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Open world=Lag

Comments

  • Shadoza2Shadoza2 Posts: 1,579 Member
    AiHaou wrote: »
    The open world and create a style is part of the reason why sims 3 lagged so much.

    In TS3, the open world does not render all at once, each world is divided into Chunks and only a chunk of it will render during game play, otherwise the distance views as blurry (without details). If your sim crosses a chunk boundary, the game will render the new chunk and leave the other chunk to bleed details from the graphic memory. I believe the size of the chunk can be adjusted by game settings. If the distance you can see details is lowered, the game will render faster.
  • JimilJimil Posts: 4,443 Member
    CASt loads 15 mins for you? I feel sorry that youhave a terrible computer. OP is scared to confront us about the subject :\
  • Shadoza2Shadoza2 Posts: 1,579 Member
    Jimil wrote: »
    CASt loads 15 mins for you? I feel sorry that youhave a terrible computer. OP is scared to confront us about the subject :\

    I think having CC and some Mods loaded might add to the load time of CaSt.
  • plopppoplopppo Posts: 5,031 Member
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    AiHaou wrote: »
    The open world and create a style is part of the reason why sims 3 lagged so much.

    In TS3, the open world does not render all at once, each world is divided into Chunks and only a chunk of it will render during game play, otherwise the distance views as blurry (without details). If your sim crosses a chunk boundary, the game will render the new chunk and leave the other chunk to bleed details from the graphic memory. I believe the size of the chunk can be adjusted by game settings. If the distance you can see details is lowered, the game will render faster.

    How does that work?

    Surely TS3 is rendering based on camera view distance and LOD is done on-the-fly, based on the movement of the camera and it's view distance - it's surely dynamic?
  • Sc3niXSc3niX Posts: 2,468 Member
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    Jimil wrote: »
    CASt loads 15 mins for you? I feel sorry that youhave a terrible computer. OP is scared to confront us about the subject :\

    I think having CC and some Mods loaded might add to the load time of CaSt.

    It could yes, however i have over 10 gigs of CC on my game and CASt still loads instantly.
  • Shadoza2Shadoza2 Posts: 1,579 Member
    plopppo wrote: »
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    AiHaou wrote: »
    The open world and create a style is part of the reason why sims 3 lagged so much.

    In TS3, the open world does not render all at once, each world is divided into Chunks and only a chunk of it will render during game play, otherwise the distance views as blurry (without details). If your sim crosses a chunk boundary, the game will render the new chunk and leave the other chunk to bleed details from the graphic memory. I believe the size of the chunk can be adjusted by game settings. If the distance you can see details is lowered, the game will render faster.

    How does that work?

    Surely TS3 is rendering based on camera view distance and LOD is done on-the-fly, based on the movement of the camera and it's view distance - it's surely dynamic?

    Forgive, had to fly to a different site for work and my communication crashed in the process. The chunk boundaries are not actually moved...just the distance one can see details.

    When working in CaW one can see where the chunk boundaries are located: bluish-white grid across the map.) When creating a world, users of CaW are advised not to place lots on boundary lines as it becomes awkward in-game because some items on the lot will be detailed others will remained blurred. This becomes a problem when in the kitchen of a sim house and the frontroom (living room for some) is blurred in details.

    There is a LoD button in the settings of the game that, when reduced, lowers the area rendered at one time.

    What I am suggesting is that the system, whether you are inside a building or outside, will render one chuck rather than the entire map.
  • plopppoplopppo Posts: 5,031 Member
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    plopppo wrote: »
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    AiHaou wrote: »
    The open world and create a style is part of the reason why sims 3 lagged so much.

    In TS3, the open world does not render all at once, each world is divided into Chunks and only a chunk of it will render during game play, otherwise the distance views as blurry (without details). If your sim crosses a chunk boundary, the game will render the new chunk and leave the other chunk to bleed details from the graphic memory. I believe the size of the chunk can be adjusted by game settings. If the distance you can see details is lowered, the game will render faster.

    How does that work?

    Surely TS3 is rendering based on camera view distance and LOD is done on-the-fly, based on the movement of the camera and it's view distance - it's surely dynamic?

    Forgive, had to fly to a different site for work and my communication crashed in the process. The chunk boundaries are not actually moved...just the distance one can see details.

    When working in CaW one can see where the chunk boundaries are located: bluish-white grid across the map.) When creating a world, users of CaW are advised not to place lots on boundary lines as it becomes awkward in-game because some items on the lot will be detailed others will remained blurred. This becomes a problem when in the kitchen of a sim house and the frontroom (living room for some) is blurred in details.

    There is a LoD button in the settings of the game that, when reduced, lowers the area rendered at one time.

    What I am suggesting is that the system, whether you are inside a building or outside, will render one chuck rather than the entire map.

    Ah.

    These 'chunk boundaries' you mention - are these not just for referencing the 'High Detail Lots' or are they completely separate to that? TS3 gives an option for High Detail Lots - but this is merely extending the higher LOD.

    I don't use CAW.
  • plopppoplopppo Posts: 5,031 Member
    300px-CAW-ChunkBoundaries.jpg
    ^ Ah, this is what you are referring to.
    Part of a map, with Chunk Boundaries visible as a grid on the landscape.
    Here's one of the more technical parts of the CAW mechanics. Each map is divided up into pieces - called chunks - of 256x256 tiles. Basically, chunks allow your computer to load part of a world's details instead of the whole thing, and makes the game run better.

    To view chunk boundaries: View > Show Chunk Boundaries.

    All you really need to worry about with chunk boundaries is that you use no more than 8 terrain paints per chunk. You can have as many as you want for your whole world, but don't mix and match them too much within a single chunk, to improve performance. And of course, fewer is better - if you can get away with 3 or 4 rather than 8, do so!
  • FelicityFelicity Posts: 4,665 Member
    edited December 2014
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    Jimil wrote: »
    CASt loads 15 mins for you? I feel sorry that youhave a terrible computer. OP is scared to confront us about the subject :\

    I think having CC and some Mods loaded might add to the load time of CaSt.

    I have a ton of CC patterns and CASt takes maybe, when doing the initial pattern load, 15 seconds. And the patterns stay loaded for the entire time I'm in build/buy mode. Now clothing... I use Master Controller set to only show one version of each outfit which immensely speeds up the loading, but since I own the store, it can still take awhile to load up all the outfits especially for adult females -- but we're still talking under 30 seconds.

    My computer is fairly old, too. It has a first generation i7 in it, overclocked to 2.95ghz (one of these days I'll upgrade, but not today).

    I do use NRaas mods though to bug fix. Master Controller, Overwatch, Error Trap, Debug Enabler. Sims 3 would be unplayble without those. While I feel that Maxis/EA should have fixed those bugs, they didn't and they won't so I choose to use third-party fixes.
  • Shadoza2Shadoza2 Posts: 1,579 Member
    plopppo wrote: »
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    plopppo wrote: »
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    AiHaou wrote: »
    The open world and create a style is part of the reason why sims 3 lagged so much.

    In TS3, the open world does not render all at once, each world is divided into Chunks and only a chunk of it will render during game play, otherwise the distance views as blurry (without details). If your sim crosses a chunk boundary, the game will render the new chunk and leave the other chunk to bleed details from the graphic memory. I believe the size of the chunk can be adjusted by game settings. If the distance you can see details is lowered, the game will render faster.

    How does that work?

    Surely TS3 is rendering based on camera view distance and LOD is done on-the-fly, based on the movement of the camera and it's view distance - it's surely dynamic?

    Forgive, had to fly to a different site for work and my communication crashed in the process. The chunk boundaries are not actually moved...just the distance one can see details.

    When working in CaW one can see where the chunk boundaries are located: bluish-white grid across the map.) When creating a world, users of CaW are advised not to place lots on boundary lines as it becomes awkward in-game because some items on the lot will be detailed others will remained blurred. This becomes a problem when in the kitchen of a sim house and the frontroom (living room for some) is blurred in details.

    There is a LoD button in the settings of the game that, when reduced, lowers the area rendered at one time.

    What I am suggesting is that the system, whether you are inside a building or outside, will render one chuck rather than the entire map.

    Ah.

    These 'chunk boundaries' you mention - are these not just for referencing the 'High Detail Lots' or are they completely separate to that? TS3 gives an option for High Detail Lots - but this is merely extending the higher LOD.

    I don't use CAW.

    The chunk boundaries are not visible in game. But in using CaW, I became aware of them and how the world map is rendered. The chunk boundaries are grids (like those you see in build mode but larger) that have a specific number of grid squares within. (The maps I have 8 chunks by 8 chunks.) Everything within that chunk of grids will be visible with details (depending on settings). If my sim moves across the (unseen) boundary in game, the system will start rendering details for the next chunk. The details for the chunk just left will be visible to a certain distance but will bleed out as the sim progresses deeper into the new chunk. The chunk boundaries have no real connection with lots as one can place a lot directly on the boundary...it just not favorable to do so.
  • plopppoplopppo Posts: 5,031 Member
    I'm suspicious that it is merely a terrain tiling system. The article mentions 8 terrain paints per chunk - if it were a single terrain then it would be 8 per world; however, you can use this to load the world (like how you mention) - it's feasible to both terrain tile and use the same system to help control LOD.
  • Shadoza2Shadoza2 Posts: 1,579 Member
    plopppo wrote: »
    I'm suspicious that it is merely a terrain tiling system. The article mentions 8 terrain paints per chunk - if it were a single terrain then it would be 8 per world; however, you can use this to load the world (like how you mention) - it's feasible to both terrain tile and use the same system to help control LOD.

    I believe so.
    The point was trying (and may have failed) is that the entire open world does not render at once...so having an open world does not necessarily slow a game down.
  • king_of_simcity7king_of_simcity7 Posts: 24,970 Member
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    Jimil wrote: »
    CASt loads 15 mins for you? I feel sorry that youhave a terrible computer. OP is scared to confront us about the subject :\

    I think having CC and some Mods loaded might add to the load time of CaSt.

    I loads in a few seconds for me
    Simbourne
    screenshot_original.jpg
  • Shadoza2Shadoza2 Posts: 1,579 Member
    plopppo wrote: »
    300px-CAW-ChunkBoundaries.jpg
    ^ Ah, this is what you are referring to.
    Part of a map, with Chunk Boundaries visible as a grid on the landscape.
    Here's one of the more technical parts of the CAW mechanics. Each map is divided up into pieces - called chunks - of 256x256 tiles. Basically, chunks allow your computer to load part of a world's details instead of the whole thing, and makes the game run better.

    To view chunk boundaries: View > Show Chunk Boundaries.

    All you really need to worry about with chunk boundaries is that you use no more than 8 terrain paints per chunk. You can have as many as you want for your whole world, but don't mix and match them too much within a single chunk, to improve performance. And of course, fewer is better - if you can get away with 3 or 4 rather than 8, do so!

    yep...chunk boundaries.
  • Shadoza2Shadoza2 Posts: 1,579 Member
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    plopppo wrote: »
    300px-CAW-ChunkBoundaries.jpg
    ^ Ah, this is what you are referring to.
    Part of a map, with Chunk Boundaries visible as a grid on the landscape.
    Here's one of the more technical parts of the CAW mechanics. Each map is divided up into pieces - called chunks - of 256x256 tiles. Basically, chunks allow your computer to load part of a world's details instead of the whole thing, and makes the game run better.

    To view chunk boundaries: View > Show Chunk Boundaries.

    All you really need to worry about with chunk boundaries is that you use no more than 8 terrain paints per chunk. You can have as many as you want for your whole world, but don't mix and match them too much within a single chunk, to improve performance. And of course, fewer is better - if you can get away with 3 or 4 rather than 8, do so!

    yep...chunk boundaries.

    There are a few more worries about chunk boundaries then the terrain paints however.
    • Avoid placing lots across boundaries (this can cause part of your house to be detailed and part to be blurred.)
    • Avoid using boundaries as a guild for placing roads (this can cause stuttering of the cars when your following them.)
    • Keep tree types to a couple inside each boundary as too many different types can increase rendering time (tree of the same time can be grouped so they are considered one item instead of several items.

    Just thought I would share.
  • plopppoplopppo Posts: 5,031 Member
    And to think they decoupled the renderer for TS4 - which would (amongst other things) negate spiking in an open world (or closed world, etc) and then they made TS4 load sub-areas, that sub-load individual lots - no LOD required - it doesn't even really need LOD.

    You couldn't make that up if you tried.

    Mickey Mouse, that's what I think - 2 sandwiches short of a sausage.
  • KrayzieStrykerKrayzieStryker Posts: 2,621 Member
    Sims 4 = Boring
  • Plumbobmad3Plumbobmad3 Posts: 153 Member
    Sims 4 = Boring

    I actually agree with your opinion. I tried playing more than an hour yesterday but there's not much to do right now. Maybe when they expand the game further with more EP's then perhaps it will actually hold my interest. But for now I'm simming with TS2 and Urbz, plenty to do there.
    "I really ought to do something! ... though I am already in my pyjamas."

    spider.gif

  • FairyLights1FairyLights1 Posts: 759 Member
    edited December 2014
    I never noticed the open world giving me lag, or create a style for that matter, what caused the lag was custom content and overpopulated worlds..

    In my custom made worlds, with very little sims in them, it was (is) smooth.

    EA worlds, while neat, are busy and crowded and will slow things down a lot.

    I've always saved like 10 Sunset Valleys, or Moonlight falls etc.. to avoide piling every family I have into one saved town.
  • KrayzieStrykerKrayzieStryker Posts: 2,621 Member
    edited December 2014
    Sims 4 = Boring

    I actually agree with your opinion. I tried playing more than an hour yesterday but there's not much to do right now. Maybe when they expand the game further with more EP's then perhaps it will actually hold my interest. But for now I'm simming with TS2 and Urbz, plenty to do there.

    Yeah i stick with Sims 2, Sims 3 too.

    I never had any lags problems with any Sims Games but the Sims 4 is the first Sims Game i can't really play because of boredom. I have reached my Career Goal and after building my Dream Home and after that nothing for me to do. No Town Editor, nothing really to play life, ain't fun at all.
    Boring 2 Neighbourhoods with only "Bars" and "Clubs".
    Needless loading btw....
    And so on.
    Sims 3 best and my fav
    Sims 2 i still love it
    Sims 1 legend
    Sims 4 well boring for me now

    End of rent
    Edit typo
  • Jessa_DakkarJessa_Dakkar Posts: 9,736 Member
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    plopppo wrote: »
    300px-CAW-ChunkBoundaries.jpg
    ^ Ah, this is what you are referring to.
    Part of a map, with Chunk Boundaries visible as a grid on the landscape.
    Here's one of the more technical parts of the CAW mechanics. Each map is divided up into pieces - called chunks - of 256x256 tiles. Basically, chunks allow your computer to load part of a world's details instead of the whole thing, and makes the game run better.

    To view chunk boundaries: View > Show Chunk Boundaries.

    All you really need to worry about with chunk boundaries is that you use no more than 8 terrain paints per chunk. You can have as many as you want for your whole world, but don't mix and match them too much within a single chunk, to improve performance. And of course, fewer is better - if you can get away with 3 or 4 rather than 8, do so!

    yep...chunk boundaries.

    There are a few more worries about chunk boundaries then the terrain paints however.
    • Avoid placing lots across boundaries (this can cause part of your house to be detailed and part to be blurred.)
    • Avoid using boundaries as a guild for placing roads (this can cause stuttering of the cars when your following them.)
    • Keep tree types to a couple inside each boundary as too many different types can increase rendering time (tree of the same time can be grouped so they are considered one item instead of several items.

    Just thought I would share.

    Thank you so much for this! I am still working on my first world and I did not know some of this. I will keep this in mind next time I am in CAW and make sure my lots and roads don't cross/follow boundaries. I also wasn't aware what the grouping of trees did, very helpful. Thanks again!!


  • 06Bon0606Bon06 Posts: 11,613 Member
    Jimil wrote: »
    CASt loads 15 mins for you? I feel sorry that youhave a terrible computer. OP is scared to confront us about the subject :\
    15 min!> My pc has the worst time running Sims but my game doesn't even take 10min to load, CAS takes a few seconds.
  • ArchieonicArchieonic Posts: 1,039 Member
    I never noticed the open world giving me lag, or create a style for that matter, what caused the lag was custom content and overpopulated worlds..

    In my custom made worlds, with very little sims in them, it was (is) smooth.

    EA worlds, while neat, are busy and crowded and will slow things down a lot.

    I've always saved like 10 Sunset Valleys, or Moonlight falls etc.. to avoide piling every family I have into one saved town.
    This. While I am able to play on a custom world (Beach City, it is EPIC) with 196 lots, populated with 96 residents, 122 service sims (lots of community lots specially with several service items such as bars), 10-20 homeless sims and 21 tourists relatively smooth (it is a huge world, leaves any of EA-made worlds in the dust), it does sometime get laggy specially during special occasions or holidays. I do have a custom world I made which is a relatively small island with 45 lots in it, I sometimes make my household travel there, flag the world as a regular world and not a vacation one, and stay there for a bit to enjoy the ultimate smooth gameplay.
  • Shadoza2Shadoza2 Posts: 1,579 Member
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    Shadoza2 wrote: »
    plopppo wrote: »
    300px-CAW-ChunkBoundaries.jpg
    ^ Ah, this is what you are referring to.
    Part of a map, with Chunk Boundaries visible as a grid on the landscape.
    Here's one of the more technical parts of the CAW mechanics. Each map is divided up into pieces - called chunks - of 256x256 tiles. Basically, chunks allow your computer to load part of a world's details instead of the whole thing, and makes the game run better.

    To view chunk boundaries: View > Show Chunk Boundaries.

    All you really need to worry about with chunk boundaries is that you use no more than 8 terrain paints per chunk. You can have as many as you want for your whole world, but don't mix and match them too much within a single chunk, to improve performance. And of course, fewer is better - if you can get away with 3 or 4 rather than 8, do so!

    yep...chunk boundaries.

    There are a few more worries about chunk boundaries then the terrain paints however.
    • Avoid placing lots across boundaries (this can cause part of your house to be detailed and part to be blurred.)
    • Avoid using boundaries as a guild for placing roads (this can cause stuttering of the cars when your following them.)
    • Keep tree types to a couple inside each boundary as too many different types can increase rendering time (tree of the same time can be grouped so they are considered one item instead of several items.

    Just thought I would share.

    Thank you so much for this! I am still working on my first world and I did not know some of this. I will keep this in mind next time I am in CAW and make sure my lots and roads don't cross/follow boundaries. I also wasn't aware what the grouping of trees did, very helpful. Thanks again!!

    Roads can cross the boundaries. I am saying they should not be aligned with the boundary lines so the boundary runs down the middle of the road.
  • NoahBangsNoahBangs Posts: 91 Member
    edited December 2015
    The open world and create a style is part of the reason why sims 3 lagged so much.

    At least its better than the c--r-a---p EA has right now.

    Swear encryption was used here.
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