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No Super Water?

JanelliellioJanelliellio Posts: 239 Member
edited August 2019 in The Sims 3 Bugs & Issues
I have been playing on a 10-year old laptop for as many years. This year, I very excitedly(!) bought a new laptop. I'm stoked to get the graphics to really shine, but I'm having some trouble. I have all settings on high but my game graphics aren't quite what I remember. (Am I that old, now? hah!) The one thing that's quite obvious to me is the game seems to be lacking Super Water, though I have it enabled.

I have only found a couple of threads addressing the issue, but no follow ups have been posted on some and others are 5-8 years old.

I'm not sure what information is relevant... it's been a while. Any suggestions?

Comments

  • puzzlezaddictpuzzlezaddict Posts: 1,877 Member
    Could you post a couple of screenshots showing the lack of difference between super water and the other settings, or at least the next one down? The difference can be subtle, although it sounds like you know what to look for.

    And have you taken steps to get your graphics card recognized? I know when I finally got around to that a year ago, most of the improvement in graphics quality was barely noticeable, but the water definitely looked better. In case you're curious, I posted some screenshots:

    https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/946069/better-graphics-and-screenshots-for-newer-cards

    Normally, it's not necessary to force card recognition. Still, the process isn't all that complicated, and it might make enough of a difference to be worth it to you. If you'd like help with the .sgr edits, just copy and paste the first 40 lines of the deviceconfig (inside your TS3 game folder in Documents) into a reply, and I'll write out instructions on how to do it.
  • igazorigazor Posts: 19,330 Member
    edited August 2019
    Probably the best place to start would be what are the specs on this new laptop? That would be processor, RAM, graphics card, hard drive space and type. I guarantee you I can go out and purchase several brand new laptops in the less than $500 (US Dollar) ranges that would not be capable of carrying the entire game, meaning all EPs, and handle advanced graphics like Super Water well or even at all. I could also purchase as many fully capable models for more, but they will need some help getting their graphics cards tamed to work with a 2009 designed program like TS3.

    If you do not know how to provide these specs, a dxdiag would give us the complete picture. The link below explains how to run one, the best way to share the results would be to upload the resulting file to a third party file host or post its contents on Pastebin.com and provide a link as they are far too long to copy/paste into message board posts.
    https://help.ea.com/en-us/help/pc/how-to-gather-dxdiag-information

    This is assuming your laptop is running Windows. If it's a Mac, then we need to have a different conversation.

    In the meantime though, we had a discussion here recently about what Super Water should look like in case that helps.
    https://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/961928/what-exactly-is-super-water-when-enabled-in-the-graphics-settings


    Edit: Whoops, got ninja'd there. But I'll let my response stand since the two take slightly different approaches from each other. :)
    Post edited by igazor on
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  • JanelliellioJanelliellio Posts: 239 Member
    Ah, you guys are quick - this is a legendary community. <3 My game looks like the first picture in the link with your comparison shots, puzzlezaddict. This is certainly not a costly computer by any means, but I figured it could get what I need it to get done... done! Hopefully, well!

    I was poking around in the DeviceConfig (trying to follow along with a webpage, and ultimately losing my place lol)

    === Application info ===
    Name: Sims3
    Version:
    Build: Release
    === Rating info ===
    GPU: 5 GPU Memory: 1 CPU: 2 RAM: 4 CPU Speed: 1996 Threading: 3
    Adjusted CPU: 2261 RAM: 7102 Adjusted RAM: 6590 Cores: 4
    === Machine info ===
    OS version: Windows 8 6.2.9200
    OS prod type: 0
    OS major ver: 6
    OS minor ver: 2
    OS SP major ver: 0
    OS SP minor ver: 0
    OS is 64Bit: 1
    CPU: AuthenticAMD
    Brand: AMD Ryzen 3 2300U with Radeon Vega Mobile Gfx
    Family: 15
    Model: 1
    Cores: 4
    HT: 0
    x64: 0
    Memory: 7102MB
    Free memory: 3762MB
    User: User
    Computer: LAPTOP-B2SKGTM7
    === Graphics device info ===
    Number: 0
    Name (driver): AMD Radeon(TM) Vega 6 Graphics
    Name (database): AMD Radeon(TM) Vega 6 Graphics [Found: 0, Matched: 0]
    Vendor: ATI
    Chipset: Vendor: 1002, Device: 15dd, Board: 84e7103c, Chipset: 00cc
    Driver: aticfx32.dll, Version: 26.20.13001.25001, GUID: D7B71EE2-569D-11CF-2512-2E9677C2D735
    Driver version: 25001
    Monitor: \\.\DISPLAY1
    Texture memory: 32MB <<OVERRIDE>>
    Vertex program: 3.0
    Pixel program: 3.0
    Hardware TnL: 1


    Igazor, when I do the DxDiag, should I be copying the whole thing or just a portion?
  • puzzlezaddictpuzzlezaddict Posts: 1,877 Member
    edited August 2019
    When the dxdiag finishes running, you click the "Save all information" button, which saves everything as a .txt file onto your desktop (or wherever you want it). Then you can copy the whole thing and paste it on a site like pastebin.com.

    No, your graphics card isn't recognized, and, perhaps more importantly for the sake of the water's appearance, your card's VRAM (listed as texture memory) isn't recognized either. You can fix both of those, if you want. But while that may help in the short term, the larger issue is that your card isn't capable of maintaining ultra settings, at least not if you have a number of demanding expansion packs in play. Pets and Seasons in particular would strain the integrated card, even on high settings, let alone ultra. So while getting your card recognized and fixing the texture memory issue—which I'm still happy to help with, if you want—may make your water look better, the game may not run well with Super Water enabled. After High-Detail Lots, it's the next most demanding setting by far, and if accompanied by, say, long-haired pets or inclement weather, you might see graphics glitches, delays in rendering, or even crashing as your card overworks itself trying and failing to keep up with the demands TS3 is placing on it.

    Of course, some of this will depend on the packs you've installed, and other factors like the strength of the cooling on your laptop. (The processor isn't great for TS3 either, but the graphics card is probably the limiting factor here.) And if you're willing to experiment, you can play with the settings to see what kind of performance you get. But I don't know if you'll be able to maintain the graphics you want for any length of time, especially if you're hoping for Super Water and other similar effects.
  • JanelliellioJanelliellio Posts: 239 Member
    edited August 2019
    Okay! So I have the DxDiag here:
    https://pastebin.com/mTG4GnbE

    and in the meantime I'll give it another shot and try to get the graphics card recognized (using this article on SimsWIki: https://simswiki.info/wiki.php?title=Game_Help:Getting_new_graphics_cards_recognized_by_the_game ).

    I would like to get the card & VRAM recognized for now and see how it runs. After that, I could always potentially pull back on the graphics settings. Is there a way I may monitor the strain that is being put on my computer?

    When I bought the computer, I was under the impression that it was possible for me to add more RAM in the future. Does this sound like a feasible solution, or at least, improvement?


    Edit: Oh jeez, so in following the directions, I have hit a snag. About halfway down the page, I've reached the section titled, "Open GraphicsCards.sgr file" wherein the reader is instructed to "Analyze the other entries for the model similar to yours, I just used the entry from the previous generation model." No models in that list seem to have a similar format to mine so my cautious self has stopped here and edited nothing. hm..
  • puzzlezaddictpuzzlezaddict Posts: 1,877 Member
    For anyone else reading, these instructions are for this specific card and don't apply to any others. If you want assistance getting your own card recognized, post the first 40 lines of your deviceconfig and ask for help.
    Your graphics card should probably rate as medium, meaning its entry should be in the paragraph of medium-ranked AMD cards. (You can always adjust the settings manually.) . Look for this in the list of ATI cards:

    seti cardLevel $cardLevelHigh
    seti isCardMatched true
    elseif (match("${cardName}", "*x14??*") or match("${cardName}", "*x850*")

    (This forum will mess up the indents, but you'll see how the entries are supposed to look.)

    Change the bolded part to whatever you used when you added your card to graphicscards.sgr. So if the entry in graphicscards looks like this:

    vendor "ATI" 0x1002
    card 0x15DD "AMD Radeon Vega 6 Series"
    card 0x6798 "AMD Radeon HD 7900 Series"
    card 0x6799 "AMD Radeon HD 7900 Series"

    The graphicsrules entry would look like this:

    seti cardLevel $cardLevelHigh
    seti isCardMatched true
    elseif (match("${cardName}", "*Vega 6*") or match("${cardName}", "*x850*")

    Be sure not to change anything else, even the punctuation around the name.

    The other edit you'll need to do is to the texture memory entry, which is 8-10 lines down. Change this:

    if ($textureMemory == 0)
    seti textureMemory 32
    setb textureMemorySizeOK false

    to this:

    if ($textureMemory == 0)
    seti textureMemory 1008
    # setb textureMemorySizeOK false

    So you're changing the 32 to a 1008 (the dedicated memory of your card) and adding a # and a space before "setb."

    You'll know the process worked when your deviceconfig says [Found: 1, Matched: 1], and your texture memory is reported correctly.

    The easiest tool to use to monitor your card is probably GPU-Z. It's quite straightforward, and you can alt-tab to it to check the sensors (especially temperature and GPU load), then go right back to your game without ever quitting or even minimizing. I don't know how well it works on AMD integrated cards though.

    https://www.techpowerup.com/download/techpowerup-gpu-z/

    If you do need help using it, let me know.

    One other thing to note is that your dxdiag lists a few suspicious errors, including a graphics card driver timeout. One alone might have been an anomaly, and these errors can have any number of causes, but it's worth keeping an eye out for glitches or crashes. If you get any, run another dxdiag and link it just like you did this one.
  • JanelliellioJanelliellio Posts: 239 Member
    wow, puzzlezaddict!! These directions are absolutely perfect, concise, and easy to read. I have made all of the changes above. Might you have a recommended website to download GPU-Z for Win10 ? I did a search and I don't recognize any of the results as trustworthy or reliable websites. I'm also curious what you would recommend me paying attention to specifically once the app and program are running?

    Thank you so much for all of your help, btw! I have never posted a question on any forum for it to be answered so directly and helpfully!

  • puzzlezaddictpuzzlezaddict Posts: 1,877 Member
    edited August 2019
    I'm glad to hear the directions worked for you; I always wonder whether I'm writing too much, or not enough.

    The site I linked is the place to download GPU-Z, as it's a TechPowerUp product. (And TechPowerUp is a verified developer for Windows tools.) You'll want the standard version in the upper left corner of the screen, or the ROG-themed version if you like the color scheme.

    Once you open it, click the Sensors heading, and keep an eye on GPU Temperature and GPU load. The other info isn't as interesting, although any category at or close to its max—the red line to the right of the reading gets thicker as the percentage rises—is worth looking into. If you need a screenshot, I can grab one the next time I'm doing something taxing enough to provide interesting data. But really, just keep an eye on those two categories, and you should be fine.

    If GPU-Z does not in fact work with your card, there are other tools you can use instead. But this one is a good place to start.
  • JanelliellioJanelliellio Posts: 239 Member
    edited August 2019
    Thank you again for your very concise answers. I have not heard of TechPowerUp until I searched for GPU-Z! (Edit: how did I miss that link. *facepalm*)

    I will look into GPU temp and GPU load and make sure I'm read up enough to make some informed decisions. You were certainly right, the computer cannot handle the game at Ultra Settings, which I'm quite bummed about. I figured a game this old would be easy to accommodate, but I have learned my lesson.... lol. However, for the price I paid, I'm happy with the outcome. I could afford something 3-4x pricier, but then that'd be more than my car is worth, and really not a backable spend on my end :) The game crashed several times within a few minutes of playing. Ah, well.

    One further question, though - does adding more Ram seem beneficial to someone in my shoes? Or would you, on a personal opinion level, consider this a wasteful investment?
  • JanelliellioJanelliellio Posts: 239 Member
    so I have turned down the graphics a couple times but the game keeps crashing.... any thoughts?
  • puzzlezaddictpuzzlezaddict Posts: 1,877 Member
    edited August 2019
    Yeah, I saw the memory question before and totally forgot to answer that, sorry. It's not likely to help TS3 run better, since the game can only use ~3.5 GB RAM anyway. Where it might help is if you're multitasking to the point that you really do use most or all of the 8 GB you have installed. But if you're getting crashes with nothing else besides TS3 running, then it can't be due to maxing out the memory.

    Still, having 16 GB RAM is great for other reasons. It's certainly a good investment from a quality of life standpoint, as in, when you have a few different apps open, your computer might slow down as it starts to run out of memory. It's hard to say how much of a difference the extra RAM would make to you without knowing how else you use your computer, although again, 8 GB is more than enough for TS3 and Windows.

    The laptop isn't bad by any means, even if it's not really built for gaming. And you're right, it's often hard to justify a gaming laptop even if you can technically afford it. If TS3 were built better, it would run just fine on medium settings on hardware like yours, and you wouldn't have to worry about the game crashing, or at least not any more than any other game.

    For the crashes, please run another dxdiag and link it as you did before. I'd like to see if there are any more obvious errors besides the ones listed the last time around. And do you have any USB devices plugged in while you play? This could include an external storage device or even a mouse. If so, try unplugging it and see if the game crashes again. And please let me know what temperature and GPU load GPU-Z is reporting. You'll need to check while in-game, before any crash, as the numbers will drop quickly once the game is closed.
  • igazorigazor Posts: 19,330 Member
    Did we ever learn which EPs the OP has in play? I'm afraid that even with any other technical issues sorted out, that processor and GPU are not going to handle the heavy-hitting ones well (if at all). Pets and Seasons in particular are probably going to be too much of a struggle for it on most any acceptable graphics settings, as had been already mentioned.
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  • JanelliellioJanelliellio Posts: 239 Member
    Ah, I definitely should have mentioned which EPs I have. I am running all of the heavy ones, Pets, WA, and Seasons, as well as UL, IP, Gen, Ambitions, SN, and LN. I have most, and I know this is strenuous on a machine but I am just so stubborn.

    I have solved the crashing issue (definitely trying to run the graphics too high). *Sigh* what a shame :( I was super looking forward to getting this game running on mad display settings haha! This computer is a FAR CRY from my last one though, so perhaps it's just preventing me from being completely spoiled o:)

    I have run another dxdiag just for the sake of it.
    https://pastebin.com/BhB9HTAy
    GPU-Z reports the GPU load at my current, slightly trimmed settings, is 85 all the way up to 98 and the temp is between 58-68, both of which seem NOT GOOD *worry*
  • puzzlezaddictpuzzlezaddict Posts: 1,877 Member
    The reason I asked about GPU load is that it's a good indicator of what your card is capable of handling. 98% may be slightly high, or maybe more than slightly; I don't know enough about your card to say for sure. A good card can run for hours at 95-96% load with no problems, as long as it's being sufficiently cooled. On that note, 68º is totally fine.

    If you want to see your other hardware temperatures, hwinfo is a useful tool (the free portable version is fine), although it's not always as accurate on AMD hardware and has a lot of info that you probably don't want to deal with. CPU-Z is simpler, and the processor is the other major source of heat, but any CPU will try to throttle itself to keep from overheating.

    https://www.hwinfo.com/download/
    https://www.techpowerup.com/download/cpu-z/

    Now that you have a sense of what your graphics card can handle, as measured by GPU load, you can try to adjust the game to manage its workload. Aside from lowering the settings, it may help to disable wild horses, or rain and snow, or avoid long-haired pets, that sort of thing. Your hardware is absolutely not equipped to run all your packs on high settings, but if you do want to play with all those packs enabled, selectively disabling some features may make it playable for you.

    Still though, you do need to be careful. Your second dxdiag lists two different BlueScreens that weren't there before, both due to a hardware error. This can be caused by overheating, but also more serious issues like a defective component. It's difficult to tell without more monitoring, but the good thing is that BlueScreens are hard to miss, and distinct from a game crash. If you get any more while playing, you might need to consider taking a couple of packs out of play entirely.

    Your dxdiag also lists a couple of DirectX 9 errors. I'm not sure whether these are due to a DX issue, or if the error log is just reporting that the game crashed and DX9 was involved (TS3 uses this version). It's just something to keep an eye on, but if the game doesn't crash anymore, you're fine.
  • JanelliellioJanelliellio Posts: 239 Member
    edited August 2019
    Ah, I spoke too soon. Game does still crash, just not quite as quickly. I do feel those bluescreens were from an incorrect version of software I downloaded (and have since uninstalled) but could that be read as being a hardware issue even though it was a software incompatibility?

    Thank you for the links! I will certainly read up on these! The suggestions for disabling features is also a great idea, I had totally forgotten I could disable wild horses lol

    Perhaps I will look into repairing DirectX9? I just took a peek into that dxdiag and I have version 12, is that causing a potential issue? That would be VERY strange, wouldn't it?
  • puzzlezaddictpuzzlezaddict Posts: 1,877 Member
    The particular BlueScreen listed in the dxdiag references a hardware failure, but it can be caused by software misusing the hardware, for example, a bad driver. So if uninstalling the software has eliminated the BlueScreens, then it's fine.

    It does still sound like your computer is overloaded with what TS3 is asking it to do. The fact that it crashes later, but still crashes, strongly suggests that the issue is the workload—turning down graphics options postpones the overload but doesn't prevent it entirely. So yes, definitely turn off any feature you can live without and see how it goes.

    DirectX 12 is the newest version, and the one that Windows 10 runs. But it can certainly use DX9, or else games like TS3 wouldn't work at all. You can reinstall DX9 easily enough, if you want to see whether it helps:

    https://www.microsoft.com/en-US/download/details.aspx?id=8109
  • JanelliellioJanelliellio Posts: 239 Member
    edited August 2019
    I will give DX9 a shot and see if that bridges any gaps. It is still so very perplexing to me how a game this old, even with so many expansions, could be so difficult for this machine to run. And again, Thank you for hanging in here with me! I work a lot...
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