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TS2 Player, Why I Do Love The Sims 4
Cinebar
Posts: 33,618 Member
Everyone knows I am one of TS4's biggest critics. That's a fact. However, when I think about a new game in The Sims series I may not be ready to move on by the time that game comes out.
In the beginning,TS4 to me was like getting a new puppy after you had just lost the dog (big dog lover) you had for fifteen years and was still grieving. Any one who had done that knows what I mean. You like the puppy, but it doesn't do what your old dog could do, it doesn't act like your old dog, it doesn't have the personality of your old dog. Your deceased dog knew you inside and out, you could just look at your old dog and he/she would read your body language and act accordingly. But that was a relationship built on ten -twenty years.
A new puppy was going to be a handful, especially having to 'retrain' another dog as you yourself had gotten older and maybe not moving as fast as you used to do, and able to grab that puppy and carry it outside when it needed to potty. It was now a bigger chore than it was ten-twenty years ago. And the new puppy may not learn it as fast as the old dog did. So, you may be thinking my beloved dog was so much smarter than this new breed or puppy and so you may not see the good things about the new puppy right away.
At least that has been the way I felt about TS4 in the beginning.
With all that said I want to speak about from TS2 player's prospective, who will never agree about TS3 with TS3 players, on some points, either.
The things that 'have improved' in TS4 shouldn't be ignored just because there are many things many people find lacking in this game.
Animations are very important to some of us. TS2 is famous for it's detailed simulation and animations. TS4 has some remarkable things people may not know.
1. I wonder how many people realize if you have a porch on a building about one step high (which Sims can now step up on without needing a staircase) your Sim can stand on that stoop and water flowers down on the ground. I wonder how many people realize how amazing that really is in the bigger scheme of things.
2. Also, in progression/and improvements concerning TS4 many may not realize if you do have stairs on a porch of any building, about three or four steps high, maybe five, Sims can converse with each other while one stands on the steps and the other stands on the ground/sidewalk. They can also enter into romantic interactions like serenade while the one stands on the steps. That is light years away from where The Sims began. Just on a pathing, routing scale. It's actually amazing to be able to see that in The Sims.
Anyone who has been around a long time knows all this and does appreciate the advancements of such an anomaly.
We can all argue about this is 2017 and that should not have been any big feat, but I will argue for The Sims and how routing is handled in the games, it was a huge deal to me to see those feats in this game. New players who play other games that aren't actually life simulators may not understand what a big deal this actually is (in my book).
3. I won't repeat myself by talking about being able to sit by a pool and dangle feet in water. Huge, but I digress.
Or being able to sit talking over a phone..huge...but some might argue it should have been there ten years ago.. Maybe, but still TS4 does deserve credit for the above.
4. Omg, toddlers being able to climb up on furniture, and crawl on stairs...that is a major, huge, improvement over past games. Immersion is something important to many of us. And that revelation is tremendous and TS4 deserves credit for it.
5. Playing rotationally. Something that is a major sticking point with TS2 players. A deal breaker if not possible and or player friendly.
It's amazing how you can bring any Sim to where your Sim may be. Huge deal for rotational players. Leave your Sim there and go play another household on the fly. Amazing. Then invite the Sim you just left at the park to the new house/household....I think some may take these mechanics for granted. Or leave that house and return to your previous Sim all on the fly. Jump from Sim to Sim in a household, or leave them somewhere and play another. With all that it's keeping faith with TS3 and TS2 players even more than before. I won't argue about they forgot to make the Sims keep doing what they were doing while you left them on a community lot, but I think TS4 does deserve some credit for making it easier for TS2 players to play their whole neighborhood, and hopefully their other Sims are safe at home (most of the time) while they play another household.
6. The aging system in TS4. I know some want more sliders under this control. But I absolutely love the aging controls in this game. Long life and aging off for my played Sims is a great option for a player like me. Until I am ready to age up individually.
7. Starting game from neighborhood view. Somewhat a return to TS2 style loading. Thank goodness! Pick any house that day without having to load the last household. Huge deal to me.
9. Being able to go into build mode on any community lot and edit anything while my Sim is standing there. Huge, huge progression.
For all TS4's short coming argued by many, including myself, I have grown to love TS4, and like to think all my input over the years has helped shape the series and found some common ground with gurus when they too, thought you know what that Sim should be able to stand on steps and talk to a Sim standing below.
Happy Simming!
ETA: Gurus, some of us know these things are new in this game series, and some of us do notice, and appreciate those things you may never get credit for doing such as the conversations below.
In the beginning,TS4 to me was like getting a new puppy after you had just lost the dog (big dog lover) you had for fifteen years and was still grieving. Any one who had done that knows what I mean. You like the puppy, but it doesn't do what your old dog could do, it doesn't act like your old dog, it doesn't have the personality of your old dog. Your deceased dog knew you inside and out, you could just look at your old dog and he/she would read your body language and act accordingly. But that was a relationship built on ten -twenty years.
A new puppy was going to be a handful, especially having to 'retrain' another dog as you yourself had gotten older and maybe not moving as fast as you used to do, and able to grab that puppy and carry it outside when it needed to potty. It was now a bigger chore than it was ten-twenty years ago. And the new puppy may not learn it as fast as the old dog did. So, you may be thinking my beloved dog was so much smarter than this new breed or puppy and so you may not see the good things about the new puppy right away.
At least that has been the way I felt about TS4 in the beginning.
With all that said I want to speak about from TS2 player's prospective, who will never agree about TS3 with TS3 players, on some points, either.
The things that 'have improved' in TS4 shouldn't be ignored just because there are many things many people find lacking in this game.
Animations are very important to some of us. TS2 is famous for it's detailed simulation and animations. TS4 has some remarkable things people may not know.
1. I wonder how many people realize if you have a porch on a building about one step high (which Sims can now step up on without needing a staircase) your Sim can stand on that stoop and water flowers down on the ground. I wonder how many people realize how amazing that really is in the bigger scheme of things.
2. Also, in progression/and improvements concerning TS4 many may not realize if you do have stairs on a porch of any building, about three or four steps high, maybe five, Sims can converse with each other while one stands on the steps and the other stands on the ground/sidewalk. They can also enter into romantic interactions like serenade while the one stands on the steps. That is light years away from where The Sims began. Just on a pathing, routing scale. It's actually amazing to be able to see that in The Sims.
Anyone who has been around a long time knows all this and does appreciate the advancements of such an anomaly.
We can all argue about this is 2017 and that should not have been any big feat, but I will argue for The Sims and how routing is handled in the games, it was a huge deal to me to see those feats in this game. New players who play other games that aren't actually life simulators may not understand what a big deal this actually is (in my book).
3. I won't repeat myself by talking about being able to sit by a pool and dangle feet in water. Huge, but I digress.
Or being able to sit talking over a phone..huge...but some might argue it should have been there ten years ago.. Maybe, but still TS4 does deserve credit for the above.
4. Omg, toddlers being able to climb up on furniture, and crawl on stairs...that is a major, huge, improvement over past games. Immersion is something important to many of us. And that revelation is tremendous and TS4 deserves credit for it.
5. Playing rotationally. Something that is a major sticking point with TS2 players. A deal breaker if not possible and or player friendly.
It's amazing how you can bring any Sim to where your Sim may be. Huge deal for rotational players. Leave your Sim there and go play another household on the fly. Amazing. Then invite the Sim you just left at the park to the new house/household....I think some may take these mechanics for granted. Or leave that house and return to your previous Sim all on the fly. Jump from Sim to Sim in a household, or leave them somewhere and play another. With all that it's keeping faith with TS3 and TS2 players even more than before. I won't argue about they forgot to make the Sims keep doing what they were doing while you left them on a community lot, but I think TS4 does deserve some credit for making it easier for TS2 players to play their whole neighborhood, and hopefully their other Sims are safe at home (most of the time) while they play another household.
6. The aging system in TS4. I know some want more sliders under this control. But I absolutely love the aging controls in this game. Long life and aging off for my played Sims is a great option for a player like me. Until I am ready to age up individually.
7. Starting game from neighborhood view. Somewhat a return to TS2 style loading. Thank goodness! Pick any house that day without having to load the last household. Huge deal to me.
9. Being able to go into build mode on any community lot and edit anything while my Sim is standing there. Huge, huge progression.
For all TS4's short coming argued by many, including myself, I have grown to love TS4, and like to think all my input over the years has helped shape the series and found some common ground with gurus when they too, thought you know what that Sim should be able to stand on steps and talk to a Sim standing below.
Happy Simming!
ETA: Gurus, some of us know these things are new in this game series, and some of us do notice, and appreciate those things you may never get credit for doing such as the conversations below.
"Games Are Not The Place To Tell Stories, Games Are Meant To Let People Tell Their Own Stories"...Will Wright.
Post edited by Cinebar on
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Comments
But actually - whoa. I've been playing since 2000 and loved Sims 4 from launch but never registered that bit in your first points about talking and other animations between partial levels. Seriously - just took that completely for granted.
Another point building a stage for performance, Sims can sit below, in chairs and listen to the performance, something not at all possible in older games.
On a more serious note, I agree with your points. I've said it for awhile now, even before toddlers came out, while TS4's improvements might not be big and flashy, there are lots of subtle ones all over. Just gotta see the game for what it is, and not what it isn't.
Bodysnatchers.
ETA: No, really these are the things I liked from the beginning and many other things and why I expressed myself often hoping things would improve for 'me' and by adding a few things I did want, I like to give credit when it's due and I have written many positive posts in the last two years that might get overshadowed when I'm frustrated by the game.
No, never. But like my four year old mutt, I love her as much but in a different way than I did my ten year old dog who passed before her.
As for myself, I feel it has improved, but I still think EA was capable of going MUCH further than the distance they've went with TS4. The core game itself still feels extremely boring to me, and virtually a carbon copy of what we already have. There was little to no innovation within the life simulation aspect of this game. We've received these nice animations and all, but there's no decent substance behind it.
I've been playing TS3 lately, after sticking with TS2/TS4 for so long. I mean, it's just undeniable, whether your game is glitchy or not, TS3 has truly innovated. It's a shame, instead of going further and removing all of the negative, technical aspects that came along with open world and go even further, that they completely regressed and went back to TS2 styled worlds, with content which does not make up for it by any means.
As far as traits should matter more, and more consequences I agree. However, I remember I had the same problem in TS1, TS2 and TS3 when I wanted my Sims to do something to stay busy other than read a skill book. I remember thinking in all those games (even with EPs added) I wish these Sims could invent more things, have more hobbies, be interested in many different things, and there was more for them to do other than sit at a pc, or skill, or paint etc. I still feel that way.
When the cas beta came out for Sims 4, I immediately loved it. It was the first time I was able to make my simself without cc, and that was amazing. Still skeptical about the rest, however, I waited until two months after release before I couldn't stand to wait any longer and finally purchased it, after having read up a bit on its contents. I imported my sims from beta, (yay that they made it so easy!) explored cas some more, (and honestly didn't even notice toddlers were missing, but I don't prioritize family play and they did get annoying for me in Sims 2 when they were screaming or crying), then went into Willow Creek.
I can tell you that my reaction was extremely different from my last experience, and right away, I knew I was going to pursue this game. It felt much more like Sims 2, which was familiar and comfortable, but with a lot of newness to it. I had already braced myself for the barebones stripping of the extra content from packs, because I was still remembering the sims 3 shock I'd had at first, so I took my time to explore it. These are the things I appreciated:
The world is just gorgeous. The scenery is full and colorful and the art is the best yet.
Multitasking! I no longer have to queue up a bunch of actions and wait for each to complete. My sims can talk while doing all kinds of other things. This is something I strongly miss when I try to play sims 2 now, and honestly haven't played it in a long time.
Things in the neighborhood to interact with. Plants, rocks, stumps, fishing, a strange tree in the park, and most of all, a whole bunch of other sims who are going about their lives.
The facial animations. I have really enjoyed the expressions as they talk and change emotions.
Pubs/bars! Having a place for my sims to go and meet other sims and see musicians perform, and comedians, is a very welcome addition to the base game.
And, of course, the ultra-amazing CAS that I play with constantly. (Kind of an addiction, haha.)
I've had my share of criticisms of the Sims 4 as well, because once I got used to it, there were other things I noticed that I felt needed tweaking or whatnot. But I'm still enjoying it, especially after Vampires released, and I actually sincerely like playing with toddlers for the first time, and actually look forward to having them in my households.
I find that there are more and more little nuances to notice as more content comes out, so I've taken to reminding myself of that first wonder of exploring the base game and taking time to notice the little things, because if I focus too much on end results, I miss the details of the journey to get there.
(Sorry, this is wicked long, haha!)
Edit: Oh! And build mode! I was able to do an add-on to my little house without much hassle, and I usually REALLY struggle with building in sims 2. I even made my own gothy nightclub for the first time, thanks to Sims 4 build changes. Love!
I do think it calls to sims 2 players that for some reason didn't click with 3. Me included. I'm glad you are enjoying it more now and are able to really see many of the little things that you can appreciate now.
The Sims 3 is the oddity out of the 4 games. Whether you like 4 or not, 4 is more inline with The Sims 1/2, than 3 was. Infact, 4 almost feels like it refers to a lot of the original Sims games, with some sprinkles of 2.
The Sims 3 was the oddity, but for some, it's what they were looking for. The Sims 3 took a back seat Simulation wise, and more focused on the world, how the Sims work within the world, and what they do in the world.
It just depends. The Sims 3 didn't cut it for me, simply because of how it badly it was programmed (not lag etc, but how the game handles data such as constant Save Errors, crashing because it tries to use more RAM than 32bit allows, eventual Ghostowns etc.) However, I enjoy it on console as it's more streamlined and they fixed a lot of the issues that cause me grief on PC.
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However comparing The Sims 4 to a dog, well, the dog wins in that level!
But yes TS4 should have made some improvements on TS2 which makes sense as there are ten years between them but I think that what @JoAnne65 has said about wishing that also being the same thing for TS3 is also valuable input.
TS4 perhaps could at least be 'on par' with TS2 in some areas but it will never be able to match up to TS3 unless you throw in a much improved Open World (not that there was anything wrong with it in TS3) and took things to a whole new level.
As I said before, if TS4 has to be an improvement on TS2 then I hope for anything that TS5 will be an improvement on TS3!
As long as sims 4 sims don't really care if their spouse cheats on them, dance back to back and "chat" across a crowded room (while randoms join in your discussions) not to mention your sims flirting with any old sim and any emotions they are feeling are wiped with a nice picture it will never be as good as the sims 2. Heck all of the above is doable in the sims 1.
I love the sims 2, I love it that much I struggled to get into 3 although I now love that game too. The sims 4 doesn't have the depth of the previous two games nor the charm or the game play of one. I like the sims 4 but its not and I will be surprised if it ever becomes my favourite sims game.
I don't think it does either.
The Sims 2 benefits as it was literally going to be a more in-depth remake of The Sims, but was later changed slightly, but the focus on Simulation was still there. Later packs like Free Time moved towards more RPG systems where you level up etc. but the ground work was there.
The Sims 3 and 4, move towards balancing RPG/Goal elements with Simulation, and I think they moved to that area due to the success of the console games being more linear and outselling the Sims 2 PC game. Which is fine, but as a Simulation, The Sims 2 will probably always be the best, because it's core is a Simulation, not a mixture of different elements.
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(without errors and crashing to worry about it's really a great game I can assure you, when it suits your playing style
Recently I reinstalled TS3 just out of curiousity. Played it lately for a handful of hours.
When I loaded up TS3 again for the first time in years, I did feel the expansion of the open world. The sim wanted to swim in the ocean and that was pretty darn neat. The vista, animals, including horses were gorgeous. There are clearly a lot more things to do (with the bunch of EPs I had). And so far (except for freezing once when I clicked on "Edit Town") it was actually running pretty well on my laptop with nVidia card.
But then after playing for a few hours, it felt like the world was open but isolated. Took my sim to a venues. There were a max of 5 other sims there no matter what time of day or night. Parties my sim got invited to were flat. Long, LONG pauses between autonomous interactions. The TS3 world started feeling closed in despite the open world.
I am not meaning to diss TS3. It's a great game in a lot of ways. There's so much to do, and so much available for builders and creators. I can see why a number of people prefer it.
However when it comes down to the core of the game, the way the game feels, I simply prefer TS4 now, probably a lot due to the reasons that the OP stated. When switching to play the TS4 I can really see the improvements. I *love* the TS4 art style. Just love it the best out of all of the games in the series. While I usually focus on gameplay, the aesthetics definitely matter to me.
But more than the art style/graphics, the TS4 animations really are top notch. It's all the little things. The idling animations, the facial expressions, etc. They make a difference to me. So whereas right now there are more things to do in TS3, everything is a bit more fun for me in TS4. It's just the way it "feels" especially with the sims themselves. The way they interact with each other is so fluid and dynamic compared to previous games in the series. Community lots are more lively; club gatherings and social events are fun to watch. The camera moves more smoothly, the sims move more smoothly, and out of hundreds of hours played I have only had 1 crash or freeze.
Finally I enjoy playing rotationally the best, and TS4 offers that whereas TS3 is not set up for that style of play (without a handful of mods).
I just hope they fix the handful of bugs soon and am looking forward to upcoming content.
Sim Stuff by Pegasys
What I mean is, for 3 they mostly reused the Simulation from The Sims 2 and then focused on how The Sims in that world interact. With 2 & 4 the Simulation was the main focus as they had to build it from the ground up. With 3, they basically used what The Sims 2 established and expanded about what they could do in the world, rather than how they do things, if that makes sense ^^
I love The Sims 3 Pets on console, and I play it at least once a month. I just wish it worked on PC like it does on console, because it plays flawlessly.
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I have the same qualms, but The Sims 3 on console fixes a lot of what you said. It's structure is a lot like The Sims 4 in the way it was programmed etc. Sims that visit venues often don't live in the world, the game just has them generate. I visited a community lot for my 100 Baby Challenge on console, and I was stunned to see 15 Sims just at a park venue, eating food etc. It was amazing.
Visit Central Park in The Sims 3 on PC, and there was 7 Sims. I got my Sim to travel to another area, and all the Sims followed so it was the same Sims
The Sims 4 does this too, but also has a mix of new as well.
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I went from 2 - 4 - 3 (the latter after 2 years of playing 4).
Just can't live without my customization and not interested in having to use mods to rotate in a game that stated we could play rotationally. I want a true colony play-style back.
Glad you're having fun though.
You can. The relationship issues have been fixed from my experience.
xUrbanSimsx is the queen of rotational play and she's not having issues (no mods).
Unless you mean time changing.
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