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Looking Forward To the End Of TS4

Comments

  • EA_RtasEA_Rtas Posts: 2,291 EA Moderator
    Hey folks I removed some off topic stuff from in here, let's keep it on topic please.
  • CinebarCinebar Posts: 31,023 Member
    edited August 20
    As far as people liking the idea of the series getting difficult sliders, I don't see that actually helps the PC series. I can see something like that for console but not for a computer version. Here is why I think this is a bad idea. In past games a difficulty slider wasn't necessary. It covered life and simulated life. The difference in difficulty was in the gameplay. No slider necessary. We all know life for a Sim is much easiser if they have a smoke detector in all the games. Why insert a slider to curb a fire outbreak when a smoke detector is the fail safe, 99% of the time. (If there are firefighters). Or even better fail safe was Sims could learn fire prevention and were no longer prone to stand around screaming but would go ahead and put the fire out, if no fire detector. See, there is where you don't need sliders, because the fail safes have always been in the gameplay.

    One, if you didn't want to see a Sim burn up, fire alarm in every room with anything that could catch fire. Problems solved. No difficulty level needed. Two, if you wanted it to not be so easy, no fire alarm and no studying fire prevention.

    I also don't think difficulty slider solves so called 'challenging' gameplay issues. I don't expect Sims who don't have a fridge, or a garden or friut trees to be able to pull imaginary food from their back pocket like they do in TS4. There is the rub, the game so water down with the built in fail safe, that one can't even tell a story about a Sim starving. Why did they feel it was necessary for the Sim in TS4 to be able to reach for food the player has no idea exists? That is more of a kiddy game to me. And no difficult slider should be inserted in my opinion, why not leave it up to the player whether they want to make sure the Sim has a garden to grabe some food, or a fridge, or a grill and or food in inventory. The great thing about the past games were they were player triggered, player choice, player inspired situations. Fail safes were always built in but by player choice, stove or no stove, fire alarm or no fire alarm, food on lot or no food on lot. Not the Sim able to go against the player and pull out food if they were about to starve. Why even add such a fail safe when it was always up to player's trigger since 2000. But not anymore.

    Energy and time. No difficulty level slider needed because the choices were in the gameplay. And triggered by player. Beds, the better bed since 2000 was always a walk down easy lane. Player choice. Whether the low end bed filled energy and comfort slower than a more expensive bed which takes less than four hours. I'm not the type of player who confines myself to a strict rule that Sims can't get up before 6 AM. No, if their energy is full, then time to get up in my game and do whatever it is I need them to do or finish. My Sims never lived by 'rules' of the game. Up an hour before work etc. and little time for food or bath etc. No, better bed equaled up earlier and more time to set out living their life before work or school etc.

    Same thing with lounge chair/ reclyner. The better one offered faster napping so energy filled faster, no need for a difficulty slider. These games have always been as easy or hard as one wants to make them until TS4 where it's easy street.

    Filling hunger, in the older games, counters, refridge, stove, table, food and skill all added food points. Why eat cereal that wouldn't keep the Sim full very long when we should know by now, the harder, more skill required foods and appliances offered fuller longer, no need to eat again for hours. However, with TS3 they forgot these fun facts, and took away starvation not to happen until at least 72 hours had passed without any food, but even in TS3 they have a built in fail safe that allows Sim to conger up some fake food from the rear pocket. When the player could have played this out by choice of the food and tables and applicances and counters offered whether the game would be harder or easier.

    The game has never needed difficulty sliders, but one thing is for sure TS4 must be set on first grade level from what I have experienced of how easy to the point you can leave it running and go off to the store down the street and nothing happened.

    ETA: And the one thing they did right was vampire pack. It was all player triggered. Didn't want a vampire breaking in, then don't answer the door the first time. That example shows some still remember The Sims were always player triggered gameplay. And I do appreciate them or someone remembering that fact when they built the vampire pack.

    "Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.

    https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/958714/cinebar-custom-content-clothes-updating-links/p1


  • DragonCat159DragonCat159 Posts: 1,789 Member

    Would this video fit the situation ?
  • Writin_RegWritin_Reg Posts: 28,818 Member
    Lots more coming -


    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/electronic-arts-boosts-gaming-lineup-164104919.html


    LIKE THIS:

    EA plans to bring at least 20 new content drops and expansion packs to The Sims franchise in fiscal 2020.

    "Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.

    In dreams - I LIVE!
    In REALITY, I simply exist.....

  • drake_mccartydrake_mccarty Posts: 5,662 Member
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Lots more coming -


    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/electronic-arts-boosts-gaming-lineup-164104919.html


    LIKE THIS:

    EA plans to bring at least 20 new content drops and expansion packs to The Sims franchise in fiscal 2020.

    They said this months ago. This isn’t news really.
  • Writin_RegWritin_Reg Posts: 28,818 Member
    edited August 20
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Lots more coming -


    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/electronic-arts-boosts-gaming-lineup-164104919.html


    LIKE THIS:

    EA plans to bring at least 20 new content drops and expansion packs to The Sims franchise in fiscal 2020.

    They said this months ago. This isn’t news really.

    It was new - yesterdays investment news for the year coming. Yesterdays date.

    EA just had a stock holders meeting about 8-10 days ago - so it's all new or renewed maybe .
    Post edited by Writin_Reg on

    "Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.

    In dreams - I LIVE!
    In REALITY, I simply exist.....

  • JoAnne65JoAnne65 Posts: 22,581 Member
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Lots more coming -


    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/electronic-arts-boosts-gaming-lineup-164104919.html


    LIKE THIS:

    EA plans to bring at least 20 new content drops and expansion packs to The Sims franchise in fiscal 2020.

    They said this months ago. This isn’t news really.

    It was new - yesterdays investment news for the year coming. Yesterdays date.

    EA just had a stock holders meeting about 8-10 days ago - so it's all new or renewed maybe .
    Could you please stick to the topic though? The topic isn’t “how much future do think Sims 4’s future still has”, that would be a topic for the section Speculation. This topic is about why (or why not) it should stop according to simmers. Not EA or simgurus.
  • Writin_RegWritin_Reg Posts: 28,818 Member
    JoAnne65 wrote: »
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Lots more coming -


    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/electronic-arts-boosts-gaming-lineup-164104919.html


    LIKE THIS:

    EA plans to bring at least 20 new content drops and expansion packs to The Sims franchise in fiscal 2020.

    They said this months ago. This isn’t news really.

    It was new - yesterdays investment news for the year coming. Yesterdays date.

    EA just had a stock holders meeting about 8-10 days ago - so it's all new or renewed maybe .
    Could you please stick to the topic though? The topic isn’t “how much future do think Sims 4’s future still has”, that would be a topic for the section Speculation. This topic is about why (or why not) it should stop according to simmers. Not EA or simgurus.

    Ultimately It is EA's decision - not the hand ful of simmers in this thread. Everyone has an opinion - and no one in this thread has a right to say rest of us can't weigh in. It's on the forum for every one. I am as much a simmer as you are - whats more i follow what the company has to say - the company has the answers and they are just talking about the games future - so are the stock holders and i don't see where they see it the way of this little thread.

    "Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.

    In dreams - I LIVE!
    In REALITY, I simply exist.....

  • playermarko456playermarko456 Posts: 4,927 Member
    TS4 is one step forwards, two steps back. With each predecessor, the next successive iteration would bring something progressive/improved upon to the Sims Franchise. For example, with TS1, when TS2 released, TS2 introduced 3D neighborhoods and Sim Models, an in-depth Create-A-Household tool, Memory System, etc. With TS3, TS3 introduced open world environment, Create-A-Style tool, personalities, etc.

    TS4 has a powerful CAS with being able to push and pull, but is a step back because instead of 5 personality traits, we have 3. I feel like the traits are just there for show and don't impact my gameplay as much as I want it to because of the Mood System we have. A Sim with the Good trait should not be able to be friends with a Sim with an Evil/Mean trait or a Family-Oriented Sim should not be able to be friends with someone that dislikes children. In TS4, I can and it defies all logic.

    With TS4, we were stripped of open world, stripped of CASt, small worlds, packs being broken down. Why not merge your team? Merge the packs? Why not merge EPs and GPs together? Back in TS2 and TS3, we just had EPs and SPs. I don't feel it is necessary to have 3 different teams working on 3 different pack types.

    If I'm visiting a neighbor, I shouldn't have to be hit with a loading screen. Sure, it is only a couple seconds, but TS4 could've had limited open world within the world you're in. For example, say your Sim lives in Willow Creek. Your Sim can freely visit lots/neighbors within Willow Creek without loading screens, however, if you want to visit a lot that isn't within Willow Creek (i.e Forgotten Hollow), it then would make sense to have a loading screen because it is not an extension of Willow Creek; it is its own world.

    With TS5, I want the team to push the boundaries within the Sims franchise. I want them to task risks. I want a Sims game that doesn't follow trends. I want Sims that have desires/fears. I want to see my Sim fail. Life isn't all perfect and happy. I want the Sims Team to go back and revisit previous iterations and take note of what made those games so successful.

    With StrangerVille, I appreciated this pack because of how close it was to the crazy wackiness of TS2. Yes, it was scripted, but you could avoid it and do your own thing. It didn't make it any less sandboxy. TS2 had families with scripted events and had you playing them in a certain order, but you didn't have to play them. You could create your own Sims, create your own stories, etc.

    Take a look: https://strategywiki.org/wiki/The_Sims_2/Walkthrough/Pleasantview

  • NushnushganayNushnushganay Posts: 203 Member
    I spent more time on the original TheSims when it first came out, and on TS4 recently, than I ever did with TS2 and TS3, so I don't have the depth on 2 and 3 that others do, but I do find the character-centered play of TS4 a fascinating and welcome change that keeps me guessing about hidden architecture in Sim personalities, perhaps destinies, tendencies, etc. that I keep encountering regardless of set traits, careers, and skills.

    Further, I find the play on TS4 feels more slick, streamlined. I recall getting turned off by how burdensome it felt to have too many details to attend to, too much of the time, and an agonizingly slow process of proceeding through life and relationships, in 2 and 3. I have yet to play Strangerville because I have a bit of an aversion to the idea of a "choose your own adventure" script complete with a boss level, in Simming, but after reading here, about some quirkiness it might add, will have to go check it out more.

    I guess one thing I love about TS4 is the sensation that I am no longer just playing digital dollhouse, but playing with characters that have algorithms a little more complex, that give them depth to discover, personalities that aren't just mine to dictate down to the nth detail. I have seen some Sims who just seemed born under an unlucky star, for romantic success, compared to others, even when they had all the same traits and aspirations. And some Sims have spawned who got deleted when I got too frustrated with them being unwilling or incapable of responding to any of their own bodily needs, ever. Made me wonder if there were a "too stupid to survive" gene or script.

    And I do wonder if there isn't something like a very small bit of learning algorithm that deepens a Sim the longer it is played? I also wonder whether each preset Sim (the townies) are identical in each iteration of the game, or whether they have certain things randomized each time I start a new game?

    There is a lot of magic and sparkle in trying to find out, that simply wasn't there in previous games. I really like whatever it is they have done that made the game more character-centered because it has brought some of the characters so much to life for me, as if they were characters in a well-written novel instead of just paper dolls.

    So, for the fascinating mystery of finding out about them, that they aren't tabula rasa after all, I am really digging TS4 over previous versions.
    "Common sense and training prohibit me from divulging information for which both the need and the right to know have not been adequately demonstrated" -Redacted
  • Evil_OneEvil_One Posts: 4,407 Member
    edited August 21
    I think I'd rather play a game in which I know where the systems are and what they are, rather than imagining that there are more than are really there.

    TS2's systems had a lot of complex interactions as the memory system would change the ways sims behaved... The Sims 4 has no such system in place.
    raw
  • SimburianSimburian Posts: 4,732 Member
    I spent more time on the original TheSims when it first came out, and on TS4 recently, than I ever did with TS2 and TS3, so I don't have the depth on 2 and 3 that others do, but I do find the character-centered play of TS4 a fascinating and welcome change that keeps me guessing about hidden architecture in Sim personalities, perhaps destinies, tendencies, etc. that I keep encountering regardless of set traits, careers, and skills.

    Further, I find the play on TS4 feels more slick, streamlined. I recall getting turned off by how burdensome it felt to have too many details to attend to, too much of the time, and an agonizingly slow process of proceeding through life and relationships, in 2 and 3. I have yet to play Strangerville because I have a bit of an aversion to the idea of a "choose your own adventure" script complete with a boss level, in Simming, but after reading here, about some quirkiness it might add, will have to go check it out more.

    I guess one thing I love about TS4 is the sensation that I am no longer just playing digital dollhouse, but playing with characters that have algorithms a little more complex, that give them depth to discover, personalities that aren't just mine to dictate down to the nth detail. I have seen some Sims who just seemed born under an unlucky star, for romantic success, compared to others, even when they had all the same traits and aspirations. And some Sims have spawned who got deleted when I got too frustrated with them being unwilling or incapable of responding to any of their own bodily needs, ever. Made me wonder if there were a "too stupid to survive" gene or script.

    And I do wonder if there isn't something like a very small bit of learning algorithm that deepens a Sim the longer it is played? I also wonder whether each preset Sim (the townies) are identical in each iteration of the game, or whether they have certain things randomized each time I start a new game?

    There is a lot of magic and sparkle in trying to find out, that simply wasn't there in previous games. I really like whatever it is they have done that made the game more character-centered because it has brought some of the characters so much to life for me, as if they were characters in a well-written novel instead of just paper dolls.

    So, for the fascinating mystery of finding out about them, that they aren't tabula rasa after all, I am really digging TS4 over previous versions.

    It's something that I can't define easily but you have the nearest to what I feel about Sims 4. The more packs added the more interlocking and depth of my Sims become. SimGuruGrant, just on Twitter, has hinted at more to come after these two this year after congratulating the Team from the sidelines, another Guru hinting that University would have to be bigger than a GP, so those looking for an end to Sims 4 will have to go on hoping for a bit.

    Everything has to come to an end sometime though but I think a lot of Simmers could stay with Sims 4 just as some have with Sims 2. :)
  • AHolyToiletAHolyToilet Posts: 772 Member
    edited August 21
    TS4 has a powerful CAS with being able to push and pull, but is a step back because instead of 5 personality traits, we have 3. I feel like the traits are just there for show and don't impact my gameplay as much as I want it to because of the Mood System we have. A Sim with the Good trait should not be able to be friends with a Sim with an Evil/Mean trait or a Family-Oriented Sim should not be able to be friends with someone that dislikes children. In TS4, I can and it defies all logic.

    I'd like to expand on this a bit. It's not just that our Sims can only have 3 traits and the traits prevent realistic relationships being made, they don't actually do much at all. Let's use the evil trait as an example.

    TS4 Evil Trait attributes:
    • These Sims may laugh maniacally.
      Have the "Discuss Evil Plans" interaction with other evil Sims.
      Will have the "Good v.s. Evil" moodlet when interacting with a good Sim.
      Will have the "Near Misery" moodlet when a Sim has negative moodlets.
      Will have the "Dismiss Goodness" interaction with a good Sim.
      Will laugh manically at the death of an enemy, whilst normal Sims would just be happy.
      Evil Sims can also smash dollhouses even when currently not angry.
      Will laugh at pets when they misbehave.

    And that's about it. There's not much else the trait does in the game. As opposed to TS3 Evil Trait Attributes, Advantages/Disadvantages, and Player Notes, to name just a few without cluttering up this post:
    • Sim will get a "Fiendishly Delighted" moodlet when misfortune strikes nearby Sims!
      Sim doesn't mind a lack of light, a dark lair is welcome!
      Sim will excel in the criminal career track.
      Sim will fare well in most fights.
      Evil Sims cruelly enjoy harassing other Sims when misfortune strikes them, such as mocking a Sim who died known to the other Sim, or teasing a Sim for not reaching the toilet in time. Other Evil Sims and Mean Spirited Sims, however, enjoy listening to the mocking.
      Evil Sims can "Shakedown" other Sims for money.
      Sometimes when walking into a room, an Evil Sim will rub his or her hands together and laugh maniacally.
      Evil Sims never get the Upset moodlet when fighting with a friend or family member, instead they will wish to see their ghost.
      Evil Sims often wish to befriend other Evil Sims upon discovering that they both share the Evil trait.
      Evil Sims are immune to the Creepy Graveyard moodlet, and aren't scared of vampires, or bugs. Evil Sims will still be disturbed by ghosts, unless they have another trait like Brave, Party Animal or Daredevil alongside it.
      An Evil Sim will always laugh when mourning a dying Sim who was unfriendly, but will cry if the Sim who has died was part of their household or was their friend. Regardless, witnessing a dying Sim will give them the "Fiendishly Delighted" moodlet for a few hours. Evil Sims also gain a slight Fun boost from watching non-friends and non-household members die.

    And there's a whole lot more the trait does. Even if TS3 allowed only three traits, the Sims would have far more depth to them because the traits do more because the game has more than TS4 could ever hope to achieve. Yet instead, the game allows five. And with University, makes the maximum seven traits in ONE Sim. Which is another reason why I find it difficult to continue supporting this game. Realm of Magic, assuming its good, is likely going to be the last pack I purchase. I already have a bunch of magic-themed Sims waiting in line for it. I might as well try to have fun with that.
  • CinebarCinebar Posts: 31,023 Member
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Lots more coming -


    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/electronic-arts-boosts-gaming-lineup-164104919.html


    LIKE THIS:

    EA plans to bring at least 20 new content drops and expansion packs to The Sims franchise in fiscal 2020.

    They said this months ago. This isn’t news really.

    It was new - yesterdays investment news for the year coming. Yesterdays date.

    EA just had a stock holders meeting about 8-10 days ago - so it's all new or renewed maybe .

    The game is already in fiscal year 2020. It ends in April of next year. The twenty content drops were determined over on SimsVip (months ago) to be across all platforms. Not twenty individual packs or patched content drops for just the pc version. Example: One pack for pc, console, mobile etc. equals three.
    "Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.

    https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/958714/cinebar-custom-content-clothes-updating-links/p1


  • HestiaHestia Posts: 1,640 Member
    edited August 21
    TS4 has a powerful CAS with being able to push and pull, but is a step back because instead of 5 personality traits, we have 3. I feel like the traits are just there for show and don't impact my gameplay as much as I want it to because of the Mood System we have. A Sim with the Good trait should not be able to be friends with a Sim with an Evil/Mean trait or a Family-Oriented Sim should not be able to be friends with someone that dislikes children. In TS4, I can and it defies all logic.

    I'd like to expand on this a bit. It's not just that our Sims can only have 3 traits and the traits prevent realistic relationships being made, they don't actually do much at all. Let's use the evil trait as an example.

    TS4 Evil Trait attributes:
    • These Sims may laugh maniacally.
      Have the "Discuss Evil Plans" interaction with other evil Sims.
      Will have the "Good v.s. Evil" moodlet when interacting with a good Sim.
      Will have the "Near Misery" moodlet when a Sim has negative moodlets.
      Will have the "Dismiss Goodness" interaction with a good Sim.
      Will laugh manically at the death of an enemy, whilst normal Sims would just be happy.
      Evil Sims can also smash dollhouses even when currently not angry.
      Will laugh at pets when they misbehave.

    And that's about it. There's not much else the trait does in the game. As opposed to TS3 Evil Trait Attributes, Advantages/Disadvantages, and Player Notes, to name just a few without cluttering up this post:
    • Sim will get a "Fiendishly Delighted" moodlet when misfortune strikes nearby Sims!
      Sim doesn't mind a lack of light, a dark lair is welcome!
      Sim will excel in the criminal career track.
      Sim will fare well in most fights.
      Evil Sims cruelly enjoy harassing other Sims when misfortune strikes them, such as mocking a Sim who died known to the other Sim, or teasing a Sim for not reaching the toilet in time. Other Evil Sims and Mean Spirited Sims, however, enjoy listening to the mocking.
      Evil Sims can "Shakedown" other Sims for money.
      Sometimes when walking into a room, an Evil Sim will rub his or her hands together and laugh maniacally.
      Evil Sims never get the Upset moodlet when fighting with a friend or family member, instead they will wish to see their ghost.
      Evil Sims often wish to befriend other Evil Sims upon discovering that they both share the Evil trait.
      Evil Sims are immune to the Creepy Graveyard moodlet, and aren't scared of vampires, or bugs. Evil Sims will still be disturbed by ghosts, unless they have another trait like Brave, Party Animal or Daredevil alongside it.
      An Evil Sim will always laugh when mourning a dying Sim who was unfriendly, but will cry if the Sim who has died was part of their household or was their friend. Regardless, witnessing a dying Sim will give them the "Fiendishly Delighted" moodlet for a few hours. Evil Sims also gain a slight Fun boost from watching non-friends and non-household members die.

    And there's a whole lot more the trait does. Even if TS3 allowed only three traits, the Sims would have far more depth to them because the traits do more because the game has more than TS4 could ever hope to achieve. Yet instead, the game allows five. And with University, makes the maximum seven traits in ONE Sim. Which is another reason why I find it difficult to continue supporting this game. Realm of Magic, assuming its good, is likely going to be the last pack I purchase. I already have a bunch of magic-themed Sims waiting in line for it. I might as well try to have fun with that.

    Mhm! Well said @AHolyToilet ! Due to these unique traits, all of the Sims from TS3 had their own personalities and different interactions appeared at all times depending on what they are like. Even though the Sims 1 and The Sims 2 didn’t specifically have personality traits, they did have a personality based on points allocated into the neats/active ness/social/etc. and these were enough back then to have them completely unique during interactions or reactions. Thus defining their emotions more when something happens.

    One single example from past iterations

    The Sims 1: Slobs would complain if they began cleaning something.

    The Sims 2: Lazy Sims will change their clothes with a sloppier animation.

    The Sims 3: Too much to explain in a single thread comment. Best to read up on the Wiki. :p

    The traits system in TS4 is too basic and doesn’t depict much at all about the Sim. It affects more on their emotions rather than their personality.

    I think personalities bring out better emotions rather than the other way around.
    OriginID: hestiah23 | Showcase
    jfIpSFy.png
  • CinebarCinebar Posts: 31,023 Member
    edited August 21
    Hestia wrote: »
    TS4 has a powerful CAS with being able to push and pull, but is a step back because instead of 5 personality traits, we have 3. I feel like the traits are just there for show and don't impact my gameplay as much as I want it to because of the Mood System we have. A Sim with the Good trait should not be able to be friends with a Sim with an Evil/Mean trait or a Family-Oriented Sim should not be able to be friends with someone that dislikes children. In TS4, I can and it defies all logic.

    I'd like to expand on this a bit. It's not just that our Sims can only have 3 traits and the traits prevent realistic relationships being made, they don't actually do much at all. Let's use the evil trait as an example.

    TS4 Evil Trait attributes:
    • These Sims may laugh maniacally.
      Have the "Discuss Evil Plans" interaction with other evil Sims.
      Will have the "Good v.s. Evil" moodlet when interacting with a good Sim.
      Will have the "Near Misery" moodlet when a Sim has negative moodlets.
      Will have the "Dismiss Goodness" interaction with a good Sim.
      Will laugh manically at the death of an enemy, whilst normal Sims would just be happy.
      Evil Sims can also smash dollhouses even when currently not angry.
      Will laugh at pets when they misbehave.

    And that's about it. There's not much else the trait does in the game. As opposed to TS3 Evil Trait Attributes, Advantages/Disadvantages, and Player Notes, to name just a few without cluttering up this post:
    • Sim will get a "Fiendishly Delighted" moodlet when misfortune strikes nearby Sims!
      Sim doesn't mind a lack of light, a dark lair is welcome!
      Sim will excel in the criminal career track.
      Sim will fare well in most fights.
      Evil Sims cruelly enjoy harassing other Sims when misfortune strikes them, such as mocking a Sim who died known to the other Sim, or teasing a Sim for not reaching the toilet in time. Other Evil Sims and Mean Spirited Sims, however, enjoy listening to the mocking.
      Evil Sims can "Shakedown" other Sims for money.
      Sometimes when walking into a room, an Evil Sim will rub his or her hands together and laugh maniacally.
      Evil Sims never get the Upset moodlet when fighting with a friend or family member, instead they will wish to see their ghost.
      Evil Sims often wish to befriend other Evil Sims upon discovering that they both share the Evil trait.
      Evil Sims are immune to the Creepy Graveyard moodlet, and aren't scared of vampires, or bugs. Evil Sims will still be disturbed by ghosts, unless they have another trait like Brave, Party Animal or Daredevil alongside it.
      An Evil Sim will always laugh when mourning a dying Sim who was unfriendly, but will cry if the Sim who has died was part of their household or was their friend. Regardless, witnessing a dying Sim will give them the "Fiendishly Delighted" moodlet for a few hours. Evil Sims also gain a slight Fun boost from watching non-friends and non-household members die.

    And there's a whole lot more the trait does. Even if TS3 allowed only three traits, the Sims would have far more depth to them because the traits do more because the game has more than TS4 could ever hope to achieve. Yet instead, the game allows five. And with University, makes the maximum seven traits in ONE Sim. Which is another reason why I find it difficult to continue supporting this game. Realm of Magic, assuming its good, is likely going to be the last pack I purchase. I already have a bunch of magic-themed Sims waiting in line for it. I might as well try to have fun with that.

    Mhm! Well said @AHolyToilet ! Due to these unique traits, all of the Sims from TS3 had their own personalities and different interactions appeared at all times depending on what they are like. Even though the Sims 1 and The Sims 2 didn’t specifically have personality traits, they did have a personality based on points allocated into the neats/active ness/social/etc. and these were enough back then to have them completely unique during interactions or reactions. Thus defining their emotions more when something happens.

    One single example from past iterations

    The Sims 1: Slobs would complain if they began cleaning something.

    The Sims 2: Lazy Sims will change their clothes with a sloppier animation.

    The Sims 3: Too much to explain in a single thread comment. Best to read up on the Wiki. :p

    The traits system in TS4 is too basic and doesn’t depict much at all about the Sim. It affects more on their emotions rather than their personality.

    I think personalities bring out better emotions rather than the other way around.

    For any of us who have been begging they overhaul the trait and emotion system in this game I think it stands to reason after five years they have decided it's not necessary, and not going to improve it and or fix their irrelevant trait system. They should have seen from the very beginning there are way too many overlaps making the Sim with a particular trait useless since an object and or an action etc. with an emotional buff can do the same thing as any of the traits and overlap so much that the Sims act and seem the same in every household.

    It's clear they are never (after five years) going to revist these issues of overlapping and define the Sim's personality. I wrote a huge thread about this in 2014 but they ignore me and hundreds of others who pointed out this flaw in the system to them. And why should they it sold anyway though it's lack luster gameplay is something left to be desired. Instead they decided to not add any new whims relevant to any new EP or GP but just hide them by default now, and not add any new traits or buffs but just reuse and reuse what is already in the base game.

    I don't know if that's a lack of focus, lack of imagination, lack of understanding human behavior, lack of time, lack of money, or lack of just don't care, and or lack of indifference of what the player sees as shallow, and or just lazy. But I think if they had ever played the game themselves, they would have soon realised how boring it is when a creative Sim (trait) wishes for the same thing a Sim who has been inspired (by object) wants such as both want to create a perfect meal and or wait so does the perfectionist. And they would or maybe they wouldn't notice the loner Sim wants to hug everyone since they are 'happy'...so with free will on, they may do just that (and sometimes with free will off which is broken since day one) and leave the player saying wth, why are you hugging or even wanting to hug Sims when you are supposed to be a loner who never needs a hug or wants one since they enjoy alone time more than human contact.

    I think they never one time played this game longer than a few minutes to show off a new feature (which btw is usually broken) so yeah, I'll be happy when Maxis snaps out of it, and starts producing good entertainment again. Because fluff isn't going to make a critical thinker happy.
    "Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.

    https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/958714/cinebar-custom-content-clothes-updating-links/p1


  • AHolyToiletAHolyToilet Posts: 772 Member
    edited August 21
    Hestia wrote: »
    TS4 has a powerful CAS with being able to push and pull, but is a step back because instead of 5 personality traits, we have 3. I feel like the traits are just there for show and don't impact my gameplay as much as I want it to because of the Mood System we have. A Sim with the Good trait should not be able to be friends with a Sim with an Evil/Mean trait or a Family-Oriented Sim should not be able to be friends with someone that dislikes children. In TS4, I can and it defies all logic.

    I'd like to expand on this a bit. It's not just that our Sims can only have 3 traits and the traits prevent realistic relationships being made, they don't actually do much at all. Let's use the evil trait as an example.

    TS4 Evil Trait attributes:
    • These Sims may laugh maniacally.
      Have the "Discuss Evil Plans" interaction with other evil Sims.
      Will have the "Good v.s. Evil" moodlet when interacting with a good Sim.
      Will have the "Near Misery" moodlet when a Sim has negative moodlets.
      Will have the "Dismiss Goodness" interaction with a good Sim.
      Will laugh manically at the death of an enemy, whilst normal Sims would just be happy.
      Evil Sims can also smash dollhouses even when currently not angry.
      Will laugh at pets when they misbehave.

    And that's about it. There's not much else the trait does in the game. As opposed to TS3 Evil Trait Attributes, Advantages/Disadvantages, and Player Notes, to name just a few without cluttering up this post:
    • Sim will get a "Fiendishly Delighted" moodlet when misfortune strikes nearby Sims!
      Sim doesn't mind a lack of light, a dark lair is welcome!
      Sim will excel in the criminal career track.
      Sim will fare well in most fights.
      Evil Sims cruelly enjoy harassing other Sims when misfortune strikes them, such as mocking a Sim who died known to the other Sim, or teasing a Sim for not reaching the toilet in time. Other Evil Sims and Mean Spirited Sims, however, enjoy listening to the mocking.
      Evil Sims can "Shakedown" other Sims for money.
      Sometimes when walking into a room, an Evil Sim will rub his or her hands together and laugh maniacally.
      Evil Sims never get the Upset moodlet when fighting with a friend or family member, instead they will wish to see their ghost.
      Evil Sims often wish to befriend other Evil Sims upon discovering that they both share the Evil trait.
      Evil Sims are immune to the Creepy Graveyard moodlet, and aren't scared of vampires, or bugs. Evil Sims will still be disturbed by ghosts, unless they have another trait like Brave, Party Animal or Daredevil alongside it.
      An Evil Sim will always laugh when mourning a dying Sim who was unfriendly, but will cry if the Sim who has died was part of their household or was their friend. Regardless, witnessing a dying Sim will give them the "Fiendishly Delighted" moodlet for a few hours. Evil Sims also gain a slight Fun boost from watching non-friends and non-household members die.

    And there's a whole lot more the trait does. Even if TS3 allowed only three traits, the Sims would have far more depth to them because the traits do more because the game has more than TS4 could ever hope to achieve. Yet instead, the game allows five. And with University, makes the maximum seven traits in ONE Sim. Which is another reason why I find it difficult to continue supporting this game. Realm of Magic, assuming its good, is likely going to be the last pack I purchase. I already have a bunch of magic-themed Sims waiting in line for it. I might as well try to have fun with that.

    Mhm! Well said @AHolyToilet ! Due to these unique traits, all of the Sims from TS3 had their own personalities and different interactions appeared at all times depending on what they are like. Even though the Sims 1 and The Sims 2 didn’t specifically have personality traits, they did have a personality based on points allocated into the neats/active ness/social/etc. and these were enough back then to have them completely unique during interactions or reactions. Thus defining their emotions more when something happens.

    One single example from past iterations

    The Sims 1: Slobs would complain if they began cleaning something.

    The Sims 2: Lazy Sims will change their clothes with a sloppier animation.

    The Sims 3: Too much to explain in a single thread comment. Best to read up on the Wiki. :p

    The traits system in TS4 is too basic and doesn’t depict much at all about the Sim. It affects more on their emotions rather than their personality.

    I think personalities bring out better emotions rather than the other way around.

    Let's expand on your last sentence since it's that very notion that marks another hole in the sinking ship that is TS4, using Fallout 4 as an example.

    Fallout 4 recieved some backlash for introducing voiced protagonists for a game featuring character creation and what should've had more RPG elements. But the benefit of silent protagonists in games where you create your own character is that it makes it easier for the player to visualize who their character was supposed to be and "attach" emotions onto your character. Fallout 4 fails this to an extent because you may have wanted to create, say, a tough cold-blooded merc, but because the protagonist sounds a certain way, the desired effect is lost. Or even on a basic level. (example being your character is black, but because the voice actor sounds white, it just looks goofy)

    Why I bring this up is because the player being able to visualize who their character is supposed to be in video games is important. TS4 fails this. TS3 was able to protray emotions from your Sim without the use of an emotion system by having certain moodlets make your Sim do certain things (for example, your Sim being cheated on makes them cry every once in a while and makes them go enraged whenever they see the one that cheated on them) and they would do multiple things that represented multiple emotions, the previous example being evidence of this. If you're thinking about your ex, you'd probably cry. If you saw them, you'd probably feel very angry. That's plausible, unlike what's presented in TS4.

    TS4 takes a more extreme route and has your Sim showcase only one emotion for specific situations. But going back to my original point, TS3 was able to help the player visualize who their Sim was supposed to be, besides the deeper traits, wishes actually mattering, all that, they had superior body language. Sims that were flirting with each other would stand closer to each other with flirty looks on their faces while in TS4, their faces are part of the UI and the Sims' faces themselves don't actually change unless they're in the middle of an interaction. TS3 did a better job of showing your Sims being aroused without needing to throw pink colors in your face and a menu telling you that they were. They just looked like they were. Sims that dislike each other would stand at an angle leaning away from each other, signifying anything YOU visualize as annoyance, disgust, or hatred. If you took a screenshot of this scenario and said to others that one Sim was annoyed and the other was creeped out, this would look plausible because that's the kind of image you put in the observer's head.

    It did a better job of allowing the player to use their imagination. TS4 isn't big enough of a game to allow you to do that as easily.
  • drake_mccartydrake_mccarty Posts: 5,662 Member
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Lots more coming -


    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/electronic-arts-boosts-gaming-lineup-164104919.html


    LIKE THIS:

    EA plans to bring at least 20 new content drops and expansion packs to The Sims franchise in fiscal 2020.

    They said this months ago. This isn’t news really.

    It was new - yesterdays investment news for the year coming. Yesterdays date.

    EA just had a stock holders meeting about 8-10 days ago - so it's all new or renewed maybe .

    I’m not suggesting that the article wasn’t written on August 19, all I’m saying is that not every bit of information in that article is new. EA themselves mentioned the 20+ content drops for FY2020 several times already. It’s a talking point that this article is using to pad out the actual new things being written. That’s how clickbait articles get clicks, by rewording old news and framing it as new to get you to visit and earn them their ad revenue. Sure some things in there may have been based on the meeting, but the 20 content drop figure is a talking point EA is going to repeatedly vomit out until FY2020 is over and they have a new figure to start talking about. That’s just how it works.
  • CinebarCinebar Posts: 31,023 Member
    edited August 21
    I wasn't here for three or four days this past weekend and so behind on news. I just watched the ROM trailer. I'm not impressed (again) with the world and or the magic I saw so far. I hope this pack has more depth and more things to do in the 'town' than I saw. But afraid it's like OR, with a few places to buy things? and a place to practice your skills and do spells...that is what the trailer made me think. Maybe it has more to offer but didn't think the trailer show cased much of the world or gameplay. Or maybe that is all there is to it? After IL I'm not falling for trailers anymore. (I took a short hype train ride on the IL trailer but then saw the gameplay...) this time I'm just not even going to be impressed to start with, lol, that way I won't have hopes dashed.
    "Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.

    https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/958714/cinebar-custom-content-clothes-updating-links/p1


  • Jordan061102Jordan061102 Posts: 3,413 Member
    edited August 21
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    JoAnne65 wrote: »
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Lots more coming -


    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/electronic-arts-boosts-gaming-lineup-164104919.html


    LIKE THIS:

    EA plans to bring at least 20 new content drops and expansion packs to The Sims franchise in fiscal 2020.

    They said this months ago. This isn’t news really.

    It was new - yesterdays investment news for the year coming. Yesterdays date.

    EA just had a stock holders meeting about 8-10 days ago - so it's all new or renewed maybe .
    Could you please stick to the topic though? The topic isn’t “how much future do think Sims 4’s future still has”, that would be a topic for the section Speculation. This topic is about why (or why not) it should stop according to simmers. Not EA or simgurus.

    Ultimately It is EA's decision - not the hand ful of simmers in this thread. Everyone has an opinion - and no one in this thread has a right to say rest of us can't weigh in. It's on the forum for every one. I am as much a simmer as you are - whats more i follow what the company has to say - the company has the answers and they are just talking about the games future - so are the stock holders and i don't see where they see it the way of this little thread.

    But you can't deny that the thread is about people who want TS4 to end not about EAs plans for the future of TS4.
    Lu4ERme.gif
  • CinebarCinebar Posts: 31,023 Member
    edited August 21
    Speaking of the new pack about magic. Again why I'm looking forward to the day TS4 is all patched up and I can play what I have without bugs (wishful thinking, right?) and move on to a new iteraton are things like reusing base game objects (again). I saw some pics over on SimsVip of the trailer shots, and it looks like in one shop that sells brooms there are crystals, too. Well, sigh, don't we already have crystals since 2014 and why would I want to buy them when my Sims have them all over the place already if I want to control emotions. Even my doctor took some (like focus) to work with him so he could focus at work and do a better job. Crystal emitters.

    This is what I'm talking about. Instead of a brand new object (at least make it something else) they reuse the crystal mesh from basegame to add to a shop (?) to sell these or just decoration? for this pack for spellcastors to buy. Why, just why, are we going down this road like the festivals (mostly) just reuse stuff already in base game. I just don't understand it gurus. In the past you guys (some of you are still there) made amazing objects for each and every pack. And I rarely saw something just revamped and more bhavs added to them or a different bhav. I just don't understand if TS4 makes so much money (according to financial meetings to share holders) why they don't put that money back into the game and you guys stop reusing base game objects. Sure crystals make sense in a magic pack, but we already have them. Redundancy is the name of the game here. It just disappointments me so much when I know Maxis used to be such a epic game company that I knew would bring out new and exicting gameplay and objects I had never seen or thought about before.

    For somene like me, who notices this stuff, and knows your greatness of the past it really disappoints me you guys go down this road more often than not with TS4 and I have to wonder why you do that, when you are capable of so much more than that. :/

    ETA: Simsvip has more info than found here today, and it's 24 hours after the trailer dropped. Again this is the official forums. Sigh.

    The new world, is five lots and a hidden lot which can only be edited with a cheat. Only five lots to live in. I'm sorry but with each pack my dissapointment grows. Maybe I had more in mind to live there in a new world. We all enjoy new worlds, who wouldn't, but the limits on lots is so old it starts to taste like old shoe leather. :'( Sigh, and sorry one unedited lot does not equal 'two worlds'. It just doesn't.
    "Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.

    https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/958714/cinebar-custom-content-clothes-updating-links/p1


  • Writin_RegWritin_Reg Posts: 28,818 Member
    edited August 21
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    JoAnne65 wrote: »
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Lots more coming -


    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/electronic-arts-boosts-gaming-lineup-164104919.html


    LIKE THIS:

    EA plans to bring at least 20 new content drops and expansion packs to The Sims franchise in fiscal 2020.

    They said this months ago. This isn’t news really.

    It was new - yesterdays investment news for the year coming. Yesterdays date.

    EA just had a stock holders meeting about 8-10 days ago - so it's all new or renewed maybe .
    Could you please stick to the topic though? The topic isn’t “how much future do think Sims 4’s future still has”, that would be a topic for the section Speculation. This topic is about why (or why not) it should stop according to simmers. Not EA or simgurus.

    Ultimately It is EA's decision - not the hand ful of simmers in this thread. Everyone has an opinion - and no one in this thread has a right to say rest of us can't weigh in. It's on the forum for every one. I am as much a simmer as you are - whats more i follow what the company has to say - the company has the answers and they are just talking about the games future - so are the stock holders and i don't see where they see it the way of this little thread.

    But you can't deny that the thread is about people who want TS4 to end not about EAs plans for the future of TS4.
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    JoAnne65 wrote: »
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Writin_Reg wrote: »
    Lots more coming -


    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/electronic-arts-boosts-gaming-lineup-164104919.html


    LIKE THIS:

    EA plans to bring at least 20 new content drops and expansion packs to The Sims franchise in fiscal 2020.

    They said this months ago. This isn’t news really.

    It was new - yesterdays investment news for the year coming. Yesterdays date.

    EA just had a stock holders meeting about 8-10 days ago - so it's all new or renewed maybe .
    Could you please stick to the topic though? The topic isn’t “how much future do think Sims 4’s future still has”, that would be a topic for the section Speculation. This topic is about why (or why not) it should stop according to simmers. Not EA or simgurus.

    Ultimately It is EA's decision - not the hand ful of simmers in this thread. Everyone has an opinion - and no one in this thread has a right to say rest of us can't weigh in. It's on the forum for every one. I am as much a simmer as you are - whats more i follow what the company has to say - the company has the answers and they are just talking about the games future - so are the stock holders and i don't see where they see it the way of this little thread.

    But you can't deny that the thread is about people who want TS4 to end not about EAs plans for the future of TS4.

    You can't deny there is two sides to every agreement or disagreement - at the very least. So for everyone that might want an end - which keep in mind still means years before that can happen - there are probably as many who are happy with the way it is. You cannot possibly have a one sided discussion and on the forum every thread is a discussion and every player and customer has a right to agree or disagree.

    The only place on a forum we have the right to have a one sided opinion is on our own personal Sims page - we all pay for this game and as customers have a right to agree or disagree with what is being said about a game some of us very much like thus far. We have the right to enjoy the CEO/COO of the company on a business related page for stock holders, not gamers game pages - indicating to the share holders their plans have not changed (well as of August 19, 2019 anyway) and to be overjoyed to see that - that they are still moving forward and still one of the companies successful franchises that they thus far do not indicate ending anytime soon and that is doing exceptionally great in sells.

    "Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.

    In dreams - I LIVE!
    In REALITY, I simply exist.....

  • Writin_RegWritin_Reg Posts: 28,818 Member
    edited August 21
    Cinebar wrote: »
    Speaking of the new pack about magic. Again why I'm looking forward to the day TS4 is all patched up and I can play what I have without bugs (wishful thinking, right?) and move on to a new iteraton are things like reusing base game objects (again). I saw some pics over on SimsVip of the trailer shots, and it looks like in one shop that sells brooms there are crystals, too. Well, sigh, don't we already have crystals since 2014 and why would I want to buy them when my Sims have them all over the place already if I want to control emotions. Even my doctor took some (like focus) to work with him so he could focus at work and do a better job. Crystal emitters.

    This is what I'm talking about. Instead of a brand new object (at least make it something else) they reuse the crystal mesh from basegame to add to a shop (?) to sell these or just decoration? for this pack for spellcastors to buy. Why, just why, are we going down this road like the festivals (mostly) just reuse stuff already in base game. I just don't understand it gurus. In the past you guys (some of you are still there) made amazing objects for each and every pack. And I rarely saw something just revamped and more bhavs added to them or a different bhav. I just don't understand if TS4 makes so much money (according to financial meetings to share holders) why they don't put that money back into the game and you guys stop reusing base game objects. Sure crystals make sense in a magic pack, but we already have them. Redundancy is the name of the game here. It just disappointments me so much when I know Maxis used to be such a epic game company that I knew would bring out new and exicting gameplay and objects I had never seen or thought about before.

    For somene like me, who notices this stuff, and knows your greatness of the past it really disappoints me you guys go down this road more often than not with TS4 and I have to wonder why you do that, when you are capable of so much more than that. :/

    ETA: Simsvip has more info than found here today, and it's 24 hours after the trailer dropped. Again this is the official forums. Sigh.

    The new world, is five lots and a hidden lot which can only be edited with a cheat. Only five lots to live in. I'm sorry but with each pack my dissapointment grows. Maybe I had more in mind to live there in a new world. We all enjoy new worlds, who wouldn't, but the limits on lots is so old it starts to taste like old shoe leather. :'( Sigh, and sorry one unedited lot does not equal 'two worlds'. It just doesn't.
    Cinebar wrote: »
    Speaking of the new pack about magic. Again why I'm looking forward to the day TS4 is all patched up and I can play what I have without bugs (wishful thinking, right?) and move on to a new iteraton are things like reusing base game objects (again). I saw some pics over on SimsVip of the trailer shots, and it looks like in one shop that sells brooms there are crystals, too. Well, sigh, don't we already have crystals since 2014 and why would I want to buy them when my Sims have them all over the place already if I want to control emotions. Even my doctor took some (like focus) to work with him so he could focus at work and do a better job. Crystal emitters.

    This is what I'm talking about. Instead of a brand new object (at least make it something else) they reuse the crystal mesh from basegame to add to a shop (?) to sell these or just decoration? for this pack for spellcastors to buy. Why, just why, are we going down this road like the festivals (mostly) just reuse stuff already in base game. I just don't understand it gurus. In the past you guys (some of you are still there) made amazing objects for each and every pack. And I rarely saw something just revamped and more bhavs added to them or a different bhav. I just don't understand if TS4 makes so much money (according to financial meetings to share holders) why they don't put that money back into the game and you guys stop reusing base game objects. Sure crystals make sense in a magic pack, but we already have them. Redundancy is the name of the game here. It just disappointments me so much when I know Maxis used to be such a epic game company that I knew would bring out new and exicting gameplay and objects I had never seen or thought about before.

    For somene like me, who notices this stuff, and knows your greatness of the past it really disappoints me you guys go down this road more often than not with TS4 and I have to wonder why you do that, when you are capable of so much more than that. :/

    ETA: Simsvip has more info than found here today, and it's 24 hours after the trailer dropped. Again this is the official forums. Sigh.

    The new world, is five lots and a hidden lot which can only be edited with a cheat. Only five lots to live in. I'm sorry but with each pack my dissapointment grows. Maybe I had more in mind to live there in a new world. We all enjoy new worlds, who wouldn't, but the limits on lots is so old it starts to taste like old shoe leather. :'( Sigh, and sorry one unedited lot does not equal 'two worlds'. It just doesn't.


    Quote - Sigh, and sorry one unedited lot does not equal 'two worlds'. It just doesn't. Unquote.


    Well it sort of does in a gp - and it sort of does when the Guru's stated as such yesterday


    Antonio Romeo
    @SimGuruRomeo

    There will be 2 new worlds. World 1 is Glimmerbrook, where you will be able to live and move your Sims in. World 2 is The Magic Realm. You are not able to officially move into this world, but there is nothing stopping you from putting a bed on the lot. ;D
    11:18 AM · Aug 20, 2019·Twitter Web App
    Post edited by Writin_Reg on

    "Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.

    In dreams - I LIVE!
    In REALITY, I simply exist.....

  • KaeChan2089KaeChan2089 Posts: 2,748 Member
    Kinda wish they just nail the coffin on this version of the game and just start a new....
  • Sk8rblazeSk8rblaze Posts: 7,100 Member
    edited August 21
    Kinda wish they just nail the coffin on this version of the game and just start a new....

    Same here, waiting patiently. I hope the last few packs we are getting will at least have made TS4 somewhat worth it. I still believe, unless there’s some major art redirection, there won’t be anyone that will miss The Sims 4 once The Sims 5 rolls around.

    All of the amazing upcoming games this year and next year are certainly keeping me patient, too. So excited for March 2020! 🐶 🐱
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