and bell pepper - nothing fancy.

    I recall in TS1 we got some info with the bills breaking up the total in 3 or 4 sums, explaining half way what it contained. They could have provided similar info in TS4, say if bills are §15.000, breaking it up like §4.000 property, §7.000 power, §3.000 water supply, §1.000 other. Then I would have a chance to see where to start reducing consume - power.

    We have a similar TS4 break down in Dine Out, probably also in Get to work if running a business. You get to know how costs are spread on wages, advertising and restocking (I think). They can easily include it for household bills too, if they want. It would be good for simmers, and the younger of us might even learn some private budgeting from it :)
    Simmerville on Youtube | My blog is updated weekly: Simmerville's Sims<br>a.jpg
  • SimmervilleSimmerville Posts: 11,644 Member
    edited March 2020
    Admiral8Q wrote: »
    @Simmerville You could start a rebellion against the extortion tax-bills, but that doesn't usually end well...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9HpDlv0rGc

    I'm planning to include some bill protests for my As Sims Go By video series, where a Council is essential :)
    Simmerville on Youtube | My blog is updated weekly: Simmerville's Sims<br>a.jpg
  • Sketch793Sketch793 Posts: 1,218 Member
    There's a known bug for bills that you receive while on another lot, especially if you are on vacation to Granite Falls (OR) or Selvadorada (JA). It appears that the game includes the value of the vacation lot and/or the lot you are visiting when calculating your bill.

    https://answers.ea.com/t5/Bug-Reports/OPEN-OR-Bills-are-higher-when-on-vacation/m-p/4318964#M8555
    https://answers.ea.com/t5/Bug-Reports/NEEDS-INPUT-OR-JA-Very-High-Household-Bills-While-On-Vacation/m-p/8243899#M106031
    https://answers.ea.com/t5/Bug-Reports/NEEDS-INPUT-Off-Grid-Living-Sims-receive-bill/m-p/7956975#M92149
  • SimmervilleSimmerville Posts: 11,644 Member
    edited March 2020
    Sketch793 wrote: »
    There's a known bug for bills that you receive while on another lot, especially if you are on vacation to Granite Falls (OR) or Selvadorada (JA). It appears that the game includes the value of the vacation lot and/or the lot you are visiting when calculating your bill.

    https://answers.ea.com/t5/Bug-Reports/OPEN-OR-Bills-are-higher-when-on-vacation/m-p/4318964#M8555
    https://answers.ea.com/t5/Bug-Reports/NEEDS-INPUT-OR-JA-Very-High-Household-Bills-While-On-Vacation/m-p/8243899#M106031
    https://answers.ea.com/t5/Bug-Reports/NEEDS-INPUT-Off-Grid-Living-Sims-receive-bill/m-p/7956975#M92149

    Thanks! I did not know this.

    So, because I play on rotation, and can't make sure to stay home at that time because I have no idea when bills will be delivered (assuming it's every 7th active day, and not on a set time) my options would be:

    A Never leaving home lot.
    B: Play normally but cheat all charged bills worth, and rather add my own bill system outside the game.

    If this is an old bug and EA is aware but do not try to fix it, I must say I'm out of words...
    Simmerville on Youtube | My blog is updated weekly: Simmerville's Sims<br>a.jpg
  • zap608zap608 Posts: 82 Member
    Yes it is a very very old bug and no they can't be bothered to fix it. I had a huge bill while on vacation that my single sim had no hope of paying. Reason? I was billed or taxed for her home plus the lot she was renting and the park she was visiting at the time the bills were issued. Total over S188,000. I now NEVER go out on bill day, or stay longer than 6 days while on vacation. I imagine the jungle Adventure trail and some shops could produce some really stupid bills if caught on them on tax day. I have even been billed for the value of the Lab while working. It can't be difficult to fix it never ever happened in the Sims 2.
    Find me; Freeasabird, The Shed @ Sims 4 Studio. Custom content for The Sims 4.
  • SindocatSindocat Posts: 5,622 Member
    Of course they fix bugs. We get a bug fix patch approximately every month.

    Thing is, game code is really weird and fussy, and they won't release a fix if it breaks six other things. So we get the fixes they can come up with that work.

    Also, there is a scale of priority. Since the means to adjust household funds for ourselves on the fly is in place, this one is not very high on the list. If it is old, and hasn't been fixed, it probably has issues tying in to other base game functions.

    Don't make accusations that are patently ridiculous. Of course the Gurus want the game to work as well as it possibly can.
  • Admiral8QAdmiral8Q Posts: 3,303 Member
    The definition of an update:
    Fix the old bugs and put new ones in. :D
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  • WaytoomanyUIDsWaytoomanyUIDs Posts: 844 Member
    I haven't tried it, But the SNBills mod (by the same modders as SNBank) includes a detailed breakdown of the bill. The property tax part of SNBills seems a bit extortionate, though. I don't know how it handles this bug though, but it might be worth trying.
    Origin/Gallery ID: WaytoomanyUIDs
  • SimmervilleSimmerville Posts: 11,644 Member
    I haven't tried it, But the SNBills mod (by the same modders as SNBank) includes a detailed breakdown of the bill. The property tax part of SNBills seems a bit extortionate, though. I don't know how it handles this bug though, but it might be worth trying.

    Cool, I'll look that one up! Would be interesting seeing the set up.

    For now, I'm having massive protests in front of my Council House, and the Councilor of Health & Welfare is working on a routine to help those getting insane bills over a certain level.
    Simmerville on Youtube | My blog is updated weekly: Simmerville's Sims<br>a.jpg
  • ddd994ddd994 Posts: 418 Member
    It’s not necessarily high lot value that gives you high bills btw, it’s having expensive items.

    That’s why on legacy challenge you always start with the suit of armour in your inventory, it gives you hefty bills from day one.. And if you add 100k+ to your vault from famous, that item will now have that value, so prepare for crazzzy bills lol
  • PenguinFoopPenguinFoop Posts: 1,582 Member
    Sketch793 wrote: »
    There's a known bug for bills that you receive while on another lot, especially if you are on vacation to Granite Falls (OR) or Selvadorada (JA). It appears that the game includes the value of the vacation lot and/or the lot you are visiting when calculating your bill.

    https://answers.ea.com/t5/Bug-Reports/OPEN-OR-Bills-are-higher-when-on-vacation/m-p/4318964#M8555
    https://answers.ea.com/t5/Bug-Reports/NEEDS-INPUT-OR-JA-Very-High-Household-Bills-While-On-Vacation/m-p/8243899#M106031
    https://answers.ea.com/t5/Bug-Reports/NEEDS-INPUT-Off-Grid-Living-Sims-receive-bill/m-p/7956975#M92149

    Thanks! I did not know this.

    So, because I play on rotation, and can't make sure to stay home at that time because I have no idea when bills will be delivered (assuming it's every 7th active day, and not on a set time) my options would be:

    A Never leaving home lot.
    B: Play normally but cheat all charged bills worth, and rather add my own bill system outside the game.

    If this is an old bug and EA is aware but do not try to fix it, I must say I'm out of words...

    The bills are always on Monday. Just so you know. :) However, the time of day on Monday seems random. Just like my mail in real life. Misty gets to our house anywhere between 10:30 am and 12:30 pm. In the game, it seems that I've never gotten the bills before 10:00 am and never after 3:00 pm but always on Monday.

    Also, several games I've played have had careers that allowed me to take my sim to work and several have retail stores and I never noticed a spike in bills just from being out and about on Monday. However, I can't visit Granite Falls or Selvadorada since I don't have those packs. In fact, I've often wondered why my sims retail stores don't seem to be counted in the bills...

    I'm on Xbox One so don't know if that matters.

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