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Are we halfway done with Sims 4's development??
DeservedCriticism
Posts: 2,251 Member
Went to take a look and do some comparing between Sims 3 and Sims 4, and I noticed something interesting.
Traditionally we all know that the average Sims game has a lifespan of about ~4 years. Sims 2 for example was in development from September 2004 to November 2008, whereas Sims 3 spanned from June 2009 to October 2013. However, this doesn't neccesarily mean pack production rate was stagnant the entire way through. Sims 3 for example saw accelerated EP production towards the end of it's lifespan, to the point it once released two EPs within 2 months of each other, which is a record for the franchise.
Well, I was looking at how long Sims 4 has been out and comparing to the previous titles and I noticed something. Sims 4 has been out for 2 years and 9 months now. If you go and look at what Sims 2 and Sims 3 accomplished within their first 2 years and 9 months, both of them released about half of their total packs at this point in time.
Sims 2 had 5 of it's 8 expansions out the door and 5 of it's 10 SPs out the door. Sims 3 had 6 of it's 11 EPs out the door and 5 of it's 9 SPs as well. If history is an indication, the numbers may look similar for Sims 4. This would imply we could reasonably expect to see 3 more EPs, ~4-5 more GPs, and lord knows how many Stuff Packs. Seems almost unbelievable to imagine 22 Stuff packs, but that's what this would imply.
Things can vary, of course, but I found it interesting that this rule of looking at packs at the two year and 9 month mark was a decently accurate representation of the final pack count for BOTH Sims 2 and Sims 3.
Assuming the same applies for Sims 4, would you be happy with the end result?
Traditionally we all know that the average Sims game has a lifespan of about ~4 years. Sims 2 for example was in development from September 2004 to November 2008, whereas Sims 3 spanned from June 2009 to October 2013. However, this doesn't neccesarily mean pack production rate was stagnant the entire way through. Sims 3 for example saw accelerated EP production towards the end of it's lifespan, to the point it once released two EPs within 2 months of each other, which is a record for the franchise.
Well, I was looking at how long Sims 4 has been out and comparing to the previous titles and I noticed something. Sims 4 has been out for 2 years and 9 months now. If you go and look at what Sims 2 and Sims 3 accomplished within their first 2 years and 9 months, both of them released about half of their total packs at this point in time.
Sims 2 had 5 of it's 8 expansions out the door and 5 of it's 10 SPs out the door. Sims 3 had 6 of it's 11 EPs out the door and 5 of it's 9 SPs as well. If history is an indication, the numbers may look similar for Sims 4. This would imply we could reasonably expect to see 3 more EPs, ~4-5 more GPs, and lord knows how many Stuff Packs. Seems almost unbelievable to imagine 22 Stuff packs, but that's what this would imply.
Things can vary, of course, but I found it interesting that this rule of looking at packs at the two year and 9 month mark was a decently accurate representation of the final pack count for BOTH Sims 2 and Sims 3.
Assuming the same applies for Sims 4, would you be happy with the end result?
"Who are you, that do not know your history?"
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Comments
I personally wouldn't be surprised if TS4 lasted longer though, since releasing a new base game means taking a big risk : starting back with a more bare game, convincing people once again, etc. We now all go through Origin, they can easily patch the game for all of us, so I wouldn't be surprised to see it follow the MMO formula : improving the base game through patch to make it last longer (like what they did with the lighting patch for example).
I hope the game will get more than 3 additional EPs. There are only so many themes you can squeeze into a GP. I'm hoping that Outdoor Retreat is not our only vacation pack we're going to get. Seeing as 2/3 of the EPs would most likely be for Pets and Seasons, there will only be one EP left for anything else.
I've seen some people asking for vacations to ski lodges and tropical beaches. If they really are to flesh out vacations they'd most likely add in hotels, swimmable oceans, and multiple worlds. I can't see that being squeezed into a GP or even a seasons pack for that matter without it being watered down.
Like with TS3, I think the EPs will accelerate after the bigger packs like Pets and Seasons are released.
However by the end of the series if we get (in EP's, GP's or maybe even SP's) Witches, Seasons/Weather, Pets (that I enjoy playing with day to day), University/College, Farming/Rural Life, a Tropical World (vacation or with the ability to house your sims there) and their take on Stardom/Celebrity this time around. Yes I will be happy.
Oh and Bed Cuddles.. I'm getting to the "sheesh" point on that one.
That you will conveniently not name. Boy, I sure am convinced.
I don't like this argument. The failure of this argument is that it suggests there's something inheritly wrong with EPs and that we should accept that they're bad and focus our hopes on GPs instead. No, there's nothing fundamentally wrong with EPs as a concept, it's just the ones we've gotten are awful. To suggest all future EPs will lack depth as if this were a fundamental issue is to paint a picture that it's good planning on their behalf to avoid them and keep the count small.
Wanna know what I find super ironic about that outlook? Know what it reminds me of...? SimCity. EA released it, it bombed, they seemingly concluded something is fundamentally wrong with SimCity, and thus we haven't heard from SimCity since 2013. In reality, people still love SimCity, they just hated the execution of the last game.
Same exact concept with pretending it's A-OK for the Sims team to focus their time away from EPs. No, the best solution would be to just fix the danged things and improve their quality.
I never even definitively stated "THIS IS 100% PROOF WE HAVE HALF THE PACKS," I suggested this as a thought based on past evidence, because I wanted to see how people reacted when faced with the possibility. It's better to engage and discuss such a possibility while we can - even if merely a possibility - than to wait for it to happen/not happen. One of those promotes discussion, the other waits around doing nothing.
I'm just saying discussions are a lot more fluid when we don't have to do this song-and-dance where I have to practically beg you to make your danged point instead of coyly acting like you've got this genius argument while never elaborating on it. I don't even know if there's any value to you and I having a discussion....I can't know because I still haven't heard the points you initially alluded to.
And if you don't see the purpose of this discussion, you're under no obligation to partake in it.
For me? Just today I saw someone say they're currently satisfied with Sims 4, but that this would immediately switch to "disappointed" if Sims 4 ended in 2018. The purpose of the discussion to me is to provide at least one method of estimate on what to expect, that way people can ask themselves how they'd feel if they got this example estimate, and if they're unsatisfied with that? Well, better start speaking up now. If they're satisfied with it? Then it's at least a somewhat reasonable estimate (by no means exact, but still reasonable) that can put perspective on what CAN and CANNOT fit the schedule. Someone mentioned Pet, Seasons, University for example. By this estimate, that still fits. Anyone who wanted those three AND a Superstar expansion or something...? Well, it may be time to mentally prepare for the fact it may not happen.
For myself for example...? I want a Witches GP, and would welcome another life state GP aswell. However, with only ~5 left by this estimate, it's somewhat unreasonable to expect anything more than Witches. They probably would've started on Witches shortly after Vampires released, meaning it's over a year away, and then unless they decided "THAT WAS SO GREAT LETS MAKE TWO EXTRA LIFESTATE GPs" right then and there, they're simply out of time to develop another one, by this estimate.
It's all about trying to put things in perspective, because even if the estimate may prove unexact, I do consider it at the very least reasonable, and thus gives a reasonable evaluation of what to expect.
I agree with some that the expansions we're getting are.... Not so great, they're okay, but ya know, not perfect.... So give the people what they want in eps, then seriously stop and focus on gps. I say this because it seems the most recent gps are... Well, better, than the eps. More thought out and in depth.
But idk, I just started playing again last night after a, maybe 3 month break playing S2, so what do I know
I haven't bought the last few SP and the Parenthood pack yet because I am now anticipating for content I personally want for the future.
Right now, I'm still waiting for Seasons, Pets, tropical island vacation (like Island Paradise with hotels and swimmable oceans, etc), and more supernatural states like Mermaids and Fairies.
I didn't fully enjoy the last few EPs for Sims 4. The EPs so far feel like a lot of micromanaging and not a lot of substantial content like the EPs for Sims 3 and Sims 2.
The sims in sims 4 are still not very reactive or unique compared to the sims in all of the previous sims games, so you have to be a very hands-on proactive player/storyteller to make things actually happen---which is not really my thing.
We also still need more new interactions and content, like Generations stuff, more romantic interactions, sports, and more hobbies, etc.
If there are three more EPs and 3-4 GPs, then I would only be happy if they included the most of the stuff I mentioned above.
Otherwise, I think I will go back to playing Sims 1, 2, and 3, while waiting for Sims 5.
At least Sims 3 made progress and has ambitious efforts and has given me my mermaids and fairies alongside genies and witches. (I LOVE mermaids and fairies especially!)
Sims 3 (and Sims 1 Makin' Magic) definitely spoiled me in the magical life states department, lol.
This sims 4 game cycle is just going a bit too slow for me, personally.
(She/her)
As for what should be in it? I agree with the other comments about Pets, Seasons and University. I'm also on Team Farming Pack because added farming abilities would be something different. Yeah, we had Appaloosa Plains but they could do a lot more. I haven't played Stardew Valley and I don't know enough about the intellectual property side as far as any limitations. I do know that Maxis had a farming game though so EA probably has the rights to that. If they don't do a farming pack, I will chalk it up to an int'l property issue - ie: not wanting to deal with any potential litigation or that litigation not being worth the return on investment.
I am more interested in the GPs than the EPs other than getting "big" concepts and large worlds unless they really wow us. Those EPs cost double, so I don't mind paying less for interesting content. More vacations including a tropical one like other people want seems obvious. I actually like OR but not as the only vacation destination. I like it as an option and I'll still send some sims camping after any other tropical destination comes out. I've mentioned wanting a Love GP to balance out that side of the game because while I like Parenthood, the game feels a little skewed right now. I'd like some sort of SP focusing on elders and perhaps midlife - possibly also a casino night lol. I'm always open to new concepts though if they are interesting.
Realistically, I'm probably going to be slow to switch over to a new version because I'll want to keep playing with this stuff that I have and because I usually like to give them time to deal with bugs. (I was late to TS3 as I recall). I may possibly get Vampires, etc, before I tire of this version of the game. If I get bored of my realistic save, I may add that in at some point. I would ideally like to see something "new" as well or several things that feel new. I'll see how I'll feel when that time comes though.
*Excuse me while I go cry in a corner
On a serious note though, I do hope that the devs pick up the pace a bit. Hire more staff, get more funding, whatever it takes! The trend with Sims games was that we got a variation of what the previous had, plus more and I do hope that TS4 follows that trend. It has the potential to be a great game if EA allows it to be.
Would I be happy? Definitely. Do I think it will happen? No. I could easily see this game lasting an additional five years above the other games. They are just starting to rebuild their fan base. It would be a very stupid move to start on the sims 5 (or even quit development altogether). They are trying their best to make this the best sims game yet, and I personally think it's heading that way. And something like that takes time. They might not even make a sims five. To be honest, if I was them, I wouldn't. It would make them a lot of money, but people have more and more expectations as time goes on. The sims 4 community already expects too much out of the developers, they care about this game, and they care about more than money.
The Sims 5 can't come soon enough. Let's hope they learned from their mistakes and make a real Sims game next time, not only 'limitation this, limitation that'.
Sometimes your creativity is limited where you use it most, but you can use those limitations to inspire new forms of creativity you may never have thought of beforehand.
ETA: I don't see this game surviving eight EPs at all. It's performance is already taking a big hit to the point people need super pcs.
Yeah, I agree, actually that's also one of my concerns. The performance got significantly worse with each addition. Oh well, maybe they figure something out to solve this issue.
As is, I've bought every EP for the game so far, as all had aspects that interested me - Get to Work had interactive careers and potential for entrepreneurship, Get Together had a new world to explore, and City Living had apartments and festivals. With pets & seasons, I'd get two more things I enjoyed from TS3 back; personally, if pets happen I hope to see some sort of rudimentary emotional system (Fine, Happy, Sad, Angry, and Playful) for the pets.
That being said, my laptop can't keep running my school work and saving my game files all at once, so something's going to have to give. That's why I like the GPs - new content and features that add to gameplay without overwhelming my laptop.
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