Considering that all parts of Sims have been total areligious (with no temples or churches and also no Sims actions to perform prayers) I doubt that there will be any religious garb ever
@MadameLee "She's wearing a HAT! That's got to have some sort of religious significance and adds weight to my argument that Christians can be predjudiced against women too!"
Except... I was trying to take the middle ground anyway.
Prepping a list of mods to add after Infants are placed into the game. Because real life isn't 'nice'.
@MadameLee "She's wearing a HAT! That's got to have some sort of religious significance and adds weight to my argument that Christians can be predjudiced against women too!"
Except... I was trying to take the middle ground anyway.
yeah but Mom has told me about when she was growing up in the 50s and 60s that Christans women/girls still had to cover their hair in church. Not to mention stuff. I don't know when that stopped-the late 60s. I would beleive (and I'm not even going to get into the fact that girls of any faith in the 60s/70s were oppressed in one way that they had to wear skirt/dresses that were a certain length at high school.. the 70s was when girls could start to wear jeans in school)
So I sometimes get annoyed with the "dresses" in the Sims 4 since they aren't full-lenght
I would absolutely love hijabs or some other kind of headscarf in the game. - And generally more outfits that aren't so 'Western'. Hijabs and burqas are quite common in my neighbourhood, and I would love to have sims in my game that actually wear them.
Headscarfs and hijabs are not the same thing and have completely different meanings.
Yet somehow women buy headscarfs, cover their hair with them, and call them "hijabs". It's just a different word. But it's basically a headscarf.
EA CREATOR NETWORK MEMBER — Want to be notified of patches, new Broken Mods threads, and urgent Sims 4 news? Follow me at https://www.patreon.com/luthienrising.
I would love it if The Sims added Hijabs. Some of my characters are Muslim and it's important for them to wear them. Other clothing from different cultures would be nice too. I think they added a few thing in the City expansion pack, but more the merrier!
If they are added. please let it be in a special pack. I like to chose, and I don't like all clothing. Some of those that came with City Living are so weird in my opinion, and the game tends to make new sims with weird names and weird clothes all the time.
Headscarfs and hijabs are not the same thing and have completely different meanings.
Yet somehow women buy headscarfs, cover their hair with them, and call them "hijabs". It's just a different word. But it's basically a headscarf.
??? So if I wear a headscarf because I feel like wearing one, maybe because I'm having a bad hair day or cold thats considered a hijab to you @luthienrising religious women wear hijabs for religious reasons actually (sign of modesty, symbol of faith) not because just because they feel like covering their hair, hence why a hijab and headscarfs are two different things.
Headscarfs and hijabs are not the same thing and have completely different meanings.
Yet somehow women buy headscarfs, cover their hair with them, and call them "hijabs". It's just a different word. But it's basically a headscarf.
??? So if I wear a headscarf because I feel like wearing one, maybe because I'm having a bad hair day or cold thats considered a hijab to you @luthienrising religious women wear hijabs for religious reasons actually (sign of modesty, symbol of faith) not because just because they feel like covering their hair, hence why a hijab and headscarfs are two different things.
Sims don't have "reasons". They just wear things. The exact same scarf can be worn for fashion and for religious reasons - and not only by Muslims - in the exact same ways. There's already a scarf in the game that is tied the way many Orthodox Jewish women wear scarfs for modesty purposes. Can you tell when you use it?
EA CREATOR NETWORK MEMBER — Want to be notified of patches, new Broken Mods threads, and urgent Sims 4 news? Follow me at https://www.patreon.com/luthienrising.
Headscarfs and hijabs are not the same thing and have completely different meanings.
Yet somehow women buy headscarfs, cover their hair with them, and call them "hijabs". It's just a different word. But it's basically a headscarf.
??? So if I wear a headscarf because I feel like wearing one, maybe because I'm having a bad hair day or cold thats considered a hijab to you @luthienrising religious women wear hijabs for religious reasons actually (sign of modesty, symbol of faith) not because just because they feel like covering their hair, hence why a hijab and headscarfs are two different things.
Sims don't have "reasons". They just wear things. The exact same scarf can be worn for fashion and for religious reasons - and not only by Muslims - in the exact same ways. There's already a scarf in the game that is tied the way many Orthodox Jewish women wear scarfs for modesty purposes. Can you tell when you use it?
yet your saying "Yet somehow women buy headscarfs, cover their hair with them, and call them "hijabs". It's just a different word. But it's basically a headscarf" yet they're two different things so it's basically not a headscarf, your contradicting yourself. I suggest you educate yourself with articles on the internet about hijab, they're different from headscarfs like this quote says "Hijab is not a term that is synonymous with the headscarf; it is a term that encompasses much more than an article of clothing".
One of the things about the Sims 4 is that a lot of its fashions reflect those of the age in which it was written. It's the 2010s, and hats aren't really a thing except for cosplay, as you can tell by the hats section of CAS.
More ethnic diversity in our clothing, rather than just "I'm walking around New York" would be nice, but then everybody would be clamouring for it. Not a bad thing, but it doubles as setting yourself up for disappointment.
Prepping a list of mods to add after Infants are placed into the game. Because real life isn't 'nice'.
It's really ignorant and offensive to say that a hijab is the same as a headscarf when a hijab has so much more meaning than just a "scarf".
They are literally headscarfs. Try hanging out in a scarf department and seeing who buys them. A scarf is a piece of fabric tied on a person's head. Some of us want more variety of those, similar to how we see them worn in the world today. And as for the no-religious-headgear deal, we already have turbans, which some people wear for religious reasons. We already have headscarfs that are tied in a way common among Orthodox Jewish women. Should those be removed from the game? A scarf lightly draped hijab-style, in black, would look just like what half the nonnas in Sicily wore when I was there less than 10 years ago. And you know? You wouldn't have to even use it.
EA CREATOR NETWORK MEMBER — Want to be notified of patches, new Broken Mods threads, and urgent Sims 4 news? Follow me at https://www.patreon.com/luthienrising.
Headscarfs and hijabs are not the same thing and have completely different meanings.
Yet somehow women buy headscarfs, cover their hair with them, and call them "hijabs". It's just a different word. But it's basically a headscarf.
??? So if I wear a headscarf because I feel like wearing one, maybe because I'm having a bad hair day or cold thats considered a hijab to you @luthienrising religious women wear hijabs for religious reasons actually (sign of modesty, symbol of faith) not because just because they feel like covering their hair, hence why a hijab and headscarfs are two different things.
Sims don't have "reasons". They just wear things. The exact same scarf can be worn for fashion and for religious reasons - and not only by Muslims - in the exact same ways. There's already a scarf in the game that is tied the way many Orthodox Jewish women wear scarfs for modesty purposes. Can you tell when you use it?
yet your saying "Yet somehow women buy headscarfs, cover their hair with them, and call them "hijabs". It's just a different word. But it's basically a headscarf" yet they're two different things so it's basically not a headscarf, your contradicting yourself. I suggest you educate yourself with articles on the internet about hijab, they're different from headscarfs like this quote says "Hijab is not a term that is synonymous with the headscarf; it is a term that encompasses much more than an article of clothing".
I'm afraid you're talking to the wrong person when it comes to learning about hijab - I actually did a pile of research on this, for work purposes, just this winter. Yes, the word has multiple meanings, one of which is "modesty". Another is a style of wearing a headscarf, which is what we're talking about here. It's not even a style that has exclusively religious meaning or use. If I pin my scarf at my neck so it doesn't fall off, it doesn't become a religious item. That's internal, and Sims can't have that intention, so it would be nonreligious - decorative like a turban or the other relatively covering scarves we have now. In the absence of religion itself, a piece of fabric tied on your head is a piece of fabric tied on your head. It might be used to make an Italian nonna, or a Sim who hates her hair today or wants the comfort of fabric on her head, or to represent a Sim-self that just feels wrong if there's so much skin and hair showing.
EA CREATOR NETWORK MEMBER — Want to be notified of patches, new Broken Mods threads, and urgent Sims 4 news? Follow me at https://www.patreon.com/luthienrising.
@luthienrising I come from a Muslim background I think I know luv. I'm not talking about what you're talking about, your not understanding. They're not the same. It's incredibly frustrating that you're saying they're the same. I suggest you read this article because I'm not in the mood to carry this on: Article here
This has nothing to do with not wanting hijabs, but rather I don't want to encourage the Sims team to focus excess time on such a feature. I hated the transgender pack, I avoided City Living like the plague.
Any time the Sims team works on something cultural or socially progressive, the common link is that there's no new gameplay. It's a hat, it's a new tank top, it's a new type of food dish or it's a new type of name in the random name generator. That's it. It's all stuff I could easily, easily do without, yet as we've seen with both City Living and the transgender patch, the Sims team seems to consider these full-on features.
The last thing I want is some cultural game pack or expansion pack where all there is to do is wear a hijab and eat falafel. Mind you, I'm not saying that's all there is to middle eastern culture; far from it. However, if you look at the Sims team's track record, that's absolutely what they'd focus on. I don't care what my sims eat, and while I want my sims to look nice or appropriate, I would take a pack with gameplay but no furniture/clothing over a pack with clothing/furniture but no gameplay any day of the week.
This is not a political podium to speak at or a soapbox to stand on. This is a video game. It's here to entertain us, not to wow us with how progressive it is while we all clap and applaud it for being as such. If I wanted to do that, there's a number of armchair activists in the world that would gladly help me out and let me applaud them. I don't want to do that though. I want to play my game.
I wouldn't mind hijabs, but man, can you imagine the controversy? I'm shuddering just thinking about it.
Yeah, "controversy."
One thing I hate these days is how people always pretend something like this is such a bold, daring move when 🐸🐸🐸🐸 it's not. I don't know anyone that would be offended by this. After all, this is a life simulator, and even someone who's bigoted and hates Muslims wouldn't deny their existence, so they'd recognize the value of hijabs as a tool for simulating life. The only controversy would be if, for example, The Sims included a religion for the first time, and we got Ramadan instead of Easter, which I sincerely doubt they have any intention of including any such thing ever. That would spark the ire of those who feel spurned when their religion doesn't come first, but a hijab...? Nah.
If anything, the "controversy" would be "free publicity," as the Sims gets all kinds of free press from news outlets applauding them for being progressive. Turn back the clock on the transgender patch. Do you remember a huge controversy and a huge discussion of how people weren't gonna buy the game anymore because of such a release...? No, they got free articles in a bunch of journalism outlets, and at most there were a handful of people lamenting that they spent so much time on a rather lackluster, time-consuming and featureless update. That to me is my real concern here, because I'd rather they just focused on making a great game instead of on how to generate free press.
If they want to make transgender Sims a part of vanilla Sims 5? By all means. If they want to make hijabs included in vanilla Sims 5? Do it. Heck, if they can control themselves and release a small patch that's literally JUST hijabs, then go for it. If you look at the history of this game though, that's not what they do; they make a big stinking deal out of their progressive politics, this gets free press and free purchases from more politically active customers, then I sit here grumbling that no one can figure out companies are highly logical and calculating, and typically when they make moves like this, they do so because they see profit, not "a chance to make a statement" or whatever it is people think this is about.
The Hijab is as much of a general term for dressing and behaving modestly as it is for the idea of covering the hair. By wearing it you show a certain familiarity and respect for Islamic tradition. Some Islamic women WANT to wear it. Some hate it. Women wore hats in churches not because they were forced to, but because they respected Christian tradition and considered it a show of modesty before God. The more unpleasant religious spokespeople for Islam can get all bullying over punishing women who don't dress to their standards and that's when it all starts to go sour and the Hijab becomes, yes, just a hat.
Anyway, different regions use different kinds of physical Hijab too - for example the Hijab you're thinking of is actually more common in the UK, and is subject to fashion, being patterened and of any colour. The Niqab is a step up and covers most of the face. Whether it's the Hijab or the Niqab that should be worn is a subject of religious debate. You'd see the Burqa (head to feet covering) is most often in Afghanistan but the Chador (which shows the face but has no buttons or ties and is held closed with one hand) is commonly Iranian.
So what I said about everybody wanting their own piece is as true as ever.
Post edited by Loanet on
Prepping a list of mods to add after Infants are placed into the game. Because real life isn't 'nice'.
Comments
She wears them quite often. She was wearing one when Obama last visited.
Considering that all parts of Sims have been total areligious (with no temples or churches and also no Sims actions to perform prayers) I doubt that there will be any religious garb ever
Except... I was trying to take the middle ground anyway.
yeah but Mom has told me about when she was growing up in the 50s and 60s that Christans women/girls still had to cover their hair in church. Not to mention stuff. I don't know when that stopped-the late 60s. I would beleive (and I'm not even going to get into the fact that girls of any faith in the 60s/70s were oppressed in one way that they had to wear skirt/dresses that were a certain length at high school.. the 70s was when girls could start to wear jeans in school)
So I sometimes get annoyed with the "dresses" in the Sims 4 since they aren't full-lenght
Yet somehow women buy headscarfs, cover their hair with them, and call them "hijabs". It's just a different word. But it's basically a headscarf.
your everyday headscarf
If they are added. please let it be in a special pack. I like to chose, and I don't like all clothing. Some of those that came with City Living are so weird in my opinion, and the game tends to make new sims with weird names and weird clothes all the time.
??? So if I wear a headscarf because I feel like wearing one, maybe because I'm having a bad hair day or cold thats considered a hijab to you
@luthienrising religious women wear hijabs for religious reasons actually (sign of modesty, symbol of faith) not because just because they feel like covering their hair, hence why a hijab and headscarfs are two different things.
Sims don't have "reasons". They just wear things. The exact same scarf can be worn for fashion and for religious reasons - and not only by Muslims - in the exact same ways. There's already a scarf in the game that is tied the way many Orthodox Jewish women wear scarfs for modesty purposes. Can you tell when you use it?
yet your saying "Yet somehow women buy headscarfs, cover their hair with them, and call them "hijabs". It's just a different word. But it's basically a headscarf" yet they're two different things so it's basically not a headscarf, your contradicting yourself. I suggest you educate yourself with articles on the internet about hijab, they're different from headscarfs like this quote says "Hijab is not a term that is synonymous with the headscarf; it is a term that encompasses much more than an article of clothing".
More ethnic diversity in our clothing, rather than just "I'm walking around New York" would be nice, but then everybody would be clamouring for it. Not a bad thing, but it doubles as setting yourself up for disappointment.
They are literally headscarfs. Try hanging out in a scarf department and seeing who buys them. A scarf is a piece of fabric tied on a person's head. Some of us want more variety of those, similar to how we see them worn in the world today. And as for the no-religious-headgear deal, we already have turbans, which some people wear for religious reasons. We already have headscarfs that are tied in a way common among Orthodox Jewish women. Should those be removed from the game? A scarf lightly draped hijab-style, in black, would look just like what half the nonnas in Sicily wore when I was there less than 10 years ago. And you know? You wouldn't have to even use it.
I'm afraid you're talking to the wrong person when it comes to learning about hijab - I actually did a pile of research on this, for work purposes, just this winter. Yes, the word has multiple meanings, one of which is "modesty". Another is a style of wearing a headscarf, which is what we're talking about here. It's not even a style that has exclusively religious meaning or use. If I pin my scarf at my neck so it doesn't fall off, it doesn't become a religious item. That's internal, and Sims can't have that intention, so it would be nonreligious - decorative like a turban or the other relatively covering scarves we have now. In the absence of religion itself, a piece of fabric tied on your head is a piece of fabric tied on your head. It might be used to make an Italian nonna, or a Sim who hates her hair today or wants the comfort of fabric on her head, or to represent a Sim-self that just feels wrong if there's so much skin and hair showing.
This has nothing to do with not wanting hijabs, but rather I don't want to encourage the Sims team to focus excess time on such a feature. I hated the transgender pack, I avoided City Living like the plague.
Any time the Sims team works on something cultural or socially progressive, the common link is that there's no new gameplay. It's a hat, it's a new tank top, it's a new type of food dish or it's a new type of name in the random name generator. That's it. It's all stuff I could easily, easily do without, yet as we've seen with both City Living and the transgender patch, the Sims team seems to consider these full-on features.
The last thing I want is some cultural game pack or expansion pack where all there is to do is wear a hijab and eat falafel. Mind you, I'm not saying that's all there is to middle eastern culture; far from it. However, if you look at the Sims team's track record, that's absolutely what they'd focus on. I don't care what my sims eat, and while I want my sims to look nice or appropriate, I would take a pack with gameplay but no furniture/clothing over a pack with clothing/furniture but no gameplay any day of the week.
This is not a political podium to speak at or a soapbox to stand on. This is a video game. It's here to entertain us, not to wow us with how progressive it is while we all clap and applaud it for being as such. If I wanted to do that, there's a number of armchair activists in the world that would gladly help me out and let me applaud them. I don't want to do that though. I want to play my game.
Yeah, "controversy."
One thing I hate these days is how people always pretend something like this is such a bold, daring move when 🐸🐸🐸🐸 it's not. I don't know anyone that would be offended by this. After all, this is a life simulator, and even someone who's bigoted and hates Muslims wouldn't deny their existence, so they'd recognize the value of hijabs as a tool for simulating life. The only controversy would be if, for example, The Sims included a religion for the first time, and we got Ramadan instead of Easter, which I sincerely doubt they have any intention of including any such thing ever. That would spark the ire of those who feel spurned when their religion doesn't come first, but a hijab...? Nah.
If anything, the "controversy" would be "free publicity," as the Sims gets all kinds of free press from news outlets applauding them for being progressive. Turn back the clock on the transgender patch. Do you remember a huge controversy and a huge discussion of how people weren't gonna buy the game anymore because of such a release...? No, they got free articles in a bunch of journalism outlets, and at most there were a handful of people lamenting that they spent so much time on a rather lackluster, time-consuming and featureless update. That to me is my real concern here, because I'd rather they just focused on making a great game instead of on how to generate free press.
If they want to make transgender Sims a part of vanilla Sims 5? By all means. If they want to make hijabs included in vanilla Sims 5? Do it. Heck, if they can control themselves and release a small patch that's literally JUST hijabs, then go for it. If you look at the history of this game though, that's not what they do; they make a big stinking deal out of their progressive politics, this gets free press and free purchases from more politically active customers, then I sit here grumbling that no one can figure out companies are highly logical and calculating, and typically when they make moves like this, they do so because they see profit, not "a chance to make a statement" or whatever it is people think this is about.
Anyway, different regions use different kinds of physical Hijab too - for example the Hijab you're thinking of is actually more common in the UK, and is subject to fashion, being patterened and of any colour. The Niqab is a step up and covers most of the face. Whether it's the Hijab or the Niqab that should be worn is a subject of religious debate. You'd see the Burqa (head to feet covering) is most often in Afghanistan but the Chador (which shows the face but has no buttons or ties and is held closed with one hand) is commonly Iranian.
So what I said about everybody wanting their own piece is as true as ever.
Also you could create a Sim with a hijab wearing a bikini which might anger religious feelings...