For me I enjoy the teens currently as they are partly due to a little interaction that took place in my runaway challenge not that long ago. In a spoiler due to length:
So my homeless, orphaned teen got lucky in gardening and was able to build a shack for herself just before her birthday. Since part of the challenge is to avoid anyone else older than teen she only had 3 other friends, all teens (a boy and girl sibling pair and then one girl who would run to the park and talk my sim's ear off for hours just complaining about her school and parents...then they would cloudgaze to chill and help calm her down). Due to having to cook all her own meals her cooking was high enough that she could try gourmet cooking (this has a point later, promise).
So come the day of the birthday I have the sim just do her normal collecting around town. She runs into a couple of the aforementioned friends above but there's never a mention of birthdays or parties. Since my sim was so busy with managing her garden and other resources it looked like she'd be spending her birthday by herself. However she's a cheerful sim so she decides she still wants a cake. I have her use that gourmet cooking skill to try baking a black and white cake.
Just after she shoved the cake in the oven: all three of her teen friends appeared at her doorstep-the two siblings came together and the other girl came a few minutes ahead of them. No party was made or anything, they all just showed up. Invite them all in and quickly get back to the cake. Before I even put the birthday candles on (so happy this is an option, btw, on homemade cakes) the teens were all celebrating and were congratulating my sim.
Sim blows out candles, and she ages. There WERE differences between her teen and adult self and between her and her now younger friends, but they were subtle. Her body had become more shapely (and I don't just mean her boobs) and her face more narrow, among a few other small details, and she was a hair taller than the rest of the kids. Everyone cheers, my sim uses some of her remaining funds to purchase a crappy little boombox so they could have music, and the four friends party it out with cake, music, and taking turns sitting on the bed to talk in her little shack. Once it passed midnight the brother and sister high-tailed it out with a friendly wave together to go home, while the more rebellious teen stayed until roughly 1 or 2 before going back to her clearly unhappy home.
And the funny thing was, this whole heart-warming random event was believable because the teens looked to be on the older-looking end of the spectrum. These kids came from various degrees of sims families and were willing to essentially sneak away from home towards the end of their teen lives so that their homeless friend who was trying to turn her life around could have a good birthday. These sims actually looked the part of 16 to 18 year old teens preparing to leave high school and venture into the next stage of their lives. If this had been TS3 (first of all cops would have stopped the whole thing) they all would have looked way too young to be able to pull off this stunt.
This scenario and others like it make me far more a supporter for having pre-teens or splitting up the teen lifespan rather than just making all teens look what we think a 13-15 year old should look like. I certainly agree that teens need more teen-only things to do, but there's a lot more to being a teen (even a parody of one) than just snubbing your parents and being shorter than other people. The life of older teens tends to get ignored and immediately lumped in with the young adult stage when really there's a lot you go through in realizing the next step of life is fast approaching.
So I dunno, I feel like in some ways teens don't stand out, but on the other hand them being closer to YAs this go around actually opens up a lot of possibilities for them in terms of stories and scenarios that just were not really there in previous games.
I've made it clear in the first post that this was intended as a response to the argument regarding modification of the appearance and height of teens to further differentiate them from young adults - I've posted images of my characters as a sample of what I believe that the majority of players are accustomed to for teen appearances and to show the developers why I won't accept any updates which will cause distortion of pre-existing characters.
Any change of height, body scaling, texture shading, or facial topology, will entirely ruin their appearances, and creation of a new and shorter 'teen race' with feature-less faces would be absurd.
"Video gaming began as an engineer's hobby and a means of creative expression for those of higher technical inclination. It is expected that those who are capable of higher engineering-related achievements will see value, in electronic entertainment products, where others see failure." -Sasquatch
For me I enjoy the teens currently as they are partly due to a little interaction that took place in my runaway challenge not that long ago. In a spoiler due to length:
So my homeless, orphaned teen got lucky in gardening and was able to build a shack for herself just before her birthday. Since part of the challenge is to avoid anyone else older than teen she only had 3 other friends, all teens (a boy and girl sibling pair and then one girl who would run to the park and talk my sim's ear off for hours just complaining about her school and parents...then they would cloudgaze to chill and help calm her down). Due to having to cook all her own meals her cooking was high enough that she could try gourmet cooking (this has a point later, promise).
So come the day of the birthday I have the sim just do her normal collecting around town. She runs into a couple of the aforementioned friends above but there's never a mention of birthdays or parties. Since my sim was so busy with managing her garden and other resources it looked like she'd be spending her birthday by herself. However she's a cheerful sim so she decides she still wants a cake. I have her use that gourmet cooking skill to try baking a black and white cake.
Just after she shoved the cake in the oven: all three of her teen friends appeared at her doorstep-the two siblings came together and the other girl came a few minutes ahead of them. No party was made or anything, they all just showed up. Invite them all in and quickly get back to the cake. Before I even put the birthday candles on (so happy this is an option, btw, on homemade cakes) the teens were all celebrating and were congratulating my sim.
Sim blows out candles, and she ages. There WERE differences between her teen and adult self and between her and her now younger friends, but they were subtle. Her body had become more shapely (and I don't just mean her plum) and her face more narrow, among a few other small details, and she was a hair taller than the rest of the kids. Everyone cheers, my sim uses some of her remaining funds to purchase a plum little boombox so they could have music, and the four friends party it out with cake, music, and taking turns sitting on the bed to talk in her little shack. Once it passed midnight the brother and sister high-tailed it out with a friendly wave together to go home, while the more rebellious teen stayed until roughly 1 or 2 before going back to her clearly unhappy home.
And the funny thing was, this whole heart-warming random event was believable because the teens looked to be on the older-looking end of the spectrum. These kids came from various degrees of sims families and were willing to essentially sneak away from home towards the end of their teen lives so that their homeless friend who was trying to turn her life around could have a good birthday. These sims actually looked the part of 16 to 18 year old teens preparing to leave high school and venture into the next stage of their lives. If this had been TS3 (first of all cops would have stopped the whole thing) they all would have looked way too young to be able to pull off this stunt.
This scenario and others like it make me far more a supporter for having pre-teens or splitting up the teen lifespan rather than just making all teens look what we think a 13-15 year old should look like. I certainly agree that teens need more teen-only things to do, but there's a lot more to being a teen (even a parody of one) than just snubbing your parents and being shorter than other people. The life of older teens tends to get ignored and immediately lumped in with the young adult stage when really there's a lot you go through in realizing the next step of life is fast approaching.
So I dunno, I feel like in some ways teens don't stand out, but on the other hand them being closer to YAs this go around actually opens up a lot of possibilities for them in terms of stories and scenarios that just were not really there in previous games.
You are giving the simulator more credit than it was due, per what Will Wright said one time. You have interjected your own story into what really happened. What really happened was your Sim had no other friends. Doesn't matter if it was her birthday, or if she was an adult or an elder. The game sent three Sims like it does when Sims show up for no apparent reason. You have interjected what you wanted out of it. That they cared. I have gotten much older these days to be fooled by the game's AI. I used to do that stuff back in TS2 and TS3 I interjected what I thought was happening. It's something Will Wright spoke about several times about giving the life simulator more credit than it was due. But a fun story.
It's not I don't see the difference if they age up, it's when my camera is on one and I still have no idea. If that male Sim is a teen or a man. And the only way to find out is to try social interactions and sometimes waste your time if you were looking for a partner for your Sim.
Rights of passage are a big part of teenhood, and this game doesn't have any.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
This is just a discussion that is forever doomed to go around in circles. The devs have said to not hold our breath for taller teens making a come back. We know that height sliders are out of the question because of resources (time basically spent on height sliders would never get approval due to the time it would take from other projects that would make money such as new packs).
We also all know that teens are like they are due to development decisions being made long before launch to focus on other areas of the game (namely emotions and multi-tasking) and we are suspicious that it is also due in part to olympus although we have never had that confirmed.
Shorter teens are not going to be part of the sims 4 no matter how much we want them or think that that is how they should be. So as players we have a choice.... except the teens and get enjoyment out of what we have or try to keep asking (and giving feedback) for shorter teens.
I'm a girl who likes to play with boys, what can I say...
“Instead of putting players in the role of Luke Skywalker, or Frodo Baggins, I'd rather put them in the role of George Lucas.”Will Wright.
This is just a discussion that is forever doomed to go around in circles. The devs have said to not hold our breath for taller teens making a come back. We know that height sliders are out of the question because of resources (time basically spent on height sliders would never get approval due to the time it would take from other projects that would make money such as new packs).
We also all know that teens are like they are due to development decisions being made long before launch to focus on other areas of the game (namely emotions and multi-tasking) and we are suspicious that it is also due in part to olympus although we have never had that confirmed.
Shorter teens are not going to be part of the sims 4 no matter how much we want them or think that that is how they should be. So as players we have a choice.... except the teens and get enjoyment out of what we have or try to keep asking (and giving feedback) for shorter teens.
They could do something more with their frame. Or make them look much younger in the face. But what is actually needed is special teen personalities. Like they do something and you see it and think, oh, that's a teen. I don't know what they could add but vandalism is a start. TS3 teens can vandalize stuff. Run amuck? why not. Run through the venues hooping and hollering and causing tense disturbance moods.
Bullying? why not, it's a parody. Add special interactions like having to ask to go out after 8:00 P.M. Parents should know their kid left. Getting lectured. Who hasn't been lectured by adults when they were a teen? Any adult especially if they ran through any venue and disturbed Sims. They aren't going to learn to drive this time so they need to come up with things that make them stand out whether they are naughty or nice. And we know they are teens and part of what teens do, and not what any self respecting adult who is more worried about career, family and or money would do. There has to be some differences.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
This is just a discussion that is forever doomed to go around in circles. The devs have said to not hold our breath for taller teens making a come back. We know that height sliders are out of the question because of resources (time basically spent on height sliders would never get approval due to the time it would take from other projects that would make money such as new packs).
We also all know that teens are like they are due to development decisions being made long before launch to focus on other areas of the game (namely emotions and multi-tasking) and we are suspicious that it is also due in part to olympus although we have never had that confirmed.
Shorter teens are not going to be part of the sims 4 no matter how much we want them or think that that is how they should be. So as players we have a choice.... except the teens and get enjoyment out of what we have or try to keep asking (and giving feedback) for shorter teens.
They could do something more with their frame. Or make them look much younger in the face. But what is actually needed is special teen personalities. Like they do something and you see it and think, oh, that's a teen. I don't know what they could add but vandalism is a start. TS3 teens can vandalize stuff. Run amuck? why not. Run through the venues hooping and hollering and causing tense disturbance moods.
Bullying? why not, it's a parody. Add special interactions like having to ask to go out after 8:00 P.M. Parents should know their kid left. Getting lectured. Who hasn't been lectured by adults when they were a teen? Any adult especially if they ran through any venue and disturbed Sims. They aren't going to learn to drive this time so they need to come up with things that make them stand out whether they are naughty or nice. And we know they are teens and part of what teens do, and not what any self respecting adult who is more worried about career, family and or money would do. There has to be some differences.
I agree 100% with your ideas and yes there is a huge amount that could be done with teens even if their height is never changed. It's just that as a simming community if we were to focus on asking for ideas such as these, things that are achievable we might actually end up with an age stage that is different, unique and special.
But when it comes to the discussion about height... I just think that it a pointless one considering what the gurus have said.
I'm a girl who likes to play with boys, what can I say...
“Instead of putting players in the role of Luke Skywalker, or Frodo Baggins, I'd rather put them in the role of George Lucas.”Will Wright.
I don't have a problem with the teens in my game. I have not had trouble telling them apart from YA's for the most part... they are thinner framed and more baby faced normally. I do admit I see them as high school age or older I can't see them as younger than 16. I could see them going to college if and when it's introduced without them adding another stage to do it. I just couldn't see a shorter sim going to college.. that would just look weird to me. To me it would be really nice if both teens and young adults had the option to go to college or night school one day.. but I'm probably dreaming.
I also wouldn't want preteens in the game as in 10-12 year olds.. to me that already looks covered as the child Sims 4 has now looks 7-11 or so in my opinion. I would like to see a sim that appeared 12-16 though. It would be weird to me if they added in things that are typically "teen" to do for pre-teens... especially any romantic options.
I don't have a problem with the teens in my game. I have not had trouble telling them apart from YA's for the most part... they are thinner framed and more baby faced normally. I do admit I see them as high school age or older I can't see them as younger than 16. I could see them going to college if and when it's introduced without them adding another stage to do it. I just couldn't see a shorter sim going to college.. that would just look weird to me. To me it would be really nice if both teens and young adults had the option to go to college or night school one day.. but I'm probably dreaming.
I also wouldn't want preteens in the game as in 10-12 year olds.. to me that already looks covered as the child Sims 4 has now looks 7-11 or so in my opinion. I would like to see a sim that appeared 12-16 though. It would be weird to me if they added in things that are typically "teen" to do for pre-teens... especially any romantic options.
No, to the part I bolded. My game has generated several very heavy set teens who when my Sim played chess with them I had no idea they were teens. So, saying thinner framed isn't a fact.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
I don't have a problem with the teens in my game. I have not had trouble telling them apart from YA's for the most part... they are thinner framed and more baby faced normally. I do admit I see them as high school age or older I can't see them as younger than 16. I could see them going to college if and when it's introduced without them adding another stage to do it. I just couldn't see a shorter sim going to college.. that would just look weird to me. To me it would be really nice if both teens and young adults had the option to go to college or night school one day.. but I'm probably dreaming.
I also wouldn't want preteens in the game as in 10-12 year olds.. to me that already looks covered as the child Sims 4 has now looks 7-11 or so in my opinion. I would like to see a sim that appeared 12-16 though. It would be weird to me if they added in things that are typically "teen" to do for pre-teens... especially any romantic options.
No, to the part I bolded. My game has generated several very heavy set teens who when my Sim played chess with them I had no idea they were teens. So, saying thinner framed isn't a fact.
No, to the part I bolded. Some of the game generated teens are noticeably thinner and more lanky. I sent my sim to the park and she ran into another sim wearing the same dress and I could immediately tell she was a teen.
I don't have a problem with the teens in my game. I have not had trouble telling them apart from YA's for the most part... they are thinner framed and more baby faced normally. I do admit I see them as high school age or older I can't see them as younger than 16. I could see them going to college if and when it's introduced without them adding another stage to do it. I just couldn't see a shorter sim going to college.. that would just look weird to me. To me it would be really nice if both teens and young adults had the option to go to college or night school one day.. but I'm probably dreaming.
I also wouldn't want preteens in the game as in 10-12 year olds.. to me that already looks covered as the child Sims 4 has now looks 7-11 or so in my opinion. I would like to see a sim that appeared 12-16 though. It would be weird to me if they added in things that are typically "teen" to do for pre-teens... especially any romantic options.
No, to the part I bolded. My game has generated several very heavy set teens who when my Sim played chess with them I had no idea they were teens. So, saying thinner framed isn't a fact.
No, to the part I bolded. Some of the game generated teens are noticeably thinner and more lanky. I sent my sim to the park and she ran into another sim wearing the same dress and I could immediately tell she was a teen.
The point was the game does generate teens and nobody can tell them apart. It's not a given they all are skinny. If I posted some pics here (which I don't have a picture host and don't want one) no one would be able to tell me which was the adult or the teen during shots taken during gameplay.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
I don't have a problem with the teens in my game. I have not had trouble telling them apart from YA's for the most part... they are thinner framed and more baby faced normally. I do admit I see them as high school age or older I can't see them as younger than 16. I could see them going to college if and when it's introduced without them adding another stage to do it. I just couldn't see a shorter sim going to college.. that would just look weird to me. To me it would be really nice if both teens and young adults had the option to go to college or night school one day.. but I'm probably dreaming.
I also wouldn't want preteens in the game as in 10-12 year olds.. to me that already looks covered as the child Sims 4 has now looks 7-11 or so in my opinion. I would like to see a sim that appeared 12-16 though. It would be weird to me if they added in things that are typically "teen" to do for pre-teens... especially any romantic options.
No, to the part I bolded. My game has generated several very heavy set teens who when my Sim played chess with them I had no idea they were teens. So, saying thinner framed isn't a fact.
No, to the part I bolded. Some of the game generated teens are noticeably thinner and more lanky. I sent my sim to the park and she ran into another sim wearing the same dress and I could immediately tell she was a teen.
The point was the game does generate teens and nobody can tell them apart. It's not a given they all are skinny. If I posted some pics here (which I don't have a picture host and don't want one) no one would be able to tell me which was the adult or the teen during shots taken during gameplay.
You can't make absolute statements like that. I agree some are difficult to distinguish but not all.
@simgirl1010 the only way I know a thin Sim is a teen is most of them wear the eyeball ring. That's it.
Lol, I don't even know what the eyeball ring is. Although there are a few teens in my neighborhood I rarely play them as there is not much to distinguish them from young adults in terms of gameplay. Waiting for that Teen Stuff pack.
@simgirl1010 the only way I know a thin Sim is a teen is most of them wear the eyeball ring. That's it.
Lol, I don't even know what the eyeball ring is. Although there are a few teens in my neighborhood I rarely play them as there is not much to distinguish them from young adults in terms of gameplay. Waiting for that Teen Stuff pack.
Does it really not bother you that you will have to buy separately all the things (some of it) in packs or stuff packs to get differences in the ages, when every base game (even TS1's kids were very different than adults) had those differences and you have paid $60 more or less whatever people paid and they have to keep spending to actually fill out the game when all the base games had those differences to a greater extent than this game ever dared.
ETA: <More money over and over just to get some of what base games had about teens, kids, toddlers, elders and babies, and then still not be up to par with those differences. I don't know, it's starting to feel like it's all just tacked on later.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
I enjoy seeing a more significant difference between teens and young adults or adults. Addressing teen sims' height, would be a first step, but what would be ideal is to give a CAS slider for simmers to adjust all sims' heights period. (There are actually a couple mods out there that do this now.) I think the thought process, as a generality, that it's more realistic for teens to be closer in height to their parents is vastly naive. Real life genetics are an interesting thing. You will find teens that tower over their parents, teens that are same height as or close to their parents, and you will find teens that aren't anywhere near the height of their parents. So again, the non-adjustable same height issue, is a bummer. It'd be nice for simmers to be able to adjust all sims' heights, as previously mentioned, without installing mods to do so. But I'm thankful for our modding community. Those guys really work some magic!
Now that we have stuff for the children, I feel more acutely the need for stuff for teens. I've been thinking of starting a game with aging on "long" to have more time for children, but that means more time for teens, and there's just not that much for them.
I must admit, though, that teens have never been my favorite age group. In TS4, I sent them to University almost immediately after their birthday. TS3 had learning how to drive, which was cute, and going to prom, which could have been so much better.
Anyway, things we can currently do -- have them join the Renegades and sabotage the community lots; give them pink, green, or blue hair; give them the goofy walk if they're skinny (it doesn't look right on overweight sims). The eyeball rings sound like a good idea, too.
Parents can lecture teens; I just don't often have them do it, unless it's part of a story.
It would be great if we could get skate-boarding (after all, we had the hover board in Into the Future), spiky hairdos, and backpacks that they can wear. Not having any teens around, I'm not sure what else. Of course, people are complaining because the Voidcritters are only for children; even if EA came up with something only for teens, people would probably complain about that, too.
I don't really see how a teen SP would help, given SPs only add 1-2 gameplay things (teens need far more than just 2 unique things) and adults would be able to wear all the teen hair/clothes anyways.
Now that we have stuff for the children, I feel more acutely the need for stuff for teens. I've been thinking of starting a game with aging on "long" to have more time for children, but that means more time for teens, and there's just not that much for them.
I must admit, though, that teens have never been my favorite age group. In TS4, I sent them to University almost immediately after their birthday. TS3 had learning how to drive, which was cute, and going to prom, which could have been so much better.
Anyway, things we can currently do -- have them join the Renegades and sabotage the community lots; give them pink, green, or blue hair; give them the goofy walk if they're skinny (it doesn't look right on overweight sims). The eyeball rings sound like a good idea, too.
Parents can lecture teens; I just don't often have them do it, unless it's part of a story.
It would be great if we could get skate-boarding (after all, we had the hover board in Into the Future), plum hairdos, and backpacks that they can wear. Not having any teens around, I'm not sure what else. Of course, people are complaining because the Voidcritters are only for children; even if EA came up with something only for teens, people would probably complain about that, too.
I think those complaining about child only objects probably never play anyone but a young adult and would be miserable if next time they get removed. But honestly other than grind for an achievement sort of gameplay and filling up those horrible long lists of aspirations in this game I see no point in the next game of having them. There is nothing special about them either. I was under the impression The Sims was a parody for years. Maybe I was wrong. But in a parody you monopolize everything about a life stage almost to the extreme because it is a parody and this game seems to have forgotten why people laughed when they played all the life stages. Because we understood it was a parody and yep, we had seen that behavior from a toddler, an elder, a teen, etc. We liked they took every advantage they could to stereotype all life stages, because some of us believed it when they said it was a parody. Now, they say it's something else. I don't know. Leaving behind the formula doesn't seem that impressive to me.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
@simgirl1010 the only way I know a thin Sim is a teen is most of them wear the eyeball ring. That's it.
Lol, I don't even know what the eyeball ring is. Although there are a few teens in my neighborhood I rarely play them as there is not much to distinguish them from young adults in terms of gameplay. Waiting for that Teen Stuff pack.
Does it really not bother you that you will have to buy separately all the things (some of it) in packs or stuff packs to get differences in the ages, when every base game (even TS1's kids were very different than adults) had those differences and you have paid $60 more or less whatever people paid and they have to keep spending to actually fill out the game when all the base games had those differences to a greater extent than this game ever dared.
ETA: <More money over and over just to get some of what base games had about teens, kids, toddlers, elders and babies, and then still not be up to par with those differences. I don't know, it's starting to feel like it's all just tacked on later.
No, it doesn't bother me at all.:) I like the game. I was satisfied with what was included in the base game. I haven't spent the last two years focusing on what was available in Sims 2 and Sims 3 and what should have been in Sims 4 and I will buy whatever continues to make the game enjoyable for me.
I don't have a problem with the teens in my game. I have not had trouble telling them apart from YA's for the most part... they are thinner framed and more baby faced normally. I do admit I see them as high school age or older I can't see them as younger than 16. I could see them going to college if and when it's introduced without them adding another stage to do it. I just couldn't see a shorter sim going to college.. that would just look weird to me. To me it would be really nice if both teens and young adults had the option to go to college or night school one day.. but I'm probably dreaming.
I also wouldn't want preteens in the game as in 10-12 year olds.. to me that already looks covered as the child Sims 4 has now looks 7-11 or so in my opinion. I would like to see a sim that appeared 12-16 though. It would be weird to me if they added in things that are typically "teen" to do for pre-teens... especially any romantic options.
No, to the part I bolded. My game has generated several very heavy set teens who when my Sim played chess with them I had no idea they were teens. So, saying thinner framed isn't a fact.
No, to the part I bolded. Some of the game generated teens are noticeably thinner and more lanky. I sent my sim to the park and she ran into another sim wearing the same dress and I could immediately tell she was a teen.
The point was the game does generate teens and nobody can tell them apart. It's not a given they all are skinny. If I posted some pics here (which I don't have a picture host and don't want one) no one would be able to tell me which was the adult or the teen during shots taken during gameplay.
You can't make absolute statements like that. I agree some are difficult to distinguish but not all.
I generally don't have any problem at all now spotting a game generated teen. Maybe it is because I have played teen-only households a lot. I don't know. I mean sure, back when the game launched it was literally impossible to spot a teen but I'm starting to feel that I'm playing a different game to everyone else.
I'm a girl who likes to play with boys, what can I say...
“Instead of putting players in the role of Luke Skywalker, or Frodo Baggins, I'd rather put them in the role of George Lucas.”Will Wright.
...guarantees that we're getting toddlers even though we've all been told that it's not happening.
"Video gaming began as an engineer's hobby and a means of creative expression for those of higher technical inclination. It is expected that those who are capable of higher engineering-related achievements will see value, in electronic entertainment products, where others see failure." -Sasquatch
You are giving the simulator more credit than it was due, per what Will Wright said one time. You have interjected your own story into what really happened. What really happened was your Sim had no other friends. Doesn't matter if it was her birthday, or if she was an adult or an elder. The game sent three Sims like it does when Sims show up for no apparent reason. You have interjected what you wanted out of it. That they cared. I have gotten much older these days to be fooled by the game's AI. I used to do that stuff back in TS2 and TS3 I interjected what I thought was happening. It's something Will Wright spoke about several times about giving the life simulator more credit than it was due. But a fun story.
It's not I don't see the difference if they age up, it's when my camera is on one and I still have no idea. If that male Sim is a teen or a man. And the only way to find out is to try social interactions and sometimes waste your time if you were looking for a partner for your Sim.
Rights of passage are a big part of teenhood, and this game doesn't have any.
That sounds like a personal problem. I can tell when a teen is a teen in the game. And in the cases you can't...you can take two seconds to hover your mouse over them and the game will tell you. Saying "no one can tell who is a teen" isn't truth because...clearly there are people who can, hence the people in this thread who are saying that looks-wise teens are fine.
I agree with some of your ideas in your other posts: I want teens to have teen-only clothes and teen-only activities to make them shine from other life stages. Absolutely.
But you can make incredibly young looking teens in the CAS mode just like you can make teens that look like Young Adults. I know for boys growth is different, but girls for the most part hit the end of their main growth...by like 14 or 15. The massive height growth for them between teen and young adult was utterly jarring. The main thing that changes between people from teen to YA is more often than not hair and clothes to match their growing differences in mentality. This is why I want another life stage, or just add a height slider to TS5 if we ever get it.
Should there be more showing of losing baby fat between teen and YA? That one I concede that they could probably add a bit more to. But then again you can just use an in-game cheat and make the face look thinner yourself after you age. Most people don't have a dramatic metamorphosis, not even in cartoons. Teens can and often try to make themselves look like adults on purpose. That's what teens do. And they're often pretty darn good at it if given the freedom. Growing up in a college town I've watched middle-schoolers manage to make themselves look like college students, to the point where adults were hitting on them. I'm not saying that's a good thing, I'm just saying that's what teenagers do. They want to look older so that they have a higher chance of being treated like an adult rather than a kid.
So yes, we need more teen-only oriented gameplay. But I personally prefer the freedom looks-wise of TS4 as I have a lot more control of whether I want my teen to look like they just became a teen or if they're about to age up. I didn't have that freedom in TS3 (to me the teens there just looked like shorter clones of the YAs, again, unless you installed a whole bunch of extra sliders).
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OUTER SENSHI PRIDE
So come the day of the birthday I have the sim just do her normal collecting around town. She runs into a couple of the aforementioned friends above but there's never a mention of birthdays or parties. Since my sim was so busy with managing her garden and other resources it looked like she'd be spending her birthday by herself. However she's a cheerful sim so she decides she still wants a cake. I have her use that gourmet cooking skill to try baking a black and white cake.
Just after she shoved the cake in the oven: all three of her teen friends appeared at her doorstep-the two siblings came together and the other girl came a few minutes ahead of them. No party was made or anything, they all just showed up. Invite them all in and quickly get back to the cake. Before I even put the birthday candles on (so happy this is an option, btw, on homemade cakes) the teens were all celebrating and were congratulating my sim.
Sim blows out candles, and she ages. There WERE differences between her teen and adult self and between her and her now younger friends, but they were subtle. Her body had become more shapely (and I don't just mean her boobs) and her face more narrow, among a few other small details, and she was a hair taller than the rest of the kids. Everyone cheers, my sim uses some of her remaining funds to purchase a crappy little boombox so they could have music, and the four friends party it out with cake, music, and taking turns sitting on the bed to talk in her little shack. Once it passed midnight the brother and sister high-tailed it out with a friendly wave together to go home, while the more rebellious teen stayed until roughly 1 or 2 before going back to her clearly unhappy home.
And the funny thing was, this whole heart-warming random event was believable because the teens looked to be on the older-looking end of the spectrum. These kids came from various degrees of sims families and were willing to essentially sneak away from home towards the end of their teen lives so that their homeless friend who was trying to turn her life around could have a good birthday. These sims actually looked the part of 16 to 18 year old teens preparing to leave high school and venture into the next stage of their lives. If this had been TS3 (first of all cops would have stopped the whole thing) they all would have looked way too young to be able to pull off this stunt.
This scenario and others like it make me far more a supporter for having pre-teens or splitting up the teen lifespan rather than just making all teens look what we think a 13-15 year old should look like. I certainly agree that teens need more teen-only things to do, but there's a lot more to being a teen (even a parody of one) than just snubbing your parents and being shorter than other people. The life of older teens tends to get ignored and immediately lumped in with the young adult stage when really there's a lot you go through in realizing the next step of life is fast approaching.
So I dunno, I feel like in some ways teens don't stand out, but on the other hand them being closer to YAs this go around actually opens up a lot of possibilities for them in terms of stories and scenarios that just were not really there in previous games.
I've made it clear in the first post that this was intended as a response to the argument regarding modification of the appearance and height of teens to further differentiate them from young adults - I've posted images of my characters as a sample of what I believe that the majority of players are accustomed to for teen appearances and to show the developers why I won't accept any updates which will cause distortion of pre-existing characters.
Any change of height, body scaling, texture shading, or facial topology, will entirely ruin their appearances, and creation of a new and shorter 'teen race' with feature-less faces would be absurd.
You are giving the simulator more credit than it was due, per what Will Wright said one time. You have interjected your own story into what really happened. What really happened was your Sim had no other friends. Doesn't matter if it was her birthday, or if she was an adult or an elder. The game sent three Sims like it does when Sims show up for no apparent reason. You have interjected what you wanted out of it. That they cared. I have gotten much older these days to be fooled by the game's AI. I used to do that stuff back in TS2 and TS3 I interjected what I thought was happening. It's something Will Wright spoke about several times about giving the life simulator more credit than it was due. But a fun story.
It's not I don't see the difference if they age up, it's when my camera is on one and I still have no idea. If that male Sim is a teen or a man. And the only way to find out is to try social interactions and sometimes waste your time if you were looking for a partner for your Sim.
Rights of passage are a big part of teenhood, and this game doesn't have any.
We also all know that teens are like they are due to development decisions being made long before launch to focus on other areas of the game (namely emotions and multi-tasking) and we are suspicious that it is also due in part to olympus although we have never had that confirmed.
Shorter teens are not going to be part of the sims 4 no matter how much we want them or think that that is how they should be. So as players we have a choice.... except the teens and get enjoyment out of what we have or try to keep asking (and giving feedback) for shorter teens.
“Instead of putting players in the role of Luke Skywalker, or Frodo Baggins, I'd rather put them in the role of George Lucas.”Will Wright.
They could do something more with their frame. Or make them look much younger in the face. But what is actually needed is special teen personalities. Like they do something and you see it and think, oh, that's a teen. I don't know what they could add but vandalism is a start. TS3 teens can vandalize stuff. Run amuck? why not. Run through the venues hooping and hollering and causing tense disturbance moods.
Bullying? why not, it's a parody. Add special interactions like having to ask to go out after 8:00 P.M. Parents should know their kid left. Getting lectured. Who hasn't been lectured by adults when they were a teen? Any adult especially if they ran through any venue and disturbed Sims. They aren't going to learn to drive this time so they need to come up with things that make them stand out whether they are naughty or nice. And we know they are teens and part of what teens do, and not what any self respecting adult who is more worried about career, family and or money would do. There has to be some differences.
I agree 100% with your ideas and yes there is a huge amount that could be done with teens even if their height is never changed. It's just that as a simming community if we were to focus on asking for ideas such as these, things that are achievable we might actually end up with an age stage that is different, unique and special.
But when it comes to the discussion about height... I just think that it a pointless one considering what the gurus have said.
“Instead of putting players in the role of Luke Skywalker, or Frodo Baggins, I'd rather put them in the role of George Lucas.”Will Wright.
I also wouldn't want preteens in the game as in 10-12 year olds.. to me that already looks covered as the child Sims 4 has now looks 7-11 or so in my opinion. I would like to see a sim that appeared 12-16 though. It would be weird to me if they added in things that are typically "teen" to do for pre-teens... especially any romantic options.
No, to the part I bolded. My game has generated several very heavy set teens who when my Sim played chess with them I had no idea they were teens. So, saying thinner framed isn't a fact.
No, to the part I bolded.
The point was the game does generate teens and nobody can tell them apart. It's not a given they all are skinny. If I posted some pics here (which I don't have a picture host and don't want one) no one would be able to tell me which was the adult or the teen during shots taken during gameplay.
You can't make absolute statements like that. I agree some are difficult to distinguish but not all.
Lol, I don't even know what the eyeball ring is.
Does it really not bother you that you will have to buy separately all the things (some of it) in packs or stuff packs to get differences in the ages, when every base game (even TS1's kids were very different than adults) had those differences and you have paid $60 more or less whatever people paid and they have to keep spending to actually fill out the game when all the base games had those differences to a greater extent than this game ever dared.
ETA: <More money over and over just to get some of what base games had about teens, kids, toddlers, elders and babies, and then still not be up to par with those differences. I don't know, it's starting to feel like it's all just tacked on later.
I enjoy seeing a more significant difference between teens and young adults or adults. Addressing teen sims' height, would be a first step, but what would be ideal is to give a CAS slider for simmers to adjust all sims' heights period. (There are actually a couple mods out there that do this now.) I think the thought process, as a generality, that it's more realistic for teens to be closer in height to their parents is vastly naive. Real life genetics are an interesting thing. You will find teens that tower over their parents, teens that are same height as or close to their parents, and you will find teens that aren't anywhere near the height of their parents. So again, the non-adjustable same height issue, is a bummer. It'd be nice for simmers to be able to adjust all sims' heights, as previously mentioned, without installing mods to do so. But I'm thankful for our modding community. Those guys really work some magic!
I must admit, though, that teens have never been my favorite age group. In TS4, I sent them to University almost immediately after their birthday. TS3 had learning how to drive, which was cute, and going to prom, which could have been so much better.
Anyway, things we can currently do -- have them join the Renegades and sabotage the community lots; give them pink, green, or blue hair; give them the goofy walk if they're skinny (it doesn't look right on overweight sims). The eyeball rings sound like a good idea, too.
Parents can lecture teens; I just don't often have them do it, unless it's part of a story.
It would be great if we could get skate-boarding (after all, we had the hover board in Into the Future), spiky hairdos, and backpacks that they can wear. Not having any teens around, I'm not sure what else. Of course, people are complaining because the Voidcritters are only for children; even if EA came up with something only for teens, people would probably complain about that, too.
I think those complaining about child only objects probably never play anyone but a young adult and would be miserable if next time they get removed. But honestly other than grind for an achievement sort of gameplay and filling up those horrible long lists of aspirations in this game I see no point in the next game of having them. There is nothing special about them either. I was under the impression The Sims was a parody for years. Maybe I was wrong. But in a parody you monopolize everything about a life stage almost to the extreme because it is a parody and this game seems to have forgotten why people laughed when they played all the life stages. Because we understood it was a parody and yep, we had seen that behavior from a toddler, an elder, a teen, etc. We liked they took every advantage they could to stereotype all life stages, because some of us believed it when they said it was a parody. Now, they say it's something else. I don't know. Leaving behind the formula doesn't seem that impressive to me.
No, it doesn't bother me at all.:) I like the game. I was satisfied with what was included in the base game. I haven't spent the last two years focusing on what was available in Sims 2 and Sims 3 and what should have been in Sims 4 and I will buy whatever continues to make the game enjoyable for me.
I generally don't have any problem at all now spotting a game generated teen. Maybe it is because I have played teen-only households a lot. I don't know. I mean sure, back when the game launched it was literally impossible to spot a teen but I'm starting to feel that I'm playing a different game to everyone else.
“Instead of putting players in the role of Luke Skywalker, or Frodo Baggins, I'd rather put them in the role of George Lucas.”Will Wright.
...guarantees that we're getting toddlers even though we've all been told that it's not happening.
I agree with some of your ideas in your other posts: I want teens to have teen-only clothes and teen-only activities to make them shine from other life stages. Absolutely.
But you can make incredibly young looking teens in the CAS mode just like you can make teens that look like Young Adults. I know for boys growth is different, but girls for the most part hit the end of their main growth...by like 14 or 15. The massive height growth for them between teen and young adult was utterly jarring. The main thing that changes between people from teen to YA is more often than not hair and clothes to match their growing differences in mentality. This is why I want another life stage, or just add a height slider to TS5 if we ever get it.
Should there be more showing of losing baby fat between teen and YA? That one I concede that they could probably add a bit more to. But then again you can just use an in-game cheat and make the face look thinner yourself after you age. Most people don't have a dramatic metamorphosis, not even in cartoons. Teens can and often try to make themselves look like adults on purpose. That's what teens do. And they're often pretty darn good at it if given the freedom. Growing up in a college town I've watched middle-schoolers manage to make themselves look like college students, to the point where adults were hitting on them. I'm not saying that's a good thing, I'm just saying that's what teenagers do. They want to look older so that they have a higher chance of being treated like an adult rather than a kid.
So yes, we need more teen-only oriented gameplay. But I personally prefer the freedom looks-wise of TS4 as I have a lot more control of whether I want my teen to look like they just became a teen or if they're about to age up. I didn't have that freedom in TS3 (to me the teens there just looked like shorter clones of the YAs, again, unless you installed a whole bunch of extra sliders).