It’s not unplayable for me (so far, knock on wood), but I’ve seen a couple of frustrating bugs, and I feel sorry for the simmers whose games are becoming unplayable.
Still, I got bugs in Sims 3 and a few really bad ones in Skyrim (really bad bugs—there were times when you couldn’t finish quests or lost stuff because of this bugs!), and I still managed to enjoy the games.
I had to eventually download an unofficial patch mod for Skyrim, the bugs were that bad, lol! My goodness!
Anyway: Let’s hope they continue to fix and patch stuff!
The line that I bolded is part of the issue.
Bugs are hard to fix, I get that, believe me. However, when the mod creators are finding ways to fix them and the company doesn't there's something wrong. It's bad practice to let the community find workarounds and fixes, meanwhile the company appears to be twiddling their thumbs.
This is where transparency comes in. It would do a lot for my perception of EA if, when a mod creator fixes an issue (almost immediately, mind you), someone at EA spoke up and thanked them. That mod creator basically showed EA the way and, whenever possible, EA should follow, test, and refine then release an official patch.
TS3 ended and many of the bugs were never fixed by EA. However, mod creators were able to fix them, years prior, in some cases.
Perhaps my view of the situation is oversimplified. But I'll never know because EA doesn't say anything.
My assumption is that when a modder creates a fix for a bug, they're not necessarily making a fix, but more so a work-around within the coding to make the game run as if the bug doesn't exist, when in reality it does, it just doesn't happen anymore. Another guess of mine is that when the developers create a fix, they create it with solutions and methods in mind to prevent it from happening/breaking again (even tho this still happens), so when a developer creates a fix, a lot more work goes into it than what a modder could/would be able to possibly do. These are just guesses, I have no idea if any of this is true by any means, but it makes sense from my understanding of the topic.
So a modder eliminates a bug and it’s a work around, but Maxis does it and it’s a fix? I don’t think you’re giving enough credit to the modders it’s not as simple as you make it out to be, and yes when a modder stops a bug from happening I would consider that a fix not simply a workaround. Anymore Maxis solutions could be considered work arounds because none of the recent bug fixes have made a different with the bugs.
Here’s a more accurate description: modders fix bugs because they find them annoying and to do the community a service which EA is terrible at, Maxis will fix bugs if enough people consistently report it and they can replicate it, but otherwise it’s not a big deal for them.
Everything I said is just an over simplified assumption, so if it sounds like I made it simple it's because I did, because how accurate could I possibly get with an assumption? On another note, I give modders a lot of credit, I love modders, I'm not someone who typically uses mods but I respect modders a whole lot, especially when they go out of their way to fix or fulfill certain community requests. All I said in my original post was in regards to people comparing the modders and their abilities to fix things, to developers and their ability to fix things, I don't think the process a developer goes through to fix a bug is anywhere similar to how a modder does it and vice versa. Yes, it may be frustrating that the developers themselves often times struggle to deliver bug fixes when the community needs them, but the reason that may be is because of other factors that come into play, and I feel like a lot of people are quick to assume that what the developers are doing is easier than it actually is, and as a result over simplify the entire topic to just a "if someone else can do it then so can they" type situation.
If I tried to explain to you what I might mean by lack of gameplay compared to the older versions, it might take this thread off topic. And I have a list of things I could expand upon comparing TS2/TS3 to TS4. Even TS1 to TS4. I will make it short, you know it when you see it.
ETA: Seems I grabbed the wrong quote..so it was this one: Quote: 'Can someone please explain to me what this lack of gameplay is? What is so lacking or so different in the way gameplay is delivered in Sims 4 compared to the other franchises?' End quote.
But I will mention depth. These Sims don't even know you deleted mommy or daddy, or baby sister...that's a lack of gameplay. They never existed.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
For me, it's not just bugs, it's almost EVERYTHING about the sims 4 itself that is making it difficult to play, but when I do play it for a few hours of relaxing downtime, I agree so much that bugs, lacking game play, everything said above by either the OP or other simmers, are ruining and have ruined the sims 4. Bugs already brought the downfall of sims 3!
A few months ago it was a thread like this that was involved in a big debacle on twitter as someone was going to take EA, or at least, the sims, to trading standards, the person at the top of all of this later said they weren't going to go ahead with their choice and that it was brought on by a series of personal problems, but the points they made were so right, so on the nose that I feel like someone else, or a few someones, should report EA and or the sims to whoever it is who fines companies and developers who do not deliver on their word.
I grew up with sims, and it's sad to see posts like these but then what makes them sad is that they're correct, they're right to be and be said because the sims franchise has gone downhill so fast that anyone riding the wave has already gone through the windscreen and is so many hundred feet down the broken highway that EA are driving on!
I struggle with bugs on and off, and when it's not bugs, it's just the awful lacking gameplay! Whenever I dare to mention such and such, other gamer's attack because they don't want to hear how far down the sims has sunk, how lacklustre it is and how, frankly, poor the game is.
Can someone please explain to me what this lack of gameplay is? What is so lacking or so different in the way gameplay is delivered in Sims 4 compared to the other franchises?
The problem I have when people make statements like the above bolded is that a lot of the time people make comments like so, but never actually explain why, it’s almost as if there’s a whole group of people that are convinced that there’s such a lack of gameplay that they don’t bother playing around with what the game has to offer, because instead they’re focusing on what’s not there. Perhaps I’m wrong, maybe there is a lack of gameplay, but I don’t see how that’s the case when I personally get a whole lot of fun from this game, constantly finding new things to try and play around with.
Do you find depth in those things you play around with?
I find Sims 4 has the most depth. As new packs get released the depth gets more apparent. What I have discovered while playing Sims 4 is they create content in such a way where everything feels connected, chances are if I'm using one feature from a pack, I'm probably also using other features vicariously through the features I most enjoy. Take Cats and Dogs for example, I find the cats and dogs themselves to be the most fleshed out and the best of the series, the pack also introduced Brindleton Bay and the Vet Clinic. Brindleton Bay is a world designed with pets in mind, giving pets activities to do and places to explore, so if I choose to go out exploring with my pets chances are I'm doing it in Brindleton Bay. Now I haven't actually gotten around to running a vet clinic much just yet, but I've still used the feature as my pets get sick and need medical attention, so I take them to the vet.
In Sims 3 I didn't have a reason to use multiple features at once, having a cat was completely separate from having a dog or a horse, the only ties I've really experienced in Sims 3 Pets was the cats and dogs new skills with the new small pets collectibles, but even then I don't need a cat or dog to experience the new small pet collectibles as I could get my sims to go out and find them. The horse was the most fleshed out pet in Sims 3 Pets for the main reason being that it wasn't just a pet, but also a way of transportation and an introduction to learning a new skill and I guess also a career as you could earn simoleons from entering competitions. But other than that most of the new features didn't really depend on each other to deliver what I would consider a full experience. (I also generally don't like how pets work in Sims 3 with the whole trait system, they can gain and lose traits as you play with them, and in theory it sounds interesting, but then I end up with pets who all have the same traits because I scolded and praised them for the same things.
Now let's take a look at Seasons and its new features, Weather, Calendar/Holidays and the new Gardening Career + gardening mechanics. weather is automatically applied to my game as it was in previous games, but now if I want to check upcoming weather I have to use the calendar, the calendar is a feature on its own that I thoroughly enjoy, but its ties to the actual weather make it all that more useful, I would say that the Calendar/Holidays are much more than a game play mechanic but also a game play tool. If I ever choose to play with the new gardening career I would have to play the career with weather in mind as harvestables now have a big tie in to the seasons and the weather, so by playing with the gardening career I am also heavily using the weather systems, but also possibly the calendar as I would like to know which days would be best to tend to my garden.
Sims 3 Seasons introduced Weather, Seasonal Festivals/Activities, and Aliens. Sims 4 Seasons is the first Sims 4 EP where I feel it delivered more than its predecessor as it also introduced Weather, Seasonal Activities, and a variety of new semi life states, but also added the new Calendar/Holiday system and Gardening Career. Besides that however, Sims 3 Seasons features don't have that same game play depth that Sims 4 Seasons has (when it comes down to how I play the game). The only features that have deep ties with one another are the seasons and the festivals, even then you don't need the festivals to enjoy those seasonal activities as you could get them in Buy Mode.
One more, my favourite pack, City Living. The packs main new features are the City, Festivals, Apartments/Penthouses and the new careers. I understand why some people don't really like City Living as a lot of its contents are locked away in the City, but for players like me it makes the pack that much more enjoyable as I have a reason to go to the city and use its features. If I want to live in an apartment I have to live in the city, and by living in the city I have quick access to the festivals which I may choose to participate in. Or if I choose to play through one of the new careers it might be smart for me to either live in the city or visit it often to accomplish my daily tasks.
Sims 3 Late Night is one of those Sims 3 packs whose features have deep ties with one another, The Celebrity System, New Hangout Spots, Bands, Mixologists and Vampires. Everything but Vampires have deep ties to one another and I really enjoy that, my only problem with the Celebrity System is that it's the same thing every single time, I really wish depending on the type of celebrity you are you'd have a different experience.
These are the reasons why I enjoy Sims 4, because to me when I play the game it feels like a more complete experience than 3 ever did, and still does, because I get a lot of use from the content that's delivered to me purely because the game was designed in such a way where using multiple features at once is possible and feels natural. I never really felt that way in Sims 3, in Sims 3 the new features that were delivered in its packs felt really disconnected, and each feature I played with on an individual scale, to me Sims 4 has more depth when it comes to multiple feature use, but even when using one feature. Just an example, the DJ Booths in Sims 4 have more depth and game play than DJ Booths in previous games, but also the DJ Booths have deep ties to social events and clubs. Of course all these reasons are because of the way I play the game, so it's all purely subjective, but these are the reasons why I find Sims 4 to have the most depth, my experience feels a whole lot more complete and full, whether I choose to play with features on an individual scale, or on a grander scale.
Edit: I realize I'm taking this thread off topic now so I apologize. I'll refrain from derailing it further.
The celeb fame in TS3 is based on who you know, not what you do. Much like social media is today, and how it is based also in TS4. TS1 is the only game that got fame, right...a mix of your ability (not going to associate with a lowly stand up comic) and who you networked with to get ahead.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
For me, it's not just bugs, it's almost EVERYTHING about the sims 4 itself that is making it difficult to play, but when I do play it for a few hours of relaxing downtime, I agree so much that bugs, lacking game play, everything said above by either the OP or other simmers, are ruining and have ruined the sims 4. Bugs already brought the downfall of sims 3!
A few months ago it was a thread like this that was involved in a big debacle on twitter as someone was going to take EA, or at least, the sims, to trading standards, the person at the top of all of this later said they weren't going to go ahead with their choice and that it was brought on by a series of personal problems, but the points they made were so right, so on the nose that I feel like someone else, or a few someones, should report EA and or the sims to whoever it is who fines companies and developers who do not deliver on their word.
I grew up with sims, and it's sad to see posts like these but then what makes them sad is that they're correct, they're right to be and be said because the sims franchise has gone downhill so fast that anyone riding the wave has already gone through the windscreen and is so many hundred feet down the broken highway that EA are driving on!
I struggle with bugs on and off, and when it's not bugs, it's just the awful lacking gameplay! Whenever I dare to mention such and such, other gamer's attack because they don't want to hear how far down the sims has sunk, how lacklustre it is and how, frankly, poor the game is.
Can someone please explain to me what this lack of gameplay is? What is so lacking or so different in the way gameplay is delivered in Sims 4 compared to the other franchises?
The problem I have when people make statements like the above bolded is that a lot of the time people make comments like so, but never actually explain why, it’s almost as if there’s a whole group of people that are convinced that there’s such a lack of gameplay that they don’t bother playing around with what the game has to offer, because instead they’re focusing on what’s not there. Perhaps I’m wrong, maybe there is a lack of gameplay, but I don’t see how that’s the case when I personally get a whole lot of fun from this game, constantly finding new things to try and play around with.
Do you find depth in those things you play around with?
I find Sims 4 has the most depth. As new packs get released the depth gets more apparent. What I have discovered while playing Sims 4 is they create content in such a way where everything feels connected, chances are if I'm using one feature from a pack, I'm probably also using other features vicariously through the features I most enjoy. Take Cats and Dogs for example, I find the cats and dogs themselves to be the most fleshed out and the best of the series, the pack also introduced Brindleton Bay and the Vet Clinic. Brindleton Bay is a world designed with pets in mind, giving pets activities to do and places to explore, so if I choose to go out exploring with my pets chances are I'm doing it in Brindleton Bay. Now I haven't actually gotten around to running a vet clinic much just yet, but I've still used the feature as my pets get sick and need medical attention, so I take them to the vet.
In Sims 3 I didn't have a reason to use multiple features at once, having a cat was completely separate from having a dog or a horse, the only ties I've really experienced in Sims 3 Pets was the cats and dogs new skills with the new small pets collectibles, but even then I don't need a cat or dog to experience the new small pet collectibles as I could get my sims to go out and find them. The horse was the most fleshed out pet in Sims 3 Pets for the main reason being that it wasn't just a pet, but also a way of transportation and an introduction to learning a new skill and I guess also a career as you could earn simoleons from entering competitions. But other than that most of the new features didn't really depend on each other to deliver what I would consider a full experience. (I also generally don't like how pets work in Sims 3 with the whole trait system, they can gain and lose traits as you play with them, and in theory it sounds interesting, but then I end up with pets who all have the same traits because I scolded and praised them for the same things.
Now let's take a look at Seasons and its new features, Weather, Calendar/Holidays and the new Gardening Career + gardening mechanics. weather is automatically applied to my game as it was in previous games, but now if I want to check upcoming weather I have to use the calendar, the calendar is a feature on its own that I thoroughly enjoy, but its ties to the actual weather make it all that more useful, I would say that the Calendar/Holidays are much more than a game play mechanic but also a game play tool. If I ever choose to play with the new gardening career I would have to play the career with weather in mind as harvestables now have a big tie in to the seasons and the weather, so by playing with the gardening career I am also heavily using the weather systems, but also possibly the calendar as I would like to know which days would be best to tend to my garden.
Sims 3 Seasons introduced Weather, Seasonal Festivals/Activities, and Aliens. Sims 4 Seasons is the first Sims 4 EP where I feel it delivered more than its predecessor as it also introduced Weather, Seasonal Activities, and a variety of new semi life states, but also added the new Calendar/Holiday system and Gardening Career. Besides that however, Sims 3 Seasons features don't have that same game play depth that Sims 4 Seasons has (when it comes down to how I play the game). The only features that have deep ties with one another are the seasons and the festivals, even then you don't need the festivals to enjoy those seasonal activities as you could get them in Buy Mode.
One more, my favourite pack, City Living. The packs main new features are the City, Festivals, Apartments/Penthouses and the new careers. I understand why some people don't really like City Living as a lot of its contents are locked away in the City, but for players like me it makes the pack that much more enjoyable as I have a reason to go to the city and use its features. If I want to live in an apartment I have to live in the city, and by living in the city I have quick access to the festivals which I may choose to participate in. Or if I choose to play through one of the new careers it might be smart for me to either live in the city or visit it often to accomplish my daily tasks.
Sims 3 Late Night is one of those Sims 3 packs whose features have deep ties with one another, The Celebrity System, New Hangout Spots, Bands, Mixologists and Vampires. Everything but Vampires have deep ties to one another and I really enjoy that, my only problem with the Celebrity System is that it's the same thing every single time, I really wish depending on the type of celebrity you are you'd have a different experience.
These are the reasons why I enjoy Sims 4, because to me when I play the game it feels like a more complete experience than 3 ever did, and still does, because I get a lot of use from the content that's delivered to me purely because the game was designed in such a way where using multiple features at once is possible and feels natural. I never really felt that way in Sims 3, in Sims 3 the new features that were delivered in its packs felt really disconnected, and each feature I played with on an individual scale, to me Sims 4 has more depth when it comes to multiple feature use, but even when using one feature. Just an example, the DJ Booths in Sims 4 have more depth and game play than DJ Booths in previous games, but also the DJ Booths have deep ties to social events and clubs. Of course all these reasons are because of the way I play the game, so it's all purely subjective, but these are the reasons why I find Sims 4 to have the most depth, my experience feels a whole lot more complete and full, whether I choose to play with features on an individual scale, or on a grander scale.
Edit: I realize I'm taking this thread off topic now so I apologize. I'll refrain from derailing it further.
I am truly happy that you enjoy the game and actually gave a very interesting answer:) Thank you. For me, I find more depth in the sims 2 and the memory system it has. Everything you do in that game affects the sims life longterm.
In the sims 4 nothing matters because they will still stand and smile like a maniac while I burn their family to death.
Sure they will be sad and cry in the bed for a minute, well until they find a nice painting and a moodlet/emotion decides that the death wasn't all that sad.
For me, it's not just bugs, it's almost EVERYTHING about the sims 4 itself that is making it difficult to play, but when I do play it for a few hours of relaxing downtime, I agree so much that bugs, lacking game play, everything said above by either the OP or other simmers, are ruining and have ruined the sims 4. Bugs already brought the downfall of sims 3!
A few months ago it was a thread like this that was involved in a big debacle on twitter as someone was going to take EA, or at least, the sims, to trading standards, the person at the top of all of this later said they weren't going to go ahead with their choice and that it was brought on by a series of personal problems, but the points they made were so right, so on the nose that I feel like someone else, or a few someones, should report EA and or the sims to whoever it is who fines companies and developers who do not deliver on their word.
I grew up with sims, and it's sad to see posts like these but then what makes them sad is that they're correct, they're right to be and be said because the sims franchise has gone downhill so fast that anyone riding the wave has already gone through the windscreen and is so many hundred feet down the broken highway that EA are driving on!
I struggle with bugs on and off, and when it's not bugs, it's just the awful lacking gameplay! Whenever I dare to mention such and such, other gamer's attack because they don't want to hear how far down the sims has sunk, how lacklustre it is and how, frankly, poor the game is.
Can someone please explain to me what this lack of gameplay is? What is so lacking or so different in the way gameplay is delivered in Sims 4 compared to the other franchises?
The problem I have when people make statements like the above bolded is that a lot of the time people make comments like so, but never actually explain why, it’s almost as if there’s a whole group of people that are convinced that there’s such a lack of gameplay that they don’t bother playing around with what the game has to offer, because instead they’re focusing on what’s not there. Perhaps I’m wrong, maybe there is a lack of gameplay, but I don’t see how that’s the case when I personally get a whole lot of fun from this game, constantly finding new things to try and play around with.
I completely appreciate you not agreeing with the statement but that most definitely is not true. You can circle the globe several times with the long and thorough posts that explain exactly that.
For me, it's not just bugs, it's almost EVERYTHING about the sims 4 itself that is making it difficult to play, but when I do play it for a few hours of relaxing downtime, I agree so much that bugs, lacking game play, everything said above by either the OP or other simmers, are ruining and have ruined the sims 4. Bugs already brought the downfall of sims 3!
A few months ago it was a thread like this that was involved in a big debacle on twitter as someone was going to take EA, or at least, the sims, to trading standards, the person at the top of all of this later said they weren't going to go ahead with their choice and that it was brought on by a series of personal problems, but the points they made were so right, so on the nose that I feel like someone else, or a few someones, should report EA and or the sims to whoever it is who fines companies and developers who do not deliver on their word.
I grew up with sims, and it's sad to see posts like these but then what makes them sad is that they're correct, they're right to be and be said because the sims franchise has gone downhill so fast that anyone riding the wave has already gone through the windscreen and is so many hundred feet down the broken highway that EA are driving on!
I struggle with bugs on and off, and when it's not bugs, it's just the awful lacking gameplay! Whenever I dare to mention such and such, other gamer's attack because they don't want to hear how far down the sims has sunk, how lacklustre it is and how, frankly, poor the game is.
Can someone please explain to me what this lack of gameplay is? What is so lacking or so different in the way gameplay is delivered in Sims 4 compared to the other franchises?
The problem I have when people make statements like the above bolded is that a lot of the time people make comments like so, but never actually explain why, it’s almost as if there’s a whole group of people that are convinced that there’s such a lack of gameplay that they don’t bother playing around with what the game has to offer, because instead they’re focusing on what’s not there. Perhaps I’m wrong, maybe there is a lack of gameplay, but I don’t see how that’s the case when I personally get a whole lot of fun from this game, constantly finding new things to try and play around with.
I completely appreciate you not agreeing with the statement but that most definitely is not true. You can circle the globe several times with the long and thorough posts that explain exactly that.
My bad, you're correct, I shouldn't make such generalizations.
After the update yesterday I just have something to say: the simgurus have to learn what "priorities" mean! Nobody needed a gallery overhaul...
I was attacked for saying this on another post. I was also attacked for it in the livestream, now it seems like more people have realised how pointless it was
Arrogance is still uncalled for, and nobody can speak for everybody else. SimGurus don't need to "learn" anything and some people needed a gallery overhaul. Watch your statements, people. I, for one, do not appreciate when others think they speak on my behalf. Thank you.
TS4's depth is hit and miss.
It suffers from the base game, which is lacking depth in sim personality, social AI, and situational awareness.
Any depth that has been added is from the more recent packs. I really appreciate Spa Day, toddlers, Vampires, Dine Out (not restaurant ownership), and Parenthood.
The OP's frustrations are sadly relateable. Now that I have Seasons, I have the pack I needed to complete my gameplay, and yet I'm playing TS4 less than ever. When I want to unwind, I always go to TS2 instead. Why? Because TS2 runs so smoothly. I know that the game has some game-breaking corruption bugs, but I also know how to avoid them, and so my gameplay runs without any major issues. My sister puts it well when she says that she has to fight TS4 to get it to work. Playing the game is tiring because you are always fighting the Sims from engaging in some bug, just to get the game to run.
The live service system is a double-edged sword. They can fix more bugs this way, but they also break content we paid for by doing so. It is unethical to render parts of a DLC a customer has paid for suddenly unusable. Even worse is when they use the system to nullify features we paid for, such as alien abductions.
TS4 is the first Sims game I have required mods to play with, since culling and relationship culling make the game completely unplayable. Now the live service system means that updates usually break my mods every month, and so every time I want to play TS4, I have to spend an hour checking to see whether my mods are updated with the new patch. This is why I always just go back to TS2 - it's so hassle-free by comparison. I've had too many experiences when I come home from an exhausting day at work and want to relax by playing the Sims, only to find that TS4 has patched and all my mods are broken, or I have a game-breaking bug from the new patch that I have to run over to the kind folks on Deaderpool's Discord to help me fix. Not how I want to spend my precious free time.
The OP's frustrations are sadly relateable. Now that I have Seasons, I have the pack I needed to complete my gameplay, and yet I'm playing TS4 less than ever. When I want to unwind, I always go to TS2 instead. Why? Because TS2 runs so smoothly. I know that the game has some game-breaking corruption bugs, but I also know how to avoid them, and so my gameplay runs without any major issues. My sister puts it well when she says that she has to fight TS4 to get it to work. Playing the game is tiring because you are always fighting the Sims from engaging in some bug, just to get the game to run.
The live service system is a double-edged sword. They can fix more bugs this way, but they also break content we paid for by doing so. It is unethical to render parts of a DLC a customer has paid for suddenly unusable. Even worse is when they use the system to nullify features we paid for, such as alien abductions.
TS4 is the first Sims game I have required mods to play with, since culling and relationship culling make the game completely unplayable. Now the live service system means that updates usually break my mods every month, and so every time I want to play TS4, I have to spend an hour checking to see whether my mods are updated with the new patch. This is why I always just go back to TS2 - it's so hassle-free by comparison. I've had too many experiences when I come home from an exhausting day at work and want to relax by playing the Sims, only to find that TS4 has patched and all my mods are broken, or I have a game-breaking bug from the new patch that I have to run over to the kind folks on Deaderpool's Discord to help me fix. Not how I want to spend my precious free time.
I feel the same. I don't play ts4 at all anymore and somewhere deep down it saddens me that there is a sims game that I don't like lol.
However, yesterday I spent 7 hours building an entire city in the sims 2, utilizing all the stuff from every pack and building cheats. I never used CC or mods but still find that I can build anything i desire. I built a frickin' boardwalk and a beach with an outside gym and a café.
I can't do any of this in 4
Beach houses, apartment blocks, any store I can come up with, a huge mall that actually functions, a graveyard, a hotel and much more. As a builder I just can't enjoy the sims 4.
It really irritates me when they either change or break something I paid for with an update. The update they did right before seasons that overhauled the whole gardening system really annoyed me - it suddenly took forever to evolve plants, plants in the wild were all messed up , and I hate that stupid weeding machine - that is not what I paid for!
I stopped using mods in Sims 4 for the reasons you stated - every time there is an update - everything is broken and it takes too much time and work to fix it all again but paying Sims 4 without at least MCCC is painful.
I do the same thing - I go back to Sims 2 or 3 to actually be able to play and relax and not have to fight to play. In Sims 4, I constantly have to reset sims and they even took that cheat away for awhile in an update!
@terra and @AprilDawn - Yes to both of you. I, too, feel like in Sims 4, I have to fight to keep my sims from, as Terra said, "engaging in some bug." Heck, I don't even buy or place high-chairs anymore, because adult Sims cannot deal with them, for example.
While I admit I couldn't play Sims 3 without NRAAS's mods, I find that I can play Sims 4 fine without them. However, many of the problems that I find people reporting are due to outdated Mods. I'm not blaming the Modding community for these because they don't have "early access" to new EPs/GPs/SPs before release.
As I have repeatedly stated in the Help Section, turn Automatic Updates OFF. This allows you to check your favorite Modder's sites and see if they have updated to incorporate all that EA/Maxis patched. You can still play while you wait for them to update and don't experience some of the problems we see a lot of. I did this while Sims 3 was updating and never updated my game until Twillian had updated all their mods.
But, back the OP's original post. People get bored or frustrated doing the same thing. I admit I have to change up my game play and will take breaks from playing the Sims (2, 3 & 4) to play other games like Fallout 4 or Skyrim or Kingdom Hearts. (There are others too, just too many to mention).
Second Star to the Right and Straight on 'til Morning.
While I admit I couldn't play Sims 3 without NRAAS's mods, I find that I can play Sims 4 fine without them. However, many of the problems that I find people reporting are due to outdated Mods. I'm not blaming the Modding community for these because they don't have "early access" to new EPs/GPs/SPs before release.
As I have repeatedly stated in the Help Section, turn Automatic Updates OFF. This allows you to check your favorite Modder's sites and see if they have updated to incorporate all that EA/Maxis patched. You can still play while you wait for them to update and don't experience some of the problems we see a lot of. I did this while Sims 3 was updating and never updated my game until Twillian had updated all their mods.
But, back the OP's original post. People get bored or frustrated doing the same thing. I admit I have to change up my game play and will take breaks from playing the Sims (2, 3 & 4) to play other games like Fallout 4 or Skyrim or Kingdom Hearts. (There are others too, just too many to mention).
Some can play Sims 4 fine without mods, others I see declaring the game is unplayable without them. Exactly the same as it was with Sims 3 (I played and enjoyed and loved the game for 4 years before adding my first mod and still I only have mods for the game that don’t alter or influence gameplay). Also I highly doubt Sims 4’s issues come down to mods that need updating, like Sims 3 had issues that in no way were mod related. Having played the game for four years modless makes me an expert in that department, believe me. The same will go for Sims 4.
Also, concerning people getting bored or frustrated doing the same thing, wanting to take breaks, that isn’t a given. Considering how many people are still playing and enjoying the older versions. Accepting the frustrations (there’s no denying there) it can bring at times. Issues in Sims 3 for me have always been like what the orks are to Legolas in this gif.
Frustrated yes but bored? If I had been bored I’d never had gone through the great lengths I have just to solve problems time after time.
While I admit I couldn't play Sims 3 without NRAAS's mods, I find that I can play Sims 4 fine without them. However, many of the problems that I find people reporting are due to outdated Mods. I'm not blaming the Modding community for these because they don't have "early access" to new EPs/GPs/SPs before release.
As I have repeatedly stated in the Help Section, turn Automatic Updates OFF. This allows you to check your favorite Modder's sites and see if they have updated to incorporate all that EA/Maxis patched. You can still play while you wait for them to update and don't experience some of the problems we see a lot of. I did this while Sims 3 was updating and never updated my game until Twillian had updated all their mods.
But, back the OP's original post. People get bored or frustrated doing the same thing. I admit I have to change up my game play and will take breaks from playing the Sims (2, 3 & 4) to play other games like Fallout 4 or Skyrim or Kingdom Hearts. (There are others too, just too many to mention).
Some can play Sims 4 fine without mods, others I see declaring the game is unplayable without them. Exactly the same as it was with Sims 3 (I played and enjoyed and loved the game for 4 years before adding my first mod and still I only have mods for the game that don’t alter or influence gameplay). Also I highly doubt Sims 4’s issues come down to mods that need updating, like Sims 3 had issues that in no way were mod related. Having played the game for four years modless makes me an expert in that department, believe me. The same will go for Sims 4.
Also, concerning people getting bored or frustrated doing the same thing, wanting to take breaks, that isn’t a given. Considering how many people are still playing and enjoying the older versions. Accepting the frustrations (there’s no denying there) it can bring at times. Issues in Sims 3 for me have always been like what the orks are to Legolas in this gif.
Frustrated yes but bored? If I had been bored I’d never had gone through the great lengths I have just to solve problems time after time.
I'm afraid Sims 4 would bore me to tears!
Mainly because there is nothing I can do there, not like with Sims 3 and Sims 2 where I redid all my towns the way I liked them. Right now in Sims 3 I am redoing Sunset Valley into Oasis Landing, and doing all the families I want to put into it. After that I will probably start in another World and redo that.
I did the same in Sims 2. Loved it when "trailer parks" were added. Trailer's with wheels. I made trailer parks all over the worlds.
While I admit I couldn't play Sims 3 without NRAAS's mods, I find that I can play Sims 4 fine without them. However, many of the problems that I find people reporting are due to outdated Mods.
I do not use mods with TS4. I never used them with TS3 or TS2. I still have most of the same bugs that people have been complaining about.
It's nice and easy to blame mods for these bugs and bad Sim behaviors and such, but lots of us don't play with any mods at all, and we still have the bugs. And I find it quite frustrating that the go-to response is "turn off/uninstall mods." This is a useless piece of advice to people who have no mods.
Just the other day I posted in frustration on the Feedback thread about my Sims refusing to finish carrying out my direct orders. Do you know why I posted there and not to the ACHQ or whatever it's called bug reporting system? Because I searched the problem and EVERY case was blamed on mods, and I know if I made a new post it would get merged into the old threads, all of which are about mods.... and it would get me no answers.
Whereas here, on the forum, at least other Simmers could give me some actionable advice other than "turn off the mods you don't even have".
While I admit I couldn't play Sims 3 without NRAAS's mods, I find that I can play Sims 4 fine without them. However, many of the problems that I find people reporting are due to outdated Mods. I'm not blaming the Modding community for these because they don't have "early access" to new EPs/GPs/SPs before release.
As I have repeatedly stated in the Help Section, turn Automatic Updates OFF. This allows you to check your favorite Modder's sites and see if they have updated to incorporate all that EA/Maxis patched. You can still play while you wait for them to update and don't experience some of the problems we see a lot of. I did this while Sims 3 was updating and never updated my game until Twillian had updated all their mods.
But, back the OP's original post. People get bored or frustrated doing the same thing. I admit I have to change up my game play and will take breaks from playing the Sims (2, 3 & 4) to play other games like Fallout 4 or Skyrim or Kingdom Hearts. (There are others too, just too many to mention).
I already have automatic updates off and don't play the game with outdated mods. I only allow updated mods to stay in my game. My bugs are not caused by my mods. In fact, the one time I took my mods out to try to fix a horrible, game-breaking bug, taking the mods out didn't help me fix the bug, but since I had to save while trying to fix the bug, having my game mod-free for a few minutes wiped out an entire generation from my legacy family tree thanks to culling. So yes, I do find the game unplayable without mods, and no, it's not because my mods are outdated. I think you missed the point of my post, if you were responding to me and the others who agreed with me; the reason I don't play TS4 much anymore is because it seems I'm always in the "waiting for the mods to update" phase, and as I've stated, my rotational legacy gameplay is not supported in TS4 without mods, unlike in TS2 where I play multi-generational legacies bug-free and mod-free.
While I admit I couldn't play Sims 3 without NRAAS's mods, I find that I can play Sims 4 fine without them. However, many of the problems that I find people reporting are due to outdated Mods.
I do not use mods with TS4. I never used them with TS3 or TS2. I still have most of the same bugs that people have been complaining about.
It's nice and easy to blame mods for these bugs and bad Sim behaviors and such, but lots of us don't play with any mods at all, and we still have the bugs. And I find it quite frustrating that the go-to response is "turn off/uninstall mods." This is a useless piece of advice to people who have no mods.
Just the other day I posted in frustration on the Feedback thread about my Sims refusing to finish carrying out my direct orders. Do you know why I posted there and not to the ACHQ or whatever it's called bug reporting system? Because I searched the problem and EVERY case was blamed on mods, and I know if I made a new post it would get merged into the old threads, all of which are about mods.... and it would get me no answers.
Whereas here, on the forum, at least other Simmers could give me some actionable advice other than "turn off the mods you don't even have".
That’s just bad. Because that’s not helping out, that’s finding an excuse to leave things the way they are.
There is a difference between blaming everything on mods and asking to check if you have tried without mods. If you come back and confirm you don't use mods or that you have tried without mods further troubleshooting can be suggested. If it is indeed a bug, but with a workaround that info can be provided or the bug can be tracked.
We do not want to blame mods, but it is a crucial steps to ask/verify as more often than not mods are causing some issues.
i wish i could remember the details of sims 4's launch, but i remember getting the game and it being... a mobile game, but on my computer. there were so many /key/ features from the previous games missing. content, overall, seemed much, much less than it had in 3 when it launched. it was such a disappointing experience, but i've stuck with the game, hoping it would get better. i would say the biggest thing keeping it from getting better is ea itself. ea's track record is horrible with companies they buy, and sims is just their latest victim as a franchise. they've also managed to chase off devs that had been with the game since the programming stages of the first sims.
it's a shame, but it is what it is, i suppose.
also, sims 5? probably never happening. sims 4 is more likely to enter into a life support mode like bioware's star wars the old republic: loads of dlc, culling of staff, followed by a slow, keening death that is painful to watch.
There is a difference between blaming everything on mods and asking to check if you have tried without mods. If you come back and confirm you don't use mods or that you have tried without mods further troubleshooting can be suggested. If it is indeed a bug, but with a workaround that info can be provided or the bug can be tracked.
We do not want to blame mods, but it is a crucial steps to ask/verify as more often than not mods are causing some issues.
That’s true and indeed therefore it’s important to always ask players whether they do use mods in case of problems first, my comment there was a bit shorthand. I’ve always been one of Sims 3’s strongest advocats in this respect because I strongly suspect a lot of issues (lag for instance, and crashing) was caused by just that, mods. I purely reacted to the statement there but you’re right, mods always must be ruled out as a possible cause first.
There is a difference between blaming everything on mods and asking to check if you have tried without mods. If you come back and confirm you don't use mods or that you have tried without mods further troubleshooting can be suggested. If it is indeed a bug, but with a workaround that info can be provided or the bug can be tracked.
We do not want to blame mods, but it is a crucial steps to ask/verify as more often than not mods are causing some issues.
Interestingly enough, when I have posted about any issues, I always even include that I have taken out my cc and mods to test out before asking help. Then I am told that I just have "start a new game" because my old one is corrupt for unknown reasons. That is not help, because I see that as avoiding the issues.
There is a difference between blaming everything on mods and asking to check if you have tried without mods. If you come back and confirm you don't use mods or that you have tried without mods further troubleshooting can be suggested. If it is indeed a bug, but with a workaround that info can be provided or the bug can be tracked.
We do not want to blame mods, but it is a crucial steps to ask/verify as more often than not mods are causing some issues.
Interestingly enough, when I have posted about any issues, I always even include that I have taken out my cc and mods to test out before asking help. Then I am told that I just have "start a new game" because my old one is corrupt for unknown reasons. That is not help, because I see that as avoiding the issues.
That simply can be the issue though. Unless an issue is experienced and shared by a lot of different simmers of course.
There is a difference between blaming everything on mods and asking to check if you have tried without mods. If you come back and confirm you don't use mods or that you have tried without mods further troubleshooting can be suggested. If it is indeed a bug, but with a workaround that info can be provided or the bug can be tracked.
We do not want to blame mods, but it is a crucial steps to ask/verify as more often than not mods are causing some issues.
Yes, I understand this fact. But there were 2 or 3 different instances of what I am experiencing reported... all ultimately were blamed on the use of mods. Because this is the case, I suspected that if I made another such report, it would get merged into those threads and be lost in a sea of "oh that's cause of a mod". Don't tell me it doesn't happen because I have read bug reports on that site that are just like that.
Over and above this, I find the AHCQ or whatever it is, much more unpleasant to read and navigate than the forum.
It's a pity they chose to give us leftovers and scraps from a failed online game project held together with the electronic version of baling wire and chewing gum, rather than a game designed and built as such from the ground up. The various posts/threads about the early days of TS4 have been both illuminating and depressing. In view of the built in limitations I wonder how much fixing is really possible, though I wholeheartedly agree that more effort to deal with the bugs is necessary. That little item known as customer support. At least I have TS2 (on 3 computers) to go to for any simming I want to do. Just finished an oceanside Vicky (from period plans) that is quite impossible to build in TS4, and it's looking and running just fine.
I saw the 'writing on the wall', with GTW, which is why I haven't bought anything for TS4 since, TS4's foundation is too badly made to ever really be fixed... It'll never be a sims game in the spirit of its immediate predecessor, let alone TS2.
At this point, I think the gurus are just running off a script that they're given, any time they seem to make a pack you want or address your concerns is simply coincidence, the script and the fans wanting the same.
Is it really supposed to go 3 more years? I haven't played for a very long time.
I have a feeling Sims 4 will be the end of the series and that's too bad, we never will get a proper successor to Sims 1, 2 and 3 then as far as I'm concerned.
Comments
If I tried to explain to you what I might mean by lack of gameplay compared to the older versions, it might take this thread off topic. And I have a list of things I could expand upon comparing TS2/TS3 to TS4. Even TS1 to TS4. I will make it short, you know it when you see it.
ETA: Seems I grabbed the wrong quote..so it was this one: Quote: 'Can someone please explain to me what this lack of gameplay is? What is so lacking or so different in the way gameplay is delivered in Sims 4 compared to the other franchises?' End quote.
But I will mention depth. These Sims don't even know you deleted mommy or daddy, or baby sister...that's a lack of gameplay. They never existed.
I find Sims 4 has the most depth. As new packs get released the depth gets more apparent. What I have discovered while playing Sims 4 is they create content in such a way where everything feels connected, chances are if I'm using one feature from a pack, I'm probably also using other features vicariously through the features I most enjoy. Take Cats and Dogs for example, I find the cats and dogs themselves to be the most fleshed out and the best of the series, the pack also introduced Brindleton Bay and the Vet Clinic. Brindleton Bay is a world designed with pets in mind, giving pets activities to do and places to explore, so if I choose to go out exploring with my pets chances are I'm doing it in Brindleton Bay. Now I haven't actually gotten around to running a vet clinic much just yet, but I've still used the feature as my pets get sick and need medical attention, so I take them to the vet.
In Sims 3 I didn't have a reason to use multiple features at once, having a cat was completely separate from having a dog or a horse, the only ties I've really experienced in Sims 3 Pets was the cats and dogs new skills with the new small pets collectibles, but even then I don't need a cat or dog to experience the new small pet collectibles as I could get my sims to go out and find them. The horse was the most fleshed out pet in Sims 3 Pets for the main reason being that it wasn't just a pet, but also a way of transportation and an introduction to learning a new skill and I guess also a career as you could earn simoleons from entering competitions. But other than that most of the new features didn't really depend on each other to deliver what I would consider a full experience. (I also generally don't like how pets work in Sims 3 with the whole trait system, they can gain and lose traits as you play with them, and in theory it sounds interesting, but then I end up with pets who all have the same traits because I scolded and praised them for the same things.
Now let's take a look at Seasons and its new features, Weather, Calendar/Holidays and the new Gardening Career + gardening mechanics. weather is automatically applied to my game as it was in previous games, but now if I want to check upcoming weather I have to use the calendar, the calendar is a feature on its own that I thoroughly enjoy, but its ties to the actual weather make it all that more useful, I would say that the Calendar/Holidays are much more than a game play mechanic but also a game play tool. If I ever choose to play with the new gardening career I would have to play the career with weather in mind as harvestables now have a big tie in to the seasons and the weather, so by playing with the gardening career I am also heavily using the weather systems, but also possibly the calendar as I would like to know which days would be best to tend to my garden.
Sims 3 Seasons introduced Weather, Seasonal Festivals/Activities, and Aliens. Sims 4 Seasons is the first Sims 4 EP where I feel it delivered more than its predecessor as it also introduced Weather, Seasonal Activities, and a variety of new semi life states, but also added the new Calendar/Holiday system and Gardening Career. Besides that however, Sims 3 Seasons features don't have that same game play depth that Sims 4 Seasons has (when it comes down to how I play the game). The only features that have deep ties with one another are the seasons and the festivals, even then you don't need the festivals to enjoy those seasonal activities as you could get them in Buy Mode.
One more, my favourite pack, City Living. The packs main new features are the City, Festivals, Apartments/Penthouses and the new careers. I understand why some people don't really like City Living as a lot of its contents are locked away in the City, but for players like me it makes the pack that much more enjoyable as I have a reason to go to the city and use its features. If I want to live in an apartment I have to live in the city, and by living in the city I have quick access to the festivals which I may choose to participate in. Or if I choose to play through one of the new careers it might be smart for me to either live in the city or visit it often to accomplish my daily tasks.
Sims 3 Late Night is one of those Sims 3 packs whose features have deep ties with one another, The Celebrity System, New Hangout Spots, Bands, Mixologists and Vampires. Everything but Vampires have deep ties to one another and I really enjoy that, my only problem with the Celebrity System is that it's the same thing every single time, I really wish depending on the type of celebrity you are you'd have a different experience.
These are the reasons why I enjoy Sims 4, because to me when I play the game it feels like a more complete experience than 3 ever did, and still does, because I get a lot of use from the content that's delivered to me purely because the game was designed in such a way where using multiple features at once is possible and feels natural. I never really felt that way in Sims 3, in Sims 3 the new features that were delivered in its packs felt really disconnected, and each feature I played with on an individual scale, to me Sims 4 has more depth when it comes to multiple feature use, but even when using one feature. Just an example, the DJ Booths in Sims 4 have more depth and game play than DJ Booths in previous games, but also the DJ Booths have deep ties to social events and clubs. Of course all these reasons are because of the way I play the game, so it's all purely subjective, but these are the reasons why I find Sims 4 to have the most depth, my experience feels a whole lot more complete and full, whether I choose to play with features on an individual scale, or on a grander scale.
Edit: I realize I'm taking this thread off topic now so I apologize. I'll refrain from derailing it further.
In the sims 4 nothing matters because they will still stand and smile like a maniac while I burn their family to death.
Sure they will be sad and cry in the bed for a minute, well until they find a nice painting and a moodlet/emotion decides that the death wasn't all that sad.
My bad, you're correct, I shouldn't make such generalizations.
You don't speak on our behalf either.
It suffers from the base game, which is lacking depth in sim personality, social AI, and situational awareness.
Any depth that has been added is from the more recent packs. I really appreciate Spa Day, toddlers, Vampires, Dine Out (not restaurant ownership), and Parenthood.
The live service system is a double-edged sword. They can fix more bugs this way, but they also break content we paid for by doing so. It is unethical to render parts of a DLC a customer has paid for suddenly unusable. Even worse is when they use the system to nullify features we paid for, such as alien abductions.
TS4 is the first Sims game I have required mods to play with, since culling and relationship culling make the game completely unplayable. Now the live service system means that updates usually break my mods every month, and so every time I want to play TS4, I have to spend an hour checking to see whether my mods are updated with the new patch. This is why I always just go back to TS2 - it's so hassle-free by comparison. I've had too many experiences when I come home from an exhausting day at work and want to relax by playing the Sims, only to find that TS4 has patched and all my mods are broken, or I have a game-breaking bug from the new patch that I have to run over to the kind folks on Deaderpool's Discord to help me fix. Not how I want to spend my precious free time.
Add Manage Neighbourhood Options - assign your own Sim to NPC jobs!
The Problems with Death in The Sims 4
Distinguish Elder gameplay with Elder-only reward traits
Filter Rugs by Room Size
I feel the same. I don't play ts4 at all anymore and somewhere deep down it saddens me that there is a sims game that I don't like lol.
However, yesterday I spent 7 hours building an entire city in the sims 2, utilizing all the stuff from every pack and building cheats. I never used CC or mods but still find that I can build anything i desire. I built a frickin' boardwalk and a beach with an outside gym and a café.
I can't do any of this in 4
Beach houses, apartment blocks, any store I can come up with, a huge mall that actually functions, a graveyard, a hotel and much more. As a builder I just can't enjoy the sims 4.
@Terra Exactly!
It really irritates me when they either change or break something I paid for with an update. The update they did right before seasons that overhauled the whole gardening system really annoyed me - it suddenly took forever to evolve plants, plants in the wild were all messed up , and I hate that stupid weeding machine - that is not what I paid for!
I stopped using mods in Sims 4 for the reasons you stated - every time there is an update - everything is broken and it takes too much time and work to fix it all again but paying Sims 4 without at least MCCC is painful.
I do the same thing - I go back to Sims 2 or 3 to actually be able to play and relax and not have to fight to play. In Sims 4, I constantly have to reset sims and they even took that cheat away for awhile in an update!
As I have repeatedly stated in the Help Section, turn Automatic Updates OFF. This allows you to check your favorite Modder's sites and see if they have updated to incorporate all that EA/Maxis patched. You can still play while you wait for them to update and don't experience some of the problems we see a lot of. I did this while Sims 3 was updating and never updated my game until Twillian had updated all their mods.
But, back the OP's original post. People get bored or frustrated doing the same thing. I admit I have to change up my game play and will take breaks from playing the Sims (2, 3 & 4) to play other games like Fallout 4 or Skyrim or Kingdom Hearts. (There are others too, just too many to mention).
Also, concerning people getting bored or frustrated doing the same thing, wanting to take breaks, that isn’t a given. Considering how many people are still playing and enjoying the older versions. Accepting the frustrations (there’s no denying there) it can bring at times. Issues in Sims 3 for me have always been like what the orks are to Legolas in this gif.
Frustrated yes but bored? If I had been bored I’d never had gone through the great lengths I have just to solve problems time after time.
I'm afraid Sims 4 would bore me to tears!
Mainly because there is nothing I can do there, not like with Sims 3 and Sims 2 where I redid all my towns the way I liked them. Right now in Sims 3 I am redoing Sunset Valley into Oasis Landing, and doing all the families I want to put into it. After that I will probably start in another World and redo that.
I did the same in Sims 2. Loved it when "trailer parks" were added. Trailer's with wheels. I made trailer parks all over the worlds.
Can't do that in Sims 4.
I do not use mods with TS4. I never used them with TS3 or TS2. I still have most of the same bugs that people have been complaining about.
It's nice and easy to blame mods for these bugs and bad Sim behaviors and such, but lots of us don't play with any mods at all, and we still have the bugs. And I find it quite frustrating that the go-to response is "turn off/uninstall mods." This is a useless piece of advice to people who have no mods.
Just the other day I posted in frustration on the Feedback thread about my Sims refusing to finish carrying out my direct orders. Do you know why I posted there and not to the ACHQ or whatever it's called bug reporting system? Because I searched the problem and EVERY case was blamed on mods, and I know if I made a new post it would get merged into the old threads, all of which are about mods.... and it would get me no answers.
Whereas here, on the forum, at least other Simmers could give me some actionable advice other than "turn off the mods you don't even have".
I already have automatic updates off and don't play the game with outdated mods. I only allow updated mods to stay in my game. My bugs are not caused by my mods. In fact, the one time I took my mods out to try to fix a horrible, game-breaking bug, taking the mods out didn't help me fix the bug, but since I had to save while trying to fix the bug, having my game mod-free for a few minutes wiped out an entire generation from my legacy family tree thanks to culling. So yes, I do find the game unplayable without mods, and no, it's not because my mods are outdated. I think you missed the point of my post, if you were responding to me and the others who agreed with me; the reason I don't play TS4 much anymore is because it seems I'm always in the "waiting for the mods to update" phase, and as I've stated, my rotational legacy gameplay is not supported in TS4 without mods, unlike in TS2 where I play multi-generational legacies bug-free and mod-free.
Add Manage Neighbourhood Options - assign your own Sim to NPC jobs!
The Problems with Death in The Sims 4
Distinguish Elder gameplay with Elder-only reward traits
Filter Rugs by Room Size
There is a difference between blaming everything on mods and asking to check if you have tried without mods. If you come back and confirm you don't use mods or that you have tried without mods further troubleshooting can be suggested. If it is indeed a bug, but with a workaround that info can be provided or the bug can be tracked.
We do not want to blame mods, but it is a crucial steps to ask/verify as more often than not mods are causing some issues.
it's a shame, but it is what it is, i suppose.
also, sims 5? probably never happening. sims 4 is more likely to enter into a life support mode like bioware's star wars the old republic: loads of dlc, culling of staff, followed by a slow, keening death that is painful to watch.
Interestingly enough, when I have posted about any issues, I always even include that I have taken out my cc and mods to test out before asking help. Then I am told that I just have "start a new game" because my old one is corrupt for unknown reasons. That is not help, because I see that as avoiding the issues.
Yes, I understand this fact. But there were 2 or 3 different instances of what I am experiencing reported... all ultimately were blamed on the use of mods. Because this is the case, I suspected that if I made another such report, it would get merged into those threads and be lost in a sea of "oh that's cause of a mod". Don't tell me it doesn't happen because I have read bug reports on that site that are just like that.
Over and above this, I find the AHCQ or whatever it is, much more unpleasant to read and navigate than the forum.
Sad but true, if it's the last one.