October 16 - Everyone ready for the Friday Highlight? It's ready for you here.

So is this officially the worst year for sims 4 ?

Comments

  • BeardedgeekBeardedgeek Posts: 4,179 Member
    Simburian wrote: »
    Sk8rblaze wrote: »
    It seems like this is the first year out of The Sims 4's lifespan where Maxis has implemented nothing but new, original ideas to the series. This comes at no surprise, given a guru has told us to expect that prior to this year. Is it a coincidence some are calling it TS4's worst year yet?

    With that said, I personally feel these original concepts are pretty... unexciting, to put it kindly. Knitting, stuff for tiny homes (which was obviously meant to supplement the expansion), and eco-living, one of the most buggy and, well... blah ideas for a pack that has also clearly not been gameplay play-tested enough, otherwise people wouldn't have NPC Sims rampantly stealing from their lots and such. How could that have passed Q&A? Is there still Q&A at all for the series?

    I swear, nothing has made me appreciate The Sims 3 more than seeing how low The Sims 4 has taken the series. World Adventures, Ambitions, Generations, horses in Pets, Supernatural, Island Paradise, Into The Future -- look at how many original ideas The Sims 3 introduced that turned out to be such fun additions to the series!! What happened???

    Everybody would LOVE new stuff if we at least was up to have everything included in the Sims 3 base game. We're not there yet.

    But every time they put in something we had before it is 🌺🌺🌺🌺 as recycled. EA/Maxis don't seem to do anything right with this community do they?

    I mostly hear the word "recycled" regard re-skinned objects and re-used animations. Not "Oh look they made an university pack again", which was wished for for years.
    Origin ID: A_Bearded_Geek
  • CynnaCynna Posts: 2,158 Member
    edited September 19
    Simburian wrote: »

    But every time they put in something we had before it is 🌺🌺🌺🌺 as recycled. EA/Maxis don't seem to do anything right with this community do they?

    Not true.

    There is a difference between accepted standards and recycling.

    If the next installment of The Sims shipped without CAS or build/buy mode, would it still be a Sims game? Many of us feel exactly the same about seasons, vacations, pets, transportation, and a myriad of other things. They are integral to our gameplay and are standards that we expect the development team to meet in each installment of a Sims game.

    Recycling is the persistent reuse of assets, animations, and features when new assets, animations, and features would have been demonstrably better. For example, there should have been new animations for reading, watching television, using a tablet or sketchpad, or speaking while on a lounge chair. However, there are none. Instead, the same bolt-upright, awkwardly stiff animations from the base game were reused as a cheap shortcut. That is recycling.

    I mostly hear the word "recycled" regard re-skinned objects and re-used animations. Not "Oh look they made an university pack again", which was wished for for years.

    Exactly.




    I3Ml5Om.jpg
  • TvldivaTvldiva Posts: 70 Member
    Yeah, I agree, I wasted money getting the Star Wars, didn't bother to get the knitting mess. I wish they had more things in the game as the Sims 3 had. I miss how the vacations were in Sims 3 and being able to build hotels and I miss being able to swim anywhere.
  • drake_mccartydrake_mccarty Posts: 5,960 Member
    Simburian wrote: »
    Sk8rblaze wrote: »
    It seems like this is the first year out of The Sims 4's lifespan where Maxis has implemented nothing but new, original ideas to the series. This comes at no surprise, given a guru has told us to expect that prior to this year. Is it a coincidence some are calling it TS4's worst year yet?

    With that said, I personally feel these original concepts are pretty... unexciting, to put it kindly. Knitting, stuff for tiny homes (which was obviously meant to supplement the expansion), and eco-living, one of the most buggy and, well... blah ideas for a pack that has also clearly not been gameplay play-tested enough, otherwise people wouldn't have NPC Sims rampantly stealing from their lots and such. How could that have passed Q&A? Is there still Q&A at all for the series?

    I swear, nothing has made me appreciate The Sims 3 more than seeing how low The Sims 4 has taken the series. World Adventures, Ambitions, Generations, horses in Pets, Supernatural, Island Paradise, Into The Future -- look at how many original ideas The Sims 3 introduced that turned out to be such fun additions to the series!! What happened???

    Everybody would LOVE new stuff if we at least was up to have everything included in the Sims 3 base game. We're not there yet.

    But every time they put in something we had before it is 🌺🌺🌺🌺 as recycled. EA/Maxis don't seem to do anything right with this community do they?

    When they take something “we had before”, as in, we had before *in The Sims 4* then it is recycling. They do this constantly. Blatantly. No one complains when they bring back popular features from older games unless they totally miss the mark on them, which again they routinely do in the event they bring something back. Examples include: apartments, shops, restaurants, pets, scuba, snow, etc, etc, etc. In every single one of those situations some obvious thing was ignored because the devs do not care about making a quality fleshed out product.
  • CynnaCynna Posts: 2,158 Member

    When they take something “we had before”, as in, we had before *in The Sims 4* then it is recycling. They do this constantly. Blatantly. No one complains when they bring back popular features from older games unless they totally miss the mark on them, which again they routinely do in the event they bring something back. Examples include: apartments, shops, restaurants, pets, scuba, snow, etc, etc, etc. In every single one of those situations some obvious thing was ignored because the devs do not care about making a quality fleshed out product.

    Perfectly stated. Kudos!
    I3Ml5Om.jpg
  • Pamtastic72Pamtastic72 Posts: 2,886 Member
    It’s the worst year period, but Journey To Batuu didn’t help.
  • CinebarCinebar Posts: 32,145 Member
    edited September 22
    Simburian wrote: »
    Sk8rblaze wrote: »
    It seems like this is the first year out of The Sims 4's lifespan where Maxis has implemented nothing but new, original ideas to the series. This comes at no surprise, given a guru has told us to expect that prior to this year. Is it a coincidence some are calling it TS4's worst year yet?

    With that said, I personally feel these original concepts are pretty... unexciting, to put it kindly. Knitting, stuff for tiny homes (which was obviously meant to supplement the expansion), and eco-living, one of the most buggy and, well... blah ideas for a pack that has also clearly not been gameplay play-tested enough, otherwise people wouldn't have NPC Sims rampantly stealing from their lots and such. How could that have passed Q&A? Is there still Q&A at all for the series?

    I swear, nothing has made me appreciate The Sims 3 more than seeing how low The Sims 4 has taken the series. World Adventures, Ambitions, Generations, horses in Pets, Supernatural, Island Paradise, Into The Future -- look at how many original ideas The Sims 3 introduced that turned out to be such fun additions to the series!! What happened???

    Everybody would LOVE new stuff if we at least was up to have everything included in the Sims 3 base game. We're not there yet.

    But every time they put in something we had before it is 🌺🌺🌺🌺 as recycled. EA/Maxis don't seem to do anything right with this community do they?

    People expect pets, cars, snow, weather, rain, heat, other life stages that aren't all the same size and or same Sim just named a different age, owning businesses, etc. because that is what people have in real life.

    When I say recycled I mean exactly that within the same iteration. Using an asset's bhavs and sticking them on a reskinned mesh and calling it new gameplay. When, hello, no, I do the same thing and see the same animation as an object or interaction from the last pack or even in the core. I suppose I am the only one bothered by reused animations and assets in some cases, such as when a Sim does something on the Sim pc am really the only one that sees it is the same screen on the Sim pc? That they do the very same animation while using the Sim pc as they do when they are trolling on the Sim pc. Then Maxis takes a career and piecemeals it out piece by piece like how they hacked up a photographer free lance career into a thousand little pieces. Or a fashion career into dozens of little pieces when any stay at home job in TS4 could have been part of any other career of that genre. But they piecemealed them out and people squeal when I'm shaking my head and saying, no, it's part of a bigger job/career but you guys think it's special? And dang, half the time it is the same task/chore and same animation. Reused assets. Recycled animations and gameplay.

    Or let's look at aspirations in TS4 (not that many compared to TS3) when most of them depend on 'workout', 'the Sim pc' 'painting' or 'writing'.

    Over and over, again with the same sort of tasks duties, depending on the only things they can think to add (reused) same animations, same gameplay sold over and over in TS4 as new gameplay.

    These are just a tip of a huge iceberg in TS4.

    I'm not talking about pets to pets to pets, four times, I'm talking about reinstating the very same tasks, collecting, aspiration requirements, same animations, same couch just reskinned with a different fabric, same bhavs on objects, used to do the very same thing already in base game.
    "Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.

    https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/958714/cinebar-custom-content-clothes-updating-links/p1


  • BrittanyChick22BrittanyChick22 Posts: 2,059 Member
    edited September 23
    Its been having the worst "year" for the past 6 years if you ask me. But content wise, yes it's been real drag. Getting packs you didnt ask for, lazy 20th anniversary gift, Didnt bother to mention the birthday of sims 4 wasnt it? One guru did but that's cause some mentioned they forgot but the actual sims twitter page didnt. It's been bad even before the shutdown. I just think the passion is gone for the sims sadly, they've lost it
    qHqq7Xx.png


  • ChadSims2ChadSims2 Posts: 3,876 Member
    Cinebar wrote: »
    Simburian wrote: »
    Sk8rblaze wrote: »
    It seems like this is the first year out of The Sims 4's lifespan where Maxis has implemented nothing but new, original ideas to the series. This comes at no surprise, given a guru has told us to expect that prior to this year. Is it a coincidence some are calling it TS4's worst year yet?

    With that said, I personally feel these original concepts are pretty... unexciting, to put it kindly. Knitting, stuff for tiny homes (which was obviously meant to supplement the expansion), and eco-living, one of the most buggy and, well... blah ideas for a pack that has also clearly not been gameplay play-tested enough, otherwise people wouldn't have NPC Sims rampantly stealing from their lots and such. How could that have passed Q&A? Is there still Q&A at all for the series?

    I swear, nothing has made me appreciate The Sims 3 more than seeing how low The Sims 4 has taken the series. World Adventures, Ambitions, Generations, horses in Pets, Supernatural, Island Paradise, Into The Future -- look at how many original ideas The Sims 3 introduced that turned out to be such fun additions to the series!! What happened???

    Everybody would LOVE new stuff if we at least was up to have everything included in the Sims 3 base game. We're not there yet.

    But every time they put in something we had before it is 🌺🌺🌺🌺 as recycled. EA/Maxis don't seem to do anything right with this community do they?

    When I say recycled I mean exactly that within the same iteration. Using an asset's bhavs and sticking them on a reskinned mesh and calling it new gameplay. When, hello, no, I do the same thing and see the same animation as an object or interaction from the last pack or even in the core. I suppose I am the only one bothered by reused animations and assets in some cases, such as when a Sim does something on the Sim pc am really the only one that sees it is the same screen on the Sim pc? That they do the very same animation while using the Sim pc as they do when they are trolling on the Sim pc. Then Maxis takes a career and piecemeals it out piece by piece like how they hacked up a photographer free lance career into a thousand little pieces. Or a fashion career into dozens of little pieces when any stay at home job in TS4 could have been part of any other career of that genre. But they piecemealed them out and people squeal when I'm shaking my head and saying, no, it's part of a bigger job/career but you guys think it's special? And dang, half the time it is the same task/chore and same animation. Reused assets. Recycled animations and gameplay.

    I know right they should as least have a grin or laughing at their trolling abilities everything looks exactly the same no matter what they are doing on the pc where's my Sims with a headset chatting with his friends while pc gaming.
    Sims 4 went from "You Rule" to "One of the stories we want you to tell"
  • CAPTAIN_NXR7CAPTAIN_NXR7 Posts: 1,848 Member
    ‘Is this officially the worst year for the sims 4?’

    I wouldn’t say so.
    When talking ‘officially‘ we need to look at this year’s sales. We don’t know what those sales are. The year isn’t over yet.

    I’d say a better word is ‘emotionally’.

    For a lot of folks this is overall a pretty bad year...considering the circumstances...

    When it comes to The Sims...many simmers are fed up,tired,angry and sad about TS4’s lack of good content this year and in general.
    Ironically it makes them as emotional as those poor sims in game. I get why.

    I hope those simmers will see their sims wishes fulfilled at some stage in the nearby future.
    Luckily there are 3 very good previous sims titles for you to re-explore until better content is released, or a new life simulator is announced.

    If not, just be as innovative as you want the sims team to be and find a new hobby.
  • SimburianSimburian Posts: 5,573 Member
    They are getting a bit careless, especially in such things as the Spark'd challenges where they told you to vote but didn't weed out those that were ineligible for the last one which was supposed to be about elders and not the younger generation which predominated there in the Stylist section.

    They seem to be getting a bit house isolation crazy and need a stronger (if not a bullying) hand to keep their minds on their jobs - and particularly coding! That can't be easy if you have to share lodgings or have children rushing around the place.
  • comicsforlifecomicsforlife Posts: 7,328 Member
    I don't think its been the worst year and the year isn't over yet
    we did get a few things on our wish list I will be going over it in my top 3 things you want in sims 4 next year thread starting this November
    I will be going over last years list and listing the things we did get as well as asking :) what people want for next year
    the sims 4 isn't getting new whims right now and I think they have dropped them all together if we want new whims in sims 4 we need to tweet the gurus and tell them we like whims
  • BreeNillaBreeNilla Posts: 73 Member
    After Tiny Living, everything went downhill. It was a surprise pack dropped early in the year and it set the tone for good things to come.

    ...and then for the 20th anniversary in February we got a hot tub (which many had already paid $10 for) and like 2 recycled songs.
    Then everyone got their hopes up for a farm pack and it ended up being an Eco pack (which felt connected to Tiny Living, the Island Conservation career, and the off-the-grid stuff, so people were a little tired of the eco theme. Also it introduced bugs that made the game unplayable for many.)
    Then Spark'd (which was fine, but not exactly content for the game)
    Then Skintone outrage (because 3-6 years is a ridiculous amount of time to ignore that situation)
    Then Nifty Knitting (which started as an arts & crafts pack but got whittled down to knitting because people wanted some kind of elder gameplay)
    Then the 6th anniversary (which was completely ignored)
    Then Journey to Batuu (which at the very least should've been it's own spinoff)
    And then the Open Letter (which confirmed none of the bigger requests coming for this year)

    So, uh, yeah.
    8a597ff0f1eef1830795b3ae467ad12c6bb980ae.jpg
    I made a Sims 4 Save File set 15 years into the future using the premade sims by giving them family trees, storylines and lore, fixed and added relationships, and more!
    Check it out here! -> kookablarn.tumblr.com
  • Dragon_KweenDragon_Kween Posts: 42 Member
    I was really disappointed with the pack haul this year, while I haven't played or been around for any of the older sims games, even I can feel the lackluster sorta aura what packs I have give off.

    After getting eco living on sale, I haven't bought any new packs, hecc, I don't even have all the packs to begin with. Eco Living really suited elements of some of my gameplay, but the NAP can be really frustrating from what I've seen and what others have experienced. I expected more then what I got, and some elements of what I got... We don't discuss that.

    Journey to Batuu really pushed my buttons, they could've at least added more to Alien lifestates and they had that opportunity to do so, instead we just have... Outfits...

    It's all one big mess, and I'm not spending money I can use for my bills anymore unless they pick their motivation pens for the community back up. CC is my now my go-to.

    Sorry if this is a mess like the packs, but the general gist is I'm a disappointed parent.
    Cool story, needs more dragons - Cries in baguette


  • BeardedgeekBeardedgeek Posts: 4,179 Member
    edited October 1
    I LOVED Tiny Living. It was a surprise pack yes, but it was right up my alley. I basically only build small houses anyway, they are so much more fun to play.

    (I am still not sure what people mean with "elder gameplay". I don't know any "elder" people IRL that does anything different than me. I am 48, my parents are 75, and they do what I do. The "elder" gameplay people talk about sounds like things my grandparents did, or even a generation before that.)
    Origin ID: A_Bearded_Geek
  • HarukotyanHarukotyan Posts: 118 Member
    So far stuff packs are the most positive thing happening this year. Hope the next leaked one will continue this tradition. Eco Lifestyle isn't bad at all, it has lots of cool ideas and mechanics but BUGS from it are unbearable. SW to me is a disaster but I simply ignore it. So overall putting emotions aside this year definitely not too good, but not a complete disaster.
    But then again... emotions - PR, promotion, communication this year is horrible. They hint basegame improvements with their survey last year and then never gave any feedback on it. They promised "the best year" and failed to stand to this standard. So with all wishes and hopes and hype and speculations this was destined to go downhill. It's not the content itself that's horrible this year it's the state of franchise perception overall as a result of sales politics based on constant hype.
  • OldeseadoggeOldeseadogge Posts: 2,892 Member
    I LOVED Tiny Living. It was a surprise pack yes, but it was right up my alley. I basically only build small houses anyway, they are so much more fun to play.

    (I am still not sure what people mean with "elder gameplay". I don't know any "elder" people IRL that does anything different than me. I am 48, my parents are 75, and they do what I do. The "elder" gameplay people talk about sounds like things my grandparents did, or even a generation before that.)

    I am an elder, and do what I did decades ago other than restrictions imposed by reduced physical capability. One almost gets the impression we are simply mobile vegetables from what some posters are saying.
  • SchmoloopSchmoloop Posts: 74 Member
    I was indifferent towards all the packs besides the Star Wars pack - I’m not a fan of that pack for many reasons, the thing is not everyone will like a pack, but you definitely did something wrong when a majority of people don’t like it. To make the most amount of money, you should listen to what a majority of people are saying. I’m trying to figure out what EA’s game plan is here and why they won’t listen to their fan base. Bad packs shouldn’t be too much of a problem if the base game wasn’t lacking so much. The Sims community has been saying what they want for years now and the things they wanted back then are still the things they want now. Between 6 years ago and now, the Sims 4’s base game hasn’t really changed, for the most part they’ve only been adding packs (which wouldn’t be a problem if the base game was good).
    。゚゚・。・゚゚。
    ゚。.~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~..~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'♥'~•.,,.•~'
     ゚・。・
  • CinebarCinebar Posts: 32,145 Member
    edited October 5
    I LOVED Tiny Living. It was a surprise pack yes, but it was right up my alley. I basically only build small houses anyway, they are so much more fun to play.

    (I am still not sure what people mean with "elder gameplay". I don't know any "elder" people IRL that does anything different than me. I am 48, my parents are 75, and they do what I do. The "elder" gameplay people talk about sounds like things my grandparents did, or even a generation before that.)

    Elders in my town play bingo. It's every Tues, and Thurs. :p they win big bucks, they stand in lines at the stores to get those pull tabs, and scratch off tickets. But the big outing for the week is always bingo. It's a social event. They care who shows up and who doesn't. Some because they care about others and if they are doing ok, others because they are glad so and so didn't show up this week because somehow that person always wins a jackpot. It may be stereotyping elders but it is a thing for some. Just visit Nevada and see how many elders are at those machines. They need that cash.

    Elders in my town book Caribbean tours, they all go together on a ship around the islands. Some visit other lands for religous reasons, they travel in groups. They have a senior citizens' building where they host dances, pot luck dinners, and other services and activities. The lack of elder play is obvivous in TS4 if we are going to call it a life simulator.
    They host bazzars and craft shows, they mentor to younger adults and children. They organize politcal movements and or charitites, they do a lot for the community work younger people don't have time to do. They also run a historical society preserving history for younger generations. They also decide which buildings and areas should be deemed historical to prevent any parking lot from replacing it and or ugly highrise. There are a lot of group activites that elders do together that TS4 hasn't even scratched the surface.
    "Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.

    https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/958714/cinebar-custom-content-clothes-updating-links/p1


  • Bluebeard45Bluebeard45 Posts: 3,657 Member
    Cheer up. Your getting new Skin Tones. So what if the game has bugs and you need mods to play. Your Sims will now look pretty in a broken game.
  • SimburianSimburian Posts: 5,573 Member
    edited October 5
    I LOVED Tiny Living. It was a surprise pack yes, but it was right up my alley. I basically only build small houses anyway, they are so much more fun to play.

    (I am still not sure what people mean with "elder gameplay". I don't know any "elder" people IRL that does anything different than me. I am 48, my parents are 75, and they do what I do. The "elder" gameplay people talk about sounds like things my grandparents did, or even a generation before that.)

    I like Tiny Living too. I found that some of my houses counted as Tiny when I checked them, so that was welcome.

    I'm glad someone else thinks that about elders. I'm now 78 and if not made to self-isolate I would be out enjoying life, travelling and eating out. I'd leave things like violent sports or skiing, to the young though some still do it and marathons! It's only lack of pots of money that holds me back. I was saving to go on a cruise and now they are breaking up the cruise ships for scrap. Sad.

    If they bring in anything else for elders to do it should be walking with two hiking sticks as they do where I live walking around our National Parks, lawn bowls, walking the dogs with their partner, ballroom dancing, gentler exercises, walking canes, more hats .......

    .......and less of the bent backs.

    The elderly are more upright than teenagers these days, bent over their screens and mobile phones. Elders should get a bit shorter though as you do lose height a bit when you age. I've lost an inch.
  • BeardedgeekBeardedgeek Posts: 4,179 Member
    I LOVED Tiny Living. It was a surprise pack yes, but it was right up my alley. I basically only build small houses anyway, they are so much more fun to play.

    (I am still not sure what people mean with "elder gameplay". I don't know any "elder" people IRL that does anything different than me. I am 48, my parents are 75, and they do what I do. The "elder" gameplay people talk about sounds like things my grandparents did, or even a generation before that.)

    I am an elder, and do what I did decades ago other than restrictions imposed by reduced physical capability. One almost gets the impression we are simply mobile vegetables from what some posters are saying.

    Exactly. What exactly are "elder activities" these days?
    Binge Netflix? Nah.
    Knitting? Nah.
    Owning cats? Nah.
    Listening to Spotify? Nah.
    Listening to Vinyl records? Definitely Nah, that's hipsters and younger people than that.

    I still want an explanation from the people demanding "More elder gameplay" about what they actually mean.

    I mean teens? Maybe. Tho most i can think of is not apropiate for Sims anyway, like under age drinking, under age um... stuff, being caught by cops doing something illegal... The two things I can come up with is Skipping School (which you can already do) and Starting a Band.

    But yes, I have absolutely no clue what these Simmers mean when they say Elder Gameplay??
    Origin ID: A_Bearded_Geek
  • xamira99xamira99 Posts: 3,048 Member
    Not for me. Every year is the same. So far, I like the add on.

    The only thing that they need to do is to update on the current gameplay by giving us more in-depth gameplay across the packs & of course the base game, instead of adding more packs.
    And now here is my secret, a very simple secret...
    giphy.gif


    Shhhhhh... I play vanilla



  • CAPTAIN_NXR7CAPTAIN_NXR7 Posts: 1,848 Member
    edited October 6
    But yes, I have absolutely no clue what these Simmers mean when they say Elder Gameplay??

    I’m not quite sure either. My folks are considered elders, but they can dance the jive better than me or anyone else I know of my age (I can’t jive at all though).
    My dear grandmother on the other hand, she’s close to 100 and sure she loves dancing but she can’t, only because she has mobility issues. I’d pick her up and dance with her, but she’s too fragile. It comes with age, but in all fairness it can come with any age and things like that should not be considered elder gameplay.
    Knitting, canes, bingo, they’re only elder stereotypes.
    I love the canes in Sims 3 and always wanted my YA to use one too, but unfortunately canes are limited to elders only.

    I believe the addition of disabilities or elements like slow dancing would be more interesting for all ages, so we as players can make that choice ourselves. Who is it more suitable for in that save? The elder, or the teen?
    If anything, gameplay for kids should be prioritized. Again, they can’t even ride a bike...
  • GordyGordy Posts: 1,309 Member
    edited October 6
    I still want an explanation from the people demanding "More elder gameplay" about what they actually mean.
    Stereotypical elder things, yeah. Obviously, not all old people are homebodies who knit all day - one of my grandmas took spin classes, while my other had dementia and would attack people with her slippers. Anyone at any age (except for babies) can enjoy knitting or partying. But low-key, low-tech and comfy hobbies would be a great way to set them apart from young adults and relax in their golden years.

    I'm not asking for elder-exclusive hobbies, because as I said, most people can do whatever they want regardless of age. But I want comfy elder things for my low-key oldies. I don't care if it's stereotypical, I want them to enjoy those things.

Sign In or Register to comment.
Return to top