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First Pet Stuff pack feels like EA trying to piece-meal the game FURTHER
PrincessSaturn
Posts: 564 Member
I just learned of this pack, but it feels like an obvious cash grab. I'm not surprised that they've gotten backlash after diluting expansion content and selling DLC for expansions? It confirms how little EA cares about their consumers. I'm afraid that the games will be missing even MORE content at launch and that we'll never have the series try to push itself to new levels/heights like 1,2 and 3 did.
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OUTER SENSHI PRIDE
OUTER SENSHI PRIDE
Post edited by PrincessSaturn on
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They are just going to keep dumbing it down, breaking up content, making it look more like Farmville and putting a price on every little thing in the game that they can collect on. And when it's all said and done, and they have completely alienated the last veteran player of the franchise...it will go on a shelf, never to be heard from again...EA will then turn their focus on another cash grab and ruin another franchise in the process.
lather, rinse, repeat. Quality is definitely not EA's thing.
TS2 was known for generational gameplay and smarter Sims, TS3 was known for open world and advanced customization, and TS4 will be known for DLC for DLC.
What an achievement.
In my opinion this Sims iteration has been a huge disaster and many people is complaining asking for changes to be applied to the game. Instead of that, instead of putting all efforts into fixing bugs or trying to change some aspects of the game that makes it so boring and static, they just release something that people does not like, it is not needed right now, and it has not been demanded by people. What are they thinking?
As I said in a previous post, in my opinion this game is not about having 5000 chairs, it is about what you can do with them. A chair is just a chair, but the potential is in the actions. A decoration is just a decoration, but the story we can create in that decoration is much more important.
Please, stop giving more clutter and unnecesary objects. This game has serious problems much more important than clutter, chairs, lamps, rats or whatever. EA is trying to fill the emptiness of the game with more static objects, but it is just getting it worse. This is a mess. I don't need to be able to dress a rat, are insulting me? Really? Is that all you can think of after the release of that kind of apartments where you can't do almost anything at all with them? Is that all you can think of?
This game is getting really bad.... You are destroying it. I really am about to uninstalling it.
I agree!!! All those stuff worth nothing without the gameplay aspect.
You can't dress the rats, actually.
I know that wasn't the point of your post but I thought I'd mention it anyway
Yes, there are other sims forums that are not so restrictive that simmers have express great criticism of this whole shady practice. BTW....I had a few sim points left over from a purchase I did a while back...so I gifted you a few things from your wishlist.
Sure, Hollow Knight may not be your thing, but it's true that it's ridiculous how much content / playing time you get out of the ridiculous 15,- you're paying for it (and most people who use steam probably didn't even pay that), compared to MFP. It would probably take me a good 60 hours to complete everything.
So, yeah, it's not enough to compare games to a night at the movies (especially when you consider that "consuming" a movie is actually dirt cheap, and what you're really paying for is a seat and some popcorn). No, they should be compared to their own industry standard: other games. There are so many fantastic, beautiful, really deep & content-rich games that cost anywhere between 10 and 40 euros, and they will entertain you for hours, weeks, .. months.
That isn't to say people can't like MFP but they should still try putting this into perspective because SPs release roughly every 2,5-3 months. Plus GPs, plus the EP. It's a very expensive hobby overall. We pay 3-4 x the amount a year in DLC minimum (on top of the initial base game) that other games cost period (just look at the HZD Complete Edition, only 10 euros more than one Sims expansion & again, compare the content in that to the price & content of C&D
The truth is, I also buy a lot of TS content so I fully understand the argument that as long as I enjoy it it's money well spent. But it's very, very hard to keep excusing EA (in general, not just when it comes to TS) for how they release content and how much they rely on DLC to create completely fleshed out experiences. People can say all they want about development having gotten harder or more expensive, but the fact of the matter remains that other less money-hungry companies seem to be doing just fine putting out far more content for a lot less money.
So yes, at this point in my life, for me to put 10 into a game, I really need more than a mere 2hrs of content
Same I didn't open my game only one time since I knew about this SP.
Not really. The point of that kind of comparison for most people is a way of evaluating if they're getting enough bang for their buck in whatever form of entertainment they consume. You could say the same thing about books, going out to eat, playing a game of laser tag or paintball, etc. $15 for a game I don't like that provides 3 million hours of play time content is useless to me, just like $10 for a movie I don't like, $15 for a meal I don't like, etc. It's not really the details of the entertainment that matter so much as how much value you get for the money you spend and using a movie is a simple, relatable activity that most people have experienced, which gives them a frame of reference. "Hey, if you spend $10 to watch a movie for 2 hours, then spending $10 for a dlc pack that offers content you can use repeatedly in your game might be of value to you." You've already stated that it's not, no matter if you willingly spend $10 on something else that provides only 2 hours of entertainment because you have other options you're happy to go with. That is most definitely your right and it proves that MFP and potentially quite a few of the other SPs are not for you.
For someone who likes MFP alright (not my favorite SP but it's got some things I like in it), I don't need to put things into perspective. The Sims is the most expensive videogame I play, bar none--and I play quite a few videogames. It also provides some of the best value for me because I tend to play it a lot longer than other games. That's not going to be the same experience for others but, frankly, that's not really my concern since I have no control or say over how they spend their money. Each of us is going to decide the entertainment value of the game and I expect most of us are fairly clear on how the costs for Sims compares to other games we play (for those who play other games). This is really nothing new since Sims has pretty much been handled this way since I started playing it with Sims 2. The only other type of game I can think of that runs extensive lifespans with regular content released for sale are MMO games like WoW, Diablo 3, etc., and it's a bit different in that they usually include some sort of storyline for their dlc. And, again, I'm not sure it matters overall since the point is, for each individual, are you getting your money's worth? If you aren't then you may want to skip spending the money on it, but that's still up to each person.
I don't think people need to excuse EA for whatever practices they use or their prices. Because it all still comes down to each individual. People make choices all the time about whether they're going to patronize a particular business for their business practices or their prices. There are stores I never step foot in because I think they're obnoxiously overpriced and know I can get what I want somewhere else for a more reasonable price. As you've pointed out, we all have exactly the same options with videogames and other production companies. Granted, the Sims still doesn't have any real competition for this particular niche sort of game but excusing EA for things isn't going to "fix" the game in the way people want or inspire another company to make their own version. Posting what you do and don't like about what's released and offering feedback can help but, regardless, "excusing" EA isn't going to really do anything for anyone.
I'm not a psychopath. I'm a high-functioning psychopath. Reaper
My game is not buggy nor do I have any unnecessary objects.
That is contradictory to me personally. I also never suggested you should spend 15 on a game you don't like
My point was that even if I like TS4 a lot and play it a lot, and therefore consider everything I bought for it technically valuable, I can still look at it and say "yeah you know what? At this price point, another company would offer me a whole lot more content that I'd enjoy probably just as much". When I say put it in perspective, I'm not saying don't buy sims 4 content, but to be able to (to some degree) critically examine the company you're buying it from.
When I look at the amount of content per TS3 pack for example, and even if I actually play TS4 a whole lot more (almost exclusively actually), I can objectively agree that TS4 packs look thin. The whole experience itself is still more fun and engaging to me, but that's not to say this fact never disappoints me. And I'm sorry, but EA has a way of just doing business like this. And that's even more obvious in genres where they have direct competitors.
Sometimes just bothers me
ETA:
Since, as you've pointed out, we don't have a competitor, no we do not have that option at all
I don't understand what you mean about my statement being contradictory to you personally? I didn't say you told me to spend money on a game I didn't like so I don't really follow that point, either.
Your point is still what we just discussed--you evaluate the game you're playing, whether you like it or not, with other entertainment options (in this case other games and previous Sims games) and feel like you're not getting your money's worth. And it's still your personal opinion, which is perfectly valid. There is nothing in what I said that compared paying for a game you don't like versus paying for MFP--if that's what you took from what I said then it's a misunderstanding and I'm sorry if I didn't word it properly. The statement I bolded is exactly what I was saying.
I get that you don't particularly like or trust EA and their whole business method bothers you. I don't feel the same way. I'm not attached to them enough to care whether they "care" for me or my wants. It's nice when they listen to us and incorporate things I've been wanting but we're not buddies, family or in some sort of weird abusive relationship like I've heard so many people on these forums imply or state. As long as they provide a product I like and I feel like I'm getting my money's worth, I'll purchase their product. End of story.
The thing on a forum about telling people what they should do (i.e., put it in perspective, think critically) is that, frankly, it's not really your place or anyone else's that isn't directly involved in the person's life. Sometimes, even then, it's not appropriate. No matter how sincere or helpful a person is trying to be, comments like that are entirely too personal and will generally end up being misconstrued. For instance, not only do you have no direct say on how I live my life and what I decide to think critically about or not, you really don't have any frame of reference for my thought processes other than what you see me state in the forums. And just because my critical thinking opposes yours, doesn't make your critical thinking more valid or accurate, which comes off as a bit insulting.
Your point regarding not having any options when it comes to purchasing the Sims or not is not really accurate. Sure, you may not have any direct competing simulation games to go to but you have a slew of alternate entertainment and videogames you can turn to and since you spent a good portion of your comments comparing what EA/TS4 provides versus other games, then you already know this. Simply put, you may not have exactly the same type of game but you do have plenty of options so you don't have to buy something from a company whose business practices bother you. I also think you misunderstood what I meant by patronizing--I was using it in the sense of being a patron or customer of something, not in the sense of looking down on something. And I disagree with your view of MFP--that you think items were stripped out of the EP and repackaged and sold and, subsequently, that a dlc for a dlc is an annoying and insulting business practice. I'm one of the few people who have no problems with dlc packs for dlc. I frequently think I would like it if one pack references another or even adds more goodies and items to a previous pack.
Finally, I don't particularly agree with you regarding your perception of EA--mainly because I don't really feel like game companies owe me anything in particular regarding the games they produce. If I really felt like that and felt the need to avoid companies that killed my favorite franchises (for whatever reason), I would likely only be able to buy independent games.
I'm not a psychopath. I'm a high-functioning psychopath. Reaper
This is the original post.
It doesn't feel like an obvious cash grab to me. The pack may have been in production at the same time as Cats and Dogs but I don't think the developers deliberately held back content to sell at a later date. We've been paying $40 for expansion packs for the last 9 years. Can't remember how much the Sims 2 expansion packs were. There are many complaints that the expansion packs are not as content rich as prior games and while I agree with that I've never expected them to be. Not for $40. Either the price goes up or content goes down. I believe we got $40 worth of content in Cats and Dogs and didn't think it was unreasonable to pay $10 for additional pet content. Just my opinion.
Of course that is how I evaluate it. What I still don't get is why this is so hard for people to understand. If for 2,- you get a gigantic burger, fries and a coke at every place in town, except one, where you pay 5,- for one burger and nothing else & that burger isn't even qualitatively better than the other ones, how many people do you think would go to that store? I evaluate EA products the very same way. And it's just very difficult for anyone honestly putting their products side by side with other similar products not to see it. Now, choosing not to see it is another thing.
No, again, a company doesn't have to be my family or buddy either. But what do you think would've happened to Battlefront and all its future instalments if those customers had applied your reasoning? "Oh I like it well enough, sure I'm spending far more than I should for a complete experience I didn't have to shell out for before, but I guess I like the basics enough not to care?".
Anyway, again, because you keep saying it: I'm not telling anyone here to buy or not to buy something. And again, yes I am getting my money's worth out of the Sims 4 since I play it a lot. I feel like you're purposefully disregarding that statement each and every single time though. What I'm saying is that I'd like for EA not to take our liking of the game as a sign that they can start selling many valuable gameplay objects off in SPs, especially those they could've easily fit into an EP if they wanted to.
Yes, thank you, I know there are many other games. But your point is still wrong: you know why I play many different games? Because I like variety. The Sims itch is, quite simply put, an itch NO other game can scratch. I think you know this too no? Notwithstanding the fact that there are many other, fantastic games out there (and that I play those I like), I want to play this one too. Some simmers really don't seem to get (or at least not expect it any longer from one of the biggest companies out there) that delivering quality content (that doesn't require DLC to begin with) shouldn't be an accident next to making money, it's what most customers would like you to make money with.
Did the person who just posted 'I completely agree' have to explain?
Didn't you know? You have to explain, provide examples, pictures, charts, and footnotes to justify any positive comments about the Sims 4.
Well it’s a business. I personally hope they don’t do this again but there here to make more money not friends.
I'm not sure on how you came away with the idea that I don't understand what you're saying? You've been very clear how and why you evaluate the game the way you do and I think that many people do it the same way so I'm not sure what you're having problems grasping about that or why you think people are misunderstanding what you're saying.
The issue with your statement is this phrase here "that burger isn't even qualitatively better than the other ones." This is a statement solely based on an individual opinion. Perhaps that's what you're missing in this equation that makes it hard for you to understand how someone can look at what EA is offering and still happily purchase it without feeling like they're being ripped off. This statement, "Now, choosing not to see it is another thing." is simply a way of saying that your mind is made up and there is nothing I can say that will validate my opinion because you can always simply point at that statement to "prove" you're correct.
I don't play Battlefront and haven't really followed all the info on the ruckus about it with the loot crates so I don't really care about that franchise. I assume that if players hadn't made some kind of fuss nothing would have changed and people would still be playing the game and either enjoying it or complaining about how it was handled. But, the thing is, this part of consumerism comes down to how people personally handle things and when it comes to videogames or other forms of entertainment, I tend to have a pretty laid back perspective on things. I did not like the ending to Mass Effect 3 but I also didn't feel the need to join the crusade against Bioware and demand they change it. I enjoyed ME3 for the 9/10s of the game that I did like and eventually modded the last 10th into something I could live with. I play a few mobile games that include microtransactions and if I feel like I'm getting my money's worth, I sometimes make a purchase. If I think the way they're handling the microtransactions is terrible, I won't touch it with a 10-foot stylus.
I don't think I've yet said anything about you telling people whether they should or should not buy something. I do feel like you've been implying that people who purchase without your specific "critical" thinking involved are foolish or blinded based on your wording ("choosing not to see it" implies a person is being deliberately obtuse about something that you believe is factual when it is actually opinion-based; telling people to put things into perspective and think critically implies they weren't thinking critically to begin with when, again, they may be thinking critically but still coming to a different conclusion). I have personally stated when I would buy something just to make my point about what makes up my critical thinking--I wasn't trying to imply that you were telling me not to.
Also, I haven't disregarded whether you purchase and enjoy TS4 at all. It's just not part of the discussion we've been having, which has been about how people evaluate the game and whether they think it's worth the price they're paying or not. Any comments I've made about not paying money to a company you feel cheated by were meant in light of having options to buy or not to buy--I didn't meant to imply that you hate the game or refuse to buy it so, again, I'm sorry if you got that impression.
The problem I see with not wanting EA to look at us purchasing MFP and decide that means we want more is that this is exactly what EA will do. They may temper it some based on the response they've received but every person that purchases essentially tells EA that they're ok with a dlc for a dlc. In my case, this is true--I am ok with dlc for a dlc. I don't have problems with them adding more content in an SP that was initiated in a previous EP or GP. I don't want them to strip things out of a previous EP to release in an SP but, again, this is where my opinion differs from many others because I believe them when they explained how they handle animation budgets and when they tell me the items they put in MFP were never intended for C&D to begin with. I also believe that at least half the people who are so up in arms over it now wouldn't have batted an eye at getting it 6 to 8 months down the road if Maxis had held onto the idea and developed and released it then. But then, I've consistently held that the marketing/PR team for TS4 has been less than stellar.
Most people play different games for variety and I do understand that having other options doesn't mean you necessarily want to give up the Sims but it still comes down to choices. Some people have very plainly stated they won't buy any more Sims stuff until XYZ happens or they won't buy anymore after MFP was released because they don't like the model. But it's a choice--in this case, to buy or not to buy. There are some game franchises I love where I don't even have that choice anymore, which makes me somewhat sad/disappointed but it is what it is. Maybe someday one of them will get sold or picked up by another franchise and I'll get to see more. Maybe when it does get picked up or revived, I'll hate the direction they go and be mad. There are very few, if any, entertainment products that would inspire me to join some kind of crusade to "make them better" or get them produced or continued (tv shows, videogames, books/book series, etc.). That's not to say I don't get passionate about them when I'm enjoying them, but I find that for me, personally, there's usually something just as good, if not better, around the corner and it doesn't take long to move on.
I'm not a psychopath. I'm a high-functioning psychopath. Reaper