Forum Announcement, Click Here to Read More From EA_Cade.

Is The Sims at risk? - Going Downhill or Uphill

Comments

  • Options
    lady8janelady8jane Posts: 350 Member
    edited May 2016
    On PC Sims 4 was the top seller in units in 2015 with 7 more Sims products (8 in total) in the Top 20 according to this:
    http://www.theesa.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/Essential-Facts-2016.pdf

    Note that there is a second Sims 4 product (Get to Work) in the Top 5 (3 Sims products in the Top 5 in total).
  • Options
    knazzerknazzer Posts: 3,382 Member
    lady8jane wrote: »
    On PC Sims 4 was the top seller in units in 2015 with 7 more Sims products (8 in total) in the Top 20 according to this:
    http://www.theesa.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/Essential-Facts-2016.pdf

    Note that there is a second Sims 4 product (Get to Work) in the Top 5 (3 Sims products in the Top 5 in total).

    The reason it being high up on the PC chart is many people now play on console. Many of EA's games have console versions whereas the Sims is solely PC which bumps it up in the charts significantly.
  • Options
    mirta000mirta000 Posts: 2,974 Member
    knazzer wrote: »
    The reason it being high up on the PC chart is many people now play on console. Many of EA's games have console versions whereas the Sims is solely PC which bumps it up in the charts significantly.

    more people play on PCs nowadays than on the console. Consoles were winning tech wise around the PS2 era, but overtime they started only being on par with mid-end PCs and losing the race and their popularity dropped.
  • Options
    GabbyGirlJGabbyGirlJ Posts: 6,858 Member
    edited May 2016
    knazzer wrote: »
    lady8jane wrote: »
    On PC Sims 4 was the top seller in units in 2015 with 7 more Sims products (8 in total) in the Top 20 according to this:
    http://www.theesa.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/Essential-Facts-2016.pdf

    Note that there is a second Sims 4 product (Get to Work) in the Top 5 (3 Sims products in the Top 5 in total).

    The reason it being high up on the PC chart is many people now play on console. Many of EA's games have console versions whereas the Sims is solely PC which bumps it up in the charts significantly.

    Another factor, I believe, is that NPD does not track digital sales.

    http://www.hardcoregamer.com/2016/01/15/esa-slams-npd-for-misleading-2015-video-game-sales-numbers/187600/
    IHJCfa6.jpg
  • Options
    knazzerknazzer Posts: 3,382 Member
    edited May 2016
    mirta000 wrote: »
    knazzer wrote: »
    The reason it being high up on the PC chart is many people now play on console. Many of EA's games have console versions whereas the Sims is solely PC which bumps it up in the charts significantly.

    more people play on PCs nowadays than on the console. Consoles were winning tech wise around the PS2 era, but overtime they started only being on par with mid-end PCs and losing the race and their popularity dropped.

    Consoles are still a massive market, what I'm trying to get as is that the sims series is exclusively a PC game so it's naturally going to get bumped to the top whereas people who buy for example Mass Effect will for console/PC. I'm not talking about what's more popular PC, console etc :)
  • Options
    StilleWaterStilleWater Posts: 1,566 Member
    But the player base and asset pages don't mention that the Sims is the reason...The Asset page mentions many other EA games but not The Sims. So the proof is not in the pudding. It's like "lets push everything else". Maybe The Sims has out grown EA and they just don't want to mess with it. Yes they are "releasing the new GP3 but still they are very lack in doing so...many simmers said they announce 2 weeks b4 release...and su[supposedly it will b released b4 the end of May...2 1/5 weeks to go.
    7FXGVZ1.jpg?1
  • Options
    StilleWaterStilleWater Posts: 1,566 Member
    On twitter the Guru's talk about other EA games
    7FXGVZ1.jpg?1
  • Options
    SimburianSimburian Posts: 6,914 Member
    Just read on the Civilisation 6 website...
    .....Although Civ 5 came out in 2010, it didn't fully find its feet until the Brave New World expansion, which arrived three years later."

    So maybe we can still hope - but another year? :'(

    BTW that comes out in October..
    http://www.polygon.com/features/2016/5/11/11653620/civilization-6-release-date-preview
  • Options
    luthienrisingluthienrising Posts: 37,628 Member
    On twitter the Guru's talk about other EA games

    They talk about non-EA games too. They're gamers. Pretty much everyone in the gaming industry, I would think, plays a variety of games and enjoys them. I work in book publishing. Everyone in my industry reads, and nobody reads only what they themselves contribute toward or what their own company publishes. If any of us did that, we'd be pretty lousy at our jobs. We share what books we enjoy with each other all the time, no matter the publisher. I can't see why it would be any different in any other cultural industry. You go into that sector because you love the product, but if you cut yourself off from other people's products within it or from the sheer enjoyment that brought you there, you might as well quit and go into accounting. (Sorry, @Scobre, first example that popped into my head.)
    EA CREATOR NETWORK MEMBER — Want to be notified of patches, new Broken Mods threads, and urgent Sims 4 news? Follow me at https://www.patreon.com/luthienrising.
  • Options
    LatteCrabLatteCrab Posts: 2,935 Member
    knazzer wrote: »

    Consoles are still a massive market, what I'm trying to get as is that the sims series is exclusively a PC game so it's naturally going to get bumped to the top whereas people who buy for example Mass Effect will for console/PC. I'm not talking about what's more popular PC, console etc :)
    That could only be said about Sims 4, the latest Sims iteration, for now.
    They might eventually make a console version of Sims 4, or even a handheld version
    (though I doubt it),
    the way they did for the Original The Sims, The Sims 2, & The Sims 3.
    (Sims 3 was the only one I skipped the console for, since I heard it freezes & wrecks the Wii. Though I do have all of the PC versions )

  • Options
    elanorbretonelanorbreton Posts: 14,549 Member
    It's difficult to say whether it's going uphill or downhill. It probably had many sales at the beginning but has lost a lot of those buyers over the following periods of time. Then it would have had new buyers coming along, but how many would stay after their initial purchase?

    As far as the forum goes, I feel it has got a little more positivity recently. Slightly more enthusiasm for the upcoming packs. But still a lot of despondency too from long-time fans who are not getting much from the game, and new fans who didn't get what they expected.

    Swings and roundabouts :)

    I do like TS4, but it falls short in a big way. I would be very sad to see its demise, they need to bring us some quality to steer it in the right direction.
  • Options
    knazzerknazzer Posts: 3,382 Member
    edited May 2016
    I have a love hate relationship with The Sims 4. I mentioned in another post, personally the lack of communication and quality of expansions have not been on par with previous incarnations and I feel the same vibe after Sim City was released and we know how that turned out in the end.

    I feel the creators have forgotten we are gamers and we what complex, diverse, creative challenges within our games and don't need someone to hold our hands when playing. :)
  • Options
    PandaORosePandaORose Posts: 549 Member
    It's on a hill...that's all I got right now :)
    2750512.gif~c200

  • Options
    DolittleRollerDolittleRoller Posts: 54 Member
    The chance of going uphill is as big as a marble rolling up a 90 degree incline.
  • Options
    ScobreScobre Posts: 20,665 Member
    edited May 2016
    On twitter the Guru's talk about other EA games

    They talk about non-EA games too. They're gamers. Pretty much everyone in the gaming industry, I would think, plays a variety of games and enjoys them. I work in book publishing. Everyone in my industry reads, and nobody reads only what they themselves contribute toward or what their own company publishes. If any of us did that, we'd be pretty lousy at our jobs. We share what books we enjoy with each other all the time, no matter the publisher. I can't see why it would be any different in any other cultural industry. You go into that sector because you love the product, but if you cut yourself off from other people's products within it or from the sheer enjoyment that brought you there, you might as well quit and go into accounting. (Sorry, @Scobre, first example that popped into my head.)
    @luthienrising LOL no worries. I enjoy accounting and numbers. I did find out fairly recently that SimGuruDrake is the community manager for Bejeweled too, so I had fun talking to her about that on her wall with the new release of a mobile version of the game. I think it is normal for Gurus to talk about multiple games being that they are in the gaming industry, so they have to keep current of what is out there.

    I do think it is hard to know exact sales figures being that EA hasn't shared them for this iteration. I mean we could guess, but it will never probably be close to the actual sales figures in one direction or another.

    Going off the NPD figures alone, the Sims 4 I think has made at least $167,972,000 going off of base game price alone. So that isn't a small sum at all, but quite profitable.
    “Although the world is full of suffering, it is full also of the overcoming of it.” –Helen Keller
  • Options
    simgirl1010simgirl1010 Posts: 35,866 Member
    edited May 2016
    For me personally it's going uphill. I've been lucky in that my play style has allowed me to avoid all the serious bugs and issues that have plagued many and I've been more than happy with the content released thus far. <3 Looking forward to continuing that trend with Dining Out and the kid's stuff pack.

    ETA : Of course there are features I miss and would like to see make a return but overall for me I'm having fun. Which is really what matters to me.
  • Options
    DarkslayerDarkslayer Posts: 9,074 Member
    edited May 2016
    mirta000 wrote: »
    knazzer wrote: »
    The reason it being high up on the PC chart is many people now play on console. Many of EA's games have console versions whereas the Sims is solely PC which bumps it up in the charts significantly.

    more people play on PCs nowadays than on the console. Consoles were winning tech wise around the PS2 era, but overtime they started only being on par with mid-end PCs and losing the race and their popularity dropped.

    Eh, outside of RTS games, MMOs and things like The Sims where a keyboard and mouse are pretty much necessary in order to play properly I don't see much in the way of "exclusive" titles being put out for PC (with the exception of the indie circuit - but those games aren't generally my kind of thing) so I don't think there is as much competition for PC-orientated games.

    No hate, I play games on PC as well but I still have a PlayStation 4 and a 3DS because if I didn't I wouldn't have been able to play so many games that have ended up being my personal favourites and on top of that I have access via my consoles to a lot of the same AAA titles that do come out on Steam and Origin.

    It doesn't feel like the PC market has really edged ahead at all to me - but that's purely based on my own feelings and what I use my hardware for.
  • Options
    imhappyimhappy Posts: 1,988 Member
    I remember reading that management is on a rolling basis for two years with Sims. Since they haven't said anything to stop Sims, it should be going for another two years.

    I don't know if it's on a hill. I think it's been pretty steady since Sims 4 came out. (I think we want it to go uphill) But they keep plugging along, doing what they do.
  • Options
    Forest_NinjaForest_Ninja Posts: 1,181 Member
    edited May 2016
    I don't believe that The Sims really even exists from the perspective that you're referring to at this point and it isn't likely that any of the hostility that you're noticing within communities will have any relevance to the future of products which are published by EA. It has been suggested repeatedly that "The Sims 4 is a new product" and, if you're interested in classic simulation, "The Sims 4 isn't the product you're looking for." You'll find that most product-related communities aren't as 'open' or social as you would expect and that the majority of the conflict is really just business. If you want The Sims to succeed then you'll have to identify and support the true interests of the developers, and you can be certain that nothing which is developed by independent parties will ever meet the previous standard.

    If you want to 'draw' a more accurate picture of the situation (preferrably at no less than 1920x1080 with antialiasing, proper shading, and no gaping holes in your terrain) you should evaluate attitudes toward community participation, depth of feedback, accuracy of product support, the relevance of feature sets to foundational interests and/or history, maintenance of the product and mandatory services, accessibility of public interfaces, and the behavior of management. It's very clear that there is no desire on the part of community management to receive any input which hasn't been specifically requested which isn't necessarily a bad thing considering the volume of irrational feedback, however there is visibly a breakdown of communication in all areas which has led to rejection of the product, and I'm not referring to the delays between announcements.
    "Video gaming began as an engineer's hobby and a means of creative expression for those of higher technical inclination. It is expected that those who are capable of higher engineering-related achievements will see value, in electronic entertainment products, where others see failure." -Sasquatch
  • Options
    mirta000mirta000 Posts: 2,974 Member
    edited May 2016
    Darkslayer wrote: »
    Eh, outside of RTS games, MMOs and things like The Sims where a keyboard and mouse are pretty much necessary in order to play properly I don't see much in the way of "exclusive" titles being put out for PC (with the exception of the indie circuit - but those games aren't generally my kind of thing) so I don't think there is as much competition for PC-orientated games.

    No hate, I play games on PC as well but I still have a PlayStation 4 and a 3DS because if I didn't I wouldn't have been able to play so many games that have ended up being my personal favourites and on top of that I have access via my consoles to a lot of the same AAA titles that do come out on Steam and Origin.

    It doesn't feel like the PC market has really edged ahead at all to me - but that's purely based on my own feelings and what I use my hardware for.

    PC architecture did, not necessarily the market itself. Because of architecture moving and games becoming easier to reach with the creation of such platforms as Steam, more people moved off the consoles towards the PC. Because of this happening previously console exclusive titles are now fully coming to PC. Titles that started on PC and moved to consoles are moving back to PCs too (Metal Gear for example).

    Nowadays a console exclusive normally means consoles get the game a year early and then PCs get their own graphically enhanced versions. Besides perhaps Persona and Ratchet and Clank I'm hard pressed to think of games that are exclusively staying on consoles for example.

    I also own both a PsP and a 3DS, but these handhelds are quite old by now and there are no plans to produce new ones.
  • Options
    Sigzy05Sigzy05 Posts: 19,406 Member
    mirta000 wrote: »

    Well it does mean *something*. Generally people aren't 'negative' for the sake of it-they often have articulated very clear reasons why they feel disappointed in the hope the situation will improve for how they enjoy the product.

    I really dislike the assumption that feedback that isn't praise equals negativity.

    People who didn't care about the game wouldn't bother. They would drop the game and be unconcerned about the future of the game. The passion this community (whether from those who like TS4 to those who don't and everyone in between!) shows towards The Sims means that it's important to a great many people. That should be appreciated and cherished. That sort of passion and commitment is very valuable and very difficult to recapture if it's lost.

    the only problem is that every single reiteration of The Sims is so different that it attracted a completely different audience to each. And that audience does not necessarily like other games in the series.

    Person A liked The sims 1 to 4
    Person B likes The Sims 2 only
    Person C likes The Sims 3 only
    Person D likes The Sims 1 to 3
    Person E likes The sims 4
    Person F likes The Sims 4 and The Sims 2

    The problem arises when people B to D want to change The Sims 4 to something that they like, because they hate what it currently is. "Well how is that a problem?" you may say. It's a problem when what B to D dislikes is what E and F specifically like. So yes, B to D are very passionate in hating, but at the same time if B to D was listened to E and F will be sitting here hating. The Sims is such a broad franchise that it can't possibly satisfy everyone.

    That sounds really selfish, just sayin'.
    mHdgPlU.jpg?1
  • Options
    luthienrisingluthienrising Posts: 37,628 Member
    edited May 2016
    Sigzy05 wrote: »
    mirta000 wrote: »

    Well it does mean *something*. Generally people aren't 'negative' for the sake of it-they often have articulated very clear reasons why they feel disappointed in the hope the situation will improve for how they enjoy the product.

    I really dislike the assumption that feedback that isn't praise equals negativity.

    People who didn't care about the game wouldn't bother. They would drop the game and be unconcerned about the future of the game. The passion this community (whether from those who like TS4 to those who don't and everyone in between!) shows towards The Sims means that it's important to a great many people. That should be appreciated and cherished. That sort of passion and commitment is very valuable and very difficult to recapture if it's lost.

    the only problem is that every single reiteration of The Sims is so different that it attracted a completely different audience to each. And that audience does not necessarily like other games in the series.

    Person A liked The sims 1 to 4
    Person B likes The Sims 2 only
    Person C likes The Sims 3 only
    Person D likes The Sims 1 to 3
    Person E likes The sims 4
    Person F likes The Sims 4 and The Sims 2

    The problem arises when people B to D want to change The Sims 4 to something that they like, because they hate what it currently is. "Well how is that a problem?" you may say. It's a problem when what B to D dislikes is what E and F specifically like. So yes, B to D are very passionate in hating, but at the same time if B to D was listened to E and F will be sitting here hating. The Sims is such a broad franchise that it can't possibly satisfy everyone.

    That sounds really selfish, just sayin'.

    It's not selfish to say that it's not possible to have a Sims game that covers everyone's desires in the unavoidable circumstances that some of what we desire is contradictory and when the game has to actually finish being created so it can be sold. How do you reconcile, for example, preferences for two very different art styles? Nobody here is saying that things shouldn't be added; they're saying that things shouldn't be removed in Sims Version X from players set 1 who have bought the game already in order to cater to player set 2 who don't like Sims Version X now. It's like, if Sims 3 had been changed to close the world off in sections, or to remove an element of story progression completely - both of which could have been done in the interest of rotational play and stability - instead of those things being done in next Sims game.

    Or rather, maybe it is selfish, but it's not like you need food because you're starving and I have extra but am refusing to give it to you. And it's a selfish that I suspect everyone here shares. We all want our personal toys. We're happy for others to have their toys too, but not if it means breaking ours.
    EA CREATOR NETWORK MEMBER — Want to be notified of patches, new Broken Mods threads, and urgent Sims 4 news? Follow me at https://www.patreon.com/luthienrising.
  • Options
    mirta000mirta000 Posts: 2,974 Member
    edited May 2016
    Sigzy05 wrote: »

    That sounds really selfish, just sayin'.

    which of the ABCs I am it doesn't even matter. Some decisions made by The sims team will not cater to me, others will. To however balance a game in a way that it would appeal to literally every Sim fan is impossible. Because reasons why they like sims, or a specific sim game are vastly different. I am not telling them to cater to me. I'm only saying that a specific amount of players and their wishes will always be left out while catering to the majority and chances are at some point it's also going to be me, my wishes and my playstyle that they may damage. And nobody wants their playstyle damaged, so here we are, fighting on the forums over what should and shouldn't be in. And despite everything that will go in, some people will be left out and not catered to for the whole lifespan of The Sims 4 (one such group that I can think of is highly likely the open world fans. I do not think that they can patch that in).
  • Options
    Sigzy05Sigzy05 Posts: 19,406 Member
    edited May 2016
    Sigzy05 wrote: »
    mirta000 wrote: »

    Well it does mean *something*. Generally people aren't 'negative' for the sake of it-they often have articulated very clear reasons why they feel disappointed in the hope the situation will improve for how they enjoy the product.

    I really dislike the assumption that feedback that isn't praise equals negativity.

    People who didn't care about the game wouldn't bother. They would drop the game and be unconcerned about the future of the game. The passion this community (whether from those who like TS4 to those who don't and everyone in between!) shows towards The Sims means that it's important to a great many people. That should be appreciated and cherished. That sort of passion and commitment is very valuable and very difficult to recapture if it's lost.

    the only problem is that every single reiteration of The Sims is so different that it attracted a completely different audience to each. And that audience does not necessarily like other games in the series.

    Person A liked The sims 1 to 4
    Person B likes The Sims 2 only
    Person C likes The Sims 3 only
    Person D likes The Sims 1 to 3
    Person E likes The sims 4
    Person F likes The Sims 4 and The Sims 2

    The problem arises when people B to D want to change The Sims 4 to something that they like, because they hate what it currently is. "Well how is that a problem?" you may say. It's a problem when what B to D dislikes is what E and F specifically like. So yes, B to D are very passionate in hating, but at the same time if B to D was listened to E and F will be sitting here hating. The Sims is such a broad franchise that it can't possibly satisfy everyone.

    That sounds really selfish, just sayin'.

    It's not selfish to say that it's not possible to have a Sims game that covers everyone's desires in the unavoidable circumstances that some of what we desire is contradictory and when the game has to actually finish being created so it can be sold. How do you reconcile, for example, preferences for two very different art styles? Nobody here is saying that things shouldn't be added; they're saying that things shouldn't be removed in Sims Version X from players set 1 who have bought the game already in order to cater to player set 2 who don't like Sims Version X now. It's like, if Sims 3 had been changed to close the world off in sections, or to remove an element of story progression completely - both of which could have been done in the interest of rotational play and stability - instead of those things being done in next Sims game.

    Or rather, maybe it is selfish, but it's not like you need food because you're starving and I have extra but am refusing to give it to you. And it's a selfish that I suspect everyone here shares. We all want our personal toys. We're happy for others to have their toys too, but not if it means breaking ours.

    She neither mentions addition nor removal she simply says she doesn't want her game to change based on what others want. Let's look at toddlers for instance how many players want this? Tons. Is it a removal? No. Does she want them? No, she said it'll change her game too much even when she can age them up and wont even affect traits.

    "The problem arises when people B to D want to change The Sims 4 to something that they like, because they hate what it currently is."
    mHdgPlU.jpg?1
  • Options
    blueturtleotterblueturtleotter Posts: 867 Member
    edited May 2016
    Sigzy05 wrote: »
    mirta000 wrote: »

    Well it does mean *something*. Generally people aren't 'negative' for the sake of it-they often have articulated very clear reasons why they feel disappointed in the hope the situation will improve for how they enjoy the product.

    I really dislike the assumption that feedback that isn't praise equals negativity.

    People who didn't care about the game wouldn't bother. They would drop the game and be unconcerned about the future of the game. The passion this community (whether from those who like TS4 to those who don't and everyone in between!) shows towards The Sims means that it's important to a great many people. That should be appreciated and cherished. That sort of passion and commitment is very valuable and very difficult to recapture if it's lost.

    the only problem is that every single reiteration of The Sims is so different that it attracted a completely different audience to each. And that audience does not necessarily like other games in the series.

    Person A liked The sims 1 to 4
    Person B likes The Sims 2 only
    Person C likes The Sims 3 only
    Person D likes The Sims 1 to 3
    Person E likes The sims 4
    Person F likes The Sims 4 and The Sims 2

    The problem arises when people B to D want to change The Sims 4 to something that they like, because they hate what it currently is. "Well how is that a problem?" you may say. It's a problem when what B to D dislikes is what E and F specifically like. So yes, B to D are very passionate in hating, but at the same time if B to D was listened to E and F will be sitting here hating. The Sims is such a broad franchise that it can't possibly satisfy everyone.

    That sounds really selfish, just sayin'.

    It's not selfish to say that it's not possible to have a Sims game that covers everyone's desires in the unavoidable circumstances that some of what we desire is contradictory and when the game has to actually finish being created so it can be sold. How do you reconcile, for example, preferences for two very different art styles? Nobody here is saying that things shouldn't be added; they're saying that things shouldn't be removed in Sims Version X from players set 1 who have bought the game already in order to cater to player set 2 who don't like Sims Version X now. It's like, if Sims 3 had been changed to close the world off in sections, or to remove an element of story progression completely - both of which could have been done in the interest of rotational play and stability - instead of those things being done in next Sims game.

    Or rather, maybe it is selfish, but it's not like you need food because you're starving and I have extra but am refusing to give it to you. And it's a selfish that I suspect everyone here shares. We all want our personal toys. We're happy for others to have their toys too, but not if it means breaking ours.

    I disagree that it is not possible to have a game that can cover most of the playerbase's desires. It can be done.

    Options in the game's settings are the way to go.

    Rotational play could be possible in an open world which has story progression. You'd simply have a rotational play option in the game settings that would turn off ageing and story progression.

    I believe that the majority of players would like an open world in 4 if it had none of the problems of the predecessor. Honestly, who thinks it is acceptable that we cannot control or even leave instructions for our played sims who are off the currently loaded lot? The best way to eliminate this, is an open world.

    There could also be options to turn off specific life-states and the more quirky NPCs like the Tragic Clown.

    I agree with you that the art style will never be able to satisfy everyone, but for most that is not a major problem with The Sims 4.
Sign In or Register to comment.
Return to top