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Are you guys sure that you really want toddlers?

OK before everyone gets excited, I am not trying to pick a fight with anyone, however I am curious to why so many people are still speculating that EP3 might be about toddlers, when it won't be out for months yet and no announcement will be made for a long time either.

The thing is, I see across these forums players saying they will not be happy until toddlers are added like they are some sort of 'given right' in the game. Yet lets look forward, and say toddlers where actually added, would you really enjoy playing with them? I mean, what can you do with toddlers other than teach to walk, talk, potty train and ready books. Ok, they might play with toys, they might be able to play with other toddler and they will make cute pictures but what else?

Will these toddlers be able to get a job? Go on a date? Get married and have kids of their own? Not while they are toddlers of course so aside from being cute, and they would certainly be an improvement from being a baby growing straight into a child, I can't really see what value they would give to a Sims game other compared to other life stages.

Now lets look at weather or not they are considered 'base content' and weather people should pay for them. I don't actually have much to say on that, they have never officially been regarded as base content, only other than they appeared in two previous Sims games. One popular suggestion is that if they ever came back in a 'Generations EP' then they could come for free in a patch. Ok cool, but then what would be the point in a Generations EP if you get toddlers for free anyway? A few interactions, a new town to play in and some clothing? Sounds more like a GP to me?

One of popular suggestion is that pre teens could come in an EP, so you get toddlers for free but to get the pre teens you have to pay for the EP. Sounds good for those who want them but now you have two life stages being made, that is twice the amount of coding to make the animations, twice the amount of testing ad twice the amount of time that will be needed to make such an EP, and why should a never been seen before preteen life stage be used to be a 'pull factor' to get people to buy an EP that would compensate toddlers being given for free?

Am I getting at something here?

Now I have been speaking to a lot of Simmers, there are many who have different opinions, some where disappointed with TS4 for a number of reasons and have long since moved on while others enjoy TS4 and do not even want toddlers in the game, nor do they want a Generations P to be thrown out just to appease people. A lot of players want a strong and stable game and to see other issues to be addressed first. I said this a few times lately but it seems that there are much more important things that need to be dealt with people more content is thrown out. Culling is an issue I see mentioned a lot and if that is an issue, then how would that be improved when you start throwing toddlers into the mix?

A lot of players are concerned about the 'silence' over the situation and there are some very good threads about that, but to be honest, I can't blame the devs to keep quiet on things. At the end of their day if they cannot talk about future content, then that is the way things are going to be. If I was a dev and working on a game, the last thing I would want to see every single time I go online is floods of messages from disgruntled players about content they want while at the same time I am also seeing compliments from happy players.

The way I see it is this, if you don't like a game, don't play it, no one is forcing you to buy any more content for that game. I have been disappointed by games before as well, Tomb Raider 2013 being one big kick in the teeth to me, yet their was a popular following so I just shrugged it off as not being the game from me and I moved on from it, loading up TS3 and all was well again ;)

So my purpose of this thread is not to debate with anyone, but I clearly have a few things I want to say for a while, toddlers are not the be all and end off of The Sims, they are a minor life stage and if you cannot enjoy other aspects of the game, then I don't think you will enjoy the much more with toddlers either. If you are happy with TS4 however, I do apologise for the hate you must have top see every day. I do not play TS4 myself for my own reasons and I have stated my reasons before but I respect other people's opinions as we are all Simmers at the end of the day :smile:

Thanks for reading and if you are going to respond then please do so respectfully and refrain from attacking others if their points of view differ from your.

Happy Simming! :smiley:

Peace
Simbourne
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Comments

  • elanorbretonelanorbreton Posts: 14,110 Member
    Well, personally i do enjoy ts4 to a degree but there are things that need improving. As far as bugs, culling etc, i feel that most of these things will be addressed at some point and therefore the game will improve in that respect.

    I know that toddlers cannot do much, other than toddler stuff, but i feel that they are a great aid for the bonding process. This is the stage i would become attached to my sims and i would enjoy their subsequent progression through the age stages after becoming so fond of them. It would also help my sims to develop their relationships more with the extra life stage. Baby to child is very jarring and makes a big feeling of loss in the game. Similarly, child to adult is too big a leap, cos - let's face it - teens are basically adults in this game.

    To me, the natural progression for a new sims game - which is all about playing with life - would be to add more life stages to it. Each new version should have additional life stages to make aging less jarring and more natural, with less gaps.

    As far as a generations ep is concerned, I would expect this to contain lots of different activities centred around the different age stages of the game rather than adding the new life stages, which should be patched in. Things like family portraits, family gatherings, wedding and anniversary parties, funeral wakes, camcorder videos, proms, parent and toddler groups, sleepovers, family board games, charades, tag, hide and seek, holiday celebrations, family vacations and lots of new interactions between every age.
  • king_of_simcity7king_of_simcity7 Posts: 25,089 Member
    Thanks for everyone providing fair feedback with your views :smile:

    In fact the feedback is so good, this thread has now been moved to... feedback... ;)
    Simbourne
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  • JoAnne65JoAnne65 Posts: 22,959 Member
    To7m wrote: »
    I had to double check the poster as am actually surprised you wrote this thread...

    I have been in many of a discussion with you and if you still fail to see what toddlers will add to this game for many of us then I'm actually upset you don't seem to have taken in anything that the entire family play thread has said (on which I see you regularly post.

    It's not as easy as 'don't like it, don't play it' (as you very well should know) and if you think toddlers really are a minor stage then you (in my opinion) clearly haven't listened to the feedback given over the last however many months by many of us.

    Sorry, but this thread has annoyed me, more so that its you that has written it. I feel you should know better or that my impressions of you were totally off base.

    I'm actually a little shocked. Lol

    --T

    ETA: although I do agree - toddlers are the tip of the iceberg in problems this game has but adding hem would be the start, for many, to hopefully liking this game.
    I think the OP sometimes likes to play the devil's advocate ;)
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  • pepperjax1230pepperjax1230 Posts: 7,933 Member
    edited February 2016
    Half of me wants toddlers because I think they will be cute and they will take that really awkward moment when babies grow up into children. Then the other part doesn't really care if they ever return because of my bad toddler experiences in TS3 where they would annoy the heck out of me. Then there is a part of me that likes my sim parents to bond with their kids and toddlers are the easiest to bond with when they are little because they aren't in school.
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  • HermaiHermai Posts: 366 Member
    I think he OP's remarks are very interesting, actually. I mean, the toddlers are the thing that people use to complai mostly about the game, but would adding them make a change to everyone who is complaining?

    To me, personally: I don't like babies and toddlers, but this is a life simulation game, and it was kind of expected, as TS2 had introduced them. And the point of having ages, in terms of game design, should also be that different ages have different game play. Toddlers have different gameplay from kids, which are different from teens, and so on. Do you remember the teens in TS2? They had some unique aspects to them like the zits and the sneaking out at night. Teens in TS4 are equal to adults, even in appearence, except they can't woohoo.

    TS4 was poorly designed, in my opinion, from day one. It's gameplay is focused in YA/A stages, and that was not the (whole) point of the The Sims, which had this sandbox aspect. Everything is made out of goals now. The neighbourhoods are pre-made and allow zero customisation. We have less one life stage, and the teens are almost equal to YA (so this limits gameplay even more).

    Everything is limited in this game, even the most basic aspect that made the franchise a masterpiece ten years ago: generational play (culling, argh) and life stages.

    So, getting back to the question, do toddlers change anything? I my view, no, they don't; the game is still limited. But I think people count on that because, by addind toddlers, they feel like the game is not as "Fixed" and limited as it appears, and that other features can be done if the players really want them. People want to trust the company, that's why they are relying so heavily on toddlers.

    As for preteens... I don't get the point. what could preteens do that teens and children would not be able to? For me, they would be useless and a waste of resources. We really need teens that look like teens, not like adults.
  • ArlettaArletta Posts: 8,444 Member
    edited February 2016
    Personally, couldn't give a hoot one way or the other whether we get them or not. I don't think they'll be all that and a bag of chips if we do get them. I didn't particularly enjoy them in either iteration but I didn't skip them either. I sincerely doubt that they'll make the growing up from one age stage to another less jarring. Neither will they fix the problems that the game has (in all likelihood, they'll do entirely the opposite).

    I think though for those who dislike the game but brought it believing that they would be added in later (that are still around), it's a matter of principle. They've had toddlers for two iterations now. They brought it truly on faith that EA would come good and add them in later. Having done that EA now needs to fulfill their end of the deal (even if one wasn't actually made). It's why they brought it after all.

    My personal belief is IF they come back (and yes, it's still if) they'll come as a GP or EP that you'll have to pay for. Whether that comes true or not, time will tell. I do wish people would stop hyping themselves up on it being in the next pack btw, but there we are.
  • gabriella92italygabriella92italy Posts: 607 Member
    OK before everyone gets excited, I am not trying to pick a fight with anyone, however I am curious to why so many people are still speculating that EP3 might be about toddlers, when it won't be out for months yet and no announcement will be made for a long time either.

    The thing is, I see across these forums players saying they will not be happy until toddlers are added like they are some sort of 'given right' in the game. Yet lets look forward, and say toddlers where actually added, would you really enjoy playing with them? I mean, what can you do with toddlers other than teach to walk, talk, potty train and ready books. Ok, they might play with toys, they might be able to play with other toddler and they will make cute pictures but what else?

    Will these toddlers be able to get a job? Go on a date? Get married and have kids of their own? Not while they are toddlers of course so aside from being cute, and they would certainly be an improvement from being a baby growing straight into a child, I can't really see what value they would give to a Sims game other compared to other life stages.

    Now lets look at weather or not they are considered 'base content' and weather people should pay for them. I don't actually have much to say on that, they have never officially been regarded as base content, only other than they appeared in two previous Sims games. One popular suggestion is that if they ever came back in a 'Generations EP' then they could come for free in a patch. Ok cool, but then what would be the point in a Generations EP if you get toddlers for free anyway? A few interactions, a new town to play in and some clothing? Sounds more like a GP to me?

    One of popular suggestion is that pre teens could come in an EP, so you get toddlers for free but to get the pre teens you have to pay for the EP. Sounds good for those who want them but now you have two life stages being made, that is twice the amount of coding to make the animations, twice the amount of testing ad twice the amount of time that will be needed to make such an EP, and why should a never been seen before preteen life stage be used to be a 'pull factor' to get people to buy an EP that would compensate toddlers being given for free?

    Am I getting at something here?

    Now I have been speaking to a lot of Simmers, there are many who have different opinions, some where disappointed with TS4 for a number of reasons and have long since moved on while others enjoy TS4 and do not even want toddlers in the game, nor do they want a Generations P to be thrown out just to appease people. A lot of players want a strong and stable game and to see other issues to be addressed first. I said this a few times lately but it seems that there are much more important things that need to be dealt with people more content is thrown out. Culling is an issue I see mentioned a lot and if that is an issue, then how would that be improved when you start throwing toddlers into the mix?

    A lot of players are concerned about the 'silence' over the situation and there are some very good threads about that, but to be honest, I can't blame the devs to keep quiet on things. At the end of their day if they cannot talk about future content, then that is the way things are going to be. If I was a dev and working on a game, the last thing I would want to see every single time I go online is floods of messages from disgruntled players about content they want while at the same time I am also seeing compliments from happy players.

    The way I see it is this, if you don't like a game, don't play it, no one is forcing you to buy any more content for that game. I have been disappointed by games before as well, Tomb Raider 2013 being one big kick in the teeth to me, yet their was a popular following so I just shrugged it off as not being the game from me and I moved on from it, loading up TS3 and all was well again ;)

    So my purpose of this thread is not to debate with anyone, but I clearly have a few things I want to say for a while, toddlers are not the be all and end off of The Sims, they are a minor life stage and if you cannot enjoy other aspects of the game, then I don't think you will enjoy the much more with toddlers either. If you are happy with TS4 however, I do apologise for the hate you must have top see every day. I do not play TS4 myself for my own reasons and I have stated my reasons before but I respect other people's opinions as we are all Simmers at the end of the day :smile:

    Thanks for reading and if you are going to respond then please do so respectfully and refrain from attacking others if their points of view differ from your.

    Happy Simming! :smiley:

    Peace

    (I didn't read your post - I hope you will forgive me for that - and I have to say that I never played TS3).
    Yesss. I want toddlers. Why? Because it's a fundamental "step" in real life......
  • king_of_simcity7king_of_simcity7 Posts: 25,089 Member
    To7m wrote: »
    I had to double check the poster as am actually surprised you wrote this thread...

    I have been in many of a discussion with you and if you still fail to see what toddlers will add to this game for many of us then I'm actually upset you don't seem to have taken in anything that the entire family play thread has said (on which I see you regularly post.

    It's not as easy as 'don't like it, don't play it' (as you very well should know) and if you think toddlers really are a minor stage then you (in my opinion) clearly haven't listened to the feedback given over the last however many months by many of us.

    Sorry, but this thread has annoyed me, more so that its you that has written it. I feel you should know better or that my impressions of you were totally off base.

    I'm actually a little shocked. Lol

    --T

    ETA: although I do agree - toddlers are the tip of the iceberg in problems this game has but adding hem would be the start, for many, to hopefully liking this game.

    I apologise if I annoyed you and I am aware of why players want toddlers in the game but I feel that there needs to be other things addressed before they start adding more content. If players want toddlers just because they want them then that is understandable but my concern is would they really enhance the game beyond being another life stage.

    I can pretty much imagine that seeing a baby grow straight into a child removes the natural progression through those stages, and I certainly wouldn't want that in my game even though I am not an avid 'toddlerite' how ever there are other things players dislike about TS4 from the culling right down to increased focus on goals and RPG elements. Adding toddlers into the game would not remove the features and I actually think that even if TS4 did come with toddlers, I still think the other issues will still hold players back so my question is, do players really want toddlers in TS4? Considering that it may well be TS4 which is the issue, rather tan simply the lack of toddlers.

    Hope that makes sense?
    Simbourne
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  • Sim_LucentSim_Lucent Posts: 689 Member
    To7m wrote: »
    I'm actually upset you don't seem to have taken in anything that the entire family play thread has said (on which I see you regularly post.

    OP is notorious for stirring the pot, and my only guess as to why they are in the 'family play' thread is because it's the one place where there's basically no drama.

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • king_of_simcity7king_of_simcity7 Posts: 25,089 Member
    Sim_Lucent wrote: »
    To7m wrote: »
    I'm actually upset you don't seem to have taken in anything that the entire family play thread has said (on which I see you regularly post.

    OP is notorious for stirring the pot, and my only guess as to why they are in the 'family play' thread is because it's the one place where there's basically no drama.

    [img]http://🤔🤔🤔🤔.com/wp-content/uploads/GIF/2014/03/Excuse-me-GIF.gif?gs=a[/img]

    I actually get along with a lot of Simmers on this forum. I post in the family play thread as I like the Simmers who also post in there and I enjoy seeing their pictures. I agree with most things they talk about and if I do not agree with something, I keep my opinions myself. I also post a lot in the TS3 GD and CAW sections a lot and again, I like most of the Simmer and agree with them. If I don't agree with someone, I simply respect their opinions and post elsewhere.
    Simbourne
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  • king_of_simcity7king_of_simcity7 Posts: 25,089 Member
    I'm trying to figure out how you're attempting to have a serious debate on this topic while asking if toddlers will be able to get jobs, marry or have kids? Like, you can't honestly be serious?

    That was a minor joke...

    Simbourne
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  • king_of_simcity7king_of_simcity7 Posts: 25,089 Member
    Sim_Lucent wrote: »
    Sim_Lucent wrote: »
    To7m wrote: »
    I'm actually upset you don't seem to have taken in anything that the entire family play thread has said (on which I see you regularly post.

    OP is notorious for stirring the pot, and my only guess as to why they are in the 'family play' thread is because it's the one place where there's basically no drama.

    [img]http://🤔🤔🤔🤔.com/wp-content/uploads/GIF/2014/03/Excuse-me-GIF.gif?gs=a[/img]

    I actually get along with a lot of Simmers on this forum. I post in the family play thread as I like the Simmers who also post in there and I enjoy seeing their pictures. I agree with most things they talk about and if I do not agree with something, I keep my opinions myself. I also post a lot in the TS3 GD and CAW sections a lot and again, I like most of the Simmer and agree with them. If I don't agree with someone, I simply respect their opinions and post elsewhere.

    You're forever creating threads and usually end them with --'oh, please discuss nicely!' Because you know everything you bring up is controversial in some way. You love to stir the pot -- I can skim through half of your discussion topics in your profile and pick out exactly where you like to bring up these types of conversations.

    But don't mind me. Just 'speaking up, speaking out and simming on!'

    What threads are these exactly? :|
    Simbourne
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  • king_of_simcity7king_of_simcity7 Posts: 25,089 Member
    Sim_Lucent wrote: »
    Let's see..

    http://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/859735/when-will-young-adults-actually-be-yas-and-not-big-kids-as-they-are-sold-as-now#latest
    - A thread started about GT, stating you want to see less 'outright' partying and more just socializing -- when explained your ideas can come to fruition with the GT EP, it was blown off with a 'well I can do that with TS3'. Also wanted to complain about bush woohoo in a game you don't even own or have ever played.. again. So why start the thread?

    http://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/860137/will-neighbourhood-editing-ever-be-an-option/p1
    - A thread starting and stating within it, the 'TS4 players get nothing.' And then further derogatory comments regarding the development team, pretty much every comment after.

    http://forums.thesims.com/en_US/discussion/864035/was-the-sims-a-victim-of-its-own-success/p1
    - A thread started about the expectations of players now compared to what we have come from (since TS1) - even though in the previous thread, you were just slamming the development team for not adding in specific features.

    These are just a few of the ones I have access to.. it would seem they cut off after a specific date.

    By all means -- despite not having ever even tried the game, give it a good bash. Try to set everyone against one another by starting these topics by saying one thing during this discussion, and then something different during another.. but at least own up to it.

    Have you got anything better to do that to derail my thread and try and dig through my old threads to catch me out? I have reported you BTW and I will not respond to you any longer.
    Simbourne
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  • simmer_jaysimmer_jay Posts: 2,342 Member
    Haven't read the entire thread but

    Um yes. I want toddlers. Clearly.
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