[quote="Zeldaboy180;c-17842532"][quote="elanorbreton;c-17842473"][quote="mightysprite;c-17842420"]Discovering new elements of the game ourselves can be fun :)
[/quote] Yes, sometimes it's boring to get everything handed to you on a plate. I like surprises 🙂[/quote]
I get what you're saying, but patch notes exist for the reason, so we know the changes made to our game. It's also very important for modders and content creators to know, not just players.[/quote]
Agreed also say it fun to look for the changes makes me feel iffy. Bc the fun of the trait improvements should be playing with them not finding them
It's not the end of the world for me, though. If Mean/Goofball/Ambitious makes himself look too much like a fool, I can always make him Cat Lover/Ambitious/Glutton or Family oriented. That way he will act civilly and self-prserving while in the hands of the A.I,, and live his goofball and mean inclinations out to the fullest while I control him
When cheerful sims are currently in a negative emotional state, they have a new self-interaction called "Look at the Brightside".
This interaction will reduce the time remaining of their negative moodlets (by about 3 hours) and you will need to wait for some time before you can make your sim do that again.
This is very nice. Some thing unique to a certain trait, yet not autonomous so those whose story would be disrupted by a shorter negative state can simply not use it.
I've actually never really used the goofball trait because I always thought it was kind of "useless" but now that goofball Sims use a lot of autonomous mischief, it makes me want to use it. Especially since I have the perfect Sim in mind to use it on. My sim version of Loki.
I also always viewed "neat" Sims as meaning "neat freak" which is why I always avoided using it. So that's much more in line with what I imagined. Although I can see where it might get a little annoying.
I just hope the mischievous interactions stay in regards to the goofball trait, and that the only changes made are to toilets being broken less often. Either that, or add a new trait and/or rename this one.
When cheerful sims are currently in a negative emotional state, they have a new self-interaction called "Look at the Brightside".
This interaction will reduce the time remaining of their negative moodlets (by about 3 hours) and you will need to wait for some time before you can make your sim do that again.
This is very nice. Some thing unique to a certain trait, yet not autonomous so those whose story would be disrupted by a shorter negative state can simply not use it.
It's not about getting annoyed by a negative state, storyplayers want fail states as much as you.
Our (my) problem with autonomy is it breaking character by either pushing the sims to do something they wouldn't according to our image of them (in canon Sims 4 sims are pretty stereotypical) or something extremely nonsensical that a person irl would not do (granny throwing herself down between my two toddlers to do push ups). It's less "oh, something bad happened, my utopia is tarnished" and more "something incredibly unbelievable happened and jolted me out of my interactive novel".
Does anyone still play with whims enabled? I've noticed that my sims seem to be getting whims that are more relevant to their traits. My ambitious sim wants to get a promotion, for example.
When cheerful sims are currently in a negative emotional state, they have a new self-interaction called "Look at the Brightside".
This interaction will reduce the time remaining of their negative moodlets (by about 3 hours) and you will need to wait for some time before you can make your sim do that again.
This is very nice. Some thing unique to a certain trait, yet not autonomous so those whose story would be disrupted by a shorter negative state can simply not use it.
It's not about getting annoyed by a negative state, storyplayers want fail states as much as you.
Our (my) problem with autonomy is it breaking character by either pushing the sims to do something they wouldn't according to our image of them (in canon Sims 4 sims are pretty stereotypical) or something extremely nonsensical that a person irl would not do (granny throwing herself down between my two toddlers to do push ups). It's less "oh, something bad happened, my utopia is tarnished" and more "something incredibly unbelievable happened and jolted me out of my interactive novel".
If you don't want sims to do things not approved by you then there is an option called free will off.
A story is not fun, nor is it interesting if everything always goes the way you want it.
People ask if sims would finally be "not all sims are the same" , and when they get it, they want them to be the same again. Ok.
My love, my love, my fearless love, I will not say goodbye..
Sea may rise, sky may fall, My love will never die..
My heart, my heart, My drowning heart, Oh all the tears I've cried
Oh I may weep forevermore, My love will never die..
People ask if sims would finally be "not all sims are the same" , and when they get it, they want them to be the same again. Ok.
I was reading the thread and thinking this exactly. Those who want to keep their sims on line with what they imagine, can do that with free will. But we finally have sims acting according to their traits.
I have played today for 5 hours and i had more fun then ever... my neat sim kept the house clean, but he also talked to others, took care of his motives and did homework autonomously. Yeah he cleaned a lot but that's why he's neat. Not average, neat, as one of his only 3 character traits...
I'm loving this. I hope devs do that with all the other traits. Sim seem to have more personality now
People ask if sims would finally be "not all sims are the same" , and when they get it, they want them to be the same again. Ok.
I was reading the thread and thinking this exactly. Those who want to keep their sims on line with what they imagine, can do that with free will. But we finally have sims acting according to their traits.
I have played today for 5 hours and i had more fun then ever... my neat sim kept the house clean, but he also talked to others, took care of his motives and did homework autonomously. Yeah he cleaned a lot but that's why he's neat. Not average, neat, as one of his only 3 character traits...
I'm loving this. I hope devs do that with all the other traits. Sim seem to have more personality now
Yes, that is WHY he is neat!
My love, my love, my fearless love, I will not say goodbye..
Sea may rise, sky may fall, My love will never die..
My heart, my heart, My drowning heart, Oh all the tears I've cried
Oh I may weep forevermore, My love will never die..
People ask if sims would finally be "not all sims are the same" , and when they get it, they want them to be the same again. Ok.
I think that if people play with a mix of autonomy and directing their sims to different actions, there might end up being a nice balance
Even so, there is no way to please everyone. So now Neat trait means something.
Nobody is forcing you to use that trait.
But then again.. maybe it is better to go back at the point when traits meant NOTHING?
My love, my love, my fearless love, I will not say goodbye..
Sea may rise, sky may fall, My love will never die..
My heart, my heart, My drowning heart, Oh all the tears I've cried
Oh I may weep forevermore, My love will never die..
I'm glad some people are seeing a difference in some of their sims. I'm still feeling bummed that my sims who hate children and commitment don't seem much different from before. Hopefully, this is just the first step to improving traits. It would be cool to see them dig into this deeper and fix the issue with emotions conflicting with the trait behaviors for certain types of sims.
I'm happy to hear that some of the traits are better. It sounds like Goof Ball and Neat got a lot of improvements.
Hopefully they get to some other traits, particularly Evil, Hates Children and Glutton, which I feel need more work.
Let's do an experiment. This is Paola, and I have edited her to give her the traits Neat, Goofball, and Cheerful, the three traits I've seen people post about that seem to have the most autonomous/noticeable changes. Will one trait be dominant over the others? I don't have time to play tonight, but stay tuned
Also, please share your own observations about sims who have multiple traits that got improvements. I'm curious to see if they balance each other out, or if one seems to dominate the others.
After reading several comments on here, I think the problem isn't people wanting Sims to still act the same as before, but more of that they want there to be a balance between Sims doing what one of their traits makes them do and other interactions. Like, Goofball Sims should definitely do Mischief interactions and Funny interactions, but there are still two other traits (if the Sim is an adult) that should also be given attention and more types of interactions for Sims to do. A Sim should do a mixture of everything, with a little more attention given to the three or less traits they have so that they don't just do one thing the whole time. I personally like it when my Sims do something that is not related to their traits, such as a more friendly Sim getting angry and then being rude to everyone else. I find that fun! However, I don't know if it would be possible to achieve this balance to make everyone happy. Maybe in the future? Who knows?
I think that is it more than anything, there should be a balance. I have a sim who is both Clumsy and a Goofball (I think Clumsy was one that was adjusted too) and I see more mischief interactions from him than anything else. He's always dropped dishes while washing them but a new thing I noticed is that ocassionally he trips over his own feet while walking, which I thought was funny. I've only seen that a couple of times, so it looks to me that the mischief and cleaning autonomy is much stronger than it is for some of the other traits.
I don't mind that the traits have been adjusted, but the tuning seems extreme compared to others that were adjusted. I'm not seeing a major difference with my mean sims, they're more or less the same as they were prior to the pach. I don't currently have any Cheerful sims, so I haven't seen that one in action yet. I am playing a household of 8 YAs and they have a variety of traits that were adjusted in the patch. I haven't seen anything different with the non-committal sim either.
I just want to summarize a bit what was find out for now, and put the question back in the topic:
Bookworm - gain fun from reading, prefer reading over TV, bookworm townies can carry books around town, can autonomously quickly browse through bookcases;
Cheerful - can look for a bright side to reduce self negative moodlets, can stress others with cheerfulness;
Clumsy - can slip on the ground without any puddles, can fell off bunk bed;
Genius - new self-interaction "solve hard problem" to build some logic, may now have eureka moments;
Gloomy - ??? unknown
Glutton - ??? unknown
Good - have a new "help out" interaction, which shares the same animation with cheering up, that's all??? Unknown;
Goofball - frequently performing mischief interactions and prank the toilet;
Hates Children - ??? unknown
Hot-Headed - ??? unknown
Jealous - ??? unknown
Mean - now constantly hit stuffed animals, that's all??? Unknown;
Neat - polish to perfection even clean objects, do this very frequently and on community lots too;
Additionally, it has been reported that frequency of emotional moodlets from emotional traits have been increased.
Did I miss something for any of the traits? Still a very long way to go to find out something for other traits... I think I'll do a test run for some of them later today.
P.S. Updated with info pointed out by @EgonVM. Thank you!
I dont feel like it is extreme in my game. My neat sims did other things beside cleaning, like watching tv and socializing with each other. My goofball sim did prank the toilet daily but it was kinda adorable because she was living alone so she was pranking herself. She is so silly XD I also felt like she was in a playful mood more frequently, it was notacible which is nice. Oh, and i feel like bookworms read more now! I would like to try some of the other traits soon.
I'm happy to hear that some of the traits are better. It sounds like Goof Ball and Neat got a lot of improvements.
Hopefully they get to some other traits, particularly Evil, Hates Children and Glutton, which I feel need more work.
I'm actually worried about changes to evil. Evil does NOT equal mean. Evil enjoys the misery of others. Evil may work toward causing that misery, yes. But I like to play my evil vampires as mafia family evil. Loving, outwardly respectful and polite, thoroughly reveling in the misery around them. I love the evil laugh they do - it shows their personality without doing some autonomously mean actions. If they start doing petty stuff like go break toilets I'd have to turn that autonomy off. Which I can and will do so I guess it's not that big of a deal.
I'm curious other people's thoughts about evil sims. Do most imagine them going round being outwardly mean? If so, what do you imagine the difference between evil and mean is?
One of my sims is Evil, Gloomy, Romantic and I wouldn't consider him to be a mean sim. He's what I would call complicated, lol. He was one of the sims I tested earlier and I saw no change in his behavior. He was Happy the whole time. I really wanted to see how Gloomy was after the patch, but I didn't see him get sad or do a mean interaction to anyone.
I just want to summarize a bit what was find out for now, and put the question back in the topic:
Bookworm - gain fun from reading, prefer reading over TV;
Cheerful - can look for a bright side to refuse self negative moodlets, can stress others with cheerfulness;
Clumsy - can slip on the ground without any puddles, can fell off bunk bed;
Genius - new self-interaction "solve hard problem" to build some logic, that's all??? Unknown;
Gloomy - ??? unknown
Glutton - ??? unknown
Good - ??? unknown
Goofball - frequently performing mischief interactions and prank the toilet;
Hates Children - ??? unknown
Hot-Headed - ??? unknown
Jealous - ??? unknown
Mean - now constantly hit stuffed animals, that's all??? Unknown;
Neat - polish to perfection even clean objects, do this very frequently and on community lots too;
Noncommittal - ??? unknown
Perfectionist - ??? unknown
Did I miss something for any of the traits? Still a very long way to go to find out something for other traits... I think I'll do a test run for some of them later today.
Well, bookworms can also autonomously quickly browse through bookcases, inspiring them. Good sims also have a new "help out" interaction, which shares the same animation with cheering up.
This tweet notes that bookworm sims who are walking by may now carry books.
And genius sims may now have eureka moments (someone who shared it here had it after a shower) that will increase one of their skills (it should be on page 1 about Izzy Fabulous).
Additionally, it has been reported that frequency of emotional moodlets from emotional traits have been increased.
From what I know, that's it. But your comment does outline where we should focus next (thank you for that). Neat and goofball traits seem popular here...
I also have a sim with the Goofball and Hot-Headed traits but I haven't noticed any change with her hotheadedness. She wakes up angry but it usually wears off after a few hours, same as before. She's Playful after she shakes off the morning anger.
From what I know, that's it. But your comment does outline where we should focus next (thank you for that). Neat and goofball traits seem popular here...
Thank you so much for pointing out what I've missed! I'll update the list with this info. Of course most obvious traits make much talk since they are not to everybody liking. But I'm really intrigued by others as well. Seen today Carl mentioned that he'll probably try to investigate them for another video. Also seen in other thread here Bienchen mentioned she can't find any significant differences in code to the point she thinks her trait overhaul mod doesn't need updating. Which I find strange. Guess we'll have to wait and see while modders investigate further. So far I've started playing with Gloomy and Hot-Headed/Glutton sims and can't see anything new standing out yet...
Does anyone still play with whims enabled? I've noticed that my sims seem to be getting whims that are more relevant to their traits. My ambitious sim wants to get a promotion, for example.
I cannot play without whims. I use them to direct my sims.
I'm happy to hear that some of the traits are better. It sounds like Goof Ball and Neat got a lot of improvements.
Hopefully they get to some other traits, particularly Evil, Hates Children and Glutton, which I feel need more work.
I'm actually worried about changes to evil. Evil does NOT equal mean. Evil enjoys the misery of others. Evil may work toward causing that misery, yes. But I like to play my evil vampires as mafia family evil. Loving, outwardly respectful and polite, thoroughly reveling in the misery around them. I love the evil laugh they do - it shows their personality without doing some autonomously mean actions. If they start doing petty stuff like go break toilets I'd have to turn that autonomy off. Which I can and will do so I guess it's not that big of a deal.
I'm curious other people's thoughts about evil sims. Do most imagine them going round being outwardly mean? If so, what do you imagine the difference between evil and mean is?
I have an evil club and a mean club at war with each other. The autonomy before this patch was pathetic; they hardly upset each other. I'm hoping this improvement will make a difference but I'm not going to find out until I rotate.
Comments
[/quote]
Yes, sometimes it's boring to get everything handed to you on a plate. I like surprises 🙂[/quote]
I get what you're saying, but patch notes exist for the reason, so we know the changes made to our game. It's also very important for modders and content creators to know, not just players.[/quote]
Agreed also say it fun to look for the changes makes me feel iffy. Bc the fun of the trait improvements should be playing with them not finding them
My sims are more than their traits, after all.
This is very nice. Some thing unique to a certain trait, yet not autonomous so those whose story would be disrupted by a shorter negative state can simply not use it.
I also always viewed "neat" Sims as meaning "neat freak" which is why I always avoided using it. So that's much more in line with what I imagined. Although I can see where it might get a little annoying.
I just hope the mischievous interactions stay in regards to the goofball trait, and that the only changes made are to toilets being broken less often. Either that, or add a new trait and/or rename this one.
It's not about getting annoyed by a negative state, storyplayers want fail states as much as you.
Our (my) problem with autonomy is it breaking character by either pushing the sims to do something they wouldn't according to our image of them (in canon Sims 4 sims are pretty stereotypical) or something extremely nonsensical that a person irl would not do (granny throwing herself down between my two toddlers to do push ups). It's less "oh, something bad happened, my utopia is tarnished" and more "something incredibly unbelievable happened and jolted me out of my interactive novel".
If you don't want sims to do things not approved by you then there is an option called free will off.
A story is not fun, nor is it interesting if everything always goes the way you want it.
Sea may rise, sky may fall, My love will never die..
My heart, my heart, My drowning heart, Oh all the tears I've cried
Oh I may weep forevermore, My love will never die..
I was reading the thread and thinking this exactly. Those who want to keep their sims on line with what they imagine, can do that with free will. But we finally have sims acting according to their traits.
I have played today for 5 hours and i had more fun then ever... my neat sim kept the house clean, but he also talked to others, took care of his motives and did homework autonomously. Yeah he cleaned a lot but that's why he's neat. Not average, neat, as one of his only 3 character traits...
I'm loving this. I hope devs do that with all the other traits. Sim seem to have more personality now
Yes, that is WHY he is neat!
Sea may rise, sky may fall, My love will never die..
My heart, my heart, My drowning heart, Oh all the tears I've cried
Oh I may weep forevermore, My love will never die..
I think that if people play with a mix of autonomy and directing their sims to different actions, there might end up being a nice balance
Even so, there is no way to please everyone. So now Neat trait means something.
Nobody is forcing you to use that trait.
But then again.. maybe it is better to go back at the point when traits meant NOTHING?
Sea may rise, sky may fall, My love will never die..
My heart, my heart, My drowning heart, Oh all the tears I've cried
Oh I may weep forevermore, My love will never die..
Hopefully they get to some other traits, particularly Evil, Hates Children and Glutton, which I feel need more work.
Also, please share your own observations about sims who have multiple traits that got improvements. I'm curious to see if they balance each other out, or if one seems to dominate the others.
I don't mind that the traits have been adjusted, but the tuning seems extreme compared to others that were adjusted. I'm not seeing a major difference with my mean sims, they're more or less the same as they were prior to the pach. I don't currently have any Cheerful sims, so I haven't seen that one in action yet. I am playing a household of 8 YAs and they have a variety of traits that were adjusted in the patch. I haven't seen anything different with the non-committal sim either.
Did I miss something for any of the traits? Still a very long way to go to find out something for other traits... I think I'll do a test run for some of them later today.
P.S. Updated with info pointed out by @EgonVM. Thank you!
I'm actually worried about changes to evil. Evil does NOT equal mean. Evil enjoys the misery of others. Evil may work toward causing that misery, yes. But I like to play my evil vampires as mafia family evil. Loving, outwardly respectful and polite, thoroughly reveling in the misery around them. I love the evil laugh they do - it shows their personality without doing some autonomously mean actions. If they start doing petty stuff like go break toilets I'd have to turn that autonomy off. Which I can and will do so I guess it's not that big of a deal.
I'm curious other people's thoughts about evil sims. Do most imagine them going round being outwardly mean? If so, what do you imagine the difference between evil and mean is?
Well, bookworms can also autonomously quickly browse through bookcases, inspiring them. Good sims also have a new "help out" interaction, which shares the same animation with cheering up.
This tweet notes that bookworm sims who are walking by may now carry books.
And genius sims may now have eureka moments (someone who shared it here had it after a shower) that will increase one of their skills (it should be on page 1 about Izzy Fabulous).
Additionally, it has been reported that frequency of emotional moodlets from emotional traits have been increased.
From what I know, that's it. But your comment does outline where we should focus next (thank you for that). Neat and goofball traits seem popular here...
Thank you so much for pointing out what I've missed! I'll update the list with this info. Of course most obvious traits make much talk since they are not to everybody liking. But I'm really intrigued by others as well. Seen today Carl mentioned that he'll probably try to investigate them for another video. Also seen in other thread here Bienchen mentioned she can't find any significant differences in code to the point she thinks her trait overhaul mod doesn't need updating. Which I find strange. Guess we'll have to wait and see while modders investigate further. So far I've started playing with Gloomy and Hot-Headed/Glutton sims and can't see anything new standing out yet...
I cannot play without whims. I use them to direct my sims.
I have an evil club and a mean club at war with each other. The autonomy before this patch was pathetic; they hardly upset each other. I'm hoping this improvement will make a difference but I'm not going to find out until I rotate.