I am not sure that EA actually did any mistakes by aiming TS4 almost completely at new 12 to 15 yrs old simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them because we don't know the sales numbers and maybe I would even have liked TS4 myself if I hadn't played the previous games too.
For me to see EA wanted to focus much more on SPs this time which must be because they had sold extremely well for the earlier games since they were introduced midway in the TS2 days. They are very fast and cheap to make because they don't require much programming and therefore can be made by much smaller teams. So if they get high sales numbers then they must be more profitable for EA than the big EPs are. The high sales numbers for stuff items and SPs have also showed EA that even the basegame, the GPs and the EPs can get high sales numbers too even if they contain less new gameplay (and maybe more stuff) than earlier. So EA's choices were logical - especially if EA knows that almost all sales are by or for 12 to 15 yrs old teens. Therefore I can't see TS4 as any mistake (even though it isn't a game for me) if sales numbers really are as high as I suspect them to be.
Ridiculous,
Why? Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?
I don't. But almost all young teens seem to at least know the games (and especially if they are girls). So I wouldn't actually be surprised if EA should tell us that more than 95% of the Sims games are sold to or for 12 to 15 yrs olds.
No, I also think that the target demographic is the same as it has been since TS1. But in those days EA hadn't even expected the basegame to sell as well as many other games did because it was only an experiment and a little spinoff game from the SimCity series. But it sold so well that EA suddenly had to release EPs too. I also remember how all the teen girls discussed the Sims cartridges in the stores when I visited the same stores to buy other games. Sometimes they had their mum with them and she seemed to be only interested because her daughter was.
This continued in the Sims 2 days where I also met many young girls in the game stores and especially when a new EP just had been released. But EA still seemed to believe that only big EPs with a lot of new gameplay would sell.
Then just before Christmas in 2005 Holiday Party suddenly was released as the very first SP. EA obviously only had expected it to sell a little just before Christmas because it wasn't even copyprotected. But it sold so extremely well that EA then released Family Fun Stuff just before Easter in 2006 - still without copy protection though. But also this SP sold (for EA) surprisingly well. So after this EA began to release SPs regularly - and from that time always with copy protection.
So EA learned from the sales numbers that stuff apparently sold as well as gameplay. This let to the Sims 3 store and it clearly also must be the main reason why TS4 was made the way it is because EA included less gameplay already in the basegame and has released SPs even more often then ever before. Also instead of releasing 2 big EPs each year EA now has replaced half of those EPs with smaller GPs to be able to move more developers to all the SP teams. (EA now switches between GPs and EPs and in average releases either a GP or an EP every 5 months - but at the same time releases about 5 SPs each year.) It also seems to me like EA now puts less gameplay (and maybe more stuff?) into even the EPs?
Of course the Sims is popular with teen girls..they probably do make up the largest demographic these days.
Doesn't mean they made the game specifcally for them, or market specifically to them.
That's not even the part that I find the most absurd....It's this bit here that's completely off the wall.
simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them
It's your clever way of saying anyone who likes this game just doesn't know any better.
Insulting.
No, that may be your opinion - but certainly not mine because we all have different interests and I actually don't think that I ever has met a person with exactly the same interests as I have
When I remember the visitors in the game stores even years ago it is also because I visited those stores about twice a week to look for new games. But I am quite sure that most people will see that is something strange to do too
I am not sure that EA actually did any mistakes by aiming TS4 almost completely at new 12 to 15 yrs old simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them because we don't know the sales numbers and maybe I would even have liked TS4 myself if I hadn't played the previous games too.
For me to see EA wanted to focus much more on SPs this time which must be because they had sold extremely well for the earlier games since they were introduced midway in the TS2 days. They are very fast and cheap to make because they don't require much programming and therefore can be made by much smaller teams. So if they get high sales numbers then they must be more profitable for EA than the big EPs are. The high sales numbers for stuff items and SPs have also showed EA that even the basegame, the GPs and the EPs can get high sales numbers too even if they contain less new gameplay (and maybe more stuff) than earlier. So EA's choices were logical - especially if EA knows that almost all sales are by or for 12 to 15 yrs old teens. Therefore I can't see TS4 as any mistake (even though it isn't a game for me) if sales numbers really are as high as I suspect them to be.
Ridiculous,
Why? Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?
I don't. But almost all young teens seem to at least know the games (and especially if they are girls). So I wouldn't actually be surprised if EA should tell us that more than 95% of the Sims games are sold to or for 12 to 15 yrs olds.
Most of the YouTubers that I watch are 17+ There's plenty of adults outside the forums that play The Sims.
The difference between 17+ simmers and the 12 to 15 yrs olds is that 12 to 15 yrs olds have many more interests because they are so young and mainly just want to try everything before they maybe later can choose what their main interests should be. So they buy the games or tell their parents that they want them as presents for their birthday or Christmas. But even so they usually only play them quite shortly because they have so many other interests too. Therefore they are very rare guests in the forums and on YouTube. But for EA they are still the most important customers because they are much more likely to get the games than older simmers usually are.
Ahh..now you're changing tactics. Your original question was 'Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?' And I responded to that. There are plenty outside of the forums that are adults that play Sims.
Maybe. But I don't know any. Do you?
But I have a few time mentioned Sims games as an example to a group of teens - and they sure know the game and are able to give comments about what they like and/or dislike about some of the newest Sims games
I was one between 2009-2013, an adult simmer who wasn't active on these forums. You didn't know me back then, you do know me now (so technically yes, you do know one). And I know a 62 year old simmer who has been playing this game since Sims 1, who never showed her 'face' here. She also plays Sims 4.
(I know more by the way, all active on other forums than this one)
I also know simmers on other forums than this one and I know that I can find some on Facebook and Twitter too. But this wasn't what I was talking about. In my own family I only know that my niece played Sims a little when she was a young teen a few years ago. I have also mentioned Sims a couple of times in the adult classes which I taught. Especially I remember a class where I (in a break) used the expression "games (PC) for girls" and a young girl in her early twenties answered whith a question: "Does that exist?" and looked around. She then answered the question herself: "Apart from the Sims?" - which clearly was a game that she didn't play anymore. The other girls in the class had no comments but clearly looked like they agreed with her.
If my adult pupils talk about interesting PC games then you can be very sure that Sims games never are mentioned at all among such games
Cut the crud.
You basically said TS4 was made for juveniles that don't really know what the Sims are about.
If that's how you feel...fine...own it.
Everything else you're on about is drowning in white noise.
White would you think that a young teen who was 13 in 2014 ever played TS3 when he/she only was 9 yrs old in 2009 when TS3 was released? Why should he/she care about open world if he/she didn't ever play TS3?
I am not sure that EA actually did any mistakes by aiming TS4 almost completely at new 12 to 15 yrs old simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them because we don't know the sales numbers and maybe I would even have liked TS4 myself if I hadn't played the previous games too.
For me to see EA wanted to focus much more on SPs this time which must be because they had sold extremely well for the earlier games since they were introduced midway in the TS2 days. They are very fast and cheap to make because they don't require much programming and therefore can be made by much smaller teams. So if they get high sales numbers then they must be more profitable for EA than the big EPs are. The high sales numbers for stuff items and SPs have also showed EA that even the basegame, the GPs and the EPs can get high sales numbers too even if they contain less new gameplay (and maybe more stuff) than earlier. So EA's choices were logical - especially if EA knows that almost all sales are by or for 12 to 15 yrs old teens. Therefore I can't see TS4 as any mistake (even though it isn't a game for me) if sales numbers really are as high as I suspect them to be.
Ridiculous,
Why? Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?
I don't. But almost all young teens seem to at least know the games (and especially if they are girls). So I wouldn't actually be surprised if EA should tell us that more than 95% of the Sims games are sold to or for 12 to 15 yrs olds.
No, I also think that the target demographic is the same as it has been since TS1. But in those days EA hadn't even expected the basegame to sell as well as many other games did because it was only an experiment and a little spinoff game from the SimCity series. But it sold so well that EA suddenly had to release EPs too. I also remember how all the teen girls discussed the Sims cartridges in the stores when I visited the same stores to buy other games. Sometimes they had their mum with them and she seemed to be only interested because her daughter was.
This continued in the Sims 2 days where I also met many young girls in the game stores and especially when a new EP just had been released. But EA still seemed to believe that only big EPs with a lot of new gameplay would sell.
Then just before Christmas in 2005 Holiday Party suddenly was released as the very first SP. EA obviously only had expected it to sell a little just before Christmas because it wasn't even copyprotected. But it sold so extremely well that EA then released Family Fun Stuff just before Easter in 2006 - still without copy protection though. But also this SP sold (for EA) surprisingly well. So after this EA began to release SPs regularly - and from that time always with copy protection.
So EA learned from the sales numbers that stuff apparently sold as well as gameplay. This let to the Sims 3 store and it clearly also must be the main reason why TS4 was made the way it is because EA included less gameplay already in the basegame and has released SPs even more often then ever before. Also instead of releasing 2 big EPs each year EA now has replaced half of those EPs with smaller GPs to be able to move more developers to all the SP teams. (EA now switches between GPs and EPs and in average releases either a GP or an EP every 5 months - but at the same time releases about 5 SPs each year.) It also seems to me like EA now puts less gameplay (and maybe more stuff?) into even the EPs?
Of course the Sims is popular with teen girls..they probably do make up the largest demographic these days.
Doesn't mean they made the game specifcally for them, or market specifically to them.
That's not even the part that I find the most absurd....It's this bit here that's completely off the wall.
simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them
It's your clever way of saying anyone who likes this game just doesn't know any better.
Insulting.
No, that may be your opinion - but certainly not mine because we all have different interests and I actually don't think that I ever has met a person with exactly the same interests as I have
When I remember the visitors in the game stores even years ago it is also because I visited those stores about twice a week to look for new games. But I am quite sure that most people will see that is something strange to do too
I am not sure that EA actually did any mistakes by aiming TS4 almost completely at new 12 to 15 yrs old simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them because we don't know the sales numbers and maybe I would even have liked TS4 myself if I hadn't played the previous games too.
For me to see EA wanted to focus much more on SPs this time which must be because they had sold extremely well for the earlier games since they were introduced midway in the TS2 days. They are very fast and cheap to make because they don't require much programming and therefore can be made by much smaller teams. So if they get high sales numbers then they must be more profitable for EA than the big EPs are. The high sales numbers for stuff items and SPs have also showed EA that even the basegame, the GPs and the EPs can get high sales numbers too even if they contain less new gameplay (and maybe more stuff) than earlier. So EA's choices were logical - especially if EA knows that almost all sales are by or for 12 to 15 yrs old teens. Therefore I can't see TS4 as any mistake (even though it isn't a game for me) if sales numbers really are as high as I suspect them to be.
Ridiculous,
Why? Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?
I don't. But almost all young teens seem to at least know the games (and especially if they are girls). So I wouldn't actually be surprised if EA should tell us that more than 95% of the Sims games are sold to or for 12 to 15 yrs olds.
Most of the YouTubers that I watch are 17+ There's plenty of adults outside the forums that play The Sims.
The difference between 17+ simmers and the 12 to 15 yrs olds is that 12 to 15 yrs olds have many more interests because they are so young and mainly just want to try everything before they maybe later can choose what their main interests should be. So they buy the games or tell their parents that they want them as presents for their birthday or Christmas. But even so they usually only play them quite shortly because they have so many other interests too. Therefore they are very rare guests in the forums and on YouTube. But for EA they are still the most important customers because they are much more likely to get the games than older simmers usually are.
Ahh..now you're changing tactics. Your original question was 'Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?' And I responded to that. There are plenty outside of the forums that are adults that play Sims.
Maybe. But I don't know any. Do you?
But I have a few time mentioned Sims games as an example to a group of teens - and they sure know the game and are able to give comments about what they like and/or dislike about some of the newest Sims games
I was one between 2009-2013, an adult simmer who wasn't active on these forums. You didn't know me back then, you do know me now (so technically yes, you do know one). And I know a 62 year old simmer who has been playing this game since Sims 1, who never showed her 'face' here. She also plays Sims 4.
(I know more by the way, all active on other forums than this one)
I also know simmers on other forums than this one and I know that I can find some on Facebook and Twitter too. But this wasn't what I was talking about. In my own family I only know that my niece played Sims a little when she was a young teen a few years ago. I have also mentioned Sims a couple of times in the adult classes which I taught. Especially I remember a class where I (in a break) used the expression "games (PC) for girls" and a young girl in her early twenties answered whith a question: "Does that exist?" and looked around. She then answered the question herself: "Apart from the Sims?" - which clearly was a game that she didn't play anymore. The other girls in the class had no comments but clearly looked like they agreed with her.
If my adult pupils talk about interesting PC games then you can be very sure that Sims games never are mentioned at all among such games
Cut the crud.
You basically said TS4 was made for juveniles that don't really know what the Sims are about.
If that's how you feel...fine...own it.
Everything else you're on about is drowning in white noise.
White would you think that a young teen who was 13 in 2014 ever played TS3 when he/she only was 9 yrs old in 2009 when TS3 was released? Why should he/she care about open world if he/she didn't ever play TS3?
To be honest not only do I have no idea how to answer that question, I have no idea what we're even talking about at this point.
I am not sure that EA actually did any mistakes by aiming TS4 almost completely at new 12 to 15 yrs old simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them because we don't know the sales numbers and maybe I would even have liked TS4 myself if I hadn't played the previous games too.
For me to see EA wanted to focus much more on SPs this time which must be because they had sold extremely well for the earlier games since they were introduced midway in the TS2 days. They are very fast and cheap to make because they don't require much programming and therefore can be made by much smaller teams. So if they get high sales numbers then they must be more profitable for EA than the big EPs are. The high sales numbers for stuff items and SPs have also showed EA that even the basegame, the GPs and the EPs can get high sales numbers too even if they contain less new gameplay (and maybe more stuff) than earlier. So EA's choices were logical - especially if EA knows that almost all sales are by or for 12 to 15 yrs old teens. Therefore I can't see TS4 as any mistake (even though it isn't a game for me) if sales numbers really are as high as I suspect them to be.
Ridiculous,
Why? Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?
I don't. But almost all young teens seem to at least know the games (and especially if they are girls). So I wouldn't actually be surprised if EA should tell us that more than 95% of the Sims games are sold to or for 12 to 15 yrs olds.
No, I also think that the target demographic is the same as it has been since TS1. But in those days EA hadn't even expected the basegame to sell as well as many other games did because it was only an experiment and a little spinoff game from the SimCity series. But it sold so well that EA suddenly had to release EPs too. I also remember how all the teen girls discussed the Sims cartridges in the stores when I visited the same stores to buy other games. Sometimes they had their mum with them and she seemed to be only interested because her daughter was.
This continued in the Sims 2 days where I also met many young girls in the game stores and especially when a new EP just had been released. But EA still seemed to believe that only big EPs with a lot of new gameplay would sell.
Then just before Christmas in 2005 Holiday Party suddenly was released as the very first SP. EA obviously only had expected it to sell a little just before Christmas because it wasn't even copyprotected. But it sold so extremely well that EA then released Family Fun Stuff just before Easter in 2006 - still without copy protection though. But also this SP sold (for EA) surprisingly well. So after this EA began to release SPs regularly - and from that time always with copy protection.
So EA learned from the sales numbers that stuff apparently sold as well as gameplay. This let to the Sims 3 store and it clearly also must be the main reason why TS4 was made the way it is because EA included less gameplay already in the basegame and has released SPs even more often then ever before. Also instead of releasing 2 big EPs each year EA now has replaced half of those EPs with smaller GPs to be able to move more developers to all the SP teams. (EA now switches between GPs and EPs and in average releases either a GP or an EP every 5 months - but at the same time releases about 5 SPs each year.) It also seems to me like EA now puts less gameplay (and maybe more stuff?) into even the EPs?
Of course the Sims is popular with teen girls..they probably do make up the largest demographic these days.
Doesn't mean they made the game specifcally for them, or market specifically to them.
That's not even the part that I find the most absurd....It's this bit here that's completely off the wall.
simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them
It's your clever way of saying anyone who likes this game just doesn't know any better.
Insulting.
No, that may be your opinion - but certainly not mine because we all have different interests and I actually don't think that I ever has met a person with exactly the same interests as I have
When I remember the visitors in the game stores even years ago it is also because I visited those stores about twice a week to look for new games. But I am quite sure that most people will see that is something strange to do too
I am not sure that EA actually did any mistakes by aiming TS4 almost completely at new 12 to 15 yrs old simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them because we don't know the sales numbers and maybe I would even have liked TS4 myself if I hadn't played the previous games too.
For me to see EA wanted to focus much more on SPs this time which must be because they had sold extremely well for the earlier games since they were introduced midway in the TS2 days. They are very fast and cheap to make because they don't require much programming and therefore can be made by much smaller teams. So if they get high sales numbers then they must be more profitable for EA than the big EPs are. The high sales numbers for stuff items and SPs have also showed EA that even the basegame, the GPs and the EPs can get high sales numbers too even if they contain less new gameplay (and maybe more stuff) than earlier. So EA's choices were logical - especially if EA knows that almost all sales are by or for 12 to 15 yrs old teens. Therefore I can't see TS4 as any mistake (even though it isn't a game for me) if sales numbers really are as high as I suspect them to be.
Ridiculous,
Why? Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?
I don't. But almost all young teens seem to at least know the games (and especially if they are girls). So I wouldn't actually be surprised if EA should tell us that more than 95% of the Sims games are sold to or for 12 to 15 yrs olds.
Most of the YouTubers that I watch are 17+ There's plenty of adults outside the forums that play The Sims.
The difference between 17+ simmers and the 12 to 15 yrs olds is that 12 to 15 yrs olds have many more interests because they are so young and mainly just want to try everything before they maybe later can choose what their main interests should be. So they buy the games or tell their parents that they want them as presents for their birthday or Christmas. But even so they usually only play them quite shortly because they have so many other interests too. Therefore they are very rare guests in the forums and on YouTube. But for EA they are still the most important customers because they are much more likely to get the games than older simmers usually are.
Ahh..now you're changing tactics. Your original question was 'Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?' And I responded to that. There are plenty outside of the forums that are adults that play Sims.
Maybe. But I don't know any. Do you?
But I have a few time mentioned Sims games as an example to a group of teens - and they sure know the game and are able to give comments about what they like and/or dislike about some of the newest Sims games
I was one between 2009-2013, an adult simmer who wasn't active on these forums. You didn't know me back then, you do know me now (so technically yes, you do know one). And I know a 62 year old simmer who has been playing this game since Sims 1, who never showed her 'face' here. She also plays Sims 4.
(I know more by the way, all active on other forums than this one)
I also know simmers on other forums than this one and I know that I can find some on Facebook and Twitter too. But this wasn't what I was talking about. In my own family I only know that my niece played Sims a little when she was a young teen a few years ago. I have also mentioned Sims a couple of times in the adult classes which I taught. Especially I remember a class where I (in a break) used the expression "games (PC) for girls" and a young girl in her early twenties answered whith a question: "Does that exist?" and looked around. She then answered the question herself: "Apart from the Sims?" - which clearly was a game that she didn't play anymore. The other girls in the class had no comments but clearly looked like they agreed with her.
If my adult pupils talk about interesting PC games then you can be very sure that Sims games never are mentioned at all among such games
If you meant 'within my own family and my classroom' you should have said so
I wrote "outside this forum" which I thought made it obvious that just because we can find 200 adults on the internet by searching for simmers from the whole world this doesn't prove that adults play Sims games just as much as the many millions of teens who don't write about all the games they have tried and played
But you actually proved my point anyway by not being able to find adult simmers elsewhere
The problem is Erpe is that it seemed everyone wanted toddlers back in the game and nearly every place was having a geekgasm when they were finally included, which is at odds with your theory about a 95% base group of 12-15yo, that never even experienced toddlers before so wouldn't have cared about them
I am not sure that EA actually did any mistakes by aiming TS4 almost completely at new 12 to 15 yrs old simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them because we don't know the sales numbers and maybe I would even have liked TS4 myself if I hadn't played the previous games too.
For me to see EA wanted to focus much more on SPs this time which must be because they had sold extremely well for the earlier games since they were introduced midway in the TS2 days. They are very fast and cheap to make because they don't require much programming and therefore can be made by much smaller teams. So if they get high sales numbers then they must be more profitable for EA than the big EPs are. The high sales numbers for stuff items and SPs have also showed EA that even the basegame, the GPs and the EPs can get high sales numbers too even if they contain less new gameplay (and maybe more stuff) than earlier. So EA's choices were logical - especially if EA knows that almost all sales are by or for 12 to 15 yrs old teens. Therefore I can't see TS4 as any mistake (even though it isn't a game for me) if sales numbers really are as high as I suspect them to be.
Ridiculous,
Why? Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?
I don't. But almost all young teens seem to at least know the games (and especially if they are girls). So I wouldn't actually be surprised if EA should tell us that more than 95% of the Sims games are sold to or for 12 to 15 yrs olds.
No, I also think that the target demographic is the same as it has been since TS1. But in those days EA hadn't even expected the basegame to sell as well as many other games did because it was only an experiment and a little spinoff game from the SimCity series. But it sold so well that EA suddenly had to release EPs too. I also remember how all the teen girls discussed the Sims cartridges in the stores when I visited the same stores to buy other games. Sometimes they had their mum with them and she seemed to be only interested because her daughter was.
This continued in the Sims 2 days where I also met many young girls in the game stores and especially when a new EP just had been released. But EA still seemed to believe that only big EPs with a lot of new gameplay would sell.
Then just before Christmas in 2005 Holiday Party suddenly was released as the very first SP. EA obviously only had expected it to sell a little just before Christmas because it wasn't even copyprotected. But it sold so extremely well that EA then released Family Fun Stuff just before Easter in 2006 - still without copy protection though. But also this SP sold (for EA) surprisingly well. So after this EA began to release SPs regularly - and from that time always with copy protection.
So EA learned from the sales numbers that stuff apparently sold as well as gameplay. This let to the Sims 3 store and it clearly also must be the main reason why TS4 was made the way it is because EA included less gameplay already in the basegame and has released SPs even more often then ever before. Also instead of releasing 2 big EPs each year EA now has replaced half of those EPs with smaller GPs to be able to move more developers to all the SP teams. (EA now switches between GPs and EPs and in average releases either a GP or an EP every 5 months - but at the same time releases about 5 SPs each year.) It also seems to me like EA now puts less gameplay (and maybe more stuff?) into even the EPs?
Of course the Sims is popular with teen girls..they probably do make up the largest demographic these days.
Doesn't mean they made the game specifcally for them, or market specifically to them.
That's not even the part that I find the most absurd....It's this bit here that's completely off the wall.
simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them
It's your clever way of saying anyone who likes this game just doesn't know any better.
Insulting.
No, that may be your opinion - but certainly not mine because we all have different interests and I actually don't think that I ever has met a person with exactly the same interests as I have
When I remember the visitors in the game stores even years ago it is also because I visited those stores about twice a week to look for new games. But I am quite sure that most people will see that is something strange to do too
I am not sure that EA actually did any mistakes by aiming TS4 almost completely at new 12 to 15 yrs old simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them because we don't know the sales numbers and maybe I would even have liked TS4 myself if I hadn't played the previous games too.
For me to see EA wanted to focus much more on SPs this time which must be because they had sold extremely well for the earlier games since they were introduced midway in the TS2 days. They are very fast and cheap to make because they don't require much programming and therefore can be made by much smaller teams. So if they get high sales numbers then they must be more profitable for EA than the big EPs are. The high sales numbers for stuff items and SPs have also showed EA that even the basegame, the GPs and the EPs can get high sales numbers too even if they contain less new gameplay (and maybe more stuff) than earlier. So EA's choices were logical - especially if EA knows that almost all sales are by or for 12 to 15 yrs old teens. Therefore I can't see TS4 as any mistake (even though it isn't a game for me) if sales numbers really are as high as I suspect them to be.
Ridiculous,
Why? Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?
I don't. But almost all young teens seem to at least know the games (and especially if they are girls). So I wouldn't actually be surprised if EA should tell us that more than 95% of the Sims games are sold to or for 12 to 15 yrs olds.
Most of the YouTubers that I watch are 17+ There's plenty of adults outside the forums that play The Sims.
The difference between 17+ simmers and the 12 to 15 yrs olds is that 12 to 15 yrs olds have many more interests because they are so young and mainly just want to try everything before they maybe later can choose what their main interests should be. So they buy the games or tell their parents that they want them as presents for their birthday or Christmas. But even so they usually only play them quite shortly because they have so many other interests too. Therefore they are very rare guests in the forums and on YouTube. But for EA they are still the most important customers because they are much more likely to get the games than older simmers usually are.
Ahh..now you're changing tactics. Your original question was 'Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?' And I responded to that. There are plenty outside of the forums that are adults that play Sims.
Maybe. But I don't know any. Do you?
But I have a few time mentioned Sims games as an example to a group of teens - and they sure know the game and are able to give comments about what they like and/or dislike about some of the newest Sims games
I was one between 2009-2013, an adult simmer who wasn't active on these forums. You didn't know me back then, you do know me now (so technically yes, you do know one). And I know a 62 year old simmer who has been playing this game since Sims 1, who never showed her 'face' here. She also plays Sims 4.
(I know more by the way, all active on other forums than this one)
I also know simmers on other forums than this one and I know that I can find some on Facebook and Twitter too. But this wasn't what I was talking about. In my own family I only know that my niece played Sims a little when she was a young teen a few years ago. I have also mentioned Sims a couple of times in the adult classes which I taught. Especially I remember a class where I (in a break) used the expression "games (PC) for girls" and a young girl in her early twenties answered whith a question: "Does that exist?" and looked around. She then answered the question herself: "Apart from the Sims?" - which clearly was a game that she didn't play anymore. The other girls in the class had no comments but clearly looked like they agreed with her.
If my adult pupils talk about interesting PC games then you can be very sure that Sims games never are mentioned at all among such games
If you meant 'within my own family and my classroom' you should have said so
I wrote "outside this forum" which I thought made it obvious that just because we can find 200 adults on the internet by searching for simmers from the whole world this doesn't prove that adults play Sims games just as much as the many millions of teens who don't write about all the games they have tried and played
But you actually proved my point anyway by not being able to find adult simmers elsewhere
The problem is Erpe is that it seemed everyone wanted toddlers back in the game and nearly every place was having a geekgasm when they were finally included, which is at odds with your theory about a 95% base group of 12-15yo, that never even experienced toddlers before so wouldn't have cared about them
No, the problem is that 12-15 yrs olds are interested in a lot of things (Sims, sports, friends, the opposite sex, parties, school, other games etc). They just try about everything and they switch fast between them. Is a game (Sims or some other game) doesn't fill their needs then they don't complain about it on the internet - they just switch to one of their many other activities.
So the simmers who complained about the missing toddlers weren't 12-15 yrs olds who never played the previous games anyway. Those complainers were instead some of the much fewer adult simmers who also played the previous games and were angry because TS4 wasn't just an improved version of TS3 which they had played for years.
I am not sure that EA actually did any mistakes by aiming TS4 almost completely at new 12 to 15 yrs old simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them because we don't know the sales numbers and maybe I would even have liked TS4 myself if I hadn't played the previous games too.
For me to see EA wanted to focus much more on SPs this time which must be because they had sold extremely well for the earlier games since they were introduced midway in the TS2 days. They are very fast and cheap to make because they don't require much programming and therefore can be made by much smaller teams. So if they get high sales numbers then they must be more profitable for EA than the big EPs are. The high sales numbers for stuff items and SPs have also showed EA that even the basegame, the GPs and the EPs can get high sales numbers too even if they contain less new gameplay (and maybe more stuff) than earlier. So EA's choices were logical - especially if EA knows that almost all sales are by or for 12 to 15 yrs old teens. Therefore I can't see TS4 as any mistake (even though it isn't a game for me) if sales numbers really are as high as I suspect them to be.
Ridiculous,
Why? Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?
I don't. But almost all young teens seem to at least know the games (and especially if they are girls). So I wouldn't actually be surprised if EA should tell us that more than 95% of the Sims games are sold to or for 12 to 15 yrs olds.
No, I also think that the target demographic is the same as it has been since TS1. But in those days EA hadn't even expected the basegame to sell as well as many other games did because it was only an experiment and a little spinoff game from the SimCity series. But it sold so well that EA suddenly had to release EPs too. I also remember how all the teen girls discussed the Sims cartridges in the stores when I visited the same stores to buy other games. Sometimes they had their mum with them and she seemed to be only interested because her daughter was.
This continued in the Sims 2 days where I also met many young girls in the game stores and especially when a new EP just had been released. But EA still seemed to believe that only big EPs with a lot of new gameplay would sell.
Then just before Christmas in 2005 Holiday Party suddenly was released as the very first SP. EA obviously only had expected it to sell a little just before Christmas because it wasn't even copyprotected. But it sold so extremely well that EA then released Family Fun Stuff just before Easter in 2006 - still without copy protection though. But also this SP sold (for EA) surprisingly well. So after this EA began to release SPs regularly - and from that time always with copy protection.
So EA learned from the sales numbers that stuff apparently sold as well as gameplay. This let to the Sims 3 store and it clearly also must be the main reason why TS4 was made the way it is because EA included less gameplay already in the basegame and has released SPs even more often then ever before. Also instead of releasing 2 big EPs each year EA now has replaced half of those EPs with smaller GPs to be able to move more developers to all the SP teams. (EA now switches between GPs and EPs and in average releases either a GP or an EP every 5 months - but at the same time releases about 5 SPs each year.) It also seems to me like EA now puts less gameplay (and maybe more stuff?) into even the EPs?
Of course the Sims is popular with teen girls..they probably do make up the largest demographic these days.
Doesn't mean they made the game specifcally for them, or market specifically to them.
That's not even the part that I find the most absurd....It's this bit here that's completely off the wall.
simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them
It's your clever way of saying anyone who likes this game just doesn't know any better.
Insulting.
No, that may be your opinion - but certainly not mine because we all have different interests and I actually don't think that I ever has met a person with exactly the same interests as I have
When I remember the visitors in the game stores even years ago it is also because I visited those stores about twice a week to look for new games. But I am quite sure that most people will see that is something strange to do too
I am not sure that EA actually did any mistakes by aiming TS4 almost completely at new 12 to 15 yrs old simmers who didn't play the previous games and therefore are unlikely to compare them because we don't know the sales numbers and maybe I would even have liked TS4 myself if I hadn't played the previous games too.
For me to see EA wanted to focus much more on SPs this time which must be because they had sold extremely well for the earlier games since they were introduced midway in the TS2 days. They are very fast and cheap to make because they don't require much programming and therefore can be made by much smaller teams. So if they get high sales numbers then they must be more profitable for EA than the big EPs are. The high sales numbers for stuff items and SPs have also showed EA that even the basegame, the GPs and the EPs can get high sales numbers too even if they contain less new gameplay (and maybe more stuff) than earlier. So EA's choices were logical - especially if EA knows that almost all sales are by or for 12 to 15 yrs old teens. Therefore I can't see TS4 as any mistake (even though it isn't a game for me) if sales numbers really are as high as I suspect them to be.
Ridiculous,
Why? Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?
I don't. But almost all young teens seem to at least know the games (and especially if they are girls). So I wouldn't actually be surprised if EA should tell us that more than 95% of the Sims games are sold to or for 12 to 15 yrs olds.
Most of the YouTubers that I watch are 17+ There's plenty of adults outside the forums that play The Sims.
The difference between 17+ simmers and the 12 to 15 yrs olds is that 12 to 15 yrs olds have many more interests because they are so young and mainly just want to try everything before they maybe later can choose what their main interests should be. So they buy the games or tell their parents that they want them as presents for their birthday or Christmas. But even so they usually only play them quite shortly because they have so many other interests too. Therefore they are very rare guests in the forums and on YouTube. But for EA they are still the most important customers because they are much more likely to get the games than older simmers usually are.
Ahh..now you're changing tactics. Your original question was 'Do you know any adults outside the forum who play Sims games at all?' And I responded to that. There are plenty outside of the forums that are adults that play Sims.
Maybe. But I don't know any. Do you?
But I have a few time mentioned Sims games as an example to a group of teens - and they sure know the game and are able to give comments about what they like and/or dislike about some of the newest Sims games
I was one between 2009-2013, an adult simmer who wasn't active on these forums. You didn't know me back then, you do know me now (so technically yes, you do know one). And I know a 62 year old simmer who has been playing this game since Sims 1, who never showed her 'face' here. She also plays Sims 4.
(I know more by the way, all active on other forums than this one)
I also know simmers on other forums than this one and I know that I can find some on Facebook and Twitter too. But this wasn't what I was talking about. In my own family I only know that my niece played Sims a little when she was a young teen a few years ago. I have also mentioned Sims a couple of times in the adult classes which I taught. Especially I remember a class where I (in a break) used the expression "games (PC) for girls" and a young girl in her early twenties answered whith a question: "Does that exist?" and looked around. She then answered the question herself: "Apart from the Sims?" - which clearly was a game that she didn't play anymore. The other girls in the class had no comments but clearly looked like they agreed with her.
If my adult pupils talk about interesting PC games then you can be very sure that Sims games never are mentioned at all among such games
If you meant 'within my own family and my classroom' you should have said so
I wrote "outside this forum" which I thought made it obvious that just because we can find 200 adults on the internet by searching for simmers from the whole world this doesn't prove that adults play Sims games just as much as the many millions of teens who don't write about all the games they have tried and played
But you actually proved my point anyway by not being able to find adult simmers elsewhere
Please define 'elsewhere'?
Anywhere else except on the internet. Google is just too efficient a search engine and it will therefore find almost all the adult simmers in the whole world. The problem is though that we can't use it to find young teen simmers in the same way for 2 reasons:
1. Young teen simmers do many other things too and they rarely discuss their games on the internet.
2. If they should discuss the game shortly on Facebook despite that then it is still difficult to find them and they are warned about giving information about their age anyway. So it almost seems that young teen simmers don't exist even though I have seen a lot of them in my real life and EA apparently also regard them as the most important group of customers for especially the Sims games.
for me it's a combination of:
1. More stuff packs, less expansion packs, expansion packs being worse quality and
2. failure to prioritize bug fixes over anything else in live updates, because one of the main selling point of this rather stripped down version of The Sims was its stability.
There were so few of those adults that EA still ok'd the inclusion of toddlers, knowing full well that their "target audience" of 12-15 yo couldn't care less. Still seems contradictory.
There were so few of those adults that EA still ok'd the inclusion of toddlers, knowing full well that their "target audience" of 12-15 yo couldn't care less. Still seems contradictory.
Not really. EA most likely omitted toddlers in the basegame because gameplay didn't seem so important for the sales numbers as EA earlier had thought when even SPs could get such high sales numbers. The 12-15 yrs olds weren't likely to miss toddlers anyway because they didn't play the previous games and because nobody missed toddlers in TS1 which had so extremely high sales numbers that it surprised everybody.
But EA of course didn't like all the bad talk on the internet about TS4 not being worth playing without toddlers because even 12-15 yrs olds read the internet and they will often believe what they read. So the continued attacks on TS4 were likely to hurt the sales numbers quite a bit. So EA finally decided to make toddlers anyway. Then EA also released he toddlers for free because 12-15 yrs olds were very unlikely to buy a toddler GP anyway and the attacks on TS4 would likely have continued if the "veterans" should pay for toddlers which they still thought were traditional basegame content (even though TS1 didn't have toddlers either).
But the attacks according to you were from just a few adults not from the 12-15yo mass market, so why would those kids care? But if they did then those kids might also care for open world , something they haven't experienced either. :P
But the attacks according to you were from just a few adults not from the 12-15yo mass market, so why would those kids care? But if they did then those kids might also care for open world , something they haven't experienced either. :P
Advertising works very well even on adults. So when adults buy more if more good advertising is done then why not 12-15 yrs olds who haven't even so much experience as adults do?
Bad advertising/rumors are feared very much also by politicians near elections because they know how harmful it is. So of course it will also harm a game like TS4.
The "kids" don't care about open world for the same reasons (that they didn't play TS3) which must be why EA omitted the open world too although the other reason of course is that it was much cheaper to make TS4 without toddlers and without the open world.
You can be very very sure that if EA really had targeted TS4 at the veterans who came from TS3 then EA would never have omitted toddlers and the open world in TS4! EA knows very well also from all EA's many other games that a new version of a game always will be compared to the previous version and likely fail if it isn't more advanced than the previous version. This is especially true for 18+ rated games but also for 16+ rated games. It is also true for even 12+ (or T) rated games if the majority of the customers are veterans from the previous version. So by dumping down the Sims 4 basegame EA clearly showed that EA regards the new very young simmers as far the most important group of customers
The situation with the toddlers may or may not be debated, but I get the distinct impression they had no intention of bringing back the open world, regardless of the intended demographic they're going for. With all the technical issues going on for TS3, the poorly routed official worlds and such, I doubt they were in any hurry whatsoever to go back to it.
Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if they decided that some of the features in TS3 (primarily but not exclusively open world) were a worthy experiment to have tried once but once only.
The situation with the toddlers may or may not be debated, but I get the distinct impression they had no intention of bringing back the open world, regardless of the intended demographic they're going for. With all the technical issues going on for TS3, the poorly routed official worlds and such, I doubt they were in any hurry whatsoever to go back to it.
This could quite easily have been I proved because computers were stronger in 2014 when TS4 was released than they were in 2009 when TS3 was released. The developers also learn from mistakes like everybody else. So they could just have adjusted the open world a little if EA had wanted the open world in TS4 too such that veteran simmers wouldn't have seen TS4 as a step backwards instead of forwards. But EA was clearly more interested in saving a little money and to make the Sims 4 stabile enough for dozens of later released SPs. This again proves that EA targeted TS4 almost exclusively at new young teen simmers without caring much about the veterans who came from TS3.
Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if they decided that some of the features in TS3 (primarily but not exclusively open world) were a worthy experiment to have tried once but once only.
It is hard to predict if the open world will be back in TS5 because we don't know which way EA wants the developers to go. I don't believe that EA will want TS5 to become too similar to TS4. But I suspect that EA still will target TS5 mainly at new young teen simmers anyway.
You can be very very sure that if EA really had targeted TS4 at the veterans who came from TS3 then EA would never have omitted toddlers and the open world in TS4! EA knows very well also from all EA's many other games that a new version of a game always will be compared to the previous version and likely fail if it isn't more advanced than the previous version. This is especially true for 18+ rated games but also for 16+ rated games. It is also true for even 12+ (or T) rated games if the majority of the customers are veterans from the previous version. So by dumping down the Sims 4 basegame EA clearly showed that EA regards the new very young simmers as far the most important group of customers
The Sims 4 does indeed feel like a reboot, but I don't think it was intentional. I don't think they were specifically trying to appeal to young Simmers, I think they just plain outright failed at incorporating features in previous titles and rushed out the game in an incomplete state. A lack of an open world is one thing, but no life simulator worth its salt would be released with missing life stages (even teens would be smart enough to realize that you don't age directly from a baby to a child). I think EA, and TS4 developers specifically, grossly miscalculated what Simmers wanted and wrongly assumed that we wouldn't miss those features. Also, releasing a bare-boned game is no way to appeal to young gamers - games today have photo-realistic visuals and are jam-packed with features, and no way would a teen gamer be impressed with a game like TS4.
I will hold My judgement on the Biggest Mistake bout The Sims 4 when it is all said and done, cause it is still being worked on, So I can not say until I know for sure, but one part was already Fixed when it came to Toddler's, so I will wait and see bout the others.
Since we don't have open worlds, I would be open to the idea of open neighborhoods other people on the boards have talked about this and I think this is completely able to be done maybe not in Sims 4 but if they do Sims 5. I am happy with Sims 4 now that toddlers have been added to the game and it seems like EA is trying to listen to the fan base. I know we cannot get everything we want. I do like how the sims look in Sims 4 but hope if Sims 5 comes out, that the base game is fleshed out more. I.E. open hoods, rain and snow, earthquakes, some disasters, the jobs a little more fleshed. That way if they only do one EP a year it makes it a little more reasonable. I don't miss the store stuff. I enjoy the stuff packs and game packs.
So far and I'd say always... releasing the base game before it was really finished, imo. I think, I speculate- meaning I really don't know, it was released a year or even two years early because first Olympus was scrapped and then SimCity '13 imploded leaving no income generators for Maxis during the time they would have been completing the Sims 4. I think the early release is why things like even open neighborhoods, some form of CASt and various CAS Build/Buy assets (like hair- basic shaped and colored furniture ect) that looked far worse then we are receiving now happened. They didn't have time to finish and once the die was cast then it wasn't really possible to go back and fix it all. There have definitely been improvements though and I'm cautiously hopeful for the future. AGAIN, I reiterate, just because what I wrote above is what I THINK is the biggest mistake doesn't mean that it actually happened that way. I do think that though.
You can be very very sure that if EA really had targeted TS4 at the veterans who came from TS3 then EA would never have omitted toddlers and the open world in TS4! EA knows very well also from all EA's many other games that a new version of a game always will be compared to the previous version and likely fail if it isn't more advanced than the previous version. This is especially true for 18+ rated games but also for 16+ rated games. It is also true for even 12+ (or T) rated games if the majority of the customers are veterans from the previous version. So by dumping down the Sims 4 basegame EA clearly showed that EA regards the new very young simmers as far the most important group of customers
The Sims 4 does indeed feel like a reboot, but I don't think it was intentional. I don't think they were specifically trying to appeal to young Simmers, I think they just plain outright failed at incorporating features in previous titles and rushed out the game in an incomplete state. A lack of an open world is one thing, but no life simulator worth its salt would be released with missing life stages (even teens would be smart enough to realize that you don't age directly from a baby to a child). I think EA, and TS4 developers specifically, grossly miscalculated what Simmers wanted and wrongly assumed that we wouldn't miss those features. Also, releasing a bare-boned game is no way to appeal to young gamers - games today have photo-realistic visuals and are jam-packed with features, and no way would a teen gamer be impressed with a game like TS4.
To think that EA's top are just lazy newcomers to business and therefore just make games at random with random features and omit features at random is an extreme underestimation of the hard work they do to make the company run as efficiently and profitable as possible because they go to work every day mainly to study, concider and discuss every detail that could be improved. Therefore I can't at all agree with your description because nothing is actually done at random in a company like EA. EA's top (and the developers) can make mistakes like everybody else. But we shouldn't believe at all that such mistakes ever are made just because things weren't considered and planned carefully.
There are millions of new young teens every year just in the US and the Sims games are sold in a huge number of other countries too. Also such new teens play more games than anybody else. Therefore they are an ideal group for EA to target.
So when we know that EA is planning everything very carefully by studying details about every game and studying the sales numbers too and that teens are the most active customers for games then it shouldn't be so difficult to see what EA is doing. SPs sell extremely well and they are fast and cheap for EA to make. So they were planned to be the main expansions for TS4 and EA only wanted to use just enough time on developing GPs and EPs too to keep people interested in the game. Also EA knew that the veterans would miss both toddlers and the open world. But apparently EA saw the veterans as too small a minority among the customers to care much about them
Comments
To be honest not only do I have no idea how to answer that question, I have no idea what we're even talking about at this point.
But you actually proved my point anyway by not being able to find adult simmers elsewhere
So the simmers who complained about the missing toddlers weren't 12-15 yrs olds who never played the previous games anyway. Those complainers were instead some of the much fewer adult simmers who also played the previous games and were angry because TS4 wasn't just an improved version of TS3 which they had played for years.
1. Young teen simmers do many other things too and they rarely discuss their games on the internet.
2. If they should discuss the game shortly on Facebook despite that then it is still difficult to find them and they are warned about giving information about their age anyway. So it almost seems that young teen simmers don't exist even though I have seen a lot of them in my real life and EA apparently also regard them as the most important group of customers for especially the Sims games.
1. More stuff packs, less expansion packs, expansion packs being worse quality and
2. failure to prioritize bug fixes over anything else in live updates, because one of the main selling point of this rather stripped down version of The Sims was its stability.
But EA of course didn't like all the bad talk on the internet about TS4 not being worth playing without toddlers because even 12-15 yrs olds read the internet and they will often believe what they read. So the continued attacks on TS4 were likely to hurt the sales numbers quite a bit. So EA finally decided to make toddlers anyway. Then EA also released he toddlers for free because 12-15 yrs olds were very unlikely to buy a toddler GP anyway and the attacks on TS4 would likely have continued if the "veterans" should pay for toddlers which they still thought were traditional basegame content (even though TS1 didn't have toddlers either).
Bad advertising/rumors are feared very much also by politicians near elections because they know how harmful it is. So of course it will also harm a game like TS4.
The "kids" don't care about open world for the same reasons (that they didn't play TS3) which must be why EA omitted the open world too although the other reason of course is that it was much cheaper to make TS4 without toddlers and without the open world.
You can be very very sure that if EA really had targeted TS4 at the veterans who came from TS3 then EA would never have omitted toddlers and the open world in TS4! EA knows very well also from all EA's many other games that a new version of a game always will be compared to the previous version and likely fail if it isn't more advanced than the previous version. This is especially true for 18+ rated games but also for 16+ rated games. It is also true for even 12+ (or T) rated games if the majority of the customers are veterans from the previous version. So by dumping down the Sims 4 basegame EA clearly showed that EA regards the new very young simmers as far the most important group of customers
Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if they decided that some of the features in TS3 (primarily but not exclusively open world) were a worthy experiment to have tried once but once only.
It is hard to predict if the open world will be back in TS5 because we don't know which way EA wants the developers to go. I don't believe that EA will want TS5 to become too similar to TS4. But I suspect that EA still will target TS5 mainly at new young teen simmers anyway.
There are millions of new young teens every year just in the US and the Sims games are sold in a huge number of other countries too. Also such new teens play more games than anybody else. Therefore they are an ideal group for EA to target.
So when we know that EA is planning everything very carefully by studying details about every game and studying the sales numbers too and that teens are the most active customers for games then it shouldn't be so difficult to see what EA is doing. SPs sell extremely well and they are fast and cheap for EA to make. So they were planned to be the main expansions for TS4 and EA only wanted to use just enough time on developing GPs and EPs too to keep people interested in the game. Also EA knew that the veterans would miss both toddlers and the open world. But apparently EA saw the veterans as too small a minority among the customers to care much about them