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Calling anyone who has respect for history

«1
RosysimmerRosysimmer Posts: 661 Member
edited March 29 in Off Topic Chat
kemmy-folly-wales-exterior.jpg


Somebody defaced a 300 year old Irish castle and it makes me ashamed that some people just has no respect for history.


[edited all-caps - EA_Leeloo]
Post edited by EA_Leeloo on
2020-09-20-2.jpg

Wilsonnnnnnn

Comments

  • icmnfrshicmnfrsh Posts: 18,512 Member
    Oh. Sheesh, that is tacky :grimace:
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  • WildIrishBansheeWildIrishBanshee Posts: 1,332 Member
  • RosysimmerRosysimmer Posts: 661 Member
    icmnfrsh wrote: »
    Oh. Sheesh, that is tacky :grimace:

    @icmnfrsh RIGHT?! Like honestly I'm building it in the sims and omg the person that did this is insane
    2020-09-20-2.jpg

    Wilsonnnnnnn
  • RosysimmerRosysimmer Posts: 661 Member
    Why would someone do that? :-o

    I don't know but it's awful. I'm not even Irish and it makes me upset lol.
    2020-09-20-2.jpg

    Wilsonnnnnnn
  • WildIrishBansheeWildIrishBanshee Posts: 1,332 Member
    Rosysimmer wrote: »
    Why would someone do that? :-o

    I don't know but it's awful. I'm not even Irish and it makes me upset lol.

    I am Irish, though American by a couple of generations. My great grandparents were from Galloway.
  • RosysimmerRosysimmer Posts: 661 Member
    Rosysimmer wrote: »
    Why would someone do that? :-o

    I don't know but it's awful. I'm not even Irish and it makes me upset lol.

    I am Irish, though American by a couple of generations. My great grandparents were from Galloway.
    oh thats cool. My stepdad's Irish.
    2020-09-20-2.jpg

    Wilsonnnnnnn
  • orenjiAiorenjiAi Posts: 447 Member
    Hi! This is coming from the perspective of an architect. :)

    In designing buildings, we have something that we call architectural integrity. That is, a respect for the authentic (whether concept, materials used, or architectural style).

    The 300-year-old Irish castle is beautiful, characterful, and rich in history. But the needs of the home—well, castle-owners have changed over that period and sometimes an expansion is needed. There are two approaches one can undertake when you add-on to these period architecture. You can match it with the original or you can contrast it. (It is apparent that they've taken the latter).

    The thing is you can never replicate the original castle. No matter how traditional the building techniques employed, no matter where you source its materials, and no matter how skilled the craftsmen are; if you make a replica of something you are creating fake architecture. And it is something most of us are against. If they matched the extension with the original castle, it might have appeared cohesive, but that IMO would have been more disrespectful to the heritage of the original structure. Also, I'd much rather they add their own architecture that's of-the-time so they add on to the structure's history. Granted that extension is horrendous lol and I believe it might *not* have been designed by an architect and could have been executed better.
  • RosysimmerRosysimmer Posts: 661 Member
    orenjiAi wrote: »
    Hi! This is coming from the perspective of an architect. :)

    In designing buildings, we have something that we call architectural integrity. That is, a respect for the authentic (whether concept, materials used, or architectural style).

    The 300-year-old Irish castle is beautiful, characterful, and rich in history. But the needs of the home—well, castle-owners have changed over that period and sometimes an expansion is needed. There are two approaches one can undertake when you add-on to these period architecture. You can match it with the original or you can contrast it. (It is apparent that they've taken the latter).

    The thing is you can never replicate the original castle. No matter how traditional the building techniques employed, no matter where you source its materials, and no matter how skilled the craftsmen are; if you make a replica of something you are creating fake architecture. And it is something most of us are against. If they matched the extension with the original castle, it might have appeared cohesive, but that IMO would have been more disrespectful to the heritage of the original structure. Also, I'd much rather they add their own architecture that's of-the-time so they add on to the structure's history. Granted that extension is horrendous lol and I believe it might *not* have been designed by an architect and could have been executed better.

    oh hey that actual makes sense lol but yeah thanks that makes sense.
    2020-09-20-2.jpg

    Wilsonnnnnnn
  • WildIrishBansheeWildIrishBanshee Posts: 1,332 Member
    edited March 21
    orenjiAi wrote: »
    Hi! This is coming from the perspective of an architect. :)

    In designing buildings, we have something that we call architectural integrity. That is, a respect for the authentic (whether concept, materials used, or architectural style).

    The 300-year-old Irish castle is beautiful, characterful, and rich in history. But the needs of the home—well, castle-owners have changed over that period and sometimes an expansion is needed. There are two approaches one can undertake when you add-on to these period architecture. You can match it with the original or you can contrast it. (It is apparent that they've taken the latter).

    The thing is you can never replicate the original castle. No matter how traditional the building techniques employed, no matter where you source its materials, and no matter how skilled the craftsmen are; if you make a replica of something you are creating fake architecture. And it is something most of us are against. If they matched the extension with the original castle, it might have appeared cohesive, but that IMO would have been more disrespectful to the heritage of the original structure. Also, I'd much rather they add their own architecture that's of-the-time so they add on to the structure's history. Granted that extension is horrendous lol and I believe it might *not* have been designed by an architect and could have been executed better.

    I've seen it done quite well. This is not that lol. I'm not even sure this is an extension - it almost looks as if they tore down half of the original structure to do the modern stuff. Otherwise, they did an excellent job expanding the base. Above the modern stuff, it even looks like they had to add new brick...

    The rear stuff is obviously the extension. The front stuff looks like they ruined history to make it semi-match, as an afterthought. But I'm an artist, not an architect.
  • orenjiAiorenjiAi Posts: 447 Member
    I've seen it done quite well. This is not that lol. I'm not even sure this is an extension - it almost looks as if they tore down half of the original structure to do the modern stuff. Otherwise, they did an excellent job expanding the base. Above the modern stuff, it even looks like they had to add new brick...

    The rear stuff is obviously the extension. The front stuff looks like they ruined history to make it semi-match, as an afterthought. But I'm an artist, not an architect.

    The semi-matching bricks might have been due to maintenance works—which is a different story altogether! For those, you have to match or at least try.

    I think the thing at the left is the extension. If you look closely, it's only a living room and a bathroom for a room on the main floor. I guess if I tear it apart, all the basics are there. The expansion attached to the castle mirrors the stepped and blocky shape of the original. Its transparency contrasts with the castle's thick solid walls. And its blandness highlights the texture of the brick. I'm not sure if I would have chosen that color though. Or have the thing at the right with the clerestory roof. Or have that porch.

    This might be fun to build in-game! But I'm two weeks behind releasing a chapter.
  • SERVERFRASERVERFRA Posts: 3,440 Member
    The building reminds me of the old Scottish Castle/Modern High Rise in Disney's Gargoyles.
  • NushnushganayNushnushganay Posts: 8,087 Member
    edited March 21
    My hubs has a name for that: remuddling.

    He had an Irish grandmother but that isn't why he'd hate that. He also adores Frank Lloyd Wright (I don't, and we tease each other about it a lot) but he'd shudder to see that awful juxtaposition. Like, if the homeowners have the budget for that, why not just build or buy their own, in the style of the addition, instead of doing it to a home they obviously don't like the style of?

    Oh, it's just a shame, isn't it?
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    rPdrmh3m.jpg

  • Pamtastic72Pamtastic72 Posts: 3,526 Member
    edited March 21
    How seeing this made me feel

    cqqjq04.gif
  • WildIrishBansheeWildIrishBanshee Posts: 1,332 Member
    orenjiAi wrote: »
    I've seen it done quite well. This is not that lol. I'm not even sure this is an extension - it almost looks as if they tore down half of the original structure to do the modern stuff. Otherwise, they did an excellent job expanding the base. Above the modern stuff, it even looks like they had to add new brick...

    The rear stuff is obviously the extension. The front stuff looks like they ruined history to make it semi-match, as an afterthought. But I'm an artist, not an architect.

    The semi-matching bricks might have been due to maintenance works—which is a different story altogether! For those, you have to match or at least try.

    I think the thing at the left is the extension. If you look closely, it's only a living room and a bathroom for a room on the main floor. I guess if I tear it apart, all the basics are there. The expansion attached to the castle mirrors the stepped and blocky shape of the original. Its transparency contrasts with the castle's thick solid walls. And its blandness highlights the texture of the brick. I'm not sure if I would have chosen that color though. Or have the thing at the right with the clerestory roof. Or have that porch.

    This might be fun to build in-game! But I'm two weeks behind releasing a chapter.

    Thanks for the clarification! It just looks odd to me. :)
  • Charla97Charla97 Posts: 66 Member
    That's so sad. Obviously that person has a few screws loose.
  • WhatCobblersWhatCobblers Posts: 1,142 Member
    edited March 21
    If the modern bit was a visitor centre aside a tourist attraction then I'd understand, but to build your house like that?
    If someone has enough money to buy a castle in the first place, surely they can afford to make any extensions look a bit like the original?

    Thinking about it some more, why would you need to extend a castle?
    cZkInMO.png
  • WildIrishBansheeWildIrishBanshee Posts: 1,332 Member
    edited March 21
    If the modern bit was a visitor centre aside a tourist attraction then I'd understand, but to build your house like that?
    If someone has enough money to buy a castle in the first place, surely they can afford to make any extensions look a bit like the original?

    Thinking about it some more, why would you need to extend a castle?

    Well, Irish castles aren't known for being particularly large for one - and families grow and needs change. However, this still makes me want to cry. @orenjiAi has much more experience with this. I'm just a lover of history who hates to see any part of it change - those who do not learn from and understand history... ;)
  • RosysimmerRosysimmer Posts: 661 Member
    If the modern bit was a visitor centre aside a tourist attraction then I'd understand, but to build your house like that?
    If someone has enough money to buy a castle in the first place, surely they can afford to make any extensions look a bit like the original?

    Thinking about it some more, why would you need to extend a castle?

    Well, Irish castles aren't known for being particularly large for one - and families grow and needs change. However, this still makes me want to cry. @orenjiAi has much more experience with this. I'm just a lover of history who hates to see any part of it change - those who do not learn from and understand history... ;)

    I'm making this my signature lol jk but yes i agree wholeheartedly. This caslte is quite literally hundreds of years old, and so seeing what these people have done is shocking.

    I also found this video of i guess the layout of the addon here
    2020-09-20-2.jpg

    Wilsonnnnnnn
  • orenjiAiorenjiAi Posts: 447 Member
    Oh hey @WildIrishBanshee! I haven’t worked with actual castles per se. Just another architect on the internet with his own opinions. But I do have an interest in historical preservation. :)

    @WhatCobblers Hmmm. It would be better if OP could share the article where they got this picture from. Then we could understand why the owners went with that decision. But WildIrishBanshee made a good point of families outgrowing their old homes. This castle is still just somebody’s house after all. And despite how massive they look, castles aren’t really that roomy inside—it’s mostly thick walls. Also they weren’t exactly designed with plumbing in mind. Maybe homies wanted more space or bathrooms but didn’t want to move out? We really don’t know for sure. I’m just putting out the most common reasons for wanting to renovate older homes.
  • RosysimmerRosysimmer Posts: 661 Member
    edited March 21
    orenjiAi wrote: »
    Oh hey @WildIrishBanshee! I haven’t worked with actual castles per se. Just another architect on the internet with his own opinions. But I do have an interest in historical preservation. :)

    @WhatCobblers Hmmm. It would be better if OP could share the article where they got this picture from. Then we could understand why the owners went with that decision. But WildIrishBanshee made a good point of families outgrowing their old homes. This castle is still just somebody’s house after all. And despite how massive they look, castles aren’t really that roomy inside—it’s mostly thick walls. Also they weren’t exactly designed with plumbing in mind. Maybe homies wanted more space or bathrooms but didn’t want to move out? We really don’t know for sure. I’m just putting out the most common reasons for wanting to renovate older homes.

    @WhatCobblers @orenjiAi Here you Go!
    2020-09-20-2.jpg

    Wilsonnnnnnn
  • orenjiAiorenjiAi Posts: 447 Member
    Yuck! Thanks @Rosysimmer! NOW I hate it!

    And can now understand where you were coming from when you said “no respect for history”!
  • RosysimmerRosysimmer Posts: 661 Member
    orenjiAi wrote: »
    Yuck! Thanks @Rosysimmer! NOW I hate it!

    And can now understand where you were coming from when you said “no respect for history”!

    lol RIGHT?!
    2020-09-20-2.jpg

    Wilsonnnnnnn
  • WildIrishBansheeWildIrishBanshee Posts: 1,332 Member
    Seriously, I just can't. There is nothing historic left in that house besides maybe the exterior! My heart is broken.
  • RosysimmerRosysimmer Posts: 661 Member
    Seriously, I just can't. There is nothing historic left in that house besides maybe the exterior! My heart is broken.

    Same girl same
    2020-09-20-2.jpg

    Wilsonnnnnnn
  • orenjiAiorenjiAi Posts: 447 Member
    To preserve my dignity as an architect and an aspiring community planner and historical preservationist, I wanted to clarify:

    Architecture is IMO one of the best records of history. These buildings are more than just a roof to put over our heads. They are expressions of how we lived, our radical thoughts, and the values we upheld in our times. And unlike other creative media, we live in them so they continue to evolve and change and grow with us. Given that they are semi-permanent, these records also persist long after we are gone.

    In consideration of the role of architecture and its integrity in recording history, I believe that it is better to add something more reminiscent of any generation’s style than to mimic or replicate an older one’s. New architecture should not be perceived as defacing adjacent older buildings just because they do not match. Rather, it should be a remembrance that we live in a historical period completely and vastly different from the previous and the next one. We are also part of an ever-changing history. Our architecture then, no matter how mundane (a cozy bungalow, a glass box house, a 19th-century warehouse reused as a 10 door flat, or that 7-Eleven down the street), is equally as important to preserve as theirs. It is a record that we existed. And might also be considered as historical architecture in the next century.

    My previous comments are made under the assumption that there was a family that lived in an original castle. Then they outgrew it. It happens. We need more space. Technologies evolve. Our needs change. And so, an extension is necessary. We see traces of these changes everywhere. But we take them for granted, because changing your bedroom with a new lick of paint isn’t as dramatic as say, adding an extension to a castle.

    And now, back to this castle. it has lived its life as an 18th-century hunting lodge and now it is resurrected as an AirBNB lol. It is still not to my preference and I still believe that it could have been executed better. But as I have said above, architecture is both a record and art. Not everyone will appreciate every chapter of a story or how an art piece is executed. But that is alright. Art is subjective. I myself will never fully understand the machinations of this architect’s mind. But I will give them credit (I can see now with the interiors) for at least preserving some of the integrity of the old castle while meeting the demands of the client. The windows, the stoneworks, and the ceiling mouldings are all still there. It’s a shame about the walls and the floors but I guess the client preferred function over form.

    @Rosysimmer I mistook the extension interiors as the old castle’s new ones. Sorry. :#
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